The two-way mirrors that Sirius gave to Harry

If only Harry remebered the mirror sirius gave him , sirius would still be alive. what's more harry could have talked sirius as much as he wanted without fires or anything. it painful to think that they could have made contact withoiut anyone knowing! if only he told hermione or ron maybe they would have reminded him to use it! i wish he had found it when he went to get the ivisibilty cloak to use the fire in umbridge's office.. oh well.

any thoughts on this?

btw does anyone know how harry got the maruaders map back?? i tought someone took it away in gof?

i know. i was practically yelling at the book for harry to remember what Sirius's last words to him were before he left Grimauld place.

i suppose it just randomly appeared then? (the Maruaders map)

Ack! I know! Although I had forgotten about the mirror too! Hee, hee!

I'm sure most of us wish that Harry had opened the mirror beforehand...I mean, who *doesn't* open presents from their parents (or godparents) as soon as they can?

...I was beating myself feircly around my head with the book when Harry opened the box...

[i]Originally posted by CentaurSaleem
if only he told hermione or ron maybe they would have reminded him to use it! i wish he had found it when he went to get the ivisibilty cloak to use the fire in umbridge's office.. oh well.



Didn't he tell Hermione, though? I recall that at some poing she was talking him out of using 'whatever it is' becouse of fear of Umbridge detecting it.:??:

I was practically yelling at the book when he was using the fire to contact Sirius. I was like "Sirius gave you an easier way! He wants you to try it! Don't risk giving away Sirius' hiding spot by using the fire!" But of course he didn't listen to me. :rolleyes: and when he found the mirror at the bottom of the box, I was so close to break out in tears again. It's one of those "If only" things. But I really wish he had found it beforehand. :(

I think that mirror may be back at some point. I mean we do not know what happened to the other one. Did sirius have it with him when he feel through the veil ?? There has to be a point of putting the mirror in the story other than harry trying to desperatly contact sirius through it

Didn't Harry smash his mirror though? And Sirius didn't take it through the veil with him. So I don't see how it can be used to contact Sirius. Harry's mirror might be able to be repairedby magic, but then Sirius still wouldn't have one.

If only, if only. :sigh: Well, the point is, Harry didn't want to have to use the mirror Sirius gave him to go whining about Snape mistreating him during the Occlumency lessons, because he didn't want Sirius to lose his temper and come after Snape. He should have at least *opened* it when he got it; that would have saved the trouble of breaking into Umbridge's fire. Honestly. :rolleyes: Of course, that would leave us with a highly un-exciting ending, so there we go.

He definitely broke the mirror, but he has the pieces in his trunk. It being a magic mirror and all, I wonder if he can repair it? And I wonder if the other one that Sirius had is still intact? It could be very useful in the future, if they can find a way to fix it.

yea.. i have posted about this b4.... its VERY unlogical that harry would have never come past the mirror before then... but what can you do now... sirius is dead and the mirror is broke....

...There's a thread about this somewhere that makes an excellent point. Earendil said it, though. :) It HAS to come back sooner or later, because it smashed in Harry's trunk. If it had smashed on the floor of the dormitory, and been cleaned up and thrown away, then that would have been the end of the mirror. But, that didn't happen.

.....I feel as though the mirror has some symbolic importance, like looking in the mirror and seeing himself, not Sirius, and not his father....but....Who knows....? It could just be me looking beneath the surface and not finding anything. :whistle:

I didn't cry when Sirius died, but I almost did once Harry found the mirror. The stupid little ....

But the mirror can be repaired. And I am sure someone else has the other mirror, or someone else has a similiar mirror. It will be used again.

I was so mad at Harry when he smashed the mirror! Hopefully he can repair it, because it seems that if he could get Sirius's mirror through the veil, they could communicate.

Harry's now got 7 years of bad luck. And, you really can't blame him - he acted out in rage. I probably would have done the same thing if I had been in that situation!

i'm not sure what he'll do with the mirrors. personally, i was mad when jkr killed off sirius and then got our hopes up of seeing him again about discussing the mirrors and then having harry talk to nearly headless nick about ghosts. it would have been funny if sirius came back as a ghost. then he could pester snape all the time and he could hang out with harry at the dursleys.

I think JKR put that whole bit in there as a sort of "closure" for Harry. Obviously they can't bury his body, which is the normal means of closure for most people, since his body is gone. Since there was no body she needed a way to convey to Harry (and the audience) that Sirius is really gone and is never coming back, because Sirius would have to be physically in front of the mirror for it to work.

Moon 17 I love your idea of Sirius being a ghost and pestering Snape! Comic Genius!!

I was very upset at how stupid Harry was to first of all forget about the mirror (he could have known that Sirius was okay and maybe JKR could have kept him ALIVE!) and then being stupid and breaking it to pieces!!! UH! So frustrating!!!

well sirius cant come back as a ghost, nick said so...and maybe something good will come out of Sirius's death...who knows...

Well, Harry could just magically repair the mirror if he wanted too.

I was so mad that Harry didn't think to use the mirror when he thought Sirius had been kidnapped by Voldemort, though.

He forgot about it. Just totally forgot about it.

If Sirius's ghost pestered him too much, Snape could complain to the MoM, who would restrict Sirus to the area of his death or something, like they did with Myrtle...

LOL!
Inkwolf I think you hold a grudge against Bruce Willis for killing Alan Rickman in Die Hard 1!

Animagi Girl: I thought he had only looked at the mirror after the Battle of the Ministry.

If Sirius came back as a ghost I think it would cheapen the series.

But the MoM would never approve restricting Sirius to the area of his death. It's their office space.

As for the mirror, I think Rowling should have found a different way to get it to Harry. Letting him have it all that time without checking what he'd been given isn't like him. Having it turn out to be something that important - Sirius would be alive if he'd opened it sooner - is just twisting the knife. How's he supposed to get over drowning in guilt, now, I'd like to know?

::puts on a monotoned voice:: this is a series that is not like LOTR...in that people come back...nothing is ever what is in black and white. But this is Harry Potter, death is death, and were all on the verge of tears reading this. I didnt even remember reading he broke his mirror. guess he did though...but these books are getting darker. and were going to have to settle with reading PoA and crying our eyes out on the first mention of our guy. I do like the idea of gettng the mirror through he veil though, but...who knows.

Yes I was upset about the mirror too, but not because he broke it, because he didn't think of using it earlier . . . and then sirius wouldn't be d- oh, I can't even say it!
But, although I love Sirius and would love for him to come back, I think that we will never see him alive again and that Harry will not be able to use the mirror to communicate with him. BUt I do hope we hear of him again, many times!

Also remember: Why would the ministry allow an ex-convicted murderer and fugitive come back as a ghost? It doesn't seem that even they are that thick. Why wouldn't they just confine him back to Azkaban?

I was so angry at Harry for having forgotten about the glass! All those times he wanted to talk to Sirius during the year! And Sirius apparently forgot as well! Ok, to be honest, I totally forgot about the mirror, too, but I am just a reader... ;-)

Originally posted by LionHeart14 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?postid=474524#post474524))
Harry's now got 7 years of bad luck.


Poor Harry, think he's had enough bad luck already! Like 16 years or something

I'm actually glad he broke the mirror. It was symbolic gesture of him giving up on his "original" family.

Like the mirror of erised showed the parents he'd never know, that small mirror was the source of communication with the godfather, who would never be a parent. Harry had hoped to hold on to Sirius as a way of getting back the family he never had, but he has to let go and find his own.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who was ****** at Harry for forgetting the mirror. But I guess the kid was having a hard time, and had more urgent things to think about. But STILL! I'm getting upset all over again. As for seeing sirius again as a ghost, I seriously doubt it. The guy is dead. That's it, nothing more. What we should be thinking about is HOW he died. JK wrote his death like that for a reason. All I know, is that there are some serious questions to be answered.

By the way, the mirror scene is one of my favourites. It was so heart-wrenching and real. I sobbed!

i got really mad at harry alot in this book to tell the truth.he was kinda thick sometimes......i mean he forgot about the mirror, and the whole timehe was having those dreams he could have looked up what they meant in divination!! i was like helooo! wake up!! don't get me worng tho i love harry tho! i was soo ad when sirius died....he will be missed! chao yall!o yeah this is my aim s/n 2 so if yall want to aim me about hp feel free!

Well, I was really upset about the mirror, too. But what is so excellent about JKR is that rarely does she have so many "what-ifs," or situations where, had Harry "remembered the mirror," the entire situation would be different. There are usually so many threads in the tapestry of the book. So my thought is that even if Harry remembered the mirror, perhaps Kreacher would have snatched it from Sirious's cloke, or maybe Sirius would hide it, so not to tempt Harry. We might find out more in Book 6. It just seems so simple to think that if Harry had remembered ONE thing, everything would be different.
Not to mention how Hermione predicted the trap "Harry, Voldemort knows you like so play the hero," and it turned out to be exactly right. It does seem like things just "went awry," that so much of this was unneccessary. But, I'm just going to put my complete faith in JKR. Whatever her reasoning, perhaps it will be more clear in future books, everything will end up working out perfectly fine.

If harry had the sense to remember the mirror Sirius gave him...Harry wouldn't have had to go to Umbridge's office....AND....he would have been able to find out if sirius was home w/ out risking the fire trick again! ugh we could still have our sirius.....


:'(

Harry decided not to use the mirror when Sirius gave it to him because he was worried it could be traced by Umbridge and the Ministry. I was disappointed, though, when Rowling introduced such an item, that could have been such an important plot device, and then just abandoned it until the very end, only to have Harry destroy it in frustration without ever even using it. It just seemed kind of messy for her. I mean, Harry has never received a gift like that which didn't have some real use. Even the pen-knife Sirius gave him came in handy. I have a hard time believing Rowling intended the sole purpose of that mirror to just be some therapeutic device for Harry to destroy in order to make himself feel better. I mean, wasn't turning Dumbledore's office upside down enough? I hope it serves some purpose in the next two books, otherwise it's going to seem just a little anti-climatic to me, despite all of Harry's drama.

Elektra

It's not just Harry's fault that Sirius died. If Sirius had been able to explain the package he gave Harry a little more maybe Harry might have used it.

Anyway, JKR killed him for a reason. Admittedly, I've got no idea why she did it, and I wish he didn't have to die, but I'm sure we'll find out why he had to die over the next 2 books.

And don't forget that Dumbledore made Sirius stay at Grimmauld Place and that Voldemort lured Harry into thinking that Sirius was in danger. And Kreacher lied to Harry.

Yea true..i have nothing totally against harry but u can't blame sirius either..poor guy was getting restless...i'm willing to say that its both their faults...its just lucky that hermione was around to tell them to @ least check even if kreacher did lie

I'm a fatist and I do not believe anyone is at fault for anything.
Harry did not open Sirius's package untill after Sirius was killed.
But if you must blame anyone it would have been Bellatrix's fault that you do not have Sirius Black to kick around anymore.

Well my opinion on the whole mirror issue is that yeah it was frusrateing to know had he at least just opened the package up to see what it was, he would have know about it. and contact siruis that way but what about his Oclumency had he tried and took it more seriously voldmort wouldnt have been able to trick him.

Even if he repared the mirrior i dont think he could talk to Siruis we dont even know that he took the mirrior with him he proabably left it at his house. I think Harry in the end may keep it, just as a token of memory. He could even get the other half and give it too ron or herimone they could come in handy with the clock,and map

I'm merging this with the existing topic on the two-way mirrors. You can find that here (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11754).

The whole mirror connection thing is very cool, and I have a feeling that someone else will be using those mirrors later...

I really hope that Sirius isn't just remembered as a 'memory' in the next books. I know, I know, he can't come back to life, and he can't be ghost, but what about... wait for it... a painting! Personally, I am sure that if Sirius isn't left as a memory, then he'll be a painting. I mean, so much emphasis has been put on the paintings! I admit, its a bit far fetched seeing as he's already dead, but the noble house of Black is full of pictures...

Originally posted by Larna (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?postid=477945#post477945))
if Sirius isn't left as a memory, then he'll be a painting. I mean, so much emphasis has been put on the paintings! I admit, its a bit far fetched seeing as he's already dead, but the noble house of Black is full of pictures...


Yeah, but if Sirius' name had been deleted from off the family tapestry, I'd suspect any portraits of him would have likewise been destroyed or removed from the house. And they would have to be of a very young Sirius, since he left when he was sixteen, and so I wonder if such a portrait did exist if the Sirius in the portrait would have the perspective of Sirius at that age, and not later, when Harry knew him. Still, that in and of itself might be interesting. There might be a portrait of an older Sirius, though, somewhere else in the wizarding world, painted before the demise of the Potters and his incarceration in Azkaban. There could be portraits of Harry's parents, for that matter, or some of his Potter ancestors. Still, I think Rowling will place a limit on this particular plot device, since she obviously doesn't want Harry sitting and visiting with these portraits the way he did with the Mirror of Erised. It's more important for Harry to mourn the people he's lost and continue living his own life, than to be able to communicate with the dead.

Elektra

I actually totally forgot about the package Sirius gave him. But Harry said he didn't want to open it, for it might lead Sirius to be tempted to come back to Hogwarts.

Also, I have a question. If Harry threw his mirror through the veil, would he be able to talk to Sirius?

ya know i posted a thread about this last nite and every one was like...."its not harry's fault JKR had it happed for a reason" I'm glad to find people who actually agree w/ me ;) humph u also bring up a very good point....if harry DID throw sirius' mirror into the veil i really wonder if they could talk to each other...yet i wonder how could harry get down to the DoM anymore without getting ca ught!:'(

Ooh, I didn't think of that...and I suppose he could repair the mirror with a spell, so it would work again. But how would he know if Sirius could find it?

I definately think that the mirrors will play a part in the next books, or else JK wouldn't have mentioned them at all. The only thing they succeeded in doing was raising both Harry's hopes and our own of still being able to communicate with Sirius. I know that his realisation that they don't work anymore will act as a sort of closure for him, but I still think those mirrors have an important part to play. Harry's can be repaired by magic and Sirius's could be at Grimauld Place so someone else could be able to use it now.

I think the mirror is bound to be in one of the next books, together with an explanation of why Harry couldn´t use it. Because if it doesn´t, I´ll feel like JKL is cheating... I mean, she puts the mirror in the book and Harry simply forgets to use it (who forgets something like that?) and whwn he founds it, he doesn´t even think "Why haven´t I used this?!". No, he just thinks "Can I use it now?" So it seems as if JKR expects us not to think about it too... This is definetely either a mistery or a big blunder.

I think the mirror is bound to be in one of the next books, together with an explanation of why Harry couldn´t use it. Because if it doesn´t, I´ll feel like JKL is cheating... I mean, she puts the mirror in the book and Harry simply forgets to use it (who forgets something like that?) and whwn he founds it, he doesn´t even think "Why haven´t I used this?!". No, he just thinks "Can I use it now?" So it seems as if JKR expects us not to think about it too... This is definetely either a mistery or a big blunder.

Oh, I was so sad to read how Harry found that mirror after Sirius had died. That is when I started to cry again. I mean, that was so obvious why didn't he remember that? (I didn't as well, but Harry could have...)

Do you think it can be used now? Maybe to connect Harry with Lupin?

Oh, I was so sad to read how Harry found that mirror after Sirius had died. That is when I started to cry again. I mean, that was so obvious why didn't he remember that? (I didn't as well, but Harry could have...)

Do you think it can be used now? Maybe to connect Harry with Lupin?

Yes, it was quite heart wrenching to see the mirror and remember it's uses at that certain time at the book. It really did make Sirius' death much harder.

About your question though, I have no doubt that it will be some use to Harry in the near future. Something with those qualities are not so easily dismissed. One of these times, it will be used to it's full potential, and Lupin is a very obvious and good guess as to it's other participant. As I've stated explicitely in the Lupin thread, Lupin is going to be the one who truly pulls Harry out of his reverie and mode he is in right now. The mirror could be an excellent way of talking to Lupin when he needs to talk. And considering what Harry is going through now, talking is what he needs to do, it will help him get over Sirius' death much faster, and the mirror provides the ample means of doing so.

Ack! I know! Although I had forgotten about the mirror too! Hee, hee!

well, even if harry hadn't opened it, shouldn't sirius have remembered he gave it to him....? why didn't he tell harry to use it when they spoke in the fire..... :shrug:

I've given a lot of thought to the symbolism behind the mirrors and here are my impressions:

When we look in a mirror in real life, we do so to look at our appearance. We see those things that are good, and those that are not-so-good, and then we set out to fix those things that are within our control. (Does my hair need to be brushed? Do I have food between my teeth? How's my make-up?)

I think Sirius was written to act as Harry's "mirror image". He was given many qualities, both good and bad, that were shared by Harry. However, somewhere inside of his soul, Harry made the choice not to acknowledge the negative traits that he needed to work on. He was fully aware of Sirius being reckless, stubborn, and a bit selfish in regards to wanting to be a part of the action, and Harry knew that those traits were dangerous for both Sirius and the order. But, just as he made the choice not to use the mirror, he just wouldn't look at Sirius in a way that allowed him to see those same traits within himself.

If Harry is going to be able to defeat Lord Thingy, then he has to fix those flaws or he will end up just like Sirius...dead. (As an aside, you could reverse this and say that Sirius could have perhaps saved himself if he had seen Harry's flaws as his own.) The mirror is broken and time for excuses is gone. He can't keep blaming Snape for his failures in Occulmency, and now that Dumbledore has finally opened up he can't complain about being out of the loop. But, because he broke the mirror *in anger*, I don't think it is going to happen easily or soon.

:clap: Good post Iggy. Very thoughtful.

. But, just as he made the choice not to use the mirror, he just wouldn't look at Sirius in a way that allowed him to see those same traits within himself.

I never really thought of it that way. I had always just assumed that Harry didn't want to see flaws in Sirius because he felt bad, but your explaination makes sense as well.

If Harry had seen those flaws in Sirius and accepted them, perhaps he would have noticed them in himself as well.

What does breaking the mirror in anger signify? I was a bit unclear on that. Were you speaking in temrs of acknowledging these flaws that he and Sirius fear, or defeating Voldie (encompassing it all)?

I actually think that his anger is going to stop as soon as it started. He knows now that his behavior has brought no good, and I am pretty sure that once the shock of he death wears off, he'll be a lot less angry about everything.

I have said elsewhere that book 6 is probably going to be a "release book" of sorts, where Harry, instead of ranting and raging will release the real emotions he's feeling: sadness, despair, worry, ect ect ect. I don't think he'll continue is raving now that he realizes it's his flaw.

:clap: Good post Iggy. Very thoughtful.

What does breaking the mirror in anger signify? I was a bit unclear on that. Were you speaking in temrs of acknowledging these flaws that he and Sirius fear, or defeating Voldie (encompassing it all)?

Thanks for the compliment. :blush: To address your question, let's look at it this way. If JKR was giving the mirrors a deeper meaning, (even though it's possible that she wasn't and I'm just reading too much into their significance), then why did she choose to have him break his, and in that manner? If she just wanted to show him acknowledging that Sirius was indeed dead, and that he was letting go of his negative traits, she could have let the mirror fall from his fingers in despair. Instead, he threw it in that manner into his trunk, (and not into a waste basket or on the floor), so to me that means that his anger still fuels him, that he is still "holding on" to it.

I think that he does indeed recognize now that he has been acting immaturely and needs to grow up, but that his anger will be the last, and hardest, issue to deal with. Bellatrix showed us that his "righteous anger" was of no use against her, or Voldemort, (if anything it is a hindrance), but letting go of that anger is going to prove very difficult.

Remember, too, that if Harry had used the mirror, he would have known that Sirius was safe. He would have surmised that Voldemort was tricking him. At some point, Voldemort would have run out of ideas, and simply Apparated into the DoM, grabbed the prophecy, and Disapparate out. Voldemort would have the prophecy, and the MoM still would believe Harry was lying about him being back. All of this just if Harry had used the mirror.

Professor Lupin gave the map back to Harry. Since he wasn't his teacher anymore, he didn't feel guilty or something like that.

Welcome to the forums, Iggie. You make some good points, but take what you just said a little further. Not only will letting go of anger be difficult, but learning to love - on the level of his mother - will be even harder. It is my theory that Harry will destroy Voldemort by loving Voldemort. It is easy enough for Harry to hate the person who killed his parents. But to love him? Now that will be hard.

Thanks for the clear-up Iggy! I understand now!

Atcually, hesdead, I think we know that Harry can love on the level of his mother. That's why Voldie couldn't possess him. But opting for love instead of anger will be Harry's challenge in the wake of Sirius's death. I don't necessarily think he'll ever have to love Voldie, but I do think that he cannot defeat him in hatred. It has to be in love, but not necessarily for Voldie.

Professor Lupin gave the map back to Harry. Since he wasn't his teacher anymore, he didn't feel guilty or something like that.
He did give it back, but then Moody (aka Barty Crouch jr.) took it from Harry in GoF. Remember there was the whole thing with Harry seeing a dot on it labeled 'Bartemius Crouch?' And then Harry thought it was Crouch sr... So jr. took it, but in the book I don't think that he ever gave it back...

Maybe when he was in Fake Moody's office he just took it off the desk. Or DD sent it to him? It wasn't explained at all...drives me nuts. JKR will have to do some quick thinking to get out of that one in her next interview.

About the two-way mirror, I had a thought the other day. The mirror broke into several pieces, right? So perhaps each piece now works as a way of comunicating with all the other pieces. This could be really useful in future with the DA.
Sorry if anyone said this before, I didn't have time to read all the posts.

I've got a theory for this. Here goes:
Sirius didn't die the usual way... natural causes or by magic... well, kind of by magic, but not by wand. I'm thinking he's still alive, but trapped in the World of the Dead (the world beyond the veil, possibly) and, wait, I'm almost finished... and that if he finds Sirius' mirror (in Sirius' house, probably), then he can put it through the veil. Because... well, if people can fall through the veil, so can objects, right? If Sirius is trapped inside, then the mirror drops through and Sirius has it, they may be able to communicate. It's a long shot, heck yeah... but I just wanna see him again! Oh... a few things off-topic.. what about Kreacher and the house? Who do they belong to... Harry? Sirius doesn't have any blood relatives yet except Bellatrix, and I have a feeling he wouldn't let her inherit anything of his.

Ok! who wouldnt open the present at the first time.. and gave by your godfather, closest person and all....Ok i admit ppl can forget but when he used the flo network (in evil umbrige room) to tlk to sirius, sirius should have ask him that why he didnt use the mirror or the gift he gave.....

Yeah, I was reading the part Harry rushed to Umbridge's office and was thinking "uh oh, he is not using whatever it was that Serius gave him and that's not a good thing". Well, Harry never listens to people to I guess it couldn't be helped.
I'm sure he can fix it though. Remember he broke the cup that had the medicine Hermione gave him for his poor hand? He fixed the cup (I think it was repardo) and I think it works for mirrors too.

That mirror HAS to come out later! It's just too sad to end this way!

Lets just hope that Harry can find all the pieces to it so he can fix it!

these topics still bring tears to my eyes, & I've been trying to get over sirius's loss, but it really seems impossible!

The idea of putting the Mirror into the veil sounds good, but, with the hypnotic effect the veil has, could you even get close enough to it safely to get the mirror through?

Yeah, that mirror is frustrating isn't it? I don't think we've seen the last of it because if we did, then the mirror wouldn't really have much of a point to be there, unless just to signify something and make everyone really frustrated and to show that Harry is in a mood that he'll break anything that annoys him... better stay out of his way, just kidding.

The mirror part got me really sad, and when I was reading it for the second time, I got really mad, because when Sirius gave it to him, Harry said, "Okay," and then he put in away in the inside pocket of his jacket, but he knew he would never use whatever it was. I was so mad at Harry, because if only he had not been stupid and actually opened the package, then he could have saved Sirius! Arg... oh well. But I do think that the mirror will come back later... I mean, I don't think JK's just going to forget about it. She's more of the type to use these kinds of things and add on to it to make it like a big clue or something.

Putting the mirror behind the veil? That is interesting. I don't know that I would want to see what is behind the veil. It might only make Harry feel worse to know where Sirius actually is.

I know you can usually just use reparo to repair stuff like broken mirrors, but don't you think there was a reason why JKR made Harry break it? Sure, it was symbolic, but I think it also means that he will not be using it again. Maybe reparo will fix outer appearances, but not magical properties?

Maybe breaking it was symbolic to the end of his communication/realationship with Sirius. That may be harsh, but he is dead afterall. In all liklihood he will never speak with Sirius again.

When I found out that Harry had a 2 way mirror and did all that mess for nothing . . . I felt like I wanted to strangle him! He let Sirius down and cost him his life.

Maybe breaking it was symbolic to the end of his communication/realationship with Sirius. That may be harsh, but he is dead afterall.

Hence my name!

But anyway, good point. We won't be seeing Sirius again except in thoughts, so Harry will have to pick up the pieces of his fractured self just like he has to pick up the pieces of the mirror.

This whole topic still upsets me. When I first read it, I too had forgotten about the package Sirius gave to Harry, and upon seeing Sirius's writing...the tears just started to burst. I don't have any clue what-so-ever as to the meaning or symbolism of Harry breaking the mirror. I don't even want to contemplate it because I know I'll never get a true answer untill JKR reveals it to us. However I honestly did not think Harry would break it. If it were me, I think I'd hold onto it forever. But then again... it was kind of frustrating so... I can't really say I blame Harry for forgetting, because I forgot as well. A few people have already mentioned that Sirius did not tell Harry to use the mirror when he contacted him through the fire. But I suppose there wasn't much time. Harry was distressed and Sirius and Lupin's only thought at the time was to help him. I think Sirius was about to tell him..but Umbridge came (that horrible, horrible, woman). What I was wondering was...if Sirius and James both had mirrors, then did Lupin and Wormtail have them as well? I don't see why they wouldn't. I don't know about throwing it into the veil (curse that veil, it took away my Sirius...I still can't bear to even read the word) because I really don't know whats beyond it. Luna said she heard voices as well, I have no idea how this will affect the overall picture of the story, but I'm sure it will somehow. However I think I am sure we will be seeing the mirror(s) again soon. :upset:

JKR doesn't do anything for nothing. If Sirius is dead (which I'm still not so sure about) it is symbolic, just as you all said. If he somehow is still alive, Harry broke his last way to find it out. And I still think Harry is a stinky little git after this DoM situation.

I think Harry breaking the mirror had major significance. He had a rush of hope that he could possibly see Sirius again and talk with him, just as us readers had hope that he wouldn't be really dead. When he found out the mirror didn't work, Sirius's death was finalized. Breaking the mirror seems to be symbolizing that Sirius is really gone and communication with him is broken. I think it means that as readers we can no longer hope Sirius is still alive or able to come back.

When mirror wasn't work it only meaned that Sirius didn't have it with him. Even if he lives, he wouldn't like Harry to find out, would he?

If only Harry remebered the mirror sirius gave him , sirius would still be alive. what's more harry could have talked sirius as much as he wanted without fires or anything. it painful to think that they could have made contact withoiut anyone knowing! if only he told hermione or ron maybe they would have reminded him to use it! i wish he had found it when he went to get the ivisibilty cloak to use the fire in umbridge's office.. oh well.

any thoughts on this?

btw does anyone know how harry got the maruaders map back?? i tought someone took it away in gof?
I have not thought about that at all but you make a good point. If Harry had known about the mirror earlier then he could have used to to check on Sirius. He would have seen that Sirius is okay and then he would not have gone to the department of mysteries to save Sirius. Harry was afraid that if he opened the package that Sirius gave that he would put Sirius in danger of being found. In the end Harry's trying to save and protect Sirius ended up killing him.

I have not thought about that at all but you make a good point. If Harry had known about the mirror earlier then he could have used to to check on Sirius. He would have seen that Sirius is okay and then he would not have gone to the department of mysteries to save Sirius. Harry was afraid that if he opened the package that Sirius gave that he would put Sirius in danger of being found. In the end Harry's trying to save and protect Sirius ended up killing him.

You have a good point. May I also add that if the mirrors could be monitored (a possibility), he could risk devulging secrets that no ordinary witch or wizard should know about. ie- what the order is up to.

Well Harry not using the mirror just confirms my notion that sometimes Harry can be an IDIOT! Don't get me wrong, Harry is bright and talented boy but he sometimes forgets that he has a brain behind those emerald eyes. There's reason for having one you know, he should remember to actually use it now and than.

Well Harry not using the mirror just confirms my notion that sometimes Harry can be an IDIOT! Don't get me wrong, Harry is bright and talented boy but he sometimes forgets that he has a brain behind those emerald eyes. There's reason for having one you know, he should remember to actually use it now and than.

I feel that way sometimes about Harry when I reread the series.

But there is one thing I forgot to mention... when Harry found the mirror at the bottom of his trunk, he actually tried to summon Sirius to it but he didn't answer. Therefore I don't think that Sirius had the mirror with him. :grumble:

Hello! im not sure if anyone as already discussed this here but what do u make of the 'discovery' by G. Waters. i don't like her techinque of sloving with just word used over again but i really like the bit about mirrors being twins. She suggested that the mirror in myrtle's bathroom and the one voldemort has (seen in harry's dream of voldemort with rookwook) are twins. The only proof she gave is that both of the mirrors were "cracked and spotted" . it really is very good proof but it brings the question "is this the wizarding internet we have all been waiting for?" I mean think about it, if those mirrors are twins (the one in the bathroom and the one voldy has) then that means that voldemort is keeping an eye on the Chamber of Secreats BECAUSE SOMETHING HE IS WAITING FOR IS DOWN THERE!!!! :scared:

Well Harry not using the mirror just confirms my notion that sometimes Harry can be an IDIOT!

As can we all. Did you remember that package when Harry had to get in touch with Sirius? And it wasn't that stupid of him to forget about it, considering he didn't know what the package was and knew by then that Sirius might want to be trying something reckless.

I was wondering if anyone has any logic issues in with any of the books. For example, in the 5th book Harry makes the risky decision to use the fireplace in Unbridge's office to try and contact Sirius. Of course he ends up getting caught finds himself in a horrible situation followed by a string of nasty encounters. Why go through all this trouble when all he had to do was use the mirror that Sirius had given him specifically for this sort of situation? The whole time I was reading the book I was asking myself this question. I guess you can reason that he just plain forgot about it, but then why introduce it in the first place? Maybe I missed something, or maybe Rowling has future plans for the mirror. Any ideas, coment?

Any time I feel that way, I just remember how old Harry is (11-15). I remember how stupid some of the things my friends and I did then, and how, when I look back in retrospect, I wish I had done a more logical action. That being said though, I think things like the mirror will probably become important later in the series, though I don't exactly know how.

Hi Perseus Evans,

I´m sure most of the readers had forgotten about the mirror, too. And I assume it was JKR´s intention to make us to forget it. By the way, even in my mind the mirror wasn´t anymore, and when Harry tried to use it was already too late. C´est la vie!
Later I got the impression Sirius idea using the mirror was completely childish. I mean he and James used it when they were kids/teens and were busy with troublemaking and their detentions. The mirror maybe was good enough too fool the other students and from time to time even the teachers. Don´t you think the ministry wouldn´t have note it, if someone had tried to use it?
And Harry acts inlogically, too. When he got the dreams that Sirius was in danger he never realised the fact one member of the Order was back at Hogwarts. It´s very easy to understand, because he hates the person who is a member: Severus Snape. Harry´s brain was occupied by Cho, Sirius and Quidditch. There were no place back for some more important thoughts.

Greetings from Austria!

I´m sure most of the readers had forgotten about the mirror, too.

i sure didnt..i always had the mirror in mind (because the mirror reminded me of beauty and the beast and somehow i always imagined harry looking or talking to sirius just as the beast looks at the girl in the movie..somehow this image poped up to my mind everytime harry said he needed to talk to sirius)..its just that i thought that harry wasnt using it because it didnt work on long distances! :rotfl: i am so dumb!...(haha..i always get those ideas when i am tired..i always read OotP at 12 am after studying.. :p )

out of topic: hallo aschenputtel! lol..this is the first time i see a german speaking person here..and yeah i have doubts..snape is too good to be a member of rammstein! :p)

Why go through all this trouble when all he had to do was use the mirror that Sirius had given him specifically for this sort of situation? The whole time I was reading the book I was asking myself this question. I guess you can reason that he just plain forgot about it, but then why introduce it in the first place? Maybe I missed something, or maybe Rowling has future plans for the mirror. Any ideas, coment?

I can see the mirror becoming very useful in the two future books. JKR has never introduced something that seems important for it to never crop up again. Harry clearly had forgotten about the mirror as he stored it in his trunk.

See this thread for theories upon the mirror: The two-way mirror that Sirius gave Harry (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=11754&highlight=Sirius+mirror)

The mirror was very annoying for me. I was left wishing by the end of the book that it had never been written in. I kept screaming for Harry to "open the package" the first time I read through OotP. I expect it to come up in the future but hope it's buried and forgotten instead.

I found that really annoying (I had forgotten about it) but I found it suprising that Harry wasn't curious enough to open the package after Sirius had given it to him. I think it will come up again though - i think someone asked about it in the latest interview she did. Not sure how, but I think it'll be related to Sirius...maybe they'll chuck a piece through the veil?

Well, if I recall, the mirror wouldn't be no more reliable than sticking his head in the fireplace. Now if he actually took the full trip and had gone to the house, he would have been able to check for himself if Sirius was home or not than relying on the info of that dead-beat house elf.

And yes, even if he did take the full trip over, he would have still have been caught. I think maybe when he made the return trip, he should have taken the invisability cloak with him, Umbridge would have only seen the green flames and not Harry. It would have sparked her suspisions though. But she wouldn't have much to go on to find out what or who was accessing her fireplace.

Harry is impulsive, when he should be thoughtful. Acting on instinct is good when in imminent danger, but not so good when you're dealing with dangers from afar. Harry is good at seeing the "there and now", but not so good at thinking about "if I do this, then what could happen next?"

If Harry had thought a little deeper when he received the mirror, he would have reasoned that there would be no cause to believe that the mirror would somehow lure Sirius away from Grimmauld place. In fact, it would have been better if Harry regularly communicated to Sirius using the mirror -- Sirius would have been less lonely and Harry would be able to consult with him when he was facing problems (while discreetly hiding less prudent topics, such as Snape), thus easing each other's hearts.

Unfortunately, not many people his age (especially boys) like to think beyond what's in front of their nose. Harry was no different.

As this thread is mostly about Harry use (or non-use) of logic in relation to the two-way mirrors in OotP, I'll merge it with The two-way mirrors that Sirius gave Harry (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=11754).

i was so mad that harry had forgotten about it, when he and ginny and the rest of htem thought up that plan to get into umbridges fire i thought why not just use the mirror! lol oh well... i dont think its gonna be in the future books due to the fact he smashed it, but then again he can REPARO it or osmething.... im babbling

The mirror has not yet served ANY purpose so it's bound to come back, isnt' it? Why would anyone put something like that in the book, just because people go crazy because Harry doesnt think of it? i dont think so

well he didnt know that it was a mirror, cause he thought that since mrs. weasley would disapprove it would lure sirius out of the house

jk as good as said that the mirror is coming back, but i dont see how... i guess it could be magically repaired..

i do agree if sirius came back it would cheapen the series, but i dont care... sirius was my favorite... he deserves to come back!

Well, if I recall, the mirror wouldn't be no more reliable than sticking his head in the fireplace. Now if he actually took the full trip and had gone to the house, he would have been able to check for himself if Sirius was home or not than relying on the info of that dead-beat house elf.
The mirror would have been much more reliable. No one knew about it other than Sirius and Harry, and Sirius would have been watching for Harry to call.

And yes, even if he did take the full trip over, he would have still have been caught. I think maybe when he made the return trip, he should have taken the invisability cloak with him, Umbridge would have only seen the green flames and not Harry. It would have sparked her suspisions though. But she wouldn't have much to go on to find out what or who was accessing her fireplace.
Umbridge would have known, and she could have just reached out and pulled off the invisibility cloak before Harry even realized what was happening.

I believe that the mirror never served a real purpose in the 5th year. I've always wondered it's purpose. The only thing I can think of is the mirror will play some role in the future books.

I would love it if someone would just explain to me the real purpose for Rowling to put the mirror in the book!
:tu:

The mirror is the one thing in OotP that really irritates me. It seems so below Rowling's usual standard, and I am so sorry to have to say that!

In this book it serves the function of telling Harry - and the rest of us - that Sirius is really dead and can be reached no more. Iggy made some good points earlier about it's possible symbolic meanings, that could well be part of Rowling's intent too. And I feel pretty certain that the mirror magic in itself will come to play again in the next books - Rowling said so in her latest online chat - why not as a means to safe communication among the DA's as somebody suggested.

All this is well and good. But I just can't accept the way Rowling wrote it into the story. It doesn't work, it screams poor plotting. She needs the mirror for the reasons mentioned above, but she can't let Harry use it to discover that Sirius is safe, because that will ruin her plot for OotP. So what she does to achieve this is let Harry have a totally unbeliveable memory lapse about something as important as this. And Sirius too! It is hard enough to believe that one of them should forget, but both!!!

Maybe I can accept Harry's choice not to use it to contact Sirius about his hard times at school, because he doesn't want to tempt him out of Grimmauld place. But that wouldn't cause him to FORGET that his beloved godfather has given him an easy means of contact. We can forget it, since it is mentioned only once at the beginning of this long book. But not Harry, with his strong emotional attachment to Sirius. Remember, even if Harry didn't open the package, Sirius told him what it was about.

No, it is not psychologically believable that Harry should forget a gift like that. It would have been a lot more plausible if he had constantly remembered it, and been tempted to use it, but resisted temptation because of his promise to himself not to put Sirius at risk. The moment the issue was not complaints that would cause Sirius to rise on his behalf, but Sirius' safety, it ought to have been the first thing he thought of. I don't accept that this can be explained away as teenager stupidity - it is not about rash actions and stupid decisios, it's about unbelievable forgetfulness of a highly emotionally significant matter.

And Sirius? Even LESS believable. Why should HE forget? When Harry's head appeared in his kitchen fire (see, Harry did make contact when he was aggieved enough regardless of his promise to himself not to - this is more in the rash teenager reaction fashion) - I would have expected his spontaneous reaction to be: "Harry! what are you doing there!! It's dangerous, get out this instant and use the mirror I gave you instead!!

*sigh* I love Rowling, I wish she hadn't been so clumsy with this one. It could have been so easy to achieve the same effect if she had just let Harry sucessfully use the mirror the first time he contacted Sirius, but let it fail the second and crucial time because Sirius might just not have brought his mirror with him when he went to tend to Buckbeak. Or Kreacher could have stolen it - the way he sneaks around the house he could easily have found out about it. So then Harry would have had to let Hermione talk him into take the time to try the fire instead, and everything could have proceeded as it does now. *double sighs*

I completely agree with just about everything necromancer said, well done :)
The only think I would add is that it is important that Harry broke the mirror INSIDE his trunk. That way, at a later date, Harry could potentially put the mirror back together and use it. Maybe it will come into play in the final battle? Or even a small battle before that. Hm....there are so many possibilities for the mirror, but i do think something is going to happen with it before the series end. I just have a feeling...

Happy Posting! :)

[QUOTE=CentaurSaleem]If only Harry remebered the mirror sirius gave him , sirius would still be alive. what's more harry could have talked sirius as much as he wanted without fires or anything. it painful to think that they could have made contact withoiut anyone knowing! if only he told hermione or ron maybe they would have reminded him to use it! i wish he had found it when he went to get the ivisibilty cloak to use the fire in umbridge's office.. oh well.QUOTE]

I know, really! Sirius was probably sittin there waiting for Harry to say something, now that he has the mirrior and is free to talk to Sirius as much as he would like to.But we know why he did'nt try opening, because he did'nt want to endanger Sirius, which is very thoughful of him.
But I agree with what some of you have stated. I think mirrior has another purpose in the future novels. Hmm, I wonder, did Sirius have the mirror with him when he was battiling, or when he died? Or did he leave it at Grimalud Place? Because if he left it at Grimauld Place, they can still use it somehow. If he did'nt leave it there, I don't know how it could be used if Sirius is dead.

The mirror will come into play again. It wouldn't have been put in the book unless it was going to come into play again. Since the mirror was broken inside the trunk, that means it could be put back together and like harryfantotheend said, it could be used.

Hello,
this is a part of the last rowling's interview. I think that it's very important:

"Cookie246122: Why did you kill Sirius? It made me very sad
JK Rowling replies -> I'm really, really sorry. I didn't want to do it, but there was a reason. If you think you can forgive me, keep reading, you'll find out. [I feel really guilty now].

SiriuslyLovinSirius: If we ever see Sirius again, what form will he be in?
JK Rowling replies -> I couldn't possibly answer that for fear of incriminating myself.

Kelpie_8: Will the two way mirror Sirius gave Harry ever show up again?
JK Rowling replies -> Ooooo good question. There's your answer."

Well, surely the mirror will be important in the future books, the question is: it will be used by Sirius? I think that Sirius will be able to speak with Harry again.

Sirius and James used the mirror when they were in school so i dont think it was from the mirror of Erised but maybe a larger one?

I agree with classical wizar....u can't talk to the people u see in the mirror of erised, but sirius and james talked together using the two small mirrors, i think that the mirror has its own history that revolves around how james and sirius got hold of it...although i haven't figured out what that is exactly

What do you mean by a bigger mirror? The mirror to my knowledge is whole it doesn’t seem to missing any pieces from it otherwise it would be shattered and useless to Harry. So if it was made from some huge mirror or something I don’t think the mirrors are connected.

My question is though...how did they find it and where? could that be where the answer lies :huh:

My question is though...how did they find it and where? could that be where the answer lies :huh:
Enchanted the mirrors, kind of looks like those women make-up compact mirrors is what I imagine them to be, or maybe something familiar to them a little more manly. But they were intelligence young men so I’m guessing they just enchanted regular mirrors to their advantage. After all if they can become animagus a simple mirror was a piece of cake.

i'm just wondering because jk rowling seems to hint its really significant, but if was just something james and sirius cooked up wouldn't they know about it and if sirius did, why didn't he tell harry? although he didn't have a lot of time i guess when he gave him the mirror...Whereas is the mirror was something they found, then there's a possibility that its history could be significant to it importance,still...what r ur thoughts?

Well... JKR said that the mirror may not have helped as much as you would think, but if Sirius had possession of the mirror at that moment, than why wouldn't it have? So I think someone else may now have the other mirror, and since no one can get into 12 GP, then the logical suspect is Kreacher. If Harry figured this out at some point, then he might be able to use it to contact Kreacher and find him in the midst of some new and dangerous mischief, thus the mirror will become very helpful.

How did Sirius get both mirrors in the first place? If James had the other one, it probably would have been destroyed in the attack on Godric's Hollow. Unless he gave it to Sirius for safekeeping before going there...oh, details...

Even before Harry was looking for a way to talk to Sirius, I willing him to read my mind: the mirror! Use the mirror!

It is sad.:( Kind of adds insult to injury.

Okay, JK's site mentioned an anser to a question. Why did Harry have to forget the mirrors Sirius gave him? She replied "I can't give a full answer to this because it is relevant in book six, and seven. Now has it said in the books Harry was sure he would never use it whatever it was." "There mirrors might not help more than you think, then maybe they will help more than you think. You'll have to read the last books to understand that!"
So heres my theory. Lily used love to save Harry by dying for him. Well, maybe Sirius put a spell on the mirror so when he died it would be able to save Harry. In the phrophecy it says "..One with the power to vanquish the dark lord." So I dunno, maybe the mirror is the power.

Two years later "Ah, it is the mirrors, suckers, and its the key for Harry to defeat the dark lord, and live happily ever after in Godric's Hollow sipping butterbeers for the rest of his life! HA HA HA! SUCKERS!"

There it is.

So heres my theory. Lily used love to save Harry by dying for him. Well, maybe Sirius put a spell on the mirror so when he died it would be able to save Harry. In the phrophecy it says "..One with the power to vanquish the dark lord." So I dunno, maybe the mirror is the power.
First of all
Noooooowwww Brett ..... Let's be serious! We all know thats not it :huh:

lol just messin w/ya.

But no, im sure that the mirror is gonna be important however i dont think its gonna be so for harry and sirius. Its more likely that he'll be able to use it with someone living like Ron and Hermione. Im not sure who originally suggested this but thats the best ive heard so far

I didn't cry when I thought Sirius was actually dead the second time I read it, but I started bursting into tears when he looked down and saw the mirror, and he actually thought he could talk to Sirius.

I'm actually glad he broke the mirror. It was symbolic gesture of him giving up on his "original" family.

Like the mirror of erised showed the parents he'd never know, that small mirror was the source of communication with the godfather, who would never be a parent. Harry had hoped to hold on to Sirius as a way of getting back the family he never had, but he has to let go and find his own.
The Mirror of Erised! Maybe Harry will get over Sirius's death by seeing Sirius in the Mirror of Erised.

and since no one can get into 12 GP, then the logical suspect is Kreacher.


No, Dumbledore is the secret keeper for 12 GP, so there is no reason why they can't still get in and continue to use it as the headquarters for the OotP.

JKR loved Sirius, and we all know she didn't even want to kill him off, which leads me to believe that there definately was a reason for Sirius' death. On her website she said she did not want to kill him, but she had to and there is a reason for all of this and that we will get an explaination. Though I do not believe Sirius is alive, and that we will ever see him again in human form, we have not seen the last of him.

If only, if only...I was heartbroken when Harry actually remembered the mirrors, and screamed (inside my head, I was eating dinner at the time and mashed-potatoes don't stay put in an open mouth) when I thought how Sirius would be alive...if only. Although I was very sad for Harry, it was an excellent touch...it made me feel more connected to the story, and I like that.

I don't know what the significance of the mirror is but I can't help but wonder why harry kept the pieces

I remember reading somewere saying that Harry was never meant to look in the mirror during Book 5? Something like that, but I was wondering. What if he looked in the mirror now, what would he see?

I was extremly sad for Harry though when he found the mirror, just the thought of being able to have solved the hole problem. I think it was one of the saddest parts of the septology (but of course, we don't have books 6 or 7 so...).

JK Rowling mentioned something about this on her site, I think. Harry didn't want to get Sirius into more trouble and kind of deliberately forgot about the mirror. According to JK it wouldn't have helped "as much as you think". It will come into play later in books 6 & 7, which to me indicates that he'll have to be able to fix the one he smashed.

I was yelling at the book to make Harry remeber the mirrors! ALthough that didnt do any good...lol

But the mirros could have saved Sirius's life, if harry had remebered.

But the mirros could have saved Sirius's life, if harry had remebered.

It's possible, but I have a feeling that Kreacher might've intervened. Harry was to kind of yell through the mirror and get Sirius's attention on the other end. Seems like the kind of thing that Kreacher would've tried to prevent happening, like when he lied to Harry in the fire. I prefer to think that it wouldn't have helped - that way Harry doesn't have to dwell on it and can move on with his life. :)

Hey people!

Jo has said that the mirror will be in Book 6, but what for? Well I pulled out my PoA DVD (which is awsome by the way) and watched the interview with Jo and Cuaron again and I got a big idea. Remember when Jo said that some scenes foreshadow what will come in the next books? Well one of those scenes (in my opinion) was at the end where Sirius tells Harry that,
"the ones that love us never really leave us, and you can always find them in here (pointing to Harry's heart)."
Now why would this be important? When Harry looked at the mirror at the end of Ootp he expected Sirius alive to speak to him. He was expecting someone at the other end (meaning the second mirror).
Look at the quote again. I believe that if Harry recognizes that Sirius is alive within him and just casually looks at the mirror and is thinking of him he will see Sirius again. Now think about this, isn't this the same way that the Mirror of Erised works. You only see the things that are reflected inside us as our deepest desires. Harry will see Sirius alive within him, and who knows maybe others?

I can't help feeling that it was odd to give Harry the mirror and then have him forget all about it. Sirius still could have died, JKR could have him intercept the mirror rather than the fire place. Of course if it is going to be in future books then it is relevant, but he could have found it at Sirius' house and just kept it or there are millions of other ways that he could have got it that didn't annoy me while I was reading the escape from Hogwarts scene. I was yelling the whole time USE THE MIRROR! It makes sense that the mirror exists, but to 'forget' it is mind baffling to me. Subconscious forgetting as well.

Jo answers how the maurders map reappeared on her website...
As for not remembering the mirror... well.. what fun would it be if everybody survived...
and maybe.... maybe... we'll be seeing Siruis..

I'm sure the purpose of the mirrors was meant to be far more than for harry and sirius to talk, otherwise harry would have remembered them....
JK does say they will come back in book six
It's not really Harrys fault he forgot about it... he had a lot of other things on his mind, remember? and maybe if he had tried to get to Sirius through it instead of the fire, it would have worked... but apparently he wasnt meant to....
I know none of us were asking for Sirius to die.... but apparently there is a purpose in it or it wouldnt have happened.

Yeah he may have had other things on his mind I just thought it would have been better to use another excuse than 'oops, I forgot' or perhaps changed the timing of the when the mirror was given to him. He may have lost the mirror, someone like Lupin could have told him he found it in Kreacher's bed and so on that could have added to the drama and tension, like trying to look for the mirror when he thinks Sirius is dying. I know it can't be helped and there is probably a reason (or possibly a reason made to cover a mistake) but the forgetting bugged me when I was reading through the whole saving sirius chapters.

I was so mad that Harry had forgotten the mirror. But then maybe someone would have prevented Harry talking to Sirius. I practically cried when Harry was sayig loud and clear Sirius's name in front of the mirror. However, I do think we will see the mirror again. The mirror was brought up in only two scenes. I just think it was an intruduction for the future books.

Did it really matter if Harry had remembered the mirror before hand? Harry said himself that no matter what it was he knew that he wouldn't use it. He didn't tell anyone about it. It was just between him and Sirius. I was sad about the mirror thing too, but do believe that it is important. It's too...convenient that the mirror was shattered. I think it is a classic red herring. :cool:

The map was last mentioned in book 4 when Jr. is under the Veritaserum (we also learn there that DD didn't know about the map). It is not mentioned for several hundred pages until the tri use it to get to Hagrid's house. The mystery of how he got it back is unexplained. I'd like to see JKR tell us that Dobby stole it out of the office of Moody and gave it back to Harry.

The map was last mentioned in book 4 when Jr. is under the Veritaserum (we also learn there that DD didn't know about the map). It is not mentioned for several hundred pages until the tri use it to get to Hagrid's house. The mystery of how he got it back is unexplained. I'd like to see JKR tell us that Dobby stole it out of the office of Moody and gave it back to Harry.
JKR said (on her website) that Harry simply took the map off of the desk after the inquiry. No magic, nothing special, he saw it laying on the desk and quitely picked it up and pocketed it...

I was so mad that Harry had forgotten the mirror. But then maybe someone would have prevented Harry talking to Sirius. I practically cried when Harry was sayig loud and clear Sirius's name in front of the mirror. However, I do think we will see the mirror again. The mirror was brought up in only two scenes. I just think it was an intruduction for the future books. I think that the mirror will definately come up again. Yes, it was a very emotional part of the book when Harry realized that he could have used the mirror. But JKR wouldn't just introduce an object like that for about 2 paragraphs of the entire book. Something as special as the mirror must have some sort of important part to be played in future books.

I forgot about the mirrors until Harry remembered them, and when he did I was sure that he would be able to talk to Sirius one last time, even though he was dead...but, alas, he wasn't. I agree with all of you on this thread that the mirrors will come up agian and play a part in the remaining 2 books. Also, the mirror that Sirius had was at Grimmauld Place, correct? So, if Harry could find the other mirror, couldn't he use it for contacting Ron/Hermione, or someone important in the Order, ex: Dumbledore? Or were the mirrors strictly for Harry/James-Sirius contact?

Harry did say right after Sirius gave him the mirror that he would never use it. Harry explained that he didn't want to be the one person who made Sirius leave Grimmauld Place, which I thought was a pretty smart decision. Sirius does seem to get himself into a lot of trouble for his godson.

I thought the dream was a trap from the begining. Then when Hermonie suggested that it was not real I knew I was right. I was yelling at Harry not to be so stupid, but you have to remember that he usually does not think before he acts, especially when it comes to Serius. That is exactly what Voldy was counting on. Then I was willing him to find the mirror, but alas he had taken the vow never to use what was in the package to call Serius and then he forgot about it.
I think the mirror will come into play again, maybe the different pieces can communicate or if you look into a piece it will take you to be with the rest of the mirror.

I thought of the mirror as soon as Harry wanted to find out if Sirius was alive, but I guess JK wanted Sirius to die, maybe we will understand in later books.

I just remember when Harry initially got the gift he vowed never to use it because he though Sirius was being reckless and Harry didn't want to be responsible for Sirius leaving 12 Grimmauld Place. It was such tragic irony that in the end he was responsible for Sirius leaving, and that it was all in vain. If Harry would have just used the mirrors to contact Sirius when he was supposed to be being tortured, Kreacher couldn't have fooled Harry. And then it was so sad when Harry found them after the fact and thought he would be able to talk to Sirius through them. I cried. But J.K. says that they will somehow make an appearance in a future book, so hopefully that will turn out better for Harry.

J.K.Rowling says on her website that when Sirius gave Harry the mirror he put it to the back of his mind and he knew he would never use it because he didn't want to risk the whereabouts of Sirius by asking for help for something small like Snape being nasty to him.
I just wish he hadn't done this :upset: :upset: :upset:

It was Ironic that Harry was the reason that Serius left the House. I think this is aluding to the fact that if you try to protect someone too much you cause them to do reckless things. I think this shows that everyine, including DD and Mrs. Weasley, needs to stop trying to protect Harry from who he is.

The fifth book just angered me the whole time I was reading it. Harry is such an emotional little girl and Umbridge is a wizatch.

people say that harry can use the mirror to contact sirius whilst he is in the mirror but how does he know he has it on him?
i think thast instead of being used to speak to sirus it will become more helpful in other ways, such as a link between harry and the trio or them and dumbledore?

I wonder why JK did that. because really she left harry feeling guilty because of that. he must feel responsible for sirius death - as he does anyways - but worse - he cold have actually prevented the whole ministry thing...

if she gives him this kind of thing to deal with I think there MUST be more to the mirrors than just the possibility to communicate...

just had a brain wave! if harry used the mirror then he would have known that sirius was ok and then consequently not gone but on the other side of the coin if he hadnt gone then no one would know that voldemort had returned, thus not helping the overall story much!

I thought it was quite dissapointing when I found out that Harry was a idiotic person to forget the mirror. Such ties to idiotism.(James)

It was Ironic that Harry was the reason that Serius left the House. I think this is aluding to the fact that if you try to protect someone too much you cause them to do reckless things. I think this shows that everyine, including DD and Mrs. Weasley, needs to stop trying to protect Harry from who he is.

It is also truer to life. It is easy to over look the obvious when under stress. And if I am remembering correctly, it is one of the few gifts that he doesn't use. He wears Vernon's socks but never looks at Sirius's mirror!

yeah. i was so mad when he opened it and it was a two way mirror.

Actually, you can't really blame Harry for not remembering, because he never knew what it was that Sirius gave him in the first place. Frankly, I think it's his fault he didn't want to open in it in the first place.

Even if Harry had opened the gift, I don't think he would have remembered to use it to see if Sirius would be at GP12. For one, he thought the vision of Sirius being tortured was real, so why would he even waste time to check? Two, he forgot about Snape being in the OotP, so he obviously wasn't thinking...which would be Three, he wouldn't have thought to use the mirrors anyways because he was only focused on finding a way to rescue Sirius, not to communicate.

If he didn't want to communicate and find out if Sirius was safe, why would he use Umbridges fireplace then? Wouldn't that be an even bigger waste of time?

I got really mad at him for not talking to Snape, and I was also thinking, was DD office sealed to Harry? He could have gone and asked Phinius Nigelus to check on Serius.

Reading about the pices made me think of a movie I saw over twenty years ago, on lazer disc. In it a girl is attached. The attacher is killed and in the struggle a mirror is broken. She pickes up the pieces, but some slivers are left and I think one piece gets stuck in her shoe. The since the man;s reflection was in the mirror when he died, the pieces of the mirror allowed his soul to come back to wherever the pieces of the mirror were.
What id since Serius' reflection was the last one that the mirror saw, it will allow something of Seruis to come back, like a Ojei board, The board with letter's on it, so you can g et messages from spirits that have passed.

a little bit of frustration in the story would give tha author a lot of fun to see the readers' reaction. the mirror was just a little bit of frustration in my opinion but there will be a futher explanation about the mirror so that we won't be tempted throw eggs and dirty looks at the author if we get the chance to meet.

a little bit of frustration in the story would give tha author a lot of fun to see the readers' reaction. the mirror was just a little bit of frustration in my opinion but there will be a futher explanation about the mirror so that we won't be tempted throw eggs and dirty looks at the author if we get the chance to meet.
It also adds a twist because there was a way that Sirius' death could have been prevented. A bit off-topic but I know we've probably all heard of alfred Hichcock's "Psycho". Well just before the shower scene when the girl is killed she admits that she’s going to head back and hand back the money. Her death is then made worse by the fact that she was going to redeem herself rather than if she’d been murdered a criminal.

Harry had to forget about the mirror, because it is needed further on in the story, but if he had used it, he would not have learned anything about how Voldy can use his own feelings against him.

I was very upset at how stupid Harry was to first of all forget about the mirror (he could have known that Sirius was okay and maybe JKR could have kept him ALIVE!) and then being stupid and breaking it to pieces!!! UH! So frustrating!!!
(There are loads of posts like this but I chose yours! Yay!)

I think there is a reason for everything Rowling puts in her books; I mean come on, there are a lot worse ways of dying than just falling through a veil. Plus, according to Dumbledore, there are a lot worse things than dying period. I believe Sirius died for a reason, if that reason be only that he wouldn't die horribly and in pain at a later time. I do believe that Harry needed someone close to him to die; his parents died but he didn't know them. Cedric died but he hardly knew him either. Sirius was it. A blade has to be passed through the fire before it can really be called a sword.

JK Rowling did mention in her official site that the 2 way mirror will come to its importance in future books...
well.. I was just p*ssed off because well.. if Sirius hasn't died... but then again.. there was a reason for it,..Harry proved himself to be someone stronger.. and hopefully deal with it

Ugh. I just finished reading OOTP again and the mirror revelation breaks my heart.

That's emergency, so it's not surprising that Harry tried the "usual" way to contact Sirius, the fireplace, although we all know there is a much easier way for Harry to do this...*sigh* This is a trap anyway... And I think that the main reason why Harry forgot the 2way mirror is the thought that "I must not use this mirror, so to protect Sirius, never give him any reason to get out of this house"...

I know that Sirius's death would be completely stopped if harry had used the two-way mirror, but something tells me that we haven't seen that last of that mirror. But if Rowling does something, she does it with reason, and it was so Harry would learn that death cannot be avoided. I do wish he sa the mirror, Sirius would not have died... :upset:

Ugh. I just finished reading OOTP again and the mirror revelation breaks my heart.

Which is, I think, the point. That sometimes, saving those you love has an easy solution that you simply overlook. There is no way Harry could have remembered the mirror, being so terrified for Sirius as he was. He almost hits (or, er, shakes) Hermione for even suggesting they check before leaving for the MoM, or that this is exactly what Voldemort would wants. Even worse, he never showed her the mirror. Now SHE would have remembered. Harry just wants to get out there and save Sirius.