Ron Weasley's abandonment in DH

Couldn't find a thread for this but I've been thinking about it a lot. The book stated that Dumbledore counted on Miss Granger to slow him (Harry) up. And honestly, Hermione was so important that without her, Harry would've been in some serious trouble. The book also says that Dumbledore 'understood' Ron abandoning the group and gave him a way to come back. When/How did Dumbledore come to that conclusion? Has Ron done something in other books that foresees this? I can't recall any off the top of my head. I know in the 4th book they have a huge fight but I always attributed it to Ron's feelings of being in Harry's shadow once again and thinking Harry took him for granted and didn't trust him enough to tell him when and how he'd entered.

Ron leaving definitely did surprise me, but as Harry said, the manner in which Ron returned made up for it. I don't think his leaving constitutes a "disservice" to him at all. Actually, his adventures on his own and efforts to return to Harry and Hermione reflect quite well on him, IMO. If Dumbledore did indeed anticipate Ron leaving (which we don't really know, anyway), then it was because he understood Ron's insecurities, which would drive him away, and understood that Ron would inevitably overcome them. Going away and coming back was part of Ron's journey, and I think it worked very well, even if it was rather unexpected.

i cannot belive ron left. i was so surprised. I remember reading and posting in a forum about Ron betraying harry. when he left i freaked out. lol! but since he came back yay! lol! i was so shockeddd whent hat happened!!

I think Dumbledore had a deep understanding for human nature in general and for his students specifically.

He already made Ron prefect for a reason, IMO. He saw Ron´s insecurities and knew that he would need to finally, once and for all deal with them. Get them out of his system. And Dd might have guessed that Ron would have to leave the other two at some point to achieve that.

At first, I was really annoyed with Ron leaving. Not so much with Ron, more with JKR for giving us insecure Ron again after the growing up he had done in HBP. But I guess, I just misinterpreted HBP. Ron was not as confident as I thought him to be at the end of book 6.

In hindsight, it all makes sense and I have reconciled with it. It was really very well explained. Ron has been more susceptible to the influence of the locket-horcrux then the other two. On top of that, they were all frustrated, and Ron was concerned about his family. At one point that was probably just enough. But he explains that he wanted to come back immediately but ran into the Snatchers which held him up and when he returned to the site, Harry and Hermione were gone.

Plotwise, I think JKR needed one of the three in contact with the rest of the wizarding world. They had been quite separated from everything, not knowing what was going on, for some time now. Ron returned with the information that saying Voldemort´s name was a taboo and they could be tracked down if they said it. Plus, he had found out about Lee Jourdan´s priate radio.

I don't think that Ron would have left if he wasn't under the effect of the Locket, it was really the locket that made him take that decision. He himself admits it that, once he was back to himself, he wanted to return but was caught up with Snatchers and I believe him when he says that.

I wasnt surprised when Ron left them. I was kind of hoping for Harry and Hermione to do something foolish though - both of them were in great despair, alone in their tent, both young... that would have been interesting :)

It was because the Locket was feeding him distorted images of his greatest insecurities of being not good enough.

I couldn't believe ron left, but it was partly to do with the horcrux that he was carrying at the time. iwas at first shocked, then desperate for him to come back them quite upset. Hermione was effected badly by it too. I understand why Hermione was so angry at Ron, but i thought she would be kinder in a way because he was alright, but that would have been too easy.

I was really surprised when Ron left, but the first thing I thought of was when he "left" in GoF (not believing Harry, etc.).

It made sense to me- over the course of the last two books Ron had been slowly learning to distinguish himself from Harry and Hermione (playing Quidditch, dating Lavender), and it seemed natural that he would break off from the group at some point.

That said, his return was sweet! :D

Well, we can say that at least Ron made a great come back after he left.

Save Harry's neck, destroy a Horcrux and take the sword.

Not bad for a come back. ^^

yeah...I cried when ron left...how could he have gone!? Ron's loyalty...yeah....your right though...he made a GREAT comeback.

I actually cried when he left and I thought he wouldn't be able to get back. Thank goodness Dumbledore had the foresight to give him that deluminator.

I don't think much of his deus ex machina return. It was Ron growing up and feeling confident enough in himself to finally leave.

I didn't actually cry but it was one of the saddest parts of the book for me. I just couldn't get into the chapters where he was missing because I just wanted him back and it made those chapters really difficult to read because all I could think about was that Ron wasn't there. When he came back was one of the best parts of the book for this reason.

I was a bit saddened by Ron's departure, but he has always been the one dealing with the most insecurities. Ron has been shown to have little control over his emotions too, therefore the locket probably naturally caused him the most pain. However, Ron remained true to form, in his desire to return to his friends. Remember, he was too ashamed to return to the Burrow because he knew his family would be dissapointed so he stayed with Bill and Fleur instead.

. The book stated that Dumbledore counted on Miss Granger to slow him (Harry) up. And honestly, Hermione was so important that without her, Harry would've been in some serious trouble. The book also says that Dumbledore 'understood' Ron abandoning the group and gave him a way to come back. When/How did Dumbledore come to that conclusion? Has Ron done something in other books that foresees this? I can't recall any off the top of my head. I know in the 4th book they have a huge fight but I always attributed it to Ron's feelings of being in Harry's shadow once again and thinking Harry took him for granted and didn't trust him enough to tell him when and how he'd entered.

I think that you are getting sthing wrong, I thougt i understood that dumbledore counted on Hermione to slow harry up in THE SEARCH OF THE HALLOWS, not the horcruxes!!
and as to Ron, i always thought that Dumbledore was keeping his eyes very closely on the trio, and lets remember that dumbledore was an accomplished legilimence

I was initially very annoyed with Ron's behaviour until we saw his insecurities played out through the locket.

From the very beginning Ron has been seen as "another Weasley", the last of six brothers, all of whom have proved themselves in different ways. As the locket says, every achievement is underplayed because his siblings have all done it before him he even feels that his parents were disappointed at his birth because he wasn't the daughter they'd wanted. Combine that with being the overlooked sidekick to the famous Harry Potter, and you can understand his inferiority complex.

Hermione was an only child, she was the first witch in her family, she was unique in her intelligence. Her contribution to the trio was obvious while Ron's was not. He was the sidekick who, although being essential to both Harry and Hermione, felt like he didn't have anything to offer. Being in love with Hermione can't have helped, if like the locket showed, he believed she cared more for Harry; that truly would make him feel like the outsider.

It wasn't a huge stretch of the imagination to envisage him deserting Harry at a crucial time, he has after all done it before during the Triwizard tournament. However during both instances he shows his true colours, he secretly informs Harry about the dragon task and he does everything he can to return to Harry and Hermione in DH.

I think at the stage that Ron left I had come in from outside and was almost jumping out of my bed. I actually feel that the way Harry got to hear what the Locket had been saying to him was really well done. Because it sounded like the fear that gnaws on all of us - bitter and hard to overcome. I think Dumbledore gave him the Deluminator because he really did know that whatever happened Ron do his best to stay with Harry. Dumbledore cared for his students. He watched over them. He cared about Harry and saw Ron abandon him in Goblet but return. So maybe Dumbledore just gave it as an "incase".

Yeah, the Locket destruction scene was one of the best of ALL the books.

So damn intense.

The scarlet eyes was a bit too much for my taste, but the rest was simply awesome.

It reallly was a fabulous scene. It seemed very personal to the characters and very true.
It wasn't a huge stretch of the imagination to envisage him deserting Harry at a crucial time, he has after all done it before during the Triwizard tournament. However during both instances he shows his true colours, he secretly informs Harry about the dragon task and he does everything he can to return to Harry and Hermione in DH.That was in the movie, was it not? I thought it was Crouch the Junior as Mad-Eye Moody through Hagrid?

It reallly was a fabulous scene. It seemed very personal to the characters and very true.
That was in the movie, was it not? I thought it was Crouch the Junior as Mad-Eye Moody through Hagrid?

It's been a while since I read GoF but you're probably right, he did definitely abandon him and come back so the similarities are still there.

Like others in this thread, I saw it as the same sort of situation Ron faced in GoF. He felt that Harry wasn't confiding in him and had, in fact, let him down. What really bothered me about the scene was that Harry felt that their relationship could never be mended.

I also felt that Ron's leaving showed how essential he was to the dynamics of the trio. Ron had become much more than a tag-alonger, as we saw at the end of HBP. It was just up to him to make that final step of believing it. Moving away from the other two was the trigger for that.

Couldn't find a thread for this but I've been thinking about it a lot. The book stated that Dumbledore counted on Miss Granger to slow him (Harry) up. And honestly, Hermione was so important that without her, Harry would've been in some serious trouble. The book also says that Dumbledore 'understood' Ron abandoning the group and gave him a way to come back. When/How did Dumbledore come to that conclusion? Has Ron done something in other books that foresees this? I can't recall any off the top of my head. I know in the 4th book they have a huge fight but I always attributed it to Ron's feelings of being in Harry's shadow once again and thinking Harry took him for granted and didn't trust him enough to tell him when and how he'd entered.

I don't have a lot of time right now, but there's actually quite a bit in previous books that made Ron's abandoning the group a predictable event. Some of the big clues I thought came from OotP. The point was made that Voldemort is known to spread discord among friends by preying on their insecurities. The Sorting Hat song contained some foreshadowing as well. And then there's Ron's character who's always had to struggle with being overshadowed causing insecurities and jealousy of Harry's fame. That made him a weak link that Voldemort would go after. Which Voldemort did or at least the fragment of his soul did, and it worked. Once Ron was away from the influence of Voldemort he of course came to his senses and wanted to come back.

I thought it was great how Ron had to come back and face his insecurities and jealousy in the form of a fake Hermione and Harry. The moment when Ron raised the sword above his head and had the choice to plunge the sword into either the locket or Harry was the turning point for Ron. And he was definitely torn between the two. But his choice was to plunge the sword into the locket. And not only was the horcrux destroyed but his jealousy of Harry. I can't think of a way in which Jo could of written it any better than that.

Ron has always been so insecure and it appears he never really got rid of that. Even his quote about Hermione "choosing Harry over him" showed that he was insecure. I was mad when he left because I loved Ron in this book and I did not want to see him leave. I really thought it was important for Ron to kill that horcrux because Harry needed to make him feel like he was needed. Ron's absence really did hurt them. They lose all of their chemistry when Ron isn't there. Ron has always been a little jealous of Harry. It was no surprise when he said "you'd choose him over me, I see how it is" to Hermione because that's just showing his jealousy again. He thinks Harry gets whatever he wants because of who he is.

Not only was it important for Harry to prove to Ron he was needed by killing that horcrux, but it was even more important for Harry to tell Ron that Hermione was like a sister to him. Ron really felt like Harry and Hermione had a thing. It was nice to see Ron finally come back and be a part of the group again. When he was with Harry and Hermione, there was no doubt he was brave and important. He saved Hermione from getting stunned by those Death Eaters in the cafe, for one thing.

I agree that he was insecure, but I felt like his departure had to do with a combination of jealousy, insecurity, and the feeling that he was inadequate. He probably felt like, here's Harry the boy who lived, who's marshalling the entire fight, and here's Hermione who's talented and putting up a fight, and she's dead useful for security and in battle. The Horcrux was probably fanning these feelings, and I think it all just boiled over with his frustration in a lack of a proper plan. His jealousy was palpable and I've said this before, he probably thought that Harry had sought Hermione after he "split" with Ginny, as sort of a substitute and that was a thought that he just couldn't bare.

I was surprised that he abandoned them, but I didn't count it out of the possibilities. But looking at the searing hole he left in the emotional health of his friends shows that Ron was not just a tag-along friend who was just there for the ride, it showed that Ron was a crucial part of the trio, who was genuinely unique in his own sense.

Nonetheless I was angry at him. I thought it was one of the emotional lows of the book when he left, and Hermione was crying, oh I just felt so bad at that point. But his sort of intrepid return completely absolved his abandonment in the first place, because it was well - would Freaking AWESOME describe it well?

Ron has always seemed to be a bit short tempered...take into account the Horcrux and the thoughts it caused, the fact that they were three teenagers on the run from extremely dangerous people, all the while trying to save the wizarding world, and I think his frustration was justified, think of all the stress...he did immediately regret it though, didn't he? He couldn't have gone straight back to them, because of all the protective charms and everything...also, if he hadn't left, he probably wouldn't have found Harry in the Forest of Dean, which no doubt would have been a fiasco.

I really didn't like that Ron left. I know he has insecurities and flaws like everyone else, but I felt that he had grown beyond these feelings enough that he would stick by Harry through anything. I felt like it was a regression of character. Ron deserved better treatment as a character, and not a repeat of what happend in GoF.

I think Dumbledore's predictions were another example of his occasional lack of judgement. He never even knew Ron nor, it seems, made an attempt to do so. Yet he still felt qualified to presume that Ron would walk out? Sure, it may have been right but his attitude is exactly what the Horcrux mentioned: Ron was constantly getting overlooked and Dumbeldore was as guilty of this as anyone. Ever think that if someone believed in him he may not have been so immature in the first place?

Ron has always seemed to be a bit short tempered.

A bit ? ^^

I felt terrible when Ron left... Harry was kind of betrayed by his best friend... That Ron who abandoned Harry and Hermione wasn't the Ron who we used to know... I think that the Horcrux made him think that way (Harry not having a plan, the useless wandering about the country, the danger Harry had put Ron's family in and so on)...
I was really pleased to see him back feeling sorry for what he had done. The trio was united once more! :tu:

Oh, and about Dumbledore foreseeing Ron would leave them for a while... Well, he was a clever man, wasn't he?

Or perhaps Dumbledore read LotR.

i know people that hated ron for what he did. i can't hate him. i love him too much. in GoF. i thought for sure that would've been the last time they would be at each other's throats. and when jo wrote "something had broken between them", i felt genuinely scared. the last thing i wanted was for ron to go all anakin skywalker on us.

but when he came back, ooo boy. i cried a lot during this book, but the one scene that got me the most was the destruction of the locket horcrux.
ron has always been second best to harry. hermione's got the brains, harry's got the fame. what does ron have? a lot of siblings? and we've always known that he's a bit touchy about this. poor guy.

I haven't read every post, just skimmed them. I think the most important thing to note here is that Ron was heavily affected by the locketcrux. He even says so when he comes back. Not only was the journay not going the way he thought it was, but he was having to deal with that certian part of Voldy's soul. I think that brought out the worst in Ron's character and it just happens that it affected him more strongly than Harry or Hermione.

I found this to be totally bogus--it was movie Ron not book Ron. It was a plot device--a way to bring the sword back and a way to get news of the outside world, nothing more.

Well i actually see Ron's leaving a step forward not backwards. He needed to leave because both Harry and Hermione took him for granted, i remember reading the discussion that H&HR were having right before Harry adresses Ron and the hole fight breaks out and i got mad at both H&HR because in no moment did they spare a thought to ask Ron his opinion.

He probably felt like he was just the third guy they would go to when it's a battle of ideas and they need to know who wins above who. Even Ron says it something like *why do you need my opinion* when obviously he felt pushed aside.

I also have to say that it was conveient for Hermione not to back up Ron when he said that both R&HR were dissapointed in Harry's lack of plan. I expected her to back him up on that because it was true, Harry wasn't doing anything but mope around having doughts about DD (that was the locket effect on Harry). But no she didn't have the courage to back Ron up and that must have felt like a betrayal to Ron, he probably imagined *great she chooses to side with him over this argument* and he blowed up.

One question if both Harry and Hermione knew the effect the locket was having on Ron why didn't they do something to help him and themselfs out of that horrible thing and it's effects? Probably because they were to busy looking at themselfs, so Ron's leaving for me was not bad because it made everyone but above all H&HR realise that Ron is needed in the trio and they shouldn't take him for granted anymore.

I was so mad when Ron left, but I wasn't as surprised that he did it.
Ron has always been insecure and has always wanted some sort of glory. He was clearly getting frustrated that this journey had no real plan and it wasn't as spectacular as he thought it would be. The locket just helped make those feelings stronger.

But they were taking him for granted because that's how JKR wrote it. The whole thing just didn't ring true to me--it seemed like poor plotting. It just seemed like the way the movie screenplay writers give all of Ron's lines from the books to other characters infected JKR's view of him.

I really didn't like that Ron left. I know he has insecurities and flaws like everyone else, but I felt that he had grown beyond these feelings enough that he would stick by Harry through anything. I felt like it was a regression of character. Ron deserved better treatment as a character, and not a repeat of what happend in GoF.

I disagree. Ron might have turned away from his negative feelings in GoF, but that was because of what HARRY did in the lake, not because of what RON did.

Ron needed to face the negative feelings that had simply been repressed, never dealt with. Leaving and returning to face the locket provided him with the opporitunity to do so.

On a side note: did anyone else notice that through OotP and HBP Ron seems to be consistantly hoping that Ginny and Harry will hook up? At first I thought that this was due to his preferance of Harry as a boyfriend for Ginny over the other boys she had been seeing, but couldn't it have been a preferance for Ginny as a girlfrien for Harry over Hermoine?

Jealousy can be a vicious emotion. It consumes people. Ron's a child in a big family, his best friends are Harry Potter (one of the most famous people) and Hermione Granger (a brilliant intelligent person). I would be jealous too. I admit I was kind of mad when Ron did that. Seriously. He said so many wrong things. He needed to be more sympathetic and understanding towards Harry. His comeback was pretty darn good, though!

When Ron walked out it really shocked me. It was so out of character for Ron. Poor Hermione. Ron was aweful for doing that although i would say he more then redeemed himself. I never would have guessed Ron would have just taken off and left Harry/Hermione. I thought i knew his loyalites better then that at least. Soemthing i didnt expect from Ron at all. What did he expect honestly while trying to find horcruxes and destroy them, and knowing harry haS to fight Voldemort till the end . Did he think everything was going to be nice and comfy although his timing coming back was perfect!

THis scene seemed uncharacteristic to me and it was one of my least favorite aspects of the book. I understood he was wearing the horcrux, etc but Ron has always been willing to sacrifice himself and his needs for the greater good (SS chess set!) and to have him walk out on his two best friends, one of whom he loves, was unbelievable to me.

You need to understand that the locket brought out his greatest insecurities. He always feared that Harry and Hermione actually loved each other, and that he would be left out. Even with Ginny in the picture, he still has that insecurity inside him. The locket brings that out and magnifies it. The fact that Harry was being insensitive to him didn't help, either. It's obvious to Harry and the readers that Harry and Hermione are like brother/sister (which he tells Ron upon his return) but it isn't to Ron. That's why he left, and Hermione "choosing Harry" didn't help, either.

I think it is highly generous to put Ron's leaving down to the influence of the locket. Ron has displayed these characteristics before, and I didn't find it surprising at all that he would leave them in a fit of jealous rage. IMO, Ron is one of the most flawed characters in the books. This entire scene was very similar to his actions GOF after Harry's name came out of the Goblet.

I think we can see a little bit of foreshadowing on this... Ron is a jealous person.
and ron's always wanted more (mirrior of erised) and alway jealous of harry. and having voldermort's bit of soul around him prolly caused all those feelings to takeover - voldermort knows how to target people and find their weakness.

I also believe that Ron had to leave to book for the story line's sake... ron was their link to the outsdie world.. otherwise they wouldnt ever thought of goignt o bill's house, and the radio thing, and knowing voldermorts name curse etc.
I think ron's leaving HAD to happen for that purpose alone.. i mean hows else would they know about that stuff if the entire time they were only talking to eachother and nobody else.

anyone agree?

I was quite shocked at Ron leaving - but I knew he would go back in the end - the scene on the front cover hadnt happened yet!!!

And as for DD knowing that Ron would leave - well he knew how protective Ron was of his family, and Ron was the only one whose Family was at limbo, so he probably left him the Deiluminator for the simple reason, that if Ron were to venture off on his own on the spur of the moment to protect his family he would habe the means to find the way back.

Plus it was needed to get an update on the wizarding world - otherwise they wouldnt have learned about the tabboo ( not that it helped them much) and other things - I agrre with chalkoutline007 there!

nano

I think we can see a little bit of foreshadowing on this... Ron is a jealous person.
and ron's always wanted more (mirrior of erised) and alway jealous of harry. and having voldermort's bit of soul around him prolly caused all those feelings to takeover - voldermort knows how to target people and find their weakness.

I also believe that Ron had to leave to book for the story line's sake... ron was their link to the outsdie world.. otherwise they wouldnt ever thought of goignt o bill's house, and the radio thing, and knowing voldermorts name curse etc.
I think ron's leaving HAD to happen for that purpose alone.. i mean hows else would they know about that stuff if the entire time they were only talking to eachother and nobody else.

anyone agree?

I agree.

I was remember what Dumbledore said back in Book 1 when Ron looked into the Mirror of Erised while reading through this thread.
Dumbledore knew that Ron felt overshadowed by his siblings and also by Harry and it was a stroke of genius to give him the Deluminator, as it had the ability to lead Ron to the other two.

Also, remember how Ron felt during the Quidditch match in OotP (when Harry and Hermoine were being introduced to Grawp). It was the first time he was praised on his own merit and was not in the shadow of Harry, therefore giving him the confidence that he can do things on his own.

I believe that Ron's leaving was critical to the plot of Book 7, as it enabled him to find out how the outside world was reacting, do some soul searching and then come back to Harry to save him from drowning in the ice pool, retrieve the sword and destroy the locket.

Ron's absence also let Harry and Hermoine miss him and realise how important he is to the trio.

Yes--what's being described here is plot contrivence. It doesn't matter if it's out of character or much to extreme to put down to jealousy. I'm pretty sure that the Harry and Hermione of the earlier books knew how important Ron was to them. The whole "Ron held back and didn't contribute" did not ring true to me at all. The little boy of the first book's chess scene (the one and only scene better in the books than in the movies) is well and truely gone. DH Ron was movies 2-5 Ron--the stripped down Ron of the screenplays in which all his lines are given to others. Brave, emotional Ron is nowhere to be found. We need the outside world, so let's have Ron leave and come back. It overshadows Snape's doe, to be honest. This book would have been so very much better if it had been "Year Seven AT HOGWARTS."

I always thought Ron would have enough. I figured it was a matter of time till he snapped. He always had this thought in his mind that Hermione liked Harry. I believe that he always wished he was better then Harry to prove to Hermione that he could also be a hero. As much as I knew he would snap and leave I knew he would never be able to stay gone. The not knowing if hermione was alright would have killed him.

Well I saw it a bit like Ginny. The horcrux affected all of them, obviously, but Ron gave something in to it - he listened to it, and was manipulated by it. When he left, it was similar to storming out of a room, slamming the door - but he couldn't come back, and he tried and tried.

I think Dumbles understood Ron, he knows what he saw in the Mirror, and perhaps he sees himself a bit in Ron - except that Ron returned, and Dumbles biggest regret was walking out on his sister who needed him.

So yeah, I think this was the time where Ron destroyed his insecurities, and he came back - some find that just as loyal as never leaving. I'd rather have a good friend leave me and come back, than people sticking by me who don't really care.

But Harry was lucky to have Hermione. HOW amazing is she!? I liked that the dynamics changed in Ron's absence, though - showed they are each others yings and yangs.

Love,
Eyrún

You need to understand that the locket brought out his greatest insecurities. He always feared that Harry and Hermione actually loved each other, and that he would be left out. Even with Ginny in the picture, he still has that insecurity inside him. The locket brings that out and magnifies it. The fact that Harry was being insensitive to him didn't help, either. It's obvious to Harry and the readers that Harry and Hermione are like brother/sister (which he tells Ron upon his return) but it isn't to Ron. That's why he left, and Hermione "choosing Harry" didn't help, either.
I basically agree, however I personally have a problem with the notion that Ron always feared Harry and Hermione loved each other. I never got that vibe from the books and was thus a bit astonished when I saw RiddleHermione and RiddleHarry coming out of the locket. I mean, when Ron is jealous he doesn´t hold exactly back. We just have to look how he treated Krum at the Yule Ball. He never was like that to Harry.
Sure, Hermione siding with Harry when they had the fight shortly before Ron left, must have felt like Hermione choosing Harry over Ron at that time.

While we are blaming Ron for leaving, can we just blame Hermione a bit for being dishonest? She was frustrated as well and could just have admitted that.

But we must not forget of course, that all three of them were under enourmous stress. Fear, hunger, inconvenience, frustration, closely huddled together for weaks without really privacy and without contact to the outside world, not knowing what was happening with their friends and families. So Harry sulked over Dumbledore, Hermione was not her usual self and couldn´t come up with ideas really, and Ron, more susceptible to the locket than the others, blew up finally. I agree with Laufa, that it was more like running out of the room and slamming the door than really abandoning his friends. He wanted to return immediately, but circumstances prevented that.

But I am sure that people who never liked Ron as a character will use this episode as justification for their views. ;) I see it like this: If Harry and Hermione could forgive Ron, why can´t we? :)

I basically agree, however I personally have a problem with the notion that Ron always feared Harry and Hermione loved each other. I never got that vibe from the books and was thus a bit astonished when I saw RiddleHermione and RiddleHarry coming out of the locket. I mean, when Ron is jealous he doesn´t hold exactly back. We just have to look how he treated Krum at the Yule Ball. He never was like that to Harry.

I agree with this. It was definetely not obvious that Ron was jealous of their relationship. It actually is more obvious in the films for me personally!
But there are hints, for instance when Hermione confunded to get Ron in the quidditch team in book 6. Harry took Hermione aside and Ron puzzled looked around and demanded what they were doing. A definite hint of jealousy?
I think as someone noted before that the locket just brought out his insecurities however unobvious and secretive they are. Ron perhaps never voiced his insecurities because he was scared it would affect his relationship with Harry?

Ron's exit made me feel like, "oh are you kidding me? AGAIN?". Ron's sour attitude really, really bothered me. Of course in hindsight the locket was definitely worsening his grim outlook. I can see the whole thing from his point of view, in terms of the worsening prospects and feeling hopeless about Harry's lack of immediate plans. It still seems irrational though that he'd stomp out on his best friends - and best chance of survival. Good thing he came to his senses pretty fast.

I haven't read pages 2 and 3, but, you have to remember that Ron sort of betrayed Harry in GoF. He got really jealous of Harry and left him. I think Ron is really quick-tempered and irrational and stubborn at times. This is who he is, he has been explained very well in the books. But he is also caring, generous and down-to-earth. That is why he returned to Harry both times. I don't see his betrayal as something bad, but very very good character writing on JKR's part.

i think my favourite part in the whole book is when Ron comes back. when he left i was so shocked but i think it was mostly because the locket brought out his insecurities and Ron said the reason he left was that the locket brought his insecutities and stuff

Couldn't find a thread for this but I've been thinking about it a lot. The book stated that Dumbledore counted on Miss Granger to slow him (Harry) up. And honestly, Hermione was so important that without her, Harry would've been in some serious trouble. The book also says that Dumbledore 'understood' Ron abandoning the group and gave him a way to come back. When/How did Dumbledore come to that conclusion? Has Ron done something in other books that foresees this? I can't recall any off the top of my head. I know in the 4th book they have a huge fight but I always attributed it to Ron's feelings of being in Harry's shadow once again and thinking Harry took him for granted and didn't trust him enough to tell him when and how he'd entered.

I think DD understood Ron because of his own brother Aberforth. Aberforth grew up in DD's shadow. DD had a friend who was also brilliant. When it came to taking care of Ariana DD took over, even though Aberforth would have been better with her.

DD recognized the same type of situation with Ron, overshadowed by his brothers, friends etc.

Ron did have a falling out with Harry in GoF. He has a falling out with Hermione (over his pet) in PoA and in HBP (feelings of inadequacy). Ron takes alot, but when he's had enough he acts before he thinks. He says in DH that as soon as he left he wanted to come back.

We know that Aberforth & DD somehow patch things up because he's, "friendly with the barman at the Hogshead." I think many people that act rashly want to fix things sooner than they do but they just don't know how (humility). DD is old enough to see these things in people, with age comes wisdom etc.

i think my favourite part in the whole book is when Ron comes back. when he left i was so shocked but i think it was mostly because the locket brought out his insecurities and Ron said the reason he left was that the locket brought his insecutities and stuff

I think the Silver Doe might be my favorite chapter. I love that Ron comes back as a "hero". Saving Harry (showing selflessness), apologizing for leaving (showing humility) and destroying the locket(showing courage).

Ron had a harder time physically than the other two. Harry was starved regularly in his home. Hermione has been camping with her parents(sometimes you just can't get a fire lit) but I think that she is not as physical a person as Ron. Harry and Hermione made the best of their situation. Ron brooded and I think wallowed in self-pity brought on by his physical discomfort. He was an easier subject for the locket to attack than the other two. Incidentally, this is the way of the monastic traditions. Separating yourself from the world, denying yourself the pleasures of the world, not to be sadistic but to become stronger. When you deny yourself physically you build your spirituality.

The destruction of the locket shows Ron has overcome his insecurities. He has "done battle" with his weakness and won.

was Ron leaving essential to the plot or could he have stayed?

I don't think that Ron would have left if he wasn't under the effect of the Locket, it was really the locket that made him take that decision. He himself admits it that, once he was back to himself, he wanted to return but was caught up with Snatchers and I believe him when he says that.


I disagree. Even if it had not been for the lockect I think Ron would have left. Ron has a passionate temper. When it consumes him it consumes him completely. Ever since PoA, perhaps before but PoA is the first time time I'm thinking we really see it. Following that it got worse with age. I think that is why Dumbledore knew he would leave. (His love of Harry and Hermione is why of course Dumbledore knew he would come back. There are many things that can be said about the Weasleys as a family; but their capasity to love should never be questioned.)

However I think this was turning point for him. He let his anger get the best of him and he nearly lost his best friend and the girl he loves because it. If that isn't a reality check I don't know what is. Some times people grow little by little, some times people seem to grow all at once. For Ron the abandonment of Harry and Hermione was one of those life changing moments. Not only did he have to deal with the realization that "hey if I lose my temper like that there is not always a way back"; but he also had to deal with weeks of shame not only interally but also externally. This was not the man he wanted his family to think of him as. He was not a child anymore and I think this really drove it home for him, that he could no longer have a child's temper.

I know in the 4th book they have a huge fight but I always attributed it to Ron's feelings of being in Harry's shadow once again and thinking Harry took him for granted and didn't trust him enough to tell him when and how he'd entered.

It wasn't a fight, it was a betrayal of friendship, because in fact harry hadn't mistrusted Ron, but only been wrongly accused and betrayed by Ron. I took that scene (since which I've not liked Ron at all) as foreshadowing and immediately thought of it when Ron did it again in DH.

I think his return and saving Harry's life is both a coming of age (outgrowing the idea that he's always overshadowed) and a redemption for his treacheries.

An apology to a slightly off topic question, but what did Dumbledore mean when he said he was counting on Hermione to slow Harry up?

Such great insights regarding Ron's decision to leave. The Silver Doe was my favorite chapter of the book, or at least my favorite Ron chapter. The three preceding Ron-less chapters with just Harry and Hermione were the most difficult to get through. This is from a fan that adores the relationship between Harry and Hermione, but has always felt that theirs was a tender sibling-type relationship--no awkwardness, but just love and respect. Jo characterized the long silences between Harry and Hermione, writing with little dialogue between them. There was no joy, no spirit between them without their prat of a red-headed best friend.

Ron's return was, for me, ushered in the bravest act that the character has ever done. He faced down his insecurities, in front of Harry, saved his best friend's life, and sought forgiveness from the woman he loved but left behind. The post that mentioned the similarities between Ron/Aberforth and Harry/DD . . . . absolutely a wonderful parallel that never occurred to me. I agree that DD's incredibly clever sense of perception of his students, particularly the Trio, told him that Ron would need the Deluminator to find his way back, rectifying mistakes that DD's own family made.

Ron's by far my favorite character, but I recognize his flaws. He can easily flare up, he's impulsive, and he's insecure . . . all leading him to act out on his jealousy and his anger. I think it's very likely he could've left the Trio without the locket's influence, but he would have found his way back just as Jo had written it.

I guess that Dumbledore remembered the brief pause in their friendship in the 4th book and thought that Hermione and Harry might be planning without Ron's input, so he assumed Ron would leave. This is all very presumptuous though, it's hard to say how Dumbledore knew..

I, like many other people, believe that his behavior was caused by the locket.
Dumbledore probably knew the risks having emotional ties to any of the horcruxes and knew that the bit of Voldemort's soul would try to manipulate Ron.
Voldemort's soul figured out about Ron's insecurities and used that to trick Ron and caused him to act irrationally.
By the way, did anyone besides me cry when Ron left? I mean, I knew he was probably going to come back because of the UK cover of DH, but it still made me teary.:upset:

When Ron left things were not going well for the trio. After several months they hadn't accomplished much, they were hungry and Harry, their leader didn't seem to have a plan. If I were Ron I'd be frustrated too. The ghoul in the attic showed that Ron knew the danger he was exposing his family and himself to, but he didn't expect finding the horcruxes to take so long. Most of the time they were just sitting around trying to come up with ideas. That feeling of hopelessness and inability to accomplish anything eats away at your self-resolve fairly quickly.

Ron knew that his family was in danger. He had just heard that Ginny had broken into Snape's office and been caught. Feeling like they weren't making progress with the Horcruxes and being terrified about the safety of his family Ron made a rash decision which he quickly regretted.

Dumbledore knew that Hermione and Ron were going to come along, thus putting their families at great risk. In my opinion Ron had the most to risk by searching for the Horcruxes. For Harry there was no choice, it always was his destiny. Hermione managed to hide her parents with relative ease and as a muggle-born would have been in danger regardless.

I'm not sure the primary reason Ron left was a feeling of being overshadowed. I think it was fear for his family and for his own life that drove him away.

Ron was under the influence of the locket's curse. I think the locket played on Ron's insecurities and once the locket was opened, tried to deceive him by distorting Harry and Hermione's friendship.

However during both instances he shows his true colours, he secretly informs Harry about the dragon task and he does everything he can to return to Harry and Hermione in DH.
That was in the movie, was it not? I thought it was Crouch the Junior as Mad-Eye Moody through Hagrid?

Yes that was in the movie.

I was quite shocked at Ron leaving - but I knew he would go back in the end - the scene on the front cover hadnt happened yet!!!

Haha :lol:, that's the same thing I said to myself!

And as for DD knowing that Ron would leave - well he knew how protective Ron was of his family, and Ron was the only one whose Family was at limbo, so he probably left him the Deiluminator for the simple reason, that if Ron were to venture off on his own on the spur of the moment to protect his family he would habe the means to find the way back.

That is possible, I never thought of the possibility that Ron might have insisted on leaving because he thought his family was in danger or something.

Plus it was needed to get an update on the wizarding world - otherwise they wouldnt have learned about the tabboo ( not that it helped them much) and other things - I agrre with chalkoutline007 there!

I also believe that Ron had to leave to book for the story line's sake... ron was their link to the outsdie world.. otherwise they wouldnt ever thought of goignt o bill's house, and the radio thing, and knowing voldermorts name curse etc.
I think ron's leaving HAD to happen for that purpose alone.. i mean hows else would they know about that stuff if the entire time they were only talking to eachother and nobody else.

anyone agree?

I agree that it was a very necessary plot device, but it wasn't the only way they could have found out about the outside world. They could have gone somewhere undercover and overheard some wizards talking about it.

I think we can see a little bit of foreshadowing on this... Ron is a jealous person.
and ron's always wanted more (mirrior of erised) and alway jealous of harry. and having voldermort's bit of soul around him prolly caused all those feelings to takeover - voldermort knows how to target people and find their weakness.

I agree with this. It was definetely not obvious that Ron was jealous of their relationship. It actually is more obvious in the films for me personally!
But there are hints, for instance when Hermione confunded to get Ron in the quidditch team in book 6. Harry took Hermione aside and Ron puzzled looked around and demanded what they were doing. A definite hint of jealousy?
I think as someone noted before that the locket just brought out his insecurities however unobvious and secretive they are. Ron perhaps never voiced his insecurities because he was scared it would affect his relationship with Harry?

Precisely, there are definitely hints that Ron was always a bit jealous. Remember in book 6 when Hermione is talking about Harry being fanciable, or when she's flattered that Harry told Slughorn that Hermione is the best witch in his year. I think there's always been a little voice in the back of his head wondering about Harry and Hermione. His voice of reason usually pushed these thoughts to the back of his head, but with all the frustration of the situation, plus the horcrux...

An apology to a slightly off topic question, but what did Dumbledore mean when he said he was counting on Hermione to slow Harry up?

He figured Hermione would insist on sticking to horcruxes and not hallows...

Is it just me or was anyone a lil apprehensive about Ron's return? I thought possibly he was either posessed (by a Death Eater or Voldy) or under the imperius curse maybe. Even after he destroyed the horocrux, I wasn't sure it was Ron for quite some time.

I hated Ron after he left. I've never liked his character, and the second he abandoned Harry, it turned into all out hate. It would have earlier in GoF, had I not said, "ah, he's only 14 or so, it's understandable he's jealous." So I gave him a free pass and decided not to really judge him, or at least not to hate him, based on one fight at 14 years old.

But leaving your supposed best friend in the middle of a war over your own insecurities? It just highlights how immature Ron is. The war is not about him. It's not about if he's the youngest of five brothers. It's not about if he was ever prefect or head boy or quidditch captain. It's not about if he has a scar on his head or is famous. Which, by the way, his insecurities were unfounded considering he was prefect, and yeah, he may not be famous, but at least he had a whole, loving family! And how about that he wasn't considered a freak or turned on like Harry in CoS? But I digress.

The point is, Ron putting himself and his hurt feelings over the fact that the lives of Wizards and Muggles alike depended on Harry finding and destroying the Horcruxes is the most immature thing I've ever seen in the HP series, and it's unforgivable in my opinion. So what, you don't feel your opinion is being heard? You're a big boy, speak up! But before you do, take into account that your friend, who is "wronging" you, has lost his parents, his godfather, his mentor of sorts (DD), and a teacher he respect. He's watched an innocent boy (Cedric) die in front of him for being in the way. He's dueled one of the most powerful Wizards of all time multiple times and won. He was willing to sacrifice his life for your sister. He's prophesized to either defeat Voldemort and save the Wizarding World or die trying. He's destined to kill or be killed. How would you like to live with that hanging over his head? So yeah, if Harry's a little stressed and narrow-minded at the moment, I don't blame him. But I will blame Ron for being too thick to understand that.

I can understand that the locket heightened everything, but the fact that all those insecurities were there from the beginning, even after everything that happened in GoF, doesn't say much for Ron. It shows that he never learns from his mistakes, and he didn't truly mean what he said in GoF.

Even the way he came back...I still can't forgive him.

Yes--what's being described here is plot contrivence. It doesn't matter if it's out of character or much to extreme to put down to jealousy. I'm pretty sure that the Harry and Hermione of the earlier books knew how important Ron was to them. The whole "Ron held back and didn't contribute" did not ring true to me at all. The little boy of the first book's chess scene (the one and only scene better in the books than in the movies) is well and truely gone. DH Ron was movies 2-5 Ron--the stripped down Ron of the screenplays in which all his lines are given to others. Brave, emotional Ron is nowhere to be found. We need the outside world, so let's have Ron leave and come back.

This is exactly how I felt when I read it the first time. It angered me so that I put the book down and resumed it later. And I have been reading the other posts and sorta understand what everyone else is saying about the horcrux locket affecting him. It just hurt my heart so much when he left.

I was originally furious when Ron lefted and felt as though I didn't want him to come back. The more I thought about it, however, the more I understood what he was feeling - the locket was affecting him, he was frightened for his parents, there was great danger, etc. I grew more sympathetic. Still, I liked the scenes with just Harry and Hermione together <guilty look>.

Of course, I am biased - I have never been much of a Ron fan <ducks tomatoes>.

I had a very Hagrid-like reaction to Ron splitting. I shouted "HE DID NOT!" Then I wept because I couldn't beleive he had done that to Harry and Hermione. Then I got angry and then I cried all over again. I was so happy when Ron came back and so proud of him for rescuing Harry the way he did and destroying the horcrux that I totally forgave him for leaving.

I thought it was neccessary for him to leave personally. It made ron brave and regret everything. It made the bond between ron and hermione stronger i think, because there was so much unsaid things in the tent when he came back.

I felt like Ron's leaving was almost like a death for Harry. Here was somebody Harry loved that was suddenly ripped away from him even if it was by Ron's on doing. I'll have to admit I was worried that Ron would not find his way back to the group. But Dd had a way of understanding how friendships work and that Ron needed time to be Ron w/o Harry to truly find himself.

Ron's leaving was definitely surprising. However, DD seemed to know so much about everything. But one thing Harry, Hermione, and Ron himself noticed was that DD didn't know Ron like that to be leaving him anything in the will. He just didn't know Ron enough to know that he would leave.

Quite honestly though I have suspected since POA that DD had a time turner that he has been using to observe some things. He just couldn't have known somethings.

The Horcrux was to Ron as the One Ring was to Frodo. And in true analogical form, Ron returned in time to save Harry's skin the same way Sam did.
However, that whole thing kind of annoyed me, hasn't JKR already made her point about Ron's insecurities? I think his little tantrum was slightly overkill. It's like, ok Jo. we get it already.

I was so annoyed at Ron for leaving! I really thought, as others have said, that we were past that.... but then so many of you have already said it and said it well: the locket, the need to know what was going on in the outside world, Ron's concern for his family, his jealousy over Harry and Hermione working so well together and his underlying insecurities.... it all made sense. Especially considering that Ron, admittedly, made a rash move and then immediately regretted it... having to actually taste the pain of consequence there (being separated for much longer than he'd have liked) really squelched it all out of him and gave him time to come to terms with things. I didn't like it, but he's better for it - and certainly his return was awesome! I love that Harry had him destroy the horcrux (not just because the sword seemed to demand it either) - symbolically, it immediately made Ron a vital part of the team.

i was truly sad when he went away, but i knew why. And i was so happy when he came back in full force and confronted his fears!

I couldn't believe it when Ron left! At first I thought he had been imperiused, but then they wouldn't have had him leave, he would've stayed to play sabotage or something. But I knew he would somehow come back, it was very hard to read Harry and HErmione without him. Like Harry said, Ron's departure cost them alot.

A lot of you mentioned that Ron needed to find himself, but I think Harry and Hermione had to realize how much Ron meant to them too. Their friendship really suffered while he was gone, and they didn't get much done (not that they had before he left, but it shows they were no better off without him). I think Harry especially needed to be reminded how much he needs his friends, that he can't do everything alone.

And Ron's return was nothing short of amazing! I really loved that scene!


Originally posted by cityxstargazers
The point is, Ron putting himself and his hurt feelings over the fact that the lives of Wizards and Muggles alike depended on Harry finding and destroying the Horcruxes is the most immature thing I've ever seen in the HP series, and it's unforgivable in my opinion. So what, you don't feel your opinion is being heard? You're a big boy, speak up! But before you do, take into account that your friend, who is "wronging" you, has lost his parents, his godfather, his mentor of sorts (DD), and a teacher he respect. He's watched an innocent boy (Cedric) die in front of him for being in the way. He's dueled one of the most powerful Wizards of all time multiple times and won. He was willing to sacrifice his life for your sister. He's prophesized to either defeat Voldemort and save the Wizarding World or die trying. He's destined to kill or be killed. How would you like to live with that hanging over his head? So yeah, if Harry's a little stressed and narrow-minded at the moment, I don't blame him. But I will blame Ron for being too thick to understand that.

I'm sorry, but I really think your underestimating the effect of the locket. When Harry wears it, it only makes him more irritable and pessimistic because he has a high self esteem. Same with Hermione. But Ron did have insecurities before the locket. He seemed to be well over them, but the locket found them and exploited them, much like the diary did to Ginny. And don't forget, Hermione was feeling the same way. Harry walked up on them having discussions about how they thought Harry had a plan and were disappointed by their lack of progress. Several times.

Don't forget that Dumbledore said Voldemort's powers for spreading enimity and discord are very great (or something to that effect). While wearing the locket, Voldemort's soul would feed upon Ron's insecurities to spread enimity and discord. It's what he does. And Ron was exposed to the locket for hours at a time, I believe 12 hours a shift. That is an awful lot of time to be unable to fight off feelings of insecurity and doubt. Don't underestimate the horcruxes power, Ron would never have left otherwise. Ron has proven himself to be incredibly loyal in the past, he wouldn't have left if the locket hadn't truly affected him. And we know it really got to him based on his reaction after defeating the locket.

Dumbledore may have predicted that Ron's shadowing of Harry might lead to him running out one day, but the thing is there are so many circumstances in which the prediction could go wrong. Harry giving Ron a chance to shine was really good, letting him destroy the Horcrux, although it did reveal Ron's fears and insecurities, Harry confirmed that none of it is true. It was after that point I think, that Ron became more confident, contributed more, and did not feel like a drag to Harry anymore. It takes some guts to overcome something like that.

Aw come on! Ron's definitely a hero! The most awesome heroes are the ones who have stuff to overcome - like Harry, for instance. Ron has his flaws, and he falls down and loses his way (and curses a lot while doing so :D ), but he gets back up. I mean, it's all good if you're Hermione and get nearly everything right (seriously, Hermione makes very few mistakes, she's incredible like that), but when you're Ron and you screw stuff up and you still manage to find your way back to your friends and are willing to bleed for them (I mean, come on, "you can have me? keep me?")...that's something else, a really incredible brand of heroism.

Is it just me or was anyone a lil apprehensive about Ron's return? I thought possibly he was either posessed (by a Death Eater or Voldy) or under the imperius curse maybe. Even after he destroyed the horocrux, I wasn't sure it was Ron for quite some time.

I actually thought that for a while - as he and Tonks werent checked when they got back - and there were quite a lot of things that implicated it could have been a polyjuice Ron - havent got the book on me, but he was very sensitive towards Hermione which was explained to be not typical of Ron, and also once or twice when he did magic that impressed the others... Then Lupin looking at Tonks all the time - I thought he kind of knew it wasnt her, but didnt want to beleive it ... I thought the two had been caught up somewhere and both were being impersonated for quite a while. When Ron left I was in Limbo, if it was to tell the DE's about the plan or wheter it actually was the real Ron - because to me that was typical Ron - don't get me wrong I love his character;

i was truly sad when he went away, but i knew why. And i was so happy when he came back in full force and confronted his fears!

To me the part of the book, where they are camping out all becoming depressive, was a bit of a yawn and I think - alone by the reaction we see on here how sad a lot of people were when Ron left -it was a very clever plot scenario, to make us all feel a bit more like the trio were feeling. After reading the whole book I realize, that this impatient, yawning feeling was essential to make us readers get the feel of what was happening - Jo never had to fear we would put the book down and stop reading it did she?

So it was very plot essential in my eyes and any other of the trio leaving would have been untrue to their characters - unlike Ron who had already 'left' Harry on his own in GoF.

nano

This scene was the best in the book. I loved the fact that the locket fed on his insecurities. I knew they would play a part since book 4.

I felt angry when Ron left too - but the trio haven't really expreienced anything like this before, have they?
They've been in danger, they've fought Death Eaters - but it was always quite a brief battle, set in a year of security at Hogwarts.
Now they're alone, tired hungry and cold. And they have been for some time - as many people have pointed out, the middle section of the book where they are travelling together does drag on!
And we already know from the previous books, Ron is insecure about Harry and Hermione.
When I first read this part, I felt like Ron should just get over it, but I guess he's always had this insecurity - remember what he saw in the Mirror of Erised? He's always felt overshadowed by others.
At least he came back in the end. . .

when i was reading I was suprised when he left and i was downhearted too, I think dumbledore thought that Ron wanted to go right into action and get back to the way things were. and he really didnt want to abandon them, he was just angry. and he came back.

i dont know if it was as much a part of overshadowing as his just nerves getting to him and his terror stricken ideas of what was going on at home. It is one thing to never know your parents but it is totally different to lose know that your family is in danger and you are doing nothing about it. Ron is stuck in the middle of his friendship to harry which has only wavered once or twice to his love for his family. He is not actually gallivanting around but he could be trying to find out more info to sese if everyone is all right.

i thought harry might have some feelings for the Weasley Family seeing how Ginny was all messed up in the death and destruction.

IT WAS NOT THE LOCKET!

This is probably going to be a long post so please stick with me.

Over and over again I have seen the reason “it was the Locket” given for Ron’s abandonment of Harry and Hermione. This is usually paired with “and JKR needed a way to let us know more about the what was going on in wirzarding world”. However I think both of these explanation are flawed, and do not fully take into account Ron’s character up until that point in the story.

Lets start off with taking the a closer look at the “it was Locket” explanation. First we have to consider what the locket was and what it wasn’t. The locket was a horcrux, one of the seven pieces of Voldemort’s soul. When Harry wore it for a long time it made him angry and disturbed. If this was the only thing we had to go on I could see why “it was the Locket” argument carries so much weight. But it isn’t. We know way more about horcruxes then this. We know way more about the locket then this. And most importantly we know way more about Ron Weasley then this.

Now before go farther lets look at what the Locket is not. The Locket is not the one Ring from Lord of the Rings, any more then Ron Weasley is Sam Gamgee. Sure there are some similarities between both, Sam and Ron are both sidekicks. Both the Ring and the Locket are ways that the bad guys of the series strive to insure power. But that is about where the similarities end for both.

The ring was a temptation because it granted power who ever wielded it. Great power, in the right hands complete power. Complete power corrupts completely. Horcruxes do not do this. They extend the life of the maker but that is pretty much it. Their power to corrupt and tempt is severely limited.

Horcruxes are also much less powerful. (One might speculate that is because the horcruxes we saw where merely 1/7th of Voldemort’s soul, while as the ring was completely Sauron’s life force. But I think it is merely different authors take on the concept.) Anyway horcruxes have much less of an ability to tempt or corrupt a mind. Harry WAS a horcrux after all. A piece of Voldemort of inside of him since he was one year old. If horcruxes where like the ring, Harry would not have been the hero of the story, but one of the villains.

But what about the diary I hear you the audience say. It MADE Ginny open the Chamber! That’s proof that the locket was responsible for Ron leaving. No it isn’t. In fact it proves or at least gives strong evidence to the contrary. The first bit of evidence that the diary was in fact not that strong is the fact that Malfoy had it in his position for many many years and never claimed it as his own. The fact that he gave it away shows it did not have that strong of a temptation/ corruption pull on its’ own.

Next lets look at the fact that even though it went into the hands of a naïve over protected 10-11 year old girl it still took months of her willing pouring her soul, completely oblivious it’s dangers, before it could corrupt her to the point of making her do anything. It took still months after that before it could make her do something against her will. And we still don’t really know how strong Riddle was when he came out it. All we know is that he decides to let the Basilisk do his dirty work, and that he is then killed by a 12 year old boy. It does not sound that powerful on it’s own. Granted it did terrible things, but that is only because it was placed in the hands of an unknowing child, who inadvertently supercharged it with her own soul, (and if we are to believe Rowlings) her own super powers.

Now let’s contrast that to the Locket and Ron. Ron was man who knew that it was a horcrux and that any emotional attachment could be devastating. He had seen battle, danger, and death. Unlike Ginny who had never been away from the shelter of her mother’s protection before. He did not pour his soul into it looking for a friend. He consciously knew what it was and that it would hurt him if it had the chance.

But I hear you the audience say, “the Locket made Harry angry and disturbed”. Let’s revisit that shall we. First we have to remember that Harry was himself a horcrux. That by wearing the locket he was putting two pieces of Voldemort’s soul very close together, doubling the trouble if you will. But also we have to remember that at the time Harry was wearing the Locket exclusively, and that they didn’t understand how it could affect them and so they did not have the proper mental guards in place. Also let us remember that as soon as Harry took it off it stopped working on him. It doesn’t affect him again that way even after Ron leaves and Harry and Hermione’s exposure to the locket is increased. So by itself the locket is not that powerful.

It did not have the power to make a perfectly loyal sidekick turn against his beloved friend and companion. (Even the Ring lacked that power, there is rarely power as strong as pure love in literature.) It might have, and probably did, expedite Ron’s betrayal (going AWOL in a time was war is treason) but it didn’t cause it, just as I’m sure the conditions they where living in accelerated the abandonment, hunger, thirst and fear are hard conditions to live in. But even with out the locket, or the less then ideal conditions the abandonment would have happened it probably only pushed it ahead by a few weeks, perhaps a month or so. Why? Because Ron’s love for Harry wasn’t pure.

He was not the selfless Sam sidekick that perhaps we sometimes wish he was. The reason the Ring failed to successfully tempt Sam in the Lord of the Rings is because Sam loved Frodo completely, purely, with out jealousy. Sam was content in his life, he didn’t want to be great, he would have been happy being a gardener of little historical consequence. He looked to Frodo to be the hero, he wanted Frodo to be the hero, because he, Sam sure as heck knew he wasn’t that.

The same can not be said about Ron. It is unquestionable that Ron loved Harry. But it was not purely. Ron’s love for Harry was strong, but also mired by doubt and jealously. Ron unlike, a Sam like sidekick, wanted to great, and he knew that no matter how great he was Harry would always be greater. Ron could never outshine Harry; he could never be the One. Nor could he stand being constantly in the large shadow that Harry cast. Ron wanted to be the hero, he wanted glory and recognition. But he also knew that if history remembered him at all it would be as Harry’s side note. Which grated on him. And so Ron relationship with Harry had a duality to it, a very real and very strong bond of love and friendship; but also an undercurrent of jealousy and bitterness.

Now add to this Ron’s temperament. Ron had a passionate temper. When he feels things he feels them completely, or at least very thoroughly. As far back as PoA we can see his temper is not just reserved for his enemies but also can be brought forth on his friends. And that once angered he can have a hard time letting go. I don’t think this is unique to him, others in his family seem to present it as well. Add to that a child’s egocentrism, (which I think Ron still posses to a greater degree then the others in the first part of DH) and you have not only a passionate temper but also bad one.

However his temper on its’ own was not strong enough, even with the Locket’s help to make Ron leave. What ever else he might have felt for Harry the strongest feeling where that of love and friendship. For the reason behind his leaving you have to really look closely not at his relationship with Harry (though feeling of being over shadowed is important) so much as his relationship with Hermione.

Hermione, a girl who has infatuated and frustrated him for so long. She is not just a girl, not just a friend, she is THE girl for him. I think that feeling unworthy of her, unsure of her feelings, had a lot to do with him leaving. For the first time the trio is totally alone for months at a time. There is no school not Quidditch, no anything; only them. They are on a mission, and Harry is the leader. Now there is no school to distract him, and he is bunking with object of his affection. And he has an idea that she might have feeling for him back, but no certainty.

If we think about what are Ron and Hermione likely to talk about when they are alone? Their feelings? No not likely. What ever chances of that happening died out when they fled the wedding. They are both scared, they both want the other to take the first step, and they are both not ready for it happen. Both want it, but neither is ready to be the first and open up. And no doubt passionate Ron is feeling the strain of it. He is aware now in a way he hasn’t been before of how he wants her. He knows he doesn’t love her as a sister, or as a friend. He knows he wants her romantically, but even though she is right there emotionally she is a million miles away. And the longer they stay like this the larger the distance, and the strain grow. And why? Harry.

What are Ron and Hermione likely to talk about when they are alone during this time. Horcruxes, Harry, and Voldemort. Both Voldemort and Horcruxes are subjects that naturally lead back to Harry. Reminders that Ron is not the one. More so Hermione is likely expressing worry over Harry. And I think it is during this time that Ron begins to wonder if Harry isn’t just the chosen one for the wizarding world, bur perhaps Harry is the chosen one for Hermione as well?

And now there is no school, no Quidditch, no brothers to distract him, now all he has in front of him is the fact that Hermione, his girl, loves Harry Potter. The one man he can never hope to outshine or out perform. She’s called him fanciable, she’s been rumored to be with his girlfriend before. Sure Rita Skeeter is a liar but what if she caught on to something Ron missed just this once? Isn’t Harry more like Krum (the one guy he knows she’s been in at least a sort of romantic relationship with) then Ron could ever hope to be?

Now of course we know that she loves Harry like a mix between a brother and child. That while Hermione loves Harry greatly, it has no romantic desires behind it. But Ron didn’t know that at that time. I think all he could think about was that she loved Harry Potter. What could Ron Weaslely have that Harry didn’t. What could he offer her that Harry couldn’t. Harry was richer then him, infinitely more famous, and now here he was acting the part of their fearless leader as they meandered around Great Britian. But what was worse is that Harry wasn’t even doing a good job at being leader and yet Hermione was still no doubt expressing concern and love for Harry when they talked.

From Ron’s perspective it’s would have gotten unbearable. His temper kept building and building, and eventually it was going to burst. Not because of the locket, but because of his own emotional baggage. And finally it does burst. And he can’t take it anymore, and he leaves.

No doubt in his anger when he left he was thinking about how he was leaving Harry to who could now become even more famous and accumulate even more glory; and Hermione to be Harry, she chose him after all. I doubt he is really thinking about the war the danger they are all in doesn’t feel real to him at the moment.

I think if left to his own devices, Ron would have stayed gone a couple of days to couple of weeks tops. He did after all love these two people deeply. And his wrath though great, still in his heart wrath came after his love for both of them..

But as soon as he leaves he runs straight into a reality check. He’s taken prisoner and has a giant hand slapped onto his forehead in an “oh yeah” moment. His insecurities are still there, but there is nothing like a reminder that your two best friends are being hunted like rabbits to make you not care about things like anger anymore. When he tries to return, they are gone.

Now he has an “oh NO.” moment. His friends are being hunted, and he can’t help them. They might die. Worse they might die thinking horribly of him. They might die thinking he didn’t care about them. Thinking that he was a awful person. And maybe even worse in Ron’s mind they might die when he could have saved them. All of this feeds his doubts about himself, his theories that Harry is the better man more deserving of the love he wants.

Finally they are reunited. And Ron has to face his doubts (which by this time have had quite a lot room to grow), the locket doesn’t have to be a super powerful thing, doesn’t have to magnify his doubts far beyond what they where, all it has to do is give them form. Which it does. And Ron, in a true show of character, defeats them both internally and externally.

Also he is reminded that though Harry might be the one to go down in history as the one. Ron has helped him get there. Harry isn’t his rival, he is the green eyed boy who shared snacks with him on the train that first year. Harry is family, and all that means to a Weasley, and a Gryffindor. Ron confronts what scared him most, not spiders, but being in the shadows, and he comes to peace with it.

So no it was not the Locket. It was not that JKR had to show us what was going on in the wizarding world (she could have done that in a hundred non magical and a thousand magical ways). It was Ron, which made Ron leave. It was the completion of journey of his character. And to be honest one of my favorite parts in the series, I think it was very well written. (And I have a fair few complaints about the JKR’s writing in this book.) Jo chose to write a much more complicated sidekick then Samwise Gamgee. Let’s not cheapen that.

Originally posted by Blackcatsmeow
Over and over again I have seen the reason “it was the Locket” given for Ron’s abandonment of Harry and Hermione. This is usually paired with “and JKR needed a way to let us know more about the what was going on in wirzarding world”. However I think both of these explanation are flawed, and do not fully take into account Ron’s character up until that point in the story.

I agree that it was ron, and not the locket, but I do think that the locket contributed to his desicion to leave. I think it just made negitive thoughts that Ron was already having more prominent in his mind.

It's still the locket that made him leave. These thoughts were Ron's but they were never to the extent that Ron would leave unless it kept amplifying it and playing it in his mind and feeding him the images he kept seeing over and over. I've said before that when it comes to stuff like that in the past, Ron has always been the most susceptible (Imperius, Veela) and it affected him far greater than Harry and Hermione because the source of all the visions the Locket was feeding him was actually there and present. However, these were still things that were in Ron's mind in the first place but they were probably just the usual type of jealousy it had been in the past but it was not the reason he left. I agree that Ron is definitely more complicated than Samwise. He's one of the bravest and most realistically written characters in the series. However, fans and the movies want him to be one-dimensional and so they can't appreciate one of the best characters JK created. He's an ordinary guy doing the extraordinary and I've always been fascinated by that because he's a real person.

Cheers :tu:

I don't really know if we can ever know how much was Ron and how much was the locket.

I imagine most of it was Ron, the book said that even without the locket on he was sullen and withdrawn. Ok the locket probably pushed him to the limit but DD, having never seen the locket would not know that it would have this effect. Therefore it follows that he suspected Ron would leave anyway. This is probably because Ron has left in the past. After the whole Crookshanks and Scabbers fiasco he refused to talk to Hermione for ages, they wouldn't speak during the time he was with Lavender and he was spending increasingly more time alone. Not only this but he has a very large family that he is close to and also very insecure about. DD probably knew he would be upset about leaving his family and not being able to keep up to date with what was happening. He was also insecure in his relationships with both Harry and Hermione. He is the underdog in both being the least smart of him and Hermione and the least... popular? famous? brave? out of him and Harry... not to mention the unwavering dedication Hermione has shown Harry right from book one, which, although we know she felt the same dedication to Ron he was still insecure about it because their feelings for each other were different and they had to put up with each others jealousies. I just think DD knew that of the three Ron had always felt the most out of place and also had a lot more connecting him to the rest of the magical world than Harry (who had lost nearly everyone he ever loved) and Hermione (who's parents are muggles).

However DD must have always firmly believed that once Ron had tested his bonds to the other two he would always want to return and would always be drawn back to them.

I love Ron, he is honestly my favourite character.

IT WAS NOT THE LOCKET!

Over and over again I have seen the reason “it was the Locket” given for Ron’s abandonment of Harry and Hermione. This is usually paired with “and JKR needed a way to let us know more about the what was going on in wirzarding world”. However I think both of these explanation are flawed, and do not fully take into account Ron’s character up until that point in the story.

Ron himself said that locket intensified his doubts and insecurities. He also says that there were other occasions in which he was effected more than most by external forces (the Veela for one- thank you cgold, The One True Ron Fan :lol: ) and that he knows that this is a weakness.

Back to his insecurities- he has no idea what is going on. Aside from when he plays wizard chess, Ron is not a planner. He does, however, want to hear that Harry has a plan and he is frustrated when there is none. This is likely intensified by the locket, which (we see later) magnifies his fears in regards to Hermione and Harry, etc. Ron has a heart and he's nervous about having it broken and about being rejected. As a child he probably has less fear, but as an adolescent there are clearly fresh fears afoot, and the locket seems to have fed off of that- which is likely why (when it is later opened) it goes for Ron's weakness rather than Harry's.

While this bit did smack of LOTR for me, I never once thought of Ron as being a Samwise Gamgee knockoff. He's a well-written character- a completely believable insecure teenager, lost and confused, whose feelings bubble to the surface on occasion.

We do know that the locket left an imprint of sorts on Harry's chest. We can extrapolate that unlike the Diary, which required an infusion of ink and some whining about one's troubles to activate, the locket just needed to be close to the skin to have an effect.

While not solely responsible for Ron taking off, it's not that much of a stretch that the locket was definitely a factor.

The locket did not make Ron leave.

The locket *did*, however, amplify his worries, his fears, his doubts, etc., as Blackcatsmeow so eloquently described.

I do not believe that Ron would have left had he not been wearing the locket, but that doesn't make the fault of Ron's departure the lockets either.

In the end, the locket was a powerful influence that caused Ron to falter just enough to make a bad decision. One he regretted immediately.

I do not think for a second that nearly getting captured made him regret it. I think he simply left, and as soon as he'd done it, he immediately regretted it, and would have regretted it - would have felt that remorse - regardless of any thing that happened next.

I think anyone who's made a really bad choice, and done something stupid or worse - bad - i mean really bad - and immediately regretted it - can understand where I'm coming from.

I think Ron's departure was mostly because he was the most affected by the locket horcrux, kind of like the ring affected Bilbo Baggins more than it affected Frodo.

Something about Ron's openness of heart made it that much more affected by the horcrux, and combined with his own insecurities, it was just too much for him.

I suppose the fact that he came back afterwards shows where his true heart was.

I'm sorry, but I really think your underestimating the effect of the locket.
And I think you're overestimating it's affect, underestimating Ron's weakness, and combining them to make an excuse for Ron.

When Harry wears it, it only makes him more irritable and pessimistic because he has a high self esteem.
True, Harry did show irritation and depression with the locket. However, I don't agree that he has a high self-esteem. I think he's a very humble person, even if he can be a bit immature or hot-headed at times. I think when it comes down to it, he's very grounded because he's aware of what he's up against and the fact that he probably will die. But I didn't see him, who faced and suffered more than Ron ever will, throwing up his hands and saying, "I'm out!" He didn't abandon his duty, even though the locket probably fed off his doubts and insecurities about how prepared he was to be the savior of the Wizarding World. He bucked up, like he always has. I've never seen Ron buck up.

But Ron did have insecurities before the locket. He seemed to be well over them, but the locket found them and exploited them, much like the diary did to Ginny.
Everyone in that tent had insecurities! Everyone in that tent wore the locket. Only one person in that tent was weak enough to let it consume them.

And don't forget, Hermione was feeling the same way.
Yes, but I didn't see Hermione running off. Did you?

Don't underestimate the horcruxes power, Ron would never have left otherwise. Ron has proven himself to be incredibly loyal in the past, he wouldn't have left if the locket hadn't truly affected him.
There's absolutely no way to know that for sure. Maybe you'd like to think that, but you don't know for sure. And to be fair, I don't know for sure that he would have left. And as for Ron being trustworthy in the past, I think he's proved the past opposite. Sure, he helped Harry in PS, but that was because he was young and wanted a piece of the glory, and didn't truly resent Harry yet. In CoS, he had his sister motivating him to help. In PoA, he was dragged into it by Scabbers. Who knew if he wanted to be in that situation? In GoF, he let his insecurities overshadow trust for his supposed best friend. He abandoned Harry and ripped Hermione away from him. When Harry needed a best friend the most, Ron let him down. I judge the characters' loyalty to Harry by moments like that instead of by moments where they are in the heat of battle and fighting for themselves and their families as well.

While not solely responsible for Ron taking off, it's not that much of a stretch that the locket was definitely a factor.
Of course it was a factor, but I didn't see Hermione or Harry taking off. Ron was a weak enough person to begin with to let it happen.

I disagree that the locket had nothing or even little to do with Ron leaving Harry and Hermione. It had everything to do with his decision to leave. JKR emphasized over and over that the locket had an influence on the behavior of all three of them. The locket was a piece of Voldemort's soul and after we figure out what's inside it (when Ron is about to destroy it), we can sort of imagine how close it was to Ron's thoughts when it was around his neck. That's the only way, I'm assuming, it knew to point to Ron's insecurities regarding Hermione and such. So it showed Harry kissing Hermione and both of them acting like they didn't need him. It knew all of his insecurities and I think that proves just how powerful it was and, consequently, how badly it could've affected him while it was around his neck.

I realize Ron's temperament and personal insecurities obviously have something to do with it, but those factors were ALWAYS around. Ever since the beginning of the series. I doubt he would've left if the locket hadn't been around his neck. They brought those feelings out even more in his head and gradually pushed him away from Harry and Hermione. He lost his temper and split.

I don't think the reason he came to his senses was because he just did, either. The absence of the locket didn't rid him of those insecurities, but there was balance again. Without the influence of the locket, he realized it was far more important to be around Harry and help him at such a time than abandon him. But the insecurities were ALWAYS there. And only Harry in the end could reassure him he had nothing to worry about.

I must say some excellent posts, I would like to point out that Ron's eyes had a "trace of scarlet" in them which does show how much of a hold the locket had on him.

Ron's leaving was actually more upsetting to me than some of the deaths.

But, from a literary point of view, it makes a lot of sense, because of the following reasons:
1. It clearly establishes that Harry and Hermione are not interested romantically in each other, and that Herimone loves Ron. This may not seem like a big deal, but it's really important in my opinion, because it makes their relationship closer.
2. It isolates Harry, some, for Godric's Hollow. Harry's experience at Godric's Hollow had to be more personal and having two sidekicks around I don't think would have helped the narrative.
3. It emphasizes the friendship between Harry and Ron when they are reunited. It also gives Harry some individual time with both Herminone and Ron.
4. It allows the trio to get information about the outside world.

Still--it was devastating to me at the time.

Ron's leaving was actually more upsetting to me than some of the deaths.


Still--it was devastating to me at the time.

It broke my heart. It was like a death. When Harry felt something broken between them, I just lost it. It's one of my least favorite parts of this book.

I do not believe that Ron would have left had he not been wearing the locket, but that doesn't make the fault of Ron's departure the lockets either.

In the end, the locket was a powerful influence that caused Ron to falter just enough to make a bad decision. One he regretted immediately.

The locket was the catalyst for his departure. It fed on his insecurities, amplifying them, and therefore he fled the scene. If he hadn't worn the locket we can guess that he would not have felt wounded as deeply as he did, and therefore he probably wouldn't have left.

Throughout the books Ron's followed Harry into some pretty horrible situations- the one that springs to mind is the Forbidden Forest and the encounter with the spiders in CoS- and he's been insecure, but this is far more serious than not speaking to Harry in GoF because he's in a foul mood over Harry's fame. This is far more serious- deepened by the locket.

I do not think for a second that nearly getting captured made him regret it. I think he simply left, and as soon as he'd done it, he immediately regretted it, and would have regretted it - would have felt that remorse - regardless of any thing that happened next.

But he also admits that his weakness made him prey to the locket and that once he got away from it he knew this. One might say that once he'd shed the locket and gotten some distance from it he came to his senses. And I'm sure running into the Snatchers helped him come to this realization as well!

I think we should remember that Ron came to his senses almost immediately. i understand that Rowling included this whole part for plot development and what not, but Ron wanted to come back 10 minutes later but couldn't. It's not like it took him weeks to change his mind and realize that there were more important things than his annoyance.

Obviously, Ron's leaving and returning was critical to his character's development, but I wonder if one of the other reasons JKR had Ron leave was so it would only be Harry and Hermione at the gravesite. That was a very emotional moment, one of my favorites in the book, and I'm not sure Harry would have let his emotions show like that if Ron had been there. That scene said a lot about Harry's relationship with Hermione, and in order for it to work, Ron had to be temporarily out of the picture.

I hated Ron for leaving. I didn't want him to come back after that. There's no excuse for abandoning your best friends, especially when they're in that much danger and counting on your help.
I couldn't believe it when he came back- I was sure it was a death eater in disguise. Ron's always been a coward but, for me, this was the last straw.

I couldn't believe ron left.

I realize Ron's temperament and personal insecurities obviously have something to do with it, but those factors were ALWAYS around. Ever since the beginning of the series. I doubt he would've left if the locket hadn't been around his neck.
Because he never let his insecurities drive him away from Harry before. :rolleyes:

I hated Ron for leaving. I didn't want him to come back after that. There's no excuse for abandoning your best friends, especially when they're in that much danger and counting on your help.
I couldn't believe it when he came back- I was sure it was a death eater in disguise. Ron's always been a coward but, for me, this was the last straw.
At least I'm not alone in this! :tu:

Yes, I was super mad at Ron abandoning them, too! I was glad that he stayed away for so long! But, you have to admit, it was really dull with just Hermione and Harry alone. Besides some key parts. And, of course, he then saved Harry, so I was no longer mad at him and forgave him.
I think that it was mainly the horcrux talking.

So no it was not the Locket. It was not that JKR had to show us what was going on in the wizarding world (she could have done that in a hundred non magical and a thousand magical ways). It was Ron, which made Ron leave. It was the completion of journey of his character. And to be honest one of my favorite parts in the series, I think it was very well written. (And I have a fair few complaints about the JKR’s writing in this book.) Jo chose to write a much more complicated sidekick then Samwise Gamgee. Let’s not cheapen that.

Actually, it was the locket. Yes, Ron is a very insecure person and those fears were his own fears. However, the locket was more than just a catalyst. The locket was shown to affect all of them negatively. They all became more irritable and negative feelings were compounded by wearing it. Ron was affected more strongly because - unlike Harry and Hermione - Ron is more openly emotional. He is more susceptible to things like that. We also see that with his reaction to Veela. It was easier for that piece of soul to worm it's way in and use Ron's existing insecurities and fears against him.

The circumstances are a factor as well. They were all irritable because of the circumstances - lack of food and being in constant fear. The presence of the locket exacerbated those negative feelings and they were all ready to snap - Ron to the greater degree because he was affected more strongly. He's also very worried about his family and they just got the news that Ginny had been caught trying to steal Gryffindor's sword. He does not see the Forbidden Forest as safe and he's worried about Ginny. Harry and Hermione were carrying on like he wasn't even there. He was wearing the locket and all those negative feelings were exacerbated. He snapped.

But you are right about one thing. The locket did not make Ron leave. Harry made Ron leave. The locket exacerbated his insecurities and fears and caused him to lash out. But Ron left because Harry told him to leave. The locket was a huge part of that for all of them. And Jo made it clear on page that as soon as Ron was away from the locket's influence he realized that he was wrong and wanted to go back. It wasn't the snatchers who made Ron want to go back. The snatchers only prevented Ron from going back after he had come to that realization on his own.

This was also significant for plot purposes as well. The trio had been isolated and this was a good way for them to find out what was going on. Ron came back with information they needed - like the fact that Voldemort's name had been tabooed and was being used to track down Order members. And he found out about Potterwatch, which gave them means to keep track of what was going on. It was also very significant to Ron's character development because the locket played on his existing fears and exacerbated them. He needed to confront those fears once and for all. And he did. He faced his deepest emotional fears and he defeated them.

But, yes, it was the locket. If they had been able to destroy the locket immediately instead of having to carry it around for all that time, that argument would not have happened the way it did. I'm not saying there wouldn't have been an argument at all, but the locket did exacerbate the negative feelings they were all having and made the situation worse.

A while back before book 6, if I recall, there was a "DIE,RON,DIE" sentiment among those who wanted Harry to hook up with Hermione. Furthermore, as Neville got better, Ron looked weaker all the time. I remember saying something like Ron's importance was not magical power or talent, but that he was Harry's best friend. Indeed, the times they were at odds in the series, or he was snogging Lavender, were rather painful to Harry.

Apparently, Dumbledore knew Ron's heart from book 1. He wanted to be the best Weasley and as Hermione said was jealous of Harry's supposed popularity and accomplishment which came to a head at the Triwizard Tournament. Yet at the same time he was a loyal friend, if pigheaded, and would always come back in the end.

I think he admired Harry too, and it was a big letdown to find Harry didn't know what he was supposed to do.

Also, since Ron left, this totally eliminated any possibility that he and Hermione would "do it" while camping or upon his return, since she was so mad.

I think the locket was not the only factor but it can't just be dismissed as nothing, considering what we eventually did see when it opened. All three of them felt some effects, but Ron just happened to be the easiest target. What would it say to Hermione? You're still not smart enough? And Harry seemed to have his head focused on his mission. Ron, on the other hand, was worried about his family who was NOT under special protection or in Australia while they wandered aimlessly in the forest. I'm sure he was frustrated that he was away from his family, all of whom are constantly in danger, and yet they weren't making any progress with the horcruxes. That, plus his insecure nature, would be easy for the locket to take advantage of. Sure, Ron himself was unfocused at the time unlike Harry or Hermione and allowed himself to fall under the locket's influence. But I don't think he would've become so fed up that he would actually leave without the locket. Could there have been an argument? Probably, but to actually take off? He needed that extra push, which the locket provided.

Also, it's later revealed that almost immediately after he left, he was already regretting it. He just couldn't come back. I don't think he could've had such a huge change of heart right away without some outside influence to begin with.

This whole episode was there to finally put to rest all those insecurities Ron has had from the very beginning with the Mirror of Erised, culminating with the locket opening and Ron overcoming it. If you think about, Ron's already accomplished a lot of what he had wanted from the mirror. He's on the quidditch team, and though he's uneven, he's always pulled through when it mattered and was the big hero at the final match in OotP. He is a prefect and got pretty decent OWLS. The problem is, to him, he thinks its still not good enough because all his brothers have already done it. Charlie is still the quidditch hot shot, Percy the smart one, Fred/George the funny ones, Bill the oldest and accomplished one, and Ginny was the first girl in some odd generations. Plus, on top of that, he's best friends with the famous Harry Potter and the super brainy Hermione. To have all those people around him-- it's not surprising he tends to play up his insecurities. And of course, whenever he does have something that sets him apart even a little, he's surprised at the attention he gets and wants to relish it.

It's kind of the opposite of Harry-- he just so much attention all the time, he brushes it off. But there was that short time after Ron was made prefect instead of Harry, when he had a brief episode of jealousy or confusion at least. I think that showed us something about the two of them in their reactions. Ron is so surprised that he accomplished something Harry didn't, he's almost speechless. Harry, on the other hand, is so used to things happening to HIM that he can't believe he didn't get it, and even he is jealous for a moment. Not because he's insecure, but because he's so accustomed to being "the one", it's a shock to him when someone else gets it.

Of course, in the end, the locket uses Hermione and his family against Ron. I think its a real fear for him, having Harry so close to his own family, that they'd prefer Harry over him. As for Hermione-- it's pretty clear to the reader that Hermione is interested in only Ron romantically, but he doesn't really know that for sure. He knows Harry now only has eyes for Ginny, but Hermione's feelings were still somewhat in the air to Ron. He wasn't there when Hermione cried when he left and everything Harry knows. After Ron finally destroys it, it just meant that book was finally closed and paved the way for the Ron/Hermione relationship.

I can't understand why people are so upset at Ron and can't forgive him. Honestly, nobody is perfect, and I commend Jo for having the guts to write such a flawed character. You would think that after all the books Ron would have gotten over his insecurities but guess what, he hadn't, which is completely realistic.

Actually, it was the locket. Yes, Ron is a very insecure person and those fears were his own fears. However, the locket was more than just a catalyst. The locket was shown to affect all of them negatively. They all became more irritable and negative feelings were compounded by wearing it. Ron was affected more strongly because - unlike Harry and Hermione - Ron is more openly emotional. He is more susceptible to things like that. We also see that with his reaction to Veela. It was easier for that piece of soul to worm it's way in and use Ron's existing insecurities and fears against him.

The circumstances are a factor as well. They were all irritable because of the circumstances - lack of food and being in constant fear. The presence of the locket exacerbated those negative feelings and they were all ready to snap - Ron to the greater degree because he was affected more strongly. He's also very worried about his family and they just got the news that Ginny had been caught trying to steal Gryffindor's sword. He does not see the Forbidden Forest as safe and he's worried about Ginny. Harry and Hermione were carrying on like he wasn't even there. He was wearing the locket and all those negative feelings were exacerbated. He snapped.

But you are right about one thing. The locket did not make Ron leave. Harry made Ron leave. The locket exacerbated his insecurities and fears and caused him to lash out. But Ron left because Harry told him to leave. The locket was a huge part of that for all of them. And Jo made it clear on page that as soon as Ron was away from the locket's influence he realized that he was wrong and wanted to go back. It wasn't the snatchers who made Ron want to go back. The snatchers only prevented Ron from going back after he had come to that realization on his own.

This was also significant for plot purposes as well. The trio had been isolated and this was a good way for them to find out what was going on. Ron came back with information they needed - like the fact that Voldemort's name had been tabooed and was being used to track down Order members. And he found out about Potterwatch, which gave them means to keep track of what was going on. It was also very significant to Ron's character development because the locket played on his existing fears and exacerbated them. He needed to confront those fears once and for all. And he did. He faced his deepest emotional fears and he defeated them.

But, yes, it was the locket. If they had been able to destroy the locket immediately instead of having to carry it around for all that time, that argument would not have happened the way it did. I'm not saying there wouldn't have been an argument at all, but the locket did exacerbate the negative feelings they were all having and made the situation worse.

Exactly Meesha! In my mind, Ron’s little more at fault than Ginny was when she opened the Chamber in book two.

I believe that Dumbledore knew that Ron and Harry and Hermione would one day be separated, and Ron would need a way back. I don't think he thought that Ron would abandon the trio, but he could come to the conclusion that the trio would need to find one another at some point. It would be too foolishly optimistic to think that Harry, Ron, and Hermione would be able to spend every minute together while searching for the Horcruxes. At some point or other, they would be separated. In which case, they would need to regroup. Ron's Deluminator did exactly that.

I agree that Ron is definitely more complicated than Samwise. He's one of the bravest and most realistically written characters in the series. However, fans and the movies want him to be one-dimensional and so they can't appreciate one of the best characters JK created. He's an ordinary guy doing the extraordinary and I've always been fascinated by that because he's a real person.

Cheers :tu:


Amen!!! :p

Aw, i hate it when people rag on ron. he didn't abandon them. he made a mistake, and he came back...sometimes you have to be pretty brave to do that.

Actually, it was the locket. Yes, Ron is a very insecure person and those fears were his own fears. However, the locket was more than just a catalyst. The locket was shown to affect all of them negatively. They all became more irritable and negative feelings were compounded by wearing it. Ron was affected more strongly because - unlike Harry and Hermione - Ron is more openly emotional. He is more susceptible to things like that. We also see that with his reaction to Veela. It was easier for that piece of soul to worm it's way in and use Ron's existing insecurities and fears against him.

I'm sorry but it's really ridiculous to say that [I]Ron[I] is the most emotional. I would say that Hermione is at least as emotional as Ron. And let's face it Harry has shown himself to have real anger issues. Yet none of things surfaced when Harry and Hermione wore the locket. It was only Ron who gave into the whisperings of Voldemort's soul, and that is no one's fault but his own. Ron is extremely insecure, we've seen this through the series, his image in the Mirror of Erised, how he abandoned Harry during GOF. This is not shocking behavior from Ron at all, and I'm simply astounded that so many people found this to be out of character. I wouldn't say that Ron is more susceptible to Veela, Harry had a very strong reaction to them as well, I believe that Ron is so infatuated with Fleur because he believes that a woman as beautiful as she is would never look twice at him, and he allows this to torture him. Let's not beat around the bush, Ron is weaker in character than the other two, that is why he gave in to the locket. In the end the locket was reiterating the things he himself already believed. He didn't need the locket to make him think those things.

I believe that Dumbledore knew that Ron and Harry and Hermione would one day be separated, and Ron would need a way back. I don't think he thought that Ron would abandon the trio, but he could come to the conclusion that the trio would need to find one another at some point. It would be too foolishly optimistic to think that Harry, Ron, and Hermione would be able to spend every minute together while searching for the Horcruxes. At some point or other, they would be separated. In which case, they would need to regroup. Ron's Deluminator did exactly that.

mmm...i dont know. I know alot of people would like to think that some characters arent severly flawed but I think that anyone that has seen Ron and Harry interact would understand the feelings Ron has had to cope with being in Harry's shadow. Not only that, Ron has always grown in the shadows of his brothers, he was never head boy, the funniest, the most athletic or anything. at least ginny was the daughter mrs weasely wanted. i think the fact that Ron did have those feelings made his relationship with Harry very realistic. Its not uncommon for the right hand man to get jealous.

however, i doubt DD would have thought that "oh maybe, they would accidentally get separated". He would have then given the Deluminator to Harry or even Hermione since she is most responsible and would therefore figure out how to use it faster. DD was smart, he know Ron's character. But that doesnt mean Ron was a bad guy...it means he is human.

as stated by others, the locket did play up those feelings of Ron. However, during their argument, Harry did suggest that Ron leave. And even without the locket, Ron would have been burned. I dont think his abadonment showed that he was a horrible friend to Harry; it proved that his friendship with him is very important since it was able to hurt him so much.

And as in all friendships, conflicts make the relationships stronger.

Well, Ron is estranged from Harry early in GoF, and from Hermione in HBP, so it's not difficullt to envision that he might need a way to "find his way back"...

No way he's weak. Yeah, Ron's insecure. So am i, about a lot of things. That he was able to overcome them speaks volumes about his strength of character. :)

I was absolutely shocked when Ron abandoned Harry and Hermione. It upset me so much..it really did. The trio's relationship has always been one of my favorite aspects of the series. When he left, it broke that bond and also made me somewhat angry at Ron for abandoning his friends and such an important mission just because times were hard. But there was no question in my mind that he would return, and I was all smiles when he did. He definitely redeemed himself. :)

It's still the locket that made him leave.

No it didn't. It may have speed the process up but it wasn't the cause of the process. It may have helped determine when he left, but it didn't determine if he left.


These thoughts were Ron's but they were never to the extent that Ron would leave unless it kept amplifying it and playing it in his mind and feeding him the images he kept seeing over and over. I've said before that when it comes to stuff like that in the past, Ron has always been the most susceptible (Imperius, Veela) and it affected him far greater than Harry and Hermione because the source of all the visions the Locket was feeding him was actually there and present. However, these were still things that were in Ron's mind in the first place but they were probably just the usual type of jealousy it had been in the past but it was not the reason he left.

Yes and in the past, free from magical reason, Ron had left Harry. Ron had also left Hermione emotionally before when he was angered. There was very none magical reasons for Dumbledore to give him a way back. That Dumbledore would know that he would leave in the first place.

I also think you are totally underestimating the effects of Ron simply being isolated with the two people his insecurities where tied to the most. Everyday all day, all night. Like I said even without the Locket, even with out the horrible conditions, this would simply have been to much for him to take.

Ron needed this wake call. He needed the prospective of making a horrible decision based on his anger, and self doubts. He had never really suffered for these before. And so before he could get over them, he needed to get under them. If that makes sense. He needed the reality check.

To use an analogy, lets picture that Ron's walking out as a bomb. Now the gun power was already in place (do to his insecurities) and the fuse was already there (his temper). Once they where traveling his fuse got lit, (his growing jealousy of Harry and Hermione). All the Locket did was shorten his fuse. Make the timer lose 10 seconds, if you will. But it didn't light the fuse, or gather the materials. It didn't make the bomb, it just made it explode sooner then it would have if it hadn't of been there. But either way the bomb would have detonated.

I agree that Ron is definitely more complicated than Samwise.

Just to be clear. I'm not saying that Ron is a better literary character then Sam. Sam was totally believable, and beautifully written. There really are people like Sam in the world, and he had so much depth to him even if it was a quiet depth.

However characters like Sam (though in lesser writers hands they are really more of caricatures then proper characters in their own right), are usually the ones authors put in to side kick positions. I thought it was interesting that Rowlings decided to give her sidekick a middle child syndrome. That she decided to make a sidekick not only aware that he was a sidekick, but also resentful of it. I thought it was brave choice and done well because Harry and Ron's friendship was beautiful for completely different reasons then the friendship of say Frodo and Sam. It was beautiful for it's flaws, for it's impurities, for the times it came up short. Because knowing it was fallible, made the times it shone through feel even more powerful.

Lets be honest, I think most of us where shocked with Harry and Ron’s fight in GoF. Why? Because we knew that no matter what Ron would be there for Harry, he had been for 3 books, and then pow he’s not. He breaks with sidekick tradition, and doubts Harry.

ETA
Since this is not something that a sidekick traditionally does. I thought it made OotP all the more poignant for Ron sticking by Harry. The flaw highlighted the brilliance of their relationship. The weaknesses the strength. If Ron had loved Harry less, these things would have broken the bond.

He's one of the bravest and most realistically written characters in the series.

Everyone has their favorites. And I'm glad Ron is so many peoples. But seriously how is he "the bravest". How was he any braver then Harry, Neville, Hermione, Snape, Lily, James and so on. There were a lot of heroes in the story I have a time assigning the title of "The bravest" to anyone. I also thought many of the characters where well done, I have a hard time assigning "the most realistic". I have no troubles assigning the title of "My personal favorite" however.

However, fans and the movies want him to be one-dimensional and so they can't appreciate one of the best characters JK created. He's an ordinary guy doing the extraordinary and I've always been fascinated by that because he's a real person.

And yet you don't want him to be too flawed. Too multi-dimensional. You are just doing it in the opposite way. You are making him too infallible, too good. And so you assign him a magical excuse for a very real and character driven problem. I think his greatest and bravest moment was coming back. And having the locket as the reason behind that totally cheapens and one dimensionalizes him.

Originally posted by Blackcatsmeow
No it didn't. It may have speed the process up but it wasn't the cause of the process. It may have helped determine when he left, but it didn't determine if he left.

I agree that the feelings were already there. Ron was insecure before the locket. But he wouldn't have left without the locket's influence. Ron has shown himself to be a loyal friend in the past he wouldn't have just left for no reason. I'm sure there would've been an argument, but Ron wouldn't have walked out. He knew that destroying the horcruxes was for the greater good. Ron has gotten into arguments before with Harry and Hermione, but he has never even left the room during an argument. In GoF, he stays in the same room, it is always Harry who storms out. Same with Hermione. Ron is not the one to leave.

I also think you are totally underestimating the effects of Ron simply being isolated with the two people his insecurities where tied to the most. Everyday all day, all night. Like I said even without the Locket, even with out the horrible conditions, this would simply have been to much for him to take.

Ron needed this wake call. He needed the prospective of making a horrible decision based on his anger, and self doubts. He had never really suffered for these before. And so before he could get over them, he needed to get under them. If that makes sense. He needed the reality check.


I agree that the conditions were very hard on Ron. That is why the locket was able to affect him so badly. He had the most insecuities and doubts and fears then either of the other two. Harry was too focused on the mission and Hermione's family was safe in Australia. Ron would've eventually blown up and had an argument, but he would never have left.

I think your right that this was a reality check for Ron, but if he had walked out on anger alone, it would've taken him a while to cool off. Yet he says he immediately wanted to go back. The second he was away from the locket, he regreted what he had done. This isn't the reaction of someone who hotly stormed out of an argument. Even if he had just gone outside and had not truly left, he would've taken a while to calm down and realize that he had been stupid to argue with Harry if the locket was not the main reason he left.


He's one of the bravest and most realistically written characters in the series.

Everyone has their favorites. And I'm glad Ron is so many peoples. But seriously how is he "the bravest". How was he any braver then Harry, Neville, Hermione, Snape, Lily, James and so on. There were a lot of heroes in the story I have a time assigning the title of "The bravest" to anyone. I also thought many of the characters where well done, I have a hard time assigning "the most realistic". I have no troubles assigning the title of "My personal favorite" however.

You'll note that the quote said one of the bravest, not the bravest. Being one of the bravest puts him up there with Harry, Hermione, Neville, etc. I agree that Ron is one of the bravest because he is the one of the few characters in the book who truly confronts his deepest demons and defeats them. It shows bravery and strength of character. And how many people would've come back after walking out on the Chosen One, no matter how much they wanted to? Both acts took enormous amounts of bravery.

And yet you don't want him to be too flawed. Too multi-dimensional. You are just doing it in the opposite way. You are making him too infallible, too good. And so you assign him a magical excuse for a very real and character driven problem. I think his greatest and bravest moment was coming back. And having the locket as the reason behind that totally cheapens and one dimensionalizes him.

We're not saying Ron is too infalliable. In fact, I wouldn't say Ron is remotely infalliable. The fact that he is overly emotional and so falls prey to a magical source easily doesn't make him one-dimensional. It makes him human, and the fact that he overcame them gives him even more character.

Even the best of us can't always stand by our bestest friends, and I think Dumbledore understood that when it came to Ron and Harry's relationship. We all have our breaking points, and being Harry Potter's best friend will give you many a day to reach the breaking point, Dumbledore just gave Ron an outlet to return. I have very few close friends and one of them I stopped talking to for over 2 years, and it was over the dumbest thing.Sure she ****** me off a lot, but if you are to be someone's friend, you have to realize you have to accept everything that comes with being their friend, something Harry and co. battle with a lot, but like a runaway kid, they always come back home..... :)

I was devestated Ron left the first time I read the book - I felt like he has deaserted the trio, but after I read it more slowly it seemed that the locket affected Ron much more after they realised that the sword could destroy it - so I felt that Ron wasn't really himself when he left - and as soon as he took the locket off and calmed down a bit his first reaction was to go back.

I think i kinda expected him to leave...by that time in the book I could feel the tension rising and the whole horcrux mission was becoming aimless...i felt that someone was gonna lose it, either harry leave to do it on his own, or ron go...
what i didn't expect was that ron was actually feeling jealous of hermione and harry, like what the locket horcrux showed...
the whole thing jsut reminded me of ron's behaviour in goblet of fire
but i knew that he'd come back cos thats just the way it had to be :)

I agree that the feelings were already there. Ron was insecure before the locket. But he wouldn't have left without the locket's influence. Ron has shown himself to be a loyal friend in the past he wouldn't have just left for no reason. I'm sure there would've been an argument, but Ron wouldn't have walked out. He knew that destroying the horcruxes was for the greater good. Ron has gotten into arguments before with Harry and Hermione, but he has never even left the room during an argument. In GoF, he stays in the same room, it is always Harry who storms out. Same with Hermione. Ron is not the one to leave.

But he had reasons. And to him they where good reasons. He didn’t just wake up one day and say “hey you know I’m tired of being here. I think I’ll leave.” The reasons he left where very close to his heart for a long time. They had been there for years, and years.

Ron might not have left the room but he did abandon Harry in GoF. And he made the choice to stay gone until just before the first task. Then there is a reality check for Ron. Harry doesn’t come to bed. Ron gets worried, and decides to look for him, Harry and Ron get into their argument. Ron has a hand to forehead moment and realizes that this not how he wants things. Then takes steps to make amends. When he is ready to make amends Harry doesn’t force him to apologize.

But the point is that of his own accord he chose not to be there for Harry. Why? Because he was tired of being out done by Harry. He was tired of being in the cheering section and not the one on the field. He felt left out and so left.

Just as he turned against Hermione in PoA and HBP. For different reasons, but both times it took something big for him come to his senses and realize what was at stake.

None of these ever really cost him anything. His pride always stayed in tact. When he was done being mad, that was that; Harry or Hermione was ready to accept him back. Before he could get over it he had to be humbled by it. Which he had never been forced to do before. And so built up and built up, and before the end it was going to burst.

Dumbledore knew that. He also knew that eventually Ron would be humbled. That when forced to chose between his pride or his friends, eventually Harry and Hermione where going to win out. And so Dumbledore gave him a way back.

I agree that the conditions were very hard on Ron. That is why the locket was able to affect him so badly. He had the most insecuities and doubts and fears then either of the other two. Harry was too focused on the mission and Hermione's family was safe in Australia. Ron would've eventually blown up and had an argument, but he would never have left.

You really think Hermione had it easier then Ron? What would be more terrifying to you personally? Knowing your family was up against a threat they did not know about and could not protect themselves from; or knowing that your family was aware of the threat, had made the conscious decision to fight, and at the very least had the appropriate weapons to put up a resistance.

Also I can not imagine how hard it would be to totally erase yourself from your parents minds. Making the decision to not only up root their lives with out their consent for their own safety. Which is by it’s self a huge and emotionally charged decision. But to also know that if you died, or they worse if they died, they would not even know that you loved them because they would not know that you ever existed.

Also was Australia really that safe? If so for how long? Voldemort had the ministry had executed the minister the one person probably more protected then any one. What where two muggles compared with that? How long before he sought world domination? Did he already have agents in other lands? What was distance to a wizard anyway.

And why was she there anyway? Why had she done that to her parents? Why was she there instead of with her family at least trying to make them safe?

You don’t think that is fertile stuff something that draw out anxiety? Yet Hermione never wavers. Even when her exposure to the locket is increased. So again it's not the Locket.

I think your right that this was a reality check for Ron, but if he had walked out on anger alone, it would've taken him a while to cool off. Yet he says he immediately wanted to go back. The second he was away from the locket, he regreted what he had done. This isn't the reaction of someone who hotly stormed out of an argument. Even if he had just gone outside and had not truly left, he would've taken a while to calm down and realize that he had been stupid to argue with Harry if the locket was not the main reason he left.


He had taken off the locket prior to him leaving. Granted not long before. But when Harry was angry the instant he took of the locket he was it lost it’s affect on him. Again it wasn’t the locket.


You'll note that the quote said one of the bravest, not the bravest. Being one of the bravest puts him up there with Harry, Hermione, Neville, etc. I agree that Ron is one of the bravest because he is the one of the few characters in the book who truly confronts his deepest demons and defeats them. It shows bravery and strength of character. And how many people would've come back after walking out on the Chosen One, no matter how much they wanted to? Both acts took enormous amounts of bravery.

Nope missed the "one of". Sorry I would agree that he is one of the heros in the story. I love that Harry, Ron and Neville all wielded the sword of Gryffindor. They are all great representatives of a house that values bravery above all else.


We're not saying Ron is too infalliable. In fact, I wouldn't say Ron is remotely infalliable. The fact that he is overly emotional and so falls prey to a magical source easily doesn't make him one-dimensional. It makes him human, and the fact that he overcame them gives him even more character.

Since you know falling prey to magic is something most of face in our lives. The locket is the easy way out. It makes it not his fault, not his choice. It makes him a victim to be pitied. A fault terribly easy to forgive.

I don’t remember Hermione having any special kind of resistance to magical temptation. Does she ever show any? (Honest question.) The veela’s didn’t affect her, but then they only seem to affect men so I don’t see that as proof of an innate ability to ward off powerful magic.

Ron leaving definitely did surprise me, but as Harry said, the manner in which Ron returned made up for it. I don't think his leaving constitutes a "disservice" to him at all. Actually, his adventures on his own and efforts to return to Harry and Hermione reflect quite well on him, IMO. If Dumbledore did indeed anticipate Ron leaving (which we don't really know, anyway), then it was because he understood Ron's insecurities, which would drive him away, and understood that Ron would inevitably overcome them. Going away and coming back was part of Ron's journey, and I think it worked very well, even if it was rather unexpected.

I agree entirely

It did surprise me & it didn't if that makes any sense - I worried about Ron before this book came out - he's suseptable to being 'taken over' & I was worried he'd be imperverised & betray Harry. Thankfully I was wrong - something I've gotten used to when it comes to Harry Potter!

He's the most immature of the trio - the one with the most insecruities and while he made huge strides in the last couple of books when it came to the crunch he was the one who broke first.
Dumbledore knew that if push came to shove & one of them broke it would be Ron but he also knew that Ron was incredibly loyal to Harry & would do all he could to get back.
Let's not forget that Ron's no dummy - he was smart enough not to go back to the barrow afterwards - once Ginny had finished with him he'd have been in no fit state to go anywhere!

I'm sorry but it's really ridiculous to say that [I]Ron[I] is the most emotional. I would say that Hermione is at least as emotional as Ron. And let's face it Harry has shown himself to have real anger issues. Yet none of things surfaced when Harry and Hermione wore the locket. It was only Ron who gave into the whisperings of Voldemort's soul, and that is no one's fault but his own. Ron is extremely insecure, we've seen this through the series, his image in the Mirror of Erised, how he abandoned Harry during GOF. This is not shocking behavior from Ron at all, and I'm simply astounded that so many people found this to be out of character. I wouldn't say that Ron is more susceptible to Veela, Harry had a very strong reaction to them as well, I believe that Ron is so infatuated with Fleur because he believes that a woman as beautiful as she is would never look twice at him, and he allows this to torture him. Let's not beat around the bush, Ron is weaker in character than the other two, that is why he gave in to the locket. In the end the locket was reiterating the things he himself already believed. He didn't need the locket to make him think those things.

Actually, it was shown on page that Ron is more susceptible to Veela than Harry. Harry was affected the first time he saw them when they did that little dance - along with Ron. But only Ron was affected when they passed the Veela in the woods and only Ron was affected by Fleur when she came to Hogwarts and, later, when she was at the Burrow during HBP. The only reason Ron was ever infatuated with Fleur was because she was part Veela. That was particularly emphasized in HBP when Fleur made her dramatic entrance and Ron was severely affected while Harry was not. Harry wasn't really affected by Veela at all once he knew what they were.

Ron is more emotional than Harry or Hermione in terms of showing his emotions. Harry internalizes everything until he reaches a boiling point and then blows up. Hermione is more practical and rarely gives in to her emotions - and given what a nasty temper she has, it's understandable that she tries to maintain such tight control over herself. Ron basically wears his heart on his sleeve. Whatever he is feeling is completely obvious. Happy, sad, hurt, angry - whatever Ron is feeling is easily discerned by simply looking at him or listening to him.

But I believe Ron has the strongest character overall because he was shown from the beginning to have such deep insecurities and he really only gave in to those insecurities twice. And both times it was because of Harry's actions. Harry refused to explain the situation in GOF and basically called Ron stupid - Ron got angry and didn't speak to Harry. But the second he realized how much danger Harry was in, Ron was the one who was man enough to swallow his pride and apologize. Harry was never able to do that and never apologized to Ron for how poorly he treated him during all that. It was the same with the locket. They were all being affected negatively by the locket and it was affecting Ron to a greater degree. Ron snapped - they argued - Harry told him to leave. Ron left because Harry told him to. And the minute he was away from them - and away from the influence of the locket - he realized his mistake and tried to go back. He was prevented from doing so by the snatchers and they had left before he could get back to them.

I think it was predictable that Ron would be the one most strongly affected by the locket because he is so open with his emotions and had such deep emotional fears. He was easy prey for that piece of Voldemort's soul. But, if they had been able to destroy the locket immediately, that situation never would have occurred. But - in the end - the whole situation was really a good thing because it forced Ron to confront those fears once and for all and defeat them.

Ron's hot tempered too - that Weasley red hair! Harry and Hermione both find it easier to keep their cool than Ron does.
I think he needed to stomp off for a while because it was all getting too much for him, and the Locket was amplifying his bad temper but he tried to come back fairly quickly didn't he? I don't think he ever intended to abandon the others for real.

But he had reasons. And to him they where good reasons. He didn’t just wake up one day and say “hey you know I’m tired of being here. I think I’ll leave.” The reasons he left where very close to his heart for a long time. They had been there for years, and years.

They were also fears that he knew were unreasonable and untrue until he wore the locket. The locket exacerbated those fears. Harry and Hermione's behavior at that moment also exacerbated the situation. Ron lost his temper and lashed out because of the locket and Harry made him leave. To suggest otherwise, is unfair because they all were behaving badly there because of the exposure to the locket and the extreme circumstances they were in.

Ron might not have left the room but he did abandon Harry in GoF. And he made the choice to stay gone until just before the first task. Then there is a reality check for Ron. Harry doesn’t come to bed. Ron gets worried, and decides to look for him, Harry and Ron get into their argument. Ron has a hand to forehead moment and realizes that this not how he wants things. Then takes steps to make amends. When he is ready to make amends Harry doesn’t force him to apologize.

But the point is that of his own accord he chose not to be there for Harry. Why? Because he was tired of being out done by Harry. He was tired of being in the cheering section and not the one on the field. He felt left out and so left.

But not until Harry called him stupid. Ron was prepared to swallow his pride. In fact, he did. He tried to smile and offer Harry congratulations. All he wanted was an explanation for why Harry didn't include him. Harry refused to explain the situation and chose to call Ron stupid instead. That made Ron angry and he didn't speak to Harry. They were both to blame for that fight - not just Ron. It was the same with the locket. It takes two people to have an argument and Harry was as much to blame as Ron for telling Ron to leave in the first place.

Just as he turned against Hermione in PoA and HBP. For different reasons, but both times it took something big for him come to his senses and realize what was at stake.

And Hermione was just as much to blame for that as well. Again, it takes two people to have an argument. Hermione disregarded Ron's concerns about Crookshanks from the beginning even though it was obvious that Crookshanks was deliberately attacking Scabbers. Just because Scabbers turned out to be one of the bad guys in the end, doesn't excuse Hermione's disregard of Ron's feelings. None of them knew what Scabbers was and Hermione should have had more respect for their friendship and made more of an effort to keep Crookshanks away from Scabbers. They both had a lesson to learn there and they both learned it.

None of these ever really cost him anything. His pride always stayed in tact. When he was done being mad, that was that; Harry or Hermione was ready to accept him back. Before he could get over it he had to be humbled by it. Which he had never been forced to do before. And so built up and built up, and before the end it was going to burst.

That is incorrect. It was Ron who swallowed his pride and admitted he was wrong when he saw how much danger Harry was facing with the tournament. Harry should have been the one to go to Ron and apologize for calling him stupid, but he never did that. If he had, the fight never would have gone on so long.

It was also Ron who swallowed his pride and forgave Hermione for disregarding his concerns about Crookshanks. But Hermione - unlike Harry - was big enough to apologize - even though she did do that after the fact.

Dumbledore knew that. He also knew that eventually Ron would be humbled. That when forced to chose between his pride or his friends, eventually Harry and Hermione where going to win out. And so Dumbledore gave him a way back.

I think Dumbledore knew that Ron would be the one who would be most affected by the Horcruxes. He also knew that Ron's loyalty would win out in the end because it always had.

You really think Hermione had it easier then Ron? What would be more terrifying to you personally? Knowing your family was up against a threat they did not know about and could not protect themselves from; or knowing that your family was aware of the threat, had made the conscious decision to fight, and at the very least had the appropriate weapons to put up a resistance.

I don't think anyone is saying that Hermione was less concerned. But her parents were safe in Australia with their memories modified. You said it yourself, Ron's family was right in the middle of all of it. The fact that they chose to fight doesn't erase worry and concern for their safety. Ron's family was in more danger because they were fighting.

Also I can not imagine how hard it would be to totally erase yourself from your parents minds. Making the decision to not only up root their lives with out their consent for their own safety. Which is by it’s self a huge and emotionally charged decision. But to also know that if you died, or they worse if they died, they would not even know that you loved them because they would not know that you ever existed.

Also was Australia really that safe? If so for how long? Voldemort had the ministry had executed the minister the one person probably more protected then any one. What where two muggles compared with that? How long before he sought world domination? Did he already have agents in other lands? What was distance to a wizard anyway.

And why was she there anyway? Why had she done that to her parents? Why was she there instead of with her family at least trying to make them safe?

Hermione felt that they were safe there. And she did not have the same worry that Ron did because her parents were safely out of it. Yes, it was an emotional decision for her and it hurt her to do that, but she believed that they were safe and she had done the right thing. Unlike Ron, she didn't have to constantly worry whether one of her parents had been killed while fighting against Voldemort. And Ron also had all of his siblings to worry about as well.

You don’t think that is fertile stuff something that draw out anxiety? Yet Hermione never wavers. Even when her exposure to the locket is increased. So again it's not the Locket.

Again, that is incorrect. Hermione did waiver and she was talking about Harry behind his back with Ron. She was also more irritable because of the locket as well. So was Harry.

And - as it was stated on page - neither Harry nor Hermione were affected by the locket as strongly as Ron was. It made them more irritable, but it was a lot worse for Ron because the locket fed his insecurities. That is clearly stated on page - the locket affected him much worse.

He had taken off the locket prior to him leaving. Granted not long before. But when Harry was angry the instant he took of the locket he was it lost it’s affect on him. Again it wasn’t the locket.

He was wearing the locket right up to the moment he left. And they had just had a big argument because of the locket and Harry told him to leave. Once he was away from the locket completely, he realized he was wrong and tried to go back immediately. He was prevented from doing that by the snatchers.

So, yes, it was the locket. And that is clearly stated on page.

Nope missed the "one of". Sorry I would agree that he is one of the heros in the story. I love that Harry, Ron and Neville all wielded the sword of Gryffindor. They are all great representatives of a house that values bravery above all else.

Agreed. :agree:

Since you know falling prey to magic is something most of face in our lives. The locket is the easy way out. It makes it not his fault, not his choice. It makes him a victim to be pitied. A fault terribly easy to forgive.

That is precisely the point. Ron was the victim and it wasn't really his choice. The locket exacerbated his fears and Harry told him to leave. Ginny faced the same situation with the diary. It wasn't her choice to open the chamber and set the basilisk on muggleborns.

The locket fed on Ron's insecurities and was starting to possess him the same way the diary possessed Ginny. We saw that just before he destroyed it when his eyes started to turn red.

I don’t remember Hermione having any special kind of resistance to magical temptation. Does she ever show any? (Honest question.) The veela’s didn’t affect her, but then they only seem to affect men so I don’t see that as proof of an innate ability to ward off powerful magic.

Hermione's practical nature would give her some measure of protection, but not completely. She was affected by the locket as well, but not as strongly as Ron. Harry has shown more resistance to magical influence though. He was able to throw off the Imperius curse and, once he knew what they were, the Veela had no noticeable affect on him at all. And when they were learning about the Imperius curse in GOF, it was also Ron who had the most trouble throwing the curse off. I think Hermione was able to throw it off as well - though not as easily as Harry. But it is shown on page that Ron is much more susceptible to things like that than Harry and Hermione were.

Actually, it was the locket. Yes, Ron is a very insecure person and those fears were his own fears. However, the locket was more than just a catalyst. The locket was shown to affect all of them negatively. They all became more irritable and negative feelings were compounded by wearing it. Ron was affected more strongly because - unlike Harry and Hermione - Ron is more openly emotional. He is more susceptible to things like that. We also see that with his reaction to Veela. It was easier for that piece of soul to worm it's way in and use Ron's existing insecurities and fears against him.
That's not true. Hermione and Harry are pretty emotional. What about when Hermione freaks out at Harry in GoF and says something like, "I'm not your owl!" And then she sets those charm birds on Ron. And she's horribly cold to him when he's dating Lavander. And in DH, when Ron returns, she almost hexes him into oblivion. She's just as, if not, more emotional, being a girl. And Harry's pretty emotional too. Does the whole Dumbledore scene in OoTP escape you? He tried to destroy Dumbledore's office! And when Hermione and Ron were skeptical about Sirius, Harry was freaking out and shouting. His emotions were very raw in that book. He learned to control them more as time went on, but he's still a very raw person. One of his flaws is that he is so emotional and hot-headed at times. So I don't buy that Ron's more emotional, or that he was more susceptible to the locket.

If anything, Harry should be the most susceptible. He had all the fears, doubts, guilt, and knowledge hanging over his head. Ron only had fear and hurt that he was being left out. And his fear was of dying or his family dying. Harry had the fear of everyone in the Wizarding World dying because of him. He had the fear of failing the prophecy and failing his friends. He had the guilt of multiple deaths on his shoulder. He had the doubts of not being good enough, of not doing the right thing. He faced so much and had so much still facing him, but we never saw him throw his hands up and leave. He could have just walked away. It was too much to ask a 17 year old. But he didn't. Ron didn't have half the pressures Harry did.

But you are right about one thing. The locket did not make Ron leave. Harry made Ron leave. The locket exacerbated his insecurities and fears and caused him to lash out. But Ron left because Harry told him to leave.
A true friend wouldn't have left though. A stronger friend would have stayed and tried to work it out.

The locket was a huge part of that for all of them. And Jo made it clear on page that as soon as Ron was away from the locket's influence he realized that he was wrong and wanted to go back.
He wanted to go back because he heard Hermione's voice, not any great love for Harry.

I can't understand why people are so upset at Ron and can't forgive him. Honestly, nobody is perfect, and I commend Jo for having the guts to write such a flawed character. You would think that after all the books Ron would have gotten over his insecurities but guess what, he hadn't, which is completely realistic.
I can't forgive him because he is too flawed. He never grows up or matures, in my opinion. I used to dislike Harry more than I should since he was a main character (because I saw him as immature), but in DH, he really stepped up to the plate and visibly matured. Now he's my favorite character. If Ron had showed some maturity, maybe.

I don’t remember Hermione having any special kind of resistance to magical temptation. Does she ever show any? (Honest question.) The veela’s didn’t affect her, but then they only seem to affect men so I don’t see that as proof of an innate ability to ward off powerful magic.

Hermione tends to keep her emotions to herself. We see her breakdown in PoA from the stress of her workload and the loss of her friends, particularly, I think, Ron. In GoF she breaksdown because of Ron's attitude. In HBP Ron and Lavender, need I say more there. Her personality is more logical than emotional. Her emotions come into play where Ron is concerned. Ron is the emotional/physical part of the trio. Body (Ron) Mind (Hermione) Spirit (Harry).

Its not about magical temptations. Hermione doesn't have the self-esteem doubts that Ron has. She is first in her class, the "smartest witch of her age" etc. She gets plenty of feedback regarding her abilities. Now Ron doesn't. What's his comment in DH? "Always the tone of surprise". He expects people not to expect much from him.

People with self-esteem problems are the ones that fall to peer pressure. They are extremely easy to confuse and manipulate. Ron was acting on his feelings (how he felt) rather than acting on what he knows. Voldemort's soul, which breeds discontent, would affect Ron more than the other two.

I was shocked by his leaving. I felt this was a sign that Hermione was now in greater danger of being killed off. I thought it was Jo's way of putting some space between him and Hermione since they'd been spending all that time together. I thought any time they'd climb up in a bunk and.... But if it's true that they didn't even kiss until the Battle of Hogwarts then this would have been unlikely.

But, I'd also agree with what was said about his motive: his insecurity combined with the presence of the Horcrux.

Yes, we know Ron is already insecure-- that's why the locket had a more significant effect on him than the others. So by saying that he left because he was insecure is basically the same as saying that it was because his insecurities made him vulnerable to the locket's influence. It's essentially the same thing. But I don't think you can just rule out the locket's impact since Jo specifically had Ron wearing it at during the big fight and had him throw it off when he left, after which he was immediately regretful.

As for his family, it's not the biggest issue for him but its one more thing that makes him an easy target. Hermione obviously took very serious precautions with her parents so that at least she knows they're SAFE (even if its in Australia, which I don't believe Voldemort has much influence. If Britain was fairly oblivious about Grindelwald as Krum said, I doubt Voldemort's power stretches farther than even mainland Europe if he's lucky.) And she said if she survives, they'd be back right away. The Dursleys are under special protection, though I don't know how much Harry thinks about them. Almost everyone in Ron's family is in the Order and constantly in danger-- if nothing else, it's one more thing that distracts him from their 'mission'.

And how could Ron honestly believe his insecurities about Harry and Hermione without some outside nudge. When the locket opens and he sees the Riddle-Harry/Hermione, he seems terrified. I think, without the locket, he would know that Harry's feelings are for Ginny alone and Harry would never betray both his best friend and his best friend's sister. The locket seemed to have removed his sense of rationality from him. Even though they acted on REAL fears he had, he wouldn't react like that unless his common sense was altered.

Book 5 or even Book 6 Harry probably would've been easy to manipulate as well-- but by DH, he's already told what he needs to do and he's had enough time to think it through. His mind is set on his mission. There's nothing to manipulate at this point. Hermione; well, she's never exactly been lacking in compliments. She's always been the smart one and she knows what her function is in the group. Sure, they both have momentary lapses of locket influence, but it doesn't get to them as much cause there's not as much to get to.

I don't know-- some people are going to dislike Ron no matter what he does, maybe as a way to justify why Hermione should've ended up with Harry instead. He was wrong to leave, but we can't just label him disloyal for a lapse in judgment. After all, he showed great remorse almost right away and tried looking for them, came back to save Harry and retrieved the sword. A disloyal friend would have just left and never looked back. The thing with Ron is, yeah, he does stupid things sometimes; but he always pulls through in the end. He admits his mistakes and comes back-- that's the important thing.

The weird aspect about Ron's character is that he got most of his shining moments at the beginning of the series, where Jo established him as the loyal best friend (Chess scene in SS, Chamber of Secrets, defending Harry in PoA). Actually I would say his most stand-out moment, up until DH, is the Chess scene in Sorcerer's Stone, where he showed great courage, tactical skill and composure. To give Ron his big scene that early on in the series makes him look more immature later one when he kind of lags behind the other two.

Doesn't being more susceptible to things like Veela and the locket show Ron to be weak of mind? And isn't weak-minded another way of saying cowardly?

Harry has just as many things to be insecure about as Ron, if not more so, and yet Harry would never let anything keep him away from his friends if they were in danger or needed his help.

What I liked about Ron's absence in DH (and this is in retrospect, because I was devastated when actually reading it the first time) is that it illuminated (ha, ha!) the symbolism behind the Deluminator, and Dumbledore's decision to give it to Ron. It's not just that Dumbledore knew that Ron would always want to come back (such a touching line). It's that when Ron left, the light went out of Harry and Hermione's lives. Resorting to Phineas Nigellus for company? What a truly miserable state of affairs. You can see it in the setting for the chapters during Ron's absence: winter leading up to Christmas, when the days are getting shorter and the nights are getting darker. The Deluminator brings Ron back a couple of days after Christmas, as the nights start shrinking again.

I have to agree with Blackcatsmeow.

Ron did not leave because of the locket, or Harry, because he's more emotional, or because there wasn't enough of a plan. Ron left because he still believed what his insecurities were telling him. Yes, the locket horcrux affected all of them. But Ron was the one who left, solely because of the insecurities he still had not mastered. Dumbledore knew this would be a problem for Ron, probably from the time he knew what Ron saw in the Mirror of Erised.

Ron was still giving power to his insecurities by believing they could be true. Even after Ron returned, and clearly knew what the locket would try to do to him, he was susceptible until he forced himself to reject his fears long enough to destroy the locket. The destruction of the locket was symbolic for Ron, finally reaching the point of choosing what he knew over what he feared.

What I liked about Ron's absence in DH (and this is in retrospect, because I was devastated when actually reading it the first time) is that it illuminated (ha, ha!) the symbolism behind the Deluminator, and Dumbledore's decision to give it to Ron. It's not just that Dumbledore knew that Ron would always want to come back (such a touching line). It's that when Ron left, the light went out of Harry and Hermione's lives. Resorting to Phineas Nigellus for company? What a truly miserable state of affairs. You can see it in the setting for the chapters during Ron's absence: winter leading up to Christmas, when the days are getting shorter and the nights are getting darker. The Deluminator brings Ron back a couple of days after Christmas, as the nights start shrinking again.

It can also be argued that the Deluminator provided the light that Ron needed to see why he left, and that he wanted to go back. Note that it's Hermione's voice that comes out of the Deluminator and creates the blue light that enters Ron and shows him the way back. Ron literally needed to see the light.

It can also be argued that the Deluminator provided the light that Ron needed to see why he left, and that he wanted to go back. Note that it's Hermione's voice that comes out of the Deluminator and creates the blue light that enters Ron and shows him the way back. Ron literally needed to see the light.

I'll buy that explanation too. Which makes the Deluminator an extremely hard-working symbol, having all of these meanings packed in :)

What made me go along the other line of thought is that the gifts Dumbledore leaves to Harry (the Snitch) and Hermione (the undecipherable book) seem to speak to the roles they play in the trio. That implies that the Deluminator must also somehow be representative of Ron's role in the trio, and I just can't believe that he would be defined as "the guy that does a runner" (or for an infinitesimally kinder version, "Class of '98's Most Likely to Lose His Way").

Ron's leaving was a complete shock, so completely out of character for the 1st year student who sacrificed himself on the chessboard.

Ron's timely return was just too convenient and as he himself says, "That makes me sound a lot cooler than I was." True enough words for someone who would abandon his friends in a very dark time.

Interesting point is that the deilluminator was of no use until Hermione said Ron's name for the first time. Not only was Dumbledore smart enough to know Ron would leave, but he made sure he could not come back till Harry and Hermione were ready to face him.

Ron's the only real character in the books. Yes he has insecurities. Hermione burst into hysterics when she faced her boggart and it became McGonagall telling her she'd failed every exam. But she grew up confident because she was talented. Ron didn't even have that- everything is a struggle for him. And while he can face his most feared childhood trauma- spiders, with some measure of calm, the horcrux attacked the very few things he could rely on for stability, family and the friendship of Harry and Hermione. Of course he was susceptible to the locket.

Ron's timely return was just too convenient and as he himself says, "That makes me sound a lot cooler than I was." True enough words for someone who would abandon his friends in a very dark time.
As convenient as Snape finding them at about the same time? It wasn't his return that was cool, it was saving Harry's life instinctively because that's the kind of person he was underneath. Ron's bravery was proved in that he didn't become another Percy and was willing to admit mistakes much sooner, as soon as he got away from the horcrux's enchantment in fact. He spent days looking for them when he was given the means to. And in the hour of need, the Sword of Gryffindor picked him for showing valor. That says it all really.

Aw, I can definitely forgive him for what he did...reminds me of when Han left Luke and Leia at the end of A New Hope and came back and saved Luke :p that made it so much cooler...

I don't think Ron's weak, and his loyalty was never in question to me...he overcame his fears and insecurities which, like i've said before, speaks volumes about his loyalty and strength of character :tu:

Hee, I love Ron!!!

The second dissapointment in the book, after Dumbledore's revealed manipulation.

I know that it may have been the horcrux working too, but still...it's just like POA and GOF again, he turned against his best friends.

The locket exacerbated those fears. Harry and Hermione's behavior at that moment also exacerbated the situation. Ron lost his temper and lashed out because of the locket and Harry made him leave.

Very interesting debate you've all got going on here.Made for great reading.:)

What do you all think about the fact that he left Hermione too?If Harry made him leave why not stay for Hermione?

Very interesting debate you've all got going on here.Made for great reading.:)

What do you all think about the fact that he left Hermione too?If Harry made him leave why not stay for Hermione?To him it looked like Hermione had chosen Harry over him. She had denied to admit that she was frustrated with the lack of progress as well, and when Harry asked Ron to go and Ron asked Hermione if she would come with him, she refused. That would have just confirmed the fears Ron had about both of them.

Being away from the locket´s influence of course, he regretted his rash action and wanted to return. I think he still had these insecurities and fears, as we see when the locket taunts him, and he was aware of it. But he also immediately realized that supporting Harry in his quest was more important.

IT WAS NOT THE LOCKET!

This is probably going to be a long post so please stick with me.

Over and over again I have seen the reason “it was the Locket” given for Ron’s abandonment of Harry and Hermione. This is usually paired with “and JKR needed a way to let us know more about the what was going on in wirzarding world”. However I think both of these explanation are flawed, and do not fully take into account Ron’s character up until that point in the story.

Lets start off with taking the a closer look at the “it was Locket” explanation. First we have to consider what the locket was and what it wasn’t. The locket was a horcrux, one of the seven pieces of Voldemort’s soul. When Harry wore it for a long time it made him angry and disturbed. If this was the only thing we had to go on I could see why “it was the Locket” argument carries so much weight. But it isn’t. We know way more about horcruxes then this. We know way more about the locket then this. And most importantly we know way more about Ron Weasley then this.

Now before go farther lets look at what the Locket is not. The Locket is not the one Ring from Lord of the Rings, any more then Ron Weasley is Sam Gamgee. Sure there are some similarities between both, Sam and Ron are both sidekicks. Both the Ring and the Locket are ways that the bad guys of the series strive to insure power. But that is about where the similarities end for both.

The ring was a temptation because it granted power who ever wielded it. Great power, in the right hands complete power. Complete power corrupts completely. Horcruxes do not do this. They extend the life of the maker but that is pretty much it. Their power to corrupt and tempt is severely limited.

Horcruxes are also much less powerful. (One might speculate that is because the horcruxes we saw where merely 1/7th of Voldemort’s soul, while as the ring was completely Sauron’s life force. But I think it is merely different authors take on the concept.) Anyway horcruxes have much less of an ability to tempt or corrupt a mind. Harry WAS a horcrux after all. A piece of Voldemort of inside of him since he was one year old. If horcruxes where like the ring, Harry would not have been the hero of the story, but one of the villains.

But what about the diary I hear you the audience say. It MADE Ginny open the Chamber! That’s proof that the locket was responsible for Ron leaving. No it isn’t. In fact it proves or at least gives strong evidence to the contrary. The first bit of evidence that the diary was in fact not that strong is the fact that Malfoy had it in his position for many many years and never claimed it as his own. The fact that he gave it away shows it did not have that strong of a temptation/ corruption pull on its’ own.

Next lets look at the fact that even though it went into the hands of a naïve over protected 10-11 year old girl it still took months of her willing pouring her soul, completely oblivious it’s dangers, before it could corrupt her to the point of making her do anything. It took still months after that before it could make her do something against her will. And we still don’t really know how strong Riddle was when he came out it. All we know is that he decides to let the Basilisk do his dirty work, and that he is then killed by a 12 year old boy. It does not sound that powerful on it’s own. Granted it did terrible things, but that is only because it was placed in the hands of an unknowing child, who inadvertently supercharged it with her own soul, (and if we are to believe Rowlings) her own super powers.

Now let’s contrast that to the Locket and Ron. Ron was man who knew that it was a horcrux and that any emotional attachment could be devastating. He had seen battle, danger, and death. Unlike Ginny who had never been away from the shelter of her mother’s protection before. He did not pour his soul into it looking for a friend. He consciously knew what it was and that it would hurt him if it had the chance.

But I hear you the audience say, “the Locket made Harry angry and disturbed”. Let’s revisit that shall we. First we have to remember that Harry was himself a horcrux. That by wearing the locket he was putting two pieces of Voldemort’s soul very close together, doubling the trouble if you will. But also we have to remember that at the time Harry was wearing the Locket exclusively, and that they didn’t understand how it could affect them and so they did not have the proper mental guards in place. Also let us remember that as soon as Harry took it off it stopped working on him. It doesn’t affect him again that way even after Ron leaves and Harry and Hermione’s exposure to the locket is increased. So by itself the locket is not that powerful.

It did not have the power to make a perfectly loyal sidekick turn against his beloved friend and companion. (Even the Ring lacked that power, there is rarely power as strong as pure love in literature.) It might have, and probably did, expedite Ron’s betrayal (going AWOL in a time was war is treason) but it didn’t cause it, just as I’m sure the conditions they where living in accelerated the abandonment, hunger, thirst and fear are hard conditions to live in. But even with out the locket, or the less then ideal conditions the abandonment would have happened it probably only pushed it ahead by a few weeks, perhaps a month or so. Why? Because Ron’s love for Harry wasn’t pure.

He was not the selfless Sam sidekick that perhaps we sometimes wish he was. The reason the Ring failed to successfully tempt Sam in the Lord of the Rings is because Sam loved Frodo completely, purely, with out jealousy. Sam was content in his life, he didn’t want to be great, he would have been happy being a gardener of little historical consequence. He looked to Frodo to be the hero, he wanted Frodo to be the hero, because he, Sam sure as heck knew he wasn’t that.

The same can not be said about Ron. It is unquestionable that Ron loved Harry. But it was not purely. Ron’s love for Harry was strong, but also mired by doubt and jealously. Ron unlike, a Sam like sidekick, wanted to great, and he knew that no matter how great he was Harry would always be greater. Ron could never outshine Harry; he could never be the One. Nor could he stand being constantly in the large shadow that Harry cast. Ron wanted to be the hero, he wanted glory and recognition. But he also knew that if history remembered him at all it would be as Harry’s side note. Which grated on him. And so Ron relationship with Harry had a duality to it, a very real and very strong bond of love and friendship; but also an undercurrent of jealousy and bitterness.

Now add to this Ron’s temperament. Ron had a passionate temper. When he feels things he feels them completely, or at least very thoroughly. As far back as PoA we can see his temper is not just reserved for his enemies but also can be brought forth on his friends. And that once angered he can have a hard time letting go. I don’t think this is unique to him, others in his family seem to present it as well. Add to that a child’s egocentrism, (which I think Ron still posses to a greater degree then the others in the first part of DH) and you have not only a passionate temper but also bad one.

However his temper on its’ own was not strong enough, even with the Locket’s help to make Ron leave. What ever else he might have felt for Harry the strongest feeling where that of love and friendship. For the reason behind his leaving you have to really look closely not at his relationship with Harry (though feeling of being over shadowed is important) so much as his relationship with Hermione.

Hermione, a girl who has infatuated and frustrated him for so long. She is not just a girl, not just a friend, she is THE girl for him. I think that feeling unworthy of her, unsure of her feelings, had a lot to do with him leaving. For the first time the trio is totally alone for months at a time. There is no school not Quidditch, no anything; only them. They are on a mission, and Harry is the leader. Now there is no school to distract him, and he is bunking with object of his affection. And he has an idea that she might have feeling for him back, but no certainty.

If we think about what are Ron and Hermione likely to talk about when they are alone? Their feelings? No not likely. What ever chances of that happening died out when they fled the wedding. They are both scared, they both want the other to take the first step, and they are both not ready for it happen. Both want it, but neither is ready to be the first and open up. And no doubt passionate Ron is feeling the strain of it. He is aware now in a way he hasn’t been before of how he wants her. He knows he doesn’t love her as a sister, or as a friend. He knows he wants her romantically, but even though she is right there emotionally she is a million miles away. And the longer they stay like this the larger the distance, and the strain grow. And why? Harry.

What are Ron and Hermione likely to talk about when they are alone during this time. Horcruxes, Harry, and Voldemort. Both Voldemort and Horcruxes are subjects that naturally lead back to Harry. Reminders that Ron is not the one. More so Hermione is likely expressing worry over Harry. And I think it is during this time that Ron begins to wonder if Harry isn’t just the chosen one for the wizarding world, bur perhaps Harry is the chosen one for Hermione as well?

And now there is no school, no Quidditch, no brothers to distract him, now all he has in front of him is the fact that Hermione, his girl, loves Harry Potter. The one man he can never hope to outshine or out perform. She’s called him fanciable, she’s been rumored to be with his girlfriend before. Sure Rita Skeeter is a liar but what if she caught on to something Ron missed just this once? Isn’t Harry more like Krum (the one guy he knows she’s been in at least a sort of romantic relationship with) then Ron could ever hope to be?

Now of course we know that she loves Harry like a mix between a brother and child. That while Hermione loves Harry greatly, it has no romantic desires behind it. But Ron didn’t know that at that time. I think all he could think about was that she loved Harry Potter. What could Ron Weaslely have that Harry didn’t. What could he offer her that Harry couldn’t. Harry was richer then him, infinitely more famous, and now here he was acting the part of their fearless leader as they meandered around Great Britian. But what was worse is that Harry wasn’t even doing a good job at being leader and yet Hermione was still no doubt expressing concern and love for Harry when they talked.

From Ron’s perspective it’s would have gotten unbearable. His temper kept building and building, and eventually it was going to burst. Not because of the locket, but because of his own emotional baggage. And finally it does burst. And he can’t take it anymore, and he leaves.

No doubt in his anger when he left he was thinking about how he was leaving Harry to who could now become even more famous and accumulate even more glory; and Hermione to be Harry, she chose him after all. I doubt he is really thinking about the war the danger they are all in doesn’t feel real to him at the moment.

I think if left to his own devices, Ron would have stayed gone a couple of days to couple of weeks tops. He did after all love these two people deeply. And his wrath though great, still in his heart wrath came after his love for both of them..

But as soon as he leaves he runs straight into a reality check. He’s taken prisoner and has a giant hand slapped onto his forehead in an “oh yeah” moment. His insecurities are still there, but there is nothing like a reminder that your two best friends are being hunted like rabbits to make you not care about things like anger anymore. When he tries to return, they are gone.

Now he has an “oh NO.” moment. His friends are being hunted, and he can’t help them. They might die. Worse they might die thinking horribly of him. They might die thinking he didn’t care about them. Thinking that he was a awful person. And maybe even worse in Ron’s mind they might die when he could have saved them. All of this feeds his doubts about himself, his theories that Harry is the better man more deserving of the love he wants.

Finally they are reunited. And Ron has to face his doubts (which by this time have had quite a lot room to grow), the locket doesn’t have to be a super powerful thing, doesn’t have to magnify his doubts far beyond what they where, all it has to do is give them form. Which it does. And Ron, in a true show of character, defeats them both internally and externally.

Also he is reminded that though Harry might be the one to go down in history as the one. Ron has helped him get there. Harry isn’t his rival, he is the green eyed boy who shared snacks with him on the train that first year. Harry is family, and all that means to a Weasley, and a Gryffindor. Ron confronts what scared him most, not spiders, but being in the shadows, and he comes to peace with it.

So no it was not the Locket. It was not that JKR had to show us what was going on in the wizarding world (she could have done that in a hundred non magical and a thousand magical ways). It was Ron, which made Ron leave. It was the completion of journey of his character. And to be honest one of my favorite parts in the series, I think it was very well written. (And I have a fair few complaints about the JKR’s writing in this book.) Jo chose to write a much more complicated sidekick then Samwise Gamgee. Let’s not cheapen that.

This is a great post. It's better than most of the editorials at Mugglenet.

I was sooo disappointed in Ron when he bailed out on Harry and Hermione. This was supposed to be done as a team. It didn't matter if Harry didn't really have a plan, but three brains are better than one and I think that with enough patience, all three could have come up with something. When he left, all I could think about was GoF. It wasn't the first time he'd abandoned Harry in one of his most trying times. I was pretty upset and I don't/didn't blame Hermione for treating him the way she did when he came back. I thought of him as pretty unreliable at that point. However, I could tell that the horcrux was affecting Ron pretty harshly than the other two, but, in my book, it's not really that much of an excuse. :no:

I was sooooo shocked when he left!! I could not believe that he would desert Harry like that. I wonder how Ddore foresaw it happening? I mean he and Ron were ahrdly close were they so how would Ddore have understood his insecurities to this extent and known him well enough to know that Ron would have wanted to go back to them?
I think it worked out well though didnt it cos it made Ron see what was most important to him in the end, love and friendship

I also think his reasons were very weak.

1) "We thought you had a plan and that you knew what you're doing." Harry never said anything like that. And I didn't see Ron coming up with any great ideas.

2) "I'm hungry and want to know what's going on with my family." So, in the middle of a wizard full-on war, and a quest he chose to be a part of, despite Harry offering him the chance not to twice, he just feels like grabbing a bite to eat and hopping back home. After all he's been through in the 6 books before, with Harry and Hermione.

3) "I'm still jealous of Harry the Chosen one, and I think he likes Hermione". I would have thought Ron was over the Chosen one jealousy since GoF, or he hasn't matured at all. As for Hermione - Harry...please. Ron knows full well Harry is in love with Ginny. Instead of being Krum-my and Won-woning around, all he needed to do was have one good talk with Hermione. He has had plenty of time since Yule Ball.

I liked the fact that Ron left (dont slate me) but by that point i felt that he needed to. The locket had drained him so much of his own personality that he was believing (or being pocessed) something that he couldnt see where it kept its brain. The locket poisoned his mind with his final major obstacle to over come. His fear that he was second best again to Harry because Hermione was not in love with him (Ron). That as you can see crushed him and Dumbledore may have known that Ron would have abandoned them for some reason so that is why he gave it to Ron because he knew Ron would try to find his way back.

Which he did. IT was then that Ron managed to overcome his fear of being second best. I feel that Dumbledore did it on purpose so that for the rest of their journey he would no longer be afraid. And he wasn't.

yeah, i think we're supposed to keep in mind that the locket played a major role...otherwise i don't think jk would've included it. i mean, she didn't have to write in the fact that they took turns wearing it, right? she could have just as easily made ron walk out all by himself. i agree with what most people said. it amplified things he was already feeling, made everything worse. when he's explaining to harry why the locket is bad for him, you get how frustrated with himself he is for giving in to it.

The locket was powerful. It prevented Harry from conjuring a patronus, something only the real deaths of Fred, Tonks and Lupin could manage.

I still say it was the locket that broke the camel's back so to speak. Ron was already feeling every thing that has been mentioned. He has been feeling many of these insecurities for years. He has always been jealous of Harry, and he seems to have been suspicious of Harry and Hermione's relationship for awhile.

Being on their own for once, these insecurities would naturally become stronger. I do not doubt that there would have been an argument. But Ron is above all loyal. He knew the danger of the war, knew the danger his family was in, knew how important it was that Harry destroy the Horcruxes.

originally posted by Blackcatsmeow
But I hear you the audience say, “the Locket made Harry angry and disturbed”. Let’s revisit that shall we. First we have to remember that Harry was himself a horcrux. That by wearing the locket he was putting two pieces of Voldemort’s soul very close together, doubling the trouble if you will. But also we have to remember that at the time Harry was wearing the Locket exclusively, and that they didn’t understand how it could affect them and so they did not have the proper mental guards in place. Also let us remember that as soon as Harry took it off it stopped working on him. It doesn’t affect him again that way even after Ron leaves and Harry and Hermione’s exposure to the locket is increased. So by itself the locket is not that powerful.


Yes Harry was a horcrux. So it would affect him. But Harry isn't has open emotionally as Ron is. The horcrux only affected him when he was wearing it. But the book said that they were all more irritated when they were wearing it for 12 hour shifts. As in, Harry and Hermione both became more angry and disturbed by wearing it. Neither one of them is as openly emotional as Ron is. And both of them are focused on the mission. Harry because he has to be, and Hermione because she still believes Harry has a plan.

Ron is more openly emotional. He would be more obviously discouraged by the lack of progress. The locket is part of Voldemort, who has the power to "spread discord and enimity". Since Ron is so openly disappointed in Harry's leadership, Hermione's cooking, and he is fearful and hungry, etc, the locket found him to be easy target. A piece of Voldemort's enimty spreading soul would latch on to Ron's fears and doubts and increase them.

When the locket is off, Ron still has the insecurities. But then the horcrux is back on and he dwells on them again, increasingly becoming more and more irritated. It's becoming more obvious to him that Harry doesn't have a clue and that Hermione doesn't love him back. The locket continues to egg him on and it tears Ron up inside.

here is a quote (pg 307):
"Take off the locket Ron," Hermione said, her voice unusually high. "You wouldn't be talking like this if you hadn't been wearing it all day."

This quote shows that Ron was wearing the locket when he finally cracked. The locket did have an affect on Ron, it had an effect on all of them. Hermione knows Ron better than almost anyone. She knew Ron wouldn't say these things if he weren't under some other influence. And she also points out how long he had been under the influence. If he had just put it on, he probably wouldn't be saying these things either.

Ron throws down the locket, but his choice is already made and he is angry. He storms out of the tent and leaves. Once Ron is totally out of it's presence he regrets his decision. He tries to return to Harry and Hermione. When he finally finds Harry, look what he says: (pg 374)

"Because that thing's bad for me!" Ron said, backing away from the locket on the rock. "I can't handle it! I'm not making excuses, Harry, for what I was like, but it affects me worse than it affected you and HErmione, it made me think stuff - stuff I was thinking anyway, but it made everything worse, I can't explain it, and then I'd take it off and I'd get my head on straright again, and then I'd have to put the effing thing back on--I can't do it Harry!"

Unless you are suggesting that Ron is lying to Harry to get back into his good graces, I see no reason to doubt Ron's word. The locket affected him. He was feeling the things anyway, but the locket made everything so much worse. The locket was the reason Ron became angry and left. The locket didn't push him out the door, he had already taken it off by then, but it made him angry and irritated enough to abandon them.

So, yes, IT WAS THE LOCKET!!!!!

i honestly think that if he hadn't been so affected by the locket he wouldn't have left. he said it himself, he didn't have his head on straight. i know he was thinking all that stuff to begin with, but if he had been in his right mind - if he had been himself - he would have checked himself, told himself what was more important, which he does - somewhat belatedly :p - after he's distanced himself from the locket.

Ron was worried about the Harry and Hermione connection. Hermione loves Harry, but not in a romantic way, as a friend/brother.....but Ron couldn't see that! I think he thought he'd lost her, just when he'd found her...and then the Horcrux drove in the knife!

Originally posted by kitkatcake1988
The weird aspect about Ron's character is that he got most of his shining moments at the beginning of the series, where Jo established him as the loyal best friend (Chess scene in SS, Chamber of Secrets, defending Harry in PoA). Actually I would say his most stand-out moment, up until DH, is the Chess scene in Sorcerer's Stone, where he showed great courage, tactical skill and composure. To give Ron his big scene that early on in the series makes him look more immature later one when he kind of lags behind the other two.

I agree completely. Jo's development of Ron has always intrigued me. He was promised so much as a character in the first few books then seemed to have taken turn not exactly to the worst but to become much less heroic than the earlier materials have us anticipated. His insecurity became such a big issue that it overshadowed his accomplishment and gift, such as loyalty and strategic mind. Saving Harry's life is of course a hugh thing but coming after his abandonment, that feels like an atonement more than anything else. Ron's character seems more lackluster when compared to the way Neville was developed. In my opinion, Neville had a bigger insecurity's and self-esteemed issue than Ron and yet he circumvented all that and became a true hero, as much a hero as Harry. he became de facto leader of the rebel in Harry's absence, faced Voldemort even when he realized Harry had died, and destroyed Nagini as Harry asked him to. I am a little disappointed in Ron or the way Jo developed him to be exact.

no, the character hasn't regressed. what jk has done with ron is brilliant. instead of giving us yet another lame sidekick in a long sad tradition of lame sidekicks, she gives us a more complex, satisfying character in ron.

for instance, she lays the groundwork for his loyalty early on, like you said...but he's still a kid then, still pretty innocent ;) i think ron's jealousy sort of creeps up on him as he gets older. i don't think he goes around consciously telling himself, oh i wish i was harry, he gets all the glory. ron's doesn't strike me as an angsty, brooding kind of guy...he's rash, he doesn't hold back, he wears his heart on his sleeve...it gets him into trouble, haha. i mean, say what you want about ron, but he loves harry, there's no denying that ;) i really don't think he carries that grudge around. it's just that once in a while - an intense, volatile situation, for instance, like what happened in the tent - that monster in him rears its ugly head and takes him by surprise.

i actually like that jk introduced this other, darker aspect of ron...sure we love our friends, but what if we're flawed enough to want what they have, to be as good as they are? does that make us any less loyal, does that mean we love them any less? i mean, that's something you'd really have to battle with, overcoming the lesser aspects of yourself. and ron does that. because he loves his friends.

i like that jk put a strain (or strains) on their friendship and had it survive, stronger for having been tested. that, to me, makes ron's loyalty even more beautiful to read about.

and if we're talking about courage...how is diving into a pool of ice-cold water to save your best friend not brave? ;)

I didn't think it was very much in character. Ron was supposed to be over all those insecurities as early as GoF. It was sort of like repeating the GoF scenario. I suppose I had come to expect unwavering loyalty by both of them, and in a way, they both did show it, even with Ron walking out on them. I just found it unnecessary, Ron's character was developing fantastically without that breach. I loved Ron in DH, by the way.

i actually like that jk introduced this other, darker aspect of ron...sure we love our friends, but what if we're flawed enough to want what they have, to be as good as they are? does that make us any less loyal, does that mean we love them any less? i mean, that's something you'd really have to battle with, overcoming the lesser aspects of yourself. and ron does that. because he loves his friends.

i like that jk put a strain (or strains) on their friendship and had it survive, stronger for having been tested. that, to me, makes ron's loyalty even more beautiful to read about.

and if we're talking about courage...how is diving into a pool of ice-cold water to save your best friend not brave? ;)

I also think that this is an excellent example of forgiveness, both giving and receiving. All the talk that LV's followers (and himself) give about LV being "merciful" then he tortures them. Harry is the merciful one because he forgives.

Ron acts like a jerk (don't we all at times?) Humbles himself and asks forgiveness. Ron could have stayed prideful and not gone back but he didn't. Its takes much courage for a man to admit he's wrong.

For those people who hate Ron for leaving and in your opinion not being loyal: I ask you, are you perfect? Do your ever make mistakes? Have you ever been in a situation where you needed to ask forgiveness? And if someone has wronged you have you forgiven them?

I think that those of us who have been on both ends of needing to be forgiven and needing to forgive understand this incident for what it is. A lesson in forgiveness.

I was so upset when Ron left. I was devastated.

I was reading this part really late at night and was so frustrated, I actually put the book down to go to sleep. I was so relieved when he came back and saved Harry.

I wasn't surpried that Ron leftt. The three of them were under a lot of stress. Imagine being 17, away from your family, trying to find these objects and you don't know where they are and you don't know what all of them look like, you have one hanging around your neck every 24 hours which makes you even more sad and depressed, and you don't know how to distroy it. Tempers can flare in this kind of situation. We've all done things while we were angry that we regret as soon as we have calmed down. Ron was angry and upset. They all were. In that kind of high stress situation, tempers will flare, things will be said. Ron got angry and left. He said so himself he regretted it as soon as it happened. As soon as he calmed down enough to realize what he had done, he realized he was being stupid. He even went to go look for them as soon as he could, he just couldn't find them.

I think Dumbledore knew them well enough to know that at some point Ron was going to get upset and do something rash. Dumbledore wouldn't have said it was alright for Harry to share the information about the horocruxes with Ron and Hermione unless he knew they could keep the secert. DD knew that Harry wouldn't have been able to complete this task on his own. He knew that Harry needed Ron and Hermione to help. When Harry first came to Hogwarts and started hanging out with Ron and Hermione, Dumbledore probably observed the other two and found out about them. DD obviously had a plan for Harry. Friends shape us as a person. It only seems natuaral that DD would have found a way to seperate Harry from the other two if he didn't think them good enough for Harry. DD was a smart man. He knew that he could trust Ron and Hermione. He also know them as people, about thier insecurities, and who they were as people. DD knew that Ron could be hot headed in certain situatiations. That is why DD left Ron the way to get back. I don't think he thought Ron a weak person. I think he thought of Ron as a normal human being with natural feelings.

no, the character hasn't regressed. what jk has done with ron is brilliant. instead of giving us yet another lame sidekick in a long sad tradition of lame sidekicks, she gives us a more complex, satisfying character in ron.

for instance, she lays the groundwork for his loyalty early on, like you said...but he's still a kid then, still pretty innocent ;) i think ron's jealousy sort of creeps up on him as he gets older. i don't think he goes around consciously telling himself, oh i wish i was harry, he gets all the glory. ron's doesn't strike me as an angsty, brooding kind of guy...he's rash, he doesn't hold back, he wears his heart on his sleeve...it gets him into trouble, haha. i mean, say what you want about ron, but he loves harry, there's no denying that ;) i really don't think he carries that grudge around. it's just that once in a while - an intense, volatile situation, for instance, like what happened in the tent - that monster in him rears its ugly head and takes him by surprise.

i actually like that jk introduced this other, darker aspect of ron...sure we love our friends, but what if we're flawed enough to want what they have, to be as good as they are? does that make us any less loyal, does that mean we love them any less? i mean, that's something you'd really have to battle with, overcoming the lesser aspects of yourself. and ron does that. because he loves his friends.

i like that jk put a strain (or strains) on their friendship and had it survive, stronger for having been tested. that, to me, makes ron's loyalty even more beautiful to read about.

and if we're talking about courage...how is diving into a pool of ice-cold water to save your best friend not brave? ;)Beautifully said, mick. Great post, I agree with what you said.

And I agree with Quicksilver. Besides everything else, it was also about forgiveness. And Harry and Hermione do forgive. Nineteen years later, one is still best friends with Ron (at least that´s the vibe I get from the epilogue) and the other is happily married with Ron, having kids (as well, this is the vibe I get from the epilogue).

In a way I think Ron´s leaving was not so much an abandonment as a necessary move for Ron to really come to himself. And it is certainly worth some kudos to JKR that she has given each of the sidekicks their own coming-of-age storyline.

I didn't find Ron's departure to be totally surprising. Part of Ron's character arc has been his ongoing struggle to overcome his insecurities; this was just one more part of that. Exacerbated by the locket, of course.

What is important is not Ron leaving, but his coming back. Remorse and forgiveness are very much a part of what brings Voldemort down, and I thought JKR illustrated their power extremely well in how she wrote Ron's return.

I was miffed at Ron for that and until he came back I stayed that way. I think Ron just needed to get away for a while and regroup. I don't know where he got it in his head that Harry would automatically know where each of the horcruxs were and how to destroy them, but I thought it would have been obvious that the journey to discover them was part of Harry's final training. He didn't have all he needed just yet, so the search was time well spent for the 3 of them.

Of course it was the locket. It was pretty darn obvious.

originally posted by mick
no, the character hasn't regressed. what jk has done with ron is brilliant. instead of giving us yet another lame sidekick in a long sad tradition of lame sidekicks, she gives us a more complex, satisfying character in ron.

for instance, she lays the groundwork for his loyalty early on, like you said...but he's still a kid then, still pretty innocent i think ron's jealousy sort of creeps up on him as he gets older. i don't think he goes around consciously telling himself, oh i wish i was harry, he gets all the glory. ron's doesn't strike me as an angsty, brooding kind of guy...he's rash, he doesn't hold back, he wears his heart on his sleeve...it gets him into trouble, haha. i mean, say what you want about ron, but he loves harry, there's no denying that i really don't think he carries that grudge around. it's just that once in a while - an intense, volatile situation, for instance, like what happened in the tent - that monster in him rears its ugly head and takes him by surprise.

i actually like that jk introduced this other, darker aspect of ron...sure we love our friends, but what if we're flawed enough to want what they have, to be as good as they are? does that make us any less loyal, does that mean we love them any less? i mean, that's something you'd really have to battle with, overcoming the lesser aspects of yourself. and ron does that. because he loves his friends.

i like that jk put a strain (or strains) on their friendship and had it survive, stronger for having been tested. that, to me, makes ron's loyalty even more beautiful to read about.

and if we're talking about courage...how is diving into a pool of ice-cold water to save your best friend not brave?

I agree completely. I don't see Ron as having become less heroic over the series. I think there are two reasons that we see all three of the trio shine so brightly in SS/PS. One of course, was to set up their charactes, and establish how each of them contributed to the success of all three. The other, was that it was the first book. What if Harry Potter had been a flop and the publishers hadn't let Jo write the sequel? Then the readers who had read the book would see that Ron is heroic and stragetic and loyal, and Hermione is smart, brave, etc. Once the book was a success and Jo was sure that she could keep writing the sequels, then the character arcs truly came into play.

But I don't think Ron became less heroic then he was in the chess match. In CoS he went into the Chamber with Harry to save his sister and confronted his worst fear, giant spiders, just for Hermione. In PoA, he pushed Harry out of the way of an attacking dog, and tried to stand between Harry and Sirius.

After the first three books, we see less of Ron shining, but we don't see him being less heroic. The deeds become more implied. In GoF, Ron's insecurities came to a front and we didn't see him confront a physical enemy. Instead, he dealt with emotional enemies and his friendship with Harry survived. Ron loyally supports Harry after the fight and keeps his bitterness to a minimum. In OotP, we see Ron stand by Harry, when most people walked away. He never doubts Harry's story, and stands with him against Umbridge and everything else, when it would have been far easier to follow Percy's advice. Then he goes to the Department of Mysteries with Harry. We don't see Ron shine here, but we see him take on the DE and survive, even if it was with scars. And no one can say that flying thousands of mile through apparently thin air doesn't take guts. In HBP, Ron's insecurities about Hermione come to the front this time. He is again battling with an emotional enemy. But he quickly realizes his mistake and tries to rectify it, although it takes awhile. He is one of the few DA members who are out battling the DE during the fight. We see him fighting one DE by himself, a DE who should be older and far more experienced then he is, yet he holds his own once again.

In DH, both his insecurities about Harry and Hermione come to a head, with the help of the locket which was increasing them and making them worse. He finally cracks and leaves. Once he is out of the locket's sphere of influence, he regrets his decision. And he comes back. He had just made the dumbest decision of his life, it took guts to come back. He had to know that Harry would very likely refuse to let him come back and that he may have blown any chance he had with Hermione. But he comes back, asks for forgiveness and restores the friendship. And he confronts the locket, defeating his insecurities once and for all.

Jo was brilliant the way she handled Ron's development. She had him as a knight in shining armor for three books, and then she developed his emotional demons. We didn't see Ron truly shine again until these demons were dealt with, but we were shown tiny glimpses of Ron's bravery and courage. It was very well written, and the scene where Ron defeats the horcrux is my favorite in the book, and one of my favorites of the whole series.

I want to say it was very satisfying to see how JKR treated Ron's insecurities in DH. The moment when Ron is poised with the sword over the locket (sort of like a knight facing a foe) and Harry sees the red light in Ron's eyes and wonders if the good is going to win over the bad... Well, that is good story telling.

But I also want to say that I agree with what some others have said about how JKR has treated Ron's character in the series. Most of Ron's moments of victory (escaping the Inquistion squad in OoTP or winning the Quidditch Cup) often took place off page, as though JKR didn't want us to see Ron being too successful. I'm not sure why she did this but I often found it very annoying. Almost all of Ron's failings were right there for everyone to see, but his virtues (other than his sense of humor) were often cloaked. Maybe it was her way of building up to telling a story concerning jealousy and forgiveness between friends.

It definitely gave plenty of ammunition to the H\Hr crowd during the shipping debates.:lol:

Of course, I think some of Ron's insecurities derive not just from being overshadowed be Harry, but the often dismissive attitiude of Hermione. She gets better after Ron nearly dies from poisoning, but up until the end of HBP Hermione often takes Ron for granted. I never felt this was as clearly pointed out about Hermione as compared to Ron's insecurities and failings. And her angry response at Ron's return, while understandable and very entertianing, is not very endearing. She mainly seemed mad that her pride had been wounded when he didn't return after she begged him to come back. She didn't want to hear that Ron had saved Harry's life or that Ron was able to find them only b\c he listened to her voice. Hermione can really hold a grudge. Of course, some of her anger is b\c she cannot openly admit her love for Ron, even when he had been obvious since the end of HBP.

Ron's comment that "all's fair in love and war...and this is a little of both", is pretty much on the mark. But it takes two to have a war, and Hermione was willing to oblige.:lol:

And all of this fed into what the locket showed Ron. Here was his friends saying that they don't need him. They were so much more superior to him that they were meant for each other and he was just a useless tag-along.

Of course, Harry had to go throught the same thing at diffeerent points throughout the series. Up until HBP Harry often questions whether he is just as bad as the Dark Lord.

I just don't recall Hermione going through anything like this, at least not on this scale. Maybe JKR just has some grudges against male insensitivity.:lol:

Of course, I think some of Ron's insecurities derive not just from being overshadowed be Harry, but the often dismissive attitiude of Hermione. She gets better after Ron nearly dies from poisoning, but up until the end of HBP Hermione often takes Ron for granted. I never felt this was as clearly pointed out about Hermione as compared to Ron's insecurities and failings. And her angry response at Ron's return, while understandable and very entertianing, is not very enduring. She mainly seemed mad that her pride had been wounded when he didn't return after she begged him to come back. She didn't want to hear that Ron had saved Harry's life or that Ron was able to find them only b\c he listened to her voice. Hermione can really hold a grudge. Of course, some of her anger is b\c she cannot openly admit her love for Ron, even when he had been obvious since the end of HBP.


Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.

That's not true. Hermione and Harry are pretty emotional. What about when Hermione freaks out at Harry in GoF and says something like, "I'm not your owl!" And then she sets those charm birds on Ron. And she's horribly cold to him when he's dating Lavander. And in DH, when Ron returns, she almost hexes him into oblivion. She's just as, if not, more emotional, being a girl. And Harry's pretty emotional too. Does the whole Dumbledore scene in OoTP escape you? He tried to destroy Dumbledore's office! And when Hermione and Ron were skeptical about Sirius, Harry was freaking out and shouting. His emotions were very raw in that book. He learned to control them more as time went on, but he's still a very raw person. One of his flaws is that he is so emotional and hot-headed at times. So I don't buy that Ron's more emotional, or that he was more susceptible to the locket.

As I clarified above, my point was that Harry is more introverted and Hermione is more controlled. Harry feels strong emotions, but he rarely lets anyone know what he is thinking or feeling - he keeps things to himself. Hermione has moments where she lets go - like the birds - but she is very controlled overall. The majority of the time you don't know what Hermione is feelings - which was a lot of the reason the shipping debates went on so long. Hermione is also more logical and practical by nature and would be less susceptible to magical influences.

Ron - in contrast - is more open with his emotions. He's not introverted like Harry or controlled like Hermione. He wears his heart on his sleeve and there is never any doubt as to what he is feeling.

If anything, Harry should be the most susceptible. He had all the fears, doubts, guilt, and knowledge hanging over his head. Ron only had fear and hurt that he was being left out. And his fear was of dying or his family dying. Harry had the fear of everyone in the Wizarding World dying because of him. He had the fear of failing the prophecy and failing his friends. He had the guilt of multiple deaths on his shoulder. He had the doubts of not being good enough, of not doing the right thing. He faced so much and had so much still facing him, but we never saw him throw his hands up and leave. He could have just walked away. It was too much to ask a 17 year old. But he didn't. Ron didn't have half the pressures Harry did.

Ron didn't have the same pressures - that is true. However, the difference between Ron and Harry was always in confidence. Harry had more confidence in himself and he realized early on that it was not his fault - it was Voldemort who had caused all that pain.

Ron's fears were a lot more intimate than Harry's worry for people dying because of him. Ron's fears had to do with his own self worth whereas Harry's were all about what Voldemort would do because of him. The locket didn't really have anything to use against Harry because he wasn't questioning himself. We saw that with the diary and Ginny as well. The diary was able to take hold of Ginny using her own insecurities against her. And, like Ron, Ginny came out of that experience more confident in herself.

A true friend wouldn't have left though. A stronger friend would have stayed and tried to work it out.

The same holds true for Harry though. A true friend wouldn't have told him to leave. A stronger friend would have asked them to stay and work it out.

The locket had a negative impact on all of them and caused them all to do things they wouldn't have done normally.

He wanted to go back because he heard Hermione's voice, not any great love for Harry.

That is incorrect. Ron wanted to go back immediately because - once he was away from the locket - he realized that he was wrong. Before he could return, he was delayed by the snatchers and, by the time he got back to where they had been, Harry and Hermione had already left. Ron went to Bill and Fleur's cottage because he didn't know how to find Harry and Hermione at that point.

Hearing Hermione's voice gave Ron the means to find them. It was Hermione who said Ron's name. If it had been Harry, the result would have been the same. Ron had decided to go back immediately, but he didn't know he could use the Deluminator to find them. Once he figured that out, he went back.

I can't forgive him because he is too flawed. He never grows up or matures, in my opinion. I used to dislike Harry more than I should since he was a main character (because I saw him as immature), but in DH, he really stepped up to the plate and visibly matured. Now he's my favorite character. If Ron had showed some maturity, maybe.

I would have to disagree. Ron has flaws - just like they all do. But he is not "too flawed". Ron grew up and matured a great deal over the course of the series. The final step in his maturation was facing his deepest emotional fears and destroying the locket. Ron confronted those fears and defeated them.

I think - as darklordspal pointed out - the problem is that a great deal of Ron's maturing happens off page with Harry being told about it later. That's the problem with a single protagonist narrative overall. We have to depend on Harry's observations to determine what is going on with the other characters. For some, that was a bad thing because they chose to ignore the evidence towards other characters' development. And that is particularly true with Ginny and Ron. Everything we need to know is given to us, but you have to be willing to look for it and take the time to think about what that character was going through. That is difficult with a single protagonist narrative - but not impossible.

The weird aspect about Ron's character is that he got most of his shining moments at the beginning of the series, where Jo established him as the loyal best friend (Chess scene in SS, Chamber of Secrets, defending Harry in PoA). Actually I would say his most stand-out moment, up until DH, is the Chess scene in Sorcerer's Stone, where he showed great courage, tactical skill and composure. To give Ron his big scene that early on in the series makes him look more immature later one when he kind of lags behind the other two.

I will agree with this because it's exactly how I feel and it's one of the ways this book disapointed me. I would've liked to see more Book 1 Ron and I really thought this was what I was going to get when I first started reading the book. With his statement to Harry after DD's funeral that they'd go with him, Tonks mentioned how impressed she was with his stunning spells, he gotten over his fear of saying Voldermort and used it, even in a joke and he had made preparations for going away with Harry (funny note that he remembered the healers/wizards in the portraits at St Mungo's saying he had a mild case of spattergoit(sp?) which would get worst as he got older). All the signs for Book 1 Ron were there.

But then it's like somewhere after that setup, JKRowling changed her mind and took Ron back to Book 4 Ron, where he's whiny, insecure, crying over food and petty. And yes, I can understand the horcrux affected him and all but I'm more annoyed with the fact that I was expecting Ron to be written better and he just wasn't. JMHO.

I thought Ron's departure was important for JRK to add to the story because it really deepened his character. Ron has always felt like he was second best to Harry and I think after months of following Harry around aimlessly he got fed up. It wasn't until Ron left that he realized exactly what he left behind. I think there was a line in the book where Ron said he just left and then moments later he wanted to return. Personally, I think it took Ron leaving for him to realize just how important it was for him to be there. Hence the returning scene where he saves Harry.

That is incorrect. Ron wanted to go back immediately because - once he was away from the locket - he realized that he was wrong.
I have to disagree with you a bit here. Ron took the locket off in the tent. We know from the beginning that taking off the locket brings virtually an instant change in effect (even for Harry, who was dealing with 2 pieces of Voldemort's soul, was amazed at how immediate the change was).

Ron had to at least move out of the protected area in order to disapparate. Hermione followed Ron out of the tent immediately, calling for him. Ron didn't disapparate right away, or he would not have heard Hermione calling for him. And this was never discussed between Harry & Ron, so Ron actually was still in the area when Hermione was begging him to come back.

"I came running after you! I called you! I begged you to come back!"
"I know" Ron said, "Hermione, I'm sorry, I'm really ---"


So Ron did not immediately want to come back, and it can't be attributed to being caused by the locket. It was that Ron believed his fears were true. This is further confirmed when Ron hears Riddle's words from the locket -- he's paralyzed, because he gives them credence -- and goes to the edge of being possessed by the horcrux (glint of red in his eyes).

In the end, of course, Ron's character wins out over his fears & insecurities, and he not only shatters the reflection of Riddle in the locket, but his own flawed image of himself as well. But while the locket may have made things more difficult for Ron, they didn't create the fears, they were always Ron's, even without the locket (which Ron says after he comes back).

I think the locket did the funky magic trick that the dairy did to Ginny. like how Ginny told the dairy all her sercrts and kind of depended on on the dairy. I don't think that the locket possesed ron but when ron was thinking that there is something between harry and herminoe then the locket would encourage that feeling and make him feel even worse. I guess that drove ron out of the tent and made him go away but as soon as he left the locket he relised it was wrong...

I have to disagree with you a bit here. Ron took the locket off in the tent. We know from the beginning that taking off the locket brings virtually an instant change in effect (even for Harry, who was dealing with 2 pieces of Voldemort's soul, was amazed at how immediate the change was).

Ron had to at least move out of the protected area in order to disapparate. Hermione followed Ron out of the tent immediately, calling for him. Ron didn't disapparate right away, or he would not have heard Hermione calling for him. And this was never discussed between Harry & Ron, so Ron actually was still in the area when Hermione was begging him to come back.

"I came running after you! I called you! I begged you to come back!"
"I know" Ron said, "Hermione, I'm sorry, I'm really ---"


So Ron did not immediately want to come back, and it can't be attributed to being caused by the locket. It was that Ron believed his fears were true. This is further confirmed when Ron hears Riddle's words from the locket -- he's paralyzed, because he gives them credence -- and goes to the edge of being possessed by the horcrux (glint of red in his eyes).

In the end, of course, Ron's character wins out over his fears & insecurities, and he not only shatters the reflection of Riddle in the locket, but his own flawed image of himself as well. But while the locket may have made things more difficult for Ron, they didn't create the fears, they were always Ron's, even without the locket (which Ron says after he comes back).

I agree that the fears in general were Ron's to begin with - I never said that the locket created them. But the locket played on those fears and exacerbated the situation. It had that affect on all of them - even when they were not wearing it. It just affected Ron more strongly than Harry or Hermione. And because it affected him so much more, it didn't really matter if he was wearing it or not. The locket had taken hold of him and forced him to dwell on fears that he knew were irrational and untrue. He had to get away from the locket all together before he came to his senses. And that is exactly what happened.

I wanted to come back the minute I'd Disapparated, but I walked straight into a gang of Snatchers, Hermione, and I couldn't go anywhere!

I won't post the whole page of dialog there, but Ron goes on to tell them how he got away from the Snatchers and that, by the time he had gotten back to the campsite, Harry and Hermione had already left. He had no way to track them that he knew of at that point so he went to Bill and Fleur's.

But that is what I was referring to. The minute he'd Disapparated - and was away from the influence of the locket - he realized he was wrong and wanted to go back. The Snatchers prevented him from doing so and the delay resulted in him not getting back until after Harry and Hermione had left.

I think it is made very clear on page that the locket was affecting Ron worse than Harry or Hermione. Whether he was wearing it or not, he was affected by it - although it was much worse for him when he was wearing it. If they had been able to destroy the locket immediately, that situation never would have happened. However, it was important to the story and Ron's character development for that situation to occur so he could confront those fears and defeat them once and for all.

Ron leaving did not make me like him any less. All through the books Ron showed vulnerabilities and I think his leaving and wanting to come right back showed signs of maturing and a glimpse of why he is in Gryffindor. Agreed, the locket was affecting him and made him react badly to things that he was already worring about. He shouldn't have ran out, however he did bring back some valuable information about the Voldemort taboo, Potterwatch and snatchers. I think his leaving was an interesting way to convey information of the wizarding world and to have his character face his insecurities and come out on top. Plus would it be correct to assume Harry has a life debt to Ron now?

I agree that the fears in general were Ron's to begin with - I never said that the locket created them. But the locket played on those fears and exacerbated the situation. It had that affect on all of them - even when they were not wearing it. It just affected Ron more strongly than Harry or Hermione. And because it affected him so much more, it didn't really matter if he was wearing it or not. The locket had taken hold of him and forced him to dwell on fears that he knew were irrational and untrue. He had to get away from the locket all together before he came to his senses. And that is exactly what happened.

*snip*

I won't post the whole page of dialog there, but Ron goes on to tell them how he got away from the Snatchers and that, by the time he had gotten back to the campsite, Harry and Hermione had already left. He had no way to track them that he knew of at that point so he went to Bill and Fleur's.

But that is what I was referring to. The minute he'd Disapparated - and was away from the influence of the locket - he realized he was wrong and wanted to go back. The Snatchers prevented him from doing so and the delay resulted in him not getting back until after Harry and Hermione had left.

:agree: By the time Ron cracked, the locket had a firm hold on him and had made him irrationally angry. Taken it off wouldn't have made him instantly calm. In fact, I believe when Ron comes back and he explains his actions to Harry, he says something like, "then I would take it off and get my head back on straight and then have to put it back on again." My bet would be that the more of a hold it got, the longer it took Ron to get his head back on straight, especially since the locket would never be very far away from him.

But the minute he was truly out of it's sphere of influence, he wanted to go back. Once away from it, he realized he had made a huge mistake but was prevented from going back immediately. And when he finally could it was too late.

It seemed that just being in the locket's presence made the trio more irritable, but wearing it was the most effective. Wearing it made Ron so angry he lashed out, but being near it made Harry angry enough to shout back. So for Ron to truly be over it's influence, he had to be far away.

After reading that part of the book, I wasn't too surprised at this, since the locket had that strong effect on him. Now, if he hadn't been wearing the locket, and he did this, then it would've surprised me. The locket just made him insecure, and he probably just needed to take a breather.

You know, when you're upset with someone or over something, you sometimes just want to be alone with your thoughts, or to just get away for a while. Harry's done this loads of times. The fact that Ron said he was going to come back immediately after he left, but was unable to, shows this to me. He needed to "fume" and get away from those two. If anything, this was showing to be realistic and that the locket's negative powers just affect Ron most. I agree that for him to "get over" it, he had to be away from it to get his head straight.

i agree that a lot of ron's great moments occur off the page, and that this is due to the narration, the point of view from which jk chose to tell her story. doesn't make me like ron any less (obviously ;) ).

I think that the deluminator was kind of a just in case kind of thing, because they have been known to argue.

My bet would be that the more of a hold it got, the longer it took Ron to get his head back on straight, especially since the locket would never be very far away from him.

Agreed, that makes sense in Ron's case, it was cumulative for him.


I think that the deluminator was kind of a just in case kind of thing, because they have been known to argue.
JKR answered a question about the deluminator in her online chat. Here's the quote:
Sampotterish: Why did dumbledore want ron to keep his deluminator
J.K. Rowling: Because he knew that Ron might need a little more guidance than the other two.

Well, possibly DD was anticipating Ron to leave the trio to sort out his insecurities. After all, it is certainly natural for a teenage boy like Ron to have such thoughts because he was the youngest boy in a large family and best friend to one of the most famous boys in the wizarding world. Also, the locket didn't help matters much.

I think if Dumbledore really watched Harry as closely as he implied in OotP, Dumbledore had to have watched Ron and Hermione too. He understood how they interacted with each other and he knew that when he died, Harry would have to go on alone andthat it would be a very hard journey. Dumbledore must have known Ron would already have insecurities and that the circumstances would be hard for him. So he gave him the deluminator so that he would always be able to come back.

I must confess i hated ron when he left ,,but then when i read about the locket it all made sense,of course he started being a git before having the locket on,when he was hungry ,but after all his life hadnt been as harrys and he was having trouble dealing with this kind of preassure and hunger..again our heros are human and thets whats so great about them....they arenot perfect...

and in on part of the book jk had someone explainthat breaking frienships appart was one of voldemrots greatestes ways to opperate it was naturla that having a poece of voldemort so near it wuld affect the m all

I hated when ron left the group
i wondered for how long was ron going to be absent and if he was going to turn up dead at the end
luckily that didnt happen :cool:

but i have to admit that it was a great obstacklle for the book
and ron didnt leave by himself on his own account
the locket had alot to do with it
and since he said that the locket made him think things that he was already thinking then maybe he just moved out of the protected area on his own.
then he later realized what he had done and wanted to come back
perhaps he would have come back sooner if they mentioned him but seeing as that everytime ron was brought up hermione started crying then thats why he wasnt back sooner

and it really did help harry and hermione realize how much his freidnship is importnat to both of them

After reading that part of the book, I wasn't too surprised at this, since the locket had that strong effect on him. Now, if he hadn't been wearing the locket, and he did this, then it would've surprised me. The locket just made him insecure, and he probably just needed to take a breather.

You know, when you're upset with someone or over something, you sometimes just want to be alone with your thoughts, or to just get away for a while. Harry's done this loads of times. The fact that Ron said he was going to come back immediately after he left, but was unable to, shows this to me. He needed to "fume" and get away from those two. If anything, this was showing to be realistic and that the locket's negative powers just affect Ron most. I agree that for him to "get over" it, he had to be away from it to get his head straight.

I agree. I think Jo did a good job in showing how Ron was more susceptible to things like that - particularly with the Veela. And Ginny's experience with the diary is significant as well. The longer she was exposed to the diary, the stronger its hold on her was and eventually, that piece of soul was able to possess her and control her.

I think that is what was starting to happen with Ron. He wasn't actually possessed at that point, but the locket had taken a very strong hold on him and, if things hadn't come to a head that night, I think he would have eventually ended up being possessed and controlled by that piece of soul. Hermione's suggestion that they take turns wearing the locket was good in that it probably delayed that from happening, but it wouldn't have prevented it from happening completely because Ron was exposed to the locket repeatedly and each time it was worse for him.

I think that is shown in the moment he finally destroyed the locket as well. Harry saw that Ron's eyes had turned red. That piece of soul did try to possess him. But Ron had been away from the locket long enough to decrease the strength of the hold it had on him and he was able to fight it and destroy the locket anyway. He needed that time to get his head back on straight and build up the strength he would need to confront those personal demons and defeat them once and for all.

Characther growth, not really.

Ron was good in the first 3 books (with some grudge for the Crookshanks rants in book 3. Hermione apologised for Scabbers being "dead" and I don't remember him apologizing) After that it went downhill.

Who can forget the touching moment at the end of HBP in which Ron vows to stand by Harry's side? I was particularly moved when Ron said;

'We're with you whatever happens,' said Ron.

And yet Ron betrays Harry by turning his back on him and abandoning him. But I really didn't find it surprising at all in fact I had been expecting it to happen. Ron's combination of insecurity and jealousy of Harry has always been present. But it wasn't until HBP that we saw the jealousy of Harry get directed towards his relationship with Hermione. The jealousy blinded Ron into thinking that there was more going on with Harry and Hermione than there was. Here are some of the hints of this in HBP.


Hermione turned to Harry with a radiant expression and whispered, 'Did you really tell him I'm the best in the year? Oh, Harry!?'
'Well, what's so impressive about that?' whispered Ron, who for some reason looked annoyed. 'You are the best in the year - I'd've told him so if he'd asked me!'

Ron gets annoyed at any praise Hermione gives Harry. In short Ron is showing his jealousy.


'Oh, Come on, Harry,' said Hermione, suddenly impatient. 'It's not Quidditch that's popular, it's you! You've never been more fanciable.'
Ron gagged on a large piece of kipper. Hermione spared him one look of disdain before turning back to Harry.

Hermione has always been aware of Ron's jealousy issues with Harry, as she stated very clearly in GoF, hence the look of disdain. Again Ron is getting jealous of the praise Hermione is giving Harry.


'Everyone knows you've been telling the truth now, don't they? The whole wizarding world has had to admit that you were right about Voldemort being back and that you really have fought him twice in the last two years and escaped both times. And now they're calling you the "Chosen One" - well, come on, can't you see why people are fascinated by you?'
*snip*
'And you've been through all that persecution from the Ministry when they were trying to make out you were unstable and a liar. You can still see the marks where that evil woman made you write with your own blood, but you stuck to your story anyway...'
'You can still see where those brains got hold of me in the Ministry, look,' said Ron, shacking back his sleeves. Rather comical Ron's attempts become at trying to pry Hermione's attention away from Harry and onto himself. And that is the whole problem in a nutshell. Ron is always being overshadowed by Harry's fame and accomplishments. And now it's happening with Hermione (at least in Ron's mind).


'And it doesn't hurt that you've grown about a foot over the summer, either,' Hermione finished, ignoring Ron.
I'm tall,' said Ron inconsequentially. Again I have to laugh, but just more of the same. It was the repetitive nature of these comments that made me sense it was leading to trouble in DH.


And then Ron's suspicions were aroused when he walked in on a conversation Harry and Hermione were having when Harry confronted her on Confunding McLaggen;

'No,' said Harry. 'No, I suppose that's true. But wasn't that dishonest, Hermione? I mean, you're a prefect, aren't you?'
'Oh, be quiet,' she snapped, as he smirked.
'What are you two doing?' demanded Ron, reappearing in the doorway to the Great Hall and looking suspicious.

So in HBP we see that Ron is suspicious and jealous at moments about the closeness of Harry and Hermione. This of course is nothing to be concerned about and I think Harry said it best when he explained to Ron in DH that Hermione is like a sister to him. But we can't blame Ron for feeling jealousy as it's understandable, after all he is best friends with the most famous boy in the year. So Ron has grown used to people getting swept up in Harry's fame while they completely ignore Ron. It just so happens that we see this very same thing happen in HBP in the form of one Horace Slughorn.


It was as though Ron was not present; Slughorn did not so much as look at him.
*snip*
'I doubt you'll be alone, Ginny'll probably be invited,' snapped Ron, who did not seem to have taken kindly to being ignored by Slughorn.
JKR makes it a point to remain steady with Ron's character as one that gets shunted to one side in the presence of Harry and then becomes resentful.


'Listen, it's not my fault Slughorn invited Hermione and me to his stupid party, neither of us wanted to go, you know!' said Harry, firing up.
'Well, as I'm not invited to any parties,' said Ron, getting to his feet again, 'I think I'll go to bed.'
He stomped off towards the door to the boys' dormitories, leaving Harry and Hermione staring after him.
Ron's insecurities cause him to stomp off, leaving Harry and Hermione staring after him... very similar to DH. :cool:


'Unlucky again!' cried Slughorn dramatically. 'Ah, well .... you can't evade me forever, Harry!'
And with a regal wave he waddled out of the shop, taking as little notice of Ron as though he had been a display of Cockroach Cluster.
*snip*
They're even quite fun sometimes...' But then she caught sight of Ron's expression.


'"Slug Club",' repeated Ron with a sneer worthy of Malfoy.

Again JKR makes it a point to demonstrate what it's like to be Ron and have a famous best friend. Therein lies the essence of Ron's insecurities and jealousy. Jealousy that locket Voldemort was easily able to feed on and spread discord.


Least loved, now, by the girl who prefers your friend... Second best, always, eternally overshadowed...
*snip*
"Who could look at you, who would ever look at you, beside Harry Potter? What have you ever done, compared with the Chosen One? What are you, compared with the Boy Who Lived?"

Voldemort is feeding on Ron's jealousy of Harry's fame and the jealousy we saw in HBP of Hermione and Harry's relationship.

I feel the Sorting Hat's warning foreshadowed Ron's betrayal of abandonment in DH.

And never did they dream that they
Might someday be divided
For were there such friends anywhere
As Slytherin and Gryffindor?

At the ending of HBP there is that tear jerking moment where Ron assures Harry that he will remain by his side no matter what. So just like Slytherin and Gryffindor never could we dream that Ron and Harry could become divided in DH.


So Hogwarts worked in harmony
For several happy years,
But then discord crept among us
Feeding on our faults and fears.
The trio was working in harmony until locket Voldemort caused discord by feeding on Ron's faults and fears.


And the clash of friend on friend
And at last there came a morning
When old Slytherin departed

Eventually Ron departed. Betraying his oath at the end of HBP in that he would be there with Harry whatever happens.

I like the forshadowing connection in the Sorting Hat's song, PrefectRon! On the matter of his jealousy, I think that the locket was honestly the one thing that caused chaos for Ron. He was probably already thinking these things, but the locket nudged him along to the point of abandoment.

I was so angry, I even started thinking of Ron as some spoiled little kid who couldn't be away from his nice and comfortable life for too long. I actually thought he was not going to come back, that that was it, the last I ever saw of Ron. He totally made up for it when he came back, but I still don't get why the horcrux was more powerful on him than it was on Harry or Hermione, maybe because he is more insecure???

I was so angry, I even started thinking of Ron as some spoiled little kid who couldn't be away from his nice and comfortable life for too long. I actually thought he was not going to come back, that that was it, the last I ever saw of Ron. He totally made up for it when he came back, but I still don't get why the horcrux was more powerful on him than it was on Harry or Hermione, maybe because he is more insecure???

Exactly. His insecurities gave the horocrux more to work with, more things to use to drive a wedge between the three, more to try to corrupt him with.

His issues have been building for many books, and NEEDED a resolution.

Ron leaving made perfect sense to me. It's his MO. He left Harry in GoF. He left Hermione in HBP(?). He seems to always be on the outs with someone over his insecurities and inability to admit maybe he had a part to play in the whole argument. He has a hard time being the bigger man, just apologizing and asking himself what he can do to make it right. He grew up a lot in HBP, but that had to do with school drama, interpersonal drama. That wasn't live or die war-time drama. I think he had to give himself time once more. He spends so much time in other people shadows, that giving himself that time away gave him the chance to see that he is the hero in his own epic too, but that doesn't mean he can't be a supporting character in someone else's. Once again, JK's story is about Choices. Ron had to choose to leave, so he could choose to grow up and come back. That was his rite of passage. That he owes it to the locket making him even more insecure than usual, I think just serves to make it more palatable.

I agree. I think Jo did a good job in showing how Ron was more susceptible to things like that - particularly with the Veela. And Ginny's experience with the diary is significant as well. The longer she was exposed to the diary, the stronger its hold on her was and eventually, that piece of soul was able to possess her and control her.

originally posted by meesha1971
I think that is what was starting to happen with Ron. He wasn't actually possessed at that point, but the locket had taken a very strong hold on him and, if things hadn't come to a head that night, I think he would have eventually ended up being possessed and controlled by that piece of soul. Hermione's suggestion that they take turns wearing the locket was good in that it probably delayed that from happening, but it wouldn't have prevented it from happening completely because Ron was exposed to the locket repeatedly and each time it was worse for him.

I think that is shown in the moment he finally destroyed the locket as well. Harry saw that Ron's eyes had turned red. That piece of soul did try to possess him. But Ron had been away from the locket long enough to decrease the strength of the hold it had on him and he was able to fight it and destroy the locket anyway. He needed that time to get his head back on straight and build up the strength he would need to confront those personal demons and defeat them once and for all.

I agree. That was exactly how I felt about Ron's red eye moment. It reminded me of Harry in OotP when he looked at Dumbledore.

And PrefectRon, I loved the Sorting Hat analysis. I admit, I didn't expect Ron to leave, but that is excellent foreshadowing. Nice catch! :tu:

I like the forshadowing connection in the Sorting Hat's song, PrefectRon! On the matter of his jealousy, I think that the locket was honestly the one thing that caused chaos for Ron. He was probably already thinking these things, but the locket nudged him along to the point of abandoment.

Thank you! Yes the locket certainly did have a negative affect on whoever wore it. Voldemort is famous for spreading discord and that seems to be exactly what the locket Voldemort did.

I was so angry, I even started thinking of Ron as some spoiled little kid who couldn't be away from his nice and comfortable life for too long. I actually thought he was not going to come back, that that was it, the last I ever saw of Ron. He totally made up for it when he came back, but I still don't get why the horcrux was more powerful on him than it was on Harry or Hermione, maybe because he is more insecure???

I totally know what you mean I was so angry with Ron as well. He wasn't helping with anything it was as if he was just some spoiled little brat who was there for the ride. I knew he'd be back but I was worried about what would happen in between. Sure enough there was an attack waiting for Harry at Gordic's Hollow. Voldemort knew he'd be coming there and where was Ron? He was hanging out comfortably with his brother while Harry and Hermione fight for their lives. At least Hermione let him have it when he got back. Also, Ron stepped it up and started contributing once he came back, so he did redeem himself like you said.

I don't think the horcrux suddenly became more powerful when it was around Ron's neck but rather that Ron already had negative feelings towards Harry and the way things were going. The horcrux just made it more inviting to leave.

Exactly. His insecurities gave the horocrux more to work with, more things to use to drive a wedge between the three, more to try to corrupt him with.

His issues have been building for many books, and NEEDED a resolution.

I agree. We've watched Ron struggle with these issues the entire series and it's nice to finally have some closure.

Ron leaving made perfect sense to me. It's his MO. He left Harry in GoF. He left Hermione in HBP(?). He seems to always be on the outs with someone over his insecurities and inability to admit maybe he had a part to play in the whole argument. He has a hard time being the bigger man, just apologizing and asking himself what he can do to make it right. He grew up a lot in HBP, but that had to do with school drama, interpersonal drama. That wasn't live or die war-time drama. I think he had to give himself time once more. He spends so much time in other people shadows, that giving himself that time away gave him the chance to see that he is the hero in his own epic too, but that doesn't mean he can't be a supporting character in someone else's. Once again, JK's story is about Choices. Ron had to choose to leave, so he could choose to grow up and come back. That was his rite of passage. That he owes it to the locket making him even more insecure than usual, I think just serves to make it more palatable.

I agree, Ron is just very insecure about his own worth which stems from being overshadowed, which is why I was so happy for him when he destroyed the horcrux. Very few wizards can say they destroyed a piece of Voldemort's soul. Even Dumbledore only destroyed one horcrux. This is what I think Ron needed to start believing in himself

And PrefectRon, I loved the Sorting Hat analysis. I admit, I didn't expect Ron to leave, but that is excellent foreshadowing. Nice catch! :tu::) Thank you!

I also felt that Ron's insecurity issues needed the moment after he stabbed the Horcrux.

P 379, US, after Ron has stabbed the Horcrux and apologized to Harry for leaving in the first place:
"You've sort of made up for it tonight," said Harry. "Getting the sword. Finishing off the Horcrux. Saving my life."
"That makes me sound a lot cooler than I was," Ron mumbled."
"Stuff like that always sounds cooler than it really was," said Harry. "I've been trying to tell you that for years."
Ron needed, not just to hear Harry downplay his escapes from Voldemort or his success in the Triwizard, but to be on the other side of it. He needed to be the one who fought through something and won, not just as part of a team (as he was at the Ministry), but to be the one someone is congratulating. And I think he needed the explicit slap that is Harry pointing out that those sorts of victories always sounds better after the fact than it felt going through it. I loved that passage.

I just feel/wish that the whole Ron dealing with his insecurities thing could've been dealt without his actual leaving of the group. And yes, I know he wanted to come back the minute he left but the fact is he was absent from the group and I hated every second of it. Why couldn't he just stormed out and taken some time to get away from the locket and gain perspective - that would've shown character growth as Ron (along with Harry) have always been hotheads. Instead I feel it showed character regression. I've been reading everyone's post to gain perspective myself and read the different POVs but I still can't see how it had to be done that way. Oh well.

I just feel/wish that the whole Ron dealing with his insecurities thing could've been dealt without his actual leaving of the group. And yes, I know he wanted to come back the minute he left but the fact is he was absent from the group and I hated every second of it. Why couldn't he just stormed out and taken some time to get away from the locket and gain perspective - that would've shown character growth as Ron (along with Harry) have always been hotheads. Instead I feel it showed character regression. I've been reading everyone's post to gain perspective myself and read the different POVs but I still can't see how it had to be done that way. Oh well.

I did not much like Ron leaving Harry and Hermione to fend for themselves either, though I do believe that it served a purpose purpose that goes further than just character developement and addressing Ron's insecurities about his place in not only his family, but his love interest's heart. By Ron leaving, rejoining the wizarding world for a time (in the shape of taking refuge at his brother and sister-in-law's home) and then returning to them some time later, he was able to bring back not only harmony amongst the three of them, but valuable information about what was going on in the government (i.e. the Trace that had been placed on the Dark Lord's moniker).

Ron's leaving served several purposes. It was the resolution for his character arc of insecurities towards both Harry and Hermione, gave the trio information on the rest of the world, and allowed Harry, Ron, and Hermione to realize how important Ron was to the trio has a whole. He was the glue of the trio and his absence helped Harry and Hermione to see that. And Ron realized that Harry and Hermione had really needed him while he was gone. And once Ron's insecurities were gone, we saw his shine again like he did in the first books, before the insecurities came to the front.

Ron has in the past separated himself from Harry and Hermione. Like in Goblet of fire where Ron was upset with Harry for half the book. So I am sure Dumbledore picked up on how Ron has issues but always comes back.

Ron's leaving served several purposes. It was the resolution for his character arc of insecurities towards both Harry and Hermione, gave the trio information on the rest of the world, and allowed Harry, Ron, and Hermione to realize how important Ron was to the trio has a whole. He was the glue of the trio and his absence helped Harry and Hermione to see that. And Ron realized that Harry and Hermione had really needed him while he was gone. And once Ron's insecurities were gone, we saw his shine again like he did in the first books, before the insecurities came to the front.

I agree with everything you said. I've always felt he's the heart of the trio and without him they're not the same.
The locket made his insecurities even bigger and he himself said that once he had left he wanted to come back. The locket also showed him his biggest fear, that Hermione didn't love him or that he wasn't good enough for her, but Harry made it clear that it wasn't like that. He told him how she'd been crying for a week after he'd left and also that he loved her like a sister, nothing more. This was the moment Ron really saw what was going on and how things actually were, and all those insecurities were gone.

Eventually Ron departed. Betraying his oath at the end of HBP in that he would be there with Harry whatever happens.

I loved the "we're with you" line as well. but i don't think ron betrayed his oath at all. i think of it like...haha brace yourself this is going to be weird...

like ron and hermione are in cars on two separate roads. in DH - in terms of their loyalty to harry - hermione's car goes straight on, no problem. but ron's runs into a little ditch in the middle of his, swerves, crashes into a tree, and has to be fixed before it can go on. or, if you think of it the jk-way, he gets lost because he refuses to ask for directions :p , but finds his way back. and it's not like he sat on his *** the whole time he was gone, waiting. he tried to get back to them, and he was always listening to the news. someone somewhere mentioned that it was sort of his punishment for storming out that he had to be away from them so long. i think that's true; i think that absolutely killed him.

anyway, the great thing is that he DOES get back on the road, and it's purely out of love for his friends that he does that. so his oath from book six not only holds, but is given newer, deeper meaning. he DID stick by harry through thick and thin for me especially since he came back. His loyalty doesn't waver: it's tested in a way hermione's loyalty isn't, and it holds.

i mean, to be completely honest, harry did tell ron to leave. i'm not saying it was harry's fault or anything. my point is that it was a really tense, taut situation in that tent and both of them lost their tempers, saying and doing things i'm sure they didn't mean.

i'm sorry though for the god-awful car analogy. it's just the only thing i could think of to explain...:p

I loved the "we're with you" line as well. but i don't think ron betrayed his oath at all. i think of it like...haha brace yourself this is going to be weird...

like ron and hermione are in cars on two separate roads. in DH - in terms of their loyalty to harry - hermione's car goes straight on, no problem. but ron's runs into a little ditch in the middle of his, swerves, crashes into a tree, and has to be fixed before it can go on. or, if you think of it the jk-way, he gets lost because he refuses to ask for directions :p , but finds his way back. and it's not like he sat on his *** the whole time he was gone, waiting. he tried to get back to them, and he was always listening to the news. someone somewhere mentioned that it was sort of his punishment for storming out that he had to be away from them so long. i think that's true; i think that absolutely killed him.

anyway, the great thing is that he DOES get back on the road, and it's purely out of love for his friends that he does that. so his oath from book six not only holds, but is given newer, deeper meaning. he DID stick by harry through thick and thin for me especially since he came back. His loyalty doesn't waver: it's tested in a way hermione's loyalty isn't, and it holds.

i mean, to be completely honest, harry did tell ron to leave. i'm not saying it was harry's fault or anything. my point is that it was a really tense, taut situation in that tent and both of them lost their tempers, saying and doing things i'm sure they didn't mean.

i'm sorry though for the god-awful car analogy. it's just the only thing i could think of to explain...:p


Your analogy seems to contradict itself. Did Ron's car crash into a tree or did he simply get lost and need directions? And another question that comes to mind is that you stated your car analogy was in reference to loyalty, was loyalty really the issue? When the horcrux spoke it seemed to be using Ron's jealousy of Harry as a tool of attempted manipulation.

And to say that Ron left because Harry asked him seems to be turning a blind eye to the true essence of what actually unfolded and bypassing certain traits of Ron's character as well as his actions and comments.

As far as betraying his oath to stand by Harry no matter what happens it appears that Ron did betray this oath as he did in fact abandon Harry and Hermione on the horcrux hunt. Ron contributed very little and acted very immature. He expected to be fed rather than be proactive and do something about it (so much for his strategic mind). He complained that Harry didn't have a plan rather than work as a team to form one. Instead of remaining by Harry's side as he vowed to do he bailed as soon as the going got tough.

well i did apologize for my car analogy :lol: i don't mind that you don't get it, i had a hard time explaining. i just meant that ron got sidetracked...whether he crashed or got lost (i only brought that up because jk said he needed "guidance" in her interview, so i felt it was appropriate)...and had to make his way back. all i'm saying is that - for me - the fact that ron got sidetracked doesn't make him any less loyal than hermione. more hotheaded, or more of an idiot maybe ;) but no less loyal.

i agree though that the locket was using ron's jealousy. but for me loyalty's a huge issue, because that's one of the things i like most about ron...

and i didn't say ron left because harry told him to - that wouldn't be very fair to harry. ron didn't make excuses for himself, so neither will i. but that harry told him to leave illustrates just how volatile everything was. because i don't think harry meant it. i think it's something he blurted out in the heat of the moment. the same way i think ron walked out in the heat of the moment. i think it's important to remember that ron's leaving came after a pretty intense fight between the TWO of them.

and about food...i don't know maybe i understand this so much because i know a few people that go REALLY nuts when they haven't eaten. so i recognize the signs. they don't make any effort to hide the fact that they're in a bad mood...sound familiar? :p must be biological or something...and we all know how ron is about food. immature? sure! but we all know ron can be immature...that's what's nice about his return...gives him a chance to rectify that, and grow up once and for all, which he does quite nicely i think. ultimately though i don't think he betrayed harry at all, or that he bailed because the going got rough. you could even say the going got really rough when he left, but he still found a way to get back.

and to his credit, there was the locket. it would have been different if jk had written his departure WITHOUT it, which she easily could have. but like he said, he didn't have his head on straight. ron all by himself would never leave his friends. he got lost though, and did leave, but he came back. That - for me anyway - is unwavering loyalty...

I disagree. Ron might have turned away from his negative feelings in GoF, but that was because of what HARRY did in the lake, not because of what RON did.

Ron needed to face the negative feelings that had simply been repressed, never dealt with. Leaving and returning to face the locket provided him with the opporitunity to do so.

On a side note: did anyone else notice that through OotP and HBP Ron seems to be consistantly hoping that Ginny and Harry will hook up? At first I thought that this was due to his preferance of Harry as a boyfriend for Ginny over the other boys she had been seeing, but couldn't it have been a preferance for Ginny as a girlfrien for Harry over Hermoine?
maybe both? :tu:

and it's not like he sat on his *** the whole time he was gone, waiting. he tried to get back to them, and he was always listening to the news. someone somewhere mentioned that it was sort of his punishment for storming out that he had to be away from them so long. i think that's true; i think that absolutely killed him.Yes, I have said something like that. He wanted to return almost immediately and then was forced to wait at Shell Cottage, not knowing how to return and not knowing what happens to Harry and Hermione. If that is not punishment. I don´t think he really enjoyed the safety, warmth and food Shell Cottage provided.

anyway, the great thing is that he DOES get back on the road, and it's purely out of love for his friends that he does that. so his oath from book six not only holds, but is given newer, deeper meaning. he DID stick by harry through thick and thin for me especially since he came back. His loyalty doesn't waver: it's tested in a way hermione's loyalty isn't, and it holds.What I find interesting as well is, that Ron decided to get back before he had dealt with his insecurities. These insecurities where still there. Not as burning as when he was wearing the locket, but he was aware of them and they were still existent. Nonetheless, he decided he wanted to return to the two people who were part of his insecurities and to the locket which had amplified them. He wanted to return out of friendship and love and I think that is a sign of loyalty in itsself, IMO.


i'm sorry though for the god-awful car analogy. it's just the only thing i could think of to explain...:pYour car analogy might not be completely consistent in itsself, but I know what you mean and I agree.