Romantic moments & that scene in Deathly Hallows

I think that we cannot trust in general Harry Potter fans who do not want to see anything romantic between Harry and Hermione. I think that the reaction of the midnight showers who were almost all in their early twenties is a much better judge of what was happening in that scene. I just cannot agree and do not think it is open to interpretation. I think there was tension as there was meant to be, but i am willing to agree to disagree on the matter.I'm in my early twenties, but then again, I'm a fan too. I don't, however, ship. The point of my discussing my niece and her friend wasn't to push "fandemonium shipping" status, but rather point out their pubescent hormone riddled take on the scene and their take, along with the rest of the people of all ages laughing hysterically at Dan's dance skillz trying to entertain Hermione, was zero tension/chemistry. BTW, the best friend does ship: Pinkpuppies? Is that even a ship? I dunno.

Basically, then, according to what you posted "we cannot trust in general Harry Potter fans" comes across as "we can trust zero fans of HP as to understand that part of the film, or voice their own opinion based on that scene, irrespective of shipping" and while I respect your opinion I totally, totally disagree with it. :yuhup:

I'm aware of what the actors have had to say on the issue, was aware of the dance scene before I took us all to see the film, but I truly feel the directors failed to convey what their real intent was.

I don't everything is open to interpretation in books and movies. In fact I think JKR in the books, does a great job, in terms of the couples, of not leaving it open to interpretation.

Oh, You misunderstood me.. Sorry.. When I say that I think everything is open to interpretation I mean that every person can see whatecer she/he wants to see.
Sorry, English is not my first language and I feel I'm getting lost in my own words! :yuhup:

I'm in my early twenties, but then again, I'm a fan too. I don't, however, ship. The point of my discussing my niece and her friend wasn't to push "fandemonium shipping" status, but rather point out their pubescent hormone riddled take on the scene and their take, along with the rest of the people of all ages laughing hysterically at Dan's dance skillz trying to entertain Hermione, was zero tension/chemistry. BTW, the best friend does ship: Pinkpuppies? Is that even a ship? I dunno.

Basically, then, according to what you posted "we cannot trust in general Harry Potter fans" comes across as "we can trust zero fans of HP as to understand that part of the film, or voice their own opinion based on that scene, irrespective of shipping" and while I respect your opinion I totally, totally disagree with it. :yuhup:

I'm aware of what the actors have had to say on the issue, was aware of the dance scene before I took us all to see the film, but I truly feel the directors failed to convey what their real intent was.

Well i don't "ship" either. I don't even particularly know what that means. I am just saying when you know who is going to end up with whom that takes away some of the objectivity when watching a scene. I also think the hormone driven twenty years are much more able to understand and interpret sexual tension then thirteen year olds. Not that there is anything wrong with being thirteen. We all were at one time or another. It is just a different perspective just as being a Harry Potter fan is a different perspective.

Also the dancing was not what i saw as sexual tension it was before that. When Harry sat on the camp chair and looked at Hermione. Then when he held out his hand and pulled her up and took off the locket and pulled her towards the dance floor. That was sexual tension. The dancing was dorky which ended in holding and i think a moment at the end where Harry looked at her, but Hermione did not she just walked away. I think it was much more on Harry's end then on Hermione's and like i said i blame the locket.

PS. Please understand that i also respect your opinion and your right to voice it. I just disagree.

I don't everything is open to interpretation in books and movies. In fact I think JKR in the books, does a great job, in terms of the couples, of not leaving it open to interpretation.

No, everything is not open to interpretation, but I feel this scene certainly is. I think this scene, more so than anything.

Considering the hype it's caused and leading to 3 leading main opinions/factions: people who think it's romantic and/or has sexual tension, platonic, or just don't care - I'd think it'd be wrong to say this scene is not open to interpretation since there are people who have interpreted it differently.

Whether it was or wasn't meant for open interpretation is besides the fact since different interpretations have come from it, regardless of intentions :cool:

PS. Please understand that i also respect your opinion and your right to voice it. I just disagree.No worries decarus!

Actually, I guess what I was trying to get at is that despite what the director intended, the bit in the film was just way to subtle to register. For myself and by my two teen gigglebots. In fact, they were heard to say "sexy" at the H/HR horcrux kiss. So that totally registered. :lol:

Er...I do have a confession though. Last April Fool's I may have actually...*cough*...engaged in a silly bit of fan shipping, one totally not ever established in the books and only as a gag. Gag, now there's a perfect descriptive word for that particular ship: "Jape" ... which I still have in my location status in homage to its horribleness.

Actually, she doesn't announce that in the film...though she tries to tell Harry something at #4, it's immediately shushed up and then the 7 Potters take center stage.

:hmm: As for the book, was she pregnant at the time? They were just announcing their marriage at Privet Drive near the end of July and it wasn't until September at Grimmauld Place that we learn she's pregnant. I suppose it's possible though, I think Teddy was born in April right after Easter holidays. {Because Ginny was safe at home instead of at Hogwarts when the Trio escaped Malfoy Manor, and Bill & Arthur were able to get everyone safely away from the Burrow and into hiding at Auntie Muriel's...then came Remus announcing news of Teddy's birth.} That's approximately 9 months from when Harry left Privet Drive.


Yes, you are right. She didn't announce it in the film. I think it's just because I know she becomes pregnant in the book, I took for granted that that was her announcement, lol. I'm jumping to conclusions. I guess technically she could have been trying to tell Harry anything. She could have just wanted to say her and Remus bought a new house, lol.
Or maybe it was supposed to be an announcement that they had gotten married? Had that been announced yet in the films?

Ok, I do hope her announcement was something else then, and not that she was pregnant, lol.

As for the book, I'll trust your timeline because I certainly can't remember, lol.

Well, she said something like "my husband, always the joker" before she started saying they had good news. I thought it was pretty obvious to anyone who knows she gets pregnant that she was about to announce such.

I agree, people totally see what they want to see. We know what Dan's said in an interview, to me that says the filmmaker's wanted something there, I honestly just don't see that they got what they wanted. Not by my POV or the POV of two teen girls either.

I saw nothing to that scene. I went with two 13 year old Potter fans, my niece and her best friend, and neither picked up on any tension either. They just saw Harry acting goofy trying to cheer up the very depressed Hermione.

My impression is the same as yours and your niece & friend. My thought is that Harry simply wanted to at least momentarily distract Hermione from her sadness, which worked but only for those moments. Granted, I'm an avid HP book reader, but still, I think anyone who was paying attention to the Harry/Ginny kiss in the film should have been able to figure out that's where Harry's real interests lie, and correctly interpret the dance scene.

No, everything is not open to interpretation, but I feel this scene certainly is. I think this scene, more so than anything.

Considering the hype it's caused and leading to 3 leading main opinions/factions: people who think it's romantic and/or has sexual tension, platonic, or just don't care - I'd think it'd be wrong to say this scene is not open to interpretation since there are people who have interpreted it differently.

Whether it was or wasn't meant for open interpretation is besides the fact since different interpretations have come from it, regardless of intentions :cool:

I do agree that this scene is open to interpretation.


I think anyone who was paying attention to the Harry/Ginny kiss in the film should have been able to figure out that's where Harry's real interests lie, and correctly interpret the dance scene


I don't necessarily agree with this. Harry kisses her and then she's not mentioned by him for the rest of the movie, so I think it would be very easy for those who haven't read the books to think well maybe he does like Hermione without even thinking about Ginny.

My impression is the same as yours and your niece & friend. My thought is that Harry simply wanted to at least momentarily distract Hermione from her sadness, which worked but only for those moments. Granted, I'm an avid HP book reader, but still, I think anyone who was paying attention to the Harry/Ginny kiss in the film should have been able to figure out that's where Harry's real interests lie, and correctly interpret the dance scene.

Correctly interpret as in that there was sexual tension caused by the locket between Harry and Hermione in the dance scene in my opinion. They don't really like each other in that way, but they were on their own and the locket was playing with their heads.

I do think that it is clear in the films that Hermione likes Ron, but it is less clear that Harry wants to be with Ginny.

Correctly interpret as in that there was sexual tension caused by the locket between Harry and Hermione in the dance scene in my opinion. They don't really like each other in that way, but they were on their own and the locket was playing with their heads.

I do think that it is clear in the films that Hermione likes Ron, but it is less clear that Harry wants to be with Ginny.

I don't think anything was created by the locket. Especially since Harry wasn't wearing it and he then took it off her. I don't think the locket would make Harry want Hermione in that way. That's just not how it worked, at least in the book, and nothing like that was implied in the movie.

Correctly interpret as in that there was sexual tension caused by the locket between Harry and Hermione in the dance scene in my opinion. They don't really like each other in that way, but they were on their own and the locket was playing with their heads.

I have read few people saying this - that the locket might have been playing with their heads and created this sexual tension. I just have to ask, why? What does the locket gain from their being sexual tension b/w Harry and Hermione. I understand what it gains from making Ron jealous with this supposed tension, but after Ron leaves, as far as the locket knows, he's not coming back and that's it. Why would it want to have something going on between Harry and Hermione at that point? Wouldn't it make them stronger and happier if they did end up getting together after Ron left? Sorry, I'm just confused, and I'd appreciate if someone could explain why the locket would mess with their heads like this. (Unless Voldemort is a secret Harry/Hermione shipper! Lol)

I have read few people saying this - that the locket might have been playing with their heads and created this sexual tension. I just have to ask, why? What does the locket gain from their being sexual tension b/w Harry and Hermione. I understand what it gains from making Ron jealous with this supposed tension, but after Ron leaves, as far as the locket knows, he's not coming back and that's it. Why would it want to have something going on between Harry and Hermione at that point? Wouldn't it make them stronger and happier if they did end up getting together after Ron left? Sorry, I'm just confused, and I'd appreciate if someone could explain why the locket would mess with their heads like this. (Unless Voldemort is a secret Harry/Hermione shipper! Lol)

The locket doesn't make people want each other or think about other people romantically. It plays on their insecurities and makes them feel very negative about everything. The locket didn't even have a huge effect on Harry and Hermione. Ron was the one it effected the most, so I don't see how the locket caused the sexual tension at all. Especially since Harry wasn't wearing it, and he took it off Hermione. Nothing about the locket was implied or said in the movie that would be an explanation for that dance.

Correctly interpret as in that there was sexual tension caused by the locket between Harry and Hermione in the dance scene in my opinion. They don't really like each other in that way, but they were on their own and the locket was playing with their heads.

I do think that it is clear in the films that Hermione likes Ron, but it is less clear that Harry wants to be with Ginny.

Neither Hermione nor Harry was wearing the locket in that scene. Hermione was the last to wear it, but it had the least effect on her of any of them.

I also think the film clearly shows the relationship between Harry & Ginny has deepened since HBP (where Ginny runs to help Harry with nary a thought for her own life & limb). They're very comfortable with each other, no awkwardness, and their kiss has the ease & intimacy of an ongoing relationship.

Neither Hermione nor Harry was wearing the locket in that scene. Hermione was the last to wear it, but it had the least effect on her of any of them.

I also think the film clearly shows the relationship between Harry & Ginny has deepened since HBP (where Ginny runs to help Harry with nary a thought for her own life & limb). They're very comfortable with each other, no awkwardness, and their kiss has the ease & intimacy of an ongoing relationship.

I think Harry and Ginny were still as awkward as ever. I didn't see any progression with them at all.

What i am saying is that the locket could effect them in such a way as they both believe that they will never be with the person they really want and so they give up. I don't think either of them would have been happy about it after if something had happened between the two of them because they are both in love with other people. I think if something would have happened between Harry and Hermione then it would have ruined their friendship completely.

I think Harry and Ginny were still as awkward as ever. I didn't see any progression with them at all.

I agree. I also think anyone who has only watched the films would think that Harry was attracted to Ginny, but not that she was the one that he would end up with. I do think it is clear in the films that Ron and Hermione are going to end up together, but Harry and Ginny have never even had a conversation about their feelings or anything.

I liked the dance. To me, it was a way for Harry to cheer up Hermione. I saw it like Harry was her big brother and he just wanted to cheer her up.

What i am saying is that the locket could effect them in such a way as they both believe that they will never be with the person they really want and so they give up. I don't think either of them would have been happy about it after if something had happened between the two of them because they are both in love with other people. I think if something would have happened between Harry and Hermione then it would have ruined their friendship completely.



I agree. I also think anyone who has only watched the films would think that Harry was attracted to Ginny, but not that she was the one that he would end up with. I do think it is clear in the films that Ron and Hermione are going to end up together, but Harry and Ginny have never even had a conversation about their feelings or anything.

They weren't wearing the locket though during the dance, and Hermione was very hesitant to dance with Harry even while wearing the locket. I just don't think it had anything to do with it.

Maybe Harry and Ginny will be done a little better in part 2, but if I hadn't read the books, I would be kind of shocked that he ended up with her in the epilogue.

On the topic of Tonks' pregnancy, I saw the film for a second time on Thanksgiving morning, and she clearly refers to Remus as her husband, calling him a joker after he reminds Fleur that Bill takes his steaks raw. She's also clearly about to announce that she's pregnant, but Moody cuts her off.

Addressing PotterGurl's comments re: Tonks, it's actually completely in character for her to want to participate in the Seven Potters mission regardless of whether or not she was pregnant; also, the way she starts to announce her pregnancy gives the implication that it (the pregnancy) is a fairly recent development.

Yeah, as bad as Harry and Ginny is, it's still better than Hermoine and Ron, imo. I just don't see it, never have. I dread the upcoming scene in DH2, I'll just have to block it out of my mind. :scared: Dan, as awkward as he is, was at least trying; much more than I can say for Rupert who just sits there with a silly look on his face.

But all this talk about shippers, love triangle and romance really distract from the movie and I believe it would have been better not to show any of that at all (esp. in HBP). More horcruxes, more supporting actors, less snogging and less dancing, imo.

Yeah, as bad as Harry and Ginny is, it's still better than Hermoine and Ron, imo. I just don't see it, never have. I dread the upcoming scene in DH2, I'll just have to block it out of my mind. :scared: Dan, as awkward as he is, was at least trying; much more than I can say for Rupert who just sits there with a silly look on his face.

But all this talk about shippers, love triangle and romance really distract from the movie and I believe it would have been better not to show any of that at all (esp. in HBP). More horcruxes, more supporting actors, less snogging and less dancing, imo.

I'll just have to completely and totally disagree with you on the Harry/Ginny Ron/Hermione, Rupert thing. I think Rupert plays being in love with Hermione perfectly. He's very much perfected the look of longing and love. I also think he's was fantastic in this movie.

Romance is a part of the story though. There's just no way around it. This isn't Kloves or Yates story to tell, it is JKR's story, so while not every details stays the same, the romances do play a part in the story. Especially in the DH and Ron leaving. That's just not something you can leave out.

I'll just have to completely and totally disagree with you on the Harry/Ginny Ron/Hermione, Rupert thing. I think Rupert plays being in love with Hermione perfectly. He's very much perfected the look of longing and love. I also think he's was fantastic in this movie.

Romance is a part of the story though. There's just no way around it. This isn't Kloves or Yates story to tell, it is JKR's story, so while not every details stays the same, the romances do play a part in the story. Especially in the DH and Ron leaving. That's just not something you can leave out.

Yeah, and the "love conquers all" thing wouldn't really work if romances weren't in the series ;)

On the topic of Tonks' pregnancy, I saw the film for a second time on Thanksgiving morning, and she clearly refers to Remus as her husband, calling him a joker after he reminds Fleur that Bill takes his steaks raw. She's also clearly about to announce that she's pregnant, but Moody cuts her off.

Addressing PotterGurl's comments re: Tonks, it's actually completely in character for her to want to participate in the Seven Potters mission regardless of whether or not she was pregnant; also, the way she starts to announce her pregnancy gives the implication that it (the pregnancy) is a fairly recent development.

Oh, ok. The marriage has already taken place, so that does increase the likelihood that her announcement was about her pregnancy.

I agree that going on the mission is in Tonk's character. I'm sure nobody pulled her arm to do it; she volunteered. I guess I'm bothered the others (Moody, Mrs. Weasley, Mr. Weasley, etc.) didn't talk her out of it. But Tonks probably insisted...and I assume Lupin didn't object so nobody else felt it was their place to say otherwise.

Just seems a bit recklist to me, nonetheless. Thank goodness Tonks made it through safely.

Oh I know you can't leave it out. It's just I believe in the adage that if it's not done well, don't do it at all.

Imo, it's been awkward at best throughout the series (and cringe-worthy at worst), more so than the book implied. The only real spark was about a few seconds in the dance and of course, the locket scene.

Oh I know you can't leave it out. It's just I believe in the adage that if it's not done well, don't do it at all.

Imo, it's been awkward at best throughout the series (and cringe-worthy at worst), more so than the book implied. The only real spark was about a few seconds in the dance and of course, the locket scene.

I thought Ron and Hermione were done well in this movie and I definitely saw a lot of spark with them. Harry and Ginny have never been done well in these films IMO. They are just totally an afterthought in these movies.



I agree that going on the mission is in Tonk's character. I'm sure nobody pulled her arm to do it; she volunteered. I guess I'm bothered the others (Moody, Mrs. Weasley, Mr. Weasley, etc.) didn't talk her out of it. But Tonks probably insisted...and I assume Lupin didn't object so nobody else felt it was their place to say otherwise.

Did any of them know she was pregnant?

Did any of them know she was pregnant?

Based on the movie, I'm assuming they did because Moody knew. He cut her off, which makes it seem like he knew what she was about to say. I can't see why he would know if nobody else did.

Still see nothing wrong with it, though, if Tonks was pregnant at the time.

According to Rowling, Lily Potter was in the Order last time and she'd have been pregnant at the time. Alice Longbottom, mother of Neville, was a famous Auror same as her husband, Frank. She'd have been working too, I presume, whilst pregnant with Neville.

In addition to what's been mentioned above (re: Tonks, Lily, and Alice), there's also the instance in DH - the novel - of Tonks charging off to Hogwarts to help in the final battle against Voldemort and the Death Eaters.

I'd also like to point out that, even if the other Order members knew of Tonks' pregnancy and disagreed with her decision to participate in the Seven Potters mission, there's actually nothing they could do to stop her, given that she's of-age and fully capable of making her own decisions; the only person who could've legitimately objected is Lupin, and, even then, given what we know of Tonks' personality, she'd probably have done what she wanted anyway (that's how they ended up together in the first place).

The protectionist behaviour people assume towards pregnant women really annoys me. It's fairly condescending to assume pregnant women need your help to make decisions about their bodies. So I'm very glad we don't see anyone trying to tell Tonks what to do and what not to do for the Order because of her pregnancy.

You are so right!! I just returned from watching the movie and it was soooooooo good. I should know that shippers always exaggerate everything and shippers on both sides love to exaggerate whenever Harry and Hermione are in a scene together. It's so annoying when they blow everything out of proportion.

This. :relax:

... Why are people going on about that dance scene? It felt very platonic. Clearly Harry was just trying to cheer up Hermione and she pretty much went back to being sad immediately and throughout the whole thing. Harry was not a creep at all. :D It was exactly like the book and it was nice to see Harry actually being a friend instead of being selfish like he was in the book. The scene actually improved his character. The scene itself was weird though but I can see why they might have felt the need to improve it.

I agree with all of this. :) The dance scene itself is kind of weird -- it produced gales of laughter on my second viewing :D -- but talk about a storm in a teacup ...

(And I find Harry's behaviour to Hermione in the book pretty selfish, too.)

I agree with you about Ron's characterisation in the film. :tu:

Yeah, and the "love conquers all" thing wouldn't really work if romances weren't in the series ;)

But to me the 'love conquers all' motif has far more to do with a selfless kind of love that transcends (but not excludes) other kinds of love, including the romantic kind. Harry's ultimate act of selflessness is to sacrifice himself to Voldemort because the only way Voldemort can be defeated is through Harry 'dying' -- Harry is also dying for people he doesn't know as well as the people he loves.

I'm not denigrating the adult romantic relationships in the story ... but I do think that the teenage romances in HP have far more to do with hormones. :lol: Rowling's kids were growing up, and it would have been unrealistic not to include elements of romance and (toned down) sexuality. :cool:

I think the R/H relationship works well enough on screen.

They weren't wearing the locket though during the dance, and Hermione was very hesitant to dance with Harry even while wearing the locket. I just don't think it had anything to do with it.

They weren't wearing the locket, but they had been around it a lot longer by this point. I think that it could easily be part of the cause of their romantic moment. Ginny didn't wear the diary.

The protectionist behaviour people assume towards pregnant women really annoys me. It's fairly condescending to assume pregnant women need your help to make decisions about their bodies. So I'm very glad we don't see anyone trying to tell Tonks what to do and what not to do for the Order because of her pregnancy.

I actually don't think people are talking about protecting the pregnant woman, but about protecting the baby. I agree though at a point where the whole world is being taken over by an evil psychopath maybe it is worth the risk.

They weren't wearing the locket, but they had been around it a lot longer by this point. I think that it could easily be part of the cause of their romantic moment. Ginny didn't wear the diary. They each took turns wearing the locket and when it was their turn it affected each of them in different "negative" ways and none of it was ever romantic in nature. It affected Ron the worst of all, and played on his fears and jealousy.

The diary, IMO, isn't comparable. Ginny didn't wear it, I know. But she did do the one thing that a Horcrux needs in order to garner strength, she poured her heart and soul into it. The same cannot be said for any of the Trio whilst wearing that locket, be it in the book OR in the film.

I actually don't think people are talking about protecting the pregnant woman, but about protecting the baby.Yeah, I get that, but for me - the tossing in the pregnancy at that point veered away from the established book canon i.e. Tonks/Remus were announcing marriage at #4, not a forthcoming baby. Obviously there has to be some time table for that type of exposition in the film and having pruned the whole Harry/Remus argument at Grimmauld Place, the idea of "she's pregnant" had to go in somewhere.

So it seems I was the only one who thought Hermione turns to Lupin after Ron and Tonks return to the Burrow.:lol: I asked a friend of mine what she thought of it but she didn't remember the scene. It wasn't until I read some comments here that I thought I might be wrong. I guess I'll have to see the film a third time to see how wrong I was.:lol:

Harry running in to join Hermione & Ron's hug...
I thought it looked a bit funny, lol. It almost looked a bit intrusive (reminiscent of Ron squeezing between Harry & Ginny on the couch in HBP). But on the other hand, it looked a bit child-like, as if Harry was a child running to hug his mom and dad.
This is exactly what I thought when I saw it the first time in that clip. Besides, I too adore the trio hug as a wonderful moment between three friends who deeply care for each other. Shipping aside, and I personally am admittedly a die-hard R/Hr shipper, but the trio friendship is just so strong, heartwarming and wonderful.

Back to Harry & Ginny for a second because this thought just occurred to me...Ron doesn't even know about the two of them in the movie, does he? The scene where he joins them in the couch implies that he may have suspected, and didn't quite approve...Other than that, there's no indication that he really knows. Hermione teases about it, but that's it...
Maybe Harry & Ginny are supposed to come as a surprise to everyone (apart from Hermione) in the end. Well, George knows (but he won't be around :( )I think the movies have established that Ron knows. At the end of HBP, Hermione tells Harry that Ron is okay with him and Ginny but they just should try and tone down the snogging when he's present. :lol:

Well, she said something like "my husband, always the joker" before she started saying they had good news. I thought it was pretty obvious to anyone who knows she gets pregnant that she was about to announce such.I didn't notice this, but a friend claims she could see Tonks covering her pregnant belly with her hands in this scene. Mind you, not nine months pregnant, but still already obvious.

But to me the 'love conquers all' motif has far more to do with a selfless kind of love that transcends (but not excludes) other kinds of love, including the romantic kind. Harry's ultimate act of selflessness is to sacrifice himself to Voldemort because the only way Voldemort can be defeated is through Harry 'dying' -- Harry is also dying for people he doesn't know as well as the people he loves.

I'm not denigrating the adult romantic relationships in the story ... but I do think that the teenage romances in HP have far more to do with hormones. :lol: Rowling's kids were growing up, and it would have been unrealistic not to include elements of romance and (toned down) sexuality. :cool:

I think the R/H relationship works well enough on screen.

Maybe the teenage romance thing wasn't the best example of "love conquers all" since teenage romance isn't exactly "selfless love". I guess I was just trying to use that to explain why the romance aspect couldn't be completely included in the HP series. I think I was referring to Harry deciding to end his relationship with Ginny in order to keep her safe. Not the best example on my behalf :lol:


(And I find Harry's behaviour to Hermione in the book pretty selfish, too.)



Glad to see I'm not the only one who was disappointed with how Harry acted in DH.

Yeah, I get that, but for me - the tossing in the pregnancy at that point veered away from the established book canon i.e. Tonks/Remus were announcing marriage at #4, not a forthcoming baby. Obviously there has to be some time table for that type of exposition in the film and having pruned the whole Harry/Remus argument at Grimmauld Place, the idea of "she's pregnant" had to go in somewhere.

She was pregnant during the seven potters scene in the book as well.

The protectionist behaviour people assume towards pregnant women really annoys me. It's fairly condescending to assume pregnant women need your help to make decisions about their bodies. So I'm very glad we don't see anyone trying to tell Tonks what to do and what not to do for the Order because of her pregnancy.


I actually don't think people are talking about protecting the pregnant woman, but about protecting the baby.

Exactly, Decarus.

I was referring to how the 7 Potters mission but the baby at risk--it was not about being condescening toward Tonks as if she needs telling what and what not to do. Of course pregnant women do not need help about what to do with their bodies. Some women work right up until they give birth, and I'd expect Tonks to be that type and to continue working with the Order.

Just common sense though, that pregnant women are adviced by doctors to not participate in strenous activities so they they do not harm the baby and cause miscarriage. With Moody presenting that they could die at any moment and that the mission would be risky, I just found it risky that Tonks should participate in this particular mission because had something gone wrong and she got hit with a curse or killed at that point, that obviously would have been a terrible tragedy, more tragic than had it been Tonk's life alone at stake. That was my point--not that pregnant women need to be treated with kid-gloves or something.
Yet, it was up to Tonks and Lupin, so if they decided it was ok, there was nothing anyone else could do. I just felt it was bad judgment from the film's perspective to hint at Tonks being pregnant at that point because it could have easily been Tonks that got killed/hurt instead of Moody.


I think the movies have established that Ron knows. At the end of HBP, Hermione tells Harry that Ron is okay with him and Ginny but they just should try and tone down the snogging when he's present.
I don't remember that part! I need to watch again, lol. That makes me laugh to think Ron ran off to Hermione to figure out what's going on between his best friend and sister. That would have been cute to show in the movie, lol.

She was pregnant during the seven potters scene in the book as well.That is not how I read it. There's zero announcement of pregnancy there at the end of July, the book gave the pronouncement of marriage at #4 Privet Drive.

In fact, it's at least a month later that Remus reveals to the Trio, at Grimmauld's Place, that Tonks is expecting. Again, Teddy was born following the Easter holidays in April, so it would fit within the timeline of events, but she'd be "just" beginning early 1st trimester during "The Seven Potters" and it normally takes a woman between 4-8 weeks to realize they might be expecting.

Could she have been? Sure. Do we know for definite? :no:

If they didn't indicate her pregnancy, or even attempt to indicate it as with the Privet Drive scene within the context of Part 1, then it sure would be a whoppingly unexpected eye opener come Part 2, yes?

That is not how I read it. There's zero announcement of pregnancy there at the end of July, the book gave the pronouncement of marriage at #4 Privet Drive.

They move Harry from privet drive two days before his birthday. Then they celebrated his birthday at the burrow. Lupin looked unhappy and Tonks looked radiant. Meaning she was pregnant and Lupin knew and was unhappy about it. Like you said it usually takes a few weeks to find out if you are pregnant, so she had to have been pregnant during the seven potters battle which was two days earlier.

They move Harry from privet drive two days before his birthday. Then they celebrated his birthday at the burrow. Lupin looked unhappy and Tonks looked radiant. Meaning she was pregnant and Lupin knew and was unhappy about it. Like you said it usually takes a few weeks to find out if you are pregnant, so she had to have been pregnant during the seven potters battle which was two days earlier.
Or she just learned about it that very day and decided to share the splendid news at Harry's party. :yuhup:

You know, in other words expecting but not necessarily knowing about it at the time "the 7 Potters" happens. So the others wouldn't know or act overly concerned for something they were entirely unaware of.

Okay, I know I'm a bit behind here but after watching the movie again I have an answer to who Ron 'thanks' when he returns to the Burrow after the Seven Potters scene. He says it as soon as Hermione hugs him, which is before Tonks says that he deserves it because he was brilliant. So it is DEFINATELY Hermione he is thanking! :)

I also think that Tonks looks a bit bigger in the Seven Potters scene, but that may just be me reading too much into things! I didn't see her try to cover up a baby bump though.

Okay, I know I'm a bit behind here but after watching the movie again I have an answer to who Ron 'thanks' when he returns to the Burrow after the Seven Potters scene. He says it as soon as Hermione hugs him, which is before Tonks says that he deserves it because he was brilliant. So it is DEFINATELY Hermione he is thanking! :)

Thanks for clarifying! I realized this today in class (yes, I think about Harry Potter sometimes when I should be teaching class...I am horrible). It is Ron's "thanks" that prompts Tonks to say 'he deserves that'. My confusion and dislike of the line was correct. I just find it odd you would thank someone for a hug...

I thought there were a lot of wonderful little moments between Ron and Hermione in this. I especially like the little detail that they probably fell asleep holding hands during their first night a Grimmauld Place.

I assume That scene refers to the dance in the tent so I'll just jump right in. For me I definitely saw it as a really innocent and dorky dance between two really good friends. It reminds me of some of the stuff I try to do when whenever my best friend is feeling down.

I know that Yates or whoever explain that he wanted there to be sexual tension between the two, yeah, sure, there was but it didn't last throughout the whole scene. Anyways, sometimes whatever the director says doesn't always mean it works or should be interpreted that way.

I think the two parts that I could see being interpreted with sexual tension is the first part, when he's taking off the locket, and the last part, where Hermione is standing there, still looking distraught and heartbroken.

I
I assume That scene refers to the dance in the tent so I'll just jump right in. For me I definitely saw it as a really innocent and dorky dance between two really good friends. It reminds me of some of the stuff I try to do when whenever my best friend is feeling down.

I know that Yates or whoever explain that he wanted there to be sexual tension between the two, yeah, sure, there was but it didn't last throughout the whole scene. Anyways, sometimes whatever the director says doesn't always mean it works or should be interpreted that way.


I think that maybe what Yates wanted out of it with the "sexual tensions" bit was not an intentional seduction but one that builds out of the situation. I understand that they were creating "sexual tension", but that doesn't have to mean that it was about Harry lusting after Hermione. I think it could have started for Harry as an attempt to brighten Hermione's mood and as sometimes happens in a given situation, the tensions build. Obviously, not what either of them planned or wanted, as witnessed by Hermione walking away.

I think that maybe what Yates wanted out of it with the "sexual tensions" bit was not an intentional seduction but one that builds out of the situation. I understand that they were creating "sexual tension", but that doesn't have to mean that it was about Harry lusting after Hermione. I think it could have started for Harry as an attempt to brighten Hermione's mood and as sometimes happens in a given situation, the tensions build. Obviously, not what either of them planned or wanted, as witnessed by Hermione walking away.

:clap: :clap: :clap: I think that's a pretty spot-on analysis. I still don't see - and will never see - Harry attempting to seduce her or lusting after her in this scene. I think your description is exactly what they were hinting at when they described how they wanted the scene to play out (whether or not you see it is another story). There is an unintentional "what if?"/could it go this way moment of sexual tension in Harry's attempt to cheer his very despondent and depressed friend up. It flickers for a moment and then passes.

:clap: :clap: :clap: I think that's a pretty spot-on analysis. I still don't see - and will never see - Harry attempting to seduce her or lusting after her in this scene. I think your description is exactly what they were hinting at when they described how they wanted the scene to play out (whether or not you see it is another story). There is an unintentional "what if?"/could it go this way moment of sexual tension in Harry's attempt to cheer his very despondent and depressed friend up. It flickers for a moment and then passes.

Thanks. :)
I want to find this interview with Yates to see how he stated it. Sometimes people just hear the words and not what they are really saying. They heard "we want sexual tension" and assumed they wanted Harry going after Hermione. Sexual tension can happen even when it is not wanted (by either party). I think that is the case here (though I didn't really see any), it was unintentional. Neither one acted on it and the moment was gone.

I really didn't feel as if there were any romantic moments in this film, even when Harry and Ginny kissed back at the Burrow. Their romance seems a bit stale to me. I'm glad George was there to break it up. :)

The H/Hr dancing scene was so gorgeous. I loved this little addition to the story. I don't believe Harry was trying to seduce Hermione, just attempting to cheer her up as she was obviously feeling distraught after Ron had left. Did you see how dorky he was? I'm just not sure if that's the best way of trying to seduce someone:D. Moments like this make me believe in these characters and these situations even more, as if they actually exist. It's one of my favorite parts of the film series. When I was watching them, I couldn't help but think back to everything they've been through together and how much they've grown. It was a nice little reminder.

I think that maybe what Yates wanted out of it with the "sexual tensions" bit was not an intentional seduction but one that builds out of the situation. I understand that they were creating "sexual tension", but that doesn't have to mean that it was about Harry lusting after Hermione. I think it could have started for Harry as an attempt to brighten Hermione's mood and as sometimes happens in a given situation, the tensions build. Obviously, not what either of them planned or wanted, as witnessed by Hermione walking away.

MsBinns beat me to it, but spot on! :tu:

This is exactly what I personally think this scene was when people point out that Yates wanted it to have "sexual tension". Your explanation is what I interpreted the intentional "sexual tension" :agree:

I really didn't feel as if there were any romantic moments in this film, even when Harry and Ginny kissed back at the Burrow. Their romance seems a bit stale to me. I'm glad George was there to break it up. :)

I didn't see that as romantic either. It seems that they are making the H/G more into an established relationship rather than them being in the brand new phase. I think they are also trying to show it as being more of a "mature" type rather than the typical teen romance. And George was very funny there. :D


The H/Hr dancing scene was so gorgeous. I loved this little addition to the story. I don't believe Harry was trying to seduce Hermione, just attempting to cheer her up as she was obviously feeling distraught after Ron had left. Did you see how dorky he was? I'm just not sure if that's the best way of trying to seduce someone:D. Moments like this make me believe in these characters and these situations even more, as if they actually exist. It's one of my favorite parts of the film series. When I was watching them, I couldn't help but think back to everything they've been through together and how much they've grown. It was a nice little reminder


Aww, such a nice visual. I can see them all growing up before my eyes.

MsBinns beat me to it, but spot on! :tu:

This is exactly what I personally think this scene was when people point out that Yates wanted it to have "sexual tension". Your explanation is what I interpreted the intentional "sexual tension" :agree:


WOW! I actually made sense? :lol: My thoughts don't usually come out that coherent. And from someone who is in a much younger age group than I, it is nice to see the same understanding of this. :p
Now I need to find that Yates interview.

WOW! I actually made sense? :lol: My thoughts don't usually come out that coherent. And from someone who is in a much younger age group than I, it is nice to see the same understanding of this. :p
Now I need to find that Yates interview.

More so than I could ever make sense on this scene :D I think I tried explaining this several days ago, but it came out as a jumble and I'm sure I irritated a person or two because they misunderstood me :( And no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't properly articulate my thoughts without confusing some people.

It's a complicated thing to explain without rambling :D

As for that scene, when I watch it, I can't help but get an incredible and sad rush of overwhelming nostalgia :( When I watch this and think back to the beginning when they were just kids, it's incredible to think that we've grown up with them. And even now, they're practically still kids going through something most people couldn't imagine. Just seeing them take a minute from their crushing responsibility is explained in the song that was playing.

Seriously, watch this scene when you get the chance, and think back to when the trio were kids in SS/PS or CoS. And how the trio interacted early in their friendship and look at them now. I know Ron isn't in this scene, but it's still remarkable, nonetheless. And overwhelming :(

I really didn't feel as if there were any romantic moments in this film, even when Harry and Ginny kissed back at the Burrow. Their romance seems a bit stale to me. I'm glad George was there to break it up. :)

The H/Hr dancing scene was so gorgeous. I loved this little addition to the story. I don't believe Harry was trying to seduce Hermione, just attempting to cheer her up as she was obviously feeling distraught after Ron had left. Did you see how dorky he was? I'm just not sure if that's the best way of trying to seduce someone:D. Moments like this make me believe in these characters and these situations even more, as if they actually exist. It's one of my favorite parts of the film series. When I was watching them, I couldn't help but think back to everything they've been through together and how much they've grown. It was a nice little reminder.

LOL! Yes, his dancing was very dorky. Not at all seductive. I'd imagine if he was trying to be seductive, he would have attempted to be smoother. :D
The dorky dancing I think just further displays the depth of their friendship. Harry is completely unashamed to look like a fool and a complete dork in front of Hermione just so she can laugh at him. Now that's a good friend, lol.

I think the two parts that I could see being interpreted with sexual tension is the first part, when he's taking off the locket, and the last part, where Hermione is standing there, still looking distraught and heartbroken.
I agree. Those are the only two parts where there is possible tension.

While that last part is a bit of a pregnant pause, a "what if" moment, I also think it can be interpreted as Harry silently pleading for Hermione to not turn away just yet, not because he's feeling lust, but because he doesn't want the light-hearted moment to be over yet. He's not ready to go back to reality. He originally was just trying to make her feel better, but goofing around with her had made him feel better too.
There's a look of longing on Harry's face-- and whether that longing is for a kiss, to keep dancing and goofing around, or whatever, I think it all boils down to simply longing to feel better and escape the somber atmosphere.

While that last part is a bit of a pregnant pause, a "what if" moment, I also think it can be interpreted as Harry silently pleading for Hermione to not turn away just yet, not because he's feeling lust, but because he doesn't want the light-hearted moment to be over yet. He's not ready to go back to reality. He originally was just trying to make her feel better, but goofing around with her had made him feel better too.
There's a look on longing on Harry's face-- and whether than longing is for a kiss, to keep dancing and goofing around, or whatever, I think it all boils down to simply longing to feel better and escape the somber atmosphere.

Best. Explanation. Ever.

Honestly, I have stayed out of this debate/conversation for the most part because the scene didn't really bother me that much (well the locket removal still does, but I tend to think that's me reading too much into it). I don't know I just never felt strongly for it one way or the other. I never saw the "near kiss", but I did see a moment at the end on Harry's part that I couldn't quite decipher. I couldn't tell what the look was or describe it, but you have explained it perfectly. Well done! :clap:

As for that scene, when I watch it, I can't help but get an incredible and sad rush of overwhelming nostalgia :( When I watch this and think back to the beginning when they were just kids, it's incredible to think that we've grown up with them. And even now, they're practically still kids going through something most people couldn't imagine. Just seeing them take a minute from their crushing responsibility is explained in the song that was playing.

Seriously, watch this scene when you get the chance, and think back to when the trio were kids in SS/PS or CoS. And how the trio interacted early in their friendship and look at them now. I know Ron isn't in this scene, but it's still remarkable, nonetheless. And overwhelming :(

Yes, they have come sooo far. :agree: You can see how much their friendship has grown. For me, it hits home in that I have kids at the ages they were in PS and can't fathom them being at a point like this.

I am so happy to know we will get the pleasure of rewatching these and see their progression. Truely a remarkable thing to have been able to keep the same actors. :tu:

While that last part is a bit of a pregnant pause, a "what if" moment, I also think it can be interpreted as Harry silently pleading for Hermione to not turn away just yet, not because he's feeling lust, but because he doesn't want the light-hearted moment to be over yet. He's not ready to go back to reality. He originally was just trying to make her feel better, but goofing around with her had made him feel better too.
There's a look on longing on Harry's face-- and whether that longing is for a kiss, to keep dancing and goofing around, or whatever, I think it all boils down to simply longing to feel better and escape the somber atmosphere.

Excellent analysis! :tu: I am inclined to think it was longing for a little more time to not have to think and just have fun and be the kids they should be. And sadness that he couldn't give that to her.

I have seen this 3 times...once before the debate started and twice after and each time I came out with the same feelings on this scene.

I think everyone is saying that it is the moment before the dancing that is the sexual tension, Harry looking, taking the locket off, pulling Hermione to the dance floor. That is what we are talking about. Not the dorky dancing.

I think everyone is saying that it is the moment before the dancing that is the sexual tension, Harry looking, taking the locket off, pulling Hermione to the dance floor. That is what we are talking about. Not the dorky dancing.

Exactly. And I still will add the few seconds at the end too, before she walks away.

While that last part is a bit of a pregnant pause, a "what if" moment, I also think it can be interpreted as Harry silently pleading for Hermione to not turn away just yet, not because he's feeling lust, but because he doesn't want the light-hearted moment to be over yet. He's not ready to go back to reality. He originally was just trying to make her feel better, but goofing around with her had made him feel better too.
There's a look on longing on Harry's face-- and whether that longing is for a kiss, to keep dancing and goofing around, or whatever, I think it all boils down to simply longing to feel better and escape the somber atmosphere.

:clap: Exactly! Couldn't have said it better :agree: I've tried to explain this, but I could never say it as well as you have :tu: It frustrates me when I try to explain something, but I can't seem to ever hit it head on :shrug: I usually end up rambling :D

Exactly. And I still will add the few seconds at the end too, before she walks away.

Yes and the few seconds after though i don't think there is an almost kiss. I think there is tension there though.

Yes and the few seconds after though i don't think there is an almost kiss. I think there is tension there though.

I didn't see an almost kiss, but it was pretty obvious to me that Harry wanted to kiss her and was disappointed when she walked away.

I think everyone is saying that it is the moment before the dancing that is the sexual tension, Harry looking, taking the locket off, pulling Hermione to the dance floor. That is what we are talking about. Not the dorky dancing.

Okay, yeah I can see that. When he walked up to her and pulled off the locket and led her out to the "dance floor," I really didn't know what to anticipate. But I never translated that into sexual tension. I think he just wanted to let her know that he was there for her, even though he had so many other tasks on which to focus, and that her feelings weren't forgotten. She was in a stump, and he did all of these things out of desperation and lonliness and frustration.

Okay, yeah I can see that. When he walked up to her and pulled off the locket and led her out to the "dance floor," I really didn't know what to anticipate. But I never translated that into sexual tension. I think he just wanted to let her know that he was there for her, even though he had so many other tasks on which to focus, and that her feelings weren't forgotten. She was in a stump, and he did all of these things out of desperation and lonliness and frustration.

I can definitely see why people see this part as sexual tension. However, I think you have a point in mentioning not knowing what to anticipate. I think that can be an alternate interpreation from just seeing sexual tension...It was Harry sort of trying to take Hermione by surprise. It's like he doesn't want her to know what to anticipate, as if he's saying, "Take of the horcrux and follow me."
Like he's trying to create an element of surprise to hopefully bring her out of her sorrow for a moment.

His body language is a bit questionable though, lol. Which is probably exactly what Dan and Yates were aiming for in the scene. Not only does Hermione not know what to expect, but neither does the audience. It starts off as misleadingly serious (or seductive as some people think), which makes the goofy dancing that much funnier and unexpected.

:clap: Exactly! Couldn't have said it better :agree: I've tried to explain this, but I could never say it as well as you have :tu: It frustrates me when I try to explain something, but I can't seem to ever hit it head on :shrug: I usually end up rambling :D

LOL. I do a lot of rambling too. It is just hard to put words to! (Probably why the scene has no dialogue). :D

I'm glad to know some of you think I got it right. I wonder if Yates knew how much discussion this scene would cause? :lol:

I also think anyone who has only watched the films would think that Harry was attracted to Ginny, but not that she was the one that he would end up with. I do think it is clear in the films that Ron and Hermione are going to end up together, but Harry and Ginny have never even had a conversation about their feelings or anything.

In the films, Ron & Hermione never talk about their feelings to each other either. It's implied in both cases. In the HBP film, Hermione talks about it to Harry but not Ron, and Hermione references Harry's feelings for Ginny, and Harry tells Hermione but not Ginny. So I don't see how you think the film makes it clear that Ron & Hermione will end up a couple, but not Harry & Ginny. Mid-point in the DH film, Hermione is still mad at Ron for leaving.

In the films, Ron & Hermione never talk about their feelings to each other either. It's implied in both cases. In the HBP film, Hermione talks about it to Harry but not Ron, and Hermione references Harry's feelings for Ginny, and Harry tells Hermione but not Ginny. So I don't see how you think the film makes it clear that Ron & Hermione will end up a couple, but not Harry & Ginny. Mid-point in the DH film, Hermione is still mad at Ron for leaving.

With Ron and Hermione it's just very obvious with how they interact with each other. They way they fall asleep holding hands, they seek each other out when there is danger at the wedding. The way he looks at her. How upset she is when he leaves. His speech when he comes back (which IMO was basically him declaring his love without actually saying it). Things like that. I thought DH made it very clear that Ron/Hermione are the couple. Harry and Ginny are a total afterthought. I don't need either couple to talk about their feelings with each other, but with Harry unless she's right in front of him, you wouldn't even know that he knows she exists. After the wedding, he totally forgets that she even exists.

LOL. I do a lot of rambling too. It is just hard to put words to! (Probably why the scene has no dialogue). :D

I'm glad to know some of you think I got it right. I wonder if Yates knew how much discussion this scene would cause? :lol:

I think the fact it has absolutely NO dialogue makes is so much harder to interpret easily and quickly :D We have to assume feelings and describe looks and such, which is no easy task.

And I think the lack of dialogue makes it more meaningful because we can just see what these 2 are feeling, no words needed.

Just like when Ron is gazing at Hermione in the piano scene - you can just see it.

And I do think Yates knew it would cause a bit of discussion, but definitely not to this extent.

Okay, yeah I can see that. When he walked up to her and pulled off the locket and led her out to the "dance floor," I really didn't know what to anticipate. But I never translated that into sexual tension. I think he just wanted to let her know that he was there for her, even though he had so many other tasks on which to focus, and that her feelings weren't forgotten. She was in a stump, and he did all of these things out of desperation and lonliness and frustration.

I am sorry, but that is book knowledge being read into the scene. I am just talking about the scene. What is happening. Harry looks at Hermione. He offers her his hand. She looks at him. He takes off the locket and looks at her. He pulls her towards the dance floor watching her and she watching him. That was the sexual tension. The look that Harry gave was enough. Everyone in the theater was look oh gosh when Harry just looked at her.

In the films, Ron & Hermione never talk about their feelings to each other either. It's implied in both cases. In the HBP film, Hermione talks about it to Harry but not Ron, and Hermione references Harry's feelings for Ginny, and Harry tells Hermione but not Ginny. So I don't see how you think the film makes it clear that Ron & Hermione will end up a couple, but not Harry & Ginny. Mid-point in the DH film, Hermione is still mad at Ron for leaving.

First, because there have been Ron/Hermione moments since film two.

Second, i disagree they have not stated your feelings. Then you know the answer don't you. Go on. Next time pluck up the courage and ask me yourself and not as a last resort.

Slughorn's having a Christmas party. We're meant to bring someone. You're going to ask McLaggan? Actually i was going to ask you.

Her...mi...o...ne.

Harry and Ginny have had nothing. They have never even had a conversation in the films. Maybe talk about their feelings isn't the right word. I mean more that they talk at all.

I am sorry, but that is book knowledge being read into the scene. I am just talking about the scene. What is happening. Harry looks at Hermione. He offers her his hand. She looks at him. He takes off the locket and looks at her. He pulls her towards the dance floor watching her and she watching him. That was the sexual tension. The look that Harry gave was enough. Everyone in the theater was look oh gosh when Harry just looked at her.



Ah....now this I can see. If I hadn't known there was going to be a dance scene that I'd seen described as Harry comoforting Hermione, I would have had "SEXUAL TENSION" flashing in my head. The dance itself had about zero tension as far as I could see, but the lead up is a different story. Especially when Harry takes the locket off. I can see some tension playing there.

I am sorry, but that is book knowledge being read into the scene. I am just talking about the scene. What is happening. Harry looks at Hermione. He offers her his hand. She looks at him. He takes off the locket and looks at her. He pulls her towards the dance floor watching her and she watching him. That was the sexual tension. The look that Harry gave was enough. Everyone in the theater was look oh gosh when Harry just looked at her.



First, because there have been Ron/Hermione moments since film two.

Second, i disagree they have not stated your feelings. Then you know the answer don't you. Go on. Next time pluck up the courage and ask me yourself and not as a last resort.

Slughorn's having a Christmas party. We're meant to bring someone. You're going to ask McLaggan? Actually i was going to ask you.

Her...mi...o...ne.

Harry and Ginny have had nothing. They have never even had a conversation in the films. Maybe talk about their feelings isn't the right word. I mean more that they talk at all.

Exactly. In the movies, Harry and Ginny's relationship consists of what 2 or 3 kisses and her tying his shoe. It was not done much better in the book either, but I at least bought that Harry loved her in the books.

Ah....now this I can see. If I hadn't known there was going to be a dance scene that I'd seen described as Harry comoforting Hermione, I would have had "SEXUAL TENSION" flashing in my head. The dance itself had about zero tension as far as I could see, but the lead up is a different story. Especially when Harry takes the locket off. I can see some tension playing there.

I was actually expecting there to be nothing in this scene even though the actors and producers talked about it. I thought it would be nothing. And then Harry looked at her. And it wasn't nothing.

Exactly. In the movies, Harry and Ginny's relationship consists of what 2 or 3 kisses and her tying his shoe. It was not done much better in the book either, but I at least bought that Harry loved her in the books.

At least inn the book we knew that Ginny had liked Harry since she was little and that has been hinted at in the film, but never stated. We also absolutely knew in the books that Harry wanted to be with Ginny in HBP. I completely agree that Harry/Ginny could have been done better. The shoe tying and the pie scene were really bad in my opinion. I don't think that it helped Ginny sort of seems silly. I am glad that they cut her getting disarmed though in the Burrow attack.

I think the Harry/Hermione dance was just a friend dance. Perhaps that comes from my own background in that I do recreational ballroom dancing, and I certainly do not feel attraction to all of my partners. In fact, some men will ask me to demonstrate a dance step with their wives so that they can see how it is done.

At first, I thought "That Scene" referred to when images of Harry and Hermione came out of the locket and started making out. I remember a few years back Emma Watson said she was not looking forward to doing kissing scenes with either Dan or Rupert because they are like brothers to her. After reading DH, she must have not been happy that she would have to do kiss scenes with both of them.

I heard a story that she was out to dinner with JKR and other people and she asked her if she would have to kiss either of them in the last book and she told her both. Don't know if it is true, but i think i remember Emma saying that.

That was the sexual tension. In your opinion, yes, but not necessarily in everyone elses. :)

I still feel that the directors failed in what they were attempting to get across with that scene.
Second, i disagree they have not stated your feelings. Then you know the answer don't you. Go on. Next time pluck up the courage and ask me yourself and not as a last resort.
What you cite is still "implied/hinted at" as HedwigOwl pointed out, because they never talk about their feelings, they go out of their way to not talk about them.

Just as in the book, same in the film. Neither came right out and said "I love you, will you go out with me". These two instances you cite weren't deliberate departures from canon by the film directors, as the dance scene was in Deathly Hallows was intended to be.

Harry and Ginny have had nothing. They have never even had a conversation in the films. Maybe talk about their feelings isn't the right word. I mean more that they talk at all.
??? It's difficult when they make the films geared toward the Trio and the secondary characters basically are forced into the background. Granted, it's been a while since I've watched all the films, but I do remember a few glimmers...not necessarily of talking, but of "implication" of feelings.

In Order of the Phoenix, there's the scene where they're on the bridge back from Hogsmeade, Hermione brings up Cho and Ginny is shown having a smile wiped off her face. *hint* She doesn't like the idea. I can't remember if she was unhappy with the Christmas DA lesson and Hermione pulling Ron away, I'll have to go back and rewatch. Was there some dialogue about going to help Sirius - again, can't remember.

HBP, immediately upon arriving at the Burrow, Harry glimpses Ginny in a window. Harry's impressed with her "shut it" at the Quidditch trials. Can't remember about the match itself. At Christmas, Mr. Weasley almost embarrassedly leaves Harry/Ginny on the sofa, she feeds Harry a small tort, Ron interrupts and blatantly sits between she and Harry. Later they almost kiss on the stairs/landing at the Burrow, she uses a "your shoes untied" to get close to him. Certainly she supports him after the Sectumsempra episode and gives him a kiss in the RoR. She's the one to comfort Harry as he kneels at Dumbledore's side. At the end of the film, Hermione tells Harry that Ron's okay with their relationship, but keep the snogging to a minimum.

DH, I wish they'd kept the "tattoo on the chest" comment in, but they didn't. Ginny and her mom rush to meet Harry, he definitely turns to her. Do they hold hands? Dunno, I'm seeing it again tomorrow. Definitely a kiss shared in the kitchen after she asked him to zip her dress. Death Eaters crash the wedding and Harry's first thought is "Ginny".

So, that's three films total, but as Harry didn't recognize Ginny as date material until Book/Film 6, I can't say as it's unexpected that some people presume it just comes out of left field.

I heard a story that she was out to dinner with JKR and other people and she asked her if she would have to kiss either of them in the last book and she told her both. Don't know if it is true, but i think i remember Emma saying that.Yes, this is true. In fact, Emma said she fell off her chair because she was laughing so hard.

With Ron and Hermione it's just very obvious with how they interact with each other. They way they fall asleep holding hands, they seek each other out when there is danger at the wedding. The way he looks at her. How upset she is when he leaves. His speech when he comes back (which IMO was basically him declaring his love without actually saying it). Things like that. I thought DH made it very clear that Ron/Hermione are the couple. Harry and Ginny are a total afterthought. I don't need either couple to talk about their feelings with each other, but with Harry unless she's right in front of him, you wouldn't even know that he knows she exists. After the wedding, he totally forgets that she even exists.

Well, that's not exactly correct about Harry. He immediately goes to protect Ginny when the DE's start arriving at the wedding, and Lupin has to physically hold him back and aggressively shove him away, yelling at him to leave.

There are more hints about Ron & Hermione because the trio are going to be together looking for horcruxes. Giving more opportunity by nature of the situation, and they need to set up Ron's leaving & making Hermione choose which sets up the Hermione-Harry-horcrux scene.

All the more reason, by the way -- the Ron/Hermione hints -- that the audience should be led to the conclusion that Harry's attraction/protectiveness toward Ginny tells us they're a couple. The movie pairs off Ron & Hermione both in HBP & DH, and does the same in those movies with Harry & Ginny. I still think that if the non-book-reading movie goer is paying attention to the details in the movies, it's evident Harry is interested in Ginny -- HBP should have left no doubt who was with whom.

With Ron and Hermione it's just very obvious with how they interact with each other. They way they fall asleep holding hands, they seek each other out when there is danger at the wedding. The way he looks at her. How upset she is when he leaves. His speech when he comes back (which IMO was basically him declaring his love without actually saying it). Things like that. I thought DH made it very clear that Ron/Hermione are the couple. Harry and Ginny are a total afterthought. I don't need either couple to talk about their feelings with each other, but with Harry unless she's right in front of him, you wouldn't even know that he knows she exists. After the wedding, he totally forgets that she even exists.

I think you have shared your opinions on Ron/Hermoine quite insistently (and with much bias) but it is clearly not "very obvious", especially when some do not see that at all.

Like I've said, it's a definite matter of perception and interpretation :cool:

Like I've said, it's a definite matter of perception and interpretation :cool:
:tu: I totally agree.

Was anyone upset that they left most of the Remus/Tonks relationship/breakup out of the film?

I think you have shared your opinions on Ron/Hermoine quite insistently (and with much bias) but it is clearly not "very obvious", especially when some do not see that at all.


I'm just stating my opinions on the discussion. I totally understand that you don't see the Ron/Hermione pairing and I respect that. I was only stating the scenes that are in this movie.


Well, that's not exactly correct about Harry. He immediately goes to protect Ginny when the DE's start arriving at the wedding, and Lupin has to physically hold him back and aggressively shove him away, yelling at him to leave.

I thought that was a nice touch, but then he doesn't think about her or worry about her the rest of the movie. I don't know. I just feel like the filmmakers really dropped the ball with Harry/Ginny.

Was anyone upset that they left most of the Remus/Tonks relationship/breakup out of the film?

I wasn't. Even with a 2-part movie there are going to be so many things left out from the books, particularly the complexity/history of characters' relationships with each other. But overall, I think they've done a very good job capturing the tone/major points from the book so far.

Was anyone upset that they left most of the Remus/Tonks relationship/breakup out of the film?

Not really. I think it was always going to get a little glossed over for the films, seeing as it's kind of a background plot. I'm actually really pleased with how they've handled it in the films (as opposed to the end of Book 6, when the topic comes up right after Dumbledore died which felt so innappropriate, but I digress...). I do kind of wish they'd tell us Tonks was pregnant in the first part of DH, but on the other hand...

Alright, that intro to the seven Potters scene was getting a little too cheery and lalalala, so I for one was very happy when Moody cut Tonks off before everyone started spewing rainbows and daisies.

I thought that was a nice touch, but then he doesn't think about her or worry about her the rest of the movie. I don't know. I just feel like the filmmakers really dropped the ball with Harry/Ginny.

They did but I think it was intentional - more like a contrived (or forced) situation since they do have to end up married at the end. I think this is yet another needless romance included in the films (among most of the others) because you don't have to explain how Harry and Ginny ended up married.

They did but I think it was intentional - more like a contrived (or forced) situation since they do have to end up married at the end. I think this is yet another needless romance included in the films (among most of the others) because you don't have to explain how Harry and Ginny ended up married.

I disagree that the romances are needless in the films. They are a part of the story, so they should be in the films, and I feel like there should be a better buildup for the main character and the woman he marries. Now obviously the romances should not overtake the actual story and what the main purpose of the story is, but they should be done in a believable way IMO.

I disagree that the romances are needless in the films. They are a part of the story, so they should be in the films, and I feel like there should be a better buildup for the main character and the woman he marries. Now obviously the romances should not overtake the actual story and what the main purpose of the story is, but they should be done in a believable way IMO.

The movies are trying to tell the main story, and can't cover everything the way it is in the books; so the romantic arc is shortened. But even in the books, Harry has to give up his relationship to protect Ginny, so there wasn't much in the DH book anyway. I think the movies (HBP & DH) did well with the trio couple relationships.

I was just going to write my thoughts on the romance - and in particular the dance scene - and having not read any of the interviews or even knowing that a dance scene would exist before I saw the film, I have to say that I didn't even get a hint of sexual tension. (and trust me In the sort of person that sees thos in everything lol)

However once I came on here and saw the controversy of the scene I tried to do a bit of background research looking at the Interviews that Dan and Yates did that suggested they intended for their to be tension - and I could not find one. So could someone who has seen these interviews please provide a link? I'm sure they are out there, but all the interviews I found just said they were trying to create a tender moment - which is very different to a sexual or lustful moment IMO.

I have to say that I didn't even get a hint of sexual tension.
I agree with you there. Anthough my friend - who hasn't read any of the books though there was tension there.
So it might be because the book ending has already been revealed, it's hard to believe.

I agree with you there. Anthough my friend - who hasn't read any of the books though there was tension there.
So it might be because the book ending has already been revealed, it's hard to believe.

That's a really good point too. I guess everyone also takes their own life experience in to it as well - the same as any movie or book. No two people interpret a whole book or movie in exactly the same way. I would like to see the interviews with Dan and Yates though, as they are clearly what make a lot of people feel passionately that it is a moment of list and seduction. As I said, I only found ones that mention the word 'tender' which has a completely different meaning, IMO, so I look forward to reading the others that allude to something different.

Ps. Your signature has me absolutely cacking myself laughing. Classic.

In your opinion, yes, but not necessarily in everyone elses. :)

I still feel that the directors failed in what they were attempting to get across with that scene.

I am sorry. It is of course your right to state your opinion, but i am not saying this is what happen in the scene in my opinion. I am saying that is in fact what happened in the scene. There was sexual tension at the beginning before the dance and possibly after by Harry. I am willing to agree to disagree though on the matter.

What you cite is still "implied/hinted at" as HedwigOwl pointed out, because they never talk about their feelings, they go out of their way to not talk about them.

Just as in the book, same in the film. Neither came right out and said "I love you, will you go out with me". These two instances you cite weren't deliberate departures from canon by the film directors, as the dance scene was in Deathly Hallows was intended to be.

I actually don't think what i cited about Ron and Hermione is implied. Hermione pretty much says if you want to ask me out then ask me out in GoF and then in HBP she says i want to ask you out. Neither of those seem implied to me. There have also been a lot of little moments between Ron and Hermione like the ones you cited between Harry and Ginny.

I am not disagreeing with any of your Harry/Ginny moments though i don't think Arthur was embarrassed when he left them on the couch. I just don't think those are any moments when they actually say i want to go out with you like Ron and Hermione have had. Also those are all of the little moments and there are a lot more little Ron/Hermione moments.

I am not saying the Harry/Ginny relationship has been ruined, but it has certainly been changed and i think the biggest change is that it is very unclear in the films whether or not Harry and Ginny have ever had a conversation as people besides in HBP about the book. If they have never had a conversation then it makes it less clear that Ginny is the one that Harry will end up with therefore leaving open the implication that Harry wouldn't mind something happening between him and Hermione.

I am sorry. It is of course your right to state your opinion, but i am not saying this is what happen in the scene in my opinion. I am saying that is in fact what happened in the scene. There was sexual tension at the beginning before the dance and possibly after by Harry. I am willing to agree to disagree though on the matter.

A fact is 2 x 2 = 4. I don't see how you can state that is a fact. You may have seen it that way, but a lot of people did not. I didn't feel it was 'sexual' tension when I saw it before this discussion started or after. Saying a look or action is a fact because you saw it a certain way does not make it one. :shrug:

David Yates: The style of Part One suits Part One. We always say these films are slightly about coming of age, but when you take these iconic characters out of that framework of Hogwarts and you put them in this dangerous world and they have to bury their first body, for example … There’s a moment in the film where Harry and Hermione dance for the first time. It’s full of proper sexual tension because they’re both teenagers and they’re at that stage where Ron’s left and there’s a sort of intimacy between them. So there are all sorts of corners that you turn because they’re young adults. And turning those corners in the real world is actually quite fun and interesting because the verity just seems to suit that.

This is the quote from David Yates.

Imo, Yates is referring to a sense of 'sexual tension' that might naturally occur, even between friends, when two lonely and devastated people seek physical contact and comfort.

This is what I saw in the scene. Harry wants to cheer Hermione up, that much is clear. But if some some sexual tension is created because of Harry's actions, it has more to do with the simple human desire to touch and be held, NOT that Harry desires Hermione and wants to seduce her.

There is no evidence what so ever in the film that Harry actually desires Hermione and wants to steal her affections from Ron. Imo, this is a misreading of the dance scene.

I thought the scene was nicely done and was an absolutely necessary moment of lightness in all the gloom. And this is coming from a canon shipper. :D

There is no evidence what so ever in the film that Harry actually desires Hermione and wants to steal her affections from Ron. Imo, this is a misreading of the dance scene.

I thought the scene was nicely done and was an absolutely necessary moment of lightness in all the gloom. And this is coming from a canon shipper. :D

Exactly! I'm a canon shipper (mainly Ron/Hermione!) and I thought the dance was nicely done. It was a beautiful scene. But in no way did I think it was romantic.

It is a definite misreading of the scene if it is ever thought that Harry has feelings for her that are not platonic. He just wants to cheer her up. Harry knew for a while that there was a good chance Hermione and Ron would get together. I really think he'd hate to interfere with that.

With Hermione, you can tell that all through out the dance, except for a small smile or two, she is really still depressed about Ron. And it was still that way after the dance.

I liked the dance scene although for me it did feel very romantic, more than friendly, like Harry was about to kiss Hermione the whole time. I do get the point of the scene, and it was mood lightening for sure!
*edit: I did notice how upset Hermione was most of the time, you can tell she's devoted to Ron, even though it's not 'in the light' yet

Exactly! I'm a canon shipper (mainly Ron/Hermione!) and I thought the dance was nicely done. It was a beautiful scene. But in no way did I think it was romantic.

It is a definite misreading of the scene if it is ever thought that Harry has feelings for her that are not platonic. He just wants to cheer her up. Harry knew for a while that there was a good chance Hermione and Ron would get together. I really think he'd hate to interfere with that.

Exactly. Sexual tension does not equal romance or seduction. I feel like the two are being confused here.

Exactly! I'm a canon shipper (mainly Ron/Hermione!) and I thought the dance was nicely done. It was a beautiful scene. But in no way did I think it was romantic.

It is a definite misreading of the scene if it is ever thought that Harry has feelings for her that are not platonic. He just wants to cheer her up. Harry knew for a while that there was a good chance Hermione and Ron would get together. I really think he'd hate to interfere with that.

With Hermione, you can tell that all through out the dance, except for a small smile or two, she is really still depressed about Ron. And it was still that way after the dance.

I agree with you and I loved that scene because I love Harry and Hermione's friendship. But I have read the books and I know how it ends. My friend, who has only seen the films, thought there might be some feelings from Harry's part and quite a few reviewers thought the film was depicting "a love triangle" and that Harry and Hermione were sort of "falling in love". Those aren't my words and maybe I didn't read the right reviews. :) Anyways, I can see why some people might have problems with this scene because it's confusing, especially to non-readers. But then I liked it so I probably wouldn't cut it. And I really liked the way Hermione and Ron's relationship was portrayed as well.

This is the quote from David Yates. David Yates: The style of Part One suits Part One. We always say these films are slightly about coming of age, but when you take these iconic characters out of that framework of Hogwarts and you put them in this dangerous world and they have to bury their first body, for example … There’s a moment in the film where Harry and Hermione dance for the first time. It’s full of proper sexual tension because they’re both teenagers and they’re at that stage where Ron’s left and there’s a sort of intimacy between them. So there are all sorts of corners that you turn because they’re young adults. And turning those corners in the real world is actually quite fun and interesting because the verity just seems to suit that.

Imo, Yates is referring to a sense of 'sexual tension' that might naturally occur, even between friends, when two lonely and devastated people seek physical contact and comfort.

This is what I saw in the scene. Harry wants to cheer Hermione up, that much is clear. But if some some sexual tension is created because of Harry's actions, it has more to do with the simple human desire to touch and be held, NOT that Harry desires Hermione and wants to seduce her.

There is no evidence what so ever in the film that Harry actually desires Hermione and wants to steal her affections from Ron. Imo, this is a misreading of the dance scene.

I thought the scene was nicely done and was an absolutely necessary moment of lightness in all the gloom. And this is coming from a canon shipper. :D

:clap:Yes! Thank you for finding that quote. I think this is exactly what is meant by it. There is the tension, but not because either of them was actually desiring it. It is NOT about Harry wanting or trying to seduce Hermione! I think he really understood what JK thought about this situation in the book!

Exactly! I'm a canon shipper (mainly Ron/Hermione!) and I thought the dance was nicely done. It was a beautiful scene. But in no way did I think it was romantic.

It is a definite misreading of the scene if it is ever thought that Harry has feelings for her that are not platonic. He just wants to cheer her up. Harry knew for a while that there was a good chance Hermione and Ron would get together. I really think he'd hate to interfere with that.

With Hermione, you can tell that all through out the dance, except for a small smile or two, she is really still depressed about Ron. And it was still that way after the dance.

Exactly! And I also think people have taken Yates comments out of context. He said there was "proper sexual tension", but because it came out of the situation, not because it was desired.

Exactly. Sexual tension does not equal romance or seduction. I feel like the two are being confused here.

:tu: :agree:

I still feel that the directors failed in what they were attempting to get across with that scene.
I feel the same. If so many people don't see the sexual tension Yates wanted to go for, as he claimed in that interview, then he must have failed there. However, I do see where they tried to make it look like there was sexual tension (mainly, as many have already stated, the beginning and end of the scene). And that is what bothers me. That they even tried. It's completely gratuitous, IMO. I don't mind a scene in which Harry tries to cheer Hermione up, a scene in which their wonderful friendship is shown. And there is certainly nothing wrong with a tender moment. But why spice it up? Why even include such a "what if?" moment. If the HP series was a romance series, fine. Then maybe. But it's just a sub-plot.

They did but I think it was intentional - more like a contrived (or forced) situation since they do have to end up married at the end. I think this is yet another needless romance included in the films (among most of the others) because you don't have to explain how Harry and Ginny ended up married.If they decide to include an epilogue in which Harry is married to Ginny and Ron is married to Hermione, then they have to explain or rather show somehow how the two couples got together. And I personally like that the WB decided early on to include the romances in the movies. After all, that makes the characters more rounded and believable, IMO.

I feel the same. If so many people don't see the sexual tension Yates wanted to go for, as he claimed in that interview, then he must have failed there. However, I do see where they tried to make it look like there was sexual tension (mainly, as many have already stated, the beginning and end of the scene). And that is what bothers me. That they even tried. It's completely gratuitous, IMO. I don't mind a scene in which Harry tries to cheer Hermione up, a scene in which their wonderful friendship is shown. And there is certainly nothing wrong with a tender moment. But why spice it up? Why even include such a "what if?" moment. If the HP series was a romance series, fine. Then maybe. But it's just a sub-plot.

Personally, I think it would be unrealistic to have the two dance and for there not to be any sexual tension. I don't see why the existence of sexual tension between Harry and Hermione in this scene has to be a problem. It doesn't mean Harry has romantic feelings towards Hermione or that he is trying to seduce her. It's a natural and normal human response given the circumstances.

That said, I do see how Harry's feelings in that scene might be a bit confusing to those who didn't read the books. But since the rest of the film makes it very clear that Harry does not have romantic feelings for Hermione, it ultimately shouldn't be a big problem.

If they decide to include an epilogue in which Harry is married to Ginny and Ron is married to Hermione, then they have to explain or rather show somehow how the two couples got together. And I personally like that the WB decided early on to include the romances in the movies. After all, that makes the characters more rounded and believable, IMO.

I think the films have handled the R/Hr relationship very well so far. H/G on the other hand has been more of an after thought. I'm not counting on things getting much better in DH part 2. I think the film makers are just counting on people accepting that Harry has to end up with someone, so why not Ginny.

My younger brother, he's 15 and he's only read the 7th book, watched the movie with me both times. He may be biased since he does know the series very well through the movies and with me explaining to him, but I thought it'd be interesting to ask him.

He said that although at first he was confused by it, he thought it was a nice touch (although he was embarrassed admitting it :lol:). He said it was nice because they were alone and needed to be cheered up. Then I asked if he thought it was romantic. He said "no, it was Harry trying to cheer up Hermione." And that "seducing" her was out of the question.

And that Harry was dancing to "dorkily" to be considered "seductive" to anyone :lol:

My younger brother, he's 15 and he's only read the 7th book, watched the movie with me both times. He may be biased since he does know the series very well through the movies and with me explaining to him, but I thought it's be interesting to ask him.

He said that although at first he was confused by it, he thought it was a nice touch (although he was embarrassed admitting it :lol:). He said it was nice because they were alone and needed to be cheered up. Then I asked if he thought it was romantic. He said "no, it was Harry trying to cheer up Hermione." And that "seducing" her was out of the question.

And that Harry was dancing to "dorkily" to be considered "seductive" to anyone :lol:

That's what my mum thinks of the dance scene. She's never read the books, but loves the movies. I asked her what she thought of the dance scene and she said: "That's my favourite part in the movie, it made me cry."

I then asked her if she thought it was "seductive" and that something was going to happen between Harry and Hermione and she said "No there wasn't anything seductive about it. It was just two friends finding comfort in each other in a dark time."

Later on she also said "It's been obvious that Ron and Hermione were going to get together since the third film."

After just seeing DH for the first time, I was relieved at how minor this scene really was. I still definitely would've preferred it to be left out entirely.

Was it corny and lame? Yeah. But, mercifully, it wasn't sexual or seductive in any manner. It was two very close friends, who had been there for each other for years and amidst many a difficult situation, just trying to be there for the other.

This is the quote from David Yates.

Imo, Yates is referring to a sense of 'sexual tension' that might naturally occur, even between friends, when two lonely and devastated people seek physical contact and comfort.

This is what I saw in the scene. Harry wants to cheer Hermione up, that much is clear. But if some some sexual tension is created because of Harry's actions, it has more to do with the simple human desire to touch and be held, NOT that Harry desires Hermione and wants to seduce her.

There is no evidence what so ever in the film that Harry actually desires Hermione and wants to steal her affections from Ron. Imo, this is a misreading of the dance scene.

I thought the scene was nicely done and was an absolutely necessary moment of lightness in all the gloom. And this is coming from a canon shipper. :D

Thank you for posting the quote! :)

I definitely agree with your interpretation as well. Sexual tension does not equal seduction or romance. I agree with others than Book Harry wouldn't necessarily behave like that, but I think we all have to concede that from the beginnng Book Harry and Movie Harry are quite different characters (in fact most book characters are different to their movie counterparts!) but I still liked the scene and didn't find it inappropriate at all.

I am sorry. It is of course your right to state your opinion, but i am not saying this is what happen in the scene in my opinion. I am saying that is in fact what happened in the scene. There was sexual tension at the beginning before the dance and possibly after by Harry. I am willing to agree to disagree though on the matter.Yes, you're stating it as fact and it's that which I disagree with, because to me it is your personal interpretation of what occurs within that scene.

Opinion: a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty

Individual opinion is based in how an individual - you, me, Bobby McGee - are interpreting {i.e. giving our personal view point} of the known facts viewed within that particular scene. The point that a large number of people, fans & otherwise, absolutely "failed" to pick up any sexual tension whatsoever in that particular scene while many others say they see sexual tension there is all based on OUR individual opinions. Not "fact". Fact: Harry removed the locket from Hermione
Fact: Harry convinced her to dance with him
Fact: Dance over, Hermione turns and walks away and Harry looks on

Opinion/Interpretation: Harry was panting hot and heavy, sexual tension zinged through the air, will he stop at taking off the necklace or is something else coming off?
Opinion/Interpretation: OMG what's he doing? Oh, taking off the Horcrux...wonder why?
Opinion/Interpretation: He lured her onto the dance floor intending to seduce her.
Opinion/Interpretation: Oh, how awkwardly sweet can you get, he's being silly to cheer up poor moping Hermione, and OMG the boy can't dance!
Opinion/Interpretation: Harry wanted to take it further but Hermione chose not to because she wants Ron, Harry doesn't care at all about Ginny, any warm body will do for him because he's got the attention span of a gnat
Opinion/Interpretation: Harry is saddened that his plan failed because Hermione is still sad over Ron's leaving, and their temporary moment of joy after days/weeks of utter depression is shattered, now he's hurt & saddened & depressed all over again.

I can totally respect and agree to disagree with one's stated opinion and/or post my own opposing viewpoint explaining why I disagree. That is different, however, from one continually asserting "it's fact, that IS what happened, no questions whatsoever about it" because that leaves zero room for discussion, debate, or dissenting opinion of the given subject...which is really what we're all here for in the first place: discussion/debate with people who hold differing POV. :yuhup:

I've no issue with Harry/Ginny vs Harry/Hermione vs Ron/Hermione vs Dumbledore/Sorting Hat/Hippogriff. To me this really is not about shipping - a fan preference of character romantic relationships within the books - though others may disagree. There are hardcore shippers out there that saw absolutely nothing with that dance scene but friendship, some hardcore shippers who saw minor hints, and there are other hardcore shippers who did see much more than friendship - all of which is down to their individual interpretations. I don't ship, so to me that's not what I'm using to interpret the scene with.

My personal opinion is that although the directors wanted there to be sexual tension pertaining to the dance scene it was not conveyed well at all - this opinion bolstered by just exactly how many viewers of all ages failed to pick up on it - and so therefore IMHO the filmmakers did not accomplish what they had deliberately set out to achieve. My understanding is that there were two songs/dance sequences, though, one much more soft & romantic in nature but the filmmakers felt it pushed the idea of Harry/Hermione way too far and so they instead went with a silly dance sequence set to a snippet of Nick Cave's O'Children.

I don't ship, so to me that's not what I'm using to interpret the scene with.


You bring up a great point about basing interpretations on ships :tu:

It's a bit frustrating sometimes, because in other discussions online, people tell me that I have no room to discuss this fairly because I've stated myself as a H/Hr shipper :shrug: Not to mention they completely disregard the fact I'm also a R/Hr shipper.

Someone told me that "I'm biased because this scene pans to my H/Hr ship".

Uh, what...? I think this would be fair to assume if I've stated that I've found this scene romantic, which then, would be in favor of H/Hr. But since I've stated several times that I don't find this romantic in the least, how does this "pan to my H/Hr ship"...? :relax:

If I was being biased as a H/Hr shipper, I would be trying to argue that this scene is romantic, not the opposite :grumble: I just wish people will stop making false assumptions :( Just because I ship H/Hr, it doesn't mean I want them together in canon, or that I don't support R/Hr or that I'm deliberately trying to see romance that I honestly don't think is there.

Sorry, just feel the need to vent after being told off on other forums. All they read is "H/Hr shipper" and stop there, and make many false assumptions.

I guess I'm saying this because I don't want people to think I'm using a ship I like to interpret this scene.

Yes, you're stating it as fact and it's that which I disagree with, because to me it is your personal interpretation of what occurs within that scene.

I am stating that it is fact. Though i also stated that it is your right to disagree and to state your opinion. I don't ship any relationships. I am not really sure what that means anyways, but i like how things worked out in the books. I think what happened with the couples made sense.

Of course we are all able to state are opinion and we all do.

PS. I think i agree with the person above. Everyone just states that it is fact that there was nothing there. I disagree completely.

Hmmmmm..... Well, it certainly seems as though the dance scene may well be the most talked-about scene in the entire HP film series! haha

Well, because Ron and Herm-ee-oh-knee :D make me happy, and I think they've been a bit overshadowed with all this talk of the dance - Part 2 of Ron/Hermione moments!!! :love:

13. Ron's splinching. So true to the book. Hermione's panic and distress were so brilliantly portrayed by Emma; I really believed that she was struggling to hold it together. I think that the way she looked at him at the end of the scene - so tenderly - was like a visual representation of this line in the book: ".... there was such tenderness in her expression that Harry felt almost as if he had surprised her in the act of kissing him. " Loved this.

14. Yes - Hermione does defend Ron in the woods. Harry is sitting outside the tent and he gets angry (having just had one of his Voldie visions) about Ron's radio playing inside. He looks as though he is about to snap at Ron, but Hermione stops him: "Don't. It comforts him. [....] I think he's just hoping that he won't hear bad news. [paraphrase]" I thought this bit of compassion/insight towards Ron was touching and very Hermione. :) Oh yeah, and when Harry asks when there'll be moving on, Hermione points out that Ron is too weak to apparate.

15. Hermione and Ron sitting alone by the tent as Harry surveys the surroundings/feels paranoid. There's a brief shot of Hermione fussing with Ron's sling. Noice. (Although could have used a little more of that....)

16. The fight. A lot has been said about how good Rupert and Dan are in this scene - and they are - but I thought Emma was really great too. She really conveyed Hermione's fear/anguish as she sees her two best friends - one of whom she is in love with - fighting. I loved how she repeatedly tried to take the locket off Ron; I liked the intimacy of her initiating this physical contact (not in the book). IMO, this scene, more than any other in the film, shows how she treats Ron differently to how she treats Harry. The way she speaks to him, looks at him, her whole manner, befits a lover. I felt really bad for her when Ron harshly pushed her away. :( In my second viewing, I noticed that a real tear falls down Emma's cheek as Ron heads for the exit. Her cries to Ron outside the tent were heartbreaking; I nearly cried. :upset:

17. Hermione tying her scarf round a tree to mark the spot for Ron, bursting into tears upon disapparating to a new location :upset:, sitting despondently as Harry casts the protective enchantments around her: nothing really to add to what others have said about these scenes, except to reiterate that Emma's acting was superb and completely sold the emotions.

18. The scene. Well, I think more than enough has been said about this ;), but Emma's acting really showed just how much Hermione was missing Ron. That radio almost symbolised Ron, so it was almost as if his presence was hanging over the whole scene.

19. Ron's return. An ENORMOUS disappointment in terms of Ron/Harry interaction (not so much as a "thank you", or a "glad to have you back" from Harry's end :td: :no:), but the Ron/Hermione reunion was in some ways better than the one in the book. Hermione wasn't quite livid enough for my liking; this was the one bit of the movie where I found Emma's acting not wholly believable. :/ But I really loved the idea that Hermione had whispered Ron's name on Christmas morning, and that we didn't get to hear it. That made it more powerful, imo.

20. Harry and Ron's post-horcrux discussion. Not a patch on the one in the book - my favourite and most re-read DH scene - and did not make up for the lack of a bromance hug, nor certain lines from the book ("I love her like a sister.... I thought you knew." This movie could really have done with that line, as we can see with this dance debate... :grumble:), but it did suggest that Harry knew about Ron/Hermione and was fine with it. :tu: "Just keep talking about that ball of light touching your heart. She'll come around. [paraphrase]" :D

21. Ron's HI-larious attempt to appease Hermione by voting to go to the Lovegoods' and her death-glare. :lol:

22. Nice bit of classic Ron/Hermione banter (twilight/midnight) at the Lovegoods'. :tu:

23. Ron trying to defend Hermy from the Snatchers.:tu: Yay! More Ron/Hermione protectiveness. :) I think he shouts "Let her go!". I like how one of them called Ron Hermione's "boyfriend". Even the evil guys can see it. :agree:

24. Malfoy Manor. Only Ron/Hermione disappointment in this film... :/ Ron should have been much more distraught. :td: But we did get some nice stuff, which only reinforced that Ron/Hermione were the couple: Ron struggling and looking distressed - much more so than Harry :tu: - when Bella is holding Hermione; "Let her go!" and grabbing the cell bars; and best of all, "Like hell!" and running up the stairs and charging into battle (again, before Harry). Hermione's knight. :love: I liked that they showed Hermione reacting to this with an expression of hope. You could really see the anguish written all over Rupert's face throughout these scenes, even if the script didn't allow him to express the appropriate amount of distress. Lastly, I loved that Ron was there to catch Hermione when Bella pushed her away......

25. .......and he doesn't let go of her for the rest of the film. :) They have clearly reached another level of physical comfort with one another by this point - just as it was in the book. The last shot of Ron and Hermione in this movie shows them standing side-by-side, two sidekicks united, tightly holding onto each other. The way it should be.

I wonder if it's an age/generation/experience thing that interprets such a scene so differently? I mean, my young teen son sees nothing but humor/dorkiness in the whole dance scene because he hasn't experienced seduction (or dancing, for that matter). While I clearly see a seduction because, you know, I've done the taking off thing?

I also believe that ones bias or attitude about the relationships does affect interpretations. For example, some have said that Ron and Hermoine hooked up in PoA. I guess I have to read some other threads but I still don't see what or when it happened. Hermoine putting her arms around Ron during the execution was, imo, one of the most awkward scenes in the whole series and so forced/contrived. Perhaps it was something else because the film series make it come out of nowhere (since they didn't like each other much in the first two films). I don't know, just a very unlikely couple and with my bias, a couple that makes no sense on screen.

I wonder if it's an age/generation/experience thing that interprets such a scene so differently? I mean, my young teen son sees nothing but humor/dorkiness in the whole dance scene because he hasn't experienced seduction (or dancing, for that matter). While I clearly see a seduction because, you know, I've done the taking off thing?


That's very possible :agree: I guess it'd be interesting to compare ages to interpretation of this scene.

scooby, can one also interpret every single point that you made as a relationship between two good, close, protective friends? I'm sorry, none of your points prove that they are nothing more than such friends (and not romantically involved).

and best of all, "Like hell!" and running up the stairs and charging into battle



Ah, I loved this. It didn't quite make up for the lack of anguished cries of "HERMIONE!" while locked up, but it certainly appeased me a little. It was a total "hell yeah!" (pun intended) moment for me.

scooby, can one also interpret every single point that you made as a relationship between two good, close, protective friends? I'm sorry, none of your points prove that they are nothing more than such friends (and not romantically involved).

Well obviously a lot of people see those moments as them being more then friends. Especially since that's what the film and the books intended them to be. Ron's feelings are totally obvious in this movie. I know you think he just has a stupid look on his face the whole time, but the locket and his biggest fears are enough to show that he's in love with her. They were meant to be from the first accordng to JKR, and of course not everyone is going to like them, and the movies haven't done as well as the books have in terms of their relationship, but they are not just close friends. They are more then that. It's why they kiss in the next movie, its why they are very much a couple according to Rupert in the next movie and it is why they get married. I guess I just don't understand denying that they do have feelings for each other.

I wonder if it's an age/generation/experience thing that interprets such a scene so differently? I mean, my young teen son sees nothing but humor/dorkiness in the whole dance scene because he hasn't experienced seduction (or dancing, for that matter). While I clearly see a seduction because, you know, I've done the taking off thing

That's very possible :agree: I guess it'd be interesting to compare ages to interpretation of this scene.

Well, as you can see I'm in the older age group and I don't see the scene as being seductive. I don't think age is the deciding factor.

Well, as you can see I'm in the older age group and I don't see the scene as being seductive. I don't think age is the deciding factor.

Nah, I'm not saying it's a directly or even vaguely correlated to age, but it'd be interesting to see :) Sorry - I always find looking at stats and such interesting.

Nah, I'm not saying it's a directly or even vaguely correlated to age, but it'd be interesting to see :) Sorry - I always find looking at stats and such interesting.

Oh, I know you weren't saying that. :D It would be an interesting thing to see, if even just on this forum. Maybe we need a poll for it?

I read a few things about the dance scene before I saw the movie. (Had to stop reading comments so I could be surprised.) And I read more before seeing it the second time.

Honestly, I only see it as a friend trying to cheer up a friend. I don't see it as a "they almost kiss" moment. They dance, and smile, and then you see Hermione think about Ron again and miss him. It was a nice way to show how miserable Hermione was without Ron around.

I agree that in the book, Hermione and Ron are the typical bickering couple. I love the duplicate "Always the tone of surprise" lines. Ron just hasn't been mature enough to pursue the relationship. He grows up during DH.

20. Harry and Ron's post-horcrux discussion. Not a patch on the one in the book - my favourite and most re-read DH scene - and did not make up for the lack of a bromance hug, nor certain lines from the book ("I love her like a sister.... I thought you knew." This movie could really have done with that line, as we can see with this dance debate... :grumble:), but it did suggest that Harry knew about Ron/Hermione and was fine with it. :tu: "Just keep talking about that ball of light touching your heart. She'll come around. [paraphrase]" :D


Just keep talking about that ball of light touching your heart...:D

That is seriously one of my absolute favorite lines/scenes in the movie. I feel like it is loaded with so much.
To me, that line alone shows:
1). Harry and Ron have made up. It is the equivalent to a "bromance" moment. Harry is good-naturedly teasing Ron.

2). It makes up for Harry saying, "She's like a sister to me" because Harry is clearly showing that he knows Ron loves Hermione (and she loves Ron). He is completely ok with it. Harry wants Ron to know that he has best wishes for their relationship. He wants them to be together because he knows it will make them happy. Harry's acknowleding that he knows Ron thought something was going on between him and Hermione, and he's reassuring Ron that that's not the case--He's not trying to stand between the two of them. He's giving them his blessing, so to speak.

I think maybe Yates felt that having the post-horcux Harry/Ron moment and this scene may have been over-kill.

I wonder if it's an age/generation/experience thing that interprets such a scene so differently? I mean, my young teen son sees nothing but humor/dorkiness in the whole dance scene because he hasn't experienced seduction (or dancing, for that matter). While I clearly see a seduction because, you know, I've done the taking off thing?

Hmm...I don't know. I'm kind of older (24), lol. And I don't really see it as intentionally seductive at all. Even if there does appear to be a bit of tension at the opening of the scene, I don't really see the need to take it seriously. Maybe it's because I've had strictly platonic male friends who have at times made vaguely "romantic" or "seductive" comments toward me that really meant nothing because they were just teasing/joking around. So I sort apply this to Harry's possibly "seductive" expression at the beginning.

I am stating that it is fact. Though i also stated that it is your right to disagree and to state your opinion. I don't ship any relationships. I am not really sure what that means anyways, but i like how things worked out in the books. I think what happened with the couples made sense.

Of course we are all able to state are opinion and we all do.

PS. I think i agree with the person above. Everyone just states that it is fact that there was nothing there. I disagree completely.

I think we can all just agree to disagree here :D

Sigh. lol I don't what else I can say that I haven't already said. I obviously hated the dance. I didn't like Harry trying to seduce Hermione. I think it does a real disservice to his character. Harry would never go after the girl that his best friend loves. It really made me look at him differently. The dance was a huge mistake IMO. It also makes me doubt even more that Harry even likes Ginny. I also hate that Ron and Hermione don't get scenes anywhere near that intimate. They never get to be alone, and if they actually film scenes with them alone they are cut. It's just super frustrating. That's not to say that they didn't have some nice moments in this movie, but Harry was always there. Even a nice little intimate moment between them after the 7 potters had to turn into a Harry moment.

Agree with all. Second post of the thread and nothing else needed to be said about it.

I didn't see anything romantic or seductive in the scene, but then again, sometimes we see what we expect to see. I don't really ship the trio, or anyone in the "current" generation; I'm more interested in the friendship between Harry, Ron, and Hermione. The parts that I found the most touching in this film were the friendship moments.

To me, the dance was a friendship moment. And probably my favourite one in the film series so far, too. I was in tears. It's almost comparable to the moment in HBP (book) where Hermione and Ron tell Harry, after Dumbledore's funeral, that they're staying by his side no matter what happens.

I didn't see anything romantic or seductive in the scene, but then again, sometimes we see what we expect to see. .

Well, before I watched the film, I'd gathered from all the reviews that the dance would be a friendship moment between Harry and Hermione but when I watched the film, I was completely thrown. I did see parts of that scene as both romantic and seductive.

I think seduce might not be quite what i mean only because it sort of has the meaning of negativity to it like leading someone astray. It was just that Harry was going to go over to Hermione and was going to see how she would react, but maybe the thought hadn't gotten to the idea that he wanted to hook up with her.

urgh enough talk about this blooming dance scene already!

this is driving me nuts! this is my fave thread to post cos i love talking about the romance in DH, but i think we've over-analysed this moment waaay too much!

why can't there be a seperate thread entirely for this controversial dance scene, so we can talk about something else already?


*deep breath* okay, rant over.

just gotta say, after watching this film for the gazillioanth time, i never get bored with the hermione/ron moments.

a frined of mine, who i suppose you can say is a 'casual' viewer asked me an interesting question once we came out the cinema.

she asked me whether or not the way i see the movie hermione/ron romance is over-influenced too much by the books (which she hasn't read).
when i asked why she thought that, she replied that although there were hinted moments in the film, like the piano scene, when she was watching the film she saw more of a closer friendship between the two characters, as oppossed to the romance that i saw.

she certaintly has a valid point.
i do wonder if moments like when ron says "always the tone of surprise" and hermione removes harry's glasses, are seen as romantic and a hermione/ron moment, becasue of how jo has written that moment in the book.

if you cast your love of the books aside and view the hermione/ron relationship through the movies, would we automatically have thought that scene a romantic moment?

urgh enough talk about this blooming dance scene already!

this is driving me nuts! this is my fave thread to post cos i love talking about the romance in DH, but i think we've over-analysed this moment waaay too much!

why can't there be a seperate thread entirely for this controversial dance scene, so we can talk about something else already?

if you cast your love of the books aside and view the hermione/ron relationship through the movies, would we automatically have thought that scene a romantic moment?

Yes, you're right :).

In regards to the Ron/Hermione movie relationship... as someone who isn't a shipper, I would say yes, I thought that the piano scene was a romantic scene. It's a little blossoming moment in my opinion. You can clearly see what Ron is feeling when he stares at her and Hermione looks rather flustered and pleased at the same time. My mum (a non-reader) also thought this was a romantic scene between the two.

why can't there be a seperate thread entirely for this controversial dance scene, so we can talk about something else already?This is the separate thread to discuss not only romantic moments in general, but for particular the DH dancing scene. It was opened to keep the general 'DH 1 Open Discussion' thread free from the never-ending talk about the scene as Morgoth explained in his starting post. :)

My standout Ron/Hermione moment from DH was the look the way Ron looks at Hermione during the wedding. That one scene is enough to establish the fact that this is a guy who is totally in love with the girl!

I was just talking to a friend of mine out in California who finally saw the film this past weekend and she said (brace yourselves) she can see Rupert Grint becoming "the next Hugh Grant" if he wanted to. I burst out laughing and thought it was quite an odd odd statement, but she explained that she thinks he's a cute, funny, charming romantic lead with great comedic delivery and she could see him charming the pants off ladies in romantic comedies for many years to come! :D I don't know if I necessarily agree or would want that for him; I personally would love to see him take on a dark role and play a 'not so good' guy, but I thought it was an interesting opinion to throw in the mix for those who think he does not do a good job portraying a young man in love.

I was just talking to a friend of mine out in California who finally saw the film this past weekend and she said (brace yourselves) she can see Rupert Grint becoming "the next Hugh Grant" if he wanted to. I burst out laughing and thought it was quite an odd odd statement, but she explained that she thinks he's a cute, funny, charming romantic lead with great comedic delivery and she could see him charming the pants off ladies in romantic comedies for many years to come! :D I don't know if I necessarily agree or would want that for him; I personally would love to see him take on a dark role and play a 'not so good' guy, but I thought it was an interesting opinion to throw in the mix for those who think he does not do a good job portraying a young man in love.

Well, I never thought of it, but I can see where she is coming from. I hope he does more than those types of movies though. I can totally see him doing something more dramatic. He is so much better than Hugh IMO. :D

I didn't see it either. I love that scene because when reading the book I wanted so badly for Harry to show any sign that he cares about Hermione, too, about her being devastated by Ron's departure, but he was merely ignoring her. The height of his indifference was when he couldn't stand her company after she'd just saved his life, because she'd broken his wand (I guess wand trumps life). It felt so unnatural. So this scene in the film smoothed out the whole narrative there - it remedied the book's weakness as far as I'm concerned. I'm grateful for it.

i so totally agree with you! I felt the same while reading DH...It's true, Harry treats her badly...he's so different from before. I think JKR did it on purpose as she wanted to stress the fact Harry has no romantic feelings towards her and how they can't get along without him around. That's so lame...
So this dancing scene is a sort of payback! Well done Yates :tu:

Just remembered another Ron/Hermione moment: Hermione telling Harry, "I'm always mad at him." Another line that seems to sum up their relationship, in addition to "Always the tone of surprise." :)

A line I didn't notice until the second time I watched it... Hermione saying 'Never let me give you a hair cut again'. To me, this seemed to have a double meaning. Yes, she was looking at his hair and she brushes it out of his eyes at that moment, but did anyone else feel like it was in regards to Ron's leaving?

I might be stating the obvious there, or I might be completely wrong! It was just something I noticed and thought I'd bring up :P

Also, I agree that Rupert is soooo much better than Hugh Grant :D But I can't see him taking on any of those roles unfortunately... He seems like the kind of guy to be involved in smaller roles on smaller budget films. But us fan girls can dream!

A line I didn't notice until the second time I watched it... Hermione saying 'Never let me give you a hair cut again'. To me, this seemed to have a double meaning. Yes, she was looking at his hair and she brushes it out of his eyes at that moment, but did anyone else feel like it was in regards to Ron's leaving?

I might be stating the obvious there, or I might be completely wrong! It was just something I noticed and thought I'd bring up :P

Mmmm.... I think Harry may have been about to apologise for what happened (or, rather, didn't) between them the night before, but Hermione cut him off with this line.

I agree with you that it seemed to have a layered meaning... In any case, Hermione seemed to lay to rest any "what ifs" with this line. :tu:

Just remembered another Ron/Hermione moment: Hermione telling Harry, "I'm always mad at him." Another line that seems to sum up their relationship, in addition to "Always the tone of surprise." :)

I had forgotten about that line. That's when Harry's asking Hermione if she's going to stay mad at Ron or something, right?

Great line. And it is another way to show that Harry does not have any romantic feelings for Hermione. First he gives Ron advice on how to win Hermione over ("Keep talking about that ball of light"), and then he asks Hermione if she's still mad at Ron (i.e. telling her "Ron loves you, stop being mean to him"). He's basically playing match-maker, lol. Regardless of "that scene", it really makes it quite skeptical that in the movies Harry is being portrayed as having feelings for Hermione, lol.


A line I didn't notice until the second time I watched it... Hermione saying 'Never let me give you a hair cut again'. To me, this seemed to have a double meaning. Yes, she was looking at his hair and she brushes it out of his eyes at that moment, but did anyone else feel like it was in regards to Ron's leaving?

I might be stating the obvious there, or I might be completely wrong! It was just something I noticed and thought I'd bring up :P

Yeah, that was something that I didn't catch at all when I watched it, but apparently quite a few people think that was a loaded line--based on the possiblity that Harry was about to apologize for any unintentional tension, lol. So Hermione is seen as dismissing it. I like to think of it as if there were any fleeting feelings in that brief moment, she knows they weren't meant, and doesn't need an apology. Maybe Harry realized his intentions could have been misinterpreted and Hermione is basically telling him, "Don't worry about it."

Further to what PotterGurl08 said, Harry has already flatly denied having any romantic feelings/intentions towards Hermione in this movie series. In the HBP movie, Dumbledore asks Harry if there is anything going on between him and "Miss Granger", and he replies (paraphrasing), "No. She's brilliant, but we're friends." I think Harry's actions and reactions throughout the HBP movie - just as in the book - make it clear that he knows his best friends like each other and that he remains neutral, if not entirely happy, on the issue. There's even a deleted scene on the HBP DVD where Harry jokingly asks Hermione to keep the snogging with Ron to a minimum during their quest. :D

I personally liked the Harry-Hermione dance scene. I thought it was well done, and I don't think that the intentions were romantic at all from Harry. Ron had just ran away so they both weren't in very good moods. So I'm sure the dancing scene was added just as an extra thing to the movie. Other than that, I didn't mind the Harry-Ginny thing. I thought that Bonnie and Daniel pulled that off pretty good. George being in there just made that scene funny without his ear. Otherwise the subtle romantic moments between Ron and Hermione were cute. Overall the romance was overwhelmed by the action.

PoA-
In the Snowballs with Malfoy scene (In the book Hermione wasn't there, it was when the boys are fighting with her) Ron is acting scared and Hermione is all cool and laughing at Ron's discomfit.
After the Time-Turner sequence, when H & Hr are back in the hospital wing, Ron asks what's going on and they laugh and mock him for his ignorance (I hate Harry in this moment, too)
She keeps calling him "Ronald" with this look of distain on her face.

GoF
The scene when Ron's horrible dress robes arrive. Both H & Hr mock him.
After the second task, Hermione is only interested in Harry and ignores Ron. (In the book she was supposed to be jealous of Fleur kissing him)

That is just the scenes I remember that make me wonder why on earth Ron wants to be with someone who treats him so poorly.

Yeah, you're right. I've watche, for the first times, the three first films together, and the change from CoS to PoA is terrible. Yeah, Ron and Hermione bicker, that's how they care for each other, they enjoy it and find it natural. But these scenes in GoF film are not that. Ron's family is poor. Everything Ron has is hand-me-downs. He hates this, and Ron and Hermione knows it. Harry and Hermione would never, NEVER, laugh at something like Ron's dress robes, which are horrible because his parents can't buy him good ones. In the book, I don't know exactly what Ron says in the book when he sees the robes, because I read it in spanish, but he is angry, and dissappoited, and Harry doesn't know what to tell him. He would never laugh at him for this, neither Hermione, as Ron or Hermione would never laugh at Harry's lack of family, or to Hermione's lack of wizard relatives. I think that the filmmakers were trying to make a joke, but they destroyed the characters. My conclusion, after all the films, is that they don't understand Harry, Ron and Hermione really, or what happen in the books.
The scene in PoA starts as a cute one, but the worst of it, apart from Hermione laughing at Ron (I don't find this case as terrible as the GoF scene), is that Malfoy calls Hermione a mudblood, and Ron does nothing!! And Harry is out of the school, and Hermione isn't worried! Also, in the Snape werewolves class, Ron agrees with Snape when he calls Hermione a know-it-all. It isn't that this isn't like that in the book... it's that is completely opposite!! Ron insults Snape! Yeah, Ron and Hermione bicker, and sometimes insult each other, but they never, never, let anyone else do it! Ron's character was destroyed from PoA. They treated to rescue him a brief in OOTP (when Ron explains how they got free from the Squad), and in DH1, but it's a bit late.
Yeah, Ron isn't exactly gentle in HBP, but in the book, we can understand Ron's reasons to kiss Lavender. We know he doesn't like her (he pretty much ignores her until the kiss). But he is jealous, he feels second-best when Hermione is flattering Harry, and she never says anything like that about him. I always understood that, since GoF, Hermione knew that she liked Ron and that Ron liked her, but Ron never realised Hermione's feelings to him until the ask-for-date for the Slughorn party. Yes, he is clueless... but what do you expect? He's no particularly brilliant about girls, and is a 16-year-old! To the point: when he discovers that Hermione kissed Krum and feels that Hermione doesn't have confidence in him (which is not true, as we know, but, well... the way she says it seems so in that moment), he becomes resentful and thinks: "If she thinks I'm nothing, I'll show her, and anyone else, that other girls like me, that I'm good". So he goes for Lavender, becauses he knows that she likes him.
In the movie nothing of this character development is showed, and we have a Ron who gets a date with Hermione and then goes to snog another girl for no reason. Terrible.

As for the dance scene... Well, I don't mind it much at all, even when I don't like how it ends. If the dance ended with a hug between the two, showing pure friendship love, it would have been better. The worst thing about the dance is not the H/Hr "what if" some people see, but the fact that it's totally OOC for Harry to dance. In the book, Harry shows his love and concern for Hermione by putting blankets over her. If they had put this in the film it would have been great. The filmmakers treated to 'lift up spirits' a bit, but they shouldn't have done it. This part of the book is precisely about despair, isolation, the terrible moment they are, the lost they feel. Harry can't comfort Hermione because he can't comfort himself. The only thing he can do is to care for her, which is what he does by putting the blankets over her.
The whole discussion about the caress in Harry's head, the embrace at the Graveyard... for heaven's sake, people! You have friends, don't you? I've touched, and kissed, and embraced friends a lot of times when they needed it, and I have a girlfriend. That isn't romantic! It's friendship! Also, the graveyard scene is the closest thing to a funeral for his parents Harry has had! Hermione hugs him, of course! She is her closest (and only) friend at the moment! When my granddad died, a lot of friends hugged me... And I didn't feel that I could be involved with them! What is more, romantic thoughts were the farthest apart from my mind! Hermione and Harry are friends in a manner we can almost no understand... what they have suffered together, with Ron, is beyond our comprehension... They know each other perfectly, they love each other, but they don't are attracted to each other. End of story.

But I have to admit that I would have liked the dance more if they had put the dance at the wedding. That was a huge step for Ron and Hermione, their first shared dance. I loved that from the book.

A line I didn't notice until the second time I watched it... Hermione saying 'Never let me give you a hair cut again'. To me, this seemed to have a double meaning. Yes, she was looking at his hair and she brushes it out of his eyes at that moment, but did anyone else feel like it was in regards to Ron's leaving?

I might be stating the obvious there, or I might be completely wrong! It was just something I noticed and thought I'd bring up :P



That's how I interpreted it too :) and I think the bit where she's brushing his hair is almost like an echo to the moment in the book where she places her hand on his head as she leaves him sitting outside the tent :) so I quite liked that moment between them.

There's no need to get angry, oscpaz00, lol We all know how the book ends as well as we perfectly know that Harry and Hermione are just friends.
I like to think that Yates was influenced by JKR's statement "It could have gone that way", so that dance can be interpreted in both romantic and friendly way.

There's no need to get angry, oscpaz00, lol We all know how the book ends as well as we perfectly know that Harry and Hermione are just friends.
I like to think that Yates was influenced by JKR's statement "It could have gone that way", so that dance can be interpreted in both romantic and friendly way.

That's what annoys me the most, that line from JKR. But I don't think she really believes that... She seems to have realized that when Kloves told her so. But, as Kloves wanted a scene with Dumbledore speaking of a girl when he was gay tell us how much he understands the characters.
An example: In book six, Doumbledore asks Harry about him and Hermione. Well, one of the key points of the whole series is that Dumbledore knows Harry, Ron and Hermione perfectly! That is why he knows what to give them in his will. Dumbledore would have never thought that Harry feels something about Hermione. He knows Harry perfectly!
Another examples are that moment when Harry and Hermione laugh about Ron's dress robes... hell, it annoys me so much...

Just thought I'd weigh in on the discussion about the dance scene as one of my first posts on the board...mostly just to clear up my own thoughts on the topic.

David Yates has gone on record as saying that while the scene that was cut was touching and light-hearted, he didn't think it would fit the overall tone of the film (dark and depressing obviously) so he had to cut it out. He's also said that he they added the dance scene because he felt that segment of the film needed a touch more levity.

Now, I'm not a 'ship conspiracy theorist or anything, but that rationale is a little confusing to me, so I'm going to go with something that makes a little bit more sense to me. I see the dance scene between Harry and Hermione as doing a lot more than just adding levity to a mostly dark film. It's kind of indicative of a choice Hermione is making whether she realises it or not. We see her do it too when she takes the glasses off of Ron's face after the 7 Potters business.

David Yates has reportedly said (now, I've read people saying that he's said this, but I've never looked for the reference myself) that he told the both of them (Dan and Emma) to play that scene with some sexual tension, as if they were going to kiss at some point. And to be honest, yeah, I saw that. Mostly at the beginning where he's taking the locket off her neck and at the end before she walks back to the radio. And as much as I know book purists (I tend to play one occasionally) were revolted by the idea, I believe it. They're two young adults on the run, not knowing if they're going to succeed in their quest or if they're even going to live for much longer. Harry's left Ginny behind. Ron's left Hermione (well, the both of them, but whatever) and as much as Harry and Hermione see each other as brother and sister....they're not. They're alone and frightened and comfort seems like a pretty damn good idea, I would think, so I don't blame them (or the writers) for writing a scene that is ultimately about Harry trying to cheer up his best friend, but that also harbours subtle underlying notes of What If? It also very nicely (and subtly, again, which is what I love) ties in to a later conversation between Harry and Hermione after Godric's Hollow when Hermione very wistfully imagines if they could just stay in the Forest of Dean forever and grow old.

But, ultimately, nothing really comes of the tension of the scene. Hermione walks back to the radio in the end. She chooses Ron just as she chose Ron when she removed Harry's glasses from his face in an earlier scene (loved that, by the way).

It's a very nuanced scene I think and I was very pleasantly surprised that the actors (especially Dan Radcliffe whom I've never seen as anything special) pulled it off.

That's what annoys me the most, that line from JKR. But I don't think she really believes that... She seems to have realized that when Kloves told her so. But, as Kloves wanted a scene with Dumbledore speaking of a girl when he was gay tell us how much he understands the characters.


I don't think you can say definitively what JKR thinks and does not think. I'm pretty sure she's the only one who can do that, so I'm going to go ahead and believe her in this instance.

They're two young adults on the run, not knowing if they're going to succeed in their quest or if they're even going to live for much longer. Harry's left Ginny behind. Ron's left Hermione (well, the both of them, but whatever) and as much as Harry and Hermione see each other as brother and sister....they're not. They're alone and frightened and comfort seems like a pretty damn good idea, I would think, so I don't blame them (or the writers) for writing a scene that is ultimately about Harry trying to cheer up his best friend, but that also harbours subtle underlying notes of What If? It also very nicely (and subtly, again, which is what I love) ties in to a later conversation between Harry and Hermione after Godric's Hollow when Hermione very wistfully imagines if they could just stay in the Forest of Dean forever and grow old.



Great point :tu:

I thought it was good. I took it as "c'mere, Hermione, I'll cheer you up" rather than "c'mere, Hermione, I wanna kiss you"
And it worked. He did that weird dancing and she smiled for about 2 minutes, and that's all it was, a friendly attempt at making her smile.

Just thought I'd weigh in on the discussion about the dance scene as one of my first posts on the board...mostly just to clear up my own thoughts on the topic.

David Yates has gone on record as saying that while the scene that was cut was touching and light-hearted, he didn't think it would fit the overall tone of the film (dark and depressing obviously) so he had to cut it out. He's also said that he they added the dance scene because he felt that segment of the film needed a touch more levity.

Now, I'm not a 'ship conspiracy theorist or anything, but that rationale is a little confusing to me, so I'm going to go with something that makes a little bit more sense to me. I see the dance scene between Harry and Hermione as doing a lot more than just adding levity to a mostly dark film. It's kind of indicative of a choice Hermione is making whether she realises it or not. We see her do it too when she takes the glasses off of Ron's face after the 7 Potters business.

David Yates has reportedly said (now, I've read people saying that he's said this, but I've never looked for the reference myself) that he told the both of them (Dan and Emma) to play that scene with some sexual tension, as if they were going to kiss at some point. And to be honest, yeah, I saw that. Mostly at the beginning where he's taking the locket off her neck and at the end before she walks back to the radio. And as much as I know book purists (I tend to play one occasionally) were revolted by the idea, I believe it. They're two young adults on the run, not knowing if they're going to succeed in their quest or if they're even going to live for much longer. Harry's left Ginny behind. Ron's left Hermione (well, the both of them, but whatever) and as much as Harry and Hermione see each other as brother and sister....they're not. They're alone and frightened and comfort seems like a pretty damn good idea, I would think, so I don't blame them (or the writers) for writing a scene that is ultimately about Harry trying to cheer up his best friend, but that also harbours subtle underlying notes of What If? It also very nicely (and subtly, again, which is what I love) ties in to a later conversation between Harry and Hermione after Godric's Hollow when Hermione very wistfully imagines if they could just stay in the Forest of Dean forever and grow old.

But, ultimately, nothing really comes of the tension of the scene. Hermione walks back to the radio in the end. She chooses Ron just as she chose Ron when she removed Harry's glasses from his face in an earlier scene (loved that, by the way).

It's a very nuanced scene I think and I was very pleasantly surprised that the actors (especially Dan Radcliffe whom I've never seen as anything special) pulled it off.



I don't think you can say definitively what JKR thinks and does not think. I'm pretty sure she's the only one who can do that, so I'm going to go ahead and believe her in this instance.

Great post :tu: I liked it. You know what? I think you're right. Now that I think about it, JKR, in her interview with Melissa Anelli, said that It could have gone that way between Harry and Hermione if only they weren't so taken by Ginny and Ron, so that scene perfectly fit with what JKR said.
In the end, Hermione doesn't choose to go further just because she falls for Ron, that's why she walks back to the radio, but otherwise something would spring up between the two

My standout Ron/Hermione moment from DH was the look the way Ron looks at Hermione during the wedding. That one scene is enough to establish the fact that this is a guy who is totally in love with the girl!

Just remembered another Ron/Hermione moment: Hermione telling Harry, "I'm always mad at him." Another line that seems to sum up their relationship, in addition to "Always the tone of surprise." :)

I agree with both of these moments. I think Ron's look at Hermion is a perfect example of the film portraying Ron's attraction to Hermione. When Hermione tells harry she is always mad at Ron, I think that's the perfect example of Hermione liking Ron. I think it's pretty neat how two small moments said so much in the film.

Just been thinking about the scene in DH1 where Ron brushes Hermione's cheek, it seems to be a mirror of when he tells Hermione that she has toothpaste on her face in HBP and goes to wipe it off but stops. It's nice to see that progression, he's reached the point where he doesn't get embarrassed about it. That, along with the piano scene was probably the most memorable for me. Lots of great moments though and can't wait for the DVD to watch them all again, and the skipping stones deleted scene of course. I can totally understand why they cut that, it would have clashed with Ron's growing jealousy. Wish they had filmed a dance scene at the wedding though, how much extra time would that have added, ten seconds? Even just a glance around from Harry when he's talking to Doge would have been good. The look Ron gives Hermione when she walks in makes up for it a bit I suppose.

Since the topic has come up, I've been thinking lately that Rupert might end up in quite serious roles, and Dan more of a comic actor (Dan's interviews and a brilliant performance in Extras give me this impression).

I think DH2 will be full of many more moments, they've built it up and I think they're keeping things back for the second part and I'm withholding judgement on some of the choices made in the first part. The kiss will be much better than the books as well I think. I can even see a scenario where the cup tries to attack Hermione, and will be the spur for her to kiss Ron since the films have not incorporated the SPEW storyline (I'm new to the forum obviously so this could be common knowledge among a lot of people :/). Even if that doesn't happen and there's nothing huge that sparks the kiss, and it just happens I'll be happy.

oscpaz00, I agree with so much of what you said, but a few bits stood out to me...

The scene in PoA starts as a cute one, but the worst of it, apart from Hermione laughing at Ron (I don't find this case as terrible as the GoF scene), is that Malfoy calls Hermione a mudblood, and Ron does nothing!! ... Also, in the Snape werewolves class, Ron agrees with Snape when he calls Hermione a know-it-all. It isn't that this isn't like that in the book... it's that is completely opposite!! Ron insults Snape! Yeah, Ron and Hermione bicker, and sometimes insult each other, but they never, never, let anyone else do it!.

Ab-so-frickin'-lutely! You've made such a good point about their relationship here! Ron would NEVER - as in ever - agree with Snape in public, about anything (even if he secretly agreed with him) - never mind backing him up when he insults Hermione!! Ron is so fiercely protective of her in the books that this movie scene is actually painful for me to watch. :no: But, thankfully, Ron's characterisation in the movies has come a very long way since POA - the lowpoint of Kloves' characterisation of both Ron and Hermione. Ron was pleasingly fierce and protective in DH1. :tu:

As for the dance scene... Well, I don't mind it much at all, even when I don't like how it ends. If the dance ended with a hug between the two, showing pure friendship love, it would have been better. The worst thing about the dance is not the H/Hr "what if" some people see, but the fact that it's totally OOC for Harry to dance. In the book, Harry shows his love and concern for Hermione by putting blankets over her. If they had put this in the film it would have been great. The filmmakers treated to 'lift up spirits' a bit, but they shouldn't have done it. This part of the book is precisely about despair, isolation, the terrible moment they are, the lost they feel. Harry can't comfort Hermione because he can't comfort himself. The only thing he can do is to care for her, which is what he does by putting the blankets over her.
The whole discussion about the caress in Harry's head, the embrace at the Graveyard... for heaven's sake, people! You have friends, don't you? I've touched, and kissed, and embraced friends a lot of times when they needed it, and I have a girlfriend. That isn't romantic! It's friendship! Also, the graveyard scene is the closest thing to a funeral for his parents Harry has had! Hermione hugs him, of course! She is her closest (and only) friend at the moment! When my granddad died, a lot of friends hugged me... And I didn't feel that I could be involved with them! What is more, romantic thoughts were the farthest apart from my mind! Hermione and Harry are friends in a manner we can almost no understand... what they have suffered together, with Ron, is beyond our comprehension... They know each other perfectly, they love each other, but they don't are attracted to each other. End of story.

But I have to admit that I would have liked the dance more if they had put the dance at the wedding. That was a huge step for Ron and Hermione, their first shared dance. I loved that from the book.

Word on all the bolded bits. However, I don't agree that the scene really lifts the spirits.... I actually found it ultimately sad and melancholy, if fleetingly amusing (Harry's poor excuse for "dancing" :D).

Yes, it is OCC for Harry to initiate dancing, but I don't really mind it.... At least his dancing was awful! That was very in-character! ha ha

Also..... can I post a video here? Because this video is SO good that all Ron/Hermione fans - no, scratch that, HP fans, full stop - simply must see it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wSvadXodV0 Check out the mirroring of moments in this vid, fishorchips!

I hope I'm not breaking the rules here.... Please tell me if I am, mods.

Wow! That is a great video scooby, straight to my favourites. Someone has obviously been thinking about mirroring far more than I have!

I didn't really mind the dancing scene, I'd read in a review that Kloves took a few liberties with the film in comparison to the book and that Hermione and Harry danced "tenderly" but in the end it wasn't as I had feared. OK there were a few looks but I've danced and physically interacted with female friends all the time. Nothing comes of the dance so of course there's no suspicion on Hermione's end. The problem people have is of course with Harry and his actions, but the locket bit was a red herring in my opinion to be a huge contrast to Harry's dancing and was only done to make it all that much funnier and take even more tension away.

That was just wonderful and it shows through all the films how much their feelings have grown. On my favourite list too.

In the end, Hermione doesn't choose to go further just because she falls for Ron, that's why she walks back to the radio, but otherwise something would spring up between the two

Yep.

Now...to think of my favourite romantic moment of the film. It's hard to pick just one because there were several that I found very touching. Of course, they're all between Ron and Hermione. :D

My favourite? It's a toss up between Hermione running to Ron and removing the glasses from his face, and the "Like hell" scene.

Loved the hug because...well...because they hug :eyebrows" and because the removal of the glasses was almost an intimate thing to do. I mean, in most other instances, removing someone's glasses is an intimate gesture more often that not. Here it's more meaningful because Hermione is removing something that's not Ron's from his face. Of course, if you want to be boring, you can just see it as Hermione being her more practical self. ;)

And the "Like hell!" scene because Ron's just so incredibly badass that there's no other way to describe it but awesome and hot and incredibly touching. He's going after Bellatrix Lestrange of all people to save Hermione and he does it with the most determined and serious (and HOT) look on his face. Of course, he only makes it better by catching her when the chandelier falls and refusing to let go. :eyebrows:

I would have included the cheek graze in the cafe, but that scene was just too disturbing to be romantic. I mean, it's nice that he's wiping blood off her face, but he's also telling her to wipe someone's memory after having considered killing said person, so I'm a little on the fence about the romance there.

Oh, thought of another precious Ron/Hermione moment in the Deathly Hallows film, which made me laugh out loud when I saw it: after Ron and Harry's post-horcrux chat and the flame explosion, Hermione comes back into the tent and says, "We need to talk." Ron [nodding solemnly - reminds me of what JKR said about Harry feeling like the only non-mourner at a funeral! :lol:]: "Yeah. [dramatic pause] All right." Hermione just gives him this look - more than a little pleased with herself - and strides past him. :lol: Not that kind of talk, Ronnie! hahah <3

I am amazed by the lack of response this thread has had over the last few days, especially since it was so active for a while there!

Scooby, that video was amazing! I have favourited it and can't stop watching it :) Thankyou for bringing it into my life! Though I am certain it was what caused my many R/Hr related dreams last night, which is a bit worrying.... Also, I too loved that moment in the movie! Though I liked the "let's vote on it" moment better, the look she gives him after he raises his hand is priceless!

This movie seemed to be filled with more moments than any other despite the darkness of the situation. Really helps to lift the mood, I think it would be a horribly depressing movie to watch otherwise. But then, I'm a sucker for a cute couple! :D

Great vid, cant wait for part 2 of DH now and that kiss.

Thought I’d weigh in on the whole dance controversy. When I first saw the film, I wasn’t looking forward to it; aware of the comments I was from the cast and crew about it being a somewhat ‘what if?’ moment between Harry and Hermione, but I was able to tolerate it. It was only when I saw it a second time with a friend who is unfamiliar with the books that I realized I didn’t appreciate it at all; she saw the tension that I wasn’t willing to accept the first time. And it’s not like the dance negates anything Hermione shares with Ron or what Harry shares with Ginny, it just taints the characters a bit, and to me, almost validates Ron’s fear that something was/or could’ve been happening between them, and being the fervent Ron fan that I am, that kind of angered me. It’s strange, cause after the viewing, my friend, who is by no means what I’d call a ‘fan,’ turned and said to me, ‘I couldn’t help but feel angry at Harry and Hermione for a moment there, how could they almost do that to Ron?’ And then on the opposite side of the spectrum, I have another friend who didn’t see anything other than a ‘mate trying to cheer up his pal that was all cut up about that guy.’ If there’s one thing that scene accomplishes, it’s major ambiguity, which is interesting as it brings forth a lot of discussion. And I’ve read a lot reviews that differ in their interpretation of the scene; some have mistaken the Harry and Hermione friendship for romantic love, some saw it as Harry just trying to cheer Hermione up, and then there are those who see the sexual tension, but wish the filmmakers hadn’t gone there, and those who think it’s realistic for them to have some sort of attraction to each other. I read this (http://www.su-spectator.com/entertainment/sexual-tension-galore-in-deathly-hallows-1.1815148) article that discusses the implications of the scene and its purpose. Found it interesting.

Thought I’d weigh in on the whole dance controversy. When I first saw the film, I wasn’t looking forward to it; aware of the comments I was from the cast and crew about it being a somewhat ‘what if?’ moment between Harry and Hermione, but I was able to tolerate it. It was only when I saw it a second time with a friend who is unfamiliar with the books that I realized I didn’t appreciate it at all; she saw the tension that I wasn’t willing to accept the first time. And it’s not like the dance negates anything Hermione shares with Ron or what Harry shares with Ginny, it just taints the characters a bit, and to me, almost validates Ron’s fear that something was/or could’ve been happening between them, and being the fervent Ron fan that I am, that kind of angered me. It’s strange, cause after the viewing, my friend, who is by no means what I’d call a ‘fan,’ turned and said to me, ‘I couldn’t help but feel angry at Harry and Hermione for a moment there, how could they almost do that to Ron?’ And then on the opposite side of the spectrum, I have another friend who didn’t see anything other than a ‘mate trying to cheer up his pal that was all cut up about that guy.’ If there’s one thing that scene accomplishes, it’s major ambiguity, which is interesting as it brings forth a lot of discussion. And I’ve read a lot reviews that differ in their interpretation of the scene; some have mistaken the Harry and Hermione friendship for romantic love, some saw it as Harry just trying to cheer Hermione up, and then there are those who see the sexual tension, but wish the filmmakers hadn’t gone there, and those who think it’s realistic for them to have some sort of attraction to each other. I read this (http://www.su-spectator.com/entertainment/sexual-tension-galore-in-deathly-hallows-1.1815148) article that discusses the implications of the scene and its purpose. Found it interesting.

The only time I saw anything iffy was the beginning when Harry was taking the locket off but I've said before that I think this was just to serve as a huge contrast to the ridiculousness of the dancing. Then at the end there's a little moment but Hermione turns away, she's not interested so there's definitely no blame on her, if there's any at all.

I had also heard about it beforehand and was dreading it but in the end it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. The film was full of Ron/Hermione moments that more than made up for it.

The only time I saw anything iffy was the beginning when Harry was taking the locket off but I've said before that I think this was just to serve as a huge contrast to the ridiculousness of the dancing. Then at the end there's a little moment but Hermione turns away, she's not interested so there's definitely no blame on her, if there's any at all.

I had also heard about it beforehand and was dreading it but in the end it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. The film was full of Ron/Hermione moments that more than made up for it.

Definitely. I have no complaints with how their relationship was handled in the film; they were adorable, funny and heartbreaking - everything they are in the book. I just hate the dance scene, is all. Want to blow it up into itty bitty pieces :) Other than that, I'm good.

Personally, I think it would be unrealistic to have the two dance and for there not to be any sexual tension. I don't see why the existence of sexual tension between Harry and Hermione in this scene has to be a problem. It doesn't mean Harry has romantic feelings towards Hermione or that he is trying to seduce her. It's a natural and normal human response given the circumstances.Sorry, for coming back to this so late. I don't think it's unrealistic for people in a comparable situation to have some sexual tension. I just don't think it necessarily and inevitably has to lead to that just because two people are in such a situation. And I don't see this scene as Harry (or Hermione) having romantic feelings either. The movies, especially DH, have made it abundantly clear that it's R/Hr and H/G, IMO (although they could have done a lot more to emphasise H/G, again IMO). And that's the point. The couples have been pretty much established, why force such a "what if" on us? That's gratuitous, IMO. It doesn't further any of the plots, be it main- or sub-plots. And it doesn't further any of the characters in their development either, IMO. The fact that JKR didn't think it necessary to actually include such a scene in the book does speak for itself too.

I'm not saying it's bad for people to enjoy this scene. I personally, just can't and I wish they would have done without that.


I think the films have handled the R/Hr relationship very well so far. H/G on the other hand has been more of an after thought. I'm not counting on things getting much better in DH part 2. I think the film makers are just counting on people accepting that Harry has to end up with someone, so why not Ginny.I don't have much hope when it comes to H/G either. :( But maybe it's okay if they play it low-key. Harry is the the protagonist, the main hero of the series, but I always considered R/Hr to be the main romance so to speak. So they get the most build-up while Harry and Ginny get less.

I didn't see anything relationship-y at all about the dance. it came across, to me, as a friend trying to cheer another friend up. And failing.

This is my first time posting on a threat; however, I have been an avid reader of this site for many years. I decided now is the time to share some of my ideas now that we are coming close to the end of a great adventure with our beloved Harry Potter. Now, talking about the dance, I still have mixed opinions, and after seeing the film twice so far, with different people, I feel that the filmmakers want to show the need of closeness of two persons that have been isolated for a long time and the feel a close human contact. As an adult person, I don't see the intention of Harry purposely wanting to "seduce or sexual desire" on Hermione in anyway. I see him wanting to cheer her up during this depressing time, and when they are dancing we see that he really enjoys the proximity with her as a normal teenager would. The very slight moment of slight sexual tension is almost at the end of the dance when they have a very brief glimpse at each other. We only see Hermione pulling away from him as showing the audience that she has no romantic feeling for Harry. We don't see very clearly what Harry is feeling in that scene, but we can conclude that it was just a tender moment for him that he enjoyed but not as a desire of passion or lust. We have to remember that these kids are in a very depressing moment, and they only have one another.

The first time I saw the film, I went with my husband and two young adult sons. None of them saw any romantic aura around them. My husband has only seen the movies and he has it very clear that Ron and Hermione are in love since PoA. He did not see any sexual tension between H/Hr during the dance, and he liked that scene because it was a very tender moment in film. His opinion, which I thought interesting for someone who has never read the books, was that the scene was there to please the H/Hr shippers, since we know that they will never end up together and because of the great chemistry Dan and Emma has on screen.

The second time I went with a couple of female friends from work, who are HP fans and older than me. One of them saw just friendship and Harry wanting to cheer up Hermione, while the other saw a bit of sexual tension because of the close proximity and nobody else to turn.

In conclusion, this dancing scene will have many interpretations and enraged some fans, but we all know that in the end each pair will be like in the book. I personally loved the dance scene; I think it was a good addition to the movie. I have to agree with many posts here that H/G is not well developed and that is the reason this dance scene creates false interpretations. But it is very clear during the whole DH Part 1 movie that it is only Ron and Hermione to the end.

This is my first time posting on a threat; however, I have been an avid reader of this site for many years. I decided now is the time to share some of my ideas now that we are coming close to the end of a great adventure with our beloved Harry Potter. Now, talking about the dance, I still have mixed opinions, and after seeing the film twice so far, with different people, I feel that the filmmakers want to show the need of closeness of two persons that have been isolated for a long time and the feel a close human contact. As an adult person, I don't see the intention of Harry purposely wanting to "seduce or sexual desire" on Hermione in anyway. I see him wanting to cheer her up during this depressing time, and when they are dancing we see that he really enjoys the proximity with her as a normal teenager would. The very slight moment of slight sexual tension is almost at the end of the dance when they have a very brief glimpse at each other. We only see Hermione pulling away from him as showing the audience that she has no romantic feeling for Harry. We don't see very clearly what Harry is feeling in that scene, but we can conclude that it was just a tender moment for him that he enjoyed but not as a desire of passion or lust. We have to remember that these kids are in a very depressing moment, and they only have one another.


Very well said :agree:

The scene where they are naked taunting Ron? The nudity I felt was exploitive and uneeded. I did like Ron's jealousy though when they were walking and Harry drinks the water bottle.....as well as his rage when killing the horcrux.

The dance was cute but since we know nothing is gonna happen with them it was not as suspenseful. Had I not read the book I would be more excited thinking "Ron's gone now maybe things will shift and Harry and Hermione will heat up that tent" but alas....no.

^^^ I think the "nudity" (you couldn't see anything, and they were both wearing clothes while filming the scene) was needed. It's supposed to make Ron horrified; this is the girl he loves naked with his best friend passionately kissing him. It needed to be as awful as possible.

I wouldn't even consider that nudity :rolleyes: Yes, we they're nude, but it's not shown on screen.

I agree that the nudity was completely unnecessary and the abrupt cut back to them being naked making out was poorly done. I think it would have been better to show them slowly kiss, but i think realistic would have made it more disturbing then it was.

It's the abrupt cut that makes the scene strange for me. Strange decision...

Agree with you decarus on the fact that a more realistic kiss would have been more disturbing, which is in a way why I don't mind the quasi-nudity (and roughness of the kiss) too much. It's just so "out-there" that it means it's easier to get over than a kiss that looked sweet and tender.

Yes, I'll agree that having it realistic would be a lot more disturbing.

But I guess they wanted it Horcrux-like or something to that effect.

^^^ I think the "nudity" (you couldn't see anything, and they were both wearing clothes while filming the scene) was needed. It's supposed to make Ron horrified; this is the girl he loves naked with his best friend passionately kissing him. It needed to be as awful as possible.

The book made this clear without them being naked. I feel this was a exploitive moment since the stars are so popular now and people DO want to see them without any cloths on or at least in suggestive situations.

Ginny needing to be "Zipped up" was a bit much too, I prefer the cute little scene where they smooch in her bedroom...without George snickering in the backround. I know provides a laugh for the movie audience but I liked how simple it was in the book and wanted that for the cinema too.

I still like Bonnie and Daniel together though they're cute.

The book made this clear without them being naked. I feel this was a exploitive moment since the stars are so popular now and people DO want to see them without any cloths on or at least in suggestive situations.

Ginny needing to be "Zipped up" was a bit much too, I prefer the cute little scene where they smooch in her bedroom...without George snickering in the backround. I know provides a laugh for the movie audience but I liked how simple it was in the book and wanted that for the cinema too.

I still like Bonnie and Daniel together though they're cute.


The book implied that they were naked. and the kiss between harry/ginny in the book was not simple at all...it was an intense moment

I disagree that the book implied they were naked. I agree that it was just an excuse to show the two of them with implied nudity.

The first time I saw it, I hated the dance scene. I was thinking, "It looks like they're happy Ron left". The second time I started to see it more in the light of Harry trying to cheer her up, and it didn't bother me as much, although I still think the same sentiment could have been shown in a better way.

That being said, they couldn't have picked a better song for that scene. 'O Children' kind of captures the whole feeling of the movie.

I liked their performances in that scene. I think the trio did a great job with the locket scenes and then after it's destoyed. I really like the way Ron explains hearing Hermione's voice and how the camera kept cutting back to her ....that part in the book was less amusing and just felt like exposition but the cut-aways in the film with the score made it feel more romantic between them for me.

I don't remember it ever being implied that Harry and Hermione were naked in the book either. I hated it in the movie.

The Harry/Ginny kiss on is birthday was definitely not simple. There was definite implication there that the kiss could have led to a lot more.


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I liked their performances in that scene. I think the trio did a great job with the locket scenes and then after it's destoyed. I really like the way Ron explains hearing Hermione's voice and how the camera kept cutting back to her ....that part in the book was less amusing and just felt like exposition but the cut-aways in the film with the score made it feel more romantic between them for me.

For me, that scene has always been Ron's declaration of love without actually saying the words. I love it.

first of all i am new to this forum. I've been a fan of Harry Potter for ages and i can give a proper introduction later :)

in regards to the "Deathly Hallows, Part 1" movie, i thought it was amazing!! i saw it twice in the theater and that's something i NEVER do (because the matinee's here are $10)!

i really liked the scene where Harry and Hermione dance, and i didn't see it as the writers trying to create anything between Harry/Hermione, i saw it more as Harry can't be with Ginny and Hermione can't be with Ron so they were both sitting there miserable and Harry was just like, "well, let's TRY and be happy". Just one friend trying to cheer up another friend. And all throughout the movie, i never felt any Harry/Hermione chemistry, other than what Ron perceived there to be in his own mind......

I recommend an update with our Forum Rules (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=120541), for particular rule #1. Please don't forget that we have quite a few members who aren't older than 10, or even younger. Our aim is that they can take part in our movie discussions as well. Thanks.

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Uhm...I hope I don't get in trouble. Just wanted to comment on the Horcrux Hermione/Harry kiss.

I do think it was realistic, and I don't think the mild nudity was meant to be exploitive at all. It was meant to take Ron's despair up a notch. Besides, we have to remember that Harry, Hermione, and Ron are 17-18 years old now. Ron's fear was that the girl he loved preferred his best friend. And when he left them alone, I think it's realistic that he would have been very much worried about what they were doing. His worry would be a bit deeper than just worrying that Hermione just had a crush on Harry, or perhaps they had just cuddled and shared a peck on the cheek or something...

He was worried about just "how close" they may have gotten in his absense. And I think Horcrux Harry & Hermione's kiss not being slow and tender, but a bit more "aggressive" was supposed to imply that they had been doing this all along; it's not like a sweet first kiss.

As for the book...I don't think their clothing situation was mentioned at all. So there's no implication about what they were or were not wearing, lol. I haven't read the book in a while, so just off memory, doesn't it say something along the lines of "they were wrapped in a embrace so tight it was hard to see where one began and the other ended?"
So, I think the book implied that the Horcrux scene was very intense, so the movie just gave an interpretation of that. I think it was perfectly intense and creepy (and even a bit inappropriate), as it was meant to be.

Yay, my thread got created :clap:

Anyway, as for "that scene", I just think it's been ridiculously blown out of proportion.

I can see where the issue lies, but I personally didn't sense the sexual or romantic subtext that many got from it.

And if I were to read into it, I found it to be a fleeting "what if" moment, if anything. And could be seen as the path Hermione could've easily taken. But she doesn't, because her heart is with Ron's :)
:agree: That's how I took it too... it was pretty much a 'what if' moment in my opinion. Nothing more, nothing less.

This scene has to be looked at as being watched through Ron's mind, his fears and I think the addition of the spiders coming out of the swirling cloud leads up to this. Until now we've known that the only things Ron feared were spiders. To me there was no real nudity, the speaking figures looked unreal and evil and so did the kissing figures. Not living people at all just imaginary dream figures playing with a terrified mind.

PotterGurl08 " I do think it was realistic, and I don't think the mild nudity was meant to be exploitive at all. It was meant to take Ron's despair up a notch. Besides, we have to remember that Harry, Hermione, and Ron are 17-18 years old now. Ron's fear was that the girl he loved preferred his best friend. And when he left them alone, I think it's realistic that he would have been very much worried about what they were doing. His worry would be a bit deeper than just worrying that Hermione just had a crush on Harry, or perhaps they had just cuddled and shared a peck on the cheek or something..."
Agree with your post. It was supposed to be Ron's worst nightmare to see the girl he loves having more than just a crush on his best friend. Moreover, he left then, and during his time away he must have been thinking "what have I done?"; now the woman he loves is alone with his best friend, and he must have been going crazy thinking on what could they be doing.

The H/Hr kiss is realistic to Ron's point of view. We as viewers are suppose to feel Ron's insecurities and fears to the highest extent. I think the portrayal was well represented. Awesome job with the trio.

See i think that is where i disagree. The way to really make it really feel Ron's insecurities and fears would have been to make it seem very real in the moment that they kiss by showing them move towards each other and begin to kiss. I think this just made the audience think what in the world is going on instead of oh my goodness Harry and Hermione are kissing.

I think without the assumed nudity and more real would have been better.

The kiss only bothers me because I'm worried about how the Ron/Hermione kiss will go down. The horcrux kiss itself, of course had to happen, I definitely didn't think it was necessary for them to be naked though.

The dance bothers me far worse then the kiss.

I think Ron and Hermione's kiss will be done justice :tu: They described it as a "hell of a snog". Hopefully, we aren't disappointed.

And although I really liked the book version of the kiss, I can see why it doesn't translate well on-screen. And Harry won't be there - so Ron and Hermione get this moment to themselves :agree:

The nudity, enhanced by CGI, is an improvement on the novel in my eyes. It guarantees Ron's fear of the scenario and him acting on that fear to destroy the locket. I also think it's one of the best scenes in the movie.

The dance bothers me far worse then the kiss.

Why? There's nothing romantic about it. All Harry is attempting to do is cheer up Hermione. It worked momentarily.

See i think that is where i disagree. The way to really make it really feel Ron's insecurities and fears would have been to make it seem very real in the moment that they kiss by showing them move towards each other and begin to kiss. I think this just made the audience think what in the world is going on instead of oh my goodness Harry and Hermione are kissing.

I think without the assumed nudity and more real would have been better.

It's a vision created by a piece of Voldemort's soul. I don't think it's going to go for realistic and heartbreaking. Their kiss is supposed to be shocking and kind of nasty 'cause...you know...Voldemort just happens to be a little bit evil.

Also, Ron wouldn't have been sitting there thinking, "Oh well, they're naked, kind of silvery, and Hermione's totally eating his face, so there's no way that's actually real. I can relax now."

:hmm:

Well, on that creepy kiss... It did exactly what it was supposed to do - make you feel incredibly uncomfortable, since we're supposed to get a feeling of what Ron is feeling.

The nudity, enhanced by CGI, is an improvement on the novel in my eyes. It guarantees Ron's fear of the scenario and him acting on that fear to destroy the locket. I also think it's one of the best scenes in the movie.



Why? There's nothing romantic about it. All Harry is attempting to do is cheer up Hermione. It worked momentarily.

Because I did see something romantic on Harry's part.

On "that scene"- I am not bothered by the movie representation of "that scene". Of course I feel disgusted, but I'm disgusted over the whole scene itself ("Riddle Harry and Riddle Hermione kissing each other), not the transition between book and movie. I felt both "scenes" in the book and movie were pretty similar. I mean, that was the image that came into my head when I read the scene in the book.

The dance- Watching the dance, I didn't feel that it was romantic. It was just a sweet scene between two childhood friends. Both of them had to grow up fast, and leave everything they've known behind them. On top of that, when Ron left, they lost a part of them. I feel that they were trying desperately to hold on to the last bit of childhood that they had, the happy times they shared with each other. And when Harry held out his hand to Hermione, I felt he was trying to say "Trust me with this, Hermione" and "Just let it go for awhile" at the same time.

The dance- Watching the dance, I didn't feel that it was romantic. It was just a sweet scene between two childhood friends. Both of them had to grow up fast, and leave everything they've known behind them. On top of that, when Ron left, they lost a part of them. I feel that they were trying desperately to hold on to the last bit of childhood that they had, the happy times they shared with each other. And when Harry held out his hand to Hermione, I felt he was trying to say "Trust me with this, Hermione" and "Just let it go for awhile" at the same time.
That's pretty much how I viewed that scene as well for the most part. I thought they did a good job on it too :).

It's a vision created by a piece of Voldemort's soul. I don't think it's going to go for realistic and heartbreaking. Their kiss is supposed to be shocking and kind of nasty 'cause...you know...Voldemort just happens to be a little bit evil.

Also, Ron wouldn't have been sitting there thinking, "Oh well, they're naked, kind of silvery, and Hermione's totally eating his face, so there's no way that's actually real. I can relax now."

:hmm:

Right, lol.
It wasn't going to be a sweet, romantic kiss because Voldemort hasn't got a clue what romance is. It makes sense that Voldemort creates a tacky and vulgur image. The horcrux knew that a vulgar visual of what Ron already fears would put him on edge.

The image was created from Ron's mind not Voldemort's.

The image was created from Ron's mind not Voldemort's.


I took it as the horcrux was sensing Ron's worst fears, and then throwing them at him in the worst way possible. So the images are based on the fears in Ron's mind, but the way they are presented to him is disturbing, as is to be expected since they are being presented by the horcrux/Voldemort.

That's how I alway viewed it.

I took it as the horcrux was sensing Ron's worst fears, and then throwing them at him in the worst way possible. So the images are based on the fear's in Ron's mind, but the way they are presented to him is disturbing, as is to be expected since they are being presented by the horcrux/Voldemort.

That's how I alway viewed it.

Same here - the horcrux is playing out his fears. So I guess it was both Ron's mind and the horcrux.

Same here - the horcrux is playing out his fears. So I guess it was both Ron's mind and the horcrux.

I basically agree; the horocrux saw Ron's worst fear and then the horocrux turned it into the worst possible interpretation of those fears.

Going on about something else "romantic," and I don't even know if this belongs here but since it will be a Ron/Hermione moment...

okay, do you think in the beginning of part two Ron sees the mudblood scar on Hermione and tells her that there is no need for her to get rid of it; like he doesn't care. Idk, I was just thinking about that on the way home from class; it might be a tender moment between them.

I basically agree; the horocrux saw Ron's worst fear and then the horocrux turned it into the worst possible interpretation of those fears.

Going on about something else "romantic," and I don't even know if this belongs here but since it will be a Ron/Hermione moment...

okay, do you think in the beginning of part two Ron sees the mudblood scar on Hermione and tells her that there is no need for her to get rid of it; like he doesn't care. Idk, I was just thinking about that on the way home from class; it might be a tender moment between them.

That would be a very nice moment for them. I hope it's addressed somehow between the two of them.

I basically agree; the horocrux saw Ron's worst fear and then the horocrux turned it into the worst possible interpretation of those fears.

Going on about something else "romantic," and I don't even know if this belongs here but since it will be a Ron/Hermione moment...

okay, do you think in the beginning of part two Ron sees the mudblood scar on Hermione and tells her that there is no need for her to get rid of it; like he doesn't care. Idk, I was just thinking about that on the way home from class; it might be a tender moment between them.

Someone brought this up in the Hopes & Aspirations thread. It definitely could be an opportunity to create a tender moment between them.

I would love if Ron threw a fit after seeing the scar on Hermione's arm. He'd be yelling and cursing Bellatrix. Hermione would be trying to hold back tears and pretend it was no big deal. Then Ron would calm himself down and stop yelling, and gently pull Hermione into a hug and say something like, "I'm so sorry you had to go through that."

Here is a quote from David Heyman i read today that annoyed the hell out of me

-----------------------------------------------------------
"[Jo] loved, for example, the scene in this film where Harry and
Hermione dance. You know? And some fans will like it, some won't, but
actually Jo loved it, because... In a way, you know, there's a part of
you that thinks Harry and Hermione should have been together, even
though they weren't. And also, it's a scene without dialogue that
really says so much."
----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.snitchseeker.com/harry-potter-news/videos-david-heyman-talks-deathly-hallows-part-2-harry-potter-films-3d-conversion-78271/

The quote happens around 15:30 into the video.

I really wish JKR would stop humouring these people as she seems very unwilling to come out and tell people that their interpretations of a certain character or certain relationship is wrong.

Here is a quote from David Heyman i read today that annoyed the hell out of me

-----------------------------------------------------------
"[Jo] loved, for example, the scene in this film where Harry and
Hermione dance. You know? And some fans will like it, some won't, but
actually Jo loved it, because... In a way, you know, there's a part of
you that thinks Harry and Hermione should have been together, even
though they weren't. And also, it's a scene without dialogue that
really says so much."
----------------------------------------------------------

http://www.snitchseeker.com/harry-potter-news/videos-david-heyman-talks-deathly-hallows-part-2-harry-potter-films-3d-conversion-78271/

The quote happens around 15:30 into the video.

I really wish JKR would stop humouring these people as she seems very unwilling to come out and tell people that their interpretations of a certain character or certain relationship is wrong.


I really hate that. If Heyman, Kloves and Yates want H/Hr together so bad, then they should have just changed the story. Quotes like that are basically a slap in the face to people who want Ron and Hermione together. JKR has been very adimant that Ron and Hermione have been the couple since the first book, so when I hear that she is saying things like that, it just really bothers me. That might be overdramatic, but I hate feeling like as a Ron/Hermione fan that basically I'm wrong in wanting who I want.

Here's another article I found - sorry if it was already posted earlier.

I know it's not going to assuage anyone's feelings on that scene, but I found it an interesting read:

'Potter' writer on the new additions to 'Deathly Hallows'

The members of the Harry Potter filmmaking team typically resist discussing particular scenes from each movie in advance. But the additions that "Deathly Hallows -- Part 1" brings to the novel have little to do with surprise plot turns and everything to do with texture, emotion and character. Several new scenes hinge on the tension generated by Hermione, Ron and Harry when they go on the run through the countryside, evading their enemies and unraveling mysteries that will determine their fate and the world's. Screenwriter Steve Kloves was happy to talk about what inspired the some of film's most poignant moments. (And for full Sun coverage of "Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows -- Part 1," click here.)

Kloves on the three-way tension of Ron, Hermione and Harry in "Hallows":

"I said to [director] David [Yates] that one of the touchstones for the actors in the first place -- what's putting pressure on the dynamic -- is that both Hermione and Ron have had to leave their families. Hermione has had to literally create a safe place for her family and Ron has no ability to do that and is just worrying about them constantly . Harry is kind of -- not blissfully free, but at least free of that concern. That creates a very dangerous dynamic when things start to go wrong. David gave me the notion that we should actually see Hermione creating that safe place for her family. And I just love how he directed that scene. I love it when she disappears from the family photographs."

Kloves on why Harry and Hermione dance after Ron leaves them -- and what happens when they do:

"The radio is identified with Ron. So the radio he leaves behind in the tent in a sense becomes a surrogate for Ron. Harry fiddling with it is a way of being in touch -- of having this phantom dialogue with his friend, who has left them. But then Harry finds a Muggle radio station. What you have to realize is that both Harry and Hermione grew up as Muggles, so when this Nick Cave song comes on ('O Children'), it's like a reminder of their simpler childhood. [That's Harry and Hermione in the tent, above.]

"Harry's intention, initially, is simply to draw her out of her melancholy by distracting her. And it shows the danger of raw emotion. They begin to feel joy, which is very simple -- he's successful at drawing her out of her melancholy. But then the intimacy becomes more complicated, as raw emotions do. They realize that they're alone, and they both think of the same person, Ron, and it's complicated now.

"It's such a strong scene that everything leading up to it had to have the right rhythm, and everything exiting out of it had to have the right rhythm, so that it really wouldn't stick out. In a sense it was giving punctuation to that desolate stretch where they seem to be wandering aimlessly.

"I thought absolutely nobody would go for that scene. And it's not an easy one to pull off. I really had some anxiety about how it would come off. Then David Yates emailed me the day they shot it and said the kids were great. It was fantastic."

Source: Here (http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/movies/blog/2010/11/potter_writer_on_the_new_addit.html)

"Harry's intention, initially, is simply to draw her out of her melancholy by distracting her. And it shows the danger of raw emotion. They begin to feel joy, which is very simple -- he's successful at drawing her out of her melancholy. But then the intimacy becomes more complicated, as raw emotions do. They realize that they're alone, and they both think of the same person, Ron, and it's complicated now.

It's complicated why? Because Harry and Hermione realize they should really be together according to Heyman, and the only reason they aren't is because Ron comes back. Both of these articles just make me mad. I really should be over the whole thing by now, but when I read stuff like this is just brings back such disappointment that this scene exists, and how much these quotes undermind the Ron/Hermione relationship. Apparently JKR even thinks that Harry and Hermione probably should have ended up together too after this scene. The whole thing just really turns me off on the whole movie.

It's complicated why? Because Harry and Hermione realize they should really be together according to Heyman, and the only reason they aren't is because Ron comes back. Both of these articles just make me mad. I really should be over the whole thing by now, but when I read stuff like this is just brings back such disappointment that this scene exists, and how much these quotes undermind the Ron/Hermione relationship. Apparently JKR even thinks that Harry and Hermione probably should have ended up together too after this scene. The whole thing just really turns me off on the whole movie.

"The radio is identified with Ron. So the radio he leaves behind in the tent in a sense becomes a surrogate for Ron. Harry fiddling with it is a way of being in touch -- of having this phantom dialogue with his friend, who has left them. But then Harry finds a Muggle radio station. What you have to realize is that both Harry and Hermione grew up as Muggles, so when this Nick Cave song comes on ('O Children'), it's like a reminder of their simpler childhood. [That's Harry and Hermione in the tent, above.]

"Harry's intention, initially, is simply to draw her out of her melancholy by distracting her. And it shows the danger of raw emotion. They begin to feel joy, which is very simple -- he's successful at drawing her out of her melancholy. But then the intimacy becomes more complicated, as raw emotions do. They realize that they're alone, and they both think of the same person, Ron, and it's complicated now."

I think this is the most in depth commentary we've had on the dance scene and I think it's very clear that Ron was present. Kloves doesn't mention sexual tension here or anything. He implies that there were strong and confusing emotions going on, but also brings up the idea that Ron is at the core of these emotions. He is the centre upon which the scene revolves. Try not to be too disappointed Erin6, Kloves seems to be implying that the real emotions of each character are brought about in the loneliness of Ron's absence. At least, that's how I read it. Kloves need not have mentioned Ron at all, but he did. :tu:

Very interesting article.

EDIT: By the way, do you think Kloves meant Hermione, instead of Harry, when he spoke of fiddling with the radio. Harry doesn't fiddle with it at all does he?

It's complicated why? Because Harry and Hermione realize they should really be together according to Heyman, and the only reason they aren't is because Ron comes back. Both of these articles just make me mad. I really should be over the whole thing by now, but when I read stuff like this is just brings back such disappointment that this scene exists, and how much these quotes undermind the Ron/Hermione relationship. Apparently JKR even thinks that Harry and Hermione probably should have ended up together too after this scene. The whole thing just really turns me off on the whole movie.

Then don't watch the movie over one 1.5 minute scene based on a subplot. It's really your loss.

I personally think there were charged up moments between Harry and Hermione during that time in the DH book, so even if it was interpreted as romantic (which I don't think it was), then I don't mind.

EDIT: By the way, do you think Kloves meant Hermione, instead of Harry, when he spoke of fiddling with the radio. Harry doesn't fiddle with it at all does he?

Yeah, I'm sure that he meant Hermione since I don't think Harry ever fiddled with it. Unless I'm missing something.

But the article is saying that the radio represents Ron - although he's not there, the radio represents him. Which I find interesting since the radio is playing in the background in this scene.

I find it interesting that with everyone saying this scene kind of leaves Ron out when it seems like a lot of focus is actually on Ron in this scene as much as Harry and Hermione.

EDIT: @ erin6 - I hope you don't think that I'm trying to change your mind on this scene, because I'm not :shrug: I'm just hoping to shed some light on some of the background information involving this scene.

Then don't watch the movie over one 1.5 minute scene based on a subplot. It's really your loss.

I personally think there were charged up moments between Harry and Hermione during that time in the DH book, so even if it was interpreted as romantic (which I don't think it was), then I don't mind.

How were there any charged up moments between them during that time when Harry and Hermione hardly even spoke to each other when Ron was gone? This whole triangle subplot is totally created by the filmmakers when nothing romantic ever existed between Harry and Hermione in the books. Now Heyman is basically saying that I should want Harry and Hermione together. It's not a good thing to basically just dismiss part of your fanbase for these movies which is essentially what he is doing. I mean I can't remember a single R/Hr scene being talked up like this, or this much effort being put into one of their scenes.

I mean I can't remember a single R/Hr scene being talked up like this, or this much effort being put into one of their scenes.

To be honest, I think most of the fuss about this scene has been created by us, the fan base. The scene, I believe, is being talked up so much because it was one of the few scenes added. And it is also a very poignant scene, whether you see romance there or not. Having read many reviews and watched plenty of interviews with the cast, I can say that the only times I've come across this scene being mentioned in such depth are on snippets of interviews posted here. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough though?

I reckon I can safely say, however, that there will be as much fuss, if not more over the Ron/Hermione kiss and the changes to that scene.

To be honest, I think most of the fuss about this scene has been created by us, the fan base. The scene, I believe, is being talked up so much because it was one of the few scenes added. And it is also a very poignant scene, whether you see romance there or not. Having read many reviews and watched plenty of interviews with the cast, I can say that the only times I've come across this scene being mentioned in such depth are on snippets of interviews posted here. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough though?

I reckon I can safely say, however, that there will be as much fuss, if not more over the Ron/Hermione kiss and the changes to that scene.

I don't know about that. Both Emma and Dan have commented on the scene along with Yates, Heyman and Kloves. Yates even went out of his way to talk about the scene and the sexual tension in it.

I agree that Hermione was sitting next to the radio because she was thinking of Ron maybe trying to listen for names. It was comforting her in the same way that it comforted Ron.

I don't know about that. Both Emma and Dan have commented on the scene along with Yates, Heyman and Kloves. Yates even went out of his way to talk about the scene and the sexual tension in it.

I wasn't by any means saying that they haven't commented on the scene, just that it hasn't been the central focus of the movie or interviews like it has for the fan base. I mean, we have a thread in excess of how many pages now (?) almost entirely dedicated to this one scene. Relatively speaking, the cast and crew haven't given it as much attention as we, the fans, have.

Also, it should be noted that in the interview posted by magic_is_might, Kloves mentioned the scene in the context of other scenes added to the movie.

That being said, I do recognise the scene has been addressed numerous times by Kloves and Yates. I just think we're all making a bigger deal out of it than it deserves.