All about Remus Lupin

For what we've seen it seems like Lupin sticks with Moody, I guess what they're doing is to find clues on were can Voldemort be.

I think though Lupin loves people he may be scared to get close to them... Hmmm

You know, that's a really good point rons-lover. Although Remus is a very caring and emphatic person, after losing both James and Sirius, he has probably tried to restrain himself from getting too close to others in case they are killed. He has already suffered great losses at the hands of Voldemort and his Death Eaters, and maybe the fear of suffering from any further deaths might cause him to retreat into isolation. Although I certainly hope this is not the case, it could add to the explanation of why Remus tends to stay in the background.

You know, that's a really good point rons-lover. Although Remus is a very caring and emphatic person, after losing both James and Sirius, he has probably tried to restrain himself from getting too close to others in case they are killed. He has already suffered great losses at the hands of Voldemort and his Death Eaters, and maybe the fear of suffering from any further deaths might cause him to retreat into isolation. Although I certainly hope this is not the case, it could add to the explanation of why Remus tends to stay in the background.

This excellent question was brought up a multitude of pages ago. However, I'd like to make a comment I failed to say beforehand.

Considering what Lupin has gone through, it would be easy to see how he could just hide away and build mental walls around himself. It would be so easy for him to do that yet....yet...he won't. He is a man with morals, principles, and has got his priorities straight. There is no way he could do that to himself and get away with it...from himself. You can just see this intensity of his to see things through and do it the right way. It is subtely written into almost every portion of text we read about him...including when he was fifteen!

I think the aloofness and the distance you are describing is being misinterpreted. He has seen horrible things in his life. Becoming a werewolf, being constantly watched because of it, almost killing someone in that guise, living with the guilt of betraying DD's trust, seeing his best friends being killed off one by one...and seeing one of their sons go through some of the hardest trials ever gone through.....These things have a mental effect that directly pretain to one's disposition. In otherwords it has a detrimental affect that has consequences of being solemn, soft spoken, and distant. Harry himself is in the same situation. If he hadn't had his parents killed and had gone through all those horrible adventures....he'd be exactly like James. Same cocky manner, disposition, and skills....except he isn't. Going through the things that Lupin and Harry have gone through has a way of cooling you down...a mellowing affect if you will.

It is this attitude that resides in Lupin and the striking similarities that he holds with Harry on life situations that I can't help but think that Lupin is going to be the one that pulls Harry through Sirius' death....and maybe Harry will pull him out as well. Lupin and a lifetime experience of dealing with meloncholy situations, he can use that experience to Harry's benefit. He also is a lifetime friend of Sirius, and knew him better than even Harry. Again, this can be useful. And finally, he has the attitude and complexion that can peacefully and comfortably relay all these thoughts in the right manner to get Harry through....Harry needs somebody to pull him through, and the key to doing so resides in Lupin. I thoroughly expect to see him a lot more and fill part of the emptiness in Harry, left by Sirius, and to be filled by Lupin.

-Ecthelion

originally posted by Ecthelion:
It is this attitude that resides in Lupin and the striking similarities that he holds with Harry on life situations that I can't help but think that Lupin is going to be the one that pulls Harry through Sirius' death....and maybe Harry will pull him out as well. Lupin and a lifetime experience of dealing with meloncholy situations, he can use that experience to Harry's benefit. He also is a lifetime friend of Sirius, and knew him better than even Harry. Again, this can be useful. And finally, he has the attitude and complexion that can peacefully and comfortably relay all these thoughts in the right manner to get Harry through....Harry needs somebody to pull him through, and the key to doing so resides in Lupin. I thoroughly expect to see him a lot more and fill part of the emptiness in Harry, left by Sirius, and to be filled by Lupin.

those are some really good points. and i really hope Lupin plays a bigger role in the next book now that Sirius is gone. it only seems logical that Harry would turn to him.

Harry should turn to Lupin ... who else knows his Dad and Sirius more than Lupin (well Peter don't count) Poor Lupin to loose everything.

Great post Ecthelion! I hope Lupin and Harry can help each other to come to terms with their difficult lives.

Even the first time I read POA, I felt that Lupin had a rather subdued air about him, even when he was being cheerful. Maybe it was just his slightly old-fashioned turn of phrase or his tired look, but he always seems to act like he has a great burden hanging on his soul. That was a great bit of characterisation.

As I specualated, maybe he had a GF, I mean coping for 12yrs? Okay well some people do do that, but they do other stuff at the same time.! So I say he have had a GF that turned out badly. He was prolly keeping his secret from her and broke up with her because of it, like he was afraid of hurting her, or he did hurt it(not on purpose) or maybe she felt he was holding back and he wouldn't say what so she said the relationship couldn't grow. And goodbye.! :p Okay me and my funny theories, but its an idea.! :D

Harry should turn to Lupin, but I'm not sure her will, not right away anyways. I think he will though, but I he may not realize he can because Lupin is a bit distant(emotionaly). But I see him as going to him because he is a Marauder. And he knows what its like to lose several people very close to you(And they just happen to be the same people.)


BTW I'm curious, is Lupin an orphan? I mean are his parents dead now?

Those are really good points, Ecthelion. I completely understand and agree with what you said. Remus is definitely a strong person, and his experience in pulling himself through times of great sorrow will surely be helpful to Harry. He has a natural wisdom that many others his age lack, which probably resulted from what you described, and his ability to cope with difficult situations is part of what makes me admire him.
Although I haven't been through nearly as much as he has, I can understand him in a way, since I am terribly shy and tend to be more emotionally distant than a lot of my friends. I have a history with depression and lost my great grandma and my grandpa a couple of years ago, so I was just using some of my experience to imagine what Remus might be going through.

BTW I'm curious, is Lupin an orphan? I mean are his parents dead now?

I don't think the book says anything about his parents in the present, so we can't really be sure at this point. Too bad we couldn't ask J.K. Rowling some of these questions!

I think all the marauders will be dead by the end of the series and that it will be this that will drive himself to sacrifice himself to kill voldemort. sorry that was a bit rash!
:lol: LOL well I hope not but I certainly wouldn't put it past JKR. Hehe, sorry I just couldn't help but laugh when I read this, it's so out of the blue. I think your sig is funny too. Or maybe I'm just in a giddy mood after finding this (http://www.artdungeon.net/) amazing site. *shrug*

Ecthelion - fantastic post. I think you're right about Lupin's character, although I'm still not sure how receptive Harry will be to his help. I hope he will be but... Harry has a tendency to push people away when he needs them most. Also, he tends to get lost in himself, you know? He may want to talk to somebody, but feels he can't because of xyz. He did this all over OotP.

Alright, so that means, Harry will push Lupin away when he really needs him? That's so sad and I'd literary kill Harry if he let that happen. I mean, lupin can provide so much help and he is an excellent wizard, knows so much!

*sigh* 4 days away from the thread and there's 6 more pages! Argh! oh well. now to reply:


wolfie, I love your sig, that's a really great picture of a fish, I usually just took mine from other websites, slowly consuming their bandwith. :whistle:
thanks Lestrange! :D

Hehe, it would be hilarious if all of us Lupin fans showed up at his house one day, and when he answered the door we all shouted, "Big squishy group hugs for Lupin!" and dove on top of him in a big mess of hugs! :D
that would be so great! attack of the fangirls! :lol:

the instrument of Lupin's demise already appears to be in place, Pettigrew's silver hand. And we know Pettigrew won't have any qualms about using it. :grumble:
I disagree with you actually. I think that Wormtail does have feelings, and that he was just weak and scared when he told Voldie where the Potters were hidden. I mean, yeah, he's not really a nice guy, but I think that he'll turn around in the end. I actually don't hate Peter. *ducks flying cod* (well, you guys must have a lot of it stashed away. what else would you throw at me? lol)

Maybe Moony could do a big marketing campaign or something :D
Equal rights for werewolfs or something.
Either that or he should say stuff you I'm going back to Hogwarts as the DADA professor and if you don't like it tough!
yes! I'd love to see him as the DADA professor again. HEY! maybe that will be the big part he has to play in book 7! I like that idea. :D and Moony for DADA is great! we need to make it a new club! Soon the Lupin fangirls will take over the world! ...or at least the cosforums. ;)

Werewolf's need love too!!!
So true! That pretty much sums up all of the Lupin threads I think.


...and that's as far as I got in the thread for now. I'll have to finish tomorrow. :)

Wow wolfie, I admire your patience! I would never be able to get through reading that many pages! By the way, your signiture is hilarious! :lol:

Harry has a tendency to push people away when he needs them most. Also, he tends to get lost in himself, you know? He may want to talk to somebody, but feels he can't because of xyz. He did this all over OotP.

Wouldn't that be awful if he refused Remus' help in a time when he needed it most? I see what you mean about Harry getting lost in himself, which I think made him even more frustrated and angry, since bottled emotions don't heal over time. It seems that both Remus and Harry need to get over their fears of talking openly about their feelings in order to help each other recover from the loss of Sirius.

I'm faily confident that eventually Harry and Lupin will grow closer and more dependent on eachother in book 6. I think Lupin will be the first one whom he'll really talk to about Sirius and his feelings, as Lupin understands this more than anybody. I doubt that we'll see another series of Harry bottling up his emotions in book 6, I have a feeling that it's going to be the 'release book' where Harry gets a chance to just spill everything and learn to work through everything, thus making him a stronger person. And Lupin, of course, will always be there for Harry, and I am sure Harry will become attatched to Lupin as he is the last thing he really has left.

But fredrocksmysocks what if Harry becomes afraid to get close to people now fearing that they'll die? He may think "I need someone to talk to, but why bother getting to know someone if they may just up and die?", have you ever thought of that? It could happen...

I just don't see Harry running to Lupin, as much as I'd like him too. Not right away anyways, I don't think it will happen till quite a ways into the book. Harry's not gonna lose his stubborness just like that. He may even be mad at Lupin if Lupin tried to talk to him... But as you said book 6 most likely will be the release book, he has to let this stuff out to someone or he'll explode and kill ever everyone in the world!!! ahahahah Well not quite... But ya know what I mean.

But I think Harry will confide in Lupin, just not right off the bat.

Rons-lover: No, I do not disagree. I think that point is very valid (and I believe I also posted something on it a page or so back.) Eventually, though, Harry will realize that he needs people and he needs to talk about it and I have no doubt that Lupin will be the first one whom he turns to. His stubbornness will fade away as Sirius's death sinks in even more and he realizes the full effect of what has happened. I doubt that Ron or Hermione will be the first ones he talks to and do not think he will remain very long without talking to somebody. Lupin is the only one who truly understands what he's feelings, and it will be a relief for Harry to have that for once. I agree, though, that it won't be right away...but eventually.

I certainly hope that he doesn't get angry with Lupin. Hasn't that man endured enough suffering? I think Harry recognizes this too, and, after his talk with DD, probably won't have too many outbursts of anger. I think that taught him a lot about how getting angry and throwing fits does nothing.

lol yeah, I know. I am thinking he wont and hoping he wont throw anymore fits :D. And probrably will control his anger much better. If not he'll have alot of trouble in the future, but I think he's learned his lessons.

And yeah I'd be really upset if he got mad with Lupin for any reason as well. So hopefully he wont.! :D

Nah Harry won't be so mean to Lupin .. no need to. He's stubbornn as a teen but he will understand

Well, yes, Harry will gradually have to get used to searching for advice in Lupin. He'd still be very sad in the beginning because of Sirius and would not want anyone to get really close to him. Because he'll think, 'see what happened to Sirius, it may happen to someone else you try to be closer too. Voldie might use that against me.'


maybe someone after the middle of book 6, or well into book 7, he'll start to see Lupin may well be a replacement to Sirius. Sure, he cares about rules and is not 'reckless' like Hermione described Sirius, but Remus is a very cool person. i mean, he is wise, caring, protective, and would even give up his life for any of his close ones...

So I say he have had a GF that turned out badly. He was prolly keeping his secret from her and broke up with her because of it, like he was afraid of hurting her, or he did hurt it(not on purpose) or maybe she felt he was holding back and he wouldn't say what so she said the relationship couldn't grow.

Maybe he ate her.

i mean, he is wise, caring, protective, and would even give up his life for any of his close ones...

And so was Sirius. :D

About Harry bottling his emotions: Well, I have no doubt that he's going to try to close himself from others in fear of hurting them, but somehow I think that there will be some communication, even if it's by owl (it's a lot easier to write down what you're feeling than saying it out loud). Remember when the the Order told the Dursleys that they were going to stop on their door if they didn't hear from Harry every three days or so? I think that part of what they said was to keep him from doing what he'd been doing all year: bottling his emotions and letting them explode during inappropriate moments. Part of the reason that he was so angry was because he had no one he could relate to. Well, now he does.

Even if he doesn't contact Lupin or the Order by letter very much, I have no doubt that one day he's going to need some type of parental guidance that he did when his scar hurt in book 4, and think "Gee, was I stupid, why didn't I think of Lupin before!" I'm certainly not saying that Sirius is going to be replaced by any means, though. ...If he wants to know something about his parents, Sirius maybe (remember how he felt when he had never asked Sirius if he played as well as his father?) Lupin is, well, the only person left now.

...One thing that I'm really wondering though, is who will go to who first. Will Lupin go to Harry and ask him how he feels, or will Harry go to Lupin first? It could go either way, kind of like and unknowing battle of wills.

If Lupin goes to Harry first, Harry might explode because he'll think that Lupin wants to replace Sirius, but then he'll go back later realizing how stupid he acted. If Harry goes to Lupin first it'll be pretty awkward to see Harry crying on his shoulder or something. :shrug:

Any thoughts more organized than mine? :D

...One thing that I'm really wondering though, is who will go to who first. Will Lupin go to Harry and ask him how he feels, or will Harry go to Lupin first? It could go either way, kind of like and unknowing battle of wills.

I think it will probably come about naturally, Harry and Lupin will be in conversation about something else, and Sirius will come up somehow. Harry, not feeling pressured, will be able to talk to Lupin calmly and release some of his feelings... It will probably be a bit further into Book 6 though.

Lupin knows better than try to go to Harry and make the impression like he'll replace Sirius. I mean, no one will replace Sirius, he was his own person, Lupin is different from him, but he is the closest to Harry's father now, even though Harry might not want to try and be closer to Lupin. That is just sad..


As I said before, later on, Harry will get used to Sirius being, well, dead. Maybe he'll even communicate with him somehow, I'm not gonna go into that. But I can see Sirius telling Harry that Lupin could be a great person in time of need and that Harry shouldn't feel like Lupin will take over the role of the godfather, and accept his advices and be closer to him. The only man left that truly knew James [i hate wormtail so i'm not gonna mention him, the guy's a hopeless case and i bet he didn't even know james as well as remus and sirius did]. harry should feel closer towards Lupin... i was kinda suprised that he only awcknowledged sirius, while they were both best friends with james....

One thing that I'm really wondering though, is who will go to who first. Will Lupin go to Harry and ask him how he feels, or will Harry go to Lupin first? It could go either way, kind of like and unknowing battle of wills.

I agree with what MSLupin said about this coming naturally, as Remus has a very peaceful, comforting aura about him, and Harry will probably feel better about going to Lupin for advice and to help deal with the loss of Sirius. Also, unlike Sirius, Remus tends to be very rational and has a deeper sense of what risks are worth taking. I loved Sirius dearly, but had an unfortunate (not to mention fatal) inclination to make rash decisions that put his life in danger. In OotP, Harry always felt that by talking to Sirius he was urging him to leave the safety of Grimmauld Place and risk being caught by the Ministry. Hopefully when Harry realizes that Remus will not take any unnecessary risks, he will feel much safer confiding in him.

I agree Scarlet Tears.! It may take some time for Harry go to Lupin, but I believe he will realize it eventually, because Lupin can relate to him about like no one else can. Plus if he continues to bottle it up he'll end up killing people, which we don't want(or at least I don't.!):p.!

So yup.! That's my bit.!

harry should feel closer towards Lupin... i was kinda suprised that he only awcknowledged sirius, while they were both best friends with james....
Yeah... but from the marauder scene in OotP I just get the impression that James and Sirius were the two best friends. They were friends first, then they found Remus and included him in the friendship, which we all know Remus was thrilled with. Sirius and James respected Remus and were dear and loyal friends, and I bet they found his lycanthropy extremely exciting. It was like a challenge to be friends with a werewolf, and you know how they loved to take risks. I don't think they were using him, and I don't think they were excluding Lupin in any way, but I think James and Sirius were just kindred spirits. OK rereading this all sounds jumbled. I hope you get what I mean. :shrug:

Actually, I am confused about why they even included Pettigrew in their group. He was eclipsed by the three of them and just seemed a tagalong. The only thing I can think of is that each of them had their own reasons for accepting him into their group: James because he loved the unfettered adoration, Sirius because he had someone to ridicule, Remus because he was another friend, someone who accepted him. Also, I think the pack needed an Omega, if you know what I mean. There is always that someone in a group that is a little below the rest, but are still included because someone has to fill that role.

Actually, I am confused about why they even included Pettigrew in their group. He was eclipsed by the three of them and just seemed a tagalong. The only thing I can think of is that each of them had their own reasons for accepting him into their group: James because he loved the unfettered adoration, Sirius because he had someone to ridicule, Remus because he was another friend, someone who accepted him. Also, I think the pack needed an Omega, if you know what I mean. There is always that someone in a group that is a little below the rest, but are still included because someone has to fill that role.

I think that's exactly it - the group needed someone lower, in intellegence, ability, bravery, morals. Pettigrew was their lackey, the adoringly subservient ego-food. Tragically, it ended up being their undoing. :frown:

Yeah, he was "ego food." However, without him, the Marauders never get off the ground. They need somone small to give them access to the Whomping Willow tunnel. He was an integral part of their youth and he'll be an integral part of all their deaths.

I don't think that they necessarily "needed" him, but they were grateful to have him around to feed their egos and whatnot. They could have done without him and could have found other ways of getting under the Whomping Willow (how did Lupin do it before Peter, then?) and they would have remained friends without him. He was, yes, just a tagalong, an added bonus. Much like Neville used to be perceived as...not talented, always thought Harry and Co. were great, hung around with them but never in their league (though now they are very much different.)

And, I agree with Mel, in that Sirius and James were friends first and would have thought having a werewolf as a friend exciting. But, didn't they befriend him before they knew about his secret. I think it said in PoA that they wondered where their friend went once a month, implying that they were friends before. And for Lupin to tell them, they had to be very close because that's a big secret to trust a friend with. Lupin was not used, not was he taken for granted. He was a nice addition to the duo. He was not excluded, he chose not to include himself in some of the two's schemes. Big difference.

FRMS, you can get under the Willow by poking the knot with a long stick.

I'd like to think that James and Sirius' friendship with Remus shows that they weren't bad people. Remus needed their friendship more than they needed his (they were brilliant and popular while Remus was a sick kid), yet they never abandoned him.

Another reason why I think Lupin doesn't show his feelings is because his self-control is very important to him - he hates what happens when he loses it. So he tries very hard to control himself, perhaps a bit more than necessary.

But, didn't they befriend him before they knew about his secret. I think it said in PoA that they wondered where their friend went once a month, implying that they were friends before.
Did they? Gah, yeah I forgot about that. :shrug: Looks like time for another reread. :D

And for Lupin to tell them, they had to be very close because that's a big secret to trust a friend with. Lupin was not used, not was he taken for granted. He was a nice addition to the duo. He was not excluded, he chose not to include himself in some of the two's schemes. Big difference.
Oh I know, that's not what I was saying at all, and I was worried I didn't really explain that right. I believe MPP were very close, very loyal, and the best of friends. In no was Lupin used/disrespected, in fact I think Sirius and James looked up to Lupin a bit - after all, he was the one person who could make them feel ashamed of their antics. Sirius described he and his friends as arrogant gits, but then says not so much Lupin.

I agree that if ever Remus was a bit isolated from the others it was do to his own doing, not because they excluded him.

I'd like to think that James and Sirius' friendship with Remus shows that they weren't bad people. Remus needed their friendship more than they needed his (they were brilliant and popular while Remus was a sick kid), yet they never abandoned him.
:agree: For real.

Another reason why I think Lupin doesn't show his feelings is because his self-control is very important to him - he hates what happens when he loses it. So he tries very hard to control himself, perhaps a bit more than necessary.
Yeah I said something like that a while back...
When werewolves transform, they become vicious, aggressive, lethal monsters that have no control over themselves. They are a turmoil of extreme emotion. So when they transform back into human, they may feel that they have to balance themselves (or perhaps rebel against that part of themselves) by being calm, stable, and in control. By doing that, they can feel more human. The werewolf may be a part of them, but they define themselves by their human form as much as possible in order to cope with the pain and shame. I see it as two opposite poles residing in the same body: their human form is the opposite of their werewolf form.

God its making me so sad talking about the Marauders and their friendships. :sad: Why did it have to go so wrong! :upset:
me -> http://www.simonsgroup.com/siteimages/s/kill.gif <-Wormtail

Quick question: has this thread been merged with any of the other Lupin threads? Or did I just make some posts on this thread thinking it was one of the other ones?

Another reason why I think Lupin doesn't show his feelings is because his self-control is very important to him - he hates what happens when he loses it. So he tries very hard to control himself, perhaps a bit more than necessary

Exactly! Lupin is always so self-controlled and he doesn't want to interfere with other people's lives.

What we saw in Pensieve (Snape's Worst Memory) wasn't just describing James's behaviour, we also saw that Lupin didn't do anything to stop him or join him. He probably thought it was the best to stay out of it.

BTW, I have never knew what Puffskein mean. I read the first 4 books on my language, so I didn't even know there were some Puffskeins in it. Then I read book 5 on English and saw that words for the first time in my life (after I saw your screen-name)... What does it mean? Who are Puffskeins?

Excuse my ignorance, please. :)

What we saw in Pensieve (Snape's Worst Memory) wasn't just describing James's behaviour, we also saw that Lupin didn't do anything to stop him or join him. He probably thought it was the best to stay out of it.
Yeah, but the thing is he was a prefect at the time, so it was his job to stop those kinds of things. :sigh:

Puffskeins are a magical creature - there were some in the petshop in POA. They look like custard coloured furballs that occasionally stick out a long pink tongue and like being cuddled.

We actully never really saw Lupin lose his temper and become really angry. We saw Sirius like that but Lupin, he seems to be in control of his actions and emotions, that's a very good quality to a wizard.

I can't even think of angry Lupin. He's always so calm in my mind. And smiled. Thought this had changed since Sirius is dead. Before dead, he'd always have a grin on his face...

Oh I can imagine an angry Lupin. :evil: But I think it would take A LOT to push him that far. It wouldn't be like a rage, but more like a very cold, intimidating, scary anger. Similar to when DD gets mad - he's not screaming and raging, he is very calculated and controlled. I think that's how Lupin's anger would be manifested.

Actually, I'm not sure we would see an angry Lupin. The more that Lupin seems to get upset, the quiter and more repressed he becomes. And didn't DD say that one of Lupin's faults is that he was always trying to be nice to people and please them so they'll like him. Somehow, I think Lupin would avoid anger, at the fear that Harry and the others wouldn't like him anymore.

Let us speculate now on what could make Lupin become angry.

Voldemort doing something terrible to Harry? Naturally. But I can't think of a reason where we'd really see one very much ****** off Remus. I just can't.

I can think of a reason, if something happened to Dumbledore. Remus says that Dumbledore's trust has ment everthing to him (in POA). I think if something happened to Dumbledore we might see a really angry Remus.

Oh I can imagine an angry Lupin. :evil: But I think it would take A LOT to push him that far. It wouldn't be like a rage, but more like a very cold, intimidating, scary anger. Similar to when DD gets mad - he's not screaming and raging, he is very calculated and controlled. I think that's how Lupin's anger would be manifested.

I agree. I think we saw a little bit of this in the Shrieking Shack. I'm sure Lupin must have been awfully angry there, to be ready and willing to kill one of his childhood best friends. His 'calm' only contrasted with Sirius's obvious anger.

Sirius Padfoot - I wanted to mention Dumbledore as well, but I don't think that Lupin would be only angry if that would happen. God knows what he could do if this would be the case.

Actually, I'm not sure we would see an angry Lupin. The more that Lupin seems to get upset, the quiter and more repressed he becomes. And didn't DD say that one of Lupin's faults is that he was always trying to be nice to people and please them so they'll like him. Somehow, I think Lupin would avoid anger, at the fear that Harry and the others wouldn't like him anymore.
I think you're right, your description fits him better than mine - in some cases. He wouldn't get outwardly angry, he would repress it and become more withdrawn... not necessarily because he wants Harry and Co to like him. It may be a part of it, but I think now he has gotten over that a little bit, and is more confident in himself. After all, he did give orders to Sirius once ("Sit down, Sirius!"). I think he would repress it because he considers such a loss of control to be a manifestation of that inhuman part of himself: the werewolf. I think the more in control of his emotions he is, the more human he feels.

Actually, I don't think he would get angry at all...

Let us speculate now on what could make Lupin become angry.

Voldemort doing something terrible to Harry? Naturally. But I can't think of a reason where we'd really see one very much ****** off Remus. I just can't.
I don't know, he seemed pretty angry with Pettigrew. And I bet he would do a number on Lestrange if he had the chance.

And I bet he would do a number on Lestrange if he had the chance.

Oh, yes. I forgot about that lame excuse for human being. She's the reason I still quietly sniff in the darkness of my room... Anyway, I would so be happy to see Lupin saying everything in that witch's face and shortly after it ... finishing her. But then again, I don't want Lupin become a murderer. Maybe he should leave that work to Voldemort.

If she kills Remus I'll :sad: :upset: lots. How do I join The Lets Hit JKR With Fish If She Kills Remus Group thingie :lol:

Just put a Cod Squad thing in your siggy :)
and the codsmack smilie is attached to this thread too if you want to use that http://www.cosforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6949&stc=1

I think he would repress it because he considers such a loss of control to be a manifestation of that inhuman part of himself: the werewolf. I think the more in control of his emotions he is, the more human he feels.

:agree: I never even thought about how feeling anger would make him feel like the werewolf side of him is taking over. Good point.

But even under the greatest provocation, Lupin channels his rage into an even harder focus. He doesn't rant and storm. His voice gets steely, his eyes get hard and he speaks evenly. It's at least as imposing as Black's ranting rage. I really can't imagine Remus apoplectic about anything, not even an attack on Harry. And yes, this could be part of his effort to curb his wildness (very like Oz in that way). If Oz matured (or matured more) into someone like Remus it would speak volumes about his character.

Lupin's way of showing anger makes a great contrast with most other characters - particularly Sirius, Snape and Harry. I think it's to do with his determination to preserve his self-control and thus prove his humanity.

Question on Mastermind last night: Which garden plant gets its name from the Latin word for wolf?

Maybe he knows something that we don't. I mean I think it's a bit odd that he wasn't overly upset over Sirius's death. Maybe he knows of some way in which he can contact Sirius. I don't know, I think there is something more to ol' Remus that we just don't know yet, he's a very deep character!

by veritaserum

Oh god I hope so! Remus is so all by himself now and he must know something about Sirius' death! He wasn't too sad about it unless he was able to cope with it...

I don't think Remus' reaction is odd in any way... Everyone reacts to death in different ways, and from what we know of his character already... He reacted in a way I expected him to.

I think he was very upset by Sirius death, but he was also very shocked. J.K.R. brought attention to his distractedness (for lack of a better word) while he was trying to subdue Harry. We've never seen him like that before.
He gives Harry a smile pretty much every time they see each other, but at the end of OotP, he really doesn't. I think he is definitely having a hard time coping with losing his friend for the second time, he's just not public about it.

Looked very pale, his voice broke, sounded like every word was causing him pain... I think that's a very Lupinesque reaction to the death of his last best friend. And we don't know what he did between the time he left the DoM and when he showed up at King's Cross.

But even under the greatest provocation, Lupin channels his rage into an even harder focus. He doesn't rant and storm. His voice gets steely, his eyes get hard and he speaks evenly. It's at least as imposing as Black's ranting rage.

That is an excellent description of how Lupin reacts to anger, jordmundt6. It's kind of strange in a way, but many of Remus' and Sirius' traits are polar opposites. Whereas Sirius tends to show his feelings forcefully and openly, Remus always keeps his emotions deep inside of him, and only a few signs of his anger (such as those you mentioned) are visible. It must take an incredible amount of self-control to be able to pull that off.

I think he would repress it because he considers such a loss of control to be a manifestation of that inhuman part of himself: the werewolf. I think the more in control of his emotions he is, the more human he feels.

That is also an excellent point, mel. It amazes me how much the gentle human side of Remus can contrast so vividly with the part of him that is the werewolf. I know we spoke about this a while ago, but this point just adds to the argument that, perhaps in either a physiological or symbolic sense, Remus' anger is built up inside of him over the course of a month, and it is released in a very violent, horrific manner every full moon.

Question on Mastermind last night: Which garden plant gets its name from the Latin word for wolf?
Is it Lupine? :)

I know we spoke about this a while ago, but this point just adds to the argument that, perhaps in either a physiological or symbolic sense, Remus' anger is built up inside of him over the course of a month, and it is released in a very violent, horrific manner every full moon.
The only problem with this is that he doesn't really let himself go - he uses the wolfsbane potion to make his wolf docile and controllable.

What I wonder is, deep down is there some part of him that likes becoming a werewolf? I mean before he started using wolfsbane. It's like you said Scarlet, it would be a great release of emotion, and that can create it's own high. Many people with mental conditions, such as bipolar disorder, enjoy the exhilaration of extreme moods - it's more fun. Some of them even avoid taking medication because of it. I don't think Lupin would ever stop taking wolfsbane, but... I just wonder if he ever looked forward to the full moon. I bet it would create even more guilt if he did.

Has anybody noticed that Professor Lupin seems to say 'excellent' more than any other character?

Everything is excellent according to that man. I've changed my socks. 'Excellent!'. I've just eaten a biscuit. 'Excellent!'. I've sawed off my own leg. 'Excellent!'.

Werewolf_eyes, he responded like I would have imagined him to. J. K. Rowling made him clearly hurt by it, without making him jump out of character in despair.

Mel--Well, he may use Wolfsbane, but remember "I've always been a terrible potion brewer" so, unless Dumbledore or Snape is brewing the stuff for him, he is transforming fully. Now, more than ever I'd like an answer to the Wagga Wagga Werewolf mystery. Do Homorphous Charms work?

No, I believe that a Homorphus Charm is what they placed on Peter Pettigrew to force him to change into a man. It would work properly on Animagi and transfigured people, but not on werewolves. They might only change for an instant. An instant long enough to do what, exactly? Chain them up? Knock them out? Kill them?

We don't know what happened to the Wagga Wagga Werewolf, only that the town's werewolf problems were over. Were his?

Well then why did it work for that Romanian warlock when he was visiting Wagga Wagga (remember, Lockhart doesn't invent the exploits, he just takes the credit for things that actually happened that other people accomplished).

The Romanian warlock might have done anything up to slaughtering the werewolf when it was transformed. Lockhart would dress that story up, leave out a few details. It sounds more heroic when he doesn't say what exactly happened. He didn't actually say that the Charm cured the werewolf, after all...

No, remember--he was very thorough. He'd find out exactly what these people did, make very exact notes, and then wipe out the source's memory. Then he'd compile the notes into a book and watch it become a bestseller. The Romanian dude DID use a Homorphous Charm and it DID work. I think the major drawback to this method is that you have to be in a confined space with a transformed werewolf for it to work and, thus, run a high risk of being bitten yourself. I would think that this would be Harry's gift to Lupin at some point. That is, if Lupin were willing to risk it (which we know he wouldn't be).

Mel--Well, he may use Wolfsbane, but remember "I've always been a terrible potion brewer" so, unless Dumbledore or Snape is brewing the stuff for him, he is transforming fully.
I don't think he would put so many lives in danger like that. His year at Hogwarts wasn't the only time he took wolfsbane, I bet he's taken it ever since it was invented. But being jobless and not too adept at potion-making, there might have been times when he couldn't get it. Now that he is in the Order, I have no doubt he is using it every month, someone has to be helping him out there. After all, Arthur said Lupin finds his condition "quite easy to manage," so he is managing it.

I know it isn't the only time he took it, but he has to have someone BREW the stuff for him. He can't buy it (for several reasons, among them lack of money and most reputable brewers' refusal to sell the stuff because it meant dealing with werewolves) and he is awful at Potions (rather like Neville when nervous). Now that the Order has been reorganized, I'm POSITIVE that Dumbledore is ORDERING Severus to brew the stuff monthly, but Lupin has not always had this safeguard (it's a "recent discovery") and he can't make it or buy it on his own. I think what saved him before was his willingness to be isolated from people. Also, Arthur is a nice man, but he's on the outisde looking in and I would hardly characterize Lupin's condition as "easy to manage" by any standard. Arthur doesn't see the struggle that goes on, which is a good thing, actually. It shows his faith in people.

Notice that the recent victim didn't storm and rant and rave and threaten Lupin when he went over to speak rationally to him about it as a fellow werewolf.

I know that Lupin's condition is nowhere near "easy" to deal with, that wasn't why I brought it up. It just shows that it is, in fact, being managed. If Lupin was ramapaging around every month I don't think Arthur would say that.

I don't think Arthur would know it if Lupin WERE rampaging around every month. But yes, it is manageable. Again, Arthur's characterization of the situation shows his own faith in people, something I hope he never loses.

The Romanian dude DID use a Homorphous Charm and it DID work.

I don't doubt that this is the truth.

However, we don't actually know what the Homorphus Charm does. As I said, Lockhart didn't say that 'he' actually cured the werewolf.

As far as I'm aware, the Hormorphus Charm has the ability to change a werewolf back to his human form.

...And to keep him that way?

"He let out a piteous moan--a little louder Harry, a little louder--that's the ticket. His fangs shrank, his fur receded, and he turned back into a man. Thus yet another village was saved by me from the month horror of werewolf attacks." I'm doing this without book, but this is pretty close to what Lockhart said. He indicated that the Homorphous Charm was what ended the problem and what it did was turn the werewolf back into a man. Since he ended the problem by doing this, it's reasonable to assume that the Romanian warlock fully reversed the effects of the inital werewolf bite. Now, it could be that this won't work for Lupin because he was BORN a werewolf. The "I was very small when I received the bite" story seems to me to have some holes.

...And to keep him that way?

One would assume that the Charm would have to be performed each month.

Lockhart is full of ****. Yeah he studied other wizards' doings meticulously, but I have no doubt he did a great amount of embellishing whenever he could. His aim is to sell books, not get the facts straight.

Does Lupin know Lockhart personally? Is it mentioned anywhere? (Just curious)

"He let out a piteous moan--a little louder Harry, a little louder--that's the ticket. His fangs shrank, his fur receded, and he turned back into a man. Thus yet another village was saved by me from the month horror of werewolf attacks." I'm doing this without book, but this is pretty close to what Lockhart said. He indicated that the Homorphous Charm was what ended the problem and what it did was turn the werewolf back into a man. Since he ended the problem by doing this, it's reasonable to assume that the Romanian warlock fully reversed the effects of the inital werewolf bite. Now, it could be that this won't work for Lupin because he was BORN a werewolf. The "I was very small when I received the bite" story seems to me to have some holes.

I don't agree, I beleive Lupin was bitten as a small child. But "his fangs shrank, his fur receded, and he turned back into a man" does not mean that the werewolf turned back into a living man...

I don't agree, I beleive Lupin was bitten as a small child. But "his fangs shrank, his fur receded, and he turned back into a man" does not mean that the werewolf turned back into a living man...

But it doesn't mean the he turned into a dead man either. It just says that the charm was successful in turning the werewolf back into human form.

One would assume that the Charm would have to be performed each month.

Would it be worth it if you had to perform it every minute?

'Lockhart' might not have cured the werewolf. Why will nobody read the words for what they are? The man changed back and then, all of a sudden, the village was saved from the horror of werewolf attacks. It sounds like the man was cured, but that's not what it says, is it?

Perhaps they're easier to curse when they're in human shape.

Would it be worth it if you had to perform it every minute?



It doesn't say it has to be performed every minute.



'Lockhart' might not have cured the werewolf. Why will nobody read the words for what they are? The man changed back and then, all of a sudden, the village was saved from the horror of werewolf attacks. It sounds like the man was cured, but that's not what it says, is it?

Perhaps they're easier to curse when they're in human shape.

The Charm isn't a cure. The only cure for a werewolf is to kill it.

No, but I'm trying to say that we don't know how long that Homorphus Charm would have lasted on the werewolf. You can't say it's a cure for werewolves, when for all we know it lasted two minutes, turned him green then killed him.

Or, even more of a possibility, it transformed him momentarily into a man, the warlock bound him, and the werewolf was taken from the village...

I didn't say that the Homorphus Charm was a cure.

I meant 'you' as in the general you. One. People in general.
:D

I doubt that there is really anything that Lupin/werewolfs can do to abate their condition other than the Wolfsbane potion. I'm sure any other options have been tried.

Hey that was funny ... about the 'excellent' thing.

Anyway long topic ago - I expected Lupin to be shocked and stammering like 'S-s-sirius ... Oh my ...' like thaat

Lockhart is full of ****. Yeah he studied other wizards' doings meticulously, but I have no doubt he did a great amount of embellishing whenever he could. His aim is to sell books, not get the facts straight.

I agree. There's no evidence that he never changed the details to make himself look good. If the homorphus charm would help Lupin, why doesn't someone do it when he's had the potion and is harmless?

OK, I know this is kind of changing the subject completely, but has anyone else noticed a lot of similarities between the characters of Lupin and Dumbledore? Both are patient and gentle, with a quiet sense of humour. Both show their anger in subtle ways- a steely note in their voice. for instance. Both care a great deal about Harry. Their greatest faults are both to do with not doing what they should (Dumbledore telling Harry about the prophecy, Lupin stopping his friends attacking Snape, telling DD about Sirius being an animagus) because they care too much about people (Dumbledore for Harry, and Lupin for the liking of his friends and DD). Of course there are differences- Dumbledore is far more extrovert and doesn't mind not being liked, whereas Lupin's greatest fear is not being liked....what do you think?

I totally agree. I tihnk that when Dumbledore dies (i say "when" instead of "if"...), Lupin will become a similar role model for Harry. Now that Sirius has gone, Lupin will be the only surviving "good" maurauderer (sorry, cant spell), and will probably take on the father figure.

In OOTP it was fairly clear that he was handling silver goblets without harm. Remember, fiction authors don't have to go along with every bit of the myths/films.

I hope this thread doesn't turn into another hotbed of bizarre sex fantasies. For some reason I screw up inside when people try to make Lupin out as a sex god. He looks worn out, poor guy! And part of the point of his character is that he's nothing like Lockhart - I didn't notice anyone outlining Lupin's lessons in little hearts! But then I find sex gods a bit scary, myself. I prefer the sweet and cuddly type, which is what I think Lupin is.

Please read my story "Ill Met By Moonlight" in the Library! It's all about Lupin's childhood!


I always assumed that Wormtail's silver hand was a riff off the legend of Nuada Silver Hand. Nuada was the Tuatha De king whose arm/hand (depending on the version) was severed during a battle with the Fir Bolg. After the battle Diancecht, the Tuatha De's leading sorcerer, replaces the hand with a silver one that exactly replicates the original's function. However, Diancecht's son, Miach, sees that the hand is evil and lops it back off. Miach then regrows Nuada a hand of "flesh and sinew" using his own flesh. His father, jealous of Miach's accomplishment, kills Miach, lops off the perfect hand (again), and replaces it with another silver one. Nuada loses the kingship because of this physical imperfection and is ultimately killed in another battle with the Fomorians.

Since Nuada was a good guy (who had an invincible sword), I think the similarities with Wormtail and he must end with the silver hand. Still, I thought the silver hand likely reflected Voldemort's imperfect powers (he can't produce one of living flesh) and, since it was "evil" in the legend, said something about Wormtail's character as well. I didn't know silver killed werewolves. Now I'm worried for Remus too.

I think the silver thing only started with old movies, gillywater. I know that some people feel nervous about it, thinking that it's an attribute of mythology.

About the Nuada of the Tuatha de Danaan - in the story I read Nuada was killed before the flesh arm was put on... or maybe I just misread it...

Anyway, they say that your most loyal servant is your own right hand. That sounds a bit rude, but it basically means 'if you want a job done right you have to do it yourself'.

Wormtail is a right hand man who has been given the gift of a strong right hand of his own. The hand could also be symbolic of power - specifically, of Wormtail's. However, this might be a bit flawed, since the hand is a replacement for one that was disfigured by an act of betrayal. Therefore, perhaps it's a symbol of Voldemort's role as master, that he rules Wormtail with a strong right hand, that he gave him a new, stronger hand where the last one was tarnished by treachery.

But perhaps this should be in a thread dedicated to Peter Pettigrew. Is there one?

I think the silver thing only started with old movies, gillywater. I know that some people feel nervous about it, thinking that it's an attribute of mythology.

About the Nuada of the Tuatha de Danaan - in the story I read Nuada was killed before the flesh arm was put on... or maybe I just misread it...

Anyway, they say that your most loyal servant is your own right hand. That sounds a bit rude, but it basically means 'if you want a job done right you have to do it yourself'.

Wormtail is a right hand man who has been given the gift of a strong right hand of his own. The hand could also be symbolic of power - specifically, of Wormtail's. However, this might be a bit flawed, since the hand is a replacement for one that was disfigured by an act of betrayal. Therefore, perhaps it's a symbol of Voldemort's role as master, that he rules Wormtail with a strong right hand, that he gave him a new, stronger hand where the last one was tarnished by treachery.

But perhaps this should be in a thread dedicated to Peter Pettigrew. Is there one?

Cool ideas, Cat--and all with disturbing implications for Remus et al. Awww! I don't think Peter *deserves* his own thread--do you?

I don't think that he will kill Professor Lupin. I don't think so yet, anyway. The simple truth of the matter is that Professor Lupin's death wouldn't actually mean anything to the story yet. We'd be blubbering, but J. K. Rowling wouldn't just kill a character to make us upset.

Also, Peter could kill anybody with that hand. There's no dramatic flair in it being made of silver - if it actually is.

Besides, aren't we kind of expecting it? Even those of us that especially don't want it to happen. Not everything in the story should be surprising, I know, but the death of Lupin would be just like the death of Sirius only more obvious. I don't think Lupin deserves a second-rate death.

Yeah, Peter deserves a thread! Horrible men make ace fictional characters.

Lupin is really nice, I hope he will play a bigger role and have a good future.

I found this on some Mythology website:

"According to legend, werewolves can be killed by silver objects such as silver arrows and silver bullets. When a werewolf dies he is returned to his human form."

So if Lupin dies he wouldn't be a werewolf anymore. Isn't that great? Then of course the website could be wrong...

Can I just say something about the whole silver thing? OK there may be a LOT of wishful thinking here on my part, but anyway...I don't reckon Lupin will be killed by the silver hand, simply because if JKR was going with the 'silver kills werewolves' mythology, we'd have had some foreshadowing by now. The werewolf lesson in bk3 would have been the perfect oppurtunity to slip it in, but it wasn't mentioned. I think if it was going to be that important, JKR would have mentioned it by now- she would never just spring it on us, especially if it was going to cause something as major as Lupin's death. If it's mentioned in bk6, then I'll be worried for Lupin in bk7!
Of course, we can never be certain, because Sirius' death was so totally unexpected, sob...

Silver object. Well, Pettigrew has a silver hand now. I hope JK isn't thinking of killing Lupin. I'd REALLY hate that

I'd really hate that too. If she kills Lupin off, I'd literally start crying my head off, kick something so hard, that my leg would explode, go on strike, and then kill Wormtail and his stupid freaking silver hand.

Now, it could be that this won't work for Lupin because he was BORN a werewolf. The "I was very small when I received the bite" story seems to me to have some holes.

We had a discussion a while ago if it was possible to be born a werewolf, or if you could pass on lycanthropy through genetics. Someone (I can't remember who at the moment) noticed that, according to Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them, it states that "Humans turn into werewolves only when bitten," so that would imply that, at least in J.K. Rowling's world, this is the sole way any person may become a werewolf.
The book also states that there is no known cure for lycanthropy, so I would assume Lockhart's story was not entirely true.

When a werewolf dies he is returned to his human form.

That could be a very interesting point, if it applies to J.K. Rowling's world. To add on to what MSLupin was saying earlier, "Lockhart" could have used the Homorphous Charm on the werewolf, killing him, and then his body changed back into human form. This would make sense, since Fantastic Beasts... stated there was no cure for lycanthropy, yet it would still fit with Lockhart's description. It would also fit with the roots of the word "Homorphous," which consists of homo, the Latin stem meaning "man," and morphe, the Greek stem meaning "form." Since we know J.K. Rowling likes to use Latin stems in her words, this would be very relevant to the word's meaning.

(Changing flow slightly) Looking over this thread I was thinking about how people would react if JKR does decide to kill off Remus (I know, I know, I'm washing my mouth out with soap). Now, I don't think this will happen as Harry really does need him, now more than ever. But if it's any consolation, should it come to pass, I'm fairly sure Lupin would at least warrent a decent death. Looking over the other deaths Harry has experienced - he doesn't remember his parents, never got to say goodbye to them. Cedric was murderd in cold blood, Harry couldn't prevent it or anything either. Sirius was killed so suddenly and unexpectedly that Harry (and my sister) have just begun to absorb it. Therefore I surmise that if JKR does decide to... do the deed it would at least somehow be something of a gentler blow to Harry and the reader.

Just some random afternoon thoughts...

Well, if JK kills Remus like Sirius, I'll be screaming and crying harder than if she killed him with a decent death. I mean, Harry would totally lose it if Remus died now. If JK wants to kill him, she'll have to either wait till Harry can control his feelings or dun kill him at all!

It could go either way. If she killed Lupin, it would be very emotional--all the remaining (true) Marauders have died at the hands of Voldie, giving Harry even more reason to defeat him, not that he needs it. If Remus lives, it would still be very emotional, as he is the only true Marauder left. I can see her going both ways. But I doubt Lupin will be killed in 6. If he is killed, I'd say in 7. Harry needs Lupin in book 6 too much to kill him off so soon.

Yeah, but we also said that Sirius wouldn't be killed till book 7, if JK decided on that. We said that Harry needed him now. Well, turns out that you get what you don't expect. XP

Though, I still think Remus wouldn't be killed off, not now in the least. Too many close people dying...and no more marauders. remus is the only true link to harry's parents. he knew james best [apart from sirius, but since he's dead...]

Heh, nah, I never said Sirius wouldn't be killed till book 7. I thought his death was very appropriate. More so than Lupins or Hagrids at the time. I still think Harry has a lot to learn from Lupin about himself and his parents. Stuff that won't be explained in just 1 book.

I actually wonder if she might abstain from a main character death in Book 6... I know it's the war and all, and people will die, but a respite from horrible deaths might be nice, scince Book 7 is going to be bloody as heck.

Oh, I agree! I'm not worried for Lupin in bk6 but in bk7 I'll be biting my nails...how would you react if Lupin died? I cried for like 3 hours after Sirius's death...I would probably cry for 12 hours if Lupin died...aahhhh! It would just be horrible! *hugs Lupin*. He's too gorgeous to die!

I hope that she doesn't kill anyone to important next book; I'm still mourning Sirius! But I don't think JK will kill of a major character, but the minor characters had better start writing their wills right now. And I don't think that she had developed Remus's character enough in the books to kill him off; she'll want us to know more about his personallity beforehand to make his death more meaningful. If she does what she did with Sirius, and tells all about his past next book, I am going to be frightened out of my wits.

Hmmm, I think it's time for me to add the Cod Squad to my sig...

Hmmm.. well, I don't think Remus will die in book 6 because JKR said he would make an appearance in book 7! I don't really think an important character will die in book 6 - I think it will be more of a "calm before the storm" type thing.

I found this on some Mythology website:

"According to legend, werewolves can be killed by silver objects such as silver arrows and silver bullets. When a werewolf dies he is returned to his human form."

So if Lupin dies he wouldn't be a werewolf anymore. Isn't that great? Then of course the website could be wrong...

But he'd be a *dead* human. Not much of an improvement, really.

I doubt Rowling would kill Lupin - at the moment, it's already pretty tragic, but if Lupin were to die, i think coincidental would be more the word to describe it. The Order's supposedly well prepared, so there can't be *too* many deaths - and if Lupin were to die, it'd just be one person close to harry/james too many.

Also, someone said earlier that they thought lupin was "destined to be lonely" - and i agree with that.

My poor baby! *hugs Lupin*. I don't reckon he'll die by silver hand- if he does die, it'll be protecting Harry, like Sirius did. He'll die a hero's death at least, sob!
Overall, though I think it would be a bit much to kill Lupin, because obviously Dumbledore is going to die, and didn't JKR say that a Weasley brother was going to die? Lupin as well would just be too much. I hope so anyway!

loony4moony, not a Weasley! Say it isn't so! Do you have a link to this?

No, sorry....I'm sure I read it in an interview somewhere...ahhhh! Can't remember! I hope I made a mistake...u've got me all worried now! Anybody else heard anything about this? If not I'll just crawl into a corner somewhere...

If JK is planning on killing Lupin, it shouldn't happen anytime soon. Maybe at the end of book 6 or 7. Cause Harry should learn more about James and Lily, so who better to get the info from than a best friend?

Can I join the Cod Squad too??

Overall, though I think it would be a bit much to kill Lupin, because obviously Dumbledore is going to die, and didn't JKR say that a Weasley brother was going to die?

NoNoNoNoNo! Say it isn't so! A Weasley?? Where did you hear this? *cries* :upset: Surely you jest...

And I don't think that she had developed Remus's character enough in the books to kill him off; she'll want us to know more about his personallity beforehand to make his death more meaningful.
I agree. And as Cat said earlier: What purpose would Lupin's death serve? She would be killing him just for the heck of it. We already know what it's like to have a Marauder who is close to Harry die, we don't need Lupin to croak as well. It would be redundant.

I'm also with the crowd who believes no one major will die in book 6. It will be a time for Harry to grow and heal and mature in the face of his loss. JKR wants Harry to develop as a character - giving him another huge loss to deal with so soon would just hinder that.

didn't JKR say that a Weasley brother was going to die?
I seriously doubt JKR would reveal such a thing. She's not one to give away plot details if she can help it, especially major ones like the death of a Weasley.

If you want to join the Cod Squad...
just put it in your signature. :) For instance: "Cod Squad: Lupin Lives or the Fish Start Flying" or whatever you want to say. :D
You can also use this smilie if you want: http://www.cosforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6949&stc=1

I hate to say this, but how do we know Lupin's death would be pointless? He might be doing something crucial for the Order! But I agree with everyone saying that Harry needs to hear more about his parents and Sirius and just needs a break! I think the Marauders' story is quite tragic enough already.

I hate to say this, but how do we know Lupin's death would be pointless? He might be doing something crucial for the Order! But I agree with everyone saying that Harry needs to hear more about his parents and Sirius and just needs a break! I think the Marauders' story is quite tragic enough already.

We don't know, but as of yet people have no reason for presuming that he's going to die. This 'silver hand' thing has got around and it seems to be making people absolutely certain that Professor Lupin's days are numbered.

I was in a Yahoo! Chatroom and one girl said that she read an article where JKR said that one of her favourite characters will die in book 6! Did anyone hear about this, cause I didn't? I hope it's just a rumor, knowing that Lupin is one of JKR'S fave characters...

So, anyone knows about this?

I was in a Yahoo! Chatroom and one girl said that she read an article where JKR said that one of her favourite characters will die in book 6! Did anyone hear about this, cause I didn't? I hope it's just a rumor, knowing that Lupin is one of JKR'S fave characters...

So, anyone knows about this?


JK can't have revealed such a big part of the plot. correct me if i'm mistaken, but JK likes to keep everyone guessing

I'm sure JKR said in another interview that Lupin plays a huge role in bk7, so I think he's safe for bk6 at least. I know this is off topic, but has anyone else heard anything about a Weasley death? I'm sure I read it somewhere...
I have such a bad memory! But I am pretty sure she said Lupin has a big part in bk7 *hugs Lupin* Yey, my baby gets a big part!!

the only thing i'm absolutely sure of is that lupin is JK's fav character apart from the trio. [like me :p]


if he's her fav character, then he might have a bigger role in the next books. i hope it's not saving harry and dying in the process. o.O

Oh no no no no no-this thread will not vanish into the realms of forgottenness..we worked to hard! *yanks it back to page one*

ah-i hope you'll forgive me for not reading through all of the pages i've missed...there are so many and i have such a little time^-^;

It could go either way. If she killed Lupin, it would be very emotional--all the remaining (true) Marauders have died at the hands of Voldie, giving Harry even more reason to defeat him, not that he needs it. If Remus lives, it would still be very emotional, as he is the only true Marauder left. I can see her going both ways. But I doubt Lupin will be killed in 6. If he is killed, I'd say in 7. Harry needs Lupin in book 6 too much to kill him off so soon.

Im agreeing with fredrocksmysocks on this one--we just cannot be sure until we see the books and read the signs...as far as im concerned there havent been all that many for poor remus yet-besides the silver hand thing...which im hoping is simply a redhadock...is that even the right fish?..n wait its a herring...red herring....*oh dear*..see what talking about moony dying does to me?!!!

anything at all could happen in the next two books which make remmy a prime target...we alreayd know he is doing ''mysterious''work for the order and is away for long periods of time...i reckon thats werewolf stuff myself...bringing 'em over to dumbledore's side:)

its a wait and see situation-until then i plan on giving remus plenty of squishy hugs to make him forget all about the trelawney like insane folk predicting his death at ever corner:)

does anyone know where the jk interview is that staes lupin will play a big role in book 7?...it seems like quite a big thing for her to give away...

Yeah maybe she was just pulling your legs ...

No, I'm SURE I read it somewhere...(this is becoming a bit of a catchphrase for me...)! I think it was on an interview that she gave soon after bk4 came out. *goes and starts manically searching through interview archives...*

I've never been aware of JKR saying anything specifically about book 6. I'd like to know if she has.

I don't believe she has. Book 6 has always been rather looked over - preceding the ultimate Book 7, and all. But there is really an awful amount riding on Book 6. There is sure to be a ton of information, making up for the dirth of revelations in OotP. It is also a good deal more dangerous than the others, it being the first time the trio will experience life under the real shadow of Voldemort. Throw in the inevitable relationships that surely will finally emerge, and we have one heck of an overlooked book on our hands!

I don't believe she has. Book 6 has always been rather looked over - preceding the ultimate Book 7, and all. But there is really an awful amount riding on Book 6. There is sure to be a ton of information, making up for the dirth of revelations in OotP. It is also a good deal more dangerous than the others, it being the first time the trio will experience life under the real shadow of Voldemort. Throw in the inevitable relationships that surely will finally emerge, and we have one heck of an overlooked book on our hands!
GAAAHHHHHHH! I CANNOT WAIT! :rotfl:

I believe she said that Professor Lupin would feature a lot in the fifth book (which he did) and the seventh book. People translated this to mean that he won't be in the sixth, but that's not necessarily the case.

Ah yes MsLupin! a highly overlooked book Im desperate to get my hands on^-^

it'll be interetsing to see what doe shappen with Lupin in book6...either we'll see a load of him - but not in a hugely important role or he'll vanish into sirius grief and we wont hardly see him at all...

im hoping for the former:) I dont want to see poor Lupin upset=/

I wonder if Lupin will be sent to rescue Harry from the dursley's again this summer?

I cant wait for the next book and it will take like another couple of years

LUPIN RULES I hope he doesnt get killed because after sirius he is the best character

:no comment: ::: Lupin!!! i really hope he doesnt ever die...

first of all, i have to give u all kudo's for this whole, cod/trout/fish- smacking deal (though i don't quite understand it), i'll be another to join your army to let jkr have it! ;) yea, i also agree that the lupin-dying-thing can go any which way, but i'm satisfied knowing that he plays an important role in book 7, and usually u don't know someone's important until the end..(breathes) so, what i'm trying to say is, at least we'll have lupin until the end of the 7th book, when we are losing all the other characters with him. do i make sense? my apologies if i'm crazy :blush: i'm also glad to see there are so many other major lupin fans out there!!! many of my friends don't understand why i like him so much- but he's sooooo kind and considerate- and to be both with all that he's lived through is extraordinary! :love:

it'd be great if lupin would save harry of drowning at dursleys! but i also wanna see how petunia will behave to harry... that will be ineterstiung, as well. *evil laugh*

Do you think we'll find out more about Lupin's past? I mean, we just kind of take adult characters for granted a lot but maybe, like she did with Sirius, JKR will expand on his life story? Maybe there are further mysterious surrounding him *mysterious music*? What d'ya think?

All I know is I want to see MORE MARAUDERS! And by association, Lupin. :D

yes, JK said that we'll learn more about harry's parents later on, and that means, that the marauders will be dragged in too.

i'd love to see more of harry's prowling in pensieves and seeing the mischevious marauders. :D

Lupin is pretty mysterious character... We don't know much about him and I'd love to read more about his past. Maybe now that Sirius is gone we'll get to see more of Lupin.... (It sounded so bad, I know... I loved Sirius very very much, but it's the fact isn't it?)

I think it would be great if when Harry leaves the Dursleys next summer, he goes off with Lupin by himself for a little while. Maybe to Grimmauld place, maybe not, and maybe with Tonks too. But Lupin could fill Harry in on his family history, and along with Tonks, Sirius' history as well. Lupin could be pivitol in helping Harry accept that his father went through arrogance and angst before becoming an adult.

But Lupin could fill Harry in on his family history, and along with Tonks, Sirius' history as well.
That would be awesome. I don't think Harry and Lupin really need to go off together though, they could just sit down and talk about it over butterbeer during Christmas break or something.

I can imagine Lupin teaching Harry Occlumency/Legilimency. It is several times mentioned in book 3 and 5 that Lupin could read Harry`s mind. Maybe he is not that fit at O/L as Snape but he is an excellent teacher. In a certain way I can`t think of DD teaching Harry directly - DD watches, advices but does not directly interfere; on the other hand I can imagine that in book 6 just this will change and - in case it is true what some in the the forum predict: that DD will die in the end of book 6 - that DD is trying to give Harry as much as he can this next term, that he will train and prepare Harry for what will have to come. The relation between Harry and Lupin will get much closer than before, it will loose the reservation and timidity which it still had in a certain way because Lupin has been Harry`s teacher. May be in book 6 Lupin will be physically distant like Sirius in book 4 but getting deeper by mail-exchange/ mail advice.

I'd love to learn more about Lupin's past Loopy^-^That'd be lovely! Great ideas too Siriusly it would be nice to see lupin take on such a role-I can really see him doing something like that:)

Excellent post Dirk! :clap: great points there!

::Racks brain for a fresh topic to revitalize this thread::
So... How do you think Remus reacted directly after the incident in the Death Chamber? I rather thought he dealt with the injured students, bringing them back to Hogwarts, etc., and then had a conversation with Dumbledore after Harry... Any other thoughts?

By the way, I was wondering if the 'Remus being James' issue had yet been discussed on this or another thread? I searched but could not find, and it's such an intriguing (and disturbing) proposition.

Hi MissLupin, yes the "Remus is James" theory has been discussed extensively, look in the Book 4 forums.

Nice theory about Lupin having that confab with DD after Harry, I can totally picture that.

didn't JKR say Lupin was going to play a big role in the seventh book? That's what it said on Mugglenet (i think).
I could easily see Lupin becoming a father figure to Harry... and since we think DDs going to die, and Sirius is already dead... maybe Lupin will be the one of his father's friends to actually last as a parent figure to harry.
that would be nice.

I don't think the 'Remus is James' theory has much weight to it. I think it's absurd and I would be thunderstruck if J. K. Rowling created such a charming character only to rip him away, never to have existed as part of the story, in order to give Harry his dad back, a concept which goes against the deep and mature themes of Harry Potter.

Since the subject of that bloody theory and how on earth it got so popular in the first place gets me riled up, I will instead take this reply to reiterate what I said earlier (or I think I did) about Professor Lupin's frequent use of the word 'excellent'...

'Excellent! (the class defeats the Boggart - POA)

'Excellent, Neville.' (giving Neville his dues - POA)

'Very well, everyone, an excellent lesson' (class dismissed - POA)

'Excellent! (Harry's first Patronus lesson - POA)

'Excellent, Harry! (more praise for the Patronus - POA)

'He's excellent' (on Harry's flying abilities - OOTP)

'Excellent' (Harry packs a trunk - OOTP)

'Excellent question' (taking his OWLs - OOTP)

Do you think that, perhaps, he likes the word a little?

i dont think that will happen much either... james wouldnt have lived if lily died. hed want to have died trying to save her.
but, regardless of the "deep and mature themes of harry potter," i think that it is definitely possible that his way of becoming a "major character in book 7" will be becoming a father-like figure to harry. particularly if dumbledore is *ahem* killed off.

cat, thats lovely, but whats the signifigance of the word "excellent"?

Oh, I'm not saying that Harry can't have a father figure. I'm just saying that it seems out of sorts for the series if he got his real father back.

On the other hand, I don't think that Harry's going to make a father figure out of anybody any time soon. The only real father figure he's had since he lost his parents was Sirius, and look what happened to him. Perhaps Harry will shy away from affection. He could even resent Lupin if he ever thought he was trying to take Sirius' place...

On 'excellence' - perhaps Ms Rowling was once fond of a particularly good teacher who was always saying 'excellent'? Or perhaps she just wants to make Professor Lupin seem very positive and bursting with compliments.

I do hope you'r right about the theory, Cat, but I do think that Harry and Lupin will grow closer somehow.

i dont think harry will ever accusse remus of wanting to take sirius's place. and i dont think lupin would want to.
besides that, i think harry will really WANT a father figure. to deal with what hes going through? i think he'll want a support from someone to help him out. and besides, lupin was close with sirius. harry might like that.

I think that Lupin and Harry will probably grow closer, but I'm not sure I'd call it a father-son relationship...Lupin seems a tad distant, don't you think? But you can always say that he'll change, but Harry might not want to put anyone else in danger because of him...now that he knows "everything" and all...

ms Lupin- love the idea of lupin having a chat with DD after the incident. He'd definately needed to talk to someone - but he wouldnt have confided in just any old one Im sure- not lupin's style really is it?

Lupin = James = silly billy
^-^.

hehe Yeah Cat good find^-^ But JK also, just to contrast the oft use of excellent also has him frown a lot. I don't have the quotes handy-but he does^-^

its hard to say what will happenwith harry and lupin. they never really seemed very close to me so far - i kind of assumed harry would now turn toLupin for advice etc...but im not so sure. he didnt really consider lupin at all in gof despite all the time he spent with him inpoa.
it'll be interesting to see which way JK goes with it.

hehe Yeah Cat good find^-^ But JK also, just to contrast the oft use of excellent also has him frown a lot. I don't have the quotes handy-but he does^-^


I've never noticed that one. His radiating excellence took all my attention.

If this is a good place to talk randomly about Professor Lupin, I will do just that. I would love to know if what he spoke to Professor Snape when Snape stopped giving Occlumency lessons. I'd love to know what was said, and why it didn't work. I wonder if J. K. Rowling has given some thought to the conversation, or whether she just left it at that.

Next time, he should try negotiating with a fist. Excellent!

I've been wondering that, too. Maybe Snape just didn't care enough to listen to Lupin, thinking that there wouldn't be much consequence if he didn't. (On that note, why didn't Dumbledore, if he knew about it, say anything? <-- I'm not sure if this is the place to mention this, so feel free to ignore...)

I think I'm starting to like the word excellent more by the minute...

hey! what happened to the lupin love! there was a 5 day lapse in posts! :( shame on you all! :no:
anyway... :D

Actually, I am confused about why they even included Pettigrew in their group. He was eclipsed by the three of them and just seemed a tagalong.

hmm... maybe there's more to Peter than we know!

lol Cat - Excellent!

and I think I already mentioned this, but the Remus=James thing isn't true. Well, according to me anyway. I don't believe it.

And on the line of Lupin randomness, I made the marauders out of legos the other day. It's quite funny. I think I should take a picture and put it in my siggy.

But JK also, just to contrast the oft use of excellent also has him frown a lot. I don't have the quotes handy-but he does^-^

Yes, he does, I've noticed that too. I think JKR is just filling in his personality with little tics, like "Excellent" and excessive small frowns...

its hard to say what will happenwith harry and lupin. they never really seemed very close to me so far - i kind of assumed harry would now turn toLupin for advice etc...but im not so sure. he didnt really consider lupin at all in gof despite all the time he spent with him inpoa.
it'll be interesting to see which way JK goes with it.

I think he didn't consider Lupin because he still thought of him as his teacher, whereas Sirius was always more of a parent figure (after the mass-murderer stigma, of course).

I believe she said that Professor Lupin would feature a lot in the fifth book (which he did) and the seventh book. People translated this to mean that he won't be in the sixth, but that's not necessarily the case.


I hope he will be in the sixth book because I will be gravely disappointed if not. He's my favorite character....mmm..

I wonder if we will see any more into his life though in the next books or has everything pretty much come otu that she wants us to know? No matter what he is a great person. :love: :love:

He certainly is. :) I remembered something - the third book, when Lupin is sleeping in the compartment on Hogwarts Express, he wasn't very easy to be awaken. Was he pretending... or was he really sound a sleep? What if it has something with the future events...? What if he wouldn't be able to wake up so quickly when something bad is happening? I know this is just speculation, but... You opinion, please :D

I suspect that he'd just had one of his stressful nights...you know.

Here's yet another wonderful thing about Lupin - he doesn't show any resentment to wizard-raised people, even though he must know they've probably been infected with prejudice against his kind. You could say that Lupin, and Hagrid for that matter, have just as much reason to hate their wizard-raised pupils as Snape does to hate Harry.

Yeah, that is a good point. Lupin is really a good soul and a wonderful person... I would die if JKR would make a horrible twist and said something awful about him...

Here's yet another wonderful thing about Lupin - he doesn't show any resentment to wizard-raised people, even though he must know they've probably been infected with prejudice against his kind. You could say that Lupin, and Hagrid for that matter, have just as much reason to hate their wizard-raised pupils as Snape does to hate Harry.
Yeah, great insight Puffskein... i luv the last bit of that post. Add this to the list of "why snape is evil and twisted" :D

I have at last caught up with this thread. ALL 26 PAGES OF IT Oh, my...

Continuing the recent bout of Lupin randomness, by my own (probably rather botched) calculations, the man has transformed into a werewolf no less than 350 times in his life. Ye gods... *hugs Remus*

Well, I spent so long reading that my mind is mush and I have nothing really important to post, but now I at least have a shot at keeping up. The sun is rising, skies are blue, and yet... it's thundering. So I'm off to investigate!

You're nuts Rien :D

Good thinking Puffskein, I think that is one of the reasons why people admire Lupin even if they aren't really aware of it.

Picko - if I wasn't before, 26 pages of Lupin worship has finally finished me off. Ah well, at least I'm in good company. :D

On 'excellence' - perhaps Ms Rowling was once fond of a particularly good teacher who was always saying 'excellent'? Or perhaps she just wants to make Professor Lupin seem very positive and bursting with compliments.
I agree with the latter. Or perhaps Lupin is channeling Mr. Burns! :D "Excellent, Harry!" said Lupin, twiddling his fingers with an evil smirk.

Re: Remus = James
:rolleyes: I think it's ridiculous. No evidence, no good reason to do it, it would go against the themes of the series, and would be a cop-out in my opinion. Like JKR didn't have the backbone to have James really be dead. But she does, so he is. And I agree with ninakix, James would not live while Lily died. The only thing that would stop him from saving her is his own death.

I have at last caught up with this thread. ALL 26 PAGES OF IT Oh, my...
:wow: Wow! Hats off to you! :D

Mel, add to your comments that the Priori Incantatem scene in GoF, made it quite obvious that Lily believed the James "shade" was indeed James, I can't see her perpetuating that belief, if it really wasn't James, plus JKR has said we will never see James and Lily alive, if Lupin was James, that would mean JKR lied to us, or very craftily worded that comment and there is a loophole in it.

It would just be too wierd if Lupin was actually to be James. It might provide an explanation for some things, but those things can be eplained otherwise, it's not as if this is the only explanation for Lupin's hand almost going on Harry's shoulder when Harry said he heard Lily's screams. (About the loophole sindatur mentioned, I suppose those people who support the theory could claim that James and Lupin are stuck with each other's bodies even after death, and we're technically not seeing a living James, we see him in Lupin's body. <-- But I don't support the whole thing, so it doesn't matter to me, it'd just be one too many people in the wrong body...)

Nightingale, I wouldn't expect JKR to turnabout that far, I was thinking something along the lines of:

"we will not see a live Lily and James in the series" and then have only one of them show up alive (Loophole: the quote Lily and James, so Lily or James could show up alive) or an epilogue note saying Harry found his parents living in Albania (Loophole: Lily and James are shown alive after the series, not in the Series). I don't believe either of the two examples I just gave, but, I meant more a subtle twisting of the phrasing, rather then something as blatantly misleading as your example would be if she went there (which I wouldn't accept as a legitimate loophole)

You're right, sindatur. James's ghost would not have come out of Voldemort's wand if he was still alive. All the people who came out of his wand were people he had killed.

There's is no way that Lupin is James. I'm sorry if I'm appearing to be rude, but it is just not subtle enough for JKR. And anyway, if James had survived why wouldn't he of brought up his son? and why wouldn't he just be known as James potter?

I do hope you guys are right about that... When I first read the theory (in the Unofficial Guide - otherwise an excellent publication) I ran to my father, a major skeptic about these things, to assure me that it was impossible.

Hmmm i agree, i don't think its JKR-stylee. Plus, Lupin is one of her favourite characters, she wouldn't just put him into the story and then randomnly say "ok, well he's not Lupin anymore, he's James!" I dunno, i just don't think is plausible.

I really, really liked the theory when I first read it, but the more I thought about it (basically the same points you've all made, so I won't repeat), the more I don't want it to be true. There's plenty of reason to like Lupin in his own right; there's no point in him being James...

Whoever said that Remus might not have been sleeping at all: Good theory, I've never heard of that one before. After all, he was asleep in broad daylight, and woke up after there were no lights. And notice that no one bumped into him when Neville and Ginny came in, he could've easily avoided them if he were awake (even in the darkness :)). ..Although, I don't see any solid point to it, other than to appear to be sleeping to the other students.

Rien: Heh, whoa. I wouldn't read all this if my life depended on it, congrats to you.

Oh, and I don't buy the James is Remus theory. Never have, never will.

Yeah yeah... I should get a job or do something equally productive with my time. :D

I wouldn't fault him for pretending to be asleep on the train. I myself have pretended to sleep on buses so that people would leave me alone. heh And it could have been beneficial - well, I mean it was, wasn't it? How fortunate that the Trio happened to pick that compartment to discuss Black (gee). So he could listen to the goings-on of anyone around him without feeling obligated to participate in or pointedly ignore any conversations.

That said, I do think he caught at least a few zzz's; at one point his mouth was kinda just hanging open. hehe But he does snort when tension escalates between Malfoy and Ron, and that's convenient, too. *shrug*

Hmm, perhaps he was sleeping on the train, or perhaps he was not. Harry's little alarm-thingy did go off on the train though, but perhaps that was because of Peter being in rat form, but I always thought that it ment something else. I don't know why he'd pretend being asleep though.

Well it probably wasn't the most comfortable of situations for Lupin. Here he is, a teacher, coming in with the students (which is quite demeaning) to probably his first job in quite a while, and he's probably being overwhelmed by memories of the marauders (being on the train, with Sirius being loose and all) and he's starting to feel guilty about betraying Dumbledore's trust again, etc. Then of course, Harry comes in, and starts talking about Sirius! It's overwhelming, in his position I might have pretended to be asleep as well...
This of course, is assuming he was pretending- he might not have been. I also like the theory that he was just coming off a full moon and was exhausted.

I go with the latter theory because Lupin was apparently asleep right from the moment Harry and co. came in - before they were talking about Sirius, probably before Lupin would have realised Harry was there (how would he know what Harry's voice sounds like?)

I love Remus Lupin...

Anyways, he was devastated when James died, and even more so when Sirius died, because Sirius was the only person (besides James and Peter) who accepted him for what he was rather than turn their backs on him. If Remus dies, I will die, he is one of the many people in Harry Potter who deserves respect and pity.

When Remus was at Hogwarts, I'm assuming he studied hard to try and get past the fact that he is a werewolf. And he never did anything to stop James or Sirius from taunting Snape because he was afraid he'd lose the only friends he ever had.

I say "More Remus, please!"

Hehe... this is my very first post! Anyways, imagin my surprise (and delight :D) when the first thing I see after signing up on these forums, is an entire thread completely dedicated to my all time favorite character, Remus Lupin! :love:

I spent the next couple of days slowly, but surly making my way through all 26 pages of it (that's right, I read all 26 pages lol) and now I'd like to make a few points...

I agree with everyone who thinks the Remus = James theory is completely rediculous. At the end of PoA, during the sceen in The Shrieking Shack, Remus was telling the story of the marauders from his point of view (that is to say, Remus' point of view). But if he were really just James trapped in Lupin's body how would he know how Remus felt throughout these defferent stanges in his life? He would have to be a really good liar/mind reader to pull that off.

I also want to say that I dont think Remus is going to die in the sieries. Surly JKR will let one of the marauders have a happy ending (if you can call that happy...). Earlier someone said "the real tragity of Lupin is that he always survives" and I want to say "BRAVO!" to whoever that was. It was well said, and I completely agree :agree: But maybe... just maybe... his "tragic survival" can turn out to be a happy one in the end *crosses fingers*

I disagre because she has been killing the closest persons to harry as fathers to him and the marauders in part the last 2 I think will fight and kill each other (silver hand and werewolf) ending with the legacy of the marauders

I disagre because she has been killing the closest persons to harry as fathers to him and the marauders in part the last 2 I think will fight and kill each other (silver hand and werewolf) ending with the legacy of the marauders

Your right in saying that JKR has killed off both of Harry's "fatherly type" poeple. But at the moment, Lupin isn't a "fatherly type" person to Harry (though I hope he will be in future books :D) and even if Lupin did become close to Harry in that way, I think it would be a bit much (not to mention a bit redundednt) for JKR to kill him off for the same reason.

And what would be the point of "ending the legacy of the marauders"? Especially on such a sorrowfull note as "ok... well, they just killed each other so thats the last of em!"? Maybe they're legacy can live on through Lupin; the last true marauder.

(To change direction a little), I was rereading the bit in OotP when Harry 'visits' Lupin and Sirius after seeing his father in the Pensive and I noticed that the two of them were finishing each others sentences for one another, much like Fred and George Weasley can. I don't mean to imply that they are brothers (they aren't, I hate long-lost-sibling theories) but I just thought it was touching how close they were, that their friendship extended to their subconscious.

Yeah MSLupin, I caught that too. So FREAKING sad. Ugh. But yeah, it was touching to see how close they were.

And I agree with those who say that killing Lupin would be bordering on redundant. He may well go out in a blaze of glory in Book 7, but I hope (and doubt) he doesn't. Something, somewhere, has to give.

wow! way to go Katie Lupin! reading all 26 pages!

and I agree that he has to survive - because he survives everything. Hey, even if Harry died I think Lupin will live. Like someone said a LONG while ago (in the first few pages of the thread) Lupin will be like Horatio in Hamlet - the last survivor left to tell the tale to the world.

I can say that the legacy will survive through other people like harry or fred ang george but JKR is putting the pieces on the board and moving them in a direction.
Lupin is harrys favorite teacher and the only one he liked the best afters sirius dead both sufered a lot more than anyone an they will comfort each other making them more close but at the end Lupin and wormtail will face off and I think that no one will survive

Well, we KNOW he's going to live till at least book 7. He's supposed to play a big part in book seven.
I, for one, absolutely adamantly do NOT believe in the Lupin-James theory, because James in no way possible would have let his friend eat the dust for him. specially if his wife and kid were in danger as well. he's built of the same stuff sirius is - hed rather die than not fight.
yeah. its really, really, REALLY sad that *bawls* sirius is his last remaining friend and he *bawls* dies. (my personal belief is hes coming back, tho :D)
i like the idea of "the legacy of the maruaders"... with the final showdown between peter and remus. but of course...
i think its odd that the marauders in their grown years fosters around the dead one's kid. theres something really... there, i guess. its sort of like a communal raising, isnt it? "If you're not there to raise your son, then I'll look after him for you!" definitely very sweet. i love the marauders (well the real ones, anyways) if just for that. :D

I agree, I think in the end Lupin and Wormtail will have it out and this is where the silver hand and Wormtail's debt to Harry will come into play. I also love the Marauders, the dynamic is fantastic. So beautiful and yet so tragic. I read a fanfiction recently where Lupin says that Peter killed them all, it only took Sirius fifteen years to die, and sometimes he wonders how long it will take him... ::Sniff::

Aaw.
Yeah, the dynamic is really amazing. And I think thats really why so many people love the Marauders. Or at least one of them. Have you ever noticed that? Everyone's favorite character is a Marauder. Or at least, it seems like it. I think that... If JKR were to write an 8th book, everyone would simply ADORE a book just full of short stories about the Marauders. I think we all hold a little bit of jealousy towards the Marauders, really wishing they had friends like that, with a dynamic like that. I definitely wish I did. And maybe therein lies the beauty of the Marauders. That they really had something we all wanted. A basic human desire, a picture-perfect situation.
And then, being JKR, she went and ruined that dynamic. That picture got coffee spilt on it, she really just went in and added the dark marks of betrayal in to it.
So really, the tragedy for Lupin (and all the Marauders, and Harry) really began before Harry was even born...

Ack! This got really depressing really fast. Lets move on to a more light-hearted Remus topic...

:lol: You're absolutely right, Katie...

Hum... so, I wonder if DD suspected that the Dementors may make an appearance on the Hogwarts Express that night. I mean, Remus could very well have apparated to Hogsmeade and carried onto Hogwarts from there or found another way of getting to the school. There's no real reason for him to have been on the train with all the students in the first place. Kind of seems like maybe he was asked to be present in case of any emergencies, to me at least.

Remus could very well have apparated to Hogsmeade and carried onto Hogwarts from there or found another way of getting to the school. There's no real reason for him to have been on the train with all the students in the first place. Kind of seems like maybe he was asked to be present in case of any emergencies, to me at least.
Good thinking! I have always wondered why Remus was on the train and that makes total sence! Everyone was being rather protective of Harry at the time because of the crazy mass murderer that was supposedly after him, so it would make perfect sence for Dumbldore to have wanted somone on the train just in case somthing happened. But why would he have chosen Remus (of all people) to do that? And isn't it a tad... ironic that Harry and co. just happned to pick the same compartment Remus was in? And if that is in fact why he was on board, shouldn't he have at least made a little effort to stay awake? :huh::shurg:

Maybe this somehow ties in with peoples' theories that he wasnt really asleep on the train after all... (though I can't think of any reason why pretending to sleep would benifit anybody.)

I think I just created a lot more confusing questions then I answered. :rolleyes: lol

Maybe he was on the train because he couldn't stay awake...it was a good place to get a rest.

Without wishing to suggest that Lupin's life is fine and dandy, I get a little annoyed (not to say depressed!) by all the people saying he's got nothing to live for. He has not lost all his friends, he's lost his oldest friends, but he's still got Dumbledore and the surviving members of the first Order, who he's known for a long time and who all accept him. He's already survived twelve years being totally convinced he'd lost all his schoolfriends, having no job and being shunned, after being involved in a war... and could still smile and be nice after that. I'm sure he can do it again. He's now got a lot of people who care about him and people he cares for. His survival is no more a tragedy than Harry's.

On another note, I thought it was a nice touch that Lupin made his friends feel ashamed of themselves - that was consistent with the way he made Harry feel ashamed of sneaking off to Hogsmeade.

But why would he have chosen Remus (of all people) to do that?
And isn't it a tad... ironic that Harry and co. just happned to pick the same compartment Remus was in?
And if that is in fact why he was on board, shouldn't he have at least made a little effort to stay awake?

1) Lupin was the Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher. He was the best person in the world to do that.

2) No, it was just fortunate. They like to be alone in their own compartment so they can talk freely. There was no free compartment, but there was one with just a sleeping man in it - that's the closest they could get.

3) Not he if was on board so that he could get some shut-eye before he got to the castle, like Puffskein said. The man that had killed his closest friends had recently escaped from prison - it's understandable to suggest that he hadn't been having many easy nights.

Well that settles that then! ;) lol, thanx Cat

And Puffskein, you don't think Harry's life has been at all tragic?

I'd say Harry and Lupin have both had tragic lives :sigh:


p.s. who likes my fish person, its me getting ready for The Great Cod Smack! :lol: which hopefully won't happen

groovychick, I love your codsquad icon. :lol: She doesn't look very angry though, maybe she's just in a sort of gleeful, delusional rage!

Also, this is... sort of? on topic, but I was at the bookstore last night looking for collections of werewolf myths, but was brought to a screeching halt when I realized I have no idea where to look for something like that. :grumble: I headed for Roman mythology first but then had a duh moment when I remembered that the Romulus/Remus thing didn't really have anything at all to do with werewolves. So then I didn't know... Anyone have any recommended reading for me? Please? I wanna make some outlandish theories here! :D

Puffskein, I think it's interesting that Lupin made Harry feel ashamed of himself, the way he used to make his friends... Particularly when it didn't work for his friends, and Harry's safety was less guaranteed, more needed, and more of his obligation. I'm guessing Lupin expected it to work - which means that he did accept that Harry wasn't James, in a way Sirius didn't.

I don't think Lupin was asked to be on board in case of an emergency, but it was a benefit of him being on board, and maybe a reason for no one to protest it.

groovychick, I'm using my 200th post to reply to you, which I actually meant to do way earlier today. I love your codsquad icon. :lol: She doesn't look very angry though, maybe she's just in a sort of gleeful, delusional rage!

Also, this is... sort of? on topic, but I was at the bookstore last night looking for collections of werewolf myths, but was brought to a screeching halt when I realized I have no idea where to look for something like that. :grumble: I headed for Roman mythology first but then had a duh moment when I remembered that the Romulus/Remus thing didn't really have anything at all to do with werewolves. So then I didn't know... Anyone have any recommended reading for me? Please? I wanna make some outlandish theories here!

It's not often that mythology sections are split up. You might fiind werewolves under a 'Mind and Spririt' kind of section, or under anything on folklore.

Looking on Amazon, I've found The Werewolf Book by Brad Steiger and The Complete Book of Werewolves by Leonard R. N. Ashley.

I saw a quite good documentary about werewolves in a series called Creatures Fantastic (there was also a very good one on dragons).

I agree with you Puffskein that Lupin has a lot going for him as well. His life isn't all doom and gloom. If he can buck up and get on with it, then so should we :D

If Lupin get the axe I don't know if Iwill be able to finish the books. Acctuall I will be able to but I will be very mad. I thought when he went over to talk to the werewolf at St. Mungos was so sweet.

People think that Wormtail will kill him with his silver hand but can't werewolves only be killed with a silver bullet?

Werewolves can be killed with silver. I don't know if it's just bullets, though. I have a thought, if indeed Wormtail repays the life debt he owes Harry me thinks it will be in the form of not killing Remus. I mean, if Wormtail has the chance he'd probably get the go ahead from Voldie, if he were to take the last living friend of Harry's dad I think that would be too much for Harry. Remus can't die.

I think that Lupin is going to play an extremely important role in Harry's life in the next books.

Since Sirius is gone, Lupin is probably next in line, next to Dumbledore, to be Harry's mentor/father figure/brother. However, since Harry already lost so many close to him, he might refuse Lupin's outstretched arms, but I think eventually they will become close. Besides, Lupin is one of the last links to James, Lily, and now, Sirius.

Lupin in the Pensieve was exactly how I pictured him as a teenager. He seemed to enjoy having his fun with being a troublemaker, but wasn't one to hurt people just for the fun of it like James and Sirius did. He seemed very mellow and just let James and Sirius have their fun, but I think that if they went too far, that he would tell they to cool down a bit.

As for the death, Lupin was probably hurt as much, if not more, than Harry was. He just lost his last remaining best friend. It even said that he voice was cracking when he held Harry back from running to Sirius.

As for the future, hopefully since Umbridge is "emotionally unstable", and the Ministry is back on Dumbledore's side, Lupin can get some sort of job to support himself. However, Sirius probably wrote out a will, considering all the free time he had and knowing he had a threat of dying, so Lupin was probably left something in Sirius' will.

Three howls for our favorite werewolf! :D

On another note, I thought it was a nice touch that Lupin made his friends feel ashamed of themselves - that was consistent with the way he made Harry feel ashamed of sneaking off to Hogsmeade.

I completely agree with you, Puffskein. Lupin is very skillful at using other tactics besides yelling to make others regret their actions. If, after he found out that Harry had been sneaking into Hogsmeade, he simply gave him a detention or a scolding, it would never have made as much impact as the use of guilt. Harry felt deeply ashamed of himself afterward when Remus brought up the fact that James had died to save him, and instead of taking this into account, Harry was willing to throw his life away for some candy and Zonko's merchandise. I thought that part showed a very interesting aspect of Lupin's character in that he has an impressive understanding of human nature.

I thought that part showed a very interesting aspect of Lupin's character in that he has an impressive understanding of human nature.

Well, we all know he's just brilliant, right? :)
Although I have been wondering about that... Whenever the Marauders are mentioned by old friends, teachers, etc., they mention James and Sirius as the brilliant, talented ones. We know Pettigrew's weakness, so where does that leave Remus? He seems very intelligent and talented in PoA but is never mentioned as exceptional. Perhaps he is more street-smart than book-smart?