Book Five Romance -- was it all you were expecting?

Something else noone has mentioned. How did Hermione know about Harry's crush for ages on Cho? Did she just assume it was so after Harry tried to ask Cho to the Yule Ball? I think not. If Hermione was aware of Harry's feelings for Cho, then she is obviously aware of Ron's feelings for her, as it appears she is very perceptive. So, if she knows Ron's feelings, then she is simply waiting for Ron to accept that he might get rejected and make the move before the shows any feelings. She realizes Ron's fear and chooses to respect it.


During welcome feast for the foreign students in GOF, Ron is staring at Fleur (we don't know her name yet) and Harry at Cho saying "they make them all right at Hogwarts". Hermione tells both of them to put their eyes back in her heads. I think that was the first clue.

But if she shares Ron's feelings then there's no need for her to wait for him to accept that he might be rejected, he wouldn't be.
That argument IMO only works if she had feelings for Harry. Then she'd need to wait for Ron to accept that she might not feel the same way in order to preserve their friendship


I'm not saying it wil definitly end up R/HR, as I do understand the arguments for h/hr, I'm just trying to point out some things I thought were significant. And I for would wouldn't be disappointed with either ship.

What girl Cho's age wouldn't be jealous of her boyfriend's best "girl" friend? I think those emotions are completely normal for this age, and were not necessarily written in to show support for a Harry and Hermione relationship. But I do agree with you, I'm glad to who "cho" thing is over.


But Cho turning into Hermione in his dream could very well be significant.

Its much more interest that Harry don´t answer Hermiones question, dos he? As she said: Harry likes Cho since ages, isn´t it so Harry? (something in that line)
Well, he don´t answer this question. I mean Hermione seems to very interest in her letter to Viktor. You know more and more its about Cho and what Hermione thinks more and more is she interest in her letter. Read that part its quiet interest how she act and Hermione gos more and more cold and matter of factly. She isn´t that happy about Cho and Harry. I´m quiet sure Hermione did sabotage Harrys first date. I mean she knows perfectly, especially after this kiss debate, how tactless he might be. So why tell Harry that he can bring Cho with, by the way she don´t explain why she want meet him (I bet if she did say Rita Skeeter Harry didn´t try to bring Cho with) and that on the VALENTINSDAY? Why not tell him come after your date? I think this was a good plan one which was back up. You know if Harry against Hermiones thinking manage Cho to bring with him than Rita Skeeter would do a quiet better job. And don´t tell me Rita wouldn´t ask nasty things.
After Hermione see Cho isn´t with him she ask in the great hall brightly what happens?! Honestly this is well very interest.

I still think the entire timing of Hermione writing that extremely long letter to Viktor while she knows something's going down with H/C is significant. What could she have been writing to him that would have taken up that much parchment? Did she turn to the idea of Vikor, her Yule Ball date, as a diversion from what she didn't want to face?

I am amazed by all the great post. WOW

After reading almost all the post here, I just really believe that the H/Hr ship is stronger that ever. The evidence in the past few posts really drive it home. Harry's thinking of Hermione about the gift, her always being with him in his many times of need, whether to talk, provide a sence of reason or help him get into trouble and out again. The H/Hr ship is just to strong.

ALSO: With the addition of Luna Lovegood and her obvious liking toward Ron I really see that ship heading out in the next book. We have never heard of Luna in any book, then all of a sudden she shows-up, befriends the group, shows all that she likes Ron, and becomes a prominant figure through the book. I can't but help seeing that Ron and Luna together.

EDIT: I also need to state what I mentioned in another post. Ron gets jealous of any girl that is close to him. (Hermione and Ginny) I think that if Luna also gets close to the group it will happen to her to. Especially if he likes her.

Here's a crazy thought...

Neville cam a long way in the wizarding world in the last 300 pages of OotP. What about a Neville - Hermione love interest.

Neville did carry her out of danger, diregarding his own saftey, showing true Gryffindor Bravery.

Maybe...probably not. But it made Neville much cooler in my book.

Plus, Neville has the whole "luke-skywalker-you-left-my-parents-to-be-vegetables" angst. That must create a LOT of hate.

I hope he gets his own wand over the summer, and not his mom's. His dad's old wand was stepped on, remember? I think he's earned his own.

"What girl Cho's age wouldn't be jealous of her boyfriend's best 'girl' friend?"

A good point but that can be explained. Cho wouldn't be jealous unless she got the impression that Hermione meant more to Harry than she did. Consequently, that is exactly the impression she got twice.

Vice versa, that is also the impression Viktor got in Book four. Note that Viktor approached Harry, not about the articles by Rita Skeeter but how often she talks about Harry. Right now they are platonic but even with that said, they're jealousy issues amongst their love interests.

Unless I am very much mistaken, it is the impression that Ron is also starting to get. The prefect issue, the "how do you know that Harry is not a bad kisser" issue, and the "why weren't they watching me playing the game of my life" issue. Ron is starting to try to get Harry and Ginny together even though there is not any interest between the two.

Theres a lot of great posts in here. Its a bumpy road. That point about the exclamation point was good. And the thought put into Harry's gift was also something to be taken into account. I personally dont think Hermione set up the meeting to break up or cause trouble with Cho and Harry. I think she did notice Harry was toubled and she wanted to know so she asked him how the date went. Still, though its strange she wanted to meet with Harry on Valentines day.

Hermione must/does know that Ron like her. As someone above mentioned she knew Harry had liked Cho for ages, so she derived this simply from Harry action and the fact that he asked her to the ball. Ron has been practically beating her over the head with hints so she definitlly knows.

My personal take on the last two books is that Hermione was slightly interested in Ron in book 4, but the way he acted and treated her during and after the Yule ball caused a change in this feeling. Back to OotP, I truly hope JK has brought Luna into the series to give Ron someone so that he wont be alone if Harry and Hermione get together. She had no other purpose. ...>Grrrr... i love you JKR but wish book 5 had more romance in it.

Oh Earandil! You make me laugh!

You are not the only one who felt that JKR was hinting rather heavily on the H/G shipping. Specially now that she will played Quidditch with him next year. That honestly surprised me because for some reason (maybe since I'm so bad at sports) I didn't see it coming but others did. I though it was rather suspicious and weird that off the 3 positions suddenly available in the team JKR manages to give Ginny the same that Harry had and then leaves a door opening for Harry to be able to come back next year. The game/Cho/Ginny thing was a bit weird also. There was a lot of things that for me were hinting rather heavily at H/G.

I loved the way she portrait the Trio friendship in this book. Ron and Hermione are definitly better friends. But it happend what I suppossed it was going to happend. Getting over the friendship is going to be difficult for them. Ron's fear of rejection completly takes him over. They are both atracted to each other and that became very obvious in this book. Ron trully appreciates Hermione in ways that Harry still doesn't. Or maybe I just don't feel that he does since Ron was rather extremelly nice and good to Hermione while Harry was awful to her thru most of the book. Maybe I'm comparing them and that would be unfair to Harry since Ron obviously like Hermione but **** he still hasn't woken up to the reality of it. Although I think that he is waking up.

But over all my all, my hapiness was greatly shot down by the death (which I still have steam coming out of my ears) It was shut down with open fire with that. I have no idea how are we read this book without that character.

Gily Ann

All I can say is Please Please Please bring Harry and Cho together again

Okay, I'll admit it, **** IT! :(

Gily and Earendil,

I see a possibility for Harry and Ginny! :'( A very slim one at that because I'll always be an H/Hr'er! :'(

*quickly runs away because I cannot believe I just admitted that*

ahahhahaha..That's funny..but there are more hints for H/Hr though...

I am not sure if anyone posted this already but I am going to even if they did. It seems that noone has noticed that Ron and Hermione where together alone much of the summer (and yes I know there where other people but dont even try to say they where not alone alot of the time). I think that if I had been alone most of the time in a place for a month with a girl that I was even remotely intrested in I would of at least tried to do something other than argue with her, and if that did happen then Harry would definitly of seen a change in the way they acted when he got there. I think however that even if Ron does somewhat like Hermione, that she will not return any feelings of that nature to him. And just to make sure everyone knows this doesent mean I am supporting and ship, all it means is that I think Ron and Hermione arent likely, thanks.

That's exactly what I see too!!!
Even though I ship for H/Hr....I don't see that Hermione give hints of liking Ron or Harry..OK she did give that comment about Harry finding her ugly...but I don't think it means anything yet...

I think that although she might not like either of them like that, I believe she has a much closer and certainly deeper relationship with Harry. I think that this in itself might be even better than having Harry and Hermione get together.

Hi everyone.

I just have to say that I really liked the way romance was played in the book. Understated but there.

I do think that H/G ship has more steam now. I have always liked Ginny and though I don't know if it will happen but I always thought if it did she did get with Harry she would have to be over the crush and grow up. Ginny did both of those in the book. I enjoyed the way her relationship with Harry is developing. He is seeing more as an equal than Ron's sister. I also love her playing the seeker position. She has got one up on Hermione now. Hermione does not really like quidditch and Ginny is playing it.

Cho: whew, boy am I glad that is over. She is a mess and needs someone not so involved with Cedric so she can deal with her grief. The last thing Harry wants is to talk about the person he saw killed.

H/Hr I sort of got the impression that their relationship didn't develop as it did in GoF. Maybe it is me but that is what I thought. I also don't understand her xmas gift to the boys. Harry was going to throw his into the fire. On one hand you still have Hermione grabbing Harry and his arm in stressful situations but he got a lot more impatient and nasty at times with her.

R/Hr: I think that this book helped these two. Ron has matured alot and he is playing it cool with his crush. I think that these two had their friendship grow alot in this book almost like H/Hr friendship in GoF. Yes they still argue but it isn't really serious. But I have to say that I did not like Hermione's view of Ron at a couple of points like when she found out that Ron was made prefect (I was thinking, open mouth insert foot) and over Ron's dismal quidditch practice and she assumed it was because of him. She needs to learn to appreciate him more.

Luna: I love her, I could see her with Ron or Harry. I think because of her experiences with death she could help Harry deal with his grief but I also think she likes Ron or at least his jokes.

I think that Grawg likes Hermy too.

I must say that I really enjoyed 'Hermione-the relationship expert/. She will be on Oprah next.

Happy posting. Sorry if I am going over old points. This site is really slow and I don't have time to read every page.

Voritian, you hit the nail they had one month and didn´t do anything. Nothing, even Ron had this crush he didn´t do a thing. Why? I think Harry she might speak to much about him. That would explain why he react how he react as Hermione said Harry isn´t a bad kisser, How do you know? asked Ron sharply.

I don´t believe H/G gonna happen. No, not because Ginny is over her crush its much more how Harry has change and how he isn´t interest in her. Fine Ron can wish that H/G get together but this say nothing. Ginny seems to me like a friend in this book. The only thing I wanna know is why Ginny grinned:
Hermione seemed to struggle with herself for a moment, then said: "Thats sound lovely."
Ginny caught Harry´s eye and looked away quickly, grinning.

Do she know what we don´t know?! This seems a little bit strange. I mean its about Lunas comment but why dos Ginny look to Harry and grinning. I have an idea but I doubt its right.

I think she grins because she knows how hard it is for Hermione not to tell Luna that they those creatures or whatever she was trying to find dont exist and she finds it funny that she had enough control that time.

Well this is my very first post here - I've just joined cosforums.

And I am ruing myself for not having found this forum much much earlier.

I'm a H/Hr shipper, and most of my opinions have already been narrated in the many posts before mine, so I shall not repeat them. In fact, some of the posts have thrown up ideas regarding my ship and others have been throughly refreshing and have served to stiffen my resolve for my ship.

Oh yes, back to discussion.

Pansy -
What girl Cho's age wouldn't be jealous of her boyfriend's best "girl" friend? I think those emotions are completely normal for this age, and were not necessarily written in to show support for a Harry and Hermione relationship.

Doesn't this prove a point for H/Hr? It is easy to get a girl for Harry, but it is by no means easy to get a girl who can replace or at least reach Hermione's position with Harry.

Harry will quite definitely turn to Hermione when he faces problems - and she will also quite possibly be the first one he turns to, whether he has a girlfriend or not. Any girl in a relationship with Harry either has to accept that or be such that Harry turns to her instead. (or be coughhermionecough)

Does any other female in the book know Harry as well as Hermione does? The very closest is Ginny, and she is far, far behind even at that.

If Ron and Hermione get together, well... I'll say that it's very possible that Harry has no one then. And how many heroes get that? No one? I don't think JKR is that cruel to Harry, no?

(Btw, the point is not mine. I picked it up from this whole compilation of H/Hr theories and explanations mainly sourcing from the HPforGrownUps yahoo group - I mentioned it to uhh... educate people ;))

Jajaja..yeah..I think that's the reason too....Both..Harry and Ginny know how hard is for Hermione to be quiet when she know she is right for sure....that's it....
I like the way in which gained certain complicity with harry..but I think it was like a frined though...Plus, now she has had a lot of boyfriends (she is clearly popular and pretty) and I wouldn't want Harry to feel insecure because of that...Plus, she is establishing relationshipd with people they know, like Dean Thomas, I don't see Harry doing anything about her when he know that his friends like her...

Well, thank you. I didn´t regornise that Hermione dos it there the first time. I mean that she didn´t argue about things which exist and which not exist.
So, Its for me now pretty clear now. Specially now that she will played Quidditch with him next year.
First if she play quiditch because she need to go iinto the try outs for chasers and than if Ginny really plays this isn´t a hint that H/G gonna happen.

I also don't understand her xmas gift to the boys
Well, Buttercup. I need to explain this. Hermione might have buy or think about a gift for quiditch or so but Harry Ã_sn´t anylonger in the team and that was pretty near of X-mas so she buyed him well this nice present. She had maybe notice that this two were very much behind with the homework what was more as obvious.
Thats the reason why Hermione didn´t buy Ron anything for quiditch. Interest or not that she bought them the same thing. They got both the same thing, strange isn´t it?

I think that the is no doubt that Harry is closer to Hermione than other person in the entire book (and I dont mean just girls). Some people might say he is a better friend to Ron, however I do not believe this is true. In everything that has happened who has Harry always turned to when he needed help, Hermione. He has almost always told her the things that he truely needs help with before he even tells Ron and always seems to have a somewhat unconditional bond with her that will last no matter who he or she ends up with.

I being a H/Hr shipper have also had another thought. When Umbridge was going to put the crucio(sp?) spell on Harry in her office with all the others around. What did Hermione do? Burst into tears at the tought of that happening to Harry. (would she have the same feeligs for Ron or anybody else, Well well will just have to speculate) Such deep feelings for Harry emerged that not only did she come-up with a lie, but she was willing to kill, or should I say have killed, by the centaurs. Hermione knew that the centaurs would get the next adult human that came into the forbidden forest and not get the childen (even though that kind-of backfired). It takes some pretty strong emotions toward someone to think of possibly having them killed.

What do you think?

Fate, wasn't Hermione fake crying? Harry mentioned right after that she had her hands over her face but no tears.

Thanks FP for trying to explain about the gifts. I just thought that the gifts were pretty cheap IMO. But I didn't get the Harry doesn't play quidditch anymore thing, thanks.

Welcome Erise, nice to have you here.

I also liked Voritians point about Ron not making a move in the month Hermione and him were alone. Good catch. But would it have worked? Knowing Ron it would have backfired spectacularly and Hermione and him would have been at odds.

When that happend she didnt actually cry (however I think she would of if he had been being tortured). She was just pretending as Harry noticed and he never saw any tears. I think that with Ron she would of also but I do believe that she would both kill and risk being killed to help Harry as she has proven many times.

Yes, when I was browsing through the book for H/Hr (and other shippy moments) I noticed that.

I've never thought of Hermione as an excellent actress - the occasional lying to the teacher yes, but that was acting - everyone was fooled until she mentioned Dumbledore.

And I liked how Harry managed to notice that there were no tears even though Hermione was apparently sobbing away ;)

A couple things i didn't notice being discussed(just skimmed though, sorry), i'd like to know your views on them:

1) The gifts...anyone notice Hermione got Haryr and Ron both homework planners - but Harry's could talk? If this isn't a direct comparison of the thougth she puts in for their gifts...what is?

2) The kiss on the cheek...the text then reads "And you, Harry -" and then cuts to Harry seeing Ron touch his cheek. Did Hermione kiss Harry too? That bit of text confused me. Other views are very welcome, i'd like to hear them...sneaky JKR!

3) Hermione, while helping with the Cho issue, didn't seem very pleased about it. Businesslike, briskly, frown...doesn't sound like she was too happy about it. There's more i'd like to say but...later.

Sorry if I seem to eager to post, but this is a topic I'm very caught up in right now and I think I need some sleep soon.

In response to Sirius:

1) That was great observation - I didn't notice that at all... Wonder what it means eh... ;)

2) When that kiss happened I was anxiously rereading that portion for any indication that Harry might have been kissed - but it also seemed weird that Harry would have absolutely no reaction if he was kissed? Unless he's really comfortable with it eh?

3) I really have to agree with that - at first I was quite horrified when Hermione appeared to have no largely visible reaction to the kiss and Harry's dating Cho, but someone on the pumpkinpie forums mentioned the frown, and my friend mentioned the way Hermione was asking Harry "What about Cho?" (or something to that extent) towards the end of the book - in that same manner. It really does make you wonder why she's so interested - even Ron, the generally more curious one (especially about girls) hadn't asked that!

Well off to bed now, and thanks for the welcome buttercup.

I think that too.....In the conversation about Cho, she was acting weird..Kind of like more know-it-all than ever....PLus, God, I have said this so many times, sorry, the fact that she told Harry that he sould have mentioned to Cho how ugly he found Hermione..It's like if she was kind of resigned that boys only like beautiful and popular girls, so she doesn't have a chance....and C'mon..Harry said "but I don't find you ugly"

About everything else..I agree..she is closer to Harry than Ron..she has always been..They have this kind of bond..I don't know where would they go (Ron and Harry) if they didn't have her...

OH! Something else, Did you guys realize that Harry doesn't really question when Hermione has an idea? Like, when she told him to go to the Three Broomsticks on V-Day,. When he got there, she was with Luna and Rita, and told Rita what to do and Harry what to do, and he didn't even ask her why she was doing it..He just did what she said....He trusts her beyond anything...

There is one thing I have been thinking of since I have been reading these posts. When Hermione asked Harry to meet her when she knew Harry was on a date with Cho, she also knew that Harry did not know how to talk to girls that he liked that well and she only gave him advice on how he should of asked Cho to go there with him after he had asked her. I am not trying to say that Hermione would try to stop his relationship with another girl, just makes you think kind of, thanks.

I'm not a shipper so I wasn't too concerned about the romance part, but I was quite surprised that Hermione being a girl seemed to have stopped being an issue for Harry and Ron.

I must have missed the part about the "no tears". THANKS

I was reading pretty fast but she still was willing to lead UmBridge to her possible death. This is not like killing her off the cuff so to speak. She quickly thought through the only things she could do and getting rid of UmBridge was what stuck in her mind. The point; she going to kill UmBridge because of what she was going to do to Harry. It takes real love to "OFF" someone because there going to hurt your "friend".


I also had another quick thought. When the group was in the MoM and they split up. I thought it was odd that Hermione, Harry and Neville were paire-up and Luna, Ron and Ginny were paired. Discounting Neville and Ginny, who I think is a great couple. That puts H/Hr and Luna and Ron together. Any other thoughts?

Well the reasons I think Ginny would make a good pair with Harry now, is only because JKR has proven her to be her own woman and strong a la Hermione. ;) And the only hint that I got that there maybe some interest was that looking in the eye and smile thing between her and Harry. Believe me though, I was disgusted when I read it. I was like that didn't mean anything! lol :rotfl: Yet like hermownninny said, it was the fact that they know Hermione so well that they laughed. I don't know, I don't want to think about it.

In regards to Ron now being good enough for Hermione because he is a Prefect, a Keeper and has matured a bit: I don't think so. I don't know which H/Hr said that, but it wasn't me. And anyhow, Ron never deserved the Prefect title in the first place.

Voritian, I agree with you in respect to Harry noticing a change in Ron and Hermione's relationship if something was up between them during the summer. I don't think they were together all summer.

I guess Hermione didn't visit Krum. That was never answered.

Buttercup, I thought Grawp like Hermy, too. :D When he went to pick her up, all I thought about was King Kong! lol

I saw a development between Harry and Hermione. In GoF, Harry wanted his bestfriend Ron back to be able to help him deal with his problems, but because they were arguing he only had Hermione to rely on. And that reliability has been extended to this book. The only difference is is that Harry is finally opening up and arguing with everyone about what he is feeling not just Hermione. Yet Hermione is the one who gets him out of Sirius' room when he locks himself up. He lets her talk him into leaving, that has to mean something.

Someone said a great point on Cho, but I can't remember who it
is or what they said! :( It was something about how she wouldn't understand what Harry is going through. I figured they would understand each other, but with her it was a loss and for him it was a guilt of getting Cedric killed. So therefore they don't have anything in common to be able to help each other out with. There were too many things going on with Harry and he doesn't need someone to be arguing with him about darling Hermione. He needs someone who is going to be able to understand his needs and a person who he can confide in. Did she ever really believe that Voldemort was back or was using DA as an excuse to get close to Harry? How are you going to be close to someone in that way? It just doesn't make any sense. I think that while Harry was expecting this perfect girl, she was expecting for him to be more mature physically speaking and supportive of her loss. But you can't go to a guy you "like" and cry on his shoulders about your dead ex, especially one who saw your ex die when he himself has the salvation of the world on his shoulders. She was just an emotional wreck and that is the last thing Harry needs.

I don't think Hermione sabotaged Harry's date. That's not in her character, but then again she did do that SNEAK thing. (But that was good for whomever to betray the group like that!) I don't think Harry mentioned to Hermione or Ron about his date so I don't see how she could've sabotaged it. She took the opportunity to see Rita Skeeter away from school and invited Harry only because Harry had to be there. The story was going to be about him. She didn't think that Harry would be so stupid as to invited Cho the way he did and that's why she broke it down for him and as an afterthought told him he should have said she's ugly. He said that he doesn't think she is ugly, she laughs and then says that he's worse than Ron. I believe she said that he's worse than Ron because only Ron would have not known how to get out of a situation like that with his date.

The afterthought is the key point here in my opinion. She was looking to see what he would say and she got an answer. We just don't know what she thought about it

Hawk, thank you for pointing out the grammars! :D Also, I thought that her phrasing of "unusual" was weird myself. That's not something that you say to a person who gives you a present, is it? And I never got the impression she wears perfume either, or is it just me?

BTW, how do you pronounced Hermy is it Her-ME or Her-MY? And why can't we ever get a facial description on the any of the girls! Thank God for Grandpre's illustrations, now I know at least what she thinks Hermione looks like!

Originally posted by Sirius83 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=393676#post393676))
A couple things i didn't notice being discussed(just skimmed though, sorry), i'd like to know your views on them:

1) The gifts...anyone notice Hermione got Haryr and Ron both homework planners - but Harry's could talk? If this isn't a direct comparison of the thougth she puts in for their gifts...what is?

2) The kiss on the cheek...the text then reads "And you, Harry -" and then cuts to Harry seeing Ron touch his cheek. Did Hermione kiss Harry too? That bit of text confused me. Other views are very welcome, i'd like to hear them...sneaky JKR!

3) Hermione, while helping with the Cho issue, didn't seem very pleased about it. Businesslike, briskly, frown...doesn't sound like she was too happy about it. There's more i'd like to say but...later.


1) I was a bit disappointed about the gifts being that she has given at least Harry great gifts. But afterwards all I really thought was that she was trying to get them to organize themselves. I didn't even notice that Harry's is the only one that talks. So what you're trying to say is taht Hermione is giving Harry the better gift?

2) I was expecting for her to kiss Harry, too. How can you give one bestfriend a good luck and not the other. Honestly, I just think JKR had her kiss Ron to even out the kissing scenes. How I do lament it though. :(

3) OH heck no Hermione didn't seem pleased at all! What got to me the most is "business-like manner". My interpretation of business like manner is being fake, pretending to be happy when you aren't. Because really who is happy with their jobs anyhow. :p ;)

FATE......
, you said that ". I thought it was odd that Hermione, Harry and Neville were paire-up and Luna, Ron and Ginny were paired. Discounting Neville and Ginny, who I think is a great couple. That puts H/Hr and Luna and Ron together. Any other thoughts?"

Yes, that's a very good point...Hermione went with Harry and Neville because when Harry turned around and ran, he grabbed Hermione by her robes ( I think), and then Hermionestarted hurrying Nevilled..WOW..Thanks a lot, I totally forgot about that..Maybe she was the closest, remember that he step on her foot? But out of the whole group, he dragged HER and not someone elese.....=)

When I posted the thing about Hermione not telling him how to ask Cho to go there, I didnt mean that I thought Hermione would try to ruin Harry's date,

Quote: I am not trying to say that Hermione would try to stop his relationship with another girl, just makes you think kind of, thanks.

I just meant that she didnt try to help it either. I think to me it didnt seem that she found it to important (or she was trying to pretend she didnt), she just said oh then have her come to like it wasent anything.

It is written toward the end of the book (I'm fried and can't remember exactly where) that there is part of Harry's mind what speaks in Hermione's voice. Now it's bugging me to the point that when I get home from work tonite I'm going to look for it again. But my point is that, if Hermone's voice already occupies a part of Harry's mind, how then will any other girl ever be able to supplant that? That to me was one of the strongest indicators for H/Hr in this book.

That is very true October, I didnt really think about that. She has now become so deeply apart of his decision making and thought process that he hears her voice whenever there is a decision to be made. That would show an extreem closeness.

I think that some of the things that Hermione does (such as when she grabs onto Harry when the giant tries to grab her) is a result of her knowing that Harry is special and powerfull even more than he himself realizes and I think that the feels closer to him than the others.

voritian, I hope you didn't think I was offending you in regards to the whole date thing because I wasn't. I was just giving my opinion since a few of you were talking about it.

Now I agree with you and October: Hermione being a voice in Harry's head means something even if it's minute.

She definitely knows that Harry is powerful after all she is the one who brought up the idea of having him teach DA. She has a lot of faith in him.

I was all for Harry and Cho. But after this book I hope she stays far away from him. I relize she was going through a hard time but just the fact that she took Harry to that horrible coffee shop and is still friends with that little sneek just makes me relize how wrong she is for Harry.

I'm still not all for a Ginny/Harry relationship. Just because how would YOU feel about going out with your best friend's sibling? However, if Rowling pulls it off I won't make too much of a fuss.

I am totally against the whole Harry/Hermione relationship especially since he spent so much effort in book 4 telling everyone the she is NOT his girlfriend. Besides, Hermione has Ron and Krum to keep her busy.

My favorite pairing is Ron and Hermione. I read a ff awhile ago with them paired and loved it. I also think that they still have feelings for eachother in book 5. They just arn't the type of people who jump right in. Perhaps they're afriad of jeprodising their friendship for a silly relationship.

Of course Ron, Hermione, or Harry could die and all these theories could be thrown out the window. ;)

I noticed in the book where they go to see Grawp, when Grawp tries to grab Hermione, Harry pulls her out of the way, and Hermione then cries, or whimpers, on Harry's shoulder. This reminded me of two things. When Cho was crying right before they kissed, and of POA when they're flying off on Buckbeak (the romantic imagery thing). I also liked how Hermione once again instinctively reaches for Harry, not Ron, in the Department of Mysteries, when the doors move.

Quote: voritian, I hope you didn't think I was offending you in regards to the whole date thing because I wasn't. I was just giving my opinion since a few of you were talking about it.

Not at all, I know you wherent (and you didnt anyway so np). I was just trying to make my post more clear.

Okay... I totally hated Harry and Cho together. I thought it was sort of tacky of Cho to be with another guy that soon after Cedric. I almost got hints thought that she was just using Harry to get over Cedric. The way she asked him if Cedric said anything about her before he died, etc. Maybe she felt like if she were closer to Harry, the last person to be with Cedric, then that would bring her closer to Cedric and maybe some peace. Hmm...

Ginny... Some of you people are knockin' her too hard for having two relationships. When I was that age I am sure I had three times that. We would break up with our boyfriends only to have our best friend dating him the very next day... Hello? Doesn't anyone else remember junior high!?

Hermione and Ron... Yeah, yeah, yeah... admitedly I sense the romantic tension between them but that doesn't mean I like it! I don't want them to be together... It just doesn't seem right to me. I like the whole "Luna and Ron" idea. She just seems more Ron. Hermione just seems too sophisticated to be with Ron. She is also too much of a best friend and family member.

I'm really enjoying this thread!

I know I have mentioned it before but I am now a prominant H/Hr shipper. But my knowledge in speach & debate requires me to understand both sides.

I would really like it if someone could tell me, other than personal opinion, some of the strongest points that make up the R/Hr ship. I dont want to be closed minded but I simply can't get them together in my mind. There are just to many things that prove H/Hr ship. Scenes together, the gifts, the summer spent together and nothing happening(R/Hr - they are hormonal after all), her thoughts in Harry's mind, the business like nature of Hermione when talking about other girls, How many times Harry grabs Hermione and the opposite(Her to Harry), who Harry looks to when there's a problem.

I'm not including the kiss only because neither proves much really if you think about it. The kiss only clouds the issue for both. I'm looking for reason that effect Ron and Harry not both at the same time.

Thanks.

edit:
I forgot about the Ron's jealously too. I'm leaving it out only because he showed jealously when he found out that Ginny was dating too. But hey, throw it back at me (and the kiss) if you really believe it supports the R/Hr ship. I want to see them all.

Ok, First I want to point out that Lily and James didn't get together till year 7. Why is that important? Wellit shows that a character may NOT be interested in someone now but will in the later books.

Now if Harry gets together with Ginny that would set up Hermonie and Ron. Harry and Ginny will both probably be on the Quidich team next Year and be most likely the best 2 players. If this does happen they would become one big Weasly Family. Hermonie Weasly and Ginny Potter

Now if Harry get with Hermonie Neville would be set up with Ginny and Ron would be with ...............Luna Lovegood. well face it they were the ones who helped Harry and for all of them to end up in a relationship would be nice. Hermonie also seemed to grab Harrys arm alot in the Forbidden forest.

Now we dont know a lot could happen in 2 years.
Anyway I also think Tonks should get with Lupin. Shes a Shapshifter so could turn in to an animal when Lupin becomes a werewolf. Also she seems to be one of the only Deceant reletives of Sirius. Now you may think that she is to young. Well think about it shes a shape shifter if you had the capeabillity wouldent you want to look younger (if you were older). After all it does take Years of study to become an Auror so she might be a lot older and just look younger.

~Gmne

I wish that I could get on this thread more often, but the stupid server keeps crashing and I haven't been able to get in awhile. :sigh: My apologies for not responding sooner, but it can't be helped.

Well, I'm on my first re-read and I'm happily picking up on the strong H/Hr evidence, which I happened to miss out on in my first reading due to blind horror at the more obvious R/Hr stuff. What struck me the most at first was their physical and emotional closeness (physical in the Grawp scene, for instance, and emotional in the part at the end). And I know that tons of people have already mentioned it, but the fact that there's a part in Harry's head (his conscience, maybe?) that speaks in Hermione's voice is pretty darn significant. Even if it doesn't mean that they're soulmates or whatever, it definitely means that she has had some sort of impact on him, and that's a start.

I keep getting struck by a horrible (for me, at least) thought that Ginny is being made "worthy" in this book. *gulp* I never liked her before, mostly because we barely knew anything about her, but I found myself growing quite fond of her in OotP because of her spunk and also because she proved to be tougher than she appears. Why is JK doing this?! AHH...okay, calm down, Earendil. The point that I'm trying to make is that now Ginny is a character with a personality, a sense of humor, and a pretty good friendship with Harry. She will never be as important as Hermione is, but honestly, I can't help but notice how much her chances of being with Harry have increased, despite the fact that she's gotten over him. :( Don't get me wrong, I still ship H/Hr through and through, but as I mentioned before in my first rambling post on the thread, I'm seeing potential with Ginny. (GilyAnn, I blame this on you...it's all your fault!! Gahh! ;) Just kidding.)

Well, about Lupin and Tonks: it sounds all right in theory, but I don't see it happening. The Order have too much to be dealing with right now, and I don't think that they can risk time for romance. Plus, she might be a little young for him -- maybe more Bill's age? Unless what Griffinmane suggested is true, and she's really older than she looks, because it certainly does seem like it would take more time to become an Auror. If we find out whom she was at Hogwarts with, it would help.

It's so cool seeing all these new H/Hr shippers -- welcome on board the HMS Harmony! And I definitely enjoy reading the thoughts of everyone, even you R/Hr shippers ;). Keep up the great posts! I just wish I could read them more often...I hope the server gets back up soon.

Well James seems as though he had it real bad for Lily in 5th year and she seemed to not be interested in James. I thought that was cute because it's like he "wore her down" and she finally fell in love with him. He waited for her.

Who in our group of SHIPs is waiting for someone to realize their feelings for them? I think that's a bad question since it could be anyone, but let's see what you have to say.

Originally posted by Earendil (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=393881#post393881))
I wish that I could get on this thread more often, but the stupid server keeps crashing and I haven't been able to get in awhile. :sigh: My apologies for not responding sooner, but it can't be helped.

Well, I'm on my first re-read and I'm happily picking up on the strong H/Hr evidence, which I happened to miss out on in my first reading due to blind horror at the more obvious R/Hr stuff. What struck me the most at first was their physical and emotional closeness (physical in the Grawp scene, for instance, and emotional in the part at the end). And I know that tons of people have already mentioned it, but the fact that there's a part in Harry's head (his conscience, maybe?) that speaks in Hermione's voice is pretty darn significant. Even if it doesn't mean that they're soulmates or whatever, it definitely means that she has had some sort of impact on him, and that's a start.

I keep getting struck by a horrible (for me, at least) thought that Ginny is being made "worthy" in this book. *gulp* I never liked her before, mostly because we barely knew anything about her, but I found myself growing quite fond of her in OotP because of her spunk and also because she proved to be tougher than she appears. Why is JK doing this?! AHH...okay, calm down, Earendil. The point that I'm trying to make is that now Ginny is a character with a personality, a sense of humor, and a pretty good friendship with Harry. She will never be as important as Hermione is, but honestly, I can't help but notice how much her chances of being with Harry have increased, despite the fact that she's gotten over him. :( Don't get me wrong, I still ship H/Hr through and through, but as I mentioned before in my first rambling post on the thread, I'm seeing potential with Ginny. (GilyAnn, I blame this on you...it's all your fault!! Gahh! ;) Just kidding.)



I feel you Earendil! That is EXACTLY how I feel about Ginny. EXACTLY! I blame Gily, as well :p

I actually didn't see any R/Hr moments. Is it just me? The whole "oh they spent the whole summer together" (which was blown out of proportion (sp?) because of Harry) and that kiss on the cheek were the only two "clues" to R/Hr. Please give me more.

Now in regards to the whole summer thing. Did anyone think at some point, like me, that Harry was jealous not because they are perhaps having fun together while he's in Privet Drive, but because of something more. ;)

I know this is in the wrong place, but since people here are giving such good posts I have to post it. You know when Harry needed to talk to Sirius and could find no way of doing it. Well did he ever think of Dobby who could apparate from Hogwarts and would do almost anything to help Harry. I just wasent sure why they didnt use Dobby instead of doing all this other stuff, thanks.

First of all a great big welcome to all of our first years. :) We look forward to sharing ideas and discussions with you all.

I would like to extend an extra welcome to all the new H/Hr shippers on this forum, or as we like to refer to ourselves HMS Harmony. So welcome aboard. There are too many of you to welcome by name so you'll forgive me for the general welcome. I would also like to point out our sister ships HMS Roony (for Ron/Luna shippers) and HMS SIGNS ( for Neville/Ginny shippers).

Once again welcome aboard. And be careful of the snacks that are offered by Mad Eye Mike and Sirius83. They've been known to slip ton toungue toffees and usnusal bertie botts flavored beans in.

Someone do me a favor and grab Grace Granger. The last time she went running around the forum she ran into me and spilled my drink all over.

Grace,

Do you know what page the part about Ginny getting over Harry is on? I can't seem to find it.

Now Back on Topic..........

Let me leave you with this. Ginny started confiding in Hermione and opening up to Hermione and being friendly with Hermione after she was over Harry. So Ginny must have seen Hermione as her biggest obstacle to Harry's heart.

So that makes 3 now Krum/Cho/Ginny who have all seen something that we don't.

And why would Ginny getting over Harry give her development just to put her back into the whole "I'm smitten with you" thing. Isn't that one step forward and 3 back?

Just a few thoughts.

Cheers!

Now in regards to the whole summer thing. Did anyone think at some point, like me, that Harry was jealous not because they are perhaps having fun together while he's in Privet Drive, but because of something more. by Grace Granger

Exactly!!!:clappy:

I have been saying that everywhere and people are like"oh you are seeing too much there"

It was in BIG LETTERS...Harry was angry because they were having fun without him TOGETHER..I also noticed that too....and then, he started hanging out more with her....

A few things in support of (and against) H/Hr:

During the fight with the Death Eaters, when the kids knock down the shelves and glass starts raining everywhere, Harry grabs Hermione's robes and leads her out of danger. Hermione, and only Hermione... we don't see Ron doing that, either!

Against H/Hr:
During the whole Hermione giving Harry dating advice thing, I couldn't help but think of my own experiences with this sort of thing. As teenagers their age, my female friends and I often hand out advice to some of my guy friends about their dates, what they should do, etc. We can't help it- it's what we do as girls... a bit of gossip mixed with knowing advice. Perhaps Hermione is doing the same thing?

I don't know if this is already on this thread or not....I suppose it is, but as I am at work, I don't have the luxury of reading all 9 pages of posts. Anyway, what I'm talking about is the fact that JKR looked disgusted (I thought) when Katie Couric asked her about a possible H/Hr relationship, and then said "Harry and Hermione? Really? Not Hermione and Ron?" I think we are getting steered in the Hr/R direction (sorry H/Hr shippers), and I hope that is where JKR is going. I think Ron and Hermione complement one another very well - and I think Harry and Ginny do as well.

I think Ginny is being made more worthy of Harry's affections - that is why we are given such insight into her character in OotP.

As far as the Harry/Cho fiasco in OotP....I don't really think it was a fiasco, and I think JKR wrote the relationship very masterfully, but I am SO glad Harry is over Cho. What a psycho girl! She needed to get a life. I was glad that Harry had his first kiss and a little romance, but I'm also VERY glad that that is all it was.

REally? I thought JKR said "Harry and Hermione! Do you think so?"

Which coming from her, of course, doesn't mean anything....She is saying all the time about Ron and Hermione, which is why I think it won't happen...she is being really mysterious

Mad-I-Moody: On that point of the interview. Doesn't it seem VERY fishy to you that JKR answered in that particular way? She has been asked the question many times before. She has always skirted the issue, always given unclear answers, etc. We also know she doesn't give away plot lines in her interviews. For her to look disgusted and say what she said, doesn't it sound like she's trying to make us think one thing while she's planning another?

Many people see this as a confirmation of R/Hr. But - her reaction was just way too extreme! It really seems as though she's trying to throw us off.

Remember: JKR does not give away her plot like that. She has been asked the same before and never seemed offended at the thought. It seems extremely weird for her to answer this the way she did. She's going to have to look the camera in the eye with a completely straight face and say "R/Hr is going to happen. H/Hr will not" to shoot down H/Hr before the final book is written.

AAACCCKKK. I keep trying to post and I keep losing things.

You know if GilyAnn turns out to be correct about H/G I think that she needs to be voted 'Best Ship Captain' here in CoS forums don't you think? Everyone is going to blame her for EVERYTHING. :lol:

I would like to know if anyone thinks it is odd that Harry's 'ex' is dating Ginny's 'ex'. I thought well that is convenient now isn't it?

Also I was wondering if the three 'couples' at the end could foreshadow something.

I really think Cho was too much on the rebound for Harry. She had some feelings for him before Cedric I think but they never were acted upon. Then when she is free to be with Harry she really isn't because she isn't over Cedric yet and that is the last person Harry wanted to talk about. It is kind of sad really. I do feel for her.

You know that I think I am more confused about ships now. I think that H/Hr is in the lead but R/Hr is sailing up fast and lastly H/G made some good ground in the 'Romance Race'.

I wonder if anyone is laying down odds in Las Vegas.

Cheers.

Edit: Oh no, please not more interviews for us to go crazy over. Make them stop!!!

Also what happened to the 'kiss' at the end of GoF? I guess it died a pitiful death. And geez, another kiss to overanalyze, this time with RON. I can't take anymore and we have got what....three years to book 6?

Originally posted by Erise

2) When that kiss happened I was anxiously rereading that portion for any indication that Harry might have been kissed - but it also seemed weird that Harry would have absolutely no reaction if he was kissed? Unless he's [I]really comfortable with it eh?



Not really. IMO the line was written that way to allow people to draw their own conclusions.

"And you Harry ---"

And you Harry what? JKR could have written "and you Harry---" said Hermione turning towards the stands. That would have been an absolute no kiss.


3) I really have to agree with that - at first I was quite horrified when Hermione appeared to have no largely visible reaction to the kiss and Harry's dating Cho, but someone on the pumpkinpie forums mentioned the frown, and my friend mentioned the way Hermione was asking Harry "What about Cho?" (or something to that extent) towards the end of the book - in that same manner. It really does make you wonder why she's so interested - even Ron, the generally more curious one (especially about girls) hadn't asked that!

Well off to bed now, and thanks for the welcome buttercup.


I would have thought that Hermione would have been brimming with advice predate. Not critiquing his actions after the fact .

True...I'm sorry, I post every 3 seconds) I'm really sorry, you guys must be tired of me.....

Well, what Sirius says is true...I really think that she doesn't even know herself how she is going to end the whole thing...I think that the hint of Ginny liking Harry was to make us notice Ginny in the Chamber of Secrets, like giving us a hint about Ginny's role....and the hints about Ron and Hermione in GoF was to make us notice Krum..there must be something about Krum that we haven't seen so far, but that we will see....JKR didn't let us forget about him by dropping the thing about Hermione writing the long letter....Besides, I really didn't think any Ron/Hermione interaction here, except Ron gettin jealous, and then JKR showed us that he does that with Ginny too.....Besides, she introduced Luna, who clearly likes Ron...
By saying all that in interviews JKR is just throwing us in the wrong path....

you know, as i started and finished the book, i really felt that harry didn't really go after cho in anyway, i mean, sure cho was on the rebound abd probally didn't know what she was doing when she kissed and ask harry out but.... harry should have used it to his advantage.

i mean in book 4 he was all over cho, couldn't keep his mind off her, and suddendly he get a date, and she walks out in a huff, really he should have tried to talk to her and bring her round.....

maybe jk is simple opening the way for another girl to get in with harry? or perhaps harry will get back with cho in another year.......
its too bad really, they would have been a funny couple to read about:love:

Ok, ive been thinking about something lately. And that would be the death of sirius. He was the last person that could stand up and say that he loved harry. Now, harry has no body. and he will definately need somebody to talk to with the whole voldemort thing going on. I see no other person that could fill this gap other than Hermione.

Why? Luna and Ginny are not developed enough. Even though ginny has now been developed a bit more. on ginny, i read somewhere in the book about ginny no longer fancying harry. ill have to look for the page.

Luna, hmmmmm, she seemed highly interested in Ron, and during the train ride, ginny had to stuff her hand in her mouth to surpress giggles. Ron then looked at them, bemused.

hmmmm. just my thoughts.

“During the whole Hermione giving Harry dating advice thing, I couldn't help but think of my own experiences with this sort of thing. As teenagers their age, my female friends and I often hand out advice to some of my guy friends about their dates, what they should do, etc. We can't help it- it's what we do as girls... a bit of gossip mixed with knowing advice. Perhaps Hermione is doing the same thing?�


She is doing exactly the same thing. I do not see Hermione giving Harry any advice on girls as a sign of them liking the other. It is her manner on top of everything else that says to me that she is not too pleased with the relationship.

two things i found odd in the book was when:

1. can't remember what chapter it was but it was at the end when harry had just thrown one of his tantrums again, but mcgonagall says to harry, "at least you listen to Hermione Granger" or something similar along them lines, to me this draws parallel to rita skeeter's article about seeing the relationship from a different viewpoint. Maybe she sees something between them?

2. i like previous posts before me is that after hermione gives her kiss on the cheek to ron, she also says "and you, Harry --". This was quite odd cos nothing was said after this and I'm sure JRK shoved this is for us 2 speculate even more. I think Hermione does something to Harry after this though I'm not sure what neither does anyone else.

“When Umbridge was going to put the crucio(sp?) spell on Harry in her office with all the others around. What did Hermione do?�

She shrieked “no�! It did strike a nerve and it also got her to come up with that rather brilliant story. Serving Umbridge to the centaurs was quite fierce for Hermione. Even Malfoy seemed to have touched a nerve in her when he insulted Harry. Platonic or not, Hermione thinks very highly of Harry. She must be to suggest that he teach her Defense Against the Dark Arts. When was the last time Hermione asked or needed any student to teach her anything?

When I got done with book 4 I wasent sure about who was going to be with who at the end. Now that I have read book 5 however there is no doubt to me that Harry will be with Hermione in the end, thanks

HMS ROONY? :rotfl: So we've got a sister ship to the HMS Harmony and SIGNS? *enthusiastically hops on board*

Well, I'm still on the first re-read and the Luna-->Ron-ness is more noticeable than ever. It's hilarious how she knows who he went to the Yule Ball with, throwing in that not-so-subtle hint about not wanting to dance much herself, and then wishing only him luck before the Quidditch game ("Ronald"...oh dear) -- and the way she went into hysterics over something stupidly funny he said. She clearly fancies him (goodness knows why, after the way he's always so rude to her) and I hope against hope that he starts to notice her in a different way too. (Poor Eloise...is the HMS Reloise still floating? I definitely think Luna is a better match for Ronniekins, but either is okay with me. As long as it's not Hermione. ;) )

I was looking over the post-Kiss part and I noticed Hermione's reaction. She's remarkably composed, which I suspect is her way of being mature and in-control, rather than pouting and behaving all jealous. Example? Her tone is described as "business-like" and "brisk" -- and then when he's talking about it with Ron, she's curiously detached. When she does speak, it's "absently" and "vaguely", while she's noticeably writing to Viktor. Now, if she is trying to make anyone jealous (doubt it) is it Harry or is it Ron? Or is she just trying to distract herself and keep her composure during this conversation by giving herself something to concentrate on? She has obviously noticed that Harry likes Cho, and that he's liked her for ages. Later, after Harry's catastrophic date, Hermione is giving him advice on how he should have treated the jealousy issue, and it even seems as if she's carefully throwing in a little hint in an attempt to discern his actual feelings for her. I don't want to start the whole "Devious Hermione the Scarlet Woman" debate, because I do NOT think that Hermione is a catty wench who toys with affections and such. I just think that she is as confused as we are about where her feelings lie, and that she needed to gauge Harry's reaction to that subtle "Mention how ugly you think I am" hint. So, long story short: Hermione has strong feelings for Harry, but she doesn't want them to get in the way of their friendship. So she reacts to his obvious crush on another girl by trying to steer him in the right direction, thinking that it will make him happy to be with Cho, and then when it doesn't work out, she tries to subtly figure out how he feels about her. Beyond that point, it's not clear. My own intuition tells me that after the Cho fiasco, Harry and Hermione definitely seemed to become much closer, sharing in the Grawp adventure and large parts of the Department of Mysteries adventure together. They actually seemed like a team, the two of them, and it was nice to see the way they took care of each other in dangerous situations. Of course, this doesn't necessarily indicate romance, but a foundation of deep friendship and trust is definitely much stronger than a superficial relationship based solely on physical attraction, don't you think?

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one having trouble getting in here!

I keep getting struck by a horrible (for me, at least) thought that Ginny is being made "worthy" in this book. *gulp* I never liked her before, mostly because we barely knew anything about her, but I found myself growing quite fond of her in OotP because of her spunk and also because she proved to be tougher than she appears. Why is JK doing this?! AHH...okay, calm down, Earendil. The point that I'm trying to make is that now Ginny is a character with a personality, a sense of humor, and a pretty good friendship with Harry. She will never be as important as Hermione is, but honestly, I can't help but notice how much her chances of being with Harry have increased, despite the fact that she's gotten over him. Don't get me wrong, I still ship H/Hr through and through, but as I mentioned before in my first rambling post on the thread, I'm seeing potential with Ginny. (GilyAnn, I blame this on you...it's all your fault!! Gahh! Just kidding.)

LOL! :p I told you were going to like her! There is a lot of things that were good about Ginny and that I though there were good for H/G but the one I never expected was the Quidditch thing. It's a big thing since Harry seems awfully fond of girls in Quidditch. That's how he liked Cho and several people have notice that Ginny was getting compared or contrast with Cho a lot. Ginny catching the Snitch in Cho's face several fellow shippers felt that it was some sort of foreshadowing. Honestly weird! The same goes for what Buttercup says it was extremelly weird that Cho is now going out with Michael Corner. Harry and Ginny Ex were both in Ravenclaw and now they are dating? Many people feel that there is something there.

Ginny gave up on Harry sentence:

It's on Page 346 of OoP American Edition

"Ginny used to fancy Harry, but she gave up on him months ago. Not that she doesn't like you, of course,"

Italics as in the books. So while Ginny gave up on Harry because she figures he would never like her. She still likes him. So if Harry ever likes Ginny he'll have to pay a bit for not pay attention to her all that time and earn her. Which it would be very interesting to read to be honest. Not to mention funny as hell! I do believe that Ginny gave up on him but as gotten over him I have my doubts. Mainly because if Ginny would have really gotten over Harry. She would have been keen to be with her boyfriend on the train on the way to Howgarts and if she really would have been with Dean (which I believe it was her way of pushing Ron's buttons, knowing now her prangsters abilities) then she would have been with him on the way to King Cross. If you don't like someone and you really have honestly given up on him and have a new found love you just don't do those things. Wouldn't Michael Corner would want his girlfriend to be with him instead of her being with famous Harry Potter? It only could cause trouble between them.

Ginny and Hermione being friends have been foreshadow ever since the beginning of GoF. It wasn't after Ginny gave up on Harry. All GoF Ginny and Hermione were close. They shared a room, had breakfast toguether, stay toguether and Hermione shared secrets with Ginny before they yule ball and before Ginny gave up on Harry. They were always very good friends. I always like that.

Ron and Hermione it happend what I expected that it would happend. Ron went thru Puberty last year (He is the oldest) While poor Harry had a hard time with that this year! So this year Ron mature a lot and was able to see and act in ways that Harry simply couldn't. It's that teenage face again. The Thing about R/Hr is that as they get older we won't see them coming around. We are probably are not going to see them when they become a couple either. If anyone notice they spend an awful lot of time toguether and they arguing was down a lot since last book. So as they become independant will get to hear less about them. I expected this to happend but I wasn't sure if JKR was going to go in that direction but it appears that she is. So it looks like that as Harry grows older his friends are going to be always his friends but the dynamics are going to change a lot. I honestly expected this, I can recall if I mention it but I though this would happend.

You know if GilyAnn turns out to be correct about H/G I think that she needs to be voted 'Best Ship Captain' here in CoS forums don't you think? Everyone is going to blame her for EVERYTHING.

LOL, LOL :p :sorry:

Also I was wondering if the three 'couples' at the end could foreshadow something.

I'm not going to go with details but yes. N/L was too cute. The funny meeting thing on the train was awfully funny. But I did feel it was some sort of foreshadowing. H/G, R/H, N/L

I can't take anymore and we have got what....three years to book 6?

She already started book 6 and she said it wasn't going to probably be that long. I honestly felt for the woman when she was interview. I would have also took 3 years to write book 5.

I really think that she doesn't even know herself how she is going to end the whole thing

I trully don't think this way. If she has written the final chapter and has sketch all the chapters. She has said more than once that she already knows what happends with everyone and how they are going to end. So I trully think she knows. I don't write anything as elaborate as this and I planned them out because if you don't you then have no idea what's going on and you could end up contradicting each other. That's mainly why when kloves ask if he can take something out he tells him yes or no. She knows what little pieces can't be taken out.

quote:
mean in book 4 he was all over cho, couldn't keep his mind off her, and suddendly he get a date, and she walks out in a huff, really he should have tried to talk to her and bring her round.....


Ok I'M REALLY, REALLY SORRY for what I'm about to say but I feel the need to get off my chest. Cho Oh boy! This girl annoyed beyond belief! What a cry baby! I mean yes I understand she lost her boyfriend but man she was ALL THE BOOK crying. I was SOOOOO happy when Harry told her 'Don't start crying now' I was like Yes! Harry tell her! I mean this was a nightmare! By the end of the book I was honestly cringing my teath at the mention of her name! It was tooo much! I mean she kisses him and she is crying! What kind of a person does that? It's no a wonder he dind't go after her. She was a crush and her actions were shooting down his emotions. I don't blame Harry, honestly! And then it appear that she had missing parts of her brain! I mean the friend thing was , the D.A. thing I felt there was no excuse for it! Honestly Cho dissapointed me and not only me it appear that Harry also was dissapointed with her.

Well I think that would be enough.
Gily Ann

I dont think the arguing with Ron and Hermione was down at all, the only time I saw it start to come down was after Harry yelled at them and told them he didnt like it.

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one having trouble getting in here!

I hate double posting! I really do! But it's so slow I don't know if it got in or not!


Gily Ann

lol, all the time I was shipping H/Hr it was known as the HMS Pumpkin Pie to me... Oh well, no matter what the name, the ship still stands =)

I'm definitely for the HMS Rooney - I did keep getting the feeling that Luna liked Ron. The feeling might be one-sided now, but you never know, do you?

v@sh - two things i found odd in the book was when:

1. can't remember what chapter it was but it was at the end when harry had just thrown one of his tantrums again, but mcgonagall says to harry, "at least you listen to Hermione Granger" or something similar along them lines, to me this draws parallel to rita skeeter's article about seeing the relationship from a different viewpoint. Maybe she sees something between them?


Yes, it's not just McGonagall (again...) who sees something, in my opinion. Even Mrs Weasley, upon reading Rita Skeeter's articles believed that Harry and Hermione were in a relationship (and I don't mean the platonic kind) which says a lot, considering that she have had the two of them staying over at her place before, and should know better if there was really anything between them right?

And yeps, as usual Harry listens to Hermione, even if Ron doesn't - something I think Ron should start doing more often if a R/Hr is supposed to happen.

Rosie. B - I am totally against the whole Harry/Hermione relationship especially since he spent so much effort in book 4 telling everyone the she is NOT his girlfriend.

Anyone else noticed that the first article regarding Harry also said that Hermione was his "steady girlfriend" but Harry only started denying that she was his girlfriend after the second article upon seeing that Hermione was taking a lot of heat from everyone, especially Mrs Weasley? And we don't see Hermione denying it either, do we? ;)

Oh, there was Harry telling Viktor there was nothing between him and Hermione... but I can't remember it was before or after he explained to Mrs Weasley. And besides, I believe that Harry has not developed feelings for Hermione and vice versa... yet.

I dont think that Harry could last long in any relationship other than one with Hermione. There have been alot of other people who have said this but I dont think that the person Harry was with could stand having Hermione always closer to him and there is no way he would ever leave her, thanks.

Hawk, don't worry I'll be stopping shortly and I promise not to spill anymore drinks. I say that there is a possibility for Harry and Ginny, but doesn't mean that I believe it! :p Sorry Gily.

I did what you said Hawk and looked up the page you wanted me to look up. Here here goes:

OoP Chapter 16 - In the Hog's Head P. 348
Ginny used to fancy Harry, but she gave up on him months ago. Not that she doesn't like you, of course," she (Hermione) added kindly to Harry while she examined a long black-and-gold quill.

Harry, whose head was still full of Cho's parting wave, did not find this subject quite interesting as Ron, who was positively quivering with indignation, but it did bring something home to him that until now he had not really reigstered.

"So that's why she talks now?" he asked Hermione. "She never used to talk in front of me." (Emphasis mine)

This confirms to me that Ginny is not interested in Harry. The whole "not that she doesn't like you" bit made me think that Hermione was only re-assuring Harry that it's not that she hates you and your personality as a whole. She likes you as a friend.
Then there's Harry who's still thinking about Cho and then he's like: hang on so that's why she didn't talk to me. And that's it.

hermownninny, although Harry states lots of times about Ron and Hermione being together this is the one that makes me suspicious:

OoP Chapter 4 - Number Twelve Grimmauld Place P. 68
"Harry snorted. He walked around the room again, looking anywhere but at Ron and Hermione. "So what have you two been doing if you're not allowed in meetings?" he demanded. "You said you'd been busy." (Emphasis mine)

Harry demanded to know what they were doing! Uh, fiesty isn't he? I was waiting for a busy doing what, alas he didn't say.

I'm apart of HMS Roony? I didn't know that. :huh: I'm not sure it'll work out, but I think it'd be cute to have quirky Luna as Ron's girl. So please pass me by life-saver just in case I start to disagree and someone wants to push me off the SHIP. :D

Now about the whole H/C kiss and Hermione's reaction to it. I don't see anything wrong with Hermione giving Harry advice. A lot of girls, who are and aren't interested in their friends, give them advice. As said by sone, it's her mannerisms and facial expression. Ms. Straight-Forward is holding her tongue. Why? Because when have we ever heard Hermione speak "business-like" and she had a "slight frown" when she's happy for Harry, when she's always supporting him. She doesn't hold back her feelings, unless she has to. It's as though she wants to know, but afterwards is bothered so she acts as though it isn't bothering her. She's quite the actress, isn't she? Where's the proof? Well just take a look at the chapter containing Hermione's "breakdown" in front of Umbridge.

Edit: Note how Hermione becomes disinterested after she finds out that Harry and Cho did indeed kiss. And becomes part of the conversation again after Harry doubts he is a good kisser.

Speaking of breakdown, oh yeah sone, Hermione thinks rather highly of Harry. Always had in my opinion and I don't mean that SHIP-wise.

Must we speak of the interviews. :( She's just too tricky!

Edit: Yes McGonagall came out of left field with that comment. Hermione wasn't even mentioned in the conversation.

The whole relationship with cho in book 5, really emphasized to me that the only person right for Harry is Hermione, or no one at all. Well i take that back, now that i think of the relationship between James and Lily. They were kind of on rough terms there at harry's age haha. Anyway to what i was saying. Harry realizes that Cho was only a physical attraction, and that Hermione is the only one that can spark interest to him emotionally and through intelligence and experience. She is the only one who can relate with many of his problems. I hope they get together, but if they do ill feel bad for Ron. Unless he starts dating Luna which would be really cool :) My 2 cents

Does anyone stop to think about the death of sirius in relation to all of this? hmmm. guess not, since no one replied to it. but im seeing some good points being made. Who knows, during the live broadcast tommorow, she might answer a relation ship wise question! Wouldnt that be cool...

hermione can spark intrest through more than emotions or intelligance. have we forgotten the kiss on the cheek in book 4?

I'm not sure about that... I still feel Ginny has feelings for Harry... However, now that she has confided in Hermione and Hermione has sort of "guided" her along on what to do, Ginny has grown up and knows that she cannot keep quiet in front of Harry if she wanted to pursue a relationship.

About her going out with Dean, I suppose that was just Ginny trying to tease Ron, nothing more.

This part shows Ginny likes -> Harry, one way only.

Harry gets jealous when he finds out that Ron and Hermione have been together for quite a bit.

Grace Granger: "Harry snorted. He walked around the room again, looking anywhere but at Ron and Hermione. "So what have you two been doing if you're not allowed in meetings?" he demanded. "You said you'd been busy."

So this could be mean Harry likes -> Hermione, but maybe not one way only.

Hermione also seems quite fond of Harry, and there are lots of clues about that, listed in many posts below.

Faye: During the fight with the Death Eaters, when the kids knock down the shelves and glass starts raining everywhere, Harry grabs Hermione's robes and leads her out of danger. Hermione, and only Hermione...

So this could mean Hermione likes -> Harry too.

Ron however, as many have noticed, likes Hermione. He gives her perfume for Christmas, and rubs his cheek after Hermione kisses him.

So Ron likes -> Hermione, but so far I feel one way only.

Luna seems to have taken a liking to Ron. (Can't remember where but I think it was in the train compartment.) but Ron obviously doesn't think much about Luna, yet.

If so, this is Luna likes -> Ron, one way only.

As for Cho, well, I've always liked her until Book 5, in which she behaved so emotionally. If I were Harry, I would try to forget about her soon, despite:

Grace: Harry, whose head was still full of Cho's parting wave, did not find this subject quite interesting as Ron...

At this point Harry would probably be "re-living" the moments of their relationship, and not thinking of how to pursue it.

Hence, Cho likes -> Cedric, no one else, not even Michael Corner. She's in an emotional mess.

So if you ask me, counting the who likes who bit, I would say Harry and Ginny, Ron and Hermione, and Cho and Luna get left out of the picture.

How did I come to this conclusion? I guess Hermione has not shown much towards Ron yet eh? But I'm for this pairing so that they will become one big Weasley family! :love:

Just a few thoughts.

Necron

aggro, I'll answer your question. I'd like to think that Hermione can fill that void, but the relationship that Sirius had with Harry is different from the one us H/Hr'ers want for Harry and Hermione.

Harry has a few people who can fill that "father gap." You have Dumbledore, Lupin and Mr. Weasley.

I'd like to say that I no one as of yet has told Harry that they love him and I honestly think that Hermione will be the first. I am not plugging HMS Harmony here. I'm serious. Hermione has become Ms. Emotional. In one of Harry's fits of rage, he will say something more or less "no one loves me or cares about me" and she'll be like "I love you and care for you Harry." (Did that sound sappy or what! :rotfl: Didn't mean to, honestly?)

Now can someone answer my question: Is it Her-MY or Her-Me?

its hermy, if you mean prononciation. listen to the tapes of movies to hear it completely though. or is it not prononciation. hmmmm. never thought about the whole fit of rage thing. but i dont think harry will be as enraged as he will be depressed.

Ach! Just noticed something else in support of H/Hr!

Hermione has started calling Voldemort Voldemort-- it shows up early in their fifth year with a nice little stutter when she first says it. Seems to me as if she's doing that to show some support for Harry. After all, at that point only he and a select group of people said Voldemort's name. Ron was still whimpering through it... don't recall if that changed after a while.

“Harry gets jealous when he finds out that Ron and Hermione have been together for quite a bit.�

Something like that was the furthest thing from his mind. No, he is upset at the fact that they did not tell him anything about what has been going on. They didn’t even tell him that they couldn’t tell him anything. He was desperate for answers from the very people he had grown to count upon and they gave him useless responses. If anything, it made Harry feel alone and unimportant.

I think you are right, sone. No romance there. Just ticked off at being left out of the action.

If you're going to build up Harry and Cho for as long as JK did, at least give us a LITTLE more than that... I mean.. eh... Have it last for a little while at least.

Good for Ginny, she's coming across as the only semi-sane one in the entire family... every family has one, you know it.:devil:

There is really a huge amount of H/H fans out there, I don't know why. When reading through the books I've never picked up anything remotely like romantic interest.

Ron and Hermione however there has been some interest going both ways. Major problem here is Ron gaining enough confidence to do something about it.

Does anyone else find it interesting that Hermione is handing out romance advice, it sounds to me that Krum and a her are a little for than pen pals. lol

harry and cho, harry and cho, harry and cho,

:)
well....i really hope so

i think harry really like cho, at the end he just didny care becose he was so upset...do did i .... :'(

I've been noticing something since the start of this thread, and it's really getting more pronounced the further along we go. It seems as if H/Hr shippers see the book one way, while R/Hr shippers see it another way. H/Hr shippers do not see much evidence in support of R/Hr in the book, but see plenty of support for H/Hr. R/Hr shippers see the exact opposite. Big difference in interpretation, eh? So, this brings up the question: Are we seeing what's in the book, or are we seeing what we want to see?

Alright, just to clear something up: Us H/Hr shippers don't see anything unusual with Hermione giving Harry advice with his relationship with Cho. What's intriguing is that she was described as saying it "in a businesslike manner" and "vaguely" and "distantly". Now, if Hermione's happy for Harry, you wouldn't expect that she would sound that way, would you?

Here's another thing that I've found interesting:

OotP British Hardcover, Beyond the Veil, page 700
Such a powerful wave of relief swept thorugh Harry that for a moment he felt light-headed.

Now, this is very different to his reaction when he found Ginny alive in CoS. Just thought that I should point that out. :)

Great posts everyone -- Cheers!

pssst... it's not about the shipping.

that said, I think canon can go in any direction at this point. Even H/G, which prior to OotP made me want to hurl. Lots of stuff there for all ships. I still don't think Hermione likes Ron. I do think Luna likes Ron though.

We shall see!

*keeping an open mind*

I see, you were discussing here lately about Voldie and Harry- that V know who is close to Harry. I think Severus Snape won't stop teaching him Occlumency. He can't. Not now. It is obvious Harry still need it. He is still in danger. Everyone is. Severus knows it is very important Harry to learn it. I suppose Harry knows, too. One of these two will decide to start Occlumency lessons again.

I think it's sad that people think Ron and Hermione like each other because they fight. No one seems to think Harry lo0o0oves everyone...but he certainly did alot of fighting didn't he? Ah...but I digress. Really, I don't think that they're fighting means anything, considering they fought before they were even friends.
As for Harry/Cho....Harrys such a dolt...even I coulda weasled my way outta that one and Im horrible with women....>.>...<.<...

LOL... I'm with LizardLaugh with the H/G shipping. Just thinking about that shipping bugged me to no end. I didn't like how Ginny was protrayed as the doting, quiet girl on the side that Harry will never notice.

Honestly, I am am R/Hr shipper, but I saw hinting for all ships in this book, and it killed me.

Harry and Hermione, had yet another little adventure together. Plus, there was a lot of physical contact between the two. Not to mention their friendship has grown stronger over time. Hermione seems to have a better understanding of Harry than Harry has of himself. But she came off as jealous at times and then sisterly. Like the ugly comment, it seemed like she was fishing for something, and why did she tell him to meet her on Valentine's Day when she knew he was with Cho? But when she was advising him about the kiss, and explaining that Cho was jealous, and so on. She came off as a big sister advising her younger brother.

But in Ron and Hermione's case there were still subtle hints. Ron was far more obvious. But one thing that stood out to me, was Hermione's comment about how Harry was worse than Ron, when it came to handling his feelings with girls. Yet, took it back when she saw Ron come in. I got this feeling as though, she wanted Ron to see something he hadn't yet. Then their arguements took a different turn. It didn't seem like it was a conflict of personalities anymore. It seemed like habit, and even more so they argued whenever Ron refused to back her up when approaching his brothers or another student about their behavior. I immediately thought of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley. How the argue when Mr. Weasley is not nearly as anxious to scold their children as Mrs. Weasley. It was even mentioned in the book, how Ron and Hermione reminded Harry of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley. I found it interesting that was mentioned at all, and I think more than once.

As for Ginny I was thrilled for her getting over Harry, but just to fall back in? Even more so Ron wants them together? I always thought he would be the over-bearing big brother type. But I suppose that's changed as well. I just knew the H/G thing was out the door, until the grin and the look away at the end of the book. :sigh: Maybe that was a misinterpret, but those two will become closer. I was especially fond of the scene when Ginny gets on Harry about being possesed by Voldemort. He was going through his misunderstood phase again, when she put him in his place. Reminded him that he is not the only victim, and he's not alone. I was getting sick of his misunderstood hero act...

As for Harry and Cho... I'm thrilled that's over.

Luna seems to be found of both Ron and Harry in my opinion. Though I think she and Harry will grow closer, seeing how they share a bit of a connection.

But everyone has failed to mention Bill and Fleur. Who called that shipping? I cracked up... Bill volunteering to give Fleur private English lessons? :lol: Maybe we'll get to see a wizard wedding by the 6th or 7th book.

Okay. Let me redeem myself here. In my last post, I said that I am a bit having second thoughts about H/H even if I am a H/H shipper. Well, I scanned the book again this afternoon and now, I still don't know where I stand.

I like H/H. Honest. But I just can't see anything that will thoroughly convince me that it will happen for sure. I've read in the other posts that the fact that Harry and Hermione do a lot of things together in the book tell all of us in the face that H/H will happen. But from my point of view, those instances don't show any romantic hints between the two. It's just purely platonic to me. I do LOVE the idea of Harry and Hermione but trouble is I just can't see it. Convince me please?

Now about Ron and Hermione. I really don't like this ship but if it happens, fine with me. Well, a lot were convinced that by book 5, we will see something growing between these two but as in my opinion, I don't see anything hard-core evidence that they will happen. I kinda saw something about Ron's feelings for Hermione but that's it. It's not two-way it's one way. I dunno but am I missing something here?

Now about H/G. I am kinda liking the idea even before OotP came. I said to myself that if Ginny doesn't develop her character by book 5, she's definitely out of Harry's love life. But as we all read, Ginny's character developed and to me, Ginny is great. Okay not as great as Hermione but she was just great in OotP. Her getting over HArry set the score to me. And besides, if H/H doesn't happen, I'd rather see her as Harry's girlfriend than Cho. The thing is, even if I'm not really convinced she's the One, I'm kinda seeing that it will happen. To be honest, these thoughts kinda freaks my H/H-loving self.

As a result, even if I LOVE H/H, I still have a STRONG feeling that H/G will happen. And basing my opinions about R/H, I see that the trio will be involved with other people.

Just some (crazy) thoughts and good posts everyone.

Cheers.

Has anyone mention that Harry couldn´t look at Hermione as she get he isn´t a prefect? Its kinda odd that Harry can look at Ron, Fred and Georg and even at Mrs. Weasley but not at Hermione. He avoid her eyes.

Hawk 92: You can add Ron to our list. Because how he react as Hermione said Harry isn´t a bad kisser and how he react as they told him they didn´t saw the game and off course that he seems to think Harry would be a better match for Ginny.
I bet he is suspicious I mean Hermione advice him around to look after Harry or to tell him something from her. I wonder why he never think or said its kinda stupid that she don´t do it herself?

For Ginny and Neville: Its interest that Ginny disagree that sharply that he isn´t nobody. Do you don´t think its odd that Neville could be easiely the-boy-who-lived, too? I mean think about it Ginny had a crush at Harry mainly because he is TBWL and now we know Neville has a connection to Harry. Wouldn´t it be interest if Ginny really falls now for Neville? It would fit for canon. I have to add that Neville is only in the office of Umbridge because off Ginny and its Ginny and Neville who managed to escape from the slytherins. That let me think? Its more hints as for H/G.

For Ron and Luna: Well, Ron shut up directly as she starts to act that strange, didn´t he? Hermione could never manage it that way, could she? He don´t take her seriously and thats the point what let me think well this could easiely happen. By the way she believes in strange things like Ron in POA.

FP, consider it done. :)

Alot of people are saying that Hermione and Ron are like Mr. and Mrs. Weasley. Hmm, I've never seen Ron act like his Dad. He seems to be more like his mother.

Now when Molly is yelling at him Arthur just kind of sits there and takes it quietly. Fred or George (I forget which one) also pointed out that their Dad was not the sort to get upset easily. In fact that point was driven home because he got upset enough to yell at Percy.

Now I was told alot how Ron was this passionate, jump to conclusions, act first and think later kind of guy. Nothing like Arthur. And I didn't see him become Arthur like in OotP. Sorry Ron still reminds me of Molly.

As for Ginny I was thrilled for her getting over Harry, but just to fall back in?

This bugs me about H/G as well. Ginny had to be brought out of the whole I'm soo in love with Harry to be developed just to put her back into that shell. It's like saying that Ginny had to become Harry's friend to become a more likely romantic interest but Hermione is too much of a friend to become a romantic interest. And that thinking confuses me. Plus as Grace pointed out that whole she still likes you but she's over you seemed to me to be added as an after thought. And at least to me Harry seemed relieved by the fact that Ginny had gotten over him. You take the tension out to make them more relaxed to add the tension back in is kind of messy to me.

Now I'm not saying that H/G is sunk, because I still think that anything is possible up until the last page of Book 7, but if Ginny pulls another disappearing act, like what happened in Cos to PoA. Then I will seriously doubt this ship. Besides I still like Ginny and Neville, now they remind me of Arthur and Molly:)

Cheers!

Is it only me or has Hermione less her interest in Quiditch after Harry isn´t anymore in the team?
Ah this quote where Hermione said that her happienes don´t lay on if Ron keep goals or not? Well, this let me think off course not because Harry catch the snitch and than is everything again allright. Never thought about it that its really not Ron who has that game in his hands? Thats why its don´t matter really if the other team makes that much goals as long as Harry get the snitch?! Its true, isn´t it? If you a fan of quiditch you look at the seeker and not to the keeper.

I should end with this.

Alot of people are saying that Hermione and Ron are like Mr. and Mrs. Weasley. Hmm, I've never seen Ron act like his Dad. He seems to be more like his mother.

Actually Harry confirms us that in this book. When he said that it made reminded him an awful lot of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley.

For Ginny and Neville: Its interest that Ginny disagree that sharply that he isn´t nobody.

This has nothing to do with shipping Neville. She also defends Hagrid. Tell Neville that it's only Luna inside the compartment. Etc.

As for Ginny I was thrilled for her getting over Harry, but just to fall back in? Even more so Ron wants them together? I always thought he would be the over-bearing big brother type. But I suppose that's changed as well. I just knew the H/G thing was out the door, until the grin and the look away at the end of the book. Maybe that was a misinterpret, but those two will become closer. I was especially fond of the scene when Ginny gets on Harry about being possesed by Voldemort. He was going through his misunderstood phase again, when she put him in his place. Reminded him that he is not the only victim, and he's not alone. I was getting sick of his misunderstood hero act...

I don't think it's about getting over him. I have my doubts that she ever did. I think she got better at hiding his feelings for him. So it's not about giving her a crush to make her fall back in. If Harry likes Ginny in future books. He will have to EARN her love. She is not waiting for him so he has to redeem himself and try to get her back. I personally don't think it was about getting Ginny out of the shell. Because I personally didn't see anything on Ginny's personality that wasn't there in the last four books. No one believe me and a few said that I was reading too much into the lines but everything that was brought out about Ginny was there from the beggining the only thing that I didn't see it coming was Quidditch but other fellow H/G shippers were not surprised at it. Then again I am a very lousy sports person.

Does anyone stop to think about the death of sirius in relation to all of this? hmmm. guess not, since no one replied to it. but im seeing some good points being made. Who knows, during the live broadcast tommorow, she might answer a relation ship wise question! Wouldnt that be cool...

::breaths deeply:: Yes Agro I do see something in relation to this. But I won't go into details. I don't want to start anything.

Gily Ann

First of all the neat possibility of pairing off the Rescue Mission Six is way too neat for JKR. Any combination how wonderful it sounds - be it H/G, R/Hr, N/L or H/H R/L, N/G or N/Hr, R/H, L/G... whatever - it's too good to be true.

I hate to be talking about Book Six, but the fact that the reader can easily imagine those people to be paired off with each other, is the ultimate sign that not all of them are going to survive. And Dead!Someone/Someone else is not an acceptable ship.

So I am rather reluctant to place any bets on Rooney or Ginny ships. Yes, I even start to wibble for Hermione. I blame OotP aka "Rowling can pull anything and we have to accept it."


Personally I thought that the "Hermione acts to Ron like Mrs Weasley to Mr Weasley" comment was a near-fatal blow to any romance R/Hr tension might have held. You know, there is one way two freshly-in-love people should not act like and this way is "like they spend already at least twenty-five years as a married couple."

When they already act like that when they are fifteen, hormonal teenagers being in love - how will they act in ten, fifteen years?

Luna is the most well defined character JKR has ever created . Luna hasn't been mentioned so far as far as i remember and Now she ends up fighting the Death eaters . The Only NON GRYFFINDOR of the group mark you.
Luna Laughs loudly at Ron's Joke , also comes and tells Harry that she believes him

Another point i want to make "would you mind not offending those few who believe me"
Hermione says "you can do better than her"

JKR seems to have opened up a lot of possibilities without commiting herself to much of anyhting, romance-wise. The many ways people are reading things seems to confirm that.

Even Harry/Cho seems to be not totally dead, but less important than it was. Or maybe I'm just reading stuff into it. Harry says he feels nothing, but things change.

As to the rest, I really Like Luna. She is a new, fresh character and seems to fit in well with the trio, possibly making them a quartet. Or sextet if we add Ginny and Neville.

So with six people, Harry, Ron, Hermione, Ginny, Neville and Luna we can get 9 possibilities of romance.

Many possibilities. Much fanfic to come.

Well, to me the Harry Cho relationship is dead. At least to Harry. The scene where Ron points Cho out to Harry means something. When they made eye contact, Cho blushed, obviously still not in control of her emotions towards him. However, Harry did not react in any embaressment or blushes, he merely looked at her without having the signs of peculiar feelings in his stomach, which throughout the book has come up every time he looks at her....not this time though.

This to me says that the relationship is done, Harry no longer feels the same way for Cho as he has. This is backed up by the fact that he really didn't feel any distress when he heard that she was with someone else. If he really still liked her, he would have probably felt some type of jealousy...incidentally, he didn't.

8 mate... incest, whatever they tell you, isn't best.

Oops, my bad. I was just considering male/female. You're right, Raistlin. Ron/Ginny is a definite no-no. 8 it is.

(Of course, we might discover someone is someone else's long-lost whatever and have more potential incest issues, but that's way too soap-operaish for JKR).

I think Harry/Cho is dead. While there is an attraction there, Cho wanted to be close to Harry in OotP as much to get information about Cedric as anything else. She needed information to help give her closure that only Harry had. Harry wasn't close enough with her to talk to her about it.

I liked the passage where Harry thought to himself that Ron and Hermione arguing back and forth reminded him of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley. I think Ron will begin to figure out his feelings over the summer and I think Hermione is writing letters to Viktor on purpose while Ron is around to make him jealous.

Ecthelion, I agree with you -- Harry is definitely over Cho (thank goodness). I do think that he needed to actually spend a little more time with her to get past these stupid crush feelings, and once he got to know her a little better, it seems that he realized that they just weren't right for each other. Good thing too. I'm sure that she's a nice girl, but she definitely is not the girl for Harry, as proven by the way that he has no reaction upon hearing that she's dating Michael Corner. (Incidentally, is Michael in Ginny's year? If he is, that would make him two years younger than Cho. :wow: )

Kia mentioned that the six at the end will probably not tie up together in a neat little box because that's not JK's style, and I agree (as much as I would like it to happen.) I see H/Hr, R/L, and N/G as being absolutely perfect, but knowing the way these books go, nothing is going to tie up so neatly and make one big happy family. Meaning that one or more of this nice little group will probably end up kicking the bucket in the near future. Still, any way you look at it, any couple has the possibility of being torn up before the end of the series, so it's hard to imagine the long-term romances. The only couple that I can see lasting beyond book 7 is Harry/Hermione (duh).

Cho seems to like guys who are younger then her doesn't she? Shows what kind of mentality she has.


Actually Harry confirms us that in this book. When he said that it made reminded him an awful lot of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley.

Harry confirms that they reminded him of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley in that moment and that moment only because Hermione is looking for Ron to back her up. Which is one of the very few occurances throughout the book because they still argue.


Another point i want to make "would you mind not offending those few who believe me"Hermione says "you can do better than her"

Oh yeah and I bet she's thinking it's her. ;)


Bill and Tonks, anyone? HMS Bonks?! :D

What do R/Hr'ers think of the Harry and Hermione's arguments? Are they in the same level of "tension" as the Ron and Hermione arguments?

Originally posted by Grace Granger (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=395705#post395705))
Cho seems to like guys who are younger then her doesn't she? Shows what kind of mentality she has.

Cedric was older than her. And I am not a huge fan of Cho-dissing. Harry was quite an insensitive prat when it came to dealing with her grief and the fact that he was her rebound guy. So blaming it all on Cho is actually adopting Harry's totally biased point of view without questioning it. Which is never a good idea. *coughsomanythingsIcouldinserthererightnowcough*

For me the H/Hr ship just has too much steam at the moment. I think that book 5 had so many subtile hints of H/HR. But for me the biggest clues relating to H/HR is

*** the "voice in Harry's head the speaks in Hermiones voice"
***Harry's comment about finally noticing Hermione's looks.
***Hermione defending Harry to the point of possibly killing Umbridge in the forbidden forest. (She knew that the next adult there might get the axe. And this was not killing on the spur on the moment but a thinking plan of offing someone)
***Harry grabbed Hermione in the MoM and ran off with her, not anyone else.
***When he say that she was alive (the way JKR describe it) was such relief that only comes for love not just like.

Those are the few that stand out the strongest.

Quote: Another point i want to make "would you mind not offending those few who believe me"
Hermione says "you can do better than her"

What she meant by that was you can get better allies than her, because Luna believes anything that doesent have any proof or evidence to back it up, I dont think it had anything to do with Harry going after Luna at all.

And now what this post is about:
I am sure some of you have thought of this but I have only seen one post here that even mentions it (I might have missed them so dont attack me plase). JKR said,
1. She wont kill Harry, Ron or Hermione.
2. This is the beginning of the deaths.
If Sirius' death is the beginning of the deaths and she isnt going to kill Harry, Ron or Hermione do you really think she is going to keep Ginny, Neville, and Luna all alive in the end so all these posts on how they are going to get together with any of the main characters seems very unlikely to me, thanks.

Originally posted by Grace Granger (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=395705#post395705))
Cho seems to like guys who are younger then her doesn't she? Shows what kind of mentality she has.

Cedric was older than her. And I am not a huge fan of Cho-dissing. Harry was quite an insensitive prat when it came to dealing with her grief and the fact that he was her rebound guy. So blaming it all on Cho is actually adopting Harry's totally biased point of view without questioning it.

Don't forget Fate that JKR said that Harry and Hermione have a platonic relationship :)

*Groan* Back to the quotes again...not that there's anything wrong with the quotes, it's just that they've been picked over so many times to the point where I wish she would stop giving interviews altogether. About the platonic quote: She did say that they are platonic friends, not that they will always be. While anti-H/Hr shippers counter this by saying that she never used a time qualifier in that sentence, I honestly don't think that she needs to. If she wanted to give us a clue about the future status of any relationship between Harry and Hermione, she could have easily said, "They'll always be just platonic friends".

But anyway, I try to avoid the interview quotes because they're so darn vague. The evidence from canon is far more convincing, because as the author, JK has the right to choose what to tell us and what to mislead us with if she would rather that we were steered in a different direction in order to be surprised later.

HMS Bonks?! :rotfl: Nice one, Grace!

Don't forget Fate that JKR said that Harry and Hermione have a platonic relationship

And lets not forget that JKR said the answer to Hermione liking Ron for more than a friend lies in Gof.

And now, even after OotP, everybody says that Ron likes Hermione but she doesn't like him yet. So Hr/R cannot happen then either.

And lets not forget that JKR said that in book 5 Ginny would have a bigger role and she didn't say anything about book 6 or 7.

So if you go by the quotes H/Hr, Hr/R and H/G are all dead in the water.

Let those who live by the quotes, die by the quotes.

Cheers!

I did expect the Harry and Cho bit to run it's course, but as some may already know, I was repulsed by that kiss..

I did giggle when JKR slyly slipped in the event. I tried to think "Oh how sweet." but such thoughts or feeligs didn't come, and when Harry described it I really thought I'd be sick. !!Yeesh!!

Then her antics of bringing up Cedric at every blanking romantic interlude and getting all misty about it ****** me off too. Gee girl do you know anything about getting together with a guy? Personally she was self absorbed and an overreactive jealous Git.

On to better things:

I honestly believe Ron and Hermione are destined, but I think I keep seeing hints of an attraction of some sort between Harry and Hermione. Not sure cause the "hints" are vauge but they are many too.

I did not notice the perfume gift from Ron to Hermione. (My head was swimming with the events of Mr. Weasly's attack and all...) But after I realized, "Oh." I thought, there are hints to a romantical interest in OOtP 'tween the two bickering birds (Perhaps they are just twitterpated.)

I thought the Ginny and her boyfs was an excellent peice of character developement. The Girl is so cool and mature in this book. Cool.

Luna Lovegood.....hmmm. I wouldn't mind seeing her and Harry as a couple...they both have this weird death thing going on...and they are both intellegent with mysterious insight....they definately have a good understanding of one another (or at least I think such an understanding would develope quite naturally between them)

But for a minute there I thought Luna was digging Ron.

Ginny and Neville would be cute. I thought they'd end up together but I don't know...

Looked like Ron has some thoughts of his own who Ginny should be dating..."Uh Hem.." Harry perhaps?

First Michael Corner is on Harry's year. But in Ravenclaw.
To answer Grace's question:

Harry confirms that they reminded him of Mr. and Mrs. Weasley in that moment and that moment only because Hermione is looking for Ron to back her up. Which is one of the very few occurances throughout the book because they still argue.

Yes that's what I said that Harry said that they reminded him of Mr. & Mrs. Weasley and then later on Ron says that Hermione sounded like his mother. :??:

What do R/Hr'ers think of the Harry and Hermione's arguments? Are they in the same level of "tension" as the Ron and Hermione arguments?

I'm sorry to say that they aren't. Please don't jump out on me and say that this is very convenient of me. I'm answering your question on my interpretation. Someone on another forum was discoussing that H/Hr are good friends who make a nice team but R/Hr make a good couple. I think that is an excellent explanation. H/Hr are better suited for other people when it comes to love issues.

Hermione understood Cho very well simply because like Cho. Hermione also wallows in emotion. Harry can't deal with that, because he himself does that also. Harry needs someone that can help him forget, understand and put him on his place. Ron does that for Hermione the same goes for Ginny to Harry. I know it sounds convenient for my ship. But I don't see this as shipping I see this from a personality point of view.

For some reason when H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other. Harry snaps heavily at Hermione while she wallows in emotion and snaps back at him with the worst she has. When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere. When H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other to the point that they aim for all the bad stuff of the other one, not getting anywhere. Hermione's mothering is answered by Harry with scolds and resent, something that she doesn't deserve. But in a way she treats him like a child, someone that needs taking care which Harry doesn't need. Ginny on the other hand while she snaps at him also. Treats him like an equal. Example of it is the Voldemort thing and this other one:

"Hi," said Ginny uncertainly. "We recognised Harry's voice. What are you yelling about?"

"Never you mind," Harry said roughly.

Ginny raised her eyebrows.

"There's no need to take that tone with me," she said coolly. "I was only wondering if I could help."

Just to name a few. On the contrary to Hermione; Ginny doesn't treat Harry like her child, little brother or nobody younger than her (this mainly because since everybody treats her that way she avoids doing it to others. Ex. Mrs. Weasley not letting her stay for the OoP, Ron and even Harry himself.) Ginny treats like an equal. Treating someone like they don't know what they are doing only causes resentment, something that Ginny has felt a lot with Mrs. Weasley hovering around her constantly. Yes she snaps at him but seeks not to scolds at him. Which in return makes Harry stop drowining in self pity and concentrate on what's important. The issue that he is having at that moment. Ginny doesn't force Harry to understand the issue, she points it to him. Which in return makes him be more open minded. Hermione on the other hand scolds and forces Harry to understand which makes him resentfull and withdrawn.

So to finally answer your question I personally never said that they arguing was cute because they had tension. I always said that it was a phase. And I was right on that. Ron is the oldest of the three while Hermione is a girl. Girls mature faster than boys but since Ron is the oldest puberty and the teenager phase was hitting him last year while this year is hitting Harry full force. Ron and Hermione had mature last year. This year it was Harry's turn. But there is a difference between the tension that R/Hr had or have against the one that H/Hr have. R/Hr tension has a base on their (IMO) personal attraction to each other. R/Hr bicker over little stuff. H/Hr fight over issues and then they bring out the worst of each other. R/Hr can simply touch each other physically or do some things that H/Hr have done simply because the mutual attraction won't let them. Hermione can grab Harry easily because (IMO) she is not atracted to him. Granted not everyone is like that but it appears to me that it is this way in this case. Hermione hasn't grabbed Ron simply because it's her own attraction what won't let her. The same goes for Ron. I honestly feel that H/Hr are very good friends. I don't want that to change. But when it comes to Love I think they are better made for other people.

Gily Ann

^
Firstly, I am NOT a Hermione-hater. She happens to be one of my favorite characters, but I also enjoy reading analytically, and that means bashing the folks I like...

In my opinion, Hermione treats Harry like a child simply because that is what she does with most of her peers. She treats people like children because she feels intillectually superior to them. Perhaps she may treat Harry like someone on "her level" if she is knocked down a few notches (or Harry is bumped up a few in her opinion)-- lperhaps after the OWL results come back?

She acts in sort of the same way towards Ron as well. All throught the series, Hermione has fussed over the two of them on homework and rule-breaking matters. It's just a part of her personality, one that prevents her at this point from entering a relationship with either of the two.

The romance was handled well in this book but not what I expected. The book in general was different that I expected. I now see book 5, 6, and 7 as one big book. There wasn't really a central story or conflict to overcome. It was a huge transitional period for all the characters and there really wasn't any time for romance, they are now maturing. Rowling left me without any real clue as to what will happen in the area of love.

Rowling has made it clear that there is R/Hr attraction. With only two books left, I don't see time for Hr to jump between H and R. My best guess is that R and Hr will end up together and H will feel jelous for a short while. H normally gets everything, you see this thinking develop in OotP from H himself. Allowing H and Hr be together would just leave R with nothing. The biggest problem with any H/Hr/R attraction is no one has any idea what Hr's feelings are. So far, Hr has treated them the same in most areas.

H/G was my other guess for a pairing. R and H could be related if he marries G and if R marries Hr it all ties up nicely. I don't see G behavior as "bad", I see it normal if anything at that age. The way kids are at that age now(I was there about 4 years ago), I would have expected H/Hr/R to have a love triangle already. The way G is developing, she could be great with H...hmm...will they compete for seeker spot next year? We all know Harry will get it over her but could be interesting. G has a fire about her that seems to be coming out, she can definately attract a guy's attention.

Now we have the dark horse, Luna Lovegood. With her trowning into the mix, who knows. I personally think that Luna and Neville would be too cute. Just remember, only two books left and a lot of plot that's non-romance. Time constraints restricts a lot of swapping and triangle stuff. I think JK will keep it simple. Too much drama and flip flopping will ruin any thought of pure true deep feelings and leave us with a teeny bopper crush "thinks they are in love forever and ever adults can't tell us how we feel syndrome." As, another thought. Who is to say that all 3 will live through the last book?

yeah, but i wouldn't want Harry to be liking Ginny when everybody else likes her too...he would be in a conflict with Dean Thomas and all the boyfriends she had..I don't really see them together...

As of Ron and Hermione..I really wouldn't like to see Hermione in Mrs. Weasley's role, you know...it just doesn't go with Hermione...

I noticed that as well, the bit where ron was telling ginny who she should be dating, with a suggestive glance at harry. I think he is fully aware of the situation and wants to square it off. But there lies the problem. You dont always get what you want. And Hermiones feelings as well are still hidden.

P.S.- It is more than natural to have a good 10 or so boy/girl friends in Jr.High. I would know, but im still on my first. Lucky me its lasted for a year now!

I was a little disappointed that Harry's relationship with Cho sorta ended without him knowing. When I was reading the last chapter I was just waiting for his conversation with Cho and was expecting them to end it off but on good terms. I think Harry is over her and thats good cuz i think he just had a crush and then he got to know her and realized it wouldn't work. Do you think the misceltoe* Sp. just showed up in the room since it was the room for requirement and they needed it? That's what my impression was but i donno.

Thank you Hawk92! Great defend.

To you-know-who:

Using quotes from JKR is really bad idea I think. She is never going to give really blatent information that leads to a direct positive conclusion. Never. If she did where would the story. I looked at the writing and the style at which it was written. I have honestly tried to read all opinions about H/Hr and R/Hr and all others inbetween. Too much happens to H/Hr as a couple. (read some of my past posts to see what I mean as well as many others) The R/Hr ship just doesn't have enough PRO vs the CON's. And what PRO's it does have can be easily rebutted. I consider myself quite adept at the whole speach and debate, having taken it for the last four years. I weeded through as many PRO vs con ideas as I can, given the small amount of free time I have. I am sorry to say the R/Hr ship just doesn't have enough Pro's to win. There are times when it seems that the R/Hr ship has good ideas but those ideas do not seem to have as much merit or carry as much weight as the H/Hr ship. Look at the written passages of hte books write what you think is for one or the other, give each idea a weight(on a scale of 1-10 for simplicity, 10 most important) Taking each idea for the H/Hr ship and the R/Hr ship, I just can't see anylonger have the R/Hr ship will last.
AND YES, I know this is technically speculation but I feel is right. (Quotes from the Auther seem to always mislead, no matter what book I read.)

Fate..i think you are totally right...Any quote from JKR can be misleading and confusing...and we can interpret it however we want...

Example...The most famous quote about Ron/Hermione is when someone asks if Ron and Hermione like eachother and she says that "the answer to that is in Goblet of Fire"..she could have been saying...

Yes!...
Maybe Ron likes Hermione and hermione likes Krum..
Hermione likes Harry, Ron likes Hermione...

There are so many ways to interpret the whole deal..The best way is to read the books and separate hints that may lead to any relationship....

Originally posted by GilyAnn (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=395955#post395955))
First Michael Corner is on Harry's year. But in Ravenclaw.
To answer Grace's question:

Yes that's what I said that Harry said that they reminded him of Mr. & Mrs. Weasley and then later on Ron says that Hermione sounded like his mother. :??:

I'm sorry to say that they aren't. Please don't jump out on me and say that this is very convenient of me. I'm answering your question on my interpretation.

You know I'll never jump down your throat! :p Your interpretation, as well as others, is what I want to know about.

Someone on another forum was discoussing that H/Hr are good friends who make a nice team but R/Hr make a good couple. I think that is an excellent explanation. H/Hr are better suited for other people when it comes to love issues.

Hermione understood Cho very well simply because like Cho. Hermione also wallows in emotion. Harry can't deal with that, because he himself does that also. Harry needs someone that can help him forget, understand and put him on his place. Ron does that for Hermione the same goes for Ginny to Harry. I know it sounds convenient for my ship. But I don't see this as shipping I see this from a personality point of view.


Tell that person at the other forum I want some backing up to that explanation. Give me some canon evidence.

Yes Hermione has become very emotional, but can you blame her? Or Cho for that matter? You have puberty, so your hormones are out of control. Your bestfriend could be killed by a lunatice in any moment and your boyfriend was killed by that lunatic. My problem with Cho is that I felt she was in a way using Harry to help her find out if Cedric said anything about her before he died and to feel close to him through Harry, who was there with Cedric when he died. Anyhow back to the topic.....

Help him forget what, exactly? If you mean in regards to things that are happening with Voldemort, I think that you are right. He should be able to forget once in a while that he is being chased after by a lunatic, but of course that is impossible because he needs to be prepared and face what is happening to him. So for now Ginny is all good for that, as Hermione is all good for helping Harry prepare. Hermione is all about "let me keep Harry alive now."

I actually think Hermione understands Harry's situation. She seems to know what he thinking so I would think she understands. She doesn't sugarcoat much, she tells it like it is the majority of the time, like Lee Jordan does when commentating on the Quidditch match.

For some reason when H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other. Harry snaps heavily at Hermione while she wallows in emotion and snaps back at him with the worst she has. When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere. When H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other to the point that they aim for all the bad stuff of the other one, not getting anywhere. Hermione's mothering is answered by Harry with scolds and resent, something that she doesn't deserve. But in a way she treats him like a child, someone that needs taking care which Harry doesn't need. Ginny on the other hand while she snaps at him also. Treats him like an equal. Example of it is the Voldemort thing and this other one:

"Hi," said Ginny uncertainly. "We recognised Harry's voice. What are you yelling about?"

"Never you mind," Harry said roughly.

Ginny raised her eyebrows.

"There's no need to take that tone with me," she said coolly. "I was only wondering if I could help."

Just to name a few. On the contrary to Hermione; Ginny doesn't treat Harry like her child, little brother or nobody younger than her (this mainly because since everybody treats her that way she avoids doing it to others. Ex. Mrs. Weasley not letting her stay for the OoP, Ron and even Harry himself.) Ginny treats like an equal. Treating someone like they don't know what they are doing only causes resentment, something that Ginny has felt a lot with Mrs. Weasley hovering around her constantly. Yes she snaps at him but seeks not to scolds at him. Which in return makes Harry stop drowining in self pity and concentrate on what's important. The issue that he is having at that moment. Ginny doesn't force Harry to understand the issue, she points it to him. Which in return makes him be more open minded. Hermione on the other hand scolds and forces Harry to understand which makes him resentfull and withdrawn.


I don't see how Harry and Hermione bring out the worse in each other when they argue. When do they bring out the bad stuff? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't read anywhere Harry telling Hermione she's a know-it-all and that she should mind her business. I haven't read Hermione telling Harry that he should stop pitying himself. The only time I can recall Hermione telling Harry about himself is when she tells him that he is trying too hard to play the part of the hero, which is true. He got mad and look at where it led: Sirius getting killed. (Just for your information, I blame Harry for Sirius' death.) But what's important here though, is that she put her personal opinions aside and helped Harry through and through.

All I see is what I always see when someone argues with Hermione: a difference of opinions. The worst that can come out of each other is that they don't speak to one another, which happens with Ron and Hermione as, well. At least, I feel, that Harry and Hermione do get somewhere. They resolve their issues. Where as Ron and Hermione don't. Do you really expect Hermione to just sit back and take everything that Harry says? (I know you don't. ;) ) She has to snap back at him. Which, ironically, is what Hermione does to Ron, as well. That's the "problem" with Hermione she doesn't take anyone's ****. The difference between her and Ginny is just the way they snap back. Ginny is calm, Hermione isn't. Yet I remember that Hermione does speak calmly to him, too. It depends on the moment and their mood. This book is what I like to call an "emotional rollercoaster", everyone is moody besides Mad-Eye Moody, of course. ;) The ones that really top the list are Harry and Hermione. We've all seen Hermione angry and cranky, especially during exams, but being that this is the 5th Year and they are studying for O.W.L.S all year long, I wan't suprised that at her attitude. I was waiting for her to snap. Add the fact that Voldemort is back and Harry is in danger, it puts Hermione more on edge. So that's why she snaps back at Harry. And Harry is officially going through puberty a year later than Ron, as you've mentioned yourself, and is on edge due to Voldemort and school, as well, so he's snapping at everyone.

In this book, I've realized that Hermione not only mothers Harry and Ron, but everyone she cares about. She's a very opinionated, caring person and she thinks she's always right (and she actually is in OoP.) Hermione has her way of dealing with Harry. If Harry didn't like it, he'd stop being her friend. She is very different from Ginny, but it doesn't bump her to the bottom of the list. It's great that Ginny, Luna and Neville are the "even-tempered 2nd Trio", they show the quiet non-stubborn side of the original stubborn Trio. Each reflect the total opposite of the other, but opposites don't always attract.

Harry and Hermione have never argued to the extent that they did in this book. This is the first book where I see them going head to head the majority of the time. I don't see their arguing as Hermione treating Harry as though he isn't her equal. I personally have always felt that Hermione thinks highy of Harry. She sees his and Ron's potentiality, they're just lazy. And it's not that Hermione doesn't think what Harry does is right, it's just the way he goes about it. She's concerned that he's going to do something harsh and reckless which could in turn get him killed because he has left Hogwarts and Voldemort can now have full access of Harry. All I see is Hermione's great concern and she gets fed up when he just doesn't seem to show that he's concerned about his own safety.

Harry's resentful and withdrawn by Hermione's scolding? Actually how about Harry's resentful and withdrawn by everyone for any little thing. It's as though the kid is going through a 24/7 PMS!!!! :rotfl: I thought that was funny.... :sorry:

So to finally answer your question I personally never said that they arguing was cute because they had tension. I always said that it was a phase. And I was right on that. Ron is the oldest of the three while Hermione is a girl. Girls mature faster than boys but since Ron is the oldest puberty and the teenager phase was hitting him last year while this year is hitting Harry full force. Ron and Hermione had mature last year. This year it was Harry's turn.

Yes this year is Harry's year, so after Harry grieves Sirius's death, I expect for his anger to ebb away and for the Trio to be back as they were pre-PoA. Harry and Hermione will be just as close as ever, expect they won't be done each other's throat. I mean with everything that they went through this year, how can they not be any closer than they were before. I, also, would like to say that Hermione won't be as stressed out because there won't be no O.W.L.s, so I can't wait for 6th Year to see how "lightened up" she'll be.


But there is a difference between the tension that R/Hr had or have against the one that H/Hr have. R/Hr tension has a base on their (IMO) personal attraction to each other.

I just don't see the personal attraction going two way. I see this: R---->Hr.

R/Hr bicker over little stuff. H/Hr fight over issues and then they bring out the worst of each other.

Yes R/Hr over little, insignificant things. The only significant thing they seem to argue about is Harry's safety and state of mind. Again, I don't see how Harry and Hermione bring out the worst in each other. Maybe you can point me out.

R/Hr can simply touch each other physically or do some things that H/Hr have done simply because the mutual attraction won't let them. Hermione can grab Harry easily because (IMO) she is not atracted to him. Granted not everyone is like that but it appears to me that it is this way in this case. Hermione hasn't grabbed Ron simply because it's her own attraction what won't let her. The same goes for Ron. I honestly feel that H/Hr are very good friends. I don't want that to change. But when it comes to Love I think they are better made for other people.

I actually see it as Hermione not being too physical with Ron so that he doesn't get the wrong idea. I see it that way because I only see R---->Hr.
[/quote]

Boy that was long! :D

Thank you Hawk92! Great defend.

Welcome!

Now I haven't posted in a while but I thought that I would answer a few things on this one,

Yes that's what I said that Harry said that they reminded him of Mr. & Mrs. Weasley and then later on Ron says that Hermione sounded like his mother.

Umm should I use Freud or Opedius to answer this :p

When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere.

Examples please. Just page numbers you don't have to write out the parts or anything.

Ginny doesn't treat Harry like her child, little brother or nobody younger than her (this mainly because since everybody treats her that way she avoids doing it to others.

There wouldn't be a reason for her acting this way because Harry is older than her. It would pretty arrogant of someone to treat someone who is older and more experienced as if they were younger. No I don't think that Ginny is arrogant and that's why I think that she treats Harry the way she does. But there is a pretty simple and straightforward explantion. Ginny treats him this way because he is older.

R/Hr tension has a base on their (IMO) personal attraction to each other. R/Hr bicker over little stuff. H/Hr fight over issues and then they bring out the worst of each other. R/Hr can simply touch each other physically or do some things that H/Hr have done simply because the mutual attraction won't let them.

Now let me get this straight. Hermione and Ron's fighting have brought out the best in each other. Such as Ron accusing Hermione of lying, betraying Harry, fraternizing with the enemy, brewing love potions, Ron yelling at her in front of everyone after the Yule Ball, Ron ruining the Yule Ball for her. These are Good Things that she has brought out of Ron :??: And when Ron and Hermione fight we get things like Hemione storming off, Hermione ignoring Ron, Hermione crying, Hermione looking dangerously, Hermione answering icily, and these are the good things that Ron brings out of Hermione. :??:

When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere.

And after the Yule Ball nothing was resolved and their relationship was, I believe, "oddly formal". Kind of like Sirius and Molly after their fight in OotP.

Cheers!

The question in that quote was "Does Hermione like Ron?" and the answer was "The answer to that is in GoF!" Now if I had my way, that would be a solid NO. I didn't pick up anything substantial to tell me that Hermione does like Ron as more than a friend; in fact, what I read told me explicitly that she doesn't like him romantically -- she likes Harry. So with a deflective response like that, I'm sure that JK was just trying to keep us speculating, which is why I hold as much faith in her interview quotes as in Goyle's ability to save the Wizarding World. :rolleyes:

Another one that I hate is from the Dateline interview, when JK appears to be appalled at the thought of Harry and Hermione snogging. To me, her reaction seemed so extreme that I was sure it was a bluff. (Call me delusional; that's what I saw.) I mean, she seemed so theatrically revolted, and then she specifically steered our attention to Ron and Hermione's "tension". Well, turns out they didn't snog in OotP either, so was her response as clear-cut as it seemed?

So, bottom line is, JK's quotes are far too vague to be taken completely seriously. We still need to bear in mind that she's the author; she doesn't necessarily want us to guess what happens in her books because where would the element of surprise be?

EDIT: Wow, some long posts beat me to it. My rambling about quotes looks weird now, but oh well. Nice posts, Grace and Hawk.

I think I was expecting more romance than there was in book 5, but I'm glad it wasn't all lovey-dovey mush. I like a mix of romance and action/adventure. OotP was a perfect balance between the two.

As for the whole Cho thing... I didn't like it. I thought it was over in GoF. There wasn't a need for Cho to break up with Harry to show that their relationship was over. Cho needed someone to talk to about Cedric, and since Harry was there at his death, she probably thought that he would understand.

I still see a H/Hr relationship in the future books-and it will last.

Well, here's what's obvious so far:
Ron likes Hermione
Luna likes Ron
The rest is up in the air! So let's look at some of the various pairings that we might see:

R/H: This seems the most obvious one, but I don't think this is going to happen. It seems that all the feelings are one-sided. Hermione HAS to know how Ron feels about her. There's no way that she doesn't. If she know Harry liked Cho, she has to know that Ron likes her. But she doesn't lead him on in the least bit! If she liked him, she'd at least give him some encouragement. But she doesn't; she seems very tactful. She writes to Krum, but won't tell Ron what's going on with her and Krum. So, I think Ron's going to be hung up on Hermione for quite a while, and I don't see Hermione returning those feelings anytime soon. (I don't see her as waiting for Ron to ask her. I think she'd tell Ginny to tell Ron to ask her.)

H/Hr: My personal favorite, because all the clues are so subtle! Harry is starting to fall for Hermione. Especially now that he's over Cho! They are obviously extremely close friends. Hermione is the ONLY one that Harry will listen to. When he had the "dream" about Sirius, only Hermione could convince him to try and find Sirius first. And when she got hit by a death eater and Harry was afraid she was dead? His reaction was very similar to the reaction that he had when Sirius fell through the curtain. He fell to his knees, held onto her shoulder, and attacked a death eater while he was panicing over her being alive or not. When Neville tells him she's still alive, he is extremely relieved. Signs of a VERY deep friendship, at the very least. He relies on her more and more. And he practically ruins his date with Cho to meet Hermione. Now on Hermione's sides, she is NOT happy about Harry and Cho dating. Yes, she gives him advice, but look at what she says, her tone of voice, and her expressions. She asks Harry is Cho "cornered him." Why cornered? Why not ask if they talked? When she said cornered, I thought she was not a happy person. And she was writing a very long letter to Krum. Hmm... Also, I don't find it odd that she might have feelings for Harry, but still give him girl advice. They are VERY close friends (closer than Harry and Ron or Hermione and Ron at this point), and she does want him to be happy. (I used to give love advice to guys I liked just to see how interested they were in other people, and to see if I even stood a chance.) She does seem to want to be with Harry more than Ron, in my opinion. She goes with Hagrid and Harry off into the forest when Ron is playing quiddich. Why? She has never missed one of Harry's matches, even in PoA when she was nearly cracking from the pressure of her classes. Also, I don't think her fights with Ron are indications of her having any kind of feelings for Ron. She fights/argues with everyone throughtout the books. She fights with Ron, the twins, her teachers, and with Harry. But look at her fights with Harry compared to her other fights: she always cries or is near tears. Hmm, why cry when arguing with Harry, but no one else? And also, Hermione cries a lot in this book, and Harry notices when she cried. But he complains that Cho (his crush) cries too much. Why doesn't he ever complain that Hermione cries so much? That's very telling, in my opinion. When Hermione and Harry fight, it is extremely upsetting to Hermione. And Harry notices this, but doesn't comment that it annoys him. Hmm...

H/G: I'm glad she's over Harry. I don't think it was anything more than a crush. Ron obviously wants Harry and Ginny to hook up (that look he gave Harry on the train back to London), just to get Harry into the family. But, Harry doesn't see her as anything but Ginny, the youngest Weasley. And he seems relieved that Ginny doesn't have a crush on him anymore. I like the new Ginny; she's great! And I don't think her personality and Harry's fit very well. Plus, Harry is a member of the Weasley family. Mrs. W thinks of Harry as a son, as does Mr. W. I see Harry as their adopted son. Ginny and Harry dating would seem a little too weird for me: like someone dating their adoptive sister.

N/G: I like this. Neville did ask Ginny to the Yule ball (though as a second choice). And he did try to save Ginny from the Slyterins. But, that's all the info on these two. I'd like to see it happen, but there's not really a lot of evidence to see if anything will happen or not. (If anything, Neville likes Ginny, but not vice-versa.)

Ron/Luna: I like this one! Luna definitely likes Ron. (She told him she wouldn't have minded going to the Yule ball with him, she calls him Ronald, shows him her lion hat, and is always humming Weasley is our King.) Ron thinks she's a weirdo, and is hung up on Hermione. But Ron has a tendency to like things that we think he doesn't. Like Scabbers: he always complained that Scabbers was useless, but it turns out that he really did care about his rat! Same with Pig. I could see him doine this with Luna, if he gets over Hermione. Plus, he would LOVE to tease her, and there's so much material that he could tease her with! The only problem is Ron's pride: I don't know if he'd be willing to date someone so unpopular. (He would be teased mercilessly by the Sytherins if he dated her.)

Harry/Luna: Nothing her, in my opinion. He pities her, but that's it. She definitely wants to be friends with the trio, but I don't think she has anything for Harry. I hope it stays this way!

Luna/Neville: Now that would just be too funny. Neville is so gullible, I could just see the two of them going off to look for some new invisible creature! (Neville stumbling all the way.) But the two of them are pretty powerful. Luna was the last kid to get injured by the death eaters; and Neville was the last one left fighting with Harry. Who knows?

Harry/Cho: Glad it's over, and it only lasted a few months. Completely realistic of a 15 year old's first "girlfriend" (that's what my first relationship looked like! And guys do have a tendency to just let things die without ever mentioning things are actually over; my boyfriend now never dumped his ex's in high school, he just let them fizzle.) Now he's able to move on to other people.

Hermione/Krum: What is going on with these two? Are they dating? I think they are, but who knows?

Bill/Fleur: I loved this! Bill giving Fleur private "English lessons". Hee, hee. What would Ron do if Bill brought Fleur home to meet the family?

Lupin/Tonks: I just want someone for Lupin, and I like Tonks. I don't think this will happen, but who knows? Tonks (or her parents) are Sirius's next of kin that aren't excaped convicts; they will probably inherit the Black house. We know Lupin lives there. If Tonks moves in, it would be just the two of them. I can have my little fantasies.

Now a little note on Hermione: Who does this girl like? She doesn't like Ron; she doens't give him any encouragement nor does she pay any kind of attention to the presents she gives him. She gives him the same gift she gives Harry. And she seems to get annoyed by him. The whole SPEW thing, and his teasing her? She seems annoyed by them more than anything else. Now what about Harry? She seems to like him more than she likes Ron, but again, does this mean she likes him as more than a friend? She misses a game of Ron's to go with Harry and Hagrid, but she's never missed a game of Harry's. She cries when she and Harry fight (every single time!), but never shen she and Ron fight. She gives Harry love advice, but in a matter-of-fact way, and she' doesn't seem to think too highly of Cho - she asked Harry if Cho cornered him. She doesn't seem to like the topic of Harry and Cho, but she does give him advice. She pleads with Harry to see things her way, she doesn't plead with anyone else. With everyone else, she argues until they give up. With Harry, she pleads with him and cries when they argue. What's up with that? And what about Krum? She's writing him LONG letters. Are they dating? Maybe that's why she's giving Ron and Harry the same presents because she doesn't like either, but likes Krum. Ron definitely thinks so. She does think that both Ron and Harry are clueless about women, but uses Ron as her marker for the most clueless about women in general. What's up with that? And so far she's kissed both boys on the cheek. Harry in a place JKR finds romantic, and Ron in a situation where it seems she was also going to kiss Harry. (Or was she?) Obviously JKR doesn't yet want to actually come out and say what Hermione is feeling.

So here's my overall feeling:
Ron likes Hermione.
Luna likes Ron.
Harry's starting to fall for Hermione (seriously, deepely fall for her)
Hermione is one big mystery!
Neville MIGHT like Ginny.
Ginny is one little man-izer: go Ginny! Likes older guys, and she's moving/moved onto Dean. Now that would be cute to see! Especially since Ron and Dean live in the same dorm! (I can just see Dean and Ron arguing because Ron wants Ginny with Harry instead.)
Bill and Fleur are dating: yeah!!

JKR won't actually answer any questions about the furture love lives of our favorite teens. She'll answer questions about the book she's promoting (the plutonic friends question was in PoA, and she hasn't repeated this since), and she will NOT answer questions about H/H. (She deflects them, and answers them without actually stating anything. Do you really think they're suited and making a face. That's like her answering that the answer to if Hermione likes Ron is at the end of GoF.) The only thing I can see from her is that she thinks that the ending scene in GoF is VERY important. She thinks that King's Cross is extremely romantic (which is where Hermione kissed Harry on the cheek in GoF). She modelled Ron after one of her best male friends, Hermione after herself. And her husband looks suspiciously like a grown-up Harry. Hmm... We're never going to get a straight answer out of her about the teens love-lives. She NEVER answers plot questions in her books, and this is becoming an important secondary plot line.

Sorry about the length of this post!

Harry and Hermione might have argued a lot in this book and I think this time the arguing went deeper than other times..but after they are done arguing, Harry trusts Hermione like no one else...Even in this book, they got to the point where he wasn't even questioning her motives..(like in the interview in V-Day), he knows she is right and will follow whatever she says....he might no be noticing, but she is becoming even more important for him...

GRACE GRANGER..that was an excellent post..after that, i think there is not too much to say....

MOCHAJAVA.....That was another excellent post.....I agree with you..the mystery here is Hermione..If we could just get a glimpse of what she feels, we would know where everything is going...So, i think JKR is doing that on purpose..she doesn't want us to know about Hermione because I think she doesn't even know herself where the thing is going....!!!!

I agree, excellent post Grace Granger and Hawk92.

Now when I need to refer others to a post, other than my own, I will direct them to yours. Truely great debating.

Now, Along with Hermownninny and all the other H/Hr shipper. I really dont think the R/Hr ship has to many legs to stand on. I have yet to read a more impressive debate on this subject that shows a great information to the R/HR ship. There just isn't any. The overwhelming information in OoTP and Gof leads to the H/HR relationship. The foundation to them (H/HR) is so strong that he now hears her voice in his head. What is that other than love and admiration. Along with the many other clues that as so plauseable there is not really much else to say.

To steal a phrase:

Thank you and Goodnight

Mochajava, nice post!

I seem to be saying that an awful lot lately. :rolleyes: But it's definitely true. The point mochajava made about crying was interesting; I think that Cho's crying made Harry uncomfortable and confused, because he's not that close to her, but Hermione's crying was significantly different. She cried mostly because his shouting made her upset, so naturally, he couldn't blame her for that.

A word about the H/Hr fights in OotP (and there were alot of them): as Grace already mentioned, the way they fight is much different from the way R/Hr fight. Their fighting is much more intense, for one thing, and they only argue over important issues (like keeping Harry alive, for one.) There's no petty bickering here: more like all-out shouting, on Harry's part at least. Now this may seem like a bad sign, but the fact that they can actually argue and get somewhere indicates that they are more on the same level than anyone else. Look at the scene when Harry has just seen Sirius supposedly being tortured, and he's all raring to go to the Dept. of Mysteries: Hermione is the only one who counters him, and the whole fight that ensues is strictly between Harry and Hermione. And this is a full-on shouting match. He's ready to shake her, for crying out loud, and the poor girl is intimidated. But she doesn't back down, and her common sense actually manages to get through to him. I wonder, is anyone else able to do this? If this had been anyone else telling him not to go tearing after Sirius right then and there, would he have listened?

No, because he trusts Hermione, and no matter what anyone else says, she manages to make him see sense every now and then. Even McGonagall notices that "at least" he listens to Hermione Granger.

My point here is that H/Hr may argue, but this isn't that senseless banter that R/Hr have. These are more serious arguments that only come out of necessity, and no matter how angry Harry gets or how emotional Hermione gets, they manage to settle on something sensible. And I think that's a better quality to have in a long-term relationship than entertainingly light bickering that only ticks both people off for awhile.

I think it's significant all by itself that Harry even argues with Hermione with the topics they did. I don't think anybody else could have made Harry rethink some of the things that were brought up in their arguements. That alone says something....

I have to agree with that. When R/Hr argue, they only get hurt. Otherwise, they're bickering over silly things and never get anywhere. With H/Hr yes, they do argue. But they do get somewhere and the arguments are few.

Cho has always annoyed me. I never expected Harry to really fall for her. It was just kind of a lust/crush for him. It didn't surprise me for her to turn out to be such an annoyance...

I was expecting some Ron/Hermione action. Very disappointed.

I'm still hopeful for some Ginny/Harry though.. I'm positive that'll come up soon....

Hawk wrote:
Now let me get this straight. Hermione and Ron's fighting have brought out the best in each other. Such as Ron accusing Hermione of lying, betraying Harry, fraternizing with the enemy, brewing love potions, Ron yelling at her in front of everyone after the Yule Ball, Ron ruining the Yule Ball for her. These are Good Things that she has brought out of Ron :( And when Ron and Hermione fight we get things like Hemione storming off, Hermione ignoring Ron, Hermione crying, Hermione looking dangerously, Hermione answering icily, and these are the good things that Ron brings out of Hermione. :(

Alright, Hawk is taking it back waaaaay back. Thank you very much for bringing this up. What Hawk wrote above is what I meant when I said that Ron and Hermione do not resolve anything. They just act as though it never happened and then later on the fight is continued! Great post, btw. :clappy:

mochajava, great insight on how Harry is annoyed by Cho's crying and not Hermione's. And yes the key to solving all this mess is Hermione. Ironic how Hermione is just as secretive as JKR. ;) Great post! :clappy:
Edit: And the pleading is a very interesting point indeed. You see there's a difference in the arguments between H/Hr and R/HR. As said before by me and other posters, H/Hr's arguments are about his safety. Hermione worries about Harry and pleads with him to be sensible. R/Hr argue about what? The most significant fight that they had was about none other than Harry. And it was Ron accusing Hermione of betraying Harry. The similarity: Ron and Harry getting mad at Hermione.

Earendil, speaking of Dept of Mysteries argument, that whole scene in Umbridge's office is going to be beautiful on film. When Umbridge is going to Crucio Harry and Hermione screams that she'll tell Umbridge what she knows. Among other things, too, of course. JKR captures the romantic imagery. I can picture that it in my mind. And once it's in film, everyone is going to be think of it as them having romantic feelings for one another. I don't know if anyone has realized that Hermione was basically going to be an accomplice to a murder. She took Umbridge to the forest because she darn well knew that once the Centaurs found another adult in their, they'd get and get it good. Great post. :clappy:

Great post EVERYONE! :D :clappy:

From what i observe, let me make an anology: Harry is Cho as Ginny is to Harry ....Harry had a crush on Cho every since he saw her, and the same goes for Ginny with Harry. Time and getting to know the actual person got rid of the crushes and even caused feelings of annoyance with the other person. As for future romances, anything is possible...the author hasn't really given any big clues.

I like that analogy. As a matter of fact, given that - wouldn't you say JKR writes drawn out first crushes that don't last before the final romance? If that's the case, H/C is out(well, now that's a given), and following the pattern i'd say so is Hr/K, R/Hr and H/G...

Well I have to admit, more and more evidence toward the H/HR keeps coming.

As I have said in a post way back on this thread. Hermione was going to kill UmBridge. I have no doubt about it. It was a thinking plan to lead her into the Forest. It WAS NOT a spur of the moment plan and someone accidently dies. She knew what needed to be done to save Harry from the Crucio curse. This curse was not going to even kill Harry but she didn't want him in that kind of pain. I can't imagine what she might do if Harry was about to die. Other than risk her own life. You can't tell me thats a crush or a liking between friends, NO SIR THAT IS LOVE.

Thats what is whole story is based on.
That, I think will be a huge part of the ending story.
That LOVE between the two helps end big V.

but hey, my personal thoughts, story related, are are for a different thread.

Originally posted by tabby (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=387605#post387605))
^Only if you insist she gives Malfoy a romance too. :D




as long as it hasn't got something to do with pansy parkinson.she's waaay too ugly for him :elaugh:.but someone like me on the other hand...oh!did i say that out loud?must watch what i'm saying when there's people around :o :eyebrows: :bigtu: :wacky: :lol:

Originally posted by Fate (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=396761#post396761))
Well I have to admit, more and more evidence toward the H/HR keeps coming.

As I have said in a post way back on this thread. Hermione was going to kill UmBridge. I have no doubt about it. It was a thinking plan to lead her into the Forest. It WAS NOT a spur of the moment plan and someone accidently dies. She knew what needed to be done to save Harry from the Crucio curse. This curse was not going to even kill Harry but she didn't want him in that kind of pain. I can't imagine what she might do if Harry was about to die. Other than risk her own life. You can't tell me thats a crush or a liking between friends, NO SIR THAT IS LOVE.

Thats what is whole story is based on.
That, I think will be a huge part of the ending story.
That LOVE between the two helps end big V.

but hey, my personal thoughts, story related, are are for a different thread.


AHA! You were the one who originally brought this up. I couldn't remember for the life of me who it was. I find it very significant that Hermione did that. That's practically murder and she didn't feel sorry about it until it seemed as though the Centaurs were going to do something to her and Harry.

Yep, she had everything planned in order to save Harry....OK, so we are seeing this from Harry's point of view right?

FATE AND GRACE.....I think you brought up the perfect example...

When Umbrige said "crucio", Hermione screames "noo!"...out of the other 5, hermione was the only one who screamed and did something.....THAT TELLS SOMETHING ABOUT WHO SHE FEELS...

MOREOVER....Since this is Harry's point of view, maybe Ginny or Ron screamed too,...BUT HARRY ONLY NOTICED THAT HERMIONE SCREAMED.....and then goes with her to the Forest...That must say something about Harry's feelings too don't you think...???

Conclusion:

Harry trusts Hermione with his life
Hermione will go to any lengths to save Harry

C'mon..if this is not LOVE..I don't know what to call it...:love:

For some reason when H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other. Harry snaps heavily at Hermione while she wallows in emotion and snaps back at him with the worst she has. When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere. When H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other to the point that they aim for all the bad stuff of the other one, not getting anywhere. Hermione's mothering is answered by Harry with scolds and resent, something that she doesn't deserve. But in a way she treats him like a child, someone that needs taking care which Harry doesn't need. Ginny on the other hand while she snaps at him also. Treats him like an equal. Example of it is the Voldemort thing and this other one:

I'm sorry to say, I have to disagree with almost everything in this paragraph (or mayeb I like arguing, either way it's all good)I'll break it down...

For some reason when H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other. Harry snaps heavily at Hermione while she wallows in emotion and snaps back at him with the worst she has.

I haven't noticed this. Then again, I haven't read any of the books 'cept 5 in a while, but I don't remember Hermione wallowing in emotions (well, book 3, but Harry didn't snap at her)

When Ron and Hermione argue they are bound to get somewhere. When H/Hr argue they bring out the worst of each other to the point that they aim for all the bad stuff of the other one, not getting anywhere

Actually, when Ron and Hermione argue, they argue over little things for prolonged periods and end up getting no where (much like little kids or the R/Hr-H/Hr arguments...but that won't stop us.) Also, about Harry and Hermione arguing... they don't really get into heated "arguments" much...in the 5th book Harry yells at Hermione alot....I'll give you that.( I would like to take this time to note that in book 3 Ron and Hermione really started fighting.)

Hermione's mothering is answered by Harry with scolds and resent, something that she doesn't deserve. But in a way she treats him like a child, someone that needs taking care which Harry doesn't need.

Ron reacts the same way.

Ginny on the other hand while she snaps at him also. Treats him like an equal. Example of it is the Voldemort thing and this other one

This is really kinda funny, cause whenever I hear someone say "dont take that tone with me" I think parent not equal...<.<...I think that H/G has some merit, but we don't know enough about Ginny yet to make any real arguments either way.
So, in conclusion, I personally think it's all up in the air right now. We see hints of Hermione liking Ron in book 4 (they're weak indicators but they're there), we see hints of Ron liking Hermione in Book 5 (also small), hints of Hermione liking Harry(Ill give ya three guesses...) and I think in book 5, Harry started showing signs of Hermione. But really, anything could happen

Yes, I orginally brought that to light. I am glad to know now that is was taken for more than what I thought. I had orginally thought that it got passed by as a "So -what" type of idea. So, THX

To me that is too strong a point for for the H/HR relationship. More so than almost anything else. The willingness to actually get rid of a Porf. and a MoM offical. And thisby the most rule knowledgeable girl in the whole school. Once again, she was not in a life or death situation. She knew that the Crucio curse would not kill Harry. She knew that he would not go insane instantly(this from seeing and hearing Neville's story). She thought about it and then realized a plan and then did it. Leading Umbridge off to the Fobidden Forest. Hermione didn't change her mind on the way there. Didn't change her mind while going through the Forest. No, she made more and more noise to attract the Centuars. She knew what was going to happen and also knew the Umbridge wa s a half-bred hater. Umbridge couldn't stop herself from making insults and SO, the almost death of a Prof. Umbridge. Thanks to DD if I remember right.

Thats love ladies and gentleman, no BUTS about. Pure, untainted LOVE.

And isn't that what the story is about? You tell me!

I must say.... amoung many of the r/h shippers.... I was disappointed that nothing happened. I am begining to think that they'll never get together.... perhaps h/h will get together in the end... and ron will just get jealous or something... but here's a new one. Maybe there will be a Harry and Luna connection.... most certainly not.... but ya never know they understand eachother......

harry and hermione.... maybe there will be a relationship, but not for long though, as hermione knows clear and well that ron fancies her from book 4 to even book 5 when he gave her the perfume....

if hermione does fall for harry their relationship will be nothing but rough, passionate and most importantly QUICK.
hermione knows that ron likes her, so h/herm can't have it going too long or else ron will notice and be hurt.

thus i expect the next book will be full of passionate details of h/herm before breaking it off after 2 weeks....

That doesn't make sense. Why would Hermione go with Ron just because he likes her? She has to like him that way as well. She's now very much aware of Ron's feelings and chooses not to return them. Isn't that a problem? Mutual love will last - one sided will not.

Ah well, friends...just cause it's obvious to us doesn't mean it's obvious to them...

A relationship between Harry and Hermione will involve ONLY Harry and Hermione: Ron has nothing to do with it. Yes, she knows that he has some kind of crush on her, because she's a perceptive girl, which is why I think that she's been careful about overtly displaying her feelings for Harry. Especially in front of Ron ("Of course you're not [that bad at kissing]" said Hermione absently. "How do you know?" said Ron sharply.) I honestly don't think that Ron's teenage fancy will break up H/Hr if they get together. Ron wouldn't want his two best friends to be unhappy on his account, even if he was insanely jealous for awhile. And he'll get over it--he has Luna, remember? :p

Ahahaha..I agree...Ron would never step in the middle if something comes up with Harry and Hermione.....

And yes, he was jealous of Herm, but He was also jealous of Ginny, which means that in turn he could be really jealous of everyone...

Maybe there would be a triangle thing....but at the end, i don't think Ron will separate them or hermione being with ron just because he likes her...

You know in almost every post about why Harry is acting the way he is, everyon seems to say well he is at that age. I think the reason he is acting this way has a little more to do with him seeing someone he knew die right next to him and then spending the summer in isolation as opposed to how old he is and what he is going through because of his age, thanks.

humm, everyone keeps on saying that hermione loves harry cause she is willing to send umbridge to her doom, i feel that this only shows her "wickedness?" and merciless nature.

i mean, god... fred and geroge was willing to set a few traps and jokes, but that would be murder, plain and simple.....

Actually, Crucio would have left Harry worse than death if done enough. Remember what happened to Neville's parents? I wouldn't put it past Umbridge to do that anyway. But anyhow you take it, wasn't Hermione really just doing what she had to do to save Harry? There's a reason the Crucio is unforgivable, and the proof is in the Longbottoms.

That doesn't make sense. Why would Hermione go with Ron just because he likes her? She has to like him that way as well. She's now very much aware of Ron's feelings and chooses not to return them. Isn't that a problem? Mutual love will last - one sided will not.

Sirius, I'm with you 100%. I have never understood why Ron liking Hermione has had to mean that Hermione will end up with Ron if she doesn't return those feelings. Perhaps I'm the only guy in this forum who had liked a girl and has not had that girl return the feeling. I'll simply say that when this happened my liking a girl did not make her my girlfriend.

Unless in the wizarding world you can have arranged marriages. I'm not sure how Ron liking Hermione is strengthening Hr/R if Hermione is not returning those feelings.

Cheers!

Ponder this... we know for a fact that J.K. Rowling has had an influence on what goes into all the movies, i.e. she has told the director(s) what is going to happen. Some interesting deletions come to mind such as the non-existence of the valentines day scene in the chamber of secrets movie and the non-existence of Cho Chang (as well as quiddich) in the third movie... so far. Perhaps these were kept out for a reason? Rowling didn't want to lead the moviegoers astay maybe?

I for one believe Harry and Luna Lovegood will develop a much closer relationship over the last 2 books.

Quote:
i mean, god... fred and geroge was willing to set a few traps and jokes, but that would be murder, plain and simple.....

So what you are saying is if you saw someone being tortured you wouldnt take the chance to stop them even at the risk of killing the person torturing them (also in the book she would of gotten a life sentence in Azkaban for using that on Harry).

I thought it sounded like Luna liked Ron...but I admit that Harry and Luna make more sense...

Don't think I'm some sort of maniac,but...do you think there will be homosexual loves in Harry Potter?
I say so because I think it would be quite good to educate teen-agers at the homosexuality since they are children.
Thay coul be grow up less intollerant.
But my name's not J.K.Rowling so.....

I'm a Ron/Luna shipper...but until JKR starts showing them in situations together, creating imagery or whatever around them or have Ron return the feelings...it's just a fannon ship. Harry/Luna...i don't know, they seemed more like Harry feeling sorry for Luna because he knows what it's like to be bullied. I just can't see the right basis for the relationship there.

Hawk: No, you're not the only one. I too have been in that situation. Said girl eventually got together with another guy, oh well what can i do? We're still the best of friends. For a relaitonship to happen, the feelings have to run both ways.

humph, harry could have taken it...
hermione obviously knew what she was doing and how she was gonna do it, my whole point is that she didn't feel or showed any remorse when the centars carried off umbridge, obviously intend upon killing.

but I admit that Harry and Luna make more sense...

by Raistlin_Majere

Why do you think so???? I mean, What makes you think so??? I'm really curious now....

I am not sure why you think Harry and Luna make more sense either. Right after the book was released JKR said that Luna was almost the exact opposite of Hermione and since Ron argues with Hermione on any idea she has or whenever she tries to help them I would think Luna would be better for him than Hermione would.

Arguments keep the relationship interesting...
>.>....Ill shut up
I think Harry and Luna make more sense because, the way I read it, Rowling was bringing up Harry and Luna's similarities. Besides, I think Luna's gonna have something to do with the veil and Sirius coming back (my personal thoughts). That'd probably cause Harry to fall for her. Or maybe I'm an idiot. Or both...
Oh..btw... I wasn't saying that Harry-Luna make more sense than Harry-Hermione...Im saying it makes more sense than Ron-Luna....Besides ...who said he had to be limited to one girl at a time? Bah....sociolitical nonsense...

Okay, about this accomplice to attempted murder deal:

Hermione would not have deliberately led Umbridge to a certain death if she didn't feel that what Umbridge was about to do was highly deserving of it. Besides, we know that Hermione is always able to think of plans to get them out of sticky situations: we should know by now to trust her. Sure, she knew that the next adult found in the forest--especially an adult from the Ministry--would definitely not be welcomed with open arms by the centaurs, but she also knew that the mysterious disappearance of Umbridge into the Forbidden Forest wouldn't go unnoticed for long. The school is full of teachers; they would have found out about it soon enough. And Hermione SAW them carrying Umbridge off in the forest--they didn't kill her on the spot. (On that note, what did they do with her for so long if not kill her? Torture her? :whistle: )

So, my point is, Hermione's quick thinking prevented Umbridge from using the Cruciatus Curse on Harry and also led Umbridge into an undoubtedly volatile punishment. It may have been that Hermione was planning on taking Umbridge to her death in the forest, OR it may have been that Hermione knew that the centaurs wouldn't necessarily kill her on the spot, giving them enough time for a teacher to notice her absence and rescue her after she had had a good sharp lesson. I would definitely not call Hermione merciless or wicked or devious: I would call her smart. And besides, isn't it a mark of how much she cares about Harry--that she was ready to face the possibility of instigating the murder of a teacher in order to save him? She may have been behaving irrationally because of her fear for him, but she definitely got Umbridge out of the way, without killing her. Don't forget that she did this in defense of one of her best friends who was about to be tortured: that's justification enough, if you ask me.

Harry and Luna? Sorry, I don't see it. They may have profound similarities in their past, but that can certainly help them to be better friends. A relationship with them wouldn't be light-heartedly amusing, like a Ron/Luna relationship: it would be awkward, strange, and, I strongly suspect, purely out of pity on Harry's part.

And it's also interesting that Luna is supposed to be the exact opposite of Hermione: precisely why I think she's a much better girl for Ron.

Uh... new member!

I was too lazy to read the entire thread (I was up to page 3). I guess I'm a H/Hr shipper (alright I AM), I wanted to add this quote.

"Did you kiss?" Hermoine said briskly.
Ron sat up so fast he sent his ink bottle flying all over the rug.
Disregarding this completely, he stared avidly at Harry.
"Well?" he demanded.
Harry looked from Ron's expression of mingled curiosity and hilarity to Hermoine's slight frown, and nodded.
(and so on to the deep disguist thing)

Ahahaha..WELCOME!!!!!

That was a good quote....

I dont see how people say Hermione wouldnt try to ruin someones date and then they say that she would kill someone for no reason though. That just doesent make sence really.

Originally posted by hermownninny (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=396886#post396886))
And yes, he was jealous of Herm, but He was also jealous of Ginny, which means that in turn he could be really jealous of everyone...


...? ...So, you mean that Ron fancies his own sister? ...I personally, think that he is just being protective of his little sister...(I have an older brother who told me if if he ever finds out that I have a boyfriend, he will beat the living crapola out of him).

...And alot of people say that Hermione chooses not to return any feelings to Ron, and therefore does not like him....I agree with that, but think: Hermione has a boyfriend. You really think Hermione would do such a thing to Krum, however many miles are between them? .....I'm not trying to bring forth any arguments because I'm neither Hermione/Harry Hermione/Ron (...any more..:)), but its just something I'd like to add....

I hadent remembered that really nice job on the quote was a good one.

...And alot of people say that Hermione chooses not to return any feelings to Ron, and therefore does not like him....I agree with that, but think: Hermione has a boyfriend. You really think Hermione would do such a thing to Krum, however many miles are between them

Oh....you don't want to know what I really think...;)

hermione doesn't want krum, she only likes him as a friend nothing more...
even in the fourth book she showed more affection toward harry than krum, i reckon hermione only wanted to get to know krum better and not date him

I dont see how people say Hermione wouldnt try to ruin someones date and then they say that she would kill someone for no reason though. That just doesent make sence really.

She did that to save Harry from being tortured...I would say that's a very good reason.....:)

...? ...So, you mean that Ron fancies his own sister? ...I personally, think that he is just being protective of his little sister...(

Exactly..he could also be very protective of Hermione.....My point is that he not only jealous of Hermione..I think that Hermione and Ginny are the girls that are around him the most, so he feels very protective with both of them...

Hermione isn't the man-eating strumpet that alot of people make her out to be. If she is serious about Krum, she's not going to go chasing after boys behind his back. We know that this isn't like her, and we know that she's not going to toy with boys' feelings like that. Hermione isn't perfect, but it would be utterly out of character for her to turn into some scarlet woman.

I don't think that she's all that serious with Krum. He is four years older than she is and he does live in another country: realistically, how much of an intense relationship can they have? I think that they're keeping contact because they agreed to be friends during that mysterious conversation at the end of GoF before the train left. But I think that there is a reason why Hermione is keeping her hypothetical feelings for Harry under wraps as of now, and that reason is Ron. She knows him well enough to know that he wouldn't be too chuffed to find out that the girl he has a crush on (as I'm very well sure that she knows) actually likes his best friend. She's trying to spare his feelings as well as her own, because she also knows that as of now, Harry doesn't like her as more than a friend. (Or does he? I have no clue. Not yet, I would imagine.)

Whew! This thread sure moves fast now that the server is back up. :D

humm i wonder if anyone noticed this but, all through book 4 there was soo many different bits and pieces all over the place showing that ron/hermione was gonna happen, HAD to happen.
but what do we see in the now fifth book? a sudden drop of rons feelings toward her and hermione gettin both physical, emotional and sentimental over harry showing she likes him.

doesn't anyone think jk might be toying with us again? and will probally sent up a totally unlikely pair in book 6?

I didn't see anything that showed that they were gonna happen till book 4. Don't gimme that stuff about how they always argue...they argued before they were even friends....=/.... (besides, I hope that arguing isn't always considered flirting, cause if it is Im sending off aloooooooot of wrong signals to some girls I know...>.>)

doesn't anyone think jk might be toying with us again? and will probally sent up a totally unlikely pair in book 6?

Yep...yep..yep.....you are so right!!!:) Sadly...but it is true....I think JKR is making things even more confusing..

No Heromwninny I am trying to say that the people who say Hermione would not ruin someones date but kill someone for no reason dont make sense really (I know she had a good reason to).

It's a little weird to me when people keep on saying that they're confused about Hermione's feelings: IMO, Hermione's feelings are the clearest of all. Maybe I'm just seeing what I want to see, but it seems glaringly obvious that she cares about Harry waaaay more than as just a friend. What I'm confused about is Harry's feelings--which is why I can only assume that he's still in the dark himself (dolt) but will come to his senses in Book 6. He'll be 16 then, and hopefully more mature--his excuse of being a naive little adolescent will be waning.

Yes Hermione has become very emotional, but can you blame her? Or Cho for that matter? You have puberty, so your hormones are out of control. Your bestfriend could be killed by a lunatice in any moment and your boyfriend was killed by that lunatic. My problem with Cho is that I felt she was in a way using Harry to help her find out if Cedric said anything about her before he died and to feel close to him through Harry, who was there with Cedric when he died. Anyhow back to the topic.....
Help him forget what, exactly? If you mean in regards to things that are happening with Voldemort, I think that you are right. He should be able to forget once in a while that he is being chased after by a lunatic, but of course that is impossible because he needs to be prepared and face what is happening to him. So for now Ginny is all good for that, as Hermione is all good for helping Harry prepare. Hermione is all about "let me keep Harry alive now."

I actually think Hermione understands Harry's situation. She seems to know what he thinking so I would think she understands. She doesn't sugarcoat much, she tells it like it is the majority of the time, like Lee Jordan does when commentating on the Quidditch match.

I don’t think Cho was using Harry. I think Hermione very well explained the problem. I sensed it that Cho liked Harry from GoF. Wasn’t sure but I assumed she did. What I didn’t expect her to be was an airhead. Harry needs someone that helps him focus on the problem but helps him forget and free himself. It became painfully obvious in this book that Hermione can’t do that. I honestly can say from my view that they are suited. It’s very clear to me that H/Hr are not suited for each other.

I think Ginny is perfect for Harry while she may help him forget once in a while his worries she is also smart and can help him be safe. Much better than Hermione. Harry treats Hermione’s good intentions with resentment. Because she treats him like a child. And he is not. I think Ron was very good when he said that it was Harry’s choice and he should be able to pick what he want it. It his life, his choice. Harry doesn’t need a mother he needs a partner and Hermione is not his partner or his equal. Simply because she treats him like a minor and someone who doesn’t know what he is doing. She becomes the nagging voice in his head.

I know many think that Harry’s dream when he dreamed of Hermione is a great thing. I think it’s a very bad thing and even worst methaphor that she turned into Cho. I know many H/Hr shippers don’t believe so. But in my view and for what I have seen that was a bad thing shipping and friendshiply speaking. I think Hermione simply can’t understand Harry and yes I do believe they bring out the worst of each other. And while her intentions are good her methods are bad in terms of reaching out to Harry.

I don't see how Harry and Hermione bring out the worse in each other when they argue. When do they bring out the bad stuff? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't read anywhere Harry telling Hermione she's a know-it-all and that she should mind her business. I haven't read Hermione telling Harry that he should stop pitying himself. The only time I can recall Hermione telling Harry about himself is when she tells him that he is trying too hard to play the part of the hero, which is true. He got mad and look at where it led: Sirius getting killed. (Just for your information, I blame Harry for Sirius' death.) But what's important here though, is that she put her personal opinions aside and helped Harry through and through.

Here are a few examples:

OoP page. 377-378

“Let’s get this straight,� said Harry angrily, as they put their bags back on the floor, “Sirius agrees with us, so you don’t think we should do it anymore?�

Hermione looked tense and rather miserable. Now staring at her own hands she said, “Do you honestly trust his judgment?�

“Yes I do!� said Harry at once. “He’s always given us great advice!�.


'You… this isn't a criticism, Harry! But you do… sort of… I mean - don't you think you've got a bit of a - a - saving-people thing!' she said.

He glared at her.

'And what's that supposed to mean, a "saving-people thing"?'

'Well… you…' she looked more apprehensive than ever. 'I mean… last year, for instance… in the lake… during the Tournament… you shouldn't have… I mean, you didn't need to save that little Delacour girl… you got a bit… carried away…'

A wave of hot, prickly anger swept through Harrys body; how could she remind him of that blunder now?

'I mean, it was really great of you and everything,' said Hermione quickly, looking positively petrified at the look on Harrys face, 'everyone thought it was a wonderful thing to do -'

That's funny,' said Harry through gritted teeth, 'because I definitely remember Ron saying I'd wasted time acting the hero … is that what you think this is? You reckon 1 want to act the hero again?'

'No, no, no!' said Hermione, looking aghast. That's not what I mean at all!'

'Well, spit out what you've got to say, because we're wasting time here!' Harry shouted.

'I'm trying to say - Voldemort knows you, Harry! He took Ginny down into the Chamber of Secrets to lure you there, it's the kind of thing he does, he knows you're the - the sort of person who'd go to Sirius's aid! What if he's just trying to get you into the Department of Myst—?'

'Hermione, it doesn't matter if he's done it to get me there or not - they've taken McGonagall to St Mungo's, there isn't anyone from the Order left at Hogwarts who we can tell, and if we don't go, Sirius is dead!'
'But Harry - what if your dream was - was just that, a dream?
“Harry let out a roar of frustration. Hermione actually stepped back from him looking alarmed.

"You don't get it," Harry shouted at her. "I'm not having nightmares, I'm not just dreaming! What d'you think all the Occlumency was for, why d'you think Dumbledore wanted me prevented from seeing these things? Because they are REAL Hermione -- Sirius is trapped

<<snip>>

But Harry, you've just said it," said Hermione fiercely. "Dumbledore wanted you to learn to shut these things out of your mind, if you'd done Occlumency properly you'd never have seen this --"

"IF YOU THINK I'M JUST GOING TO ACT LIKE I HAVEN'T SEEN --".

That’s one of the many times that Harry shots angrily at Hermione and Hermione in the end. (I didn’t copy it enterily I trust you have the book too) ends up being shut up and miserable (first one). Fight makes Harry aim to hurt Hermione’s feelings and Hermione to mistrust Harry’s judgement. It's very clear to me that while Hermione may have the best intentions. Harry simply doesn't trust her judgement. In another one Harry complaits that she didn't complaint when he saved them from the dementors. H/Hr fight and they aim to hurt each others feelings to no end. That became clearer and this book. They are nice friends but to go into a relationship it would meant to be a horrible disaster.

Here is the other one you asked:
OoP Page 499


“Oh stop feeling all misunderstood,� said Hermione sharply. “Look the others told me what you overheard last night on the Extendable Ears –“

Yeah?� growled Harry, h is hands deep in his pockets as he watched the snow now falling thicky outside. “All been talking about me, have you? Well, I’m getting used to it. . . “

“We wanted to talk to you, Harry,� said Ginny angrily, “seeing as you don’t know anyone but me who’s been possessed by You know who, and I can tell you how it feels.�

Harry remained quite still as the impact of these words hit him.
The he wheeled around.“


Hermione’s remark only causes even more resentment and withdrawn in Harry. She treats him like a child. Like someone that doesn’t know what he is doing. And even if sometimes that it’s true. Harry doesn’t like that which only causes for him to be awfull at her and to her be even more uptight about the situation. For some reason (again maybe because it’s done an awful lot to her) Ginny seems to reach him because she doesn’t treat him like he doesn’t know what he is doing. Yes she snaps at him but the way she remarks at him. it doesn’t aim to belittle him just to reach him.

“Yes this year is Harry's year, so after Harry grieves Sirius's death, I expect for his anger to ebb away and for the Trio to be back as they were pre-PoA. Harry and Hermione will be just as close as ever, expect they won't be done each other's throat. I mean with everything that they went through this year, how can they not be any closer than they were before. I, also, would like to say that Hermione won't be as stressed out because there won't be no O.W.L.s, so I can't wait for 6th Year to see how "lightened up" she'll be.“

Don’t expect the Trio to come back again, Grace. I’m almost sure that the stage ended in book 4. It had to come to and end. Simply because they were growing up. If anything expect them to separate even more. It’s meant to happened IMO. Simply because unlike other series JKR choosed that they grow up as it then time won’t stand still and they are bound to go their own path. It already started with Ron (which if I’m not mistaken it’s the one that jkr uses to sets up the path for the other two, since he is the older one.) and almost with Hermione(she is the next one since she is a girl and she matures with Ron). Next year it will be Harry’s turn(which stupidly as it sounds I’m almost sure that he matures with Ginny, because girls mature faster than boys). They will always be friends and we will see them sitting in the common room laughing and having some adventures. But as it was before book 5 no I’m not expecting that to come back again. That could be the reason that jkr expected a lot of people to drop the series or be disappointed at it. Unlike other series she has allow them to grow up and that is not usual but it also means that they will be very good friends but they are bound to choose their own way.

I don't see their arguing as Hermione treating Harry as though he isn't her equal. I personally have always felt that Hermione thinks highy of Harry. She sees his and Ron's potentiality, they're just lazy. And it's not that Hermione doesn't think what Harry does is right, it's just the way he goes about it. She's concerned that he's going to do something harsh and reckless which could in turn get him killed because he has left Hogwarts and Voldemort can now have full access of Harry. All I see is Hermione's great concern and she gets fed up when he just doesn't seem to show that he's concerned about his own safety.

I don’t believe that Hermione is treating Harry like her equal I think she constantly treats him like someone that needs watching something that completely bothers Harry to no end. She was a lot lighten up in this book and she still bugged him to no end. The reason behind this is that Hermione is a person not used to people being in danger. So she get's extremelly nervous by it.

I actually see it as Hermione not being too physical with Ron so that he doesn't get the wrong idea. I see it that way because I only see R---->Hr.

Nope I believe it’s S. tension (I’m not sure if I can mention the word) but you get the picture. In this book Hermione grabbed Ginny in a moment of tension. Hermione is simply not used to mayhem and trouble (seeing that she appears to be an only child) and when she comfronts it she get’s nervous. It’s nothing against Hermione it’s simply the way the are made. Ginny is probably more used to it since she grew up with 6 savages! Ups! sorry 6 boys! Well maybe we should say 20 Fred and George count as fourth each! It’s a wonder that Mrs. Weasley is still a sane person! But no I believe it's sexual tension what causes R/Hr not to be physical with each other.

There wouldn't be a reason for her acting this way because Harry is older than her. It would pretty arrogant of someone to treat someone who is older and more experienced as if they were younger. No I don't think that Ginny is arrogant and that's why I think that she treats Harry the way she does. But there is a pretty simple and straightforward explantion. Ginny treats him this way because he is older.

I think I posted a quote above. And it explain it. No the reason maybe simply because we see in cannon that everybody treats her like a child. The only ones that believe in her are Fred and George who appear to clarify that being on a receiving line of one of her bat boogie hexes is not a pleasant experience. Mrs. Weasley treats her like a child, Ron does, Everybody does and the fact is that she doesn’t like it! She argued with Harry because of that. She believes that she is the same as him. And even though she knows a lot more than Harry since she is Obviously smart. She doesn't pretend that he is inferior or that she knows more. Which is one of the things that Hermione does.

Now let me get this straight. Hermione and Ron's fighting have brought out the best in each other. Such as Ron accusing Hermione of lying, betraying Harry, fraternizing with the enemy, brewing love potions, Ron yelling at her in front of everyone after the Yule Ball, Ron ruining the Yule Ball for her. These are Good Things that she has brought out of Ron And when Ron and Hermione fight we get things like Hemione storming off, Hermione ignoring Ron, Hermione crying, Hermione looking dangerously, Hermione answering icily, and these are the good things that Ron brings out of Hermione.

Harry made Hermione cry in this book so it’s the same for both boys. Harry was horrible to Hermione in this book. So that’s makes it even to both boys. And that’s not the only time that Ron and Hermione fight. I already answered some of this part to Grace above.

So, bottom line is, JK's quotes are far too vague to be taken completely seriously. We still need to bear in mind that she's the author; she doesn't necessarily want us to guess what happens in her books because where would the element of surprise be?

I know your state on this but some people like myself don’t share this opinion so we do believe when she said something that she is telling the truth is our prerogative to do so. You can't say that they don't count just because you think they are vague. It's like trying to force an opinion on someone. Not that that is what you are trying to do. But just clarifying my view.

To clarify this in my view. Luna is bound to be with Neville. Meet cute scene was a small give away. Also is the way the repell each other.

WoW! Long post!
Gily Ann

). Fight makes Harry aim to hurt Hermione’s feelings and Hermione to mistrust Harry’s judgement. It's very clear to me that while Hermione may have the best intentions. Harry simply doesn't trust her judgement. In another one Harry complaits that she didn't complaint when he saved them from the dementors. H/Hr fight and they aim to hurt each others feelings to no end. That became clearer and this book. They are nice friends but to go into a relationship it would meant to be a horrible disaster.

Well, after all that fight, Harry ended up doing what Hermione said to do (clear sign that he really trusts her judgement)......At the end, she was right and he wasn't....See the point??? They fight, but they solve the problems right there....That's better than with Ron,(now, that would be a disaster) where Hermione just gets annoyed because most of the time he is too stubborn or doesn't understand....

ok ok some good points. Nothing compared to the row Hermione and Ron had in Book Three though. I don't really see Harry/Ginny happening. I still think we don't know enough about her. Besides, doesn't seem like she likes Harry anymore.
Like I said before, everyone's on equal footing right now. Hermione seems to like Harry more in this book (to me anyways) but Harry's particularly horrible to her (I dunno if that might be a good sign...you always hurt the one you love?) Ron seems to liek Hermione more, but Hermione seems to have lost all interest in him. Right now I'd say H/Hr is more likely than R/Hr , but that might change...in book 4 I thought R/Hr was more likely...

[i]Originally posted by GilyAnn


Harry made Hermione cry in this book so it’s the same for both boys. Harry was horrible to Hermione in this book. So that’s makes it even to both boys.

First off: Nice job!!

Cant say that I agree with you..but you made some valid arguements. The only one that I'll respond too is the one above...because you seemed to mention or allude to it multiple times:

Harry was down right angry at nearly everyone in this book. He screams and yells at dumbledore, hermione, sirus, members of the order, the Dursleys,etc...he gets to just about everyone. And who can blame him? I was cheering him on everytime he started yelling.

He's at a point in his life, where NO ONE knows EXACTLY what he's going through. He never really told anyone after GoF what happened after he grabbed hte Cup. He had to deal with all of that by himself. The people around him know this. They want him to tell his story. They want to know what happens....so that they can help Harry defeat his fears, and his enemy. In the two quotes that you posted, you showed Harry and Hermione arguing. Like I've said earlier...Harry is all alone, at least that how he percieves it to be. NO ONE (at least in Harry's mind) can even begin to understand what his life is like.
As I began reading the series, I always could picture Hermione as Harry's conscience. His guide between right and wrong. Truth from fiction. Sometimes it's hard to listen to, and you want to fight it (and Harry does)but in the end you listen to your conscience because you know it's right. That's Hermione's role in Harry's life. To show my point further...Harry listend to Hermione's advice about girls when he talks to her about his relationship with Cho. McGonagall even noticed it! "Well at least you listen to Hermione Granger" (that quote by the way was in refernce to Umbridges speech, when McGonagll asked Harry what Umbridge was tlaking about). I personally would love to have someone helping me along and guiding me into making the right decisions..especially if it keeps me alive for another day or heck...even another year so that I can continue my studies at Hogwarts.

Eventhough they may argue, that doesn't mean that he's not listening or that he doesn't care about Hermione. But you have to remember the mindset that Harry was going through in book 5...Hermione wasn't the only one being yelled at.

First of all, GilyAnn, I have to say that I did agree with something you said in your post:
Harry was horrible to Hermione in this book.

Yes, he most certainly was. Harry was horrible to EVERYONE in this book, but Hermione seemed to take alot more face-to-face shouting from him than anyone, except for dear old Dumbles. (How Harry could look Dumbledore in the face and shout at him while trashing his office is beyond me, but I digress.) Well, tell me, who enjoys being shouted at like this? No one. And who will take this kind of irrational shouting and still stand by the person doing this? A true friend. Now, Harry gave everyone a fair share of his temper, but like I said before, it's evident that he has no problem screaming at Hermione, as shown in the big argument before the Department of Mysteries scene. I keep coming back to this because it's a prime example of the way H/Hr communicate, and while that may seem terrible at first, look closely at the text:

"They're not normal dreams!" Harry shouted in her face, standing up and taking a step closer to her in turn. He wanted to shake her.
<snip>
"Okay," she said, looking frightened yet determined. "I've just got to say this..."
"What?"
"You...This isn't a criticism, Harry! But you do...sort of...I mean--don't you think you've got a bit of a--a--saving-people-thing?" she said.
He glared at her. "And what's that supposed to mean, a 'saving-people-thing'?"
"Well...you..." She looked more apprehensive than ever. "I mean...last year, for instance...in the lake...during the Tournament....you shouldn't have...I mean, you didn't need to save that little Delacour girl...You got a bit...carried away..."
A wave of hot, prickly anger swept through Harry's body--how could she remind him of that blunder now?
"...I mean, it was really great of you and everything," said Hermione quickly, looking positively petrified at the look on Harry's face.
"That's funny," said Harry through gritted teeth, "because I definitely remember Ron saying I'd wasted time acting the hero...is that what you think it is?"
"No, no, no!" said Hermione, looking aghast."That's not what I mean at all!"
<snipped for more of Harry shouting at everyone>
Even through his anger and impatience Harry recognized Hermione's offer to accompany him into Umbridge's office as a sign of solidarity and loyalty.

Now I bolded the parts which I think show the kind of interaction between these two. Harry's anger is beyond control, he's actually on the point of shaking her to make her understand: is it just me or is she finally getting through to him? He hasn't released his anger like this in awhile, his frustration at not being able to do anything about his situation is actually coming through in his argument with Hermione. No more bottling it up and channeling it on Umbridge, unfortunately. As the passage continues, Hermione manages to touch a nerve by pointing out the infamous "saving-people-thing". He's clearly sensitive about this. He wants his heroics to be recognized for what they are, and she's belittling it by attributing it to his need to play the hero. Yet she has a valid point, and he comes to realize later that what she said is true. He's so angry at this point that it sounds like she's insulting him, but at least it gets through eventually.

Then, look at Hermione's reaction. She's terrified of offending him further, yet she pursues it. Why? Because she has to get her point across to him. She knows that this could be a matter of life and death, and she goes to any lengths to make him understand that he needs to consider his actions before he goes dashing off to the Ministry. She doesn't care if he keeps on screaming at her till he's hoarse, she pursues the matter until she makes him see sense. And doesn't she finally get through to him? He certainly takes her advice, and he can even recognize that she's telling him this because she cares about him. Who else has been able to get through to him when he's in this kind of temper? Dumbledore, and that's about it. He actually *listens* to Hermione, through all the yelling and shouting, he actually takes her advice. And doesn't he usually do this anyway?

I highlighted some parts above because Hermione's reaction during this fight is drastically different from the way she behaves when she's squabbling with Ron. Here we get words like "snapped", "coldly", "snarled", and "irritably". Even during their most serious argument, the Yule Brawl, it's obvious that she's not so visibly upset at Ron shouting at her as she is when Harry shouts. She seems more concerned with defending herself and saving face rather than getting her point across.

potterfreak, I agree about Hermione being kind of like the voice of Harry's conscience. The little voice inside his head that tells him right and wrong and thumps him over the head when he's being stupid. And even he knows that it curiously enough sounds like her voice, for crying out loud.

Since this post is getting kind of lengthy, I still want to address some of GilyAnn's points, but I'll save it for later. Cheers!

I think in this book if you actually tried to stop Harry from yelling at you and suceeded (such as when Ginny did), you actually made him much more angry and he just started to disregard what you say to him and kind of stop yelling but also just not listen to you. I think that Hermione knew Harry so well that even though he had never acted like this before in any of the other books, she could pick up on what to do so quickly when he was acting very different from how he had ever acted before. Oh one last thing, I think both Earendil and Hermowninny have made some really great points in there post, thanks.

Eventhough they may argue, that doesn't mean that he's not listening or that he doesn't care about Hermione. But you have to remember the mindset that Harry was going through in book 5...Hermione wasn't the only one being yelled at.

Good so this mean that we all understand what Ron was going thru last year. Right? Because it's exactly the same thing. The difference between Harry and Ron is basicly the gap between the ages. Ron faces things earlier than Harry (Puberty). Ron is the one that gives you the hint of what kind of development they are going thru next.

Earendil:

Yes Hermione was not the only being yelled at it. But if you see closely he yelled at the people that exactly were hurting him. Harry felt betrayed by Dumbledore and as great as he is. He did do that. Harry prefers to know the truth rather that being kept in the dark for it. Dumbledore's actions is what cause this and being in the dark and not said anything about what was going on. Was what causing feeding his anger. Hermione didn't make it any better. If you notice Harry didn't yelled at Ron as much as he did to Hermione. Why? Simply because he let him walk his own path and only stood by him when he needed. Yes he yelled at him but Hermione took the worst part because she is Inflexible like jkr called her. Ron let him be his own and even though he didn't agree in some things he stood aside and let him walk his own path. That's why in this book we saw a completly different Ron. Hermione is argumentative and as good as her intentions were she has to stop mothering Harry. She HAS to step aside and let him be on his own. Otherwise there are bound to be more ugly confrontations like the ones we had in this book.

He's so angry at this point that it sounds like she's insulting him, but at least it gets through eventually.

I don't expect you to agree with me. But I did consider this an insult to Harry.


Then, look at Hermione's reaction. She's terrified of offending him further, yet she pursues it. Why? Because she has to get her point across to him. She knows that this could be a matter of life and death, and she goes to any lengths to make him understand that he needs to consider his actions before he goes dashing off to the Ministry. She doesn't care if he keeps on screaming at her till he's hoarse, she pursues the matter until she makes him see sense. And doesn't she finally get through to him? He certainly takes her advice, and he can even recognize that she's telling him this because she cares about him. Who else has been able to get through to him when he's in this kind of temper? Dumbledore, and that's about it. He actually *listens* to Hermione, through all the yelling and shouting, he actually takes her advice. And doesn't he usually do this anyway?

If Hermione didn't do something. Harry was going to without her. It didn't matter she just offered an alternative. And it was a good one. I don't deny that. And that's not the issue. The issue is that when H/Hr fight they aimed to hurt each other feelings. Which is the worst kind of combination, IMO.

Gily Ann

Alright, first off, let me clear up a bit on the 'Anti-Interview-Quote' thing.

Posted by GilyAnn
I know your state on this but some people like myself don't share this opinion so we do believe when she said something that she is telling the truth is our prerogative to do so. You can't say that they don't count just because you think they are vague. It's like trying to force an opinion on someone. Not that that is what you are trying to do. But just clarifying my view.

OK, let me say that I don't disagree with you on the point that "when she said something that she is telling the truth". Fine. A good example would be the Royal Albert Hall interview:

JK Rowling:
That is an excellent question and the reason is… I have to be careful… not to say too much. However, when Professor Dumbledore took Professor Snape onto the staff and Professor Snape said he'd like to teach Defence Against the Dark Arts please and Professor Dumbledore felt that it might bring out the worst in Professor Snape, so Dumbledore said: "I think we'll let you teach potions and see how you get along there."

That is, of course, perfectly factual, and I don't think that anyone could argue with that. That, however, is very different from another of her interviews where she mentions the infamous "going on" quote. The problem with that is that she leaves quite a few holes in her answer. Consider, perhaps, that she doesn't mention wether it's only Ron who has feelings for Hermione, or if Hermione has feelings for Ron. As a result, the implications of that particular quote may be thoroughly dissected by distressed shippers (particularly H/Hr and R/Hr shippers) who want answers. My point is that we may never come to a unanimous decision as to the meaning of that quote, seeing as though there is such a huge gap between the views of H/Hr and R/Hr shippers.

Nice Job Earendil, Grace, Ecthelion, some great posts guys. :clappy:

and potterfreak24 and hermownninny :welcome: some nice work and don't let the other ships get to you ;) If you find the time take a look at the old love thread in the Great Hall. In there you will find a link to the H/Hr file as it is affectionately called. A file that is well worth the time and effort to read. In the book 5 love thread part 6 you'll also see a few of the answers to the quotes and other such subjects this can help as well.

Hey Sirius83 can we get a new link in here? Sirius83 might be able to help if not you can find the link in the old love thread.

Now back on topic............

To add a little to Earendil (hope you don't mind),

"That's funny," said Harry through gritted teeth, "because I definitely remember Ron saying I'd wasted time acting the hero...is that what you think it is?"
"No, no, no!" said Hermione, looking aghast."That's not what I mean at all!"

Hermione doesn't seem to be to happy to be accused as having the same thoughts as Ron.

Even through his anger and impatience Harry recognized Hermione's offer to accompany him into Umbridge's office as a sign of solidarity and loyalty.

And it said in the book jacket that Harry would find boundless loyalty and look where he finds it.... Hermione.

Just a few thoughts

Cheers!

Good so this mean that we all understand what Ron was going thru last year. Right? Because it's exactly the same thing.


No, it is not. What Harry is going through is much deeper and much more complicated than what Ron was going through. Ron is older but not that much older. What Harry was going through was not just an age thing.

If you notice Harry didn't yelled at Ron as much as he did to Hermione.


He did not talk to Ron as much as he did to Hermione. Not as meaningfully anyway. Harry and Hermione had much deeper conversations. Ones where more emotions were bound to come out. Besides that, Hermione always made more sense than almost anyone and when it really came down to it. He listened to her.


The issue is that when H/Hr fight they aimed to hurt each other feelings. Which is the worst kind of combination, IMO.


I highly disagree. They have never hurt each other to the point where it looked like the end of their friendship. When it came down to it, look at their reactions when the other was in danger or hurt.

Hi this is my first post here.

Anyone noticed Hermione starts saying Voldermorts name?
But whats more important is how it affects Harry.
(pg 293 UK edition)

Just a theory concerning the mirror of erised, Ron is well on his way to gaining all that he wanted in book 1, mainly to overshadow all his brothers. But remember when Harry looked into the mirror he saw his family standing behind him? With the loss of Sirius I can't help but think that the love and support he gained from Sirius will now be replaced by Hermione.

Also I don't think it's necessary to the story for Ron or any other character to be in love, Harry on the other hand is completley diffrent.

No, it is not. What Harry is going through is much deeper and much more complicated than what Ron was going through. Ron is older but not that much older. What Harry was going through was not just an age thing.

Actually is the same thing. And yes it a main problem with Harry was the age he had. He went from mood to mood in 0 to 5 seconds. I see no diference. Puberty is just that puberty. Hits all boys. One of the main problem with Harry's temper was his age and his hormones going out of control. Other things were hitting him hard but this contribute a lot to his stage.

I highly disagree. They have never hurt each other to the point where it looked like the end of their friendship. When it came down to it, look at their reactions when the other was in danger or hurt.

Harry and Hermione went to the point of aiming to take on the others one's face things that they did for each other, and even more aim to hurt the other one. It's just a bad combination. Even if she only wanted to make her point across which I know it was her purpose still it is a dangerous thing. And Hermione has that with everybody is not just with Harry he does it with Ron and with Luna and a lot of other people.

Gily Ann

Edit: I forgot. Actually Harry did had a couple of meaniful conversations with Ron. Ron is just better at handling Harry.

And it said in the book jacket that Harry would find boundless loyalty and look where he finds it.... Hermione.

Yes and Sirius, Ron, Ginny, Luna and Neville. Who all stood by him and never abandon him even though he was being rude to all of them. All of them risking their skin to stand by him. This has nothing to do with shipping. Why are we discoussing this? Just curious.

One of the main problem with Harry's temper was his age and his hormones going out of control. Other things were hitting him hard but this contribute a lot to his stage.


Even so, that was not his main problem. Harry would not have had been so angry if not for the probably worst two months of his life. Life and death situations, being called insane by the MoM and the Daily Prophet, being abused by his blood relatives (not to mention his teachers) and being shut out of everything that was going on in the wizarding world.


Harry and Hermione went to the point of aiming to take on the others one's face things that they did for each other, and even more aim to hurt the other one.


I do not see that anywhere in the book. Hermione and Harry never tried to hurt one another verbally or otherwise. The type of anger you are talking about, is that shown by Cho and Harry.

[quote]Originally posted by Earendil (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=397051#post397051))
Hermione isn't the man-eating strumpet that alot of people make her out to be. If she is serious about Krum, she's not going to go chasing after boys behind his back. We know that this isn't like her, and we But I think that there is a reason why Hermione is keeping her hypothetical feelings for Harry under wraps as of now, and that reason is Ron. She knows him well enough to know that he wouldn't be too chuffed to find out that the girl he has a crush on (as I'm very well sure that she knows) actually likes his best friend. She's trying to spare his feelings as well as her own, because she also knows that as of now, Harry doesn't like her as more than a friend. (Or does he? I have no clue. Not yet, I would imagine.)[quote]

I;m a bit late to this discussion but I think you might have hit on a possible reason for her <sigh>

She's hoping that Ron will catch on that she just doesn't like him that way for himself rather than having to tell him.

Alright. JKR is one cryptic lady. I want opinions on this. It came up in conversation a few minutes ago and it's a piece of cryptic writing indeed. Here is the context:


It became clear after ten minutes, however, that Ron was not capable of eating anything more and Harry thought it best to get him down to the changing rooms. As they rose from the table, Hermione got up too, and taking Harry's arm, she drew him to one side.
"Don't let Ron see what's on those Slytherins' badges," she whispered urgently.
Harry looked questioningly at her, but she shook her head warningly; Ron had just ambled over to them, looking lost and desperate.
"Good luck, Ron," said Hermione, standing on toptoe and kissing him on the cheek. "And you, Harry -"
Ron seemed to come to himself slightly as they walked back across the Great Hall. He touched the spot on his face where Hermione had kissed him, looking puzzled, as though he was not quite sure what had just happened. He seemed too distracted to notice much around him, but Harry cast a curious glance at the crown-shaped badges as they passed the Slytherin table, and this time he made out the words etched onto them: Weasley is our king.


And you, Harry...WHAT? Really, what did Hermione do? "And you, Harry, good luck," or "And you, Harry, *kiss*" My interpretation is she also kissed Harry good luck, but Harry was too busy looking at Ron to really notice. The text leads us to believe she kissed both boys, but we only have confirmation of one.

I think Hermione did kiss both boys good luck, but JKR broke off Harry's bit so it looks like both boys got 1 each(end of GOF remember?)...another thing is those badges. Hermione knows Ron likes her. Did she do this so Ron's mind would be elsewhere and not noticing the badges? I don't know, this is just a very cryptic bit of writing...what are your interpretations?

It's in chapter 19, by the way. "The Lion and the Serpent"...page 404 in the US hardcover edition.

Originally posted by Sirius83 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=397754#post397754))
Alright. JKR is one cryptic lady. I want opinions on this. It came up in conversation a few minutes ago and it's a piece of cryptic writing indeed. Here is the context:



And you, Harry...WHAT? Really, what did Hermione do? "And you, Harry, good luck," or "And you, Harry, *kiss*" My interpretation is she also kissed Harry good luck, but Harry was too busy looking at Ron to really notice. The text leads us to believe she kissed both boys, but we only have confirmation of one.

I think Hermione did kiss both boys good luck, but JKR broke off Harry's bit so it looks like both boys got 1 each(end of GOF remember?)...another thing is those badges. Hermione knows Ron likes her. Did she do this so Ron's mind would be elsewhere and not noticing the badges? I don't know, this is just a very cryptic bit of writing...what are your interpretations?

It's in chapter 19, by the way. "The Lion and the Serpent"...page 404 in the US hardcover edition.



I agree with you. Some type of action took place after that statement and I do lean towards a good luck kiss as well. . . the comment really makes no sense otherwise. And I think that JKR wrote it fully knowing we'd analyse it like crazy.

"Good luck, Ron," said Hermione, standing on toptoe and kissing him on the cheek. "And you, Harry -"

I also came to your conclusion. It seems to me that there is a definite pause of something happening, much like the pause where cho kissed Harry, except this one was much shorter. For it seems to skip an interval of time between the very plausible Harry's kiss to where the scene begins anew.

Okay, here's what I think about the kiss.

1. The kiss that was given to Ron was for support, and not for romantic reasons. Why? Hermione says “Good luck� before she kisses Ron, so logically, it is a good luck kiss. Ron is sorely lacking in confidence and the fact that the Slytherins are wearing a badge to mock him is definitely only going to make things worse. She wants to show her support.

2. Fine. Now that I’ve gotten that off my chest, I have to say that IF Hermione kissed Harry after the “-,� it is meaningless for shipping debates because it is also for encouragement.

3. After the “-,� the narrative focalization changes. Prior to it, the narrative is focalized from Harry’s point of view. Harry “thought� it best to leave the hall and go change. He was drawn aside by Hermione without knowing why. He looks “questioningly� at Hermione. He watches as she gives Ron a kiss on the cheek. After the “-,� the narrative shifts out of Harry’s focal point and we see Ron’s reaction to the kiss. What happens between Hermione and Harry is not known.

4. Did Hermione kiss Harry? We cannot definitively say. When Hermione said “You too, Harry – ,� she could have meant “good luck to you too, Harry.� Or, she could have meant to give him a kiss on the cheek as well. No one can say definitively and without equivocation that there was a kiss or that there was not a kiss for Harry.

5. Hawk’s Theory of Interruptions: everytime Hermione and Harry are about to enter a “connection� moment, it is interrupted by one thing or another. If you have read the Love Thread Part Six in the Great Hall, you will know what I am talking about here. If you have not read it, I suggest you go take a look at what Hawk has written on “Interruptions.�

In this scene, we see another instance of Hermione and Harry almost making a connection, only to have the scene be interrupted. What is Rowling trying to achieve by using this strategy of avoidance? What purpose do the interruptions serve as a tactic?

Or Hermione may of kissed Ron to draw his attention from seeing what was on those badges. She knows Ron likes her afterall.

You all have some really good back-up theories! At first I was convinced that Ron and Hermione mutually liked each other, but now I'm really shooting in the dark.

I won't go into this in great detail since I'm about to fall into my tea cup from drowsiness, but I'm pretty convinced now that Hermione is looking for a bit more than friendship in Harry, though I'm positive that Ron likes Hermione.

yes, that particular scene made me scream at the book, and what?

AND WHAT?!?

Hey, the whole cryptic lady thing reminded me of something. im not sure if i ever posted this or not. im not sure due to the difficulty the site was having. ill post it again JIC. (just in case)

It had to do with the Royal Alburt Hall interview, or whatever that place is called. (sorry, i dont live over in the Uk, or is it britain? or great britain? or england? so many names...)

Anyway, during the interview, she described Luna as an anti hermione. This really made me raise an eyebrow. An anti hermione? Who do we know whos anti hermione? Well, lots of people im sure, but i believe Ron could go as an anti hermione much better. They are constantly bickering.

Hey! That just reminded me of something my old 7th grade English teacher taught us! It was on relationships in writing. She said that a positive and a negative wont get along. yet a positive and a positive would! Same for negative.

Now I see JKR's description of Luna as such and Lunas attraction to ron, along with Rons personality. With this theory, It leaves wide open the possibility for Luna and Ron in my opinion.

Though have you already picked over this? (sorry, i just get tired of going through page after page.)

Prophecy:
Cho will return to H's life.
H and Hm get closer.
R struggles with confessing to Hm.
R walks in on H and Hm in an inconvenient moment.
R won't talk to H.
H/R/Hm triangle.
H will be torn btwn Cho and Hm.
R an Luna?

:clappy: Everyone GREAT POSTS!!! I'd like to thank Earendil for that really great post about the "hero" scene.

Now Gily, I see where you're coming from, but I just don't agree with it. I cannot see, for the life of me, how their arguments bring out the worst in each other. Sure Harry wanted to shake her (that's the worst I've seen, but he never really did it, did he?) He could have and she wouldn't have let her guard down. She wasn't about to let Harry make a big mistake. This is a life and death situation for both Harry and Sirius. I understand why Harry is angry at Hermione, Hermione understands as well, but she would prefer to explain to Harry that perhaps Voldemort has finally "possessed" Harry. She is trying to be reasonable.

After they argued they are interrupted by Ginny and Luna (who he, by the way, doesn't want in his business.) Ginny asks if she could help and Hermione comes up with a plan. Even after such a "terrifying" fight they compromise! Take a looksy at the end result, please:

OoP American Edition: Chapter 32: Out of the Fire P.735-736:
"Wait," said Hermoine suddenly. "Wait...Harry, they can help."
Harry and Ron looked at her.
"Listen," she said urgenly, "Harry, we need to establish whether Sirius really has left headquarters-"
"I've told you, I saw-"
"Harry, I'm begging you, please!" said Hermione desperately. "Please let's just check that Sirius isn't at home before we go charging off to London - if we find out he's not there then I swear I won't try and stop you, I'll come, d-do whatever it takes to try and save him-"
<snip where Hermione explains the plan to Harry>
"Okay," Harry said aggessively to Hermione, "Okay, if you can think of a way of doing this quickly, I'm with you, otherwise I'm going to the Department of Mysteries right now-"

'Nuff said. Oh....I agree with everyone else, as I said before and I'll say it again, Harry was screaming at EVERYONE throughout the book.

Next stop Hermione's Accomplice to a Murder:
I don't see anything wrong with what Hermione did. This topic, as well as Harry's Crucio, is much talked about in other places as something that disturbed them. Well, I say, if they are supposed to kick Voldy and DE's butt, then they need to leave their politeness at the door and fight!

Hermione did what she had to do to save Harry. Look at what Cruciatus did to the Longbottoms. Hermione, after "visiting" Lockhart with Ron, Ginny and Harry, knows what Cruciatus does to someone and she does not want it to happen to Harry. And I'm sure she would have done it for anyone else, as well. The thing about this is that Hermione is the one to "come to the rescue." We didn't hear Ginny screaming "NO!" We didn't hear Ron screaming "NO!"


Hermione's Loyalty:
Loyalty does have something to do with SHIPping. You would like someone who will be loyal to you to be your mate, right? You'd like to know that someone will go to the ends of the world to do something for you, right? To save you, even if it meant they'd put their life on the line, just as you would do for them. And I think Hawk brought up the loyalty subject to show us that Harry notices Hermione's loyalty. I, myself, have already mentioned that although there are other people helping him out, he chooses to say this about Hermione. And this is after their HUGE fight which has "brought out the worst in Harry and Hermione." He sees that even after arguing with him, she still is willing to help.

"And you, Harry -" WHAT?!
Yes this has disturbed me as well. And it IS INTERRUPTION! Hawk, get down from your nest and start hunting! What was that pause for? Hmmmm....could mean anything, but I'll let others speak about it first. :p But if she did kiss him, it was just a good luck kiss, also. So perhaps we shouldn't make a big deal out of it.

Where have all the R/Hr'ers gone?

Am I the only one who would like the trio to just stay friends and nothing more? Oh well.

Originally posted by marspeach (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=398013#post398013))
Am I the only one who would like the trio to just stay friends and nothing more? Oh well.


No. There are a few others here who do want to see the Trio remain friends. I just can't remember who they are....sorry. :sorry:

Well, i woudl want the trio to remain just friends if the alternative is Harry being with Cho, Ginny, or well anyone but Hermione. I can take about anything or any relationship but Ron and Hermione. I dont know why i feel so against it, but i do. But the posts have been great on this topic. Does anyone think that in book 6, maybe 7 voldie will make an attack on Ron or Hermione? I think this will happen, and i put money on Hermione......(she is a mudblood after all) Can you just see the rage and fury of Harry going after her?! Coupled with the fact that Voldie has taken away his Godfather Harry will be out for blood if they lay a finger on Hermione......

Hey Grace Granger you made a very good point, it seems that Hermione always does come to the rescue for Harry when others wont (and Harry always seems to risk his neck to rescue her).