Severus Snape's Death

I had always believed that Snape was working for Voldemort, and I believed Harry when in HBP he told people including Prof. McGonagall that Dumbledore had been wrong to trust Snape because Snape had said he was sad for the Potters' deaths.

However... in this book Snape's death made me cry for ages, when I realized what he had done for Harry and for the Order. Snape wasn't a good man - as we can see from the first 6 books, he was vindictive and refused to see Harry for what he was, and was determined to let his past colour how he treated Harry. He did however prove himself to be extremely loyal and brave. Lily Potter was what seemed to be the only true friend he ever had. He agreed that Dumbledore should protect all three Potters and that he would do anything in return for that promise. As we can see, even though that promise broke and James & Lily Potter were murdered, Snape still stuck to his own promise to Dumbledore, and worked to protect Harry, even though he didn't like him. Snape took a huge risk in playing a double-agent and being trusted by Voldemort whilst really working for Dumbledore, but through his cunning and his ability he managed it. He remained loyal to Lily, to Dumbledore and to Hogwarts.

His death was necessary in terms of the plot - like others have said, Harry would never have listened to what Snape needed to tell him, he wouldn't have believed him, and Snape himself would probably have been unable to tell Harry everything he needed to know to understand it all, since his own feelings would have prevented him. In terms of being murdered, though, his death was un-necessary - he had no power over the Elder Wand and his death made no difference to Voldemort's power over the wand. This knowledge is what made me cry the hardest. I didn't know what Snape was wanting to do when he kept pleading with Voldemort to let him find Harry - I thought he was wanting to bring him to Voldemort to be killed - but obviously he was trying to keep his promise to Dumbledore. I don't think he was expecting to be killed, I think Voldemort's logic that Snape was the master of the wand surprised him and that was why he didn't react to the threat. He was also scared that he wouldn't get the chance to tell Harry what he needed to know. Somebody mentioned that it was unlikely that Snape died so quickly when Arthur Weasley lived for so long after being bitten by the same snake, but I think they were bitten in a different place on the body: Snape was bitten in the throat and probably an artery was punctured.

Snape's is a sad story. He wasn't a pleasant man, he was nasty to Harry and his friends - but I understood the reason behind Harry naming his son after him. Snape, though not a nice man, was, as Harry acknowledged, very brave.

Do you believe it was necessary?

I think it was because... obviously, Voldemort THOUGHT that if he killed Snape he would have complete power along with the Elder Wand... If he hadn't have killed him Harry would never have been able to keep Voldemort believing that he was still leading and in control...

Did you see it coming?

Yes, but I thought Voldemort would kill him because he helped Draco when Draco was the one that was meant to kill Dumbledore not Snape.

What did you think about how he died?

I thought it was awful! I couldn't believe it! I thought it would have been done quickly because Voldemort believed, at that point, that Snape was a VERY loyal Death eater! And then... ew... I don't want to watch that bit when the film comes out :(

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

He wasn't very happy really... He was really upset because Lily had died and it was partly his fault so I think he wanted to go really... I felt sad at HOW he died though, i thought that was a bit too brutal :(

And now he's back with all four marauders ... I hope they let him off now for helping Harry :D

Yes, he was the one character that engrossed me right from the start and which made me a compulsive HP fan, still - why cry all the time since Saturday?! I keep on telling myself, 'now get a grip for goodness' sake, this is ridiculous', and as soon as contemplating his fate and death, I'm instantly back to laboured breathing. This isn't the Fleur I know :no:

You are not alone. :upset:

I guess Rowling did an absolutely brilliant job wit this character, making him so real to us that we can't help but care now that we know his whole story. And now that we do, the death scene, despite its shortness and simplicity, is so compelling. "Look...at...me..." *sniff*

Why should who turned out to be the most powerful and noble wizard in the book bleed to death? I can't accept that he would die in that way. Wouldn't he have wanted some sort of revenge? Wouldn't he want to avenge Lily's death, or have a more visible hand at Voldemort's downfall? Is not one of the main reasons he joined the DE was to 'fit in' and get some 'recognition'?

That's why the death was so fitting and so sad. Yes, I am sure he would have liked to avenge Lily's death and receive the admiration of his fellow Order members. Instead, at the moment he died he was despised by all of them as a coward and a murderer. That he was willing to play that role, and die that way, just proves how far he had come in the years since he 'returned' to the good side.

I thought Snape deserved to die more honoroubly. He wasn't exatcly a morally good person. He amended his ways only because he loved Lily. But there is not doubt that he was probably one of the strongest and bravest charecters in the book. He was killed by Nagini. I thought that was kind of sad. He should have died in battle.

Sanpe's death hit me the most, and i've still got that nasty feeling inside me that he did not desrve to die because i loved his character. And then you think about his past, he never had happiness in his llive until he breifly met Lily. It's really sad when you think wbout it, he was a child and his parents used to have arguments, he went to Hogwarts and he used to be picked on by James and Sirius and the girl he loved wasn't with him, then Lily dies and Snape's alone and empty. He promises Dumbledore he will protect Harry and in doing so he dies.

yes what gripped me as well was his last words "look...at...me", he died seeing the eyes of his love

he didn't deserve to die...Rest.In.Peace...Severus Snape

Snape's death left me completely devastated - crushed. Even though we all knew he was going to die, that there was no other way, no other ending for him, reading that scene was in no way easy. I'm still mourning Snape's death, Snape's life, Snape's sacrifices and how much of a good character he made himself without anyone knowing before the end. He was the true hero of the books - no other character could have been capable of what Snape did. He was much braver by far than Dumbledore, and even Harry. Because he spent 17 years of his life fighting for someone he cared about who was dead.

He had such a horrible horrible life. Having been brought up in an abusive family, having no one to confide in, finally having Lily for a friend, but slowly losing her because of the wrong choices he made in life. Losing her to no one else but to his worst enemy. And then never having been able to talk to her again ever since he insulted her. But still turning back to the good side in order to save her life, and willing to sacrifice "Anything." Still having that plan backfire and to have her death on his conscience, but still agreeing even though it killed him to protect her son. "I wish.. I wish I were dead." In a way, Severus Snape did die the day Lily did. But Snape didn't let that defeat him. He turned his character completely around and fully redeemed himself. He wasn't just any Gothic Hero, who feels slight remorse over a lost love - he pulled himself away from the Dark Arts and became a good, pure human being again, willing to sacrifice everything just so that her son could live on.

It was killing me so much how when Voldemort had Nagini safe in her enclosure, how Snape kept looking distractedly over at it, and kept saying "Let me get the boy.. I'll get the boy." It just shows how desperate he was to find Harry and to fulfill what he had to do, even in the face of death. And his death was the most horrible and pointless things in the books. In DH, he was truly alone, imagine what must've been going on inside him.

And when he was dying, the way the memories were leaking out from everywhere, from his ears, his mouth, it's a sign of how much Snape wanted Harry, the one person he probably felt closest to at that moment, to understand what he had undergone, to understand everything, and to fulfill his last mission and his promise to Dumbledore and to Lily's memory. And... and.. "Look.. at.. me." :upset: His last request for Lily's eyes to look at him one last time. How could one man undergo so much? Without a single soul reaching out towards him all that time?

Ah no, I have tears falling again. *sniff*

I keep telling myself that Snape is happy now. He got his happy ending. I imagine he woke up in the place where all the dead souls were, and got to meet Lily again. Happy end, right? *sobs*

I'm with you on the prolonged sobbing, I felt weird, like I shouldn't be crying this much over a character in a book...but it was bad. :( POOR SNAPE!
Anyway I think Snape dying was necessary.. but not the way he died. The fact that VM didn't know much about the Elder Wand, I can accept- VM is not as clever as he believes, we've learned-- but I don't understand a number of things about it, like why DD didn't tell Snape in the first place that he meant the Elder Wand to become his, and why portrait DD didn't warn him VM might ask Snape about the wand, and believe by killing Snape its power would be his. I thought the way Harry and DD discussed this bit in King's Cross didnt explain anything.
Also, I didn't really like the way Harry did not react at all to what he saw in the Pensieve about Snape, I would have liked to see his reactions to the memories he was viewing...:( It was so sad!

It's just such a Boromir!! Though Snape was way better.

Man does things that are unforgiveable, sets out to redeem himself, remains secretive about it, loves a lost woman, and finally is reprieved in public.

It only serves that such a tortured soul is released, though it injures me greatly.
I don't think he could have stayed alive, there wasn't a place for it. Afte rhe died, I cried for like, the last hour of the book.

The fact that again, his death was really in vain, for Voldemort, is another notch for Snape. Even in death he was misunderstood.

Getting teary again!!!

I was disappointed with the way he died at first, but the more I thought about it, the more realised that that was the whole point. Snape has been living proof the whole way through the series that (to misquote Harper Lee) "Courage isn't a man with a wand in his hand". If Snape had died a swashbuckling warrior's death it would have undermined the fact that his bravery was greater because he did what needed to be done, even if it was unglamorous and made him despised by his own side. A low key, bathetic death was just in keeping with this whole strand.

Do you think Snape knew Harry was outside the room? And what do you think his last expression was, in his eyes I mean...love probably. SOB. To be honest I don't think I could re-read DH, or any HP book, for a long time, I was too upset.

His death does not hurt me as much any more. Though I would have loved him to have had not made poor decisions in his youth, though I would have liked Lily to have died knowing the extent of his love for her (though there is a possibility she knew some of it), in death this may be rectified. He will pass on to see Lily and to make amends. She will know all that he did for her son.

There was, in the end, not much for him to live for. Lily, his love, was gone. Dumbledore, his part-saviour, was gone. He would never love another as he had loved Lily nor been as close to anyone as Dumbledore. Death was a rescue.

This thread is so that you may discuss your reaction to Severus Snape's death.

Do you believe it was necessary?

Did you see it coming?

What did you think about how he died?

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

I knew there was a good chance he would die, but the manner in which he died surprised me. It shocked me as I was reading that he would die before having any sort of real interaction with Harry, even if it was Harry continuing to doubt Snape's loyalties.

It could have been a more spectacular death tbh. Snape could have put up a fight and then died. Then again Snape was always my favourite character, so i'm bias that way and I wanted his death to be epic.

The death was neccessary though and the choice in revealing everything after he died, rather than Snape telling Harry in person made the impact of Snape's story much stronger. He had just died and then the reader get's given this incredibly emotional story from his memories very soon after.

It was very obvious he would die, Snape had been undercover for so long it was obvious he wouldn't get away with it, and although I didn't want him to die, I could tell he would. However, I wish he had gone out with a bit of style, with a bang so to speak, fighting, rather than giving his memories away then collapsing. Yes his death was necessary to the plot, but I wish the Voldie had know at the last minute that his loyal servant wasn't so loyal, and proved that he was Dumbledore's man through and through.

As unforgiving as Harry normally was, how could he so quickly forgive the 6 years of hell Snape put him through, just because he really "meant well"?

I think it was because Harry knew he was projecting his anger and rage onto Snape all those years. Harry wasn't stupid, and since we read the story from Harry's point of view, we know that Harry noticed something going on between Albus and Severus, many times. Also, Harry trusted Albus, who told him over and over to trust Severus.

When Severus died, Harry saw him as a human being, not an object. Remember that late in "Half-Blood Prince", Harry was surprised to find he could feel sorry for Draco. So yes, Harry could put aside his hatred while Severus lay dying, and once he had the evidence of the pensieve memories, Harry knew the truth and no longer hated Severus. You may note that Harry did not suddenly become a cheerleader for Severus Snape; Snape was not a good teacher or a nice person or a model for personal hygiene, but Harry gave him his due.

And I have to say, Severus spending years in mortal peril to provide critical information for Albus and the Order, and finally dying in protection of his cover, is rather more substantial than "meant well".

Cornelius Fudge "meant well", Severus Snape was for real.

By the way, did anyone else note the irony of the greatest Slytherin in the story, dying by a snake?

It was certain that Voldemort was going to kill Snape, but I figured it would be done the way Voldemort has killed so many other people, with one movement of his wand. However, looking back on it, it made more sense for Snape to be killed by a snake for several reasons. The first is that Harry had earlier thought of Snape as having been a snake, coiled and waiting to strike at the top of the Astronomy Tower, and that had resulted in Dumbledore's death.

But when you go further it also fits in with the Prince's Tale. For much of his life, Severus Snape was proud of having been a Slytherin and all that it meant for him; we saw however in the Prince's Tale that Dumbledore comments upon Snape's bravery and mentions how perhaps the sorting (at least for Snape) is done far too early in the lives of the students. Snape was killed BY Syltherin, proving that he wasn't one in the end.

As for Snape being good, I had known it even from the first book because of how he was meant to SEEM like the villain, and ended up being vindicated. To me it seemed the perfect pattern, and Rowling ended up playing out that same story (Snape suspected, Snape almost CERTAINLY guilty, Snape vindicated and shown to have all along had the right intentions).

What I was most upset during and after Snape's death (including the Prince's Tale) was how Rowling (and in effect, Harry) focused mostly on Harry's shock (but acceptance) of seemingly having been betrayed and used by Dumbledore "For the Greater Good." He did not (not until he fought Voldemort and mentioned to all who could hear that Snape was never Voldemort's man from the time Voldemort tried to kill the Potters) seem to care and certainly didn't mention how he'd been wrong about Snape all along and, and he could have trusted to Dumbledore. He seems to think more about how Dumbledore was untrustworthy, working (in Harry's mind, at this point of the book) to bring down Voldemort even though it meant the end for Harry as well.

To be honest, I was not happy with the direction of the book from the moment Harry left Dumbledore/Snape's office to the King's Cross chapter because I had no doubt at ALL in my mind that Harry would live and that Dumbledore DID in fact love him and would not allow him to be sent to die. With the snake still alive, there was no way that Harry could die fighting Voldemort, he could ONLY die (in my opinion) if it meant that neither him nor Voldemort would get up again. However, I never for a second believed Harry would die all throughout the series (and people can say I am wrong, pointing to the King's Cross chapter, but I will also say that Dumbledore makes it quite clear in that chapter that Harry is NOT dead at that time, even if he is in some netherworld between life and death). It is exceptionally rare for the hero to die in series such as this, especially when these stories follow the Campbell paradigm so closely. The nearest I know of a character who dies in a similar tale (meaning it can be said to follow Joseph Campbell's theory) would be Frodo at the end of the Lord of the Rings. Frodo does not actually die, however he cannot enjoy the world he has helped to save, and must leave it (the place he goes, the Undying Lands are physically outside the borders of the world). For all intents and purposes he is dead, because he is not immortal, unlike Gandalf and the others who go (save for Bilbo, and far later, Sam). Frodo will not forever remain in the Undying Lands, instead he will heal of his pain (both of the wound given by the Nazgul, and the greater pain inflicted upon his soul by the Ring) and then die indeed and go where Men go after death. So in a sense, Frodo (along with Bilbo and Sam) dies twice, and his departure at the end of the book CAN be said to be death (in the movie, they live very little doubt, but the movie is NOT the canon).

Severus Snape was always my favorite character throughout the series, not for being warm and cuddly but for being complex. It was obvious early on (in my mind) that he would not let harm come to Harry, and I never had trouble (despite Harry's misgivings) with his treatment of Harry considering that I knew that when it MATTERED, Snape would not let him down. Even now I do not fault Snape for his ill-treatment of Harry (which actually made his life FAR more difficult, and made it so much easier for the Order to envision him as a servant of Voldemort) because I can empathize with his pain. He had loved Lily, meaning that ANYONE she would pick other than him would be hated (or at least seriously disliked) by Snape. However, James Potter was someone he hated even BEFORE Lily loved him, because of the incidents between Snape and the Marauders. While James may never have known it, the ultimate defeat for Snape was losing Lily (although you cannot really lose something you never "had") to him. To have Lily's son (the one thing that survived of her) look like an EXACT clone of James (except for his eyes) was no doubt torture. Here in class every day was a reminder that it was James who wound up with Lily. Here in class every day was a reminder that Lily had died, and that James could not protect her (nor could Snape). Who knows what reaction Snape would have borne the child of Lily and James Potter were that child a girl who resembled Lilly. Who knows even what his reaction might have been had Harry looked even a LITTLE more like his mother.

Through Harry's actions during the series I agree with Dumbledore that Harry has a lot more of his mother in him than Snape could see, but it is not hard to understand why Snape could NOT see it. No matter how Harry acted he would always look like James, and Lily's eyes were not enough to make Snape forget that he had lost her...not once just to James, but a second (and final) time when she left the world forever. That is why he could never forgive Voldemort, because no matter what happened Snape would be the hopeless romantic, loving Lily from afar and hoping against hope that maybe one day, she'd be his (although I don't recall ever hearing of a single divorce in the wizarding world. When wizards marry, they seem to really mean that they won't part before death).

Rowling made Snape's death necessary because there was pretty much no way that Harry could ever hear the story from him and believe him, or could even sit in a room with him and not try to kill him. In a literary sense, Rowling was almost painted into a corner by the way the character evolved, and there was little way that Harry could see the good in Snape, or that the countless readers who always believed him evil would do so in any other way than the way it actually happened. Snape was a hard man to like despite knowing what was behind his actions, and I wondered even in the last book (all the time believing 100% in his being on the right side) why he would allow the Carrows to have as much power as it seems they did. Sure, Voldemort had to believe Snape was on his side, and Snape was doing all he could to protect the entire student population (while still staying alive to be able to give Harry the information that ONLY he could give him). Yet the Carrows have been seen in their few occassions to be VERY medicore/poor wizards, and to be quite stupid to boot. Taking that into consideration, I don't understand how Snape could not do a better way of keeping them in line, and yet I DO know that he was in a sensitive situation by being the Headmaster of a school where most of the professors believed him to be a murderer annd a Death Eater, and where even many of the students believed the same thing. So perhaps there WAS no way for him to protect the students, while STILL staying alive long enough to give Harry the most important information (including the sword) without doing it the exact way he did it.

I was upset at Snape's death even though I knew that it served a literary purpose and could not have been dnoe without. I also though took even more time to marvel at the great character constructed by Rowling (in my mind, her absolute best without question. I have always been most impressed by rather complex characters, as they are hardest to create in my opinion) and how in his own world, he had performed about as well as he could have. Despite Voldemort's desire (and he did succeed) to kill Snape to make his wand work, he had been ENTIRELY fooled by Snape. As great a legillimens as Voldemort was, he could not crack Snape's mind or find out what he truly thought and felt. However, I also felt that Dumbledore did NOT do right by Snape. Would it (perhaps it would have) made Snape's job harder (or even impossible) if the Order (or even just Harry and a couple others) had truly known where he stood? Yes, we heard that Snape didn't want people to know "The Best of him," but knowing Dumbledore, I just don't believe he could not have conveyed it far better to Harry that Severus Snape was totally trustworthy. Snape's bravery was such that he took a job that NO OTHER wizard could have, but I just think he (and Dumbledore) could have done a little better job making it easier, so that death would not have been the ONLY way for him to convince Harry of his loyalty.

In closing, I would wonder how the information would affect Harry throughout his life. Afterall, he HAD hated Snape, and then had found out the truth. But Snape would be for Harry (and is for the reader) a sad case because had he gotten what he truly wanted all his life (the love of Lily Potter), then Harry would never have existed in the first place. James Potter is the father of Harry and the man Lily loved, and while Severus loved her (and knew her longer than James did), he did not wind up with her. I do not know if Snape would have had a chance had he been in the same house as Lily or had he not been keen to join the Death Eaters....or maybe, even had he done everything "right," Lily would only have considered him like a brother, and still loved James. However, Harry could pity Snape's unrequited love for his mother, and yet still be happy it did not work out between them, for if it had he would not have existed, and Tom Riddle would never have met his match.

(One more thing...as for Arthur living when getting bitten by the snake and Snape dying; besides the fact that Snape was seemingly bit in a far more lethal place and that the snake struck on Dumbledore's direct orders to kill, I cannot help thinking that the proximity of Voldemort, and his will being forced upon the snake DIRECTLY had also to do with how quick Snape's death came after being bitten. Also, Voldemort was more than aware of Nagini having bitten Arthur Weasley, and yet failing to kill him. He would not make the same mistake he'd already made.)

I though his death was the strongest moment in the entire book - perhaps series. To die so patheticly, so unheroic, yet his last move was the one that lead to voldemort's death and saved so many lives (because of harry's "death"). And his last wish... to look to Lily's eyes. I still believed he's bad at the time, which is so unfair, becuase harry never had the chance to talk with snape, to apologize...

By the way, did anyone else note the irony of the greatest Slytherin in the story, dying by a snake?


Heck, yes, I noticed this.

The other thing that struck me is the fact that the snake bit him on the neck.

Please note, I don't or never have ever believed in the whole SNAPE IS A VAMPIRE theory but it gave me a chuckle that he got bitten on the neck... EXACTLY the way a vampire would bite it's victim and the fact that Snape had "things in common" with a vampire all along the way (the resemblence of a bat.. etc.) Honestly. It made me giggle. Whether it was an intentional dig at all the vampire-snape people I don't know, but I thought it was pretty funny.... Oh, that, and the fact that Nagini could have bitten Snape ANYWHERE and the result still would have been his death ;) - She's poisonous, right? ;) If not, then just ignore me.. She just wanted the jugular :D.

I KNOW! Dumbledore's portrait was up not an hour after he died, where's Snape's? Already I have read several amusing fanfics in which Snape interacts with the other portraits (and one where he interacts with young Albus!)

I think it might be because he wasn't appointed properly, the same reason Umbridge didn't have a portrait.




ok, I really don't believe that Umbridge could have warranted a portrait mainly because she is NOT DEAD. The portraits were specifically of those who were "dead headmasters/mistresses"

I think his death by a snake bite was necessary - how else could he give his memories to Harry? And even if Harry was not at the Shrieking Shack, I feel almost quite sure that he would send a last minute warning. Wounded Wizard made a very good point regarding the fact that Snape's death also served a literary purpose, and the way he died was quite symbolic. I think in this case, Snape's death was hastened by the fact that he spent a lot of his energy giving a lot of memories to Harry, and because no one in the Shack knew how to bring him to St. Mungo's or anything. No one knew he was going to die, except for Harry, Ron, Hermione, and Voldemort. Voldemort surely was not going to help him, and I think the three of them could not have brought him to the hospital. (at that time, Harry still felt certain animosity towards Snape)

And even though Harry never truly acknowledged the fact that Snape was redeemed in his eyes, I think it was enough to name his son after Snape. For me, that was a great tribute and a lasting legacy. Maybe Harry realized that Snape loved Lily, but it didn't register in his mind that Snape loved HIM. After all, Snape only did what he did for Lily's sake. Not for Harry's sake.

I have always been a believer of the Snape/Lily thing, and I thought that the Princes tale was done really well, although I thought that Snapes actual death was a bit disappointing. I felt that jis character was so heroic and brave that he should have gone out better than being bit by that blody snake. I thought it was sad when he made Harry look at him though...*sniff*

I always thought that Snape was good, and that he would die to save Harry, so I was expecting it, but I did not expect it to hit me so hard. I thought that it was absolutely beautifully written, and heart-wrenchingly sad. I did think that it was necessary for him to die, both for the plot, and for himself. I don't think that he would have been happy had he lived, especially having to face all that awkward questioning about Dumbledore's death. He died at peace, knowing that the last thing he would see would be Lily's eyes. ("Look...at...me.") However, I wish that he had had a chance to prove his loyalties to the Order, and to stand up to Voldemort before he died. I think that it was a humiliating way for him to go, and I was extremely sad.
R.I.P Severus Snape, a true hero.

That's true...but I think by the end of it, Snape also knew it was futile to do anything. The last things he said to Voldemort were all "Please, let me go find the boy and bring him to you." Really pointless if you ask me, and I think Voldemort couldn't care less whether Snape could bring Harry or not. So I don't think he could have stood up to Voldemort. I wish he did, but whatever Snape did, I think that was all he could do.

I'm pretty sure he knew he was going to be under the Order's wrath just by following Dumbledore's orders. In my opinion, I think the only people he cared about knowing his true self were Dumbledore, Lily, and Harry.

The death was kinda abrupt. I would've preferred if Snape could've told Harry everything personally and then died in battle, instead of something this unheroic...but at least the truth came out when Harry looked at his memories in the Pensieve

I don't think Snape would have been able to tell Harry much if any of that if he were alive. I also gather from his reaction to DD telling him that Harry must die that he woulld have been unlikely to have been able to break that news to Harry either. I can guess though, that there was an alterior motive for Snape continually asking to go back and find Potter and bring him to VM, though.

Albus Severus Potter, nice tribute and the bravest man I ever knew comment was really good

What I was most upset during and after Snape's death (including the Prince's Tale) was how Rowling (and in effect, Harry) focused mostly on Harry's shock (but acceptance) of seemingly having been betrayed and used by Dumbledore "For the Greater Good." He did not (not until he fought Voldemort and mentioned to all who could hear that Snape was never Voldemort's man from the time Voldemort tried to kill the Potters) seem to care and certainly didn't mention how he'd been wrong about Snape all along and, and he could have trusted to Dumbledore. He seems to think more about how Dumbledore was untrustworthy, working (in Harry's mind, at this point of the book) to bring down Voldemort even though it meant the end for Harry as well.



I enjoyed your post, thank you, and I especially agree with this bit above. I couldn't believe Harry didn't seem at ALL fazed or shocked by the Snape revelations. He doesn't mention it and we have no idea of his reaction when he realised Snape loved his mother; he must have guessed everything from the very first memory but we don't know what he felt. I see how it was necessary to avoid a showdown between Snape and Harry, it probably wouldn't have worked and Harry would probably not have believed Snape without the memories- which Snape would have been mortified to show him, we see his reaction in OoTP. BUT I still think the whole thing was a bit of a cop out. Snape died for a stupid reason IMO and he died alone with everyone thinking he was Mr. Evil. When VM called Snape to him at that point I was expecting him to have guessed Snape was double-crossing, although I suppose it is better for him to die having won what he and DD set out to do, which is fool Voldemort. I found the whole thing seriously emotionally draining and I was surprised by how much those chapers upset me, especially what I now consider to be the line of the whole series, which is "Still?" and "Always.."

I think it was an acceptable way for Snape to die, but it seemed to occur very quickly (like in the span of a paragraph or two.) Mind you it seemed like a LOT of people were dying in rather quick fashion.

This is what I think JKR was sort of going for - in this and really, almost all the deaths. Sirius' was quite sudden and surprising in its quickness, too. It seems like only Dumbledore's death was really built up.

I think the anticlimactic feel of it is quite fitting - its how death happens often in real life, and it kind of enhances the tragedy of Snape's character that after all he did to help Harry that he DIDN'T die in the middle of a noble or selfless act, like throwing himself in front of Harry on the battle field.

Snape was (and still is) my favourite character in the books. I knew he was good from the moment I finished HBP.

I have mixed feelings about the way he died though...in some ways I think it was pointless, but on the other hand, it's a war and people die in all sorts of ways.

When he said "look....at...me...." I practically strated sobbing!

ahh, I was so sad when he died, you know, not revealing anything to Voldemort, like - 'Hahaha, fooled ya, I wasn't your servant!' but as many of you already pointed out, that's how death happens in real life, without fireworks or something.

Knowing, almost from book one, that at some point in the future Harry and Snape were going to have to face each other with the truth behind their mutual hatred of each other - I'm glad it never really happened.

But I still think that in his final words, when Snape says "Look at me" he is telling Harry to look at his memories, look at his life, understand him. Yes, he wanted to look into Lily's eyes, but he also wanted Harry to understand him. Only with Snape's memories could Harry continue his journey.

Do you believe it was necessary?
I believe it was necessary from a literary point of view. His survival would have complicated things; he'd require too much focus, taking away from the central story.

Did you see it coming?
Yes.

What did you think about how he died?
I think it was terribly contrived. Voldemort kills everyone with a killing curse, so why subject Snape to a different treatment, especially one that allows for mistakes? Oh, that's right, so Snape would live for long enough to pass the memories on to Harry. Please.

I entertained the idea of Voldemort refraining from the Avada Kedavra because he considered that the curse might backfire, Snape being the purported master of the Elder Wand; but, if so, he would not have risked cursing Harry either.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I expected him to die sacrificing himself for Harry, so I am a bit surprised in that respect. From an emotional point of view, I am, of course, devastated. I also think the aftermath of the death was not handled well. Snape should have had a commemoration that exceeded being a means for Harry to rub Voldemort's mistakes in his face. For probably being the bravest person Harry ever knew, his posthumous rewards were not that great. No mention of a funeral, a portrait, Harry crying over him, nothing.

Snape would only reveal the secret about Lily and himself if he was on his death bed and not to mention that if Dumbledore plan was to suceed Snape would have to die. The only way to win the wand is to duel the person who has the elder wand. Naturally Dumbledore made Voldemort think Snape had the Elder Wand to throw him off Draco's scent and so that Snape could protect Draco still from Voldemort's wrath. A duel between Voldemort and any other wizard (especially Draco) for the Elder Wand would fail at the cost of there life and so Snape protects Draco again in a way by sacrificing his life to complete the double bluff.

So Snape had to die really and not a bad way to bow out, pulling a fast one on Voldemort and knowing about it.

Come to think of it, if Snape just started to fight on the side of the Order, it would have been quite significant, and a sign that there was more to him than others thought. Of course, there would be questions raised, but once he started killing Death EAters, I don't think anyone would really protest. AFter the battle was over, MAYBE they'll confront him...but if he's going to help them, no one would stop him

I had imagined that he would immediately jump into battle, and Harry would be battling alongside him screaming, "What the hell do you think you are doing?!" and Snape would be like "Shut up Potter! Duck! Pay attention to whom you're battling! Stop saying your curses out loud! I'll explain everything to you later!" and then hours after the battle, we'd have "The Prince's Tale"

What do you guys think Snape's plan was, I mean after he told Harry DDs message? Do you think he planned to pass on the message but stay with VM, still acting? What would be the point of that though. I was also wondering, if Harry, Ron and Hermione had rushed in to try save Snape (lets just pretend) do you think he would have joined the three of them to fight VM?

To be honest, Severus Snape has always been my favorite character. I was expecting his death to be more heroic... physically saving Harry from Voldemort out in the open for the first time for everyone to see. But the death was kind of symbolic of his life. Nobody knew that he was good when he died.

I LOVED when he said to Harry "Look...at....me..." before he died so that he could see Harry's eyes... Lily's eyes. I was sobbing from there and all the way through his memories.

I guess his impact on Harry was given some closure with Harry's son [the only one who had Lily's eyes] was named Albus Severus and Harry called him the bravest man he knew. SO ADORABLE.



But in my opinion, the perfect ending would have been Snape staying alive for longer, then after Voldy "killed" Harry he would come back and see what happened and yell out "NOOOO!" and pick him up and carry him instead of Hagrid carrying him. And then everyone would see whose side he was really on. And then Harry would come back to life and Voldy would kill Snape and then Snape can say "Look...at....me..." and give him the memories. Something like that.

Snape would only reveal the secret about Lily and himself if he was on his death bed and not to mention that if Dumbledore plan was to suceed Snape would have to die. The only way to win the wand is to duel the person who has the elder wand. Naturally Dumbledore made Voldemort think Snape had the Elder Wand to throw him off Draco's scent and so that Snape could protect Draco still from Voldemort's wrath. A duel between Voldemort and any other wizard (especially Draco) for the Elder Wand would fail at the cost of there life and so Snape protects Draco again in a way by sacrificing his life to complete the double bluff.

So Snape had to die really and not a bad way to bow out, pulling a fast one on Voldemort and knowing about it.

Tane! Good to see you again! :D

Anyways...I think that makes his death harder for me. The fact that he knew he had to die to protect so many people, and the fact that he had to pull a fast one on Voldemort like that. First of all, it makes me all the more angry at Voldemort's complete stupidity. And also, it makes me feel glad deep inside that Snape would die to protect Harry and possibly even Draco. In that sense, couldn't his death be a way of protecting Harry as Lily's death did? Maybe it ensured the fact that Harry's soul would be unharmed? I thought the whole sharing the same blood bit with Voldemort was good, but not a very strong explanation.

What do you guys think Snape's plan was, I mean after he told Harry DDs message? Do you think he planned to pass on the message but stay with VM, still acting? What would be the point of that though. I was also wondering, if Harry, Ron and Hermione had rushed in to try save Snape (lets just pretend) do you think he would have joined the three of them to fight VM?

No. Instead, I think Snape would have forced Ron and Hermione to get out of the way, saying something like these people were useless, pretend to give up Harry, and at the last minute save Harry from Voldemort's curses. I don't think he would have allowed any of them to fight Voldemort.

If Severus had talked his way out of that room, I believe that he would have done everything he could to stop the Death Eaters (and perhaps Harry would have had to prevent some of the Order from eviscerating him), but it wouldn't have been "hours after the battle" when we got "The Prince's Tale." If Snape and Harry had turned around and fought their way through Death Eater lines (Snape killing as he went), they'd have taken the ceasefire and the hour deadline as an opportunity to whisk their way up to Dumbledore's office and Snape would have mixed the memory and Harry would have experienced it. Remember, Harry NEEDS to know that he's an accidental Horcrux, needs to know and be willing to sacrifice himelf, in order for Voldemort to be defeated.

About the original questions

I believe Snape's death was necessary, I sort of saw it coming when Voldemort mentioned the "service" he wanted from him.

For me, there is shock, there is mourning, and--like Harry, a great deal of admiration. I don't believe Harry miscalculated or overstated when he explained his second son's middle name to him in the Epilogue.

If Snape and Harry had turned around and fought their way through Death Eater lines (Snape killing as he went), they'd have taken the ceasefire and the hour deadline as an opportunity to whisk their way up to Dumbledore's office and Snape would have mixed the memory and Harry would have experienced it. Remember, Harry NEEDS to know that he's an accidental Horcrux, needs to know and be willing to sacrifice himelf, in order for Voldemort to be defeated.

That makes sense. And now I really wished they HAD done that. :( But what I believe WOULD have happened doesn't really matter because in the end, I think it would have been harder for Harry to listen to Snape and go to DD's office and learn that he was an accidental horcrux. Even though I think that Snape should have started fighting on the side of good, I think when it comes to confrontation he is a true coward. That's why he didn't want Harry or everyone else to know that he was helping to protect Harry. That's why he didn't fight anyone at the battle.

Of all the deaths in the book, Snape's was the one I expected (and dreaded) the most.
I think he died as lived, in the shadows, alone and with really the only person who mattered to him (DD was already gone) at his side. I think that's what he would have wanted.
And I don't have a problem with how Harry reacted at the time. I agree that some kind of disclosure scene between the two would have just wound up a shouting match. Harry wouldn't have listened.
I think it would take time for Harry to really "get" what Snape was all about. I would take being a grown man himself. And the grown man thought enough of Snape to name his son after him.
I got through everything else in the book pretty much without getting weepy( a little misty maybe) until I read
"Albus Severus" and " the bravest man I ever knew"
Then the waterworks started.

Hmm, as much as I wanted to see a discussion between Harry and Snape I don't think it would have worked. Snape would possibly have been embarrassed and proud- if not, he would've let DD show Harry what he calls "the best of him". I still hate that Snape died the way he did though, he died with Harry and the other two hating him and he had literally no one in the world to care for him. Gaah my Snape grief is starting up again :(

He shouldn't have died before he could experience any gratitude and being officially in everyone's good books again. I pity him so much! And he didn't find out that Lily's son was to live after all and that Dumbledore didn't raise him to be killed.

He was forced to play the bad guy, and for all he knew at the point of his death, he would never be known to have acted for the good side and in accordance with DD's design.

He hasn't deserved that!

Do you believe it was necessary?
Yes. Much as I hate to admit it; yes. For starters Harry would never have believed what Severus had to tell him if he had said it to his face. This way, it sunk in. Not that I think JK killed him just to make a point with Harry, but yeah. I'm sure there are plenty reasons why he had to die, I just can't come up with any right now.

Did you see it coming?
Yes. The second Dumbledore fell off that tower, I knew Severus was a dead man.

What did you think about how he died?
Not at all what I expected. I thought he would die in battle. I even toyed with the idea of Harry killing him. But Voldemort himself killing him... that I did not see coming.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I cried buckets when it happened, mostly because I thought this meant he'd die and we'd never find out the truth about him. I always believed he was good. But then the memory, and everything and... once I saw the memory it sorta made sense. And it was... ok, in some weird way. I was expecting it, just not the way it happened.

I didn't predict the manner of Snape's redemption...I also didn't predict that Nagini would kill him. But it came off well, and believable, and Harry was barely able to get those memories. I was thinking up til close to the end that Snape was Villian Snape (against my predictions pre-DH), but in the end, he revealed himself. Though, upon reread, I should have known when he sent Ginny, Neville, and Luna into the forest as "punishment" - Snape was protecting them from the Carrows.

Though, upon reread, I should have known when he sent Ginny, Neville, and Luna into the forest as "punishment" - Snape was protecting them from the Carrows.

That one mention vanquished every doubt I could possibly have maintained at that point still. I read it and thought "See! SEE?! And why don't you, Harry, see it, too?!?!"

i am gutted that Severus died, i kind of knew he would but it hurts all the same.

It was sad that Snape died. I always believed he was good and it was unfortunate that the others didn't find out until afterward but I suppose Harry Potter wouldn't have been the same if he wasn't always believing Snape was the cause of something. I'm not exactly sure whether or not I believed he was going to die. I knew he had a chance, I was just hoping he wouldn't die.

Do you believe it was necessary?

Necessary? Well, he had to find out why Dumbledore trusted Snape, and that Snape loved Lily, and also that Harry had to die for Voldemort to be completely destroyed. So I suppose in a way, maybe. But I don't think it was particularly 'necessary'.

Did you see it coming?

I thought that he would die, but I didn't expect it to happen like it did.

What did you think about how he died?

I wish he would have had a more noble death, as everyone else said. I think that after everything, he at least deserved something more noble. That truly sucked.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

I'm still really sad, but I'm glad that we found out that he was a good guy after all. And everything else, like the Snape/Lily relationship, etc. In a way he got to redeem himself, which is good.

That one mention vanquished every doubt I could possibly have maintained at that point still. I read it and thought "See! SEE?! And why don't you, Harry, see it, too?!?!"


Yes upon thinking about it it clearly makes sense now that he was protecting them by sending them into the Forbidden Forrest and I didn't even realize it then at the time of first reading.

I didn't predict the manner of Snape's redemption...I also didn't predict that Nagini would kill him. But it came off well, and believable, and Harry was barely able to get those memories. I was thinking up til close to the end that Snape was Villian Snape (against my predictions pre-DH), but in the end, he revealed himself. Though, upon reread, I should have known when he sent Ginny, Neville, and Luna into the forest as "punishment" - Snape was protecting them from the Carrows.

Snape sending them out to the forest as punishment reminded me of when Snape pretended not to understand Harry's code about Padfoot being in the place where it was hidden in OotP and giving Umbridge fake veritaserum. In fact, every action that Snape made ever since OotP I knew had a good noble reason behind it...he was an excellent fake-evil, and complex character...

I'm scared of rereading the book because of his death alone actually...

Do you believe it was necessary? - um, yes I suppose so, I mean his story was so tragic that a tragic ending was fitting, was completely and utterly gutting though!

Did you see it coming? - yeh, was a militant member of the 'Snape is good' Camp and so didn't really see any other way out for him.

What did you think about how he died? - not too happy to be honest, Nagini I ask you? (and doesnt that mean he is avenged by Neville Longbottom of all people!) It's just that he was only in three scenes (not including the memories) and i just wish we'd got to see him interact with Harry properly, or see him do anything to be honest.... his death seemed so, i dunno, I dont want to say small because it wasnt, it was horrific (won't forget his fingers trying to staunch his wound for a while), but hmm... I wish he'd got a chance to turn around to Voldemorte and tell him where to go himself, because when Harry does it for Snape, he seems to be saying something more along the lines of 'haha - Dumbledore tricked you again!'

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
Sad - The Prince's Tale was absolutely devastating
definitely not happy, probably a bit in shock and angry mainly... wish we'd got to see Harry, Ron and Hermione get a chance to process what had happened and what Snape had done for them at the end, wish he'd come out of the stone or had a portrait next to Dumbledore's

and also - isn't it a bit harsh of Dumbledore to try and manipulate Snape into getting the Elder Wand when he killed him and not warn him that that would happen, even thought it is essentially making him a marked man?

Do you believe it was necessary?

I do think it was necessary. I would have preferred he died saving Harry (like so many others have said) I don't think Harry would have listened to him if he tried to tell him all the things we learned if he just tried to talk to Harry. It had to happen so Harry could really understand and would really listen.

Did you see it coming?

Yes - for the reasons above. Harry would never had accepted the information from Snape personally - this was the only way he would have accepted the information.

What did you think about how he died?

I don't know. I think it could have been done better differently. Just being bitten by the Nagini just didn't do it justice. Again, I wanted him to die saving Harry.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I always hoped there would be redemption for Snape and I think there was. It doesn't excuse his willingness to sell James or Harry out for his love of Lily but it showed he did have a kinder side, a side of him that did care.

Bet the movie producers for OOTP are sorry they downplayed Snape's worst memory now. They completely left out Lily. I don't think that it was his worst memory because of childhood fighting. It was that he truly lost his best friend Lily after that.

I am at a point where I am still bitter by Snape's death. In fact, I am very bitter by Snape's life. It seems to me that he was an entire tragedy. Yes, I know that he was able to love and that that is a wonderful thing, but every other "good" character had love returned in their lives and didn't have to endure so lonely and detached as did Snape.

In addition, I am not a big supporter of the Lilly and Snape love story. I don't really do the forum thing very often so I hadn't read any theories on this prior and it shocked me. I was hoping for something a little deeper when we learned that Dumbledore had an asbolute, rigid reason for trusting Snape, not that he felt an obligation to an unrequitted love. I found it melodramatic and changed the character for me.

But the worst was how he died. Not only does it make me hate Voldemort more, which I guess is the point that there is nothing he will not do if it means acquiring more power, but it angers me that this poor character not only had to put his life at risk, but he had to do so while being hated and loathed by everyone who believed that he was on the dark side. What did he really get, in the end? To die knowing that he helped Lilly's son?

I'm sorry, I just wanted more for the most misunderstood character in the wizarding world. The whole thing is a sad shame to me.

I think the only way Snape could admit that he loved Harry was in death. I loved the fact that Harry was able to find out and through his memory show Harry how truely special Lily was to him. I also wept as he saw the memories of Snape with Dumblesore and learnign how he chose his death. It all fell together. I do think the manner in which Snape died, well LV didn't have a wand his own wand to kill Snape with, and he belived Snape owned the Elder wand. The only way he could kill Snape was with the snake. All the books, all the hate I hade for Snape ended during the Prince's Story. What a magical chapter.

I am at a point where I am still bitter by Snape's death. In fact, I am very bitter by Snape's life. It seems to me that he was an entire tragedy. Yes, I know that he was able to love and that that is a wonderful thing, but every other "good" character had love returned in their lives and didn't have to endure so lonely and detached as did Snape.

In addition, I am not a big supporter of the Lilly and Snape love story. I don't really do the forum thing very often so I hadn't read any theories on this prior and it shocked me. I was hoping for something a little deeper when we learned that Dumbledore had an asbolute, rigid reason for trusting Snape, not that he felt an obligation to an unrequitted love. I found it melodramatic and changed the character for me.

But the worst was how he died. Not only does it make me hate Voldemort more, which I guess is the point that there is nothing he will not do if it means acquiring more power, but it angers me that this poor character not only had to put his life at risk, but he had to do so while being hated and loathed by everyone who believed that he was on the dark side. What did he really get, in the end? To die knowing that he helped Lilly's son?

I'm sorry, I just wanted more for the most misunderstood character in the wizarding world. The whole thing is a sad shame to me.

My thoughts exactly! Snape never had love, he never had happiness. His life was one huge struggle and everyone hated him. And he died without ever having the happiness he so deserved. THATS why I hated his death so much. I feel so utterly sorry for him. After everything he's done, after everything he's risked...

I'm never going to get over that. Never.

I am at a point where I am still bitter by Snape's death. In fact, I am very bitter by Snape's life. It seems to me that he was an entire tragedy. Yes, I know that he was able to love and that that is a wonderful thing, but every other "good" character had love returned in their lives and didn't have to endure so lonely and detached as did Snape.




That, to me, is what makes Snape such a magnificent character, and I think it's why Harry described him as "the bravest man he ever knew."

Everyone else on Harry's side had very real, tangible things to fight for: love. Friendship. Family.

Snape had none of these. Nobody liked him, only one person really trusted him...and that person eventually asked him to be his executioner. He got no support or recognition for his sacrifices, and had to watch all of that lavished on a boy who was the spitting image of the man who stole his one true love.

Snape was asked to give up more than anybody else, with the possible exception of Harry. The most Harry was asked to give up was his life; Snape was asked to engage in acts that might possibly have damaged his soul. He was asked to make these sacrifices with less prospect of reward than anyone else. What future would there have been for Snape once Voldemort was gone? Even had he lived, it's entirely likely that he would have been imprisoned as a supporter of Voldemort; his heroism would have gone unknown. (I have to assume that Pennsieve memories aren't valid in court, seeing as they've never been admitted in any of the trials we've seen thus far.)

Anyone can fight to defend the people who love them. Snape fought to defend people who hated him.

I knew he would die,not how he did I thought he would die trying to help harry find one of the horcruxes, He gave harry a better gift though. He gave harry the truth something he always wanted.

Being in the Snape is good and probably loved Lily camp, I was not surprised he died. The manner surprised me, and it really illustrated how callous and shallow Voldemort was. He in essence "used" the death of one of his most (to his mind) loyal lieutenants to "soup-up" his wand. And how there was no chance of Voldemort showing any remorse, ever.

I was expecting more of a 'Snape died to save Harry' act, like stepping in front of an AK or something. Being bitten by Nagini was unexpected, to say the least. I had to read those pages again to make sure I understood what had just happened. Yep, it was the same the second time around.

The memories of Snape were very helpful to those of us who wanted to know all the details. We now know Snape was "that awful boy" Petunia was refering to. We know lots more about Petunia, and what motivated her to choose a so aggressively normal life.

I'm not devastated because I was expecting the death. Though I think there might be some interesting fic that has him surviving and living on..........

I had expected Snape to try and redeem himself in person, before he died. I expected him to have been killed by Voldemorts own hand, rather than Nagini, as it could have made him seem less weak.
However, I respect him for not being a coward, it was a brave and noble death. I thought his dying words and actions were amazing, but I wish Harry had understood Snape before he died.
I loved that Snape was redeemed in Harrys eyes, after all, his son's middle name was Severus!

Jo

I don't know if I liked the fact that Voldemort killed Snape before he knew that Snape wasn't loyal to him. I do like the fact that Harry confronts Voldemort and tells him about Snape though. I feel Snape death, along with a lot of other deaths were unemotional, and very quickly done.

Anyone can fight to defend the people who love them. Snape fought to defend people who hated him.

I wholeheartedly agree with that... I just wish that Snape could have gotten a little bit of satisfaction before he died. I wish that others could have known his heroism before his death. He deserved it more than any other character, including Dumbledore.

I was really disappointed in the way that Snape died. He proved himself to be braver than anyone else (with the exception of Harry), yet he was killed by Nagini. I would have at least liked Voldemort himself to do it. I completely agree with SongDove. Snape really was the tragic hero.

Anyone can fight to defend the people who love them. Snape fought to defend people who hated him.

Very well said. I may quote you in my sig :)

But :( :( :( for Snape, it really will take me a while to deal with it, it was so horrible.

I am at a point where I am still bitter by Snape's death. In fact, I am very bitter by Snape's life. It seems to me that he was an entire tragedy. Yes, I know that he was able to love and that that is a wonderful thing, but every other "good" character had love returned in their lives and didn't have to endure so lonely and detached as did Snape.

In addition, I am not a big supporter of the Lilly and Snape love story. I don't really do the forum thing very often so I hadn't read any theories on this prior and it shocked me. I was hoping for something a little deeper when we learned that Dumbledore had an asbolute, rigid reason for trusting Snape, not that he felt an obligation to an unrequitted love. I found it melodramatic and changed the character for me.

But the worst was how he died. Not only does it make me hate Voldemort more, which I guess is the point that there is nothing he will not do if it means acquiring more power, but it angers me that this poor character not only had to put his life at risk, but he had to do so while being hated and loathed by everyone who believed that he was on the dark side. What did he really get, in the end? To die knowing that he helped Lilly's son?

I'm sorry, I just wanted more for the most misunderstood character in the wizarding world. The whole thing is a sad shame to me.

I think the point is that it was sad!

Additionally, what better way to prove loyalty than to have the most magical and powerful entitie at your side, love.

Snape never would have been a powerful wizzard without it!

Secondly, his death doesn't really bother me, and I don't think it bothered Snape either. Snape felt remorse for what he had done, and I think maybe the only way to redeem himself fully was to put Harry first and himself last.

Snape died at the hand of the snake because he didn't try to fight it. He remained a spy till the last moment, in accordance with his loyalty to DD. He even begged to retrieve the boy, only to give him his memories.

His story is truely heart breaking, I'll agree, but I'm not upset with Jo for leaving out a happy ending for Snape. I'm not sure he really deserved one, and I'm not sure there would have been an ending that would have been more satisfying. He was in love with Lilly, and she's dead. I think he'd be more tortured if he had lived.

On a related note, was I the only one troubled by the fact that we never see Snape's post-death fate? After the possibility that killing Dumbledore would damage his soul was brought up, I would have very much liked to have some reassurance that he at least found peace in the hereafter.

I couldn't quite shake the awful, nagging thought that the snivelling, damaged child-thing was not the fragment of Voldemort's soul (which Dumbledore said was destroyed, after all) but was, instead, Snape's soul.

And that would just purely suck.

i was so sad when severus died, mainly because of the fact that i thought that it wasn't going to proved that he was always dumbledores man through and through.
it made me cry. i was in a car in new hampshire, waiting for my family to return from a hike, and i was crying thinking that snapes name would always be bad, when i knew he was good.
i cried with happiness when harry saw all the details.
i love snape.

i think his death was the saddest because of the fact that he wanted to die looking into lily's eyes and that he still loved her with all of his heart, even 26 years later. thats true love....

On a related note, was I the only one troubled by the fact that we never see Snape's post-death fate? After the possibility that killing Dumbledore would damage his soul was brought up, I would have very much liked to have some reassurance that he at least found peace in the hereafter.

I couldn't quite shake the awful, nagging thought that the snivelling, damaged child-thing was not the fragment of Voldemort's soul (which Dumbledore said was destroyed, after all) but was, instead, Snape's soul.

And that would just purely suck.
I think it is safe to say that the snivelling thing was Voldemort's soul.
I think Dumbledore made it clear that Snape would not be murdering him - and it is murder that damages the soul. Slughorn said that it took a supremely evil act to tear the soul and that was murder. When Snape killed Dumbledore it was not supremely evil because he wasn't killing Dumbledore for his own gain. In other words the motive and intent are extremely important. As dumbledore said - only Severus would know if what he was doing was with evil intent and would therefore damage his soul. I do not think
Snape's soul was damaged when he killed Dumbledore.

. As dumbledore said - only Severus would know if what he was doing was with evil intent and would therefore damage his soul. I do not think
Snape's soul was damaged when he killed Dumbledore.


I don't think so, either, Cathy...I don't think Dumbledore would have requested it if he thought there was even a decent chance of damage to Snape's soul.

I just wish it could've been confirmed. I know it would've been hard to work it into the story, but I can't help wishing we could've seen at least a little happiness and peace for Snape after all his sacrifices.

Fleur--Harry was surprised that Snape was that lenient, but I think he figured that Snape just made a blunder. Prejudice and predisposition is very hard to overcome. I mean, look at Severus, it took him until the last seconds of his life to really appreciate that Hary was Lily's son as much, if not more than, James' son.

I think it is safe to say that the snivelling thing was Voldemort's soul.
I think Dumbledore made it clear that Snape would not be murdering him - and it is murder that damages the soul. Slughorn said that it took a supremely evil act to tear the soul and that was murder. When Snape killed Dumbledore it was not supremely evil because he wasn't killing Dumbledore for his own gain. In other words the motive and intent are extremely important. As dumbledore said - only Severus would know if what he was doing was with evil intent and would therefore damage his soul. I do not think
Snape's soul was damaged when he killed Dumbledore.

But what about the other murders he may of committed?

We must remember that he was a Death Eater prior to coming to DD. I would assume that he did commit murder then.

I think he died as lived, in the shadows, alone and with really the only person who mattered to him (DD was already gone) at his side. .

Nicely Put... i agree

But what about the other murders he may of committed?

We must remember that he was a Death Eater prior to coming to DD. I would assume that he did commit murder then.

But didnt Hermione say that true remorse can put a soul back together?

Do you believe it was necessary? I had a feeling that Snape would either be dead or in Azekaban at the end of the book. It was just a feeling I had.

Did you see it coming? Not really at that point; not until Voldy started talking about the elder wand and control of wands.

What did you think about how he died? I didn't like the way he died. He was just another unimportant victim in Voldy's quest. I had imagined Snape dying in a more glorious way, maybe with his sectumsempra curse or maybe Harry would have killed him, I don't know. I just didn't imagine THAT.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still? I am a little sad given the memories Snape had. Would he have had the chance to tell Harry in person? Would Harry have listened to Snape? I don't know but it is something I wished could have played out.

All in all, I was not happy with the way Snape was killed off. I liked his character in the series. I knew he was complex and very interesting. I would have loved to have seen more memories and stuff.

That being said, I was really teary eyed with the way he had been in love with Lily all his life. It just broke my heart.

I always knew it was a possibility but I believed he'd pull through...hoped he would. I've thought about it and I can't help but feel his death wasn't necessary. He was never the true owner of the Deathstick so he and his death were meant to throw Voldemort off. JK could have, just as easily, allowed Voldemort to operate under the mistaken belief that he was its true owner without having to kill Snape.

I'm still pretty torn up about his death, actually. Snape had such a tough life...a poor homelife and then a lost, confused, and tortured existence at school. I think he held so much in that it pained him more than most people thought so it's really sad to think that he died, essentially, alone. Dumbledore was harsh with him and Harry, too, yes, but Harry lived. Dumbledore thought there was a chance for him but didn't properly save/help Snape and never revealed the whole plan to him. Poor Snape died thinking that everything he'd been working toward was only to save Harry so he could die at the "proper" time. And it seems that no one really mourned his death, not even after they knew the truth. No one even mentioned going back to recover his body...

I'm not sure if I like how he died, either... We only "saw" him in "battle" once and his true potential failed to shine through, not that I was expecting it to considering whose side he was fighting on, but it would have been nice to see him really hammer it out...

Snape had a horrible life, and his after-life (which is a definite concept in the HP series) will also be quite horrible, because he still won't be with the woman he loves - she's with James.

After all he'd done, he deserved better.

it would have been nice to see him really hammer it out...


Know what you mean, We've always been given the impression that he's very powerfull, like at the end of HBP, Harry can't even get a curse anywhere near Snape so it would have been ace to see him fully spread his wings, especially since he as good...

On a related note, was I the only one troubled by the fact that we never see Snape's post-death fate?

Definitely not, I felt/feel the same way. As I said above, he had it rough so it would have been nice to know what became of him. It would have been nice to know if anyone even bothered to mourn his death and/or recover his body to give him the proper burial that he deserved as well...

Do you believe it was necessary? Undecided. In a way yes, because Voldemort needed the wand, so necessary to the plot. But no in the sence that I wish eveyrone could have seen he was good.

Did you see it coming? Not untill the few sentences before it happened.

What did you think about how he died? I think it was a cheap shot. I htnk he shoudl have faught back, and attempted to defend himself, even though he knew it wuold be useless.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still? Kind of distant from it. He was one of the only characters I didn't cry about when they died. Maybe because of the way he died, or maybe because he didn't know everyhting about him until the next chapter. But I do feel incredibly bad for him.

I'd have liked to see him duel Voldemort myself, but what we saw in the book hinted both at his cunning and his power and those hints were quite impressive.

JurneyAhed--Frankly, I don't think Snape's afterlife will be horrible. I think he'll be vindicated--he may never possess the heart of the woman he loved since he was 9, but he will be a close and valued friend--it might be possible even to heal the breach between him and James because he did so much to protect and safeguard Harry for Lily's sake--it was interesting to see that the "life debt" explanation was nearly all hot air.

Do you believe it was necessary?

Yes, but it was very sad nonetheless.

Did you see it coming?

I saw it coming as soon as Severus said "Let me get Potter"

What did you think about how he died?

He deserved better. He should have gone out in a blaze of glory. I had pictured him being with Voldy at the end, the last lieutenant, after Bellatrix's demise. Then I saw Voldy getting ready to kill Harry, and Snape turning on him and cursing him for killing Lily, and then being killed defending Harry, and Harry killing Voldy as he was killing Snape.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

Very sad. Snape was never truly happy. His sacrifices were never acknowleged during his life, and in the afterlife he still wouldn't be able to be with Lily.

Well, The Prince's Tale was by far the best chapter of the book. Also, the way he asked Harry to look him in his eyes just before he died was great. Lily's Eyes.

I found it moving, especially how throughout the whole book you expected a huge confrontation between Snape and Harry - but when it came down to it, they never needed one. They would never see eye to eye, and at least they came to a level of mutual respect.

Cheers,
Talen :)

I think it was terribly contrived. Voldemort kills everyone with a killing curse, so why subject Snape to a different treatment, especially one that allows for mistakes? Oh, that's right, so Snape would live for long enough to pass the memories on to Harry. Please.

I entertained the idea of Voldemort refraining from the Avada Kedavra because he considered that the curse might backfire, Snape being the purported master of the Elder Wand; but, if so, he would not have risked cursing Harry either.


It was the Elder Wand thing. With Snape, Voldemort did not have to take the chance of a backfire, an alternative in thye form of Nagini was available to hand.

Voldemort had no choice but to risk trying to kill Harry at the end. He believed that Harry would try to kill him, and if Harry had tried, he would have succeeded, because the Elder Wand would not have acted against Harry. He had to hope Harry was wrong.

I expected him to die sacrificing himself for Harry, so I am a bit surprised in that respect.

His life AND death were a sacrifice for Harry. He agreed to kill Dumbledore and continue in his spying, knowing that this could lead to his death at any moment. As it finally did, fortunately after he was able to pass on the information Harry needed to have.

Also, he could have tried to save himself by explaining about the Ring Curse, and claiming this meant he was NOT the master of the Elder Wand. He did not.


For probably being the bravest person Harry ever knew, his posthumous rewards were not that great. No mention of a funeral, a portrait, Harry crying over him, nothing.

I would have liked to see a bit more of that, myself, and not just for Snape. But we did not get it for anyone who died in the final battle. We saw no funerals, etc - the story cut right from the immeduate aftermath to the Epilogue. In that sense, Snape got more than a lot of characters, since he was mentioned in the Epilogue.

Snape's death was sooo unnecessary. And the fact that he died not knowing Harry would live speaks very little of the great Albus Dumbledore. Pah!!

Dumbledore was a man who manipulated Snape's unrequited love for Lily to make him do what he wanted of Snape and he always mocked and belittled Snape at every turn, it looks like after seeing the treatment he meted out to Snape in Snape's memories.

Remeber in GoF Dumbledore does not acknowledge Snape's accusation of Sirius's prank that may have killed him to the scenes in DH where Dumbledore treats him like dirt.

And Snape was killed in a way that was so pathetic it was a shame. There was no redumption or recognition for a man who had served the order and Dumbledore so faithfully for eighteen years risking his life every time he went to Voldemort and Dumbledore does not even have the courtesy to tell him that Harry would live.

Worse was the fact the way Dumbledore brushed off Snape's death so blithely when he was discussing it with Harry in Harry's mind.

Snape should have lived. He had paid his dues to his society time and again. But he died and died not making his peace with Harry. It is all very well for Harry to call his son after Snape, but Snape I feel died without knowing if Harry would ever acknowledge and realize his sacrifices or not.

Poor, poor Snape.

Do you believe it was necessary? Of course, it was a matter of time before Snape would die and sacrafice himself for Harry (or at least those were my original predictions) and it was also completely neccessary as it solved the puzzle of the horcruxes and Harry/Voldemort fates and connection.

Did you see it coming? Like I said above it was one of my original theories of Snape that he would sacrafice himself for Harry in some or other, so yes I saw it coming.


What did you think about how he died? Now this was a complete shock, to die by the snake rather then by Voldemort's hand or stepping in front of some other killing curse for Harry came as a surprise to me. Though the moment Voldemort called I knew what was about to happen.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still? I'm more sad then anything but none the less it had to happen, at the time of it happen I wasn't all to grieved about it but after his memories it really hit me how much he really cared and sacraficed for Harry.

Also, Voldemort had no reason to believe that Harry MIGHT be the master of the Elder Wand--I'm a bit puzzled as to why he didn't just use his regular wand after he discovered that Harry's had snapped, but Voldemort was known for overlooking details. Also, he probably figured using the Elder Wand would give him an added advantage.

We don't know whether Snape eventually got a portrait (he might not have been recognized as a true Headmaster in every respect since he got the job because of Voldemort). Also, we never saw his funeral--although I'm sure he was buried with honor. If you recall, Harry shouted Snape's entire history at Voldemort in full hearing of all the surviving Death Eaters and ALL the surviving Order members, so Snape would definitely have been honored posthumously. But, wouldn't it have seemed rather contrived and forced if Harry had wept over the man who had loathed him for 17 years? I thought the respect he showed Severus was adequate as a personal testament, and giving Severus' struggle a public voice was a fitting tribute--or at least the beginnings of one.

The_Green_Woods, keep in mind that Snape treated Harry, and pretty much everyone not in Slytherin, like dirt. Dumbledore was a saint compared to the way Snape was. He couldn't even muster some kindness for Harry, who was very much like Snape, being raised in horrible conditions, and who suffered directly because of Lily and James's death.

Also, don't forget that Snape only cared because Lily was going to die. He wouldn't have given a rat's derrière had "the chosen one" been Neville, and had Frank and Alice been murdered. As much as Snape loved, he was still very selfish.

Out of all the characters in the book, I don't think there is one who sacrificed more for Harry than Snape. And that's probably why I love his character the most.

He is the one who stuck it out, protecting Harry, despite being despised by all those who protected him, and despite being suspected by his Dark peers. He was forever the spy. He gave his life up to protect Harry. He risked his position with everyone to protect Harry. He had to overcome the fact that Harry looked so much like James to protect Harry.

Harry's parents did a lot for him - they protected him for seventeen years. They're heroes without saying. Dumbledore protected Harry but to a certain extent because in a way, he also had Snape do the dirty work. And he knew he had to die, so he had Snape continue the protection. The other professors, Weasleys, Hermione, everyone else, aurors - they could only do so much.

I think that's what makes his death all the more painful.

And I really think that he died to protect Harry, and so his love should have been another kind of charm to protect Harry.

Do you believe it was necessary? No, it would have been much more satisfying if he had lived, resolved his conflict with Harry - been 'saved' by Harry's forgiveness and had to live with his humiliation. But his death did brilliantly demonstrate Voldemort's complete lack of feeling. In a way, he really didn't even sacrifice himself for Harry. His death was unnecessary also, because, if Dumbledore had confided in him about the Hallows and if Snape had realized that he hadn't received the transferred power of the Elder Wand, then he would have been able to inform Harry.

Did you see it coming? Yes, it was pretty predictable. JKR had indicated once before that she was surprised that people found Snape a redeemable character.


What did you think about how he died? A master potion's maker dying by snake poison? Why didn't he see it coming. Why didn't he have an antidote? Did he want to die? I don't think so, he wanted to abandon Voldemort and go to Harry.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still? I am devastated that Harry never had the chance to forgive Snape, that Snape never had the chance to 'confess' and be redeemed and recognized as a good but flawed person. He never got the chance to change, to grow, to deserve love. It is horribly depressing.

I would have liked to see a bit more of that, myself, and not just for Snape. But we did not get it for anyone who died in the final battle. We saw no funerals, etc - the story cut right from the immeduate aftermath to the Epilogue. In that sense, Snape got more than a lot of characters, since he was mentioned in the Epilogue.

agreed - in fact, he is the only character that no one would have expected to be tributed so greatly. And Harry didn't say that Dumbledore was the bravest man he knew; he said Snape.

Albus, James and Lily were all expected names - no one can deny those. So Severus is a true surprise.

[QUOTE=BelleSnowyOwl;4639743]The_Green_Woods, keep in mind that Snape treated Harry, and pretty much everyone not in Slytherin, like dirt. Dumbledore was a saint compared to the way Snape was. He couldn't even muster some kindness for Harry, who was very much like Snape, being raised in horrible conditions, and who suffered directly because of Lily and James's death.

Psychologically speaking, this is very realistic. Snape has to be nasty, cold and horrible so that everyone will hate him, (which he believes he deserves), so he will not be tempted to open himself up (which would open him to Voldemort's probing-destroyed his hard-won Occlumency protection. This is a classic way of keeping people at a distance so he wouldn't be hurt again. It is rather cowardly, actually. If he had opened himself up to love again, he might have 'betrayed' Lily's memory, but he would have been happy. By keeping her memory and depriving himself of anyone else's love, he is punishing himself.

Do you believe it was necessary?
I'm not going to say 'necessary' but it seems fitting.

Did you see it coming?
I have to say that I'm surprised about how much I didn't speculate or guess on who would live or die so most of the deaths pretty much schocked me.

What did you think about how he died?
I think it was very sad and tragic that even for Voldemort it was an unnecessary death. I'm still confused as to what his last words meant.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I'm sad, how could anybody be happy? Then after reading the chapter after his death confirming my belief that he was a good guy I felt so sad.

[B]
I think it was very sad and tragic that even for Voldemort it was an unnecessary death. I'm still confused as to what his last words meant.



Harry's eye's look exactly like Lilly's, and since Snape had been in love with Lilly for most of his life, he wanted to look at Harry's eyes one last time because that was the closest to Lilly he was going to be able to see before he died.

Worse was the fact the way Dumbledore brushed off Snape's death so blithely when he was discussing it with Harry in Harry's mind.

Poor, poor Snape.

you are so right!!! If there was ever a point when i felt that I wouldn't like Dumbledore anymore it was the 'poor Severus' line. It came across as really glib. Especially considering that he didnt warn Snape that by killing him he would become master of the Elder wand which means that Voldermorte would most likely end up killing him for it. Snape would have done it anyway, he was so brave and Dumbledore knows that and should have shown him the respect of telling him.

I haven't read this whole thread, but am I the only one who thinks that the fact that Harry and Snape never met face-to-face was a bit of a cop-out? This was the guy Harry now hated as much as Voldemort himself, meanwhile Snape had so much to tell Harry. Snape having to relive all of those memories to Harry would have been a tough scene to execute successfully ,and Rowling didn't even try to do it. I'm disappointed in that aspect.

you are so right!!! If there was ever a point when i felt that I wouldn't like Dumbledore anymore it was the 'poor Severus' line. It came across as really glib. Especially considering that he didnt warn Snape that by killing him he would become master of the Elder wand which means that Voldermorte would most likely end up killing him for it. Snape would have done it anyway, he was so brave and Dumbledore knows that and should have shown him the respect of telling him.

Yeah your right Dumbledore should have told Snape, but I think he knew deep down what was coming to him. He loved lily so much that he was willing to give his life to save Harry. I'm pretty sure that he knew it would happen.

He's one of those guys i hated all throughout the books, but now that i know his true colors you kinda love him, but now if i go back and reread the books he'll be a totally different person since i know where his loyalties lie.

I agreew, that was such a punk way for Snape to die. Bitten by Nagini. Not even the decency of dying in battle.

*sigh*



Yeah, I assumed that Snape wouldn't survive ... but just having Voldie's pet kill him ... that's an exit for a minor character ... not one that's been around for everything!

you know, I was also disappointed that there was no Harry-Snape showdown. But I suppose that would have just been even more pain Harry would have to endure if he had been the one responsible for killing snape and then found out later that he was on his side the whole time.

I always thought Snape was really on the good side because I didn't believe Dumbledore could have made that big of a mistake, but I was actually losing faith in Snape during the book. So when he was about to die and gave Harry the memories I kind of felt a mixture of happiness and sadness. I was sad Snape died but happy that he turned out to be on Harry's side the whole time.

I was so happy that Snape turned out to be a good guy after all. When the
doe petronis showed up with the sword I said to myself--It's Snape. I was
never happy with Snape running off at the end of book six. Dumbledore was
too smart to have been taken in by him. Besides, we shouldn't judge a man
just because of his unwashed hair, right?

I never believed Harry would die at the end. Studying of
story structure and the Potter books follow the classic likes of the Odyssey
and other "Hero's Journies." Usually in these stories the Hero learns
something important about himself through the various tests and battles that
he faces so that in the end he can suffer a "ritual death" of somekind, and
through his knowledge, find resurrection. In the resurrection, the hero is
ablee to bring something (Joseph Campbell calls it the "magic elixir") back
to the ordinary world and throught this magical elixir he restores the
balance.

Only in a a true Greek tragedy does the hero die and then because he has a
"tragic flaw" that he's unable to recognize in himself. But Harry was never
like a tragic hero. He was always able to see his own shortcomings, and, in
fact, he had to overcome many of them to finally understand (through the
help of his mentor) where his power lay. In sacrifice. Always in
sacrifice.

But snape sacrificed too. The difference lies in his "tragic flaw" that he does
not see within himself. Perhaps it his pride and arrogance. It is very satisfactory,
then, for me that Snape dies. He plays his part as a hero, but by all means he is
the true tragedy of these stories.

And so, I could not imagine a more satifying ending to this book. It hangs
together as great story telling, in the classic tradition.

Do you believe it was necessary?
-yes. I think it was good that he died.

Did you see it coming?
-not really. Not in that way as he died

What did you think about how he died?
-Pointless. wrong. stupid. I was hoping he would die with a greater gesture. Somehow more heroically.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
- I was appalled. I couldnt believe JK did it that way. He was supposed to die shielding Harry from an AK curse or something. We didnt see him through entire book. It wasnt done well. But after where he died, it was done well. I mean how he gave harry his memories, and how harry cleaned his name in front of everyone

Yeah, I assumed that Snape wouldn't survive ... but just having Voldie's pet kill him ... that's an exit for a minor character ... not one that's been around for everything!
exactly the way i feel

1) Yes. Snape had to die. I don't know why...he just had to.

2) I expected him to die in the book. I knew that in some way he was going to give up his life after all the treachery he had done.

3) BAD. Stupid way for him to die. Get strangled by Nagini? He was a main character in the entire series. He was possibly the most talked about character after the trio. His death was just so fast and rushed. I thought he deserved a better death than the one he received. I expected him to get AK'd by Voldemort or saving Harry in some way. Not get bitten by the snake....

4) I actually felt nothing about this death. I didn't like Snape but I didn't dislike Snape. I was not emotionally attached to this character the way I was attached to other characters like Lupin or Sirius and I expected it to happen. As I've stated before though, I was not happy with the way he died.

Psychologically speaking, this is very realistic. Snape has to be nasty, cold and horrible so that everyone will hate him, (which he believes he deserves), so he will not be tempted to open himself up (which would open him to Voldemort's probing-destroyed his hard-won Occlumency protection. This is a classic way of keeping people at a distance so he wouldn't be hurt again. It is rather cowardly, actually. If he had opened himself up to love again, he might have 'betrayed' Lily's memory, but he would have been happy. By keeping her memory and depriving himself of anyone else's love, he is punishing himself.
I totally agree with that! :tu:
I actually wrote a fanfic called Snape's Happy ending (because I was sure he was going to die in DH) in which he falls in love again, and in that I had to cover a lot of "betraying Lily's memory" ground and deal with his fear of loving again.

Snape's death was sooo unnecessary. And the fact that he died not knowing Harry would live speaks very little of the great Albus Dumbledore. Pah!!

I was thinking the same thing. How cruel... :(

Dumbledore was a man who manipulated Snape's unrequited love for Lily to make him do what he wanted of Snape and he always mocked and belittled Snape at every turn, it looks like after seeing the treatment he meted out to Snape in Snape's memories.

I was shocked by his treatment of Snape, too. You'd think that someone like Dumbledore would have believed in second chances...seems to me like he only gave Snape half a second chance. Given his past mistakes, he had no right to treat Snape so poorly...


Worse was the fact the way Dumbledore brushed off Snape's death so blithely when he was discussing it with Harry in Harry's mind.

I just said the same thing myself, elsewhere, actually -- that it was almost like Dumbledore said, "Whoops..." and walked away. :no:

Snape should have lived. He had paid his dues to his society time and again. But he died and died not making his peace with Harry. It is all very well for Harry to call his son after Snape, but Snape I feel died without knowing if Harry would ever acknowledge and realize his sacrifices or not.

Poor, poor Snape.


Agreed. :(

I am sad Severus had to die. I believed he was good before the book and now that it has been confirmed and why he was still hanging on to good made me very sad but happy at the same time.
I always am a sucker for the tortured soul. :) I just think it's sad he didn't have any type of good things happen for him for all his sacrifices. I mean he is the ultimate in suffering.
I guess it would have been nice to see that he got to live and stay headmaster and finally have some justification to all his actions but I think that he still would have the problem of people never fully trusting him.
I didn't see it coming but I think Snape did. I think he knew that sooner or later he was going to be brought down playing the part he did. I don't think he had any foolish ideas that Voldemort would spare him if he felt that he wasn't needed.

The_Green_Woods, keep in mind that Snape treated Harry, and pretty much everyone not in Slytherin, like dirt. Dumbledore was a saint compared to the way Snape was. He couldn't even muster some kindness for Harry, who was very much like Snape, being raised in horrible conditions, and who suffered directly because of Lily and James's death.

Also, don't forget that Snape only cared because Lily was going to die. He wouldn't have given a rat's derrière had "the chosen one" been Neville, and had Frank and Alice been murdered. As much as Snape loved, he was still very selfish.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

Dumbledore had to have known that Snape felt awful, that he was suffering, and yet he treated Snape like a tool. That doesn't seem very saintly to me.

And, again, Dumbledore made mistakes as well, one that resulted in the death of his sister. Whether he was the one who cast the spell that killed her or not, it was he who introduced Grindelwald to his home and set the stage for disaster.

Snape did have to die, and yeah I saw it coming. I must admit, I bawled like a child when he asked Harry to look at him before he died so he could look into the eyes of the woman he loved!!

However, it was a bit of an unceremonious death for such a big character. But having said that, it must`ve been difficult to write. Snape could`nt die immediately, as he needed a few moments to give Harry his memories, and ofcourse the emotional bit of getting Harry to look at him was great for the overall effect. So Snape couldn`t really die protecting Harry from a killing curse, and it had to be somewhere quiet and private (no time to give out memories in the thick of the battle).

With regards to Dumbledore's behaviour towards him, yes, at first he was quite cold towards him, saying "you disgust me" but that is to be expected really, as he was still a death-eater then, and had just informed Voldemort of the prophecy. However, as Snape and Dumbledore spent more and more time together, I do believe Dumbledore developed a real friendship for Snape, and he was not merely a pawn in Dumbledore's bidding. It looked the same way with Harry, and that Harry himself was going to be used by Dumbledore for the greater good, but at the end, I do think Dumbledore cared for both of them. Hopefully they can resume their friendship if they have both "gone ahead".

Snape died a tragic hero's death, and I guess considering his life, and how he suffered so much, it was inevitable. I like thinking that Snape "moved on" after he died, and is somehow reunited with Lily

However, it was a bit of an unceremonious death for such a big character. But having said that, it must`ve been difficult to write.

I agree with both your points here. It was a viciously cold, meaningless, abrupt end on the mistaken, desperate whim of Voldemort. And I'm thinking this and/or The Prince's Tale may be the chapter towards the end of the book that JKR says she sobbed and wailed over when she finished it. It's hard to imagine a chapter that has triggered more sorrow and pain. I think it will always hurt me.

Did snape get a portrait in the headmaster's office? Would have been in in there when all the other ones were applauding for Harry?

Snape was never one of my favorite characters, until I read the Princes Tale chapter. How could you read that and not like him? I do believe his death, while sad, was necessary. I thought he was going to be killed by Voldemort anyway, so it wasn't really a surprise.

Very sad though... But now almost eveyone loves him.

Yeah, just like Beethoven. And a fat lot of good it does both of them, aye? :sigh:

Knew he was going to die - was looking forward to a big confrontation/revelation scene between him and Harry beforehand - didn't get it - absolutely gutted - death scene sucked big time. Total lack of drama and tension! Sorry, Jo, but the "dramatic arc" of Snape's journey crashed before it reached its fitting end.

I really do think that this was the biggest let down in the book ; all that build up just had to be answered with a more fulfilling/excruciating death scene. Not just a quick snake bite witnessed by Harry in secret followed by clunky exposition of Snape's memories.....

I'd have done it with a direct confrontation between Harry and Snape - even if Harry didn't learn everything about Snape in one go, it would have been enough to have Harry feel the seeds of doubt creeping into his mind (just as they did with Dumbledore's secrets) and for the rest to follow later......

I enjoyed the book but this was a huge disappointment.....:no:

This thread is so that you may discuss your reaction to Severus Snape's death.

Do you believe it was necessary?

Did you see it coming?

What did you think about how he died?

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

I absolutely think it was necessary, Harry wouldn't have listened to Snape any other way.
Yes, I thought since he is split 2 ways, either Voldemort was going to kill him because of his disloyalty or someone from the Order was going to kill him because of Dumbeldore.
I was sad, Snape has always been one of my favorite characters(yes, even after killing Dumbeldore). I trusted him and knew there was more to him than met the eye. But I do wish that Harry could of had sometime to talk to Snape before he died

I agree with both your points here. It was a viciously cold, meaningless, abrupt end on the mistaken, desperate whim of Voldemort. And I'm thinking this and/or The Prince's Tale may be the chapter towards the end of the book that JKR says she sobbed and wailed over when she finished it. It's hard to imagine a chapter that has triggered more sorrow and pain. I think it will always hurt me.


It`s funny you ask that, cos the first time I tried to post my previous comment (it didn`t work for some reason), I actually said "I bet that was the chapter that had JK Rowling "howling" with tears!

But yeah, Snape`s death, if anything, was a bit of an anti climax. I mean both Harry and Arthur survived being bitten by Nagini (I think it was Nagini that got them too). Alas, poor Snape!

I really liked this part of the book and i think Snape needed to die. However f he had died by some other means then i think it would have been better. Maybe in some duel with Voldy after he found out where Snapes Loyalties lied. I found the whole "look at me" thing really sad, i didn't realise until after that this was because Snape wanted to see Lilys eyes again before he died. I cried so much.

I don't mind Snape dying in such an unceremonious way: because spies don't die in blazes of glory - they die in the shadows, unseen, often betrayed and without much honor given towards them.

I do have problems with how easily he died though - I mean, what, he couldn't face Nagini? Even if he expected the attack to come from LV himself, it seems like Snape could have reacted in time to fend off Nagini. Snape is a capable wizard.

I do wish that he and Harry got to have some interaction before he died: I'd have liked Harry to discover the truth then talk with Snape - they didn't have to become friends, but some sense of acknowledgement of the truth would have been a great scene.

I liked how he grabbed Harry and looked into his eyes - I think he wanted to die looking at Lily's eyes.

snape had to die.
it saddens me that he died but he had to.
I think snape was an amazing well written charcter! i loved him personally (after i read the 7th book before i hated him)
Im going to miss it
it was very necessary for him to die!

Am I the only person that still doesn't like Snape? Him loving Lily doesn't make him noble and honorable to me. I see he was on the good side, and that he was brave, and I would trust him. But, I don't like him.

I thought about that too. Mr.Weasley was bit by Nagini in OOTP and he lived. It took the time of Harry having the out of body experience, to him telling Ron, to them getting McGonnagal, to McGonnagal alerting the Order, to the Order rescuing him-----and Snape died in two minutes? It just didn't add up. I also didn't know you could force memories out of your body in the nature that Snape did. Out of his eyes, ears, mouth......wow!!! But why couldn't Snape heal himself, like he did to Malfoy after the Sectumsempra spell, or did he want to die? I also thought, in all her magicalness, why couldn't Hermione heal him, or at least bandage him, but shock of the moment has to factor in. I'm very confused about Snape being murdered by Nagini, so unnecessary, but so necessary. Weird. :no:

There's a difference between getting nipped once in the side and having a snake sing its fangs into your neck. Also, Nagini's fangs do have poison as Arthur had that problem with the wound being rather difficult because of it. Severus got Nagini's poison direct into his blood stream which was closer to his brain and heart. He died faster because his jugular most likely got bit and he bled out, also because the poison worked faster. It must have been incredibly painful and frightening and that's why it's such an emotional death.

I think Snape's death was kinda key to redeeming himself. It gave him the tragic hero aspect.

I have to admit, I did see it coming; I just can't see Snape going on...

Getting bitten by a massive snake.. clearly a rather messy way to go. It was terribly sad though, especially when Snape told Harry to look at him so he could see the eyes that were so like the woman he loved.


Snape has always been among my favorite characters, particularily in the last couple of books where he as a character has really grown in depth. I'm still sad, but he died a hero, his last act helping Harry. Prince's Tale was probably my favorite chapter of the book. It was so heart wrenching and beautiful.

I don't mind Snape dying in such an unceremonious way: because spies don't die in blazes of glory - they die in the shadows, unseen, often betrayed and without much honor given towards them.

I do have problems with how easily he died though - I mean, what, he couldn't face Nagini? Even if he expected the attack to come from LV himself, it seems like Snape could have reacted in time to fend off Nagini. Snape is a capable wizard.

I do wish that he and Harry got to have some interaction before he died: I'd have liked Harry to discover the truth then talk with Snape - they didn't have to become friends, but some sense of acknowledgement of the truth would have been a great scene.

I liked how he grabbed Harry and looked into his eyes - I think he wanted to die looking at Lily's eyes.

Yeah, but you are forgetting the key thing: Severus was actually petrified of Voldemort. The Occlumency are scenes give that away a bit in that he is not comfortable saying Voldemort because he is afraid. When Dumbledore sends him in GoF, he turns white. When he is around Voldemort, he hates it because he is scared to death of him. When he goes to Voldemort and sees Nagini, he is very nervous and is very white as the way Voldemort is speaking is making him nervous. Also, when Voldemort tells him how he broke into Dumbledore's tomb, he goes stone white and looks up suddenly. He DID NOT like hearing that. He may be a capable wizard but we see that he is so afraid he doesn't even have a quick reaction to Voldemort's movement, and when nothing happens for a moment, he thinks he has been spared, but then Nagini's cage flies at him. He couldn't react. He was petrified. Mostly because he was afraid he would not get the info to Harry.

However, as Snape and Dumbledore spent more and more time together, I do believe Dumbledore developed a real friendship for Snape, and he was not merely a pawn in Dumbledore's bidding.

I don't think Snape felt that way, though...

"You have used me."

I don't know if I liked the fact that Voldemort killed Snape before he knew that Snape wasn't loyal to him. I do like the fact that Harry confronts Voldemort and tells him about Snape though. I feel Snape death, along with a lot of other deaths were unemotional, and very quickly done.

Snape staying in character as a Death Eater until his death was actually of some importance to the outcome. If Snape had chosen to make it a dramatic moment "Ha, you fool! I was Dumbledore's all along, and I never defeated him!!" he would have been giving away information that might have prevented Voldemort from making his final, fatal mistake. And erasing even the miniscule chance that he might somehow be able to pass on the message he needed to pass to Harry (which was clearly very much on his mind, I would say. He kept looking at the snake, doubtless remembering this was the sign Dumbledore had given him for when he needed to tell Harry, and trying to convince Voldemort to let him find Harry).

Snape staying in character as a Death Eater until his death was actually of some importance to the outcome. If Snape had chosen to make it a dramatic moment "Ha, you fool! I was Dumbledore's all along, and I never defeated him!!" he would have been giving away information that might have prevented Voldemort from making his final, fatal mistake. And erasing even the miniscule chance that he might somehow be able to pass on the message he needed to pass to Harry (which was clearly very much on his mind, I would say. He kept looking at the snake, doubtless remembering this was the sign Dumbledore had given him for when he needed to tell Harry, and trying to convince Voldemort to let him find Harry).

Yeah it's very important to note that. Even as he was giving the memories to Harry while making death-rattle noises, Voldemort had already left the room...I found it great that Snape turned out to be the most important character in the whole story.

I was sad that Snape died but it was not unexpected. I dont want to make anyone mad but I dont understand why Harry would forget about the way he treated Harry while he was a student. He was still a mean git, even if he did love Lily he always hated Harry.

But what about the other murders he may of committed?

We must remember that he was a Death Eater prior to coming to DD. I would assume that he did commit murder then.

Two points: one, we now have canon that the damage to the soul does not have to be permanent. True remorse can cause it to heal, and I think Snape was truly remorseful.

Two, I actually don't think he did kill anyone as a Death Eater, ever. Dumbledore and Snape discuss related topics twice in the memories - when Dumbledore asks Snape to kill him, and Snape objects that this could damage his soul, that it is alerady a mess because of his past murders does not come up.

And when Dumbledore tells Snape his plan for Harry, and Snape objects, Dumbeldore asks him how many people he has watched die. Surely, if he had killed people, that would be an even stronger argument?

It was both terrible and great... Snape, the Death Eater Voldemort respected most, died, killed by The Dark Lord - that just proved to me that Voldemort had no heart, no feelings, no friends. His one and only goal in life was to become invincible and killed everyone who stood on his way - even his best Death Eater (that's what Voldemort thought anyway). And all that just to obtain the ElderWand's full and unlimited power. Still, I was happy with the way he gave Harry all those memories and by doing so - revealing all his secrets to him... Snape turned out to be a great character - so complicated and different. Becoming a bad guy at first, then switching to the good side to protect Lily... Then doing his best to protect her son. And he had to lie to the Dark Lord, to overpower his Oclumency skills, to make him think he was still on the dark side... Such a dangerous task. And nobody never knew that he was actually good, had always been good.
He died so unfairly - taking no credit for all the good stuff he had done.

Both terrible and fascinating... JKR really made Snape and everything about him great - sad and real. At least Harry forgot all his hatred towards the Prince, even named his child for him.

I don't think Snape felt that way, though...

"You have used me."

I completly agree!

I was a big Snape hater and was convinced he fooled Dumbledore. So you can imagine the shock of discovering that it was Dumbledore who fooled Snape. Dumbledore in the end proved to be much more colder and manipulative than Snape ever was. Dumbledore never really care about Harry or Snape he just saw them as a means to an end, and use them as such.

Dumbledore had a gift of inspiring confidence and trust and used this to manipulate those around him for "the greater good". Its just SHOCKING to discover that in the end it was Snape who held more of an emotional attachment to Harry and need to keep him alive.

At least this explains the look of hate Snape had on face when he killed Dumbledore. It must've been a slap in the face to discover that after all he has done to ensure Harry's survival Dumbledore just used and lied to him and Harry both all those years and never had any intention of keeping Harry alive.

I almost took it for granted that Snape would die when Voldemort discovered he had been a spy all along, I thought that was the "service" Voldemort was calling Snape was. But he was doing his job until the very end as he kept asking Voldemort that might he go and capture Potter for him--not for Voldemort, but to give Harry the information Dumbledore gave him. I think JKR really used some good techniques while dealing with Snape's last moments; his last few words were vague yet seemed to come from his core; reading about his memories after he was dead produced a weird and empty mourning mood. The fact that he died because of Voldemort's greed and ignorance made it more sadder.

He died so unfairly - taking no credit for all the good stuff he had done.

Both terrible and fascinating... JKR really made Snape and everything about him great - sad and real. At least Harry forgot all his hatred towards the Prince, even named his child for him.


Since there is such a real and natural afterlife in this story, I have to imagine the great peace and happiness Snape will find in Lily's gratitude for his protection of Harry. And to be able to see her again at last. That would make sense in the Potterverse maybe?

The movie PoA stands out in my mind. The scene in the Shrieking Shack when the Trio stun him and Severus is forced back to the floor unconscious forshadows his death in the same Shack. So, to me, the scene was expected. In the movie it only shows Harry doing that. In the movie it later shows Severus in front of the trio, shielding them from Remus Lupin in werewolf form. I believe that foreshadows Severus not revealing Harry's whereabouts in the Shack in Deathly Hallows. So Severus' death should have been expected. Even though, I did NOT want Severus to die. I thought that since he had a pattern of redemption that he would just be battle weary and scarred at the end. My theories were all proved to me in The Prince's Tale. That he indeed luved Lily. That his patronus/boggart had something to do with Lily. That the reason he prtoected Harry was because he was and always would be in luve with Lily. His one request, " Look at me." was to look into those emerald green eyes before he took his last breath. During that time he gave Harry the best present he could, his memories. Severus needed to rid himself of his guilt so he could go onto the next adventure light hearted. Harry needed the knowledge of what Severus truly was and why. Severus' death was not in vain. But, I do not understand how Ms. Rowling could only devote one paragraph to a true hero's death.

I was just thinking about Snape, and I realized: he never got to see that Lily Potter's son lived. He had been so mad at Dumbledore that Harry was going to die, but then he lived, and Snape never got to know that in life. It kind of makes me sad.

the thing about snape is,if harry hadnt gone down to the shrieking shack when he did, he would have never been given snape memories and known he was supposed to 'die'.i know snape kept repeating he wanted to find the boy for voldemort when in fact he wanted to tell him everything..but he left it too late in my opinion.

I was actually pleased with his death scene. The speed of it seemed pretty realistic. I sure didn't expect Voldemort to set the snake on him, and Snape appeared to have been taken off-guard (I suspect that perhaps Voldemort used the snake to throw him off, rather than the predictable "AVADA KEDAVRA!" everyone expects.)
To me, it's way better than having Snape jumping in front of a curse (I'm sorry, but I find the whole "Jumping in front of something lethal at the last minute" thing is WAY too overdone and overdramatic.) And an extensive monologue would be unnecessary and kind of odd, since Snape doesn't seem to be the sort of person who would sit down and discuss his feelings (Again, it's also overdone.)
It's a shame we didn't get to see much of him in this novel, though his presence was there. When I reached the part about the doe Patronus, I immediately connected the doe with Harry's stag, thinking it represented Lily like the stag represented James. And although I'd hoped Snape would turn out evil, and didn't buy into the Snape loves Lily theories, I believed then and there that it was Snape's Patronus, and turned out to be correct.
I only actually had one problem with Snape in the book - and that was the whole "bravest man" reference in the epilogue. Given Harry and Snape's history as it unfolded it through the books, I could never see Harry referring to him as the bravest man he ever met, or using "Severus" as his son's middle name. Given that J.K. had this ending wrote ages ago, and made only minor changes to it, I suppose that maybe she originally intended on having Snape do something more dramatic to earn such respect from Harry.

I just wish that Snape got a portrait in the headmaster's office. Even if he was not properly appointed he deserves one for trying to protect the school as much as he could while he was in charge.

True remorse can cause it to heal, and I think Snape was truly remorseful.

"DON'T!" bellowed Snape. "Gone...dead..."

"Is this remorse, Severus?"

"I wish...I wish I were dead..."

Interesting word to use, considering... I'm positive his soul was fully intact when he died. :agree:

[QUOTE=Stahlgeist;4641831 only actually had one problem with Snape in the book - and that was the whole "bravest man" reference in the epilogue. Given Harry and Snape's history as it unfolded it through the books, I could never see Harry referring to him as the bravest man he ever met, or using "Severus" as his son's middle name. Given that J.K. had this ending wrote ages ago, and made only minor changes to it, I suppose that maybe she originally intended on having Snape do something more dramatic to earn such respect from Harry.[/QUOTE]


I couldn't see the boy Harry doing that either but the grown man Harry...oh yeh. By the time young Albus Severus is born Harry's what 25 -26 years old. He knows everything, he's digested everything and now understands just how much Snape really did for him
and why.
It's not the one big thing dramatic thing Snape might have done...it's all the little things over 17 years Snape did that I suspect earned Harry's respect.

I was sad that Snape died but it was not unexpected. I dont want to make anyone mad but I dont understand why Harry would forget about the way he treated Harry while he was a student. He was still a mean git, even if he did love Lily he always hated Harry.
Can you blame Snape? James IMO was a jerk throughout his school years. And Harry was much like James (not a jerk though). James treated Snape like **** so you cant help but understand why he would despise Harry who was so much like his father.

Since there is such a real and natural afterlife in this story, I have to imagine the great peace and happiness Snape will find in Lily's gratitude for his protection of Harry. And to be able to see her again at last.
:lol: Well, not with James around...
But yeah, I hope so. Dumbledore, Sirius, Lily, even James have to thank Severus for what he has done, haven't they? So it turns out that everything is fair... Snape, after all his miseries in his life on Earth, would be rewarded in his afterlife. And Voldemort... well, let's just say he wouldn't have great afterlife.

Snape's death was another that made me cry. I only cried after he had given Harry the memory though. I was so glad when I found out that he was good, and I totally understand why he went mad when Harry called him a coward...

Snape's death still wrings my heart. But I don't mind that he is dead. I just think he is somewhere else - perhaps he took a train somewhere close-by to Lily.

I didn't want snape to die!!!!! I cried all through the Prince's tale, it was so sad and touching, but i still think Snape's a jerk for being mean to Harry, he was his love's son, I would've just ignored the fact that he was like James.

HEM HEM!
Character Bashing/Worship: aka Shades of Gray (http://www.cosforums.com/showpost.php?p=4370151&postcount=1)

I thought it was particularly sad that Snape was not even treated as a proper adversary and that Voldemort didn't even kill him with his own hand.

He deserved a fight, did Snape. He had so much fight in him, after all that.

Harry who was so much like his father.

I think he was similar to him but I agree with Dumbledore -- his nature is much more similar to that of his mother's.

I thought it was particularly sad that Snape was not even treated as a proper adversary and that Voldemort didn't even kill him with his own hand.

He deserved a fight, did Snape. He had so much fight in him, after all that.

Lillbet, you're going to make me cry. :( :p

I do have problems with how easily he died though - I mean, what, he couldn't face Nagini? Even if he expected the attack to come from LV himself, it seems like Snape could have reacted in time to fend off Nagini. Snape is a capable wizard.

His upper body was trapped in the magical sphere so he cold not move to fend her off. AFter he is bitten, he does not fall free of it until after Voldemort waves the wand again and moves it off him, so that he can leave with Nagini. A nasty way to go, yes, but I don't think he could have avoided it despite his skill.

Do you believe it was necessary?

I do believe it was necessary because he had to show his loyalty to Dumbledore. I was extremely sad that he didn't even get a glorious death in battle. He died only because Voldy that that it would make his wand more powerful. I love that he made Harry look at him. I thought it was very touching.

Did you see it coming?

I did see it coming. I just thought Snape would have died in a more valiant way.

What did you think about how he died?

Like I said before, I thought his death was too casual. I believe, thought, that he knew Harry was watching and wanted to prove that he truly was Dumbledore's man. I thought he should have died trying to save Harry.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

I am very sad because I really liked Snape. I was so happy to find out that he was good. Once I read about his death I almost cried. I thought it was beautiful, thought, how he made Harry look into his eyes to see who he truly was.

Do you believe it was necessary?

For purposes of Jo's plotline, yes, it was necessary. The reason Voldemort chose to kill him, however, was something else again.

Did you see it coming?

Sure. I've never liked Snape and was hoping for something to take him out of the story since Sorcerer's Stone.

What did you think about how he died?

Almost unbearably brutal. I always expected him to be taken out by an AK after he was caught by Voldemort or one of the death eaters. The first chapter of the book was sure a hint that Snape was going to die a particularly gruesome death - but, even so, I wasn't anticipating anything like what actually happened.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

Shocked would be my choice of words. I cried when reading about Dobby's death and again when Fred died, but I was stunned at Snape's death.

I actually think his death was perfect.
Severus was not some golden, outwardly
heroic person and he hadn't ever drawn
attention to himself..on purpose, at least.
To die with trumpets
blaring as Harry's shield against the
brilliant green light that is Avada Kedavra
would have completely ruined the
tragedy and strife and and plain old
-grayness- that made Snivellus who he was.
It would have utterly broken the character
and I would have had less respect for him
if he threw himself out there like that.

Severus Snape is one of the greatest heroes
of all the books, yes. But honestly, does anyone
think he'd choose a pomp and circumstance
death over falling in the shadows, where he
can just be left in peace?

I had some idea that he was going to die. And I think it was important that he would die, especially since he could not save Lilly

Yep I saw it

I did not like how he died. I thought maybe they should have had him die defending the school like changing side and maybe even taking a death spell meant for someone else

I was saddened by his death because they could have had him survive and still be a pain in the butt!

I was a big Snape hater and was convinced he fooled Dumbledore. So you can imagine the shock of discovering that it was Dumbledore who fooled Snape. Dumbledore in the end proved to be much more colder and manipulative than Snape ever was. Dumbledore never really care about Harry or Snape he just saw them as a means to an end, and use them as such.


Ah, but Dumbledore believed that if Harry the Horcrux went to die willingly, then because of the thing with Voldmeort using his blood, he would actually survive. But only if he went willingly, with the certain knowledge that he would die. So Dumbledore's real plan was for Harry to cease to be a Horcrux, AND to live. But he could not tell Snape that, because Snape had to convince Harry there was no way out. So his plan always did include a provision for Harry to live.

I think he also felt badly about what he was asking of Snape. If he did not care about him at all, I don't see why he would have teared up when they had the conversation about the plan, when Snape shot off his Patronus.

Do you believe it was necessary?
Well, for the plot, yes. It would've been kind of weird if Snape had just started telling Harry his life story all of the sudden, and I don't think Harry would have believed him if he did. That was the only way Harry could've accepted the truth.

Did you see it coming?
No, not really. :upset: I didn't really have any thoughts on the subject at the time...I was so worried that Lupin would die for the entire book that I wasn't concentrating on Snape.

What did you think about how he died?
Well, it did sort of make sense. All those years in the service of evil...he had to pay the price sometime. I know he had a turnaround and was doing the right thing, but it kind of serves as a lesson that you shouldn't mess around with evil.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
Total shock and really sad. Sad especially after Harry looks at his memories in the Pensieve...obviously he had some good times in his life, especially with Lily, but jeez, he really went through some seriously hard times. Poor Snape. :(

I actually think his death was perfect.
Severus was not some golden, outwardly
heroic person and he hadn't ever drawn
attention to himself..on purpose, at least.
To die with trumpets
blaring as Harry's shield against the
brilliant green light that is Avada Kedavra
would have completely ruined the
tragedy and strife and and plain old
-grayness- that made Snivellus who he was.
It would have utterly broken the character
and I would have had less respect for him
if he threw himself out there like that.

Severus Snape is one of the greatest heroes
of all the books, yes. But honestly, does anyone
think he'd choose a pomp and circumstance
death over falling in the shadows, where he
can just be left in peace?

Too true (and nicely put, by the way), but that's what makes him such a tragic figure. The character deserved to die as he lived- behind the scenes, unknown, unmourned. Yet by the same token his death and what follows (his memories) makes some of us wish better for him.

I would have liked for him to go down, wand in hand. But after he "did a bunk" I suppose it makes sense that he didn't. Anything more noble would have lessened the character in my eyes.

His life AND death were a sacrifice for Harry. He agreed to kill Dumbledore and continue in his spying, knowing that this could lead to his death at any moment. As it finally did, fortunately after he was able to pass on the information Harry needed to have.
I meant in a more literal way, i.e. throwing himself in front of an Avada Kedavra. Trite, I know.

the thing about snape is,if harry hadnt gone down to the shrieking shack when he did, he would have never been given snape memories and known he was supposed to 'die'.i know snape kept repeating he wanted to find the boy for voldemort when in fact he wanted to tell him everything..but he left it too late in my opinion.

Dumbledore stressed that the timing was important. Otherwise, Dumbledore could haveb told Harry himself! At least he would not have had to worry about being believed.

And what Dumbledore told Snape is that for reasons Dumbledore would not explain, there would come a time when Voldemort would start being very protective of Nagini. And whe that happened, it would be time to find Harry and tell him.

Well, Snape first saw that happen in the Shack! That's why he was staring at Nagini in her magical sphere - he realized that Dubledore had been rightg about what would happen, and that it was time to tell Harry.

I actually think his death was perfect.
Severus Snape is one of the greatest heroes
of all the books, yes. But honestly, does anyone
think he'd choose a pomp and circumstance
death over falling in the shadows, where he
can just be left in peace?

I think he would. Which makes the life he chose after he 'returned' that much more admirable.

Severus Snape is one of the greatest heroes
of all the books, yes. But honestly, does anyone
think he'd choose a pomp and circumstance
death over falling in the shadows, where he
can just be left in peace?

Maybe Snape wouldn't choose, or allow, pomp and circumstance, but I think he certainly deserved it. I wonder what his memorial was like? Harry gave immediate public testimony about Snape being on the good side while playing the role of traitor, all for love of Harry's mother. Everyone at his last battle with Tom Riddle heard that, and the flurry of news and documentation of all the events that surely would have become history in the 19 intervening years until the epilogue would have repeated and repeated Snape's vindication. I find that satisfying.

Yeah, same here, and also I think his memories in the Pensieve should've revealed a lot more... Harry calling him "the bravest man I ever knew" in the epilogue might be unjustified. :whistle:

Not at all. Harry knew how much courage it took to kill Dumbledore at his request. Remember, one of the hardest things Harry ever had to do was forcefeed that basin of liquid down Dumblesdore's throat. Harry also knew how much courage it took to deal with unfounded accusation as Snape had to after Dumbledore's death. If you had in his spy gig than yes, I can understand why Harry called Snape the bravest man he ever knew.

As for Snape's death, it seems very fitting. Snape was brave but he wasn't heroic. He didn't particularly deserve a hero's death. He was still the same guy who bullied children, who really didn't care if James and Harry died if Lily would be spared, who emersed himself in the Dark Arts and joined the Death Eaters.

Also Snape's Death reinforced the idea that it didn't matter how loyal someone was to Voldemort, if he thought they stood in his way, he killed them.

Snape's death was quite shocking. He was killed by a snake. I thought that was sad

I didn't see it coming, to be honest. Came as a bit of a shock.. But I wasn't totally freaked out over it, like I were some of the others.

But I couldn't believe the stuff from his memories though! Wow.

In all honesty, I really didn't expect Snape to die. I figured that once everyone knew the truth about his devotion to Dumbledore and Hogwarts, he would've officially been made Headmaster. Much like my dismay at Petunia and Harry having nothing to say before they parted, I felt that Harry and Snape, after all they've been through with each other, should've had their "moment" as well.

Do you think it was necessary?
Somehow, I thought his death was going to be more important than what it turned out to be. But for Voldemort, it was pretty much necessary.

Did you see it coming?
Sadly, yes. I had figured Snape was going to die. However, I thought it was Harry who was going to kill him. Whether Snape was good or not wouldn't matter because Harry's anger would've been enough to face him and bring him down.

What did you think about how he died?
Once I read the next chapter and discovered the truth about his loyalties, I felt devastated. I felt so awful that I had doubted Snape and that he had lived his life as a miserable man tormented by love that he kept screwing up. I nearly cried because he was so innocent. No matter what he did, he was lost in two worlds - the world of Dark Magic, and the world that was encompassed by Lily. The clash of the two worlds was never meant to be, and so Snape was stuck in the middle of it all. It just makes me so upset, because he could've been such a wonderful person if he had had the right circumstances.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
Again, I'm very upset. He could've been such a great man if he had been born under the right circumstances and realized his mistakes with Lily.

Do you believe it was necessary?
I always believed that if Snape was "good" he would die helping Harry. If he was bad, he would live. So as soon as the snake bit him, I knew there was more. I think it was appropriate that Harry never knew until after his death he was protecting him. It helped shape Harry into the man he would become.

Did you see it coming?
Well, I thought he was probably good, so going along with my own theory I felt that yes, he would have to die.

What did you think about how he died?
Killed by a snake, the symbol of the house he represented. I call that ironically cool.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I thought it was the most beautiful and poignant moment in the entire book "Look at me". Wow! Just Wow! Thank you Jo!

I am still somewhat in shock about Snape's death. As I was one of those "Snape is good" people, I had a hard time coming to grips with the fact that he had to die, especially since we found out shortly after his death that he was good all along. Also, it did shock me in the cold blood of the act (not like I really thought Voldemort had feelings, but still...) I was very surprised that Voldemort would have made that decision but it was a powerful message, anyway.

I thought it was poignantly ironic that Voldemort would kill off his, supposedly, most useful servant for something like that-- and that the whole reason would turn out to be incorrect. It shows how very little he thinks of his death eaters, and it displays his disgusting selfishness. I thought it was pretty good... the fact that Snape couldn't tell Harry anything-- that he had to give him his memories... the morbid way they streamed out of him.... I thought it was good even though I was really hoping for some meaningful interaction with Harry...not just glimpses into his past revealing his true allegiances. However, I don't think there was time for that... it just might not have been feasible. And I agree that Snape is probably much happier now. I was sobbing throughout that chapter... and pretty much every subsequent chapter... oh well.

I think it was necessary for the plot of the book. I was pretty sure he would end up dying in the book, but I did not think he would be killed by Nagini. I think Snape should have died in a fight with Voldemort, he deserved to fight with Voldemort. It would have been better if he had a duel with Voldemort in the shack rather than being killed by the snake. It was good though that only a few people witnessed his death and, there was not a big scene which was probably the way Snape would have wanted it.

I agree, I think he should've died in a duel with Voldemort.


I hated his death only because he really died...for nothing once Voldemort finds out that he was not the true owner of the Elder Wand. I wanted to see him save Harry for the last time or just do something so that his death wouldn't be in vain.

I knew Snape was going to die. It had to be so because of the numerous poor choices Snape made in life. He had to die to atone for his crimes.

However, I think Jo wrote this entire plot line very poorly. She failed to convey any true feelings of love or remorse on Snape's part and she left all the important questions about Snape unanswered. Harry's reaction was contrived - unbelievable and completely unrealistic.

To be quite honest, I think Snape got what he deserved. For all his dreams of glory, he ended up being a little snack for Nagini because it was convenient for Voldemort due to his belief that Snape was the master of the elder wand. For someone like Snape, it was a fitting end, IMO.

Perhaps that seems cold, but Jo gave me no sympathy for Snape at all. I don't really care what Snape's childhood was like. Snape always had a choice and he chose to be a horrible person. Harry's childhood was much worse than Snape's and he didn't make such horrible choices. Jo chose to focus on Snape's obsession with Lily and his desire for revenge instead of answering all the important questions about Snape. In the end, I was left feeling ambiguous. He deserved to die for his crimes, but I don't feel he deserved to be called "the bravest man Harry knew". Snape never showed any bravery, IMO. He hid behind Dumbledore, Voldemort, and his role as spy. He allowed innocent people to be tortured and killed and didn't care. The only thing Snape truly cared about was himself and his obsession with Lily. He did what Dumbledore wanted because it coincided with his desire for revenge. He hated Harry to the very end and he didn't want to die. He never made a stand. He never apologized to Harry. The whole thing was just extremely disappointing and very poorly written.

Could the memories just have leaked out? I'm not sure i believe that they did, but, i just remembered, when you die aren't you supposed to have your life flash before your eyes? He might not have been able to control that whilst concentrating on getting the important later memories out.


Or, I guess, his memories clear his name, including his motivation.

i was shocked actually. I really was one hundred percent sure that Snape was evil. His death should have been in battle though. I would have liked to have seen him saving Harry's life, or something. I was kinda sad, i surprised myself when i cried. ha.

Do you believe it was necessary?

I think so. I didn't think the Snape/Lily revelation would have made as much of an impact of Snape was still living.

Did you see it coming?

I knew he had to die :\

What did you think about how he died?

Really scary. Did Nagini just bite him or like...swallow him then bit him? I was really confused...

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I start sobbing about it out of nowhere at times because his last words were so tragic and expressed so much supressed love of Lily :(

It was killing me so much how when Voldemort had Nagini safe in her enclosure, how Snape kept looking distractedly over at it, and kept saying "Let me get the boy.. I'll get the boy." It just shows how desperate he was to find Harry and to fulfill what he had to do, even in the face of death. And his death was the most horrible and pointless things in the books. In DH, he was truly alone, imagine what must've been going on inside him.

Did you notice that Snape seemed OOC during this dialog? Your right it could be that he was just desperate But one would think that Snape was use to having his life in mortal peril. I don't know, Snape's dialog just seemed so ooc.

I hated Snape's Death. Important to the plot, but so...impersonal...I think he deserved more than that. But then again, who ever deserves to die?

You really don't think Snape became a great man after all he'd done? Love is the most powerful thing in the world, and even if he may have been selfish, the fact that he could conceal such a deep love under that rough exterior-- a love that would cause him to sacrifice himself-- is amazing. And he cares about deaths. When Dumbledore tells him Harry must die... and the elder queries about all the people he's seen die, implying 'what's one more?', Snape replies that he regrets all the lives he could not save. He is appalled by Dumbledore's blase way of putting it by him, Harry being raised like a pig for slaughter-- as he thought.

By being a spy, how many people did he save from death, I wonder? Many, I would wager!

I think Snape was a great man whose one choice-- joining the death eaters because it seemed tantalyzingly comfortable for one with such ambitions and desire for pride and acceptance-- came back to bite him. Literally. But I don't think he was a horrible man. Quite the contrary.

I thought it was rather interesting that Harry learned what he did through memories willingly given by Snape considering their history with memories and pensieves and all that. It was like... full circle... or something. I liked it. It gives all of it that aspect of reality... and when Voldemort says, "I regret this", it brings it home that that's what he thinks is the worst that can happen--death.

I knew Snape was going to die. It had to be so because of the numerous poor choices Snape made in life. He had to die to atone for his crimes.

However, I think Jo wrote this entire plot line very poorly. She failed to convey any true feelings of love or remorse on Snape's part and she left all the important questions about Snape unanswered. Harry's reaction was contrived - unbelievable and completely unrealistic.

To be quite honest, I think Snape got what he deserved. For all his dreams of glory, he ended up being a little snack for Nagini because it was convenient for Voldemort due to his belief that Snape was the master of the elder wand. For someone like Snape, it was a fitting end, IMO.

Perhaps that seems cold, but Jo gave me no sympathy for Snape at all. I don't really care what Snape's childhood was like. Snape always had a choice and he chose to be a horrible person. Harry's childhood was much worse than Snape's and he didn't make such horrible choices. Jo chose to focus on Snape's obsession with Lily and his desire for revenge instead of answering all the important questions about Snape. In the end, I was left feeling ambiguous. He deserved to die for his crimes, but I don't feel he deserved to be called "the bravest man Harry knew". Snape never showed any bravery, IMO. He hid behind Dumbledore, Voldemort, and his role as spy. He allowed innocent people to be tortured and killed and didn't care. The only thing Snape truly cared about was himself and his obsession with Lily. He did what Dumbledore wanted because it coincided with his desire for revenge. He hated Harry to the very end and he didn't want to die. He never made a stand. He never apologized to Harry. The whole thing was just extremely disappointing and very poorly written.

Sorry to be one of those people who quotes someone, thus taking up a huge portion of their post with just a quote, but i completely disagree with Meesha :) That's part of the joy i get from reading books; talking to people who have formed completely different views on the story then myself.

Firstly, I think that Snape did feel remorse, but only for those things related to Lilly. What i took from the chapter where Harry looks at Snapes story is that 'good' though he ultimately was in the end, he was still fascinated by the dark arts, still someone who wanted to be in Slytherin house and someone who viewed pure bloods as 'better' then muggles. Does his original seduction to the dark arts make him a bad person? Maybe, but everyone makes mistakes, everyone does bad things/makes bad choices while they try to convince themselves that they're doing the right thing to ease their guilty conscience - that's part of being human and a mistake that Dumbledore himself made in his younger years.

JK made me care a great deal for Snape in the end, i was someone who always thought he was bad and never believed that he was working with Dumbledore but how wrong i was. Harrys childhood may have been worse then Snapes but different people react to things and cope with things differently. I don't believe that Snapes choices in his early life should condem him to being someone who could never atone for his sins. I don't think it is possible to forgive him for his treatment of Harry but i understand why he treated him that way and i think JK made it completely beilevable; having to look at Harry and see the love he could never have (and indeed the life he helped to kill) staring back at him would have been sheer torture.

As for hiding behind his role as a spy, he really had no other choice, coming out into the open would render the missions Dumbledore sent him on pointless. I think any apology he made to Harry, before his death and before Harry saw his story, would have seemed pointless and hollow. The fact that Harry was able to forgive him his mistakes and see what he did to make things right by risking his own life for years by betraying Voldemort also goes towards showing what a good person Harry is.

Phew, that was alot of typing *wipes away sweatdrop* I hope you don't take my post too personally Meesha, i was just using your post as a way of getting my own ideas and thoughts across because mine conflicted so much with yours :D

I knew Snape was going to die. It had to be so because of the numerous poor choices Snape made in life. He had to die to atone for his crimes.

However, I think Jo wrote this entire plot line very poorly. She failed to convey any true feelings of love or remorse on Snape's part and she left all the important questions about Snape unanswered. Harry's reaction was contrived - unbelievable and completely unrealistic.

To be quite honest, I think Snape got what he deserved. For all his dreams of glory, he ended up being a little snack for Nagini because it was convenient for Voldemort due to his belief that Snape was the master of the elder wand. For someone like Snape, it was a fitting end, IMO.

Perhaps that seems cold, but Jo gave me no sympathy for Snape at all. I don't really care what Snape's childhood was like. Snape always had a choice and he chose to be a horrible person. Harry's childhood was much worse than Snape's and he didn't make such horrible choices. Jo chose to focus on Snape's obsession with Lily and his desire for revenge instead of answering all the important questions about Snape. In the end, I was left feeling ambiguous. He deserved to die for his crimes, but I don't feel he deserved to be called "the bravest man Harry knew". Snape never showed any bravery, IMO. He hid behind Dumbledore, Voldemort, and his role as spy. He allowed innocent people to be tortured and killed and didn't care. The only thing Snape truly cared about was himself and his obsession with Lily. He did what Dumbledore wanted because it coincided with his desire for revenge. He hated Harry to the very end and he didn't want to die. He never made a stand. He never apologized to Harry. The whole thing was just extremely disappointing and very poorly written.
I couldn’t disagree more.

I couldn’t disagree more.

ill second that.

This thread is so that you may discuss your reaction to Severus Snape's death.

Do you believe it was necessary?

Did you see it coming?

What did you think about how he died?

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

Was it necessary? Before I knew of the Hallows, I thought that no, Snape could and would easily stay by voldemort's side until he shows Voldemort that he has been with DD. Then, I thought, he would be in mortal danger.

Did I see it coming? Once I found out about the Hallows, I wasn't quite sure what to think. But in Snape's final scene with Voldemort, I got a feeling...

How did I feel about it? I wasn't sad, but I was a little upset over it. I felt it was as though no one really cared, almost like Pettigrew's death (but in that case I didn't care either).

i wanted to post what i said about Snapes death and the epilogue here too...if i am repeating myself please say:


For me the epilogue was an interesting piece. In one context i didnt enjoy it, in another i did.

I didnt enjoy it in that it from harry's point of view we didnt really need it, an extra chapter on how he began to move on after the final battle and got back with ginny and all that would have probably done the same thing, plus of course a bit of exposition about Ron and Hermione. But this is why i dont think the epilogue was really for harry...and why there is another context in which i enjoyed it.

For me, the best way to read it is almost as an epigraph to Snape. I read it as a bit of closure on snapes character and he is finally getting the respect (as opposed to childhood hatred) from harry. this couldnt have taken place when harry was 17 as it probably have been too close to Sirius's death for harry. however, 19 years on, as an adult, harry is able to appreciate Snape (indeed sooner as he named one of his children after him).

Another reason why i think it is more about snape is that the other major protagonists (Dumbledore, Harry's parents, Sirius and even Voldemort) all get closure on their deaths and the emotions that surround them. In the final book we only get snapes story explained and not closure on the effect that it had on people. So for me it is as subtle, and very nice, way of showing that Snape is appreciated as a brave and noble soldier, despite his flaws, as opposed to the closing of the story. I can only ever read it as the last chapter in Snapes life as opposed to the final chapter in harry potter.

Finally, what drew my attention to this is that a big deal is made of harry saying (or implying at least) that snape was the bravest man he knew. it is almost the centre of the epilogue, where a simple reassurance of his young son would have done, JKR chose to reference snape.

Thats my true feelings on the epilogue ....if I read it as an explanation to the end of the series i find it a bit unsatisfying as so many characters are omitted but if i read it as an explanation to the end of snape, it reads as an emotiona l and heartfelt good bye to one of JKR's best characters (and my favourite).




ps what a great book.

This is how i look at Snapes death. again, sorry if i am boring people by repeating this...but the thread i was discussing this on got closed.

I was so sad when Snape died. There was nothing “upset” about it, I was fully depressed. Not surprised, I was expecting it the whole time, but I was so sad. Especially after watching his memories. He may never have been nice to Harry, but after seeing that it’s clear. He was a really good person, and all he wanted was Lily, and he could never have her.

I found it unbelievably tragic (especially once we confirmed his status as one of the most intense closet romantics of all time in the following chapter) and also inevitable. In choosing to be the ultimate spy, he was never going to make it out alive and I think he knew that, but it was tragic that he didn't have the chance to finally turn the tables on Voldemort-- or see Harry triumph in the end.

And his last words are haunting.

Omg. His death was a total shock to me. I hadn't seen it coming at all. True, it had crossed my mind that he may die, but in my mind it was him dying to protect Harry the same way that Lily did. When Nagini just bit him and Voldemort walked away, I was completely stunned. I had this clear picture in my mind, of him grabbing his neck hunched over on all fours, bleeding, while Voldemort just calmly walked away. That is one of the most vivid mental pictures that I have in my mind.

I don't think that his death was necessary per se, but I can see why it happened. I'm so glad that Harry took off his cloak and walked over to him, otherwise Severus Snape's death may have been in vain.

And I have to say, this is probably the point in the book where I was crying the most. At this point, not only had Fred died, who had been one of my favorite characters, but Snape too? I couldn't handle it, and I just started sobbing. And I mean sobbing. Tears pouring down my face, my whole body shaking, and I felt as if there was a giant hand constricting my chest; my heart and lungs seemed to be crushing against each other, and I just felt like I was dying, too. Oh god, that was terrible. D:

I was shocked at the time. Sad later.

I was surprised at how very little Snape and Harry interacted in the book, and I was sad at how Snape died. I figured he would die though and I liked the memory scenes, so it's all good.

Agreed, and also a more noble death such as defending Harry from Voldemort's death curse before carrying on as it did would've flowed better methinks.

I think his death was quite appropriate.

It is said that Snape was very close to LV and Snapes death just shows us how cruel and nasty LV is. Lv is very happy for his main man to be eaten for dinner.

He had to die to atone for his crimes.

I'm only aware of him having made two major mistakes -- joining the Death Eaters and telling Voldemort of the prophecy. In my opinion, we can't really count Dumbledore's death because that was never his idea and he never would have done it if not for Dumbledore pushing the job off on him.

She failed to convey any true feelings of love or remorse on Snape's part and she left all the important questions about Snape unanswered.

I'll have to disagree. :)

I think she proved how he felt in The Prince's Tale perfectly. She showed him running to Dumbledore for help and crying and bellowing in agony.

What questions did she leave unanswered? I can't seem to think of any... Doesn't mean there aren't any, though. :hmm:

Harry's reaction was contrived - unbelievable and completely unrealistic.

I'd have to agree but I don't think we agree for the same reasons. :lol:

I felt that Harry should have shown a little more emotion. It wasn't his fault that he viewed Snape as untrustworthy the entire time but Harry has always been thought of as a character who loves and forgives rather easily and yet all he did, in reaction to Snape's death, was get up and go. JK didn't even mention anyone going back to recover his body or giving him a proper burial.

For all his dreams of glory, he ended up being a little snack for Nagini because it was convenient for Voldemort due to his belief that Snape was the master of the elder wand.

I was never under the impression that Snape had dreams of glory. And, even if he did, so did Dumbledore.

He hid behind Dumbledore, Voldemort, and his role as spy.

I wouldn't call his being at Hogwarts hiding, especially not since Voldemort ordered him there and Dumbledore wished him to remain there until the time was right for him to return. Maybe that's just me, though. :shrug:

He allowed innocent people to be tortured and killed and didn't care.

When did he allow innocent people to be tortured and killed, pre-Deathly Hallows?

I don't think we can assume he didn't care either, especially not after what he said to Dumbledore about having only witnessed the deaths of only those he couldn't save.

He never apologized to Harry.

Harry never apologized to him, either... :(

Do you believe it was necessary?
Yes. Not because of the Elder Wand, which turned out to be a mistake on Voldemort's part yet again, but because he never would have been accepted as part of the Wizarding World had he lived. If he lived, I'm firmly convinced he would have gone to Azkaban. Those on the light side barely tolerated/trusted him - they only did it because Dumbledore did, and he killed Dumbledore. Sure, he had a reason, and a good one, but to the people who loved Dumbledore, there was no excuse. I doubt they would accept his reasons.

I think he had to die to gain redemption in the reader's eyes, as well as Harry's. There was no way he could live and have a happy ending. In death, he was finally free of the burdens and secrets (plus I don't think he would have given them to Harry unless he was on his deathbed, I don't think he could have lived with Harry knowing about his feelings for Lily). In death, he finally gains respect and trust from Harry, who names his son after him!

Did you see it coming?
Yes, I didn't see any way he could live a happy life.

What did you think about how he died?
I think it was tragic and sad, but I think it served the purpose it needed to without being overly dramatic. I'm not sure I could stomach any other sort of death, where he died on the battlefield as some sort of redeemed hero. This way, redemption comes privately and quietly. It needed to be between him and Harry alone.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?
I always had a fondness for Snape, so I'm sad, but seeing as it's the only thing that made sense for his character, I'm okay with it.

Geez, my post has been edited.....


The Snape Story unravelled almost EXACTLY TO THE TEE as I had thought and hoped it would. What's great about the bok though is there were places were I actually started doubting myself thinking maybe I was wrong and I was about to be ******. LOL! But it turned out the way I had thought - and most of my theory was based on PEtunia's line from last book, "That awful boy!" I KNEW it!

Well, anyway, I was SHOCKED when Snape died. I knew he would die but not in that manner! I was like, "What?" "WHAT?" I kept thinking someone would heal him or he woudl come back. It devastated me that a wizard as brilliant as he would be murdered in cold, calcuated blood. But then... that's the point, isn't it? That Voldemort is a muderer with no remorse, nothing. I wanted Snape to die in BATTLE, maybe even defending Harry - I had Darth Vader on the brain. But now that it's happened, I see WHY it had to happen the way it did.

I bawled through the Prince chapter. It was freaking beautiful.
And when Snape showed Dumbledore his doe patronus and Dumby asked, "Still?" and Snape said, "Always." I wanted to die. It was gorgeous. There is no way IMO that Snape could have lived a full, happy life. Even if he and Harry had reached some sort of peace, some sort of relationship --- Snape had already died with Lily that night. He was barely alive while he lived.

I would also like to say that I am thankful that this character exists in a mass literary work such as this. Maybe it will show people that things aren't always BLACK and WHITE. GOOD or BAD. That sometimes things happen in our lives that are so heartbreaking that we make rash wrong choices without thinking and come to regret them in the end. But that the love will always be there buried somewhere deep inside. Snape is a three dimensional character and a human being who was never surrounded by the love that he IMO deserved. So he reacted by pushing that love even further away. It's heartbreaking. I've been tearing up all day.

Long live my Snape.

I've been tearing up all day.

I was actually sick to my stomach for a while. I couldn't believe that he'd died so quickly and for such a selfish, stupid reason. I always knew it was possible that he'd die but I always kind of thought it'd be in battle...

Originally posted by DarkDaysAheadI felt that Harry should have shown a little more emotion. It wasn't his fault that he viewed Snape as untrustworthy the entire time but Harry has always been thought of as a character who loves and forgives rather easily and yet all he did, in reaction to Snape's death, was get up and go. JK didn't even mention anyone going back to recover his body or giving him a proper burial.


There wasn't really time for Harry to show any more emotion. So much was going on in that part of the book and so many people were dieing. We also found out in the epilouge that one of Harry's sons was called Albus Severus.

I think that it made sense for Snape to die, but I'm still really sad about it. I loved seeing the memories because they showed anther side of him. In the other books we mainly see him being mean to Gryffindors in general and Harry in particular.

why would Harry show any emotion to Snape at the time, before viewing his memories? it doesnt make sense. Im pretty sure he was happy that Snape was dead at that point

Oh, it was also amazing in the memories when Dumbledore says he thinks she Sorting Hat chooses too soon -- IE Snape might have been a good Gryffyndor --IMAGINE how differently his story would have turned out. There may never have BEEN a Harry Potter..........

I'm not in the least bit surprised he died, I was very surprised by the manner in which he died. I expected Snape to go out heroically protecting Harry.

I'm not certain that he and Harry would have been able to talk about everything. Would Harry have actually taken the time to listen to him? Or would Harry have hexed first and asked questions later.

I've felt for ages that Snape loved Lily, it was nice to see that was true. His last words were heartbreaking.

I cried all the way through "The Prince's Tale."

Do you believe it was necessary?

No. But I suppose it makes for a better book. Sigh...

Did you see it coming?

Yeah. Not far ahead of time, though. And I did hope he'd survive to carry on a curmudgeonly existance. At least he got to play Headmaster for a bit...

What did you think about how he died?

I think it was fitting, and had a certain dignity. No soppy emotional scenes. No arguing with Harry, no begging for mercy from Voldemort, no flashy end-preordained battle. It was fast and inescapable, and it showed how easily Voldemort would discard his own (supposedly) loyal followers on a whim. No more agonizing over lost love, no more regrets over past sins. Rest In Peace, Severus Snape.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still?

I'm okay with it, but I WANT A FUNERAL, DARN IT! Not JUST for Snape, but for all the others who died. Well, at least we have Albus Severus, half named after the bravest man Harry Potter ever knew.

I was in the Snape was good camp. I loved how JKR kept me guessing through out this book. To be honest, as I was reading I just could nnot accept he was evil. There was no way. I knew he was going to die, but I thought it was going to be in battle. I could not imagine him dying in such a manner. I thought JKR did him a disservice. There was nothing noble about his death.

He would never be the type for speeches. He was more of a man of actions.Nothing he could say would ever change Harry's mind. I thought the only way for Harry to "listen" to Snape or to consider Snape's motives would be for Snape to prove himself by laying down his life for Harry. However, I think Harry looking into Snape's eyes and seeing the memories he wants to share...I thought his last words were perfect. Now, I can't think of any other way for Severus to meet his end. He was such a tragic figure, so his tragic death is fitting. He did die a hero, he did redeem himself. He stayed true to Dumbledore to the bitter end.

The Prince's Tale made me weep. What got me was when the realization that Harry must die hits him. The pain was so palpable for me.

I still don't get why he did not fight back. He KNEW it was coming. He didn't run, put up a fight, or anything.

Also, what was up the the "silver liquid leaking out". I thought that you had to use a wand on yourself to get it out... And as a reader, you really had NO CLUE what it was at that time. It was vaguely described, and I don't see how one was supposed to glean what it was.

The fact that Harry just took it, STILL under the impression that Snape was a BAD GUY, did not make sense. If someone that, I thought, wanted to kill me just died, and had ooze leak out of his head, and his dying words were "take it", I really doubt I would have taken it. Could have been explosive, poisonous, anything. Also, it was described differently in this book. It was described as being "stringy" in other books. What was described here was similar to what unicorn blood was described as earlier.

Welcome to all the new posters! Glad to see so many of you here. :)
I've liked Snape since book one, finding him to be the most complex character in the series, and also in most other books I've read. When I got to the end of "The Elder Wand", I wanted to read even faster than I already do to see what memories Snape had given Harry. I wept as I saw how his life played out. Even DD had tears in his eyes as he saw Snape's Patronus. I think then, at that moment, DD might have realized what a person he had in Snape. It was, and is, one of the most beautifully written chapters I've ever read, to the end, when he says, "look..at...me." I cried more than I did when Dobby died.

There wasn't really time for Harry to show any more emotion. So much was going on in that part of the book and so many people were dieing. We also found out in the epilouge that one of Harry's sons was called Albus Severus.

I'll have to disagree.

He wouldn't have had to have thrown himself over Snape's body and begin to wail, all he had to do was, at the very least, think of him, just to show he felt something. He thought of Fred. He thought of Lupin. He thought of Tonks. But not Snape.

And then, Dumbledore's brushing off of his death seemed a little harsh, too.

So little was said, so little was done, that it really shocked me and I'm still a little surprised. He was such an important character and yet he kind of got the short end of stick, even in death.

I still don't get why he did not fight back. He KNEW it was coming. He didn't run, put up a fight, or anything.

The way he was behaving in Voldemort's presence screamed fear and nervousness to me. It was, rather plainly, out of character and his demeanor even made me nervous for him. I don't think he had time to react, he was too frightened.

Also, what was up the the "silver liquid leaking out". I thought that you had to use a wand on yourself to get it out...

I don't believe it was ever said that you had to have a wand. I think it's just easier that way because it keeps it all together, intact.

And the fact that Harry just got it, STILL under the impression that Snape was a BAD GUY, did not make sense. If someone that, I thought, wanted to kill me just died, and had ooze leak out of his head, and his dying words were "take it", I really doubt I would have taken it. Could have been explosive, poisonous, anything.

He did not know why he was doing it, why he was approaching the dying man: He did not know what he felt as he saw Snape's white face, and the fingers trying to staunch the bloody wound at his neck.

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Silvery blue, neither gas nor liquid, it gushed from his mouth and his ears and his eyes, and Harry knew what it was, but did not know what to do -

He probably felt unthreatened by Snape. It wasn't as though Snape was in any state to harm him and he knew what the silver stuff was so he knew it wasn't poisonous.

Do you believe it was necessary? Yes. It was a redemption thing.

Did you see it coming? Again, I figured Voldemort would kill him in the end.

What did you think about how he died? Unexpected, but I liked the way JK Rowling wrote it and the reason why it was done.

And how did you feel about it, are you sad, happy, or in total shock still? I was fine with it.

i would have wanted to see severus telling something to harry about his eyes or about lily before he gave the memory to harry, a bit more drama in his death, i suspected he was going to die, but it was to quick, and by nagini (i didn't like that either)

One other thing I find odd is that Harry named his kid after Snape. Just because Snape loved his mother, that redeemed him for being a death eater, wanting his father dead, and never being nice to Harry (sure the memory said he "liked" Harry, but still....). Seems weird that just the "he loved his mother" thing was THAT redeeming. There were far more worthy people for his son's middle name IMO.

One other thing I find odd is that Harry named his kid after Snape. Just because Snape loved his mother, that redeemed him for being a death eater, wanting his father dead, and never being nice to Harry (sure the memory said he "liked" Harry, but still....). Seems weird that just the "he loved his mother" thing was THAT redeeming. There were far more worthy people for his son's middle name IMO.

I think Harry named his son Severus not just because he loved his mother but because that love was the catalyst that drove Snape behave in a manner that led Harry to call him "the bravest man I ever knew"

One other thing I find odd is that Harry named his kid after Snape. Just because Snape loved his mother, that redeemed him for being a death eater, wanting his father dead, and never being nice to Harry (sure the memory said he "liked" Harry, but still....). Seems weird that just the "he loved his mother" thing was THAT redeeming. There were far more worthy people for his son's middle name IMO.

It wasn’t that Snape loved Lily, it was that because of that, Snape devoted his whole life to helping Harry, even if he never showed it to Harry himself. He wasn’t just an ordinary Order member, either, he put his life on the line every single day, every time he lied to Voldemort, every time he agreed to another of Dumbledore’s crazy schemes.