Underground Lake #41: Attack of the Dueling Book Covers Again - The Redux

This is to discuss Underground Lake #41: Attack of the Dueling Book Covers Again - The Redux (http://www.mugglenet.com/editorials/theundergroundlake/tul41.shtml) by Brandon Ford.

I don't think that the castle on DH is Azkaban, as much I was would like to see it, if Harry were to go to Azkaban it would probably be important enough to put on the cover, the thing is, I was under the impression that Azkaban was in the Arctic, way out in the sea (http://www.accio-quote.org/themes/otherplaces.htm). By the look of the Bloomsbury cover it seems as if Hermione, Ron, and Harry are in Gringotts, could that be the castle shown on the U.S. cover?

i found that was a reallly good editiorial, i really like how he looked at every single book!!! anwayz what really interestes me the most out all bookcovers is the fact Vold. and harry are reaching out for something, and Harry looks ...kind of CALM? he isnt like scared, or worried, he seems to be fine, but look of maybe bit of suprise? i really dont understand, .... escpecially the fact they hav no wand??? its all soo confusing!!!! lol

About the symbol on the spine of the UK Deathly Hallows...
Did you take the last W.O.M.B.A.T. test?
At the room of requirement, you had to make that exact figure with a circle, a triangle and a line to access the test.

Kisses from Chile

I love your theories, and I have quite enjoyed reading through many of your Underground Lake editorials.

It is interesting to see how you were so spot on correct about DD's dying in HBP. I am anxious to see if any of your theories for DH prove to be true.

One thing -- please note that you are misspelling the word British a number of times. You're writing "Brittish." Just one "t." Not the worst mistake in the world, but if I were writing an editorial, I would want to know.

Interesting editorial, as usual!

Some obvservations I'd like to add:

1) Did you notice that both Harry and Voldemort are in the same brown robes? That implies some kind of "in the same boat" kind of thing to me. As you suggest, they do not look to me like they are fighting - perhaps in the world beyond the veil they find that they need to work together for some reason. (Although I'm sure there is still some interpersonal tension.)

2) The colosseum architecture is very classic. If this is the land beyond the veil, then a Greek/Roman feel would make a lot of sense, given how Orpheus, Theseus, Heracles, etc. seemed to like to take visits there a lot (excellent summer vacation spot). (BTW if Harry has to go rescue Ginny from there, and Ginny trips as they are leaving, I will be very annoyed at Harry if he has the stupidity to look behind. Orpheus is the only mythological character who really irks me.)

3) There is something about the snake in the orb on the British children's cover that looks a bit mobius-strip-like to me. The snake seems to change colors, and each time I look at it, it looks almost like it is two snakes merging into one, one light and one dark(the whole color thing confuses me in that picture). If it is two snakes merging into one, one light and one dark, then this is extremely meaningful. The "Tai Chi" symbol in Zen/Taoism is supposed to be two snakes biting the other's tail, one light and one dark (with a dark eye in the light snake, and a light eye in the dark snake, such that no cross-section of the image is either completely dark or completely light). This is a symbol of of the mixed interplay of death and rebirth, of higher nature and lower nature, etc. (Those who have read Michael Ende's "The Neverending Story" might remember that the symbol of the Auryn is described as this exact thing - two snakes biting each other's tail, one light and one dark, and the themes covered in the book are very relevant to life and death.) This is very relevant in that Harry and Voldemort are diametric opposites from a certain perspective, except that they do share some common traits, talents, and histories.

Of course if it really only is one snake, then this doesn't fly. It could just be funky full-moon lighting reflecting on a horcrux, a prophecy concerning Nagini, or a random drawing that isn't relevant to the story.

Very interesting! I cant wait to get my hands on that book!

Hi Brandon. I always love to hear your theories, but you sound as stumped as the rest of us are. LoL:lol:.
I think Bloomsbury said that it is Hogwarts on the back of the UK childrens cover, dont quote me on that. I didnt notice the significance of the full moon. I always hoped Lupin would get a chance to repay Fenrire for all those kids lives he's ruined. I hope Lupin lives, he deserves it just as much as Harry does.
I agree that Bloomsbury should have picked a single artist instead of several. The covers have been inconsistant and frankly boring. But DH is a huge departure from the mundanee confusion that is usually their covers. It's almost like a sensory overload.
The one lovley thing about Mary Grande Pre is that she tastefully interjects several key points to the story plot on a single cover. My favorite cover has always been the OotP becasue of its ominous feeling, not to mention the blue colors are just breath taking.

The triangle symbol seems very important since it is on the cover and used to open the wombat. It could be a pyramid with an entrance shaft and the circle showing that it is hollow. As in every thing magic the inside is always bigger then the outside. This is not intended as a hollow hallow reference.LOL

Alright, the symbol in the spine power position was the symbol that JKR had us make to take the WOMBAT 3. It means something crucial, it's not just there like the guy on the back of the first UK cover.

I really think that that US cover for DH is definately behind the veil because of the curtains and the old looking stone archways. I also think the shadowy figures are all the people who have passed through the veil before.

I noticed on the UK cover that Hermione's arms are also cut/bruised. It almost looks as if they are being sucked into the circle/archway...maybe behind the veil and being returned to the land of the living? I'm not sure of the armor...maybe this was gringotts that has a secret passage to Hogwarts. So many questions. I think Ron and Hermione's robes are from the wedding as they are fancier and more appropiate. Can't wait to read the book! :love:

I took the treasure room of the UK version to be in relation to Hepzibah Smith's house or possibly even the Room of Requirement. Both have been described as heavily cluttered with antiques/artifacts and one could easily depict that as a room full of treasure (particularly in regard to Smith's house as we've seen in HBP that she was a treasure seeker).

Oh and the "creature's head" on the back of the US GoF edition is Rita Skeeter as a beetle.

What is the animal on the bottom of the UK Children's version? It is located just to the right of the SKU and looks a bit like a cat or a terrier. You can even see a shadow under the cat / terrier and it looks as though it is running toward the open door.

What is the animal on the bottom of the UK Children's version? It is located just to the right of the SKU and looks a bit like a cat or a terrier. You can even see a shadow under the cat / terrier and it looks as though it is running toward the open door.

If we're thinking about the same thing, that's just the Bloomsbury symbol and is on every cover. :)
Great editorial, I had never even noticed the house elf on the UK copy. I now feel a bit stupid. :lol:
I always assumed that all the treasure was them searching for a horcrux, since we know that Voldy has used bits of jellwery to make them before. One thing that puzzles me is that Hermy and Ron both look terrified while Harry looks almost excited, it's like they desperately want to leave but he wants to stay for some reason and carry on with what they're doing.
Also, on the first UK copy of PS it was definitely Dumbledore on the back; he had the long white beard. but the newer copy, I don't know who that's supposed to be. Nor do I know why they changed it.

I always thought that the strange-looking creature on the back of the GoF cover was supposed to be a blast-ended skrewt. It seems too large for a beetle, and it's not dragon-like at all.

On the back of the GoF artwork, I always thought that the strange looking creature was supposed to be a blast-ended skrewt. Doesn't that make the most sense? It's too big to be the Rita Skeeter beetle, and it's not dragon-like at all. The skrewt seemed to be the only remaining possibility.

Just a few little comments: on the US GoF cover, the "head of a strange creature that could be the head of the dragon though it looks more like Dragonite from Pokemon, than a Hungarian Horntail" could be a Blast-Ended Skrewt. Also, the stairway on the UK GoF cover could represent the Yule Ball. Not that it really matters what these things are anyway. :)

Everyone notice: Harry is still wearing the fake locket around his neck as a talisman. *Tear for Dumbledore.*

Who says this is the fake Horcrux?! There was never any mention of Harry wearing it, he just kept it in his pocket. I think this is the real Horcrux, perhaps after it has been destroyed, or maybe in the process of destroying it (?).

About the symbol on the spine of the UK Deathly Hallows...
Did you take the last W.O.M.B.A.T. test?
At the room of requirement, you had to make that exact figure with a circle, a triangle and a line to access the test.

You're so right!!! Then it's definitely something important. The number three seems to be very important to the series (with the Trio and all)...maybe that's the triangle? Or that symbol might have some historical significance.

I think the castle on the UK cover is definitely Hogwarts. I think it was the one place Voldemort felt at home and it is a stonghold of ancient magic. I think he would love to have it as the base of his empire.

I think the room with the veil (at the MOM) is featured on the US cover. I think the deathly hallows was what Harry heard wispering behind the veil that day in the MOM (in Book 5) and that's where he and V will have their final confrontation. Same on the UK front cover. Its definitely the Arch that featured.

One thing I would like to add about the DH cover; it seems to me like Harry is reaching out for whatever they are looking at. Voldemort ,however seems to be blocking himself from it. Something about the positioning of their hands. It may be significant, maybe not.

Can't actually believe I'm doing this.

Re: Deathly hallows spine position.

I was reading one of Jorge Luis Borges essays today (Avatars of the Tortoise) and I quote

Nicholas of Cusa - who saw in the circumfrence of the circle a polygon with an infinite number of sides and wrote that an infinite line would be a straight line, a triangle, a circle and a sphere (De docta ignotantia (On learned Ignorance), I, 13)

Anyone think that sounds familiar? Maybe the spine position has three representations of an infinity. Or looked at in another way, immortality.

Good night. I'm never posting again.

I wish he had addressed the UK adult versions and the US special editions ones. I mean, whats up with that dragon?

Originally posted by rhhgrt: I wish he had addressed the UK adult versions and the US special editions ones. I mean, whats up with that dragon?

I've noticed that too! I think it's very important since it is on the deluxe version. I hope it's Norbert. :D And the two people on the back of the dragon? I think it could be Harry and someone else, I'm not exactly sure...

And Brandon, I was hoping that you could enlighten us more about the back of the US edition of OotP! Near the top of the back cover there's an open door with someone in the doorway because you can see the shadow. Also, above Lupin, there's a face that looks to me like Sirius, but it could also be his mother. And what are Moody, Lupin, and Tonks looking at beyond? Could they be in 12 Grimmauld Place or the Department of Mysteries?

A theory I like is that Harry is wearing the last Horcrux around his neck. So Voldemort won't dare fire an Avada Kedavra at him.

Also, I'd love it if the unidentified castle were Durmstrang. I can just see Krum at Fleur's wedding. The trio brings up the subject of Horcruxes. "I know nothing of Horcruxes," Krum says. "I never even went into the Horcrux section of the Durmstrang library."

By the way the man on the back of the British cover of Book one is a YOUNG DUMBLEDORE!
They have change this for the second edition of book one which has Dumbledore the correct age!

Ooh, I really enjoyed reading this editorial!

A few points which you were unsure about:

There has been a lot of debate between British readers concerning the identity of the goatee-d man on the back of Philosopher's Stone and my personal opinion is that it is Nicholas Flamel, since the man's appearance matches that of no one in the books but Flamel is a significant characters who is never described. It's also interesting to note that on later editions of that book, the man on the back is replaced by a picture of Dumbledore.

And also, on the back of the UK edition of Goblet of Fire, I was under the inpression that it was the Entrance Hall's marble staircase, with Pigwideon perched on the banister, as he does in the book when he's delivering a letter to Ron.

I find it slightly annoying that sometimes pictures in the 'spine power position' sometimes hold significance and sometimes do not. I mean, there's Flamel (possibly), the Grim/Sirius, a phoenix feather and the ring Horcrux. But then there's also Hedwig and Pig.

Just a few little comments: on the US GoF cover, the "head of a strange creature that could be the head of the dragon though it looks more like Dragonite from Pokemon, than a Hungarian Horntail" could be a Blast-Ended Skrewt. Also, the stairway on the UK GoF cover could represent the Yule Ball. Not that it really matters what these things are anyway. :)


I've heard the Skrewt theory several times but I have to disagree on it. Skrewt's were basically described as scorpions, and that looks nothing like a scorpion. Granted it doesn't resemble any real beetle I've ever seen, but the curled antenna, round head and wing-like extensions make it pretty apparent that it's meant to be a beetle. Most people I believe view it backwards, thinking the pointy part on the bottom right to be a set of pinchers, when in fact that is the rear of the animal in question.

Good editorial. Got me thinking big time.

The symbol on the UK bookspine, the Wombat, and Bloomsbury website show that it is indeed significant. As you enter the Bloomsbury website, the septology symbol is engraved in some sort of stone. (Dumbledore's tomb, pyramid, etc? Sure looks like Rowling wants us to get this.

We know from early interviews with Rowling that she studied alchemy extensively. Alchemy was and is studied on many levels: as religious pursuits, philosophical, literary, geometrically, and chemically to construct the philosopher's stone. The UK book 1 name is The Philisophers Stone. She has given many hints. Isn't Harry in pursuit of the stone? A seeker? In ancient alchemy text, the philosopher's stone was sometimes depicted as a golden globe with WINGS, like the snitch. I am astounded at how rich Rowling's imagery is. We could drown in it. (I realize that I may be way of the trail and overanalyzing)
The four elements of alchemy are:
1. oneness "as above, so below" (the material world and the spiritual)
2. duality (dark/light; ying/yang; male/female; good/evil) Think of the snake in a continuous circle with its own tail in mouth. This is called the ouroboros.
3. Triangle/trinity: body, soul (spirit), and mind
4. The 4 elements: fire, air, earth, and water

The ancient scetches and diagrams are coincidentally like Rowlings. Or are they? Rowling's does not have the inner square and outer big circle. In She also has the line up the middle. Perhaps that represents the duality/male and female or evil/goodness.

One journeys through stages, much like metals would have to be put in a crucible to remove the impurities. It is very involved, but stated simply, an alchemist has made the philosphers stone after ridding self of impurities and false ideas: when one has obtained perfect harmony/enlightenment with God or the spiritual realm. The steps in alchemy are basically the same across different ancient civilizations and cultures, with different names and spins. Sumaria, Greece, and Egyps (see the Emerald Tablet).
Back to the symbol. Rowling's symbol only has certain elements of the philosopher's stone symbol.

The easiest explanation with diagrams is at Claud Furstner's Philosophers Stone webpage. You may go there to view diagram symbols with explanations. (philospher's stone and the secret of its geometry)

Is the symbol on the tomb of Albus Dumbledore? Was he an alchemist like his friend Flamel and found out the secret of the philosophers stone?
We will see on the 21st!

good editorial...nice to actually show the covers.
I was surprised (and a bit sad) that you didn't show the grownups version of the books. I am sure that meanings and hints could be gained from careful observation of those, as well.
Thanks again!

There has been a lot of debate between British readers concerning the identity of the goatee-d man on the back of Philosopher's Stone and my personal opinion is that it is Nicholas Flamel, since the man's appearance matches that of no one in the books but Flamel is a significant characters who is never described. It's also interesting to note that on later editions of that book, the man on the back is replaced by a picture of Dumbledore.

Yes! I'm sure it is Nicholas Flamel because you can see the stone in his pocket, which is why he looks young, I mean why would they have a young dumbledore or a random dude? Could be though i spose hehe.