Found in Translation - Part Two

This is to discuss Found in Translation - Part Two: A Field Guide for Americans (http://www.mugglenet.com/editorials/editorials/edit-FischerR04.shtml) by Robbie Fischer.

oh, now I know how a Balacalava looks like, thanks:)

This is great thanks!!

Are you doing one in terms? In OOTP I had no idea what Snogging was and was trying to figure out just what Kreacher was doing with Mr. Blacks pants?..... anyhoo, I did figure it out later...

Another fun read! Thanks!

One correction—I don't think that the Fang in the films is a boarhound. It looks like a Neopolitan mastiff, a breed native to Italy and recently recognized by the American Kennel Club as a member of the Working group, not a hound. From what I can find, a boarhound is another name for Great Dane, although it may not be the same breed Americans recognize.

I knew a lot more of the things in this editorial than in the first one. I have even, unfortunately, had tripe. My grandmother used to make tripe soup, which I tried not to eat. Tripe is very chewy.

I had tripe in Menudo. Once.

I couldn't find the perfect picture of "snogging" but I believe that's the British equivalent of "sucking face," a.k.a. "tonsil hockey." I always thought the word "snogging" evoked images of mucus being exchanged. Eurgh.

Someone asked me about "git," which is another hard thing to illustrate. I learned from Monty Python that it's pronounced with a hard "G" (like "get"). It basically means "twerp" or "jerk." Some of these things you can just pick up from the context.

It's interesting that the Brits use the word "cow," when speaking of a human female, in the same sense that they would call a male human a "git." As in: "That Skeeter cow..." In the U.S. a certain term for a female dog is used in the same way...so effectively, indeed, that most people consider it a "dirty word."

While we're talking swear words, I have a theory that the time Ron called someone a "b--" the word he was using had a double g in it and ended in "er." That's a very strong word in British usage. It doesn't mean anything in standard American.

And finally, if you've seen the first HP movie, you know that "bogey" is British for "booger." In American English, "bogey" means one of three things: a nickname for Humphrey Bogart, an approaching or pursuing enemy, and most importantly, the first name of the creature who will "get you if you don't watch out" (his last name is "man"). Or so generations of American children have been told. This is why I think the Latin American version of PS/SS mistranslates the "curse of the bogeys" as "curse of the demons" rather than "curse of the boogers."

Jumpers are knitted items of clothing that are pulled on over the head - also known as 'pullovers' for this self evident reason.
An open fronted jumper is known as a cardigan.
All of these items can also be known as 'woollies" because traditionally they are of course knitted using wool.

PS if you mean the Crocodile Hunter please spell his name correctly
ie Steve Irwin
a small thing but important.

Balaclavas are so called because when the British Army went to the Crimea in 1854 it was very badly equipped. As winter set in the soldiers suffered from the cold. Women in England knitted the eponymous garments and sent them out to the British main supply base at Balaclava.

And tripe is one of the most disgusting foods known to humanity

edit - in part 3 can you point out that Dumbledore's scar is a map (http://cache.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/colourmap.pdf) of the London Underground (i.e. the underground railway) and not a map of underground London

On the other hand, very few Americans have the word “budgerigar” or its shortened form “budgie” in their vocabulary. I’m still not sure exactly how to pronounce the longer word.

They are a common species here in Australia, both as a pet, and as a wild bird in the more arid parts of the country. “Budgerigar” is pronounced BUDGE-er-ee-gar. I believe the word is an Australian Aboriginal name for this bird.

I totaly love the idea of these editorials! It has helped me a lot, a lot better than google anyways. Isn't it cool that we (American's specificaly) know about all this 'culture' and it stems for HP? Horray for the fandom! :)

HAHA! These editorials have made me laugh so much! I never realised how many different words America has from Britain!

Moleskin isn't made of moles (blecch). My dictionary says: "A thick strong cotton fabric with a shaved pile surface." But in the films Hagrid's coat looks to me as if it is made of moles...

Great editorial! The dog in the movie is indeed a Napolitan Dog. A boarhound is about the size of a Great Dane but I believe it has wiry hair.
Here in Portugal they have a dish made of tripe; it's called dobrada and it is this that McGonagall offers to Trelawney at the Christmas feast in the Portuguese version.
A jumper is a pullover sweater usually wool. Where did this word came from? I have no idea.
Looking forward to the next installment

Great editorial! The dog in the movie is indeed a Napolitan Dog. A boarhound is about the size of a Great Dane but I believe it has wiry hair.
Here in Portugal they have a dish made of tripe; it's called dobrada and it is this that McGonagall offers to Trelawney at the Christmas feast in the Portuguese version.
A jumper is a pullover sweater usually wool. Where did this word came from? I have no idea.
Looking forward to the next installment

Well, logically speaking... a sweater is something you pull over your head...

The more and more I read of the basic things american's can't understand, I mean "snogging", "balacalva" "trainers" and "jumpers" are basic fundamental things in helping you understand a certain situations. How anyone could not understand all these and still claim that they enjoy the books as much a someone who can is beyond me. :no:

The more and more I read of the basic things american's can't understand, I mean "snogging", "balacalva" "trainers" and "jumpers" are basic fundamental things in helping you understand a certain situations. How anyone could not understand all these and still claim that they enjoy the books as much a someone who can is beyond me. :no:


Oh - come one, we are not idiots. It's just a difference in culture. These are not main points or concepts. What the mind does not know, it fills in with what is known. Besides, we find it enjoyable to learn about things in European culture. That is part of the fun for me. I feel like saying something nasty to you but I will refrain.

Thanks so much for these two, and (in advance) the third article in this series. As a Canadian, and one over 50, I am familiar with almost all the terms and descriptions used by the esteemed JKR in the books. In fact, here in Canada, we get the British version, so when I read about Ron's (and Harry's) Christmas jumpers, I knew they were sweaters. I DID wonder what my American friends would think them to be, as well as what they might make of balaclavas, hosepipes, tripe and puddings (the term "pudding", by the way is used very differently in Canada these days than it used to be - a pudding, in the British sense is, essentially, a dessert (see Dickens' A Christmas Carol, when Tiny Tim extolls the virtues of a wonderful Christmas pudding). Nowadays, we here in Canada seem to use the North American harmonised version of "pudding", meaning something creamy and thick in a bowl, usually deriving from a box with the word Jello on it, though sometimes made from scratch.

Just one interesting note regarding Balaclavas. Indeed, the term came from the type of woven or knitted helmet worn by the British in the Battle of Balaclava. These head coverings were, apparently known as "protectors" prior to the battle in question. Why, then, the name change? Well, it seems there were TWO articles of clothing that were renamed as a result of that battle, because of the fame and sacrifice of the soldiers. The battle of Balaclava was none other than the famed "Charge of the Light Brigade", lead by the Earl of Cardigan. You guessed it fans! To commemorate that ill-fated charge, the knitted sweater the Earl wore was forever to be known as the cardigan, and the "protector" the soldiers wore, which didn't protect 300 of those 600, was renamed the Balaclava.

In any case, as you can see, I love this sort of information and look forward to Installment 3. Thanks to all who have contributed to this discussion!!

The_Old_One

Balaclava is not unknown to winter athletes in America. I own one, in fact. I think that people who live in the warmer climates of the USA would be less likely to see one or use one, though. They are usually only worn in extremely cold weather.

There's so many words that seem so common to me. It's weird. And i've never heard of a jumper being a type of dress. It's just a sweater or woolly top type thing. also, to my mind the word budgie usually applies to the small blue birds.

Hooray for part two! I knew all of the clothing, but as for tripe (ewwwwww) and the budgie, I had no clue what those were. How cute is that Scops Owl, by the way? No wonder Pig has a hard time with large packages. I gathered that he was small, but not that small! What about Eagle Owls? Those seem fairly popular with the antagonists of these books. Also, it's pretty common now in the U.S. for people to take cloth shopping bags with them to the grocery stores, especially the health food stores, and to farmer's markets.
And to you Brits who just can't believe that we "Yanks" don't know some of this stuff, you'd be surprised as to what you don't know about our culture, so ease up a bit, eh? We're all enjoying learning about your culture. You should be flattered.

best,
la femme

Oh - come one, we are not idiots. It's just a difference in culture. These are not main points or concepts. What the mind does not know, it fills in with what is known. Besides, we find it enjoyable to learn about things in European culture. That is part of the fun for me. I feel like saying something nasty to you but I will refrain.


I have to wholly disagree. Part three will reveal even more shortcomings in the americans fundamental understanding of JK Rowling's words. These are the elementary stages in grasping the context of the situation and the moods and feelings of characters as well as the enviroment. It is therefore obvious to conclude that without these I do not for one second believe that anyone who doesn't understand these will be able to in essence enjoy, appreciate and value the books as much as someone who does.

The fact that you even want to say something nasty for a mere opinion of mine does nothing to strengthens your argument but just adds to mine. :tu:

Yes, a buderigar is in fact a parakeet.

I don't know if my previous post posted, but....

The author was not sure if a Budgie and a parakeet were the same bird, and yes, they are.

And as far as the jumper is concerned, I was a fashion major and never once knew it was also a sweater. I have only heard it in reference to a dress that goes over a shirt ( like a denim jumper) or a pant/top combo, like it's all one thing.

I have to wholly disagree. Part three will reveal even more shortcomings in the americans fundamental understanding of JK Rowling's words. These are the elementary stages in grasping the context of the situation and the moods and feelings of characters as well as the enviroment. It is therefore obvious to conclude that without these I do not for one second believe that anyone who doesn't understand these will be able to in essence enjoy, appreciate and value the books as much as someone who does.

The fact that you even want to say something nasty for a mere opinion of mine does nothing to strengthens your argument but just adds to mine. :tu:


I would like to wholly disagree with everything that you have said. Part three will not reveal any more "shortcomings" in Americans' understanding of JKR's words, just as part one and two did not. He said that part three was going to be about constellations and flowers, two things that Americans can understand just as well as British people, and in some cases better. I, myself, have taken a college level Astronomy class, and feel that I probably know more about constellations than your average Brit reading the books.

I would further like to ask if you have ever read a book with difficult vocabulary. If so, you could still understand what was happening, you just have to make assumptions as to what it means. Not knowing precisely what a budgie is will not change the story at all. It is rather presumptuous of you to assume you understand something better than someone else does. There are probably things you missed too.

I feel bad for you if you cannot enjoy a book as much without knowing what each and every word means. In fact, looking up words and discovering what they mean can add even more joy to reading.

I love your musings on words. But you left out the one that gave me the most trouble to figure out. Marquee. I think of it as a movie marquee, which lists the movies that are playing, not a big tent. One can find out what any of these words mean by going to the Lexicon. That's a great site for all questions answered!

I would like to wholly disagree with everything that you have said. Part three will not reveal any more "shortcomings" in Americans' understanding of JKR's words, just as part one and two did not. He said that part three was going to be about constellations and flowers, two things that Americans can understand just as well as British people, and in some cases better. I, myself, have taken a college level Astronomy class, and feel that I probably know more about constellations than your average Brit reading the books.

I would further like to ask if you have ever read a book with difficult vocabulary. If so, you could still understand what was happening, you just have to make assumptions as to what it means. Not knowing precisely what a budgie is will not change the story at all. It is rather presumptuous of you to assume you understand something better than someone else does. There are probably things you missed too.

I feel bad for you if you cannot enjoy a book as much without knowing what each and every word means. In fact, looking up words and discovering what they mean can add even more joy to reading.


Dumbledore's girl please could you pick out one quote in which I said you can't enjoy a book without knowing what each and every word means??.

Difficult vocabularly is a whole different subject. As I have already stated understandind most of the words and phrases mentioned in the two editorials are part the elementary stages in grasping the context of the situation and the moods and feelings of characters as well as the enviroment. It's not about difficult vocabularly.

What has astronemy and constellations got to do with the issue at hand. Apart from the fact that Rowling rarely mentions them what were talking about are things Harry etc also all know about, and what i'm saying is that it is difficult for the american reader to relate to Harry et al and therefore understand, value and therefore enjoy the books as someone who does know the things mentioned.

ahh i could never figure out what a jumper was when ginny ran down the stairs in CoS asking her mother where her jumper was if she mean a dress or a sweatshirt....
i imagine its a sweatshirt though..i mean when i was 11 i didnyt feel the need to wear dresses everyday:cool:

I will comment on both parts of your editorial here! Wow! You have really shown me how different British culture is different from American. Yes, I did know there there was some differences, but not knowing what a Christmas Cracker was! It baffles me, but it was so intersting to read, something really different and not the same old editorals!Thank you!

You also remember McGonagall’s Christmas dinner crack at Trelawney: “Tripe, Sibyll?”

I don't know if Robbie realized this but to 'tripe' also means rubbish eg 'Sybill Trelawney's predictions are a load of old tripe'. Not sure what the American equivalent would be - garbage? Anyway, Professor McGonagall was having a real dig at her.

For American readers - do the books refer to mothers as 'Mum' or 'Mom' in the US editions?

I don't see how, in any way, not knowing the definition of the term "budgie" can detract from a reader's overall enjoyment of the books. The reader who didn't know what that term exactly meant was able to dicipher that a budgie was some form of an animal, I mean, it was fairly obivious. Same goes for "snogging," "balaclavas," and "trainers." "Jumper" would be confusing for most Americans as we have articles of clothing called "jumpers" as well and they are nothing like sweaters and not very popular, so to see the term used so often and for Harry to be wearing one is a bit odd.
I wonder, Boromir, that if you read any form of American literature you know the exact meaning of every American word, term, and food that isn't used everyday in the U.K.? Of course, you just might be so well versed on all of the American cultures and sub-cultures to know that there is indeed a difference between Mexican, Tex-Mex, and New Mexican food, and to that I would say, "Congratulations! Truly impressive for a 17 year young Englishman, especially since most Americans don't know that."
Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to get ready to leave my casita (house), put some gas (petrol) in my ride (car) and head of to work.

best,
la femme

P.S. Pale_Empress, the books use, "Mum." :)

America culture is like an other world when compared to English culture.

It is really interesting to see how different both cultures are!

I am English which is the same as British.

I can not believe you guys don't have Chirstmas Crackers!!

America culture is like an other world when compared to English culture.

It is really interesting to see how different both cultures are!

I am English which is the same as British.

I can not believe you guys don't have Chirstmas Crackers!!

They are slowly becoming more popular now. I see them in a lot of stores around Christmas time. Martha Stewart even showed people how to make them on her TV show. I've been familiar with them for a while because my best friend's mom was Scottish as so they used to have them. They're quite fun!

best,
la femme

Thanks for these editoirals! I knew most of these things, but it is reassuring to know for sure that I was right. Now that line from CoS about Ginny's jumper being on the cat makes sense! Ok, no that's still weird but it sounds more reasonable! But as an American, I thank you for writing these articles, it's nice to know what these words are and not have to feel like an idiot for not knowing! These are certainly a refreshing change from the normal articles! :tu:

I can't believe that you don't know the difference between a sneaker and a trainer.

Who would have thought such an innocent editorial would have brought out negative posts....hmmm how sad.

I think the younger kids ( 7-maybe young teen) who read the books and come to the site would really enjoy this editorial. My own kids didn't really understand the different terms...but still know just about everything HARRY!

I as an adult knew most of the things but not the different foods and as I had mentioned before the whole snogging thing...but figured that out pretty quick. I think for most adults we got it..... but younger kids may not understand the different terms. So anyway, this is a fun editorial to share with them and show them the different foods and items.

So thank you again!

Thanks, yes, I did catch the irony in McGonagall's "Tripe, Sibyll?" remark. It's always been one of my favorite lines in POA.

Also, please don't be offended that I used the word British rather than English. I was trying to be "all inclusive" and I believe "British" includes Scottish.

Didn't the American edition of Sorcerer's Stone use "Mom" instead of "Mum?"

Honestly, I could have gone on and on and on with these editorials. Perhaps it would have been pointless. Most Americans don't need help guessing that "football" means "soccer" in a British book, or that a "side" in sports is the same as a "team," or that "supporters" are the folks cheering for a particular side. These aren't the way we generally use the words, but we're not completely incapable of following the context. Our education may have been "sadly neglected" but we're not dummies. The point of this 3-parter is not so much to explain things no American could guess for him- or herself, but to confirm his or her guesses with solid, visual evidence.

Great editorial, but I do have a little problem with one thing in it. Being a person who knows a lot about dogs, I must say that the picture posted in this editorial is not actually of a Boarhound, it is of a Neopolitan Mastiff, which is Fang's breed in the movie but not in the book. Movie Fang is a Neo, but book Fang is a black Boarhound which is an old term for a Great Dane. So this picture of Fang should actually be of a black Great Dane, not a Neo.

It always fascinates me to see the ways cultures differ even though they all speak english - I'm half english/british and half australian so I'm used to differences between them, but although I have read some American books they tend to show what you do have, whereas this is a brilliant illustration of what you don't. A jumper is definately a woollen top, not a dress (I never knew there was a sort of dress called a jumper!), also known as a jersey or a cardigan if it has buttons down the front (Harry probably won't be wearing a cardigan - they tend to be worn by girls not boys). A sweater or sweatshirt in Britain usually means a warm top not made of wool (although these are sometimes called jumpers too) that in general won't be handmade (Molly Weasley's Christmas jumpers are definately woollen).

Great idea for an editorial.

Geez, Americans are so darn insulated. Here in Australia we grew up reading books set in the US and Britain, and of course we came across unfamiliar words (primarily in the US books) like bangs, cookies, etc. But we eventually figured it out - through basic logic. I think the problem is that a lot of overseas literature is edited before being published in the US to remove non-US terms and replace them. One of my favourite books, set in Sydney, was edited so porridge became oatmeal in the US version, netball became volleyball (though those sports are two entirely different things) etc etc. It's a shame some American publishing is so insulated - part of the joy of reading is about learning new things and experiencing the unfamiliar vicariously. Obviously they haven't changed the Harry Potter terminology (well, some of it) because of the immense popularity of the books - they don't need to alter it to make it more palatable to an American mind to boost sales.

Btw, budgies are Australian birds that have become popular as pets in England. Though Americans call them parakeets, that's misleading, as parakeet refers to many varieties of small parrots.

I'm British, and I know that there are a lot of cultural differences between here and the US. I actaully really want to experience a year of living with all of you, then you should come and live here for a year. I remember once I tried to eexplain what a pantomime was to some American friends, it's such an English thing...

But the crackers are really getting me, it wouldn't be Christmas without the silly hats and the really bad jokes and tacky presents (this year I got a crocodile shaped bottle opener, yay!).

But anyhoo, I really really enjoyed this! Lots of them were expected, like the jumper. When I went to Swizerland we had to get some Girl Scouts to explain to us what the difference was between a sweater and something else... Can't remember what the alternative was!

Additionally, I've never had the misfortune of eating tripe.

A sweater or sweatshirt in Britain usually means a warm top not made of wool (although these are sometimes called jumpers too) that in general won't be handmade (Molly Weasley's Christmas jumpers are definately woollen).

What you just described is what Americans call a sweatshirt. As Aulie pointed out, Americans might have to go to great lengths to explain the difference between a sweater and a sweatshirt, which are the same thing to the British. No American would ever call a knitted jumper a sweatshirt, nor would they call a woolen top a sweater.

We Americans are not especially insulated compared to other folks. Like everybody, we're occupied with our own business, only it just happens to be different in many ways from business in other countries. We really do need "netball" to be changed into "volleyball" because we have no idea what "netball" is or what the fact that a character plays it says about that character. We insist on the word "soccer" for football because, like Canadians and Australians, we have something called "football" that isn't quite what the rest of the world calls football. And if you start talking about cricket in the presence of an American, expect his/her eyes to go all glassy. Every time we see the Olympics or tune into an international sports broadcast we discover new things. But that's all right--it's not that we're so sheltered that we have no games to play when we go to the gym. We have lots of games! But they're ours.

I don't want to let anyone get away with this idea that Americans are unusually "sheltered." America happens to be a very big, and very diverse, country. It can become almost a world unto itself. This can make Americans seem sheltered sometimes, because there's a thin line between being "self-sufficient" and being "self-absorbed." But suppose you're from Australia or England -- just think about how different your life would be if you lived in a country where you could drive for a week and still be in the same country, surrounded by people who share the same language and experiences. For example, the trip I used to drive to see my parents, from Arizona to Missouri, covers a distance in cultural terms from, say, Cornwall to Kent, but in geographical terms, from Paris to Moscow. So for an American to imagine himself in a country where an entire culture exists within a territory the size of Oregon, is magic indeed!

On a cultural note: tripe (animal's stomach) is extremely tasty (apologies to the vegetarians)!

I did not know that Mexicans used it so much. Greeks use it in soup too: one is the standard soup you will eat on Easter's night (which comes after 40 days of fasting, so I suppose you are ready to eat anything), and the other one is again a standard soup that it combines brilliantly with a semi-drunk and hunger situation -you go party until 5-6am, you are tired, tipsy, and most importantly hungry, and then you go to one of these little shops that are always across a club and you get a tripe soup with lots and lots of dried chili peper flakes (I suppose again that the inebriated state you are in makes you find the soup devine)!

Parenthetical comments aside, I truly like that stuff! Goes well with brains, intestines, and kidneys (all of them stuff that you can find in such a soup)!

The more and more I read of the basic things american's can't understand, I mean "snogging", "balacalva" "trainers" and "jumpers" are basic fundamental things in helping you understand a certain situations. How anyone could not understand all these and still claim that they enjoy the books as much a someone who can is beyond me. :no:

To you and also to Aurocka, who finds Americans "so darn insulated," I have copied the end of my post from the first of these editorials:

As for whether the Brits or the Yanks (which outside this country often applies to all Americans, not just Northerners) enjoy the Potter books more, I think the main difference is that Brits enter a new world of wizards and magic and hippogriffs and giants. Americans get to enter that world, but we also get to enter the world of castles and other buildings that are over 300 years old, trainers, public school (which over here means something entirely different), and gardens (which are really just yards, but sound so much nicer and often are). So I guess it's a matter of whether you like having the familiar to anchor you as you enter the magical world, or whether you like the challange of entering two new worlds. As an Anglophile, I have enjoyed my time in both.

I don't disagree that American publishers do tend to Americanize some things, although I didn't find many glaring differences when reading my Bloomsbury copy of SS/PS. I have spent a fair amount of time in Britain over the years, including some time at University, and there were still a couple of things I wasn't familiar with but I was, like most adult readers, able to understand from context. I am sure that we could dig up some things that would be strange to people from Britain or Australia, as well.

I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but I was rather surprised with the bit about the prefect badge and the headboy badge. Robbie Fischer said that the idea of prefects were not that common in America. Is that really true? I'm asking all you Americans out there. Because here in Australia, every school has prefects and school captains (headboy/girl) and we get badges as well.

It is a very interesting editorial. Words like jumper, budgie, balaclava and crackers are very common here in Australia, but we do certainly use the word soccer instead of football, like America. Maybe we're just a mix of British and American words. :D

Robbie Fischer said that the idea of prefects were not that common in America. Is that really true? I'm asking all you Americans out there. Because here in Australia, every school has prefects and school captains (headboy/girl) and we get badges as well....We do certainly use the word soccer instead of football, like America. Maybe we're just a mix of British and American words. :D

Well, it's been a long time since I was in school, but I don't remember ever having prefects or school captains. In the lower grades we had "hall monitors" who were students deputized by the teacher to help maintain order in the hallways. In high school we had the valedictorian & salutatorian, who were the top 2 students in each graduating class ("year" in British terminology), but they were only designated at the end of their last year & their only job was to give a speech at the graduation ceremony. In college we had "RA's" (resident assistants) who mainly helped new students settle in (like Percy Weasley in PS/SS) and tried to keep the noise level down to a dull roar.

We also had things like "class president and vice president" and "student senate" and I suppose even a "student body president." The class officers were generally elected only by the senior class and their job was to pick the colors for the Prom (formal ball) and maybe to extort donations from their classmates to buy a commemorative gift for the school. The student senate was pretty much a mock government that, maybe, brought in some guest lecturers or administered student publications, etc. So I suppose you could call the student body president a "school captain," but I don't remember ever knowing who the president of my student body was (except when it was me) and he/I certainly didn't wear a badge to announce the fact. Nobody outside the student senate & the people who ran against them for election really cared about it.

As for the soccer thing, isn't there a uniquely Australian game called "football" in that country? I seem to remember seeing some games on cable TV.

Words are interesting aren't they. Like Fire Angel I am also an Aussie and yes, we have very little trouble with the British words as our culture is largely affected by Britain due to our historical links. We are also pretty savvy on American culture as most of our TV shows are American.

Like the British we have always had Christmas Crackers but here we call them Bon Bons.

By the way, you pronounce budgerigars like this: bud - like a flower bud; ger - like in Germany; rigar - rhymes with cigar.

One of the best experiences I have had with my Harry Potter has been my online chats with my sister in law (who is french). She had read all the Potter books in French and then decided to read them in English. She had so many questions about vocabulary and phrases and cliches and sayings ..... some were very hard to answer but it was very enjoyable sharing the answers with her.

As to all the squabbling about who which cultures can appreciate the books more, I'd like to think that all of us are richer for reading this captivating series. All of us take away something unique from the experience of reading a book.

Like the British we have always had Christmas Crackers but here we call them Bon Bons.

In America, Bon Bons are a coconut candy with a hard candy shell (in a variety of colors). I used to sell them in our local "five and dime". :p

As to all the squabbling about who which cultures can appreciate the books more, I'd like to think that all of us are richer for reading this captivating series. All of us take away something unique from the experience of reading a book.

Thank you for that.

Ok everyone I'm going to ask that we stick to the actual editorial here and not insulting one anothers cultures.

Back on topic then!

I don't see how, in any way, not knowing the definition of the term "budgie" can detract from a reader's overall enjoyment of the books. The reader who didn't know what that term exactly meant was able to dicipher that a budgie was some form of an animal, I mean, it was fairly obivious. Same goes for "snogging," "balaclavas," and "trainers." "Jumper" would be confusing for most Americans as we have articles of clothing called "jumpers" as well and they are nothing like sweaters and not very popular, so to see the term used so often and for Harry to be wearing one is a bit odd.
I wonder, Boromir, that if you read any form of American literature you know the exact meaning of every American word, term, and food that isn't used everyday in the U.K.? Of course, you just might be so well versed on all of the American cultures and sub-cultures to know that there is indeed a difference between Mexican, Tex-Mex, and New Mexican food, and to that I would say, "Congratulations! Truly impressive for a 17 year young Englishman, especially since most Americans don't know that."
Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to get ready to leave my casita (house), put some gas (petrol) in my ride (car) and head of to work.

best,
la femme

P.S. Pale_Empress, the books use, "Mum." :)


Of course I don't know every thing about american culture and sub culture. But that is not what I am trying to say anyway. If I were to read american literature, which I have had the fortune (but on many occasions misfortune) of reading there are many aspects that I don't quite understand and therefore cannot essentially relate to and enjoy as much as others. So what you are suggesting is only further highlighting my point.

"Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to get ready to leave my casita (house), put some gas (petrol) in my ride (car) and head of to work."

And interestingly enough I find nothing exiting in learning about your "cultures words", in the sentence quoted. :err:

Geez, Americans are so darn insulated. Here in Australia we grew up reading books set in the US and Britain, and of course we came across unfamiliar words (primarily in the US books) like bangs, cookies, etc. But we eventually figured it out - through basic logic. I think the problem is that a lot of overseas literature is edited before being published in the US to remove non-US terms and replace them. One of my favourite books, set in Sydney, was edited so porridge became oatmeal in the US version, netball became volleyball (though those sports are two entirely different things) etc etc. It's a shame some American publishing is so insulated - part of the joy of reading is about learning new things and experiencing the unfamiliar vicariously. Obviously they haven't changed the Harry Potter terminology (well, some of it) because of the immense popularity of the books - they don't need to alter it to make it more palatable to an American mind to boost sales.

Btw, budgies are Australian birds that have become popular as pets in England. Though Americans call them parakeets, that's misleading, as parakeet refers to many varieties of small parrots.

Exactly aurocka. Mostly, as usual they bend over backwards to change it for the americans and it does nothing in helping them learn about different cultures and societies. This coupled with their weak education system is definately not a good combination.

However the Potter books on the whole have proved thankfully to be mostly to be beyond this. Apart from the "socerors stone" fiasco. But unlike the Ausralians and others, they havn't benefited from a gradual process but it is the first one, and that is the reason for my views.:tu:

Ok everyone I'm going to ask that we stick to the actual editorial here and not insulting one anothers cultures.

Back on topic then!

Lissele I don't personally think this is an issue of insulting other people's cultures's but is about highlighting the evident differences and trying to understand how one enables you to relate to the Hp books far more easily and in turn resulting in better enjoyment.

Boromir, I still don't understand why a few foreign terms can make the books less enjoyable for me. Sure, our education system is weak, but that doesn't mean I, as a 13-year-old American, have ever had any trouble with terms that I don't recognize. Not knowing exactly what each of the different foods looks and tastes like doesn't effect the meaning, and while I may not have know what a balaclava was, or hadn't come across the word "snogging" before, in context it's perfectly clear that one is a head covering and the other is a slang for kissing.

These editorials are interesting to me because they inform me about things specific to another culture, but they don't add to the meaning of the books at all. I can relate to Harry's world just fine without being able to picture what wine gums are. We can recognize that Christmas crackers are an enjoyable and traditional part of Christmas in Britain, and since we have our own individual customs, we know what it means to Harry and everyone else.

Thanks again, Robbie, for these fascinating editorials.:tu:

Another fun read! Thanks!

One correction—I don't think that the Fang in the films is a boarhound. It looks like a Neopolitan mastiff, a breed native to Italy and recently recognized by the American Kennel Club as a member of the Working group, not a hound. From what I can find, a boarhound is another name for Great Dane, although it may not be the same breed Americans recognize.



Yes, a Boarhound is a Great Dane it's what they were originally bred to hunt. The only main difference really from an American Great Dane would be that the ears of the European dogs are left natural, not cropped. Also, you are correct that the Fang in the fims is a Neopolitan Mastiff, a blue one (which is a common color for them) .

Re: "balaclava"

A major battle of the Crimean War, between Russia on one side and France, Britain and the Ottoman Empire on the other, was fought in Balaclava Valley. The famous "Charge of the Light Brigade" occurred in this battle.

The commander of the British forces was Lord Raglan. The commander of the Light Brigade was the Earl of Cardigan.

The balaclava hat was named for this battle, and the cardigan sweater was named for the Earl because of their use during the Crimean War. (As you might guess, British troops had to suffer through a bitterly cold winter.) The raglan sleeve was named after the Lord, but from an earlier war. Raglan had his right arm amputated in the Battle of Waterloo. The raglan sleeve was apparently invented to accommodate the missing arm, although I don't know how this worked.

Well, it's been a long time since I was in school, but I don't remember ever having prefects or school captains. In the lower grades we had "hall monitors" who were students deputized by the teacher to help maintain order in the hallways. In high school we had the valedictorian & salutatorian, who were the top 2 students in each graduating class ("year" in British terminology), but they were only designated at the end of their last year & their only job was to give a speech at the graduation ceremony. In college we had "RA's" (resident assistants) who mainly helped new students settle in (like Percy Weasley in PS/SS) and tried to keep the noise level down to a dull roar.

We also had things like "class president and vice president" and "student senate" and I suppose even a "student body president." The class officers were generally elected only by the senior class and their job was to pick the colors for the Prom (formal ball) and maybe to extort donations from their classmates to buy a commemorative gift for the school. The student senate was pretty much a mock government that, maybe, brought in some guest lecturers or administered student publications, etc. So I suppose you could call the student body president a "school captain," but I don't remember ever knowing who the president of my student body was (except when it was me) and he/I certainly didn't wear a badge to announce the fact. Nobody outside the student senate & the people who ran against them for election really cared about it.

As for the soccer thing, isn't there a uniquely Australian game called "football" in that country? I seem to remember seeing some games on cable TV.


Wow...all these leadership roles sound so complex yet interesting. For me it's just every year we elect a School Captain, then a Vice Captain and a Senior Prefect and then about 20 to 30 prefects. I find it really interesting that you guys didnt' wear badges. At my school (I'm in my final year and so a few of my friends are prefects) people make quite a big fuss over prefect election/nomination and the whole badge thing. Reminds me a bit of Ron and Percy.

And yes there is a unique Australian game called football, or rather, here we call it footy, and it is quite different to soccer.

Jumpers are not only known as sweaters, they can sometimes be called

1. Pullovers

2. Jerseys

3. Guernseys


And the word budgerigar is pronounced bud-jer-i-gar. A budgerigar is a small bird of the parakeet family native to Australia. And so the name is shortened to budgie.

I liked this series of articles and appreciate the explanations for the non-British. Thank you.

Hey, we have the word "jersey" too - but I don't think it means sweater. I think, in the U.S., "jersey" means the top part of an athletic uniform, like the big sort of numbered shirt thing American football players wear on top of all their pads.

We would probably be amused to hear someone's sweater pointed out as a "guernsey." Many of us think of Guernsey as a breed of cattle. It would be like saying, "Look at the cow she's got on!"

Jersey cows are much prized as well

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y4/MundunguFletc/jersey_cow_350x350.jpg

The jumper garments are called Jerseys and Guernseys because the technique of dying the wool without stripping the natural oils out of it was first developed on those islands. This was particularly useful for sailors, who needed waterproof woollens.

FishEByrd, I think you hit the nail on the head! I was thinking along the same lines as for how vast the US is compared to the UK. I'm not insulted that some people think we Americans are "sheltered". We just have enough home grown terms and knowledge to keep up with. I've lived all over the Midwest and Southern states and have had to adjust my vocabulary with each move just to remain local in my speech (I deal a lot with the public in my work.) I once had a job in South Carolina that I had to leave because I could not get customers orders right because I couldn't understand what they were asking for. I wasn't upset that I had to give up my job. I knew it was what was best for both of us. I just hadn't lived in that area long enough to understand the southern lingo. Eventually it all worked out but it took some studying on my part during conversations to understand. And this all happened in a major city in my own country. And again when I lived in Minnesota, I would have people chuckle at terms I used for different things. They weren't making fun of me. They just didn't understand why I didn't use the term they used. One example of this is...HOw to say I want a Pepsi...Do you want a soda, a pop, a soda pop, a coke (eventhough Coke is a brand name it can mean any soda even an orange soda) and that's just in the Midwest and South. I don't know what they call it in the West and New England states.

I think people in the UK may have an advantage over us because they can take a train to Paris in a day (or so I understand) and be in a totally different culture. They're use to being exposed to different cultures on a more frequent basis whereas Americans tend to stay in the same area for most of their lives.

Oddly enough I turned on Animal Planet last night and they were doing a show on dogs. The segment they were on when I turned it on was about various Hunting dogs in use in older times in Europe and what they were used for. They had an Irish Wolfhound, a Scottish Deerhound, and Otter hound, and yep, a Boarhound/Great Dane. Two actually, but one was Fawn and one Brindle, not Black like Fang.

Hello everyone :) Enjoyed the editorial. I think it could have been better had you consulted some real Brits, but it was still good.


But the crackers are really getting me, it wouldn't be Christmas without the silly hats and the really bad jokes and tacky presents (this year I got a crocodile shaped bottle opener, yay!).

LOL your crackers were expensive compared to mine then!

I would like to encourage everyone to resist arguing with the US-haters here. Basic intelligence allows anyone to work out meaning from context, and most of the items in this editorial are interesting but not vital to understanding the books. I sometimes have to use context when reading American literature (especially on newer terms).

:tu:

Boromir, I still don't understand why a few foreign terms can make the books less enjoyable for me. Sure, our education system is weak, but that doesn't mean I, as a 13-year-old American, have ever had any trouble with terms that I don't recognize. Not knowing exactly what each of the different foods looks and tastes like doesn't effect the meaning, and while I may not have know what a balaclava was, or hadn't come across the word "snogging" before, in context it's perfectly clear that one is a head covering and the other is a slang for kissing.

These editorials are interesting to me because they inform me about things specific to another culture, but they don't add to the meaning of the books at all. I can relate to Harry's world just fine without being able to picture what wine gums are. We can recognize that Christmas crackers are an enjoyable and traditional part of Christmas in Britain, and since we have our own individual customs, we know what it means to Harry and everyone else.

Thanks again, Robbie, for these fascinating editorials.:tu:

It's touching, abbeyroad that a young American like yourself is aware of the comparatively feeble education system in the country which you reside. but rather ironically you still have failed to understand or even perhaps bothered to fully read what I have previously said.

In response to your extremely simplistic view, not knowing what different foods are and basic terminology used by JK Rowling to describe the different sitautions, and with that give the full effect and significance of the current mood and atmosphere as well as the different emotions and sensations felt by the characters you are essentially unable to relate to and value what is fundamentally going on as well as someone who does.

Therefore, on the whole of course it effects the meaning. These editorials shouldn't be just interesting but are fundamentally stepping stone's for you and others to (not before time), to better understand the culture in which your's and my precious books are set as well as written in.

Weather it can by the same thing as someone already leaned in the culture I don't know.:err:

HAHA! These editorials have made me laugh so much! I never realised how many different words America has from Britain!

Well we did invent the language....you lot just plagiarized it & took letters out to make your lives easier :p :lol:

What your suggesting is that I am saying an American's and others not familiar with these terms cannot enjoy the books, which cannot be further from the truth, what I am saying is that they cannot for the many reasons mentioned as much as people who are.

That is part of the fun for me. I feel like saying something nasty to you but I will refrain.

Aww go on, don't be a spoilsport lol. Seriesly though, a lot of ppl think that Americans are as thick as 2 short planks but to be fair, a lot of ppl also think that us Brits all have stiff upper lips & the only thing we know how to do in a crisis is make a cuppa!! The brew I can do, nothing stiff about my upper lip :lol:

Not sure about our buddies in Canada though...what's the stereotype for Canadians apart from the RCMP? :hmm:

Ok this is the last time I'm going to say in this thread or any of the other threads, I will not stand for people insulting other cultures or making snide remarks.

I want to stress that people from all countries and all walks of life enjoy the Harry Potter series for a wide range of reasons. Now I want us to get back please to discussing the very excellent article written and not the american school system versus anyone elses!

If anyone isn't happy with what's contained in a post, you can report it to staff using the "!" on the top right hand side of the post.

If needs be I will give warnings.

I'm just making friendly jokes, can't speak for others though....

I'm just talking common sense, not sure about anyone else.

You're talking about what's common sense to you....not everyone shares your views. Certainly makes life interesting though! :lol:

I do not possess a photographic memory, so when I first read any book I miss many details. This is more because I am interested in the whole story instead of minor points (even though they may be important). This is no different than viewing a painting. I'm not worried about the type of paint or brush that the artist used. At first viewing I'm just wanting to enjoy the whole image. I'm just trying to soak in the whole thing.

As I've re-read the books, I've taken time (as an American) to learn what some of the unfamiliar terms/concepts are. Since I have taken the time to fill in the gaps this HAS increased my overall enjoyment of the books and the series as a whole. I can now appreciate many of the little things that Rowling has included in this series, which increases my appreciation of just how well the Harry Potter world has been created. However, I never felt that not having a fully complete image of a jumper or tart has taken away my understanding as a whole. I have missed a few funny moments though.

I think what we can take from these editorials is that for some of us not as familiar with British language that we should take some extra time to understand what we are missing. Older readers/parents should take some time to introduce younger readers to a new culture. This is another example of how Harry Potter as a whole has been a good thing for young and old readers.

But to illustrate how language differs, as an American the following makes perfect sense to me. "While waiting for a dog to come off my grill, I enjoyed some fries and a pop. When I returned back to my lazy-boy, I watched the slugger blast a bomb into the cheap seats while I high-fived my buddy." Or how about this? "I hopped in my ride and raced down to the 7-11 and grabbed a case of Bud. On the way back to my crib I got pulled over by the fuzz which ruined my day." Does this make sense to someone in Britain? Maybe, maybe not.

But to illustrate how language differs, as an American the following makes perfect sense to me. "While waiting for a dog to come off my grill, I enjoyed some fries and a pop. When I returned back to my lazy-boy, I watched the slugger blast a bomb into the cheap seats while I high-fived my buddy." Or how about this? "I hopped in my ride and raced down to the 7-11 and grabbed a case of Bud. On the way back to my crib I got pulled over by the fuzz which ruined my day." Does this make sense to someone in Britain? Maybe, maybe not.

What about someone from IReland ;)

While you're waiting for your hot dog/sauseage to cook you had some chips and fizzy drink. You went back to your chair and watched some baseball player (I have no idea of the positions!) hit a long/high one intio the crowd. You celebrated by doing a high 5 with your friend.

You got into your car, went to the local shop for a case of Bud. On the way home you got pulled over by the police which ruined your day.


:D

Okay, maybe baseball isn't a good example. :)

:rotfl: I just about get soccer and rugby and the irish sports. Baseball and cricket confuse me utterly. That and they're not really played here.

I understand where you're coming from though, I think most things are self explainatory if taken in context. To be honest although I'm from Ireland and we've very similiar lifestyles to those in the UK there are a couple of things I had to read a few times to get. The Pumpkin Pastry is definitely one. I just don't understand WHY! But it's good to learn ;)

But to illustrate how language differs, as an American the following makes perfect sense to me. "While waiting for a dog to come off my grill, I enjoyed some fries and a pop. When I returned back to my lazy-boy, I watched the slugger blast a bomb into the cheap seats while I high-fived my buddy." Or how about this? "I hopped in my ride and raced down to the 7-11 and grabbed a case of Bud. On the way back to my crib I got pulled over by the fuzz which ruined my day." Does this make sense to someone in Britain? Maybe, maybe not.
I think it probably helps that we see more films and TV programmes from the US than those in the US would see British films and TV programmes.

The first Potter book I read was Order of the Phoenix and without reading the previous books it was difficult to make sense of some of the things being referred to: Dementors, Quidditch etc. It took a second reading to understand the plot once I'd figured out roughly what these things were (I didn't get Quidditch until I read GoF).

We do get British programs, though. Some of my favorite shows came from across the water. And some not-so-favorite ones that I just had to watch a lot because nothing else was on at that time of night! Let's hear it for Red Dwarf...Keeping Up Appearances...Fawlty Towers...Ballykissangel...the occasional Doctor Who...Cracker...As Time Goes By...Monty Python's Flying Circus...to be sure, we get mostly the mysteries and the sitcoms...and the shows with people who speak "proper" English go over better, because they don't require subtitles like the shows set, for example, in the Northeast...

And then there's Scotland. What a fascinating, rich dialect they have. The part of me (maybe one-twelfth) that is of Scots lineage wakes up and looks around when it hears dialogue in Scots English. It doesn't know what the &#@% it's looking at, though. I read one of those police procedurals by Ian Rankin..."Black and Blue" to be exact...and it wasn't much easier than reading Goethe in the original German. I'd like to know, I'd really like to know, is "paraffin budgie" REALLY a slang term for a helicopter? Why paraffin, anyway? Isn't that a kind of wax used to maintain an airtight seal in home-canned jelly? I'm all ears.

Paraffin is a fuel used in heaters that is probably the same as aviation fuel (it smells the same) I don't believe anyone ever called a helicopter a paraffin budgie though
Indy Racer wrote
However, I never felt that not having a fully complete image of a jumper or tart has taken away my understanding as a whole. I have missed a few funny moments though.
I'm sure you're right. Unless you know that Scotch Tape is known as Sellotape over here Spellotape will rather pass you by - but it's hardly integral to understanding the plot

edit- what we call paraffin is kerosene in the US

Budgie is slang for helicopter.

:rotfl: I just about get soccer and rugby and the irish sports.

When you say soccer I take it you mean the beautiful game? "Soccer" is an Americanism & means nothing to the majority of the rest of the world. Football is the worldwide recognised name for a game where you move a ball with your foot. Soccer should just not be allowed :p :lol: Even Mr I'm So Wonderful (aka David Beckham) has started calling it soccer now he's moving.

I really can't understand why you can't just call it football & drop the "American" when you're talking about it. I must admit I havent spent much time watching American football, but from what I've seen, there's a lot of throwning & running with the ball. It's like Aussie rules...& that's more like rugby. My partner has been trying to explain the rules of rugby league for 8 yrs & I'm still none the wiser!!! :no:

haha i love this, i knew that there was a difference in english between America and Britain, but you've got to laugh about it, some words that i use daily would make no sense to you guys across the pond! it's classic.

over the last summer, i spent 3 months working in a summer camp in Vermont, and to be honest, it was an education, there were a lot of differences in the way the locals spoke and the way i did, it's funny how we speak the same language, but not the same dialect. there were some things that i would say to some of the kids, and they would have no clue what i was talking about. mind you i did have a Britaish-American english dictionary with me when i was there last summer, didnt use it much though..... i think i watch too much american tv, so i didnt really have much difficulty in understanding the cultural differences :D i have to say the best one was cletes/footwear for football (is that how you spell it?) is what i would call studs.

but you know, this difference in the way we speak can even be found back in Britain, back here in Wales i could be speaking welsh with someone thats only a couple of towns away from my home, but a lot of the time i find it hard to understand what they are talking about, because their dialect is slightly different to mine. obviously the language is more or less the same, but like American/British english there are slight variations in dialect, so if i find it hard to understand some words or phrases that my frineds, who live only a stone throw away use. So it's quite understandable that Americans would find it hard to a degree to understand British terms for things in the HP series. i do find it amusing though! it's crazy!

as to good tv programmes from britain, i would suggest watching Only Fools and Horses, it's the best ever! you guys form over in the States might not get it though, but it's great! you should give it a try!

oh yes, and to important matters, football, calling it soccer is blasphemous and sacrilege! :D football is what it is internationally known as, and only in North America is it known as soccer, i dont understand this... potterbuff is right, why is the NFL/American Football called that, it has nothing to do with kicking the ball, the only time the foot comes into play is during a punt and conversion kicks, there's more foot/ball contact in rugby, yet they mostly carry the ball, and they still dont use the term football, well... some clubs are known as RFC (rugby football clubs) but thats more to do with history than anything, keeping tradition. Oh yes one more thing, how can the Colts, and all the other superbowl winners of the past be considered world champions, when the NFL is only exclusively played in the States.... surely they're champions of America, same for the 'world series' in baseball...... get my point? :D sorry im going on a bit of a rant now hehe!

but about the editorial, it was a very interesting read! funny how there's so many differences in dialect between two nations who claim to speak the same language! classic!

When you say soccer I take it you mean the beautiful game? "Soccer" is an Americanism & means nothing to the majority of the rest of the world. Football is the worldwide recognised name for a game where you move a ball with your foot. Soccer should just not be allowed :p :lol: Even Mr I'm So Wonderful (aka David Beckham) has started calling it soccer now he's moving.
Soccer isn't in fact an Americanism but an abbreviation of "Association football", which was coined when some university types wrote down some rules for the game (previously football was the favourite pastime of "the great unwashed" and rules just didn't get written down or even adhered to during play). So it's basically snobbery towards the upper classes that prevented soccer being widely used in Britain.

Soccer isn't in fact an Americanism but an abbreviation of "Association football", which was coined when some university types wrote down some rules for the game (previously football was the favourite pastime of "the great unwashed" and rules just didn't get written down or even adhered to during play). So it's basically snobbery towards the upper classes that prevented soccer being widely used in Britain.

Very true that soccer is an abbreviation of "Association Football", and that the old favourite "mob football" as it's known now played by the working class had no real rules but I don't follow that snobbery part aftwerwards:no:

Regardless, what a previos poster was trying to say is why do the Americans call a game that rarely uses the feet and more the hands, body and huge padding "Football" rather then the beatiful game that the rest of the world call "football". Which as the name suggests uses the primarily the feet.:shrug:

i think mob football had some rules, not in the sense that football or any other sport has today, there was only one golden main rule, it was to carry a ball from one end into the opposition's end to score the goal, using any means necessary, to do it, excluding taking someone's life, but fouling and hurting someone was common place in the game! what a great game that would be, i think they should bring it back... good times! just like british bulldogs!

haha i love this, i knew that there was a difference in english between America and Britain, but you've got to laugh about it, some words that i use daily would make no sense to you guys across the pond! it's classic.

over the last summer, i spent 3 months working in a summer camp in Vermont, and to be honest, it was an education, there were a lot of differences in the way the locals spoke and the way i did, it's funny how we speak the same language, but not the same dialect. there were some things that i would say to some of the kids, and they would have no clue what i was talking about. mind you i did have a Britaish-American english dictionary with me when i was there last summer, didnt use it much though..... i think i watch too much american tv, so i didnt really have much difficulty in understanding the cultural differences :D i have to say the best one was cletes/footwear for football (is that how you spell it?) is what i would call studs.

but you know, this difference in the way we speak can even be found back in Britain, back here in Wales i could be speaking welsh with someone thats only a couple of towns away from my home, but a lot of the time i find it hard to understand what they are talking about, because their dialect is slightly different to mine. obviously the language is more or less the same, but like American/British english there are slight variations in dialect, so if i find it hard to understand some words or phrases that my frineds, who live only a stone throw away use. So it's quite understandable that Americans would find it hard to a degree to understand British terms for things in the HP series. i do find it amusing though! it's crazy!
(...)
but about the editorial, it was a very interesting read! funny how there's so many differences in dialect between two nations who claim to speak the same language! classic!

The highlighted word is spelled "cleats", also used on baseball shoes.

Having been in Vermont (part of New England) you have been in the most "British-sounding dialect/accent in the whole U.S., if you would travel to the "South" (SE U.S.) you would find a whole different language and almost unintelligible accent. After 37 years of living here, I still find areas/pockets where I have to listen real closely or ask someone to repeat. It's not just accent, sometimes it the word or phrase used to get the point across.

I imagine it is like the different areas of the U.K., only our "regions" are much larger.

Speaking of the Southern United States - look up Jeff Foxworthy as he is a comedian who has made a living off of making fun of that part of the US. Also look up his Redneck Dictionary to get some examples of how that part of the U.S. has a unique way of saying things. Obviously it is meant to be funny, but there is some truth in how things are said.

The highlighted word is spelled "cleats", also used on baseball shoes.


haha thanks, i thought i might have spelt it wrong!

Having been in Vermont (part of New England) you have been in the most "British-sounding dialect/accent in the whole U.S., if you would travel to the "South" (SE U.S.) you would find a whole different language and almost unintelligible accent. After 37 years of living here, I still find areas/pockets where I have to listen real closely or ask someone to repeat. It's not just accent, sometimes it the word or phrase used to get the point across.

I imagine it is like the different areas of the U.K., only our "regions" are much larger.

yeah i kind of gathered that Vermont might have a bit more british influence than other parts due to it's historical connections with britain during the industrial periods of the late 18th and throughout the 19th century! but vermont it's self was actually french to start with if im correct, just take a look at the towns there, montpellier for instance.... :D maybe there's a french connection aswell :D lol no, it's been many years since britain had a direct influence over New England, i think that everywhere throughout the US, N.E included is Americanised in their language, i wouldnt go as far as saying 'the most "British-sounding dialect/accent in the whole U.S' is in NE, because Britain has no direct influence there now, nor has it had for the last 100+ years. Surely during this period a new american dialect would have flourished, one thats far less influenced by Britishness, and one that would be much more American.

you wouldnt find a whole different language in the south, it would still be english, only a different dialect, as you already said, different words for somethings, also different sayings etc. and i have been to the south aswell, just so that you know, i know how they talk there! and yes it is hard to follow sometimes :D but you still ge there in the end, because it's only some words that throw you off.

its just i find it remarkable how different dialects fluctuate only within a few miles of each other here in the UK, and seeing that the US is much larger than here, then it must no doubt be happening there, on a grander scale maybe!

yeah i kind of gathered that Vermont might have a bit more british influence than other parts due to it's historical connections with britain during the industrial periods of the late 18th and throughout the 19th century! but vermont it's self was actually french to start with if im correct, just take a look at the towns there, montpellier for instance.... :D maybe there's a french connection aswell :D lol no, it's been many years since britain had a direct influence over New England, i think that everywhere throughout the US, N.E included is Americanised in their language, i wouldnt go as far as saying 'the most "British-sounding dialect/accent in the whole U.S' is in NE, because Britain has no direct influence there now, nor has it had for the last 100+ years. Surely during this period a new american dialect would have flourished, one thats far less influenced by Britishness, and one that would be much more American.

you wouldnt find a whole different language in the south, it would still be english, only a different dialect, as you already said, different words for somethings, also different sayings etc. and i have been to the south aswell, just so that you know, i know how they talk there! and yes it is hard to follow sometimes :D but you still ge there in the end, because it's only some words that throw you off.

its just i find it remarkable how different dialects fluctuate only within a few miles of each other here in the UK, and seeing that the US is much larger than here, then it must no doubt be happening there, on a grander scale maybe!

You are right, there is not much of the "British sound" left in New England and certainly not the words used, but if you take U.S. as a whole, the only accent even close to the mother-country of the first refugees is in that locale.

I have heard many British accents in all my years and New England does not come close, but compared to the rest of the U.S., it at least, has a suggestion of its British roots. (Something that would not be even considered here in "the South".) Jamestown in Virginia had one of the largest British settlements and there is a mostly "southern accent" there.

People move so much these days, it is hard to find areas with exclusive accents and dialects. We really are a "melting pot" and the stew is getting thicker and more varied. :D A language geek like me just loves it.

You are right, there is not much of the "British sound" left in New England and certainly not the words used, but if you take U.S. as a whole, the only accent even close to the mother-country of the first refugees is in that locale.

I have heard many British accents in all my years and New England does not come close, but compared to the rest of the U.S., it at least, has a suggestion of its British roots. (Something that would not be even considered here in "the South".) Jamestown in Virginia had one of the largest British settlements and there is a mostly "southern accent" there.

People move so much these days, it is hard to find areas with exclusive accents and dialects. We really are a "melting pot" and the stew is getting thicker and more varied. A language geek like me just loves it.

fairplay you're perfectly right, i know exactly what you mean, i guess you're right that NE due to it's british influence in the past is much more inflenced in a lot of britishness in the way the speak and do things than other parts, maybe not as literally as i think, because there are underlying currents of influences that are not on the surface that we see, so really you are right, compared to other places in the US i can understand why you would make the connection of NE being more directly influenced by Britishness, thats a valid one to be honest, and justified! :D

oh yes, i was wondering if anyone has ever tried tripe? and if anyone knows what it is, i may be a bit slow on the uptake here! ;)

It depends what type of "tripe" you mean. Tripe is a type of edible offal made from the stomach of various domestic animals. Beef tripe is typically made from the first three of a cow's four stomachs, the rumen (blanket/flat/smooth tripe), the reticulum (honeycomb and pocket tripe), and the omasum (book/bible/leaf tripe). Abomasum (reed) tripe is also seen, but with much less frequency, owing to its glandular tissue content. Sheep and pork tripe are also produced.

Personally I'll pass.

hahaha yeah i think i will also, but i have had the pleasure of trying pig's brains in the past, wasnt bad actually, coming to think about it haha! gimme a creme egg anyday! *how do you eat yours?!*

There are small-town cafes in Missouri where you can order a "brain sandwich" right off the menu.

I have had tripe, you know. In Menudo. Just a tiny bit. I even managed to swallow it.

It depends what type of "tripe" you mean. Tripe is a type of edible offal made from the stomach of various domestic animals. Beef tripe is typically made from the first three of a cow's four stomachs, the rumen (blanket/flat/smooth tripe), the reticulum (honeycomb and pocket tripe), and the omasum (book/bible/leaf tripe). Abomasum (reed) tripe is also seen, but with much less frequency, owing to its glandular tissue content. Sheep and pork tripe are also produced.

Personally I'll pass.

I really really hope you looked that up cos if that just came of the top of your head I'd be seriously worried :lol: Then again, if it did I'd like to have you in my pub quiz team :tu: