Dumbledore, an Animagus?

I heard Professor Dumbledore might be an Anigmi. That he could turn into a Pheniox. What do you think of this rumor?

I personally think this is probably a false rumor. We already have Fawkes the phoenix, so I doubt Dumbledore would be one too. They can't just be the same person because we've seen them together in the same scenes plenty of times. Plus, can magicians turn into magical creatures? All the people who are animagus that we've seen so far (as I recall) only turn into normal animals (McGonagall=cat, Peter=rat, Sirius=dog, etc.). Magicians might not even be allowed to turn into such a magical creature like a phoenix. Just a thought. :D The rumor could be true, I don't really know...but somehow I don't think Dumbledore is an animagus.

I really doubt that Dumbledore is an Animagus. What would he change into? I'd say a lemon drop but that isn't an animal...

Originally posted by Qeomash
I really doubt that Dumbledore is an Animagus. What would he change into? I'd say a lemon drop but that isn't an animal...

LOL. That's funny

what about a bumblebee :??: but what real diference would it make if Dumbledore was a animgus

I always wondered about this. I think that DD could be a Animagi, after all he was the transfiguration teacher before he became headmaster. If his one I highly doubt that he is a phoenix. I like the idea of a bumble bee.

I don't know. I don't think that there is any evidence out there to support Dumbledore being a animagi. And, I'm going to have to back seashell on this one--I don't think that animagi can turn into magical creatures-only normal ones.

I was wondering about this myself. dumbledore is 150 years old and hremione says that there were only seven register animagi in the last century, so dumbledore wouldn't have been on that list if he was one. and maybe the records in the school only go back 100 years. I think it could be a possibilty, but i have no idea what sort of animal he could be, just not a pheonix.

I would think that the records would list any active/living animagi and Dumbeldore does not seem like the type to be a secret animagus, so I don't think so or else Hermione would have mentioned it.

Maybe Hermione hasn't thought about it. Maybe she thinks Dumbledore would have told Harry. I think we're all cluless to this one:??:

I don't think Dumbledore is a animagusi...but if he is, maybe e isn't on the register, finding it more important that it is kept a secret....or maybe he was in the past but he hasn't used it awhile and has been taken off the list (okay a little out there but anything is possible:) )

I believe that Dumbledore is a animagus. But I don't have any positive evidence to prove it. I think we will find out for sure in the next book. I also think that Dumbledore, in his animagus form, has been keeping an eye on Harry.

Well, if he is I don't think it will be important, cos it would be chewing an idea that has already benn very important over and over again and that is not JK. And i'm 100% sure he's not a Phoenix, because Phoenixes are powerfully magical individuals themselves so it would feel wrong changing into one - like changing into another human.

kgonekrazy, I've never thought about Dumbledore being the transfiguration teacher before. That makes it seem more possible (to me anyway) that Dumbledore is an animagus. Though, I still don't think he is one.

On an unrelated note, at my Uni, they have a poster sale called "Imaginus" Poster Sale. I saw the sign today and had to look twice. The first time I thought it said "Animagus"!

Ok, here is the argument for DD being an Animagius:

1)We all know that DD is a very powerful wizard, maybe the most powerful in the world. This means that he is more then capable of being an animagius.

2)He used to be the transfiguration teacher.

3)His name is in fact taken from an animal (bumblebee).

I my opinion it is a weak argument but I think that it is possible. Hey, anything is possible!!!

I say it's 50-50 chance of that being right. :hmm:

Remember when Dumbledore told harry in PS that he didn't need a cloak to become invisible. That's never been explained, what if that has something to do with his being an animagus?
What's the magical animal in Fantastic Beasts that can become invisible at wish?
I'm going to look it up.

I doubt him turning invisible will be important, as it was left out of the movie completely. Of course, so was the fact that it was Sirius Black's motorcycle that Hagrid was riding.

Anywho, there is a fairly good chance that he can do it. Who wouldn't love to see a bumblebee with a half moon eye markings? Besides, do you think that Peter, James, and Sirius could have learned such a complicated task on their own? I have a feeling that they received some sort of instruction from him so that they could be with their friend Remus.

Originally posted by Filius Flitwick
Besides, do you think that Peter, James, and Sirius could have learned such a complicated task on their own? I have a feeling that they received some sort of instruction from him so that they could be with their friend Remus.

I was under the impression that DD was completely in the dark about Peter, James, and Sirius being animagi. This is what he said at the end of PoA:
"Last night Sirius told me all about how they became Animagi... ...An extraordinary achievement-- not least, keeping it quiet from me."

Originally posted by Filius Flitwick
I doubt him turning invisible will be important, as it was left out of the movie completely.

I haven't seen the movie for a while, but i had the feeling dumbledore did say it there too. In the scene with the mirror of erised?

I'll have to watch it again and check.

I think turning invisible without an invisibility cloak is some kind off an art. You have to learn it, it takes time. Just like martial arts or karate. Dumbledore probably mastered it.

Originally posted by kgonekrazy
I was under the impression that DD was completely in the dark about Peter, James, and Sirius being animagi.

You are correct. Lupin also said at the end of PoA that he had never told Dumbledore that Sirius was an animagus and might have been using that trait to sneak past the dementors into the castle, because it would have meant revealing that he had lured three people into becoming illegal animagi, and Dumbledore's trust had been very important to him. Lupin therefore convinced himself that Sirius had been getting in by using Dark magic that he'd learned from Voldemort.

PoA also notes that it took Sirius, Peter, and James until their fifth year to accomplish the animagus transformation, and Peter needed all the help he could get.

So, no - Dumbledore did not help the Marauders become animagi. They did it without his knowledge.

Did it mention a time frame that they did their transformation in?
I can't seem to remember exactly but it wasn't in the first year.
In one of the threads it is suggested that Dumbledore reads minds
but that can't be or he would have known about this.
If I had that power I would be probing Lupin's minds and not
some girly first year. Find out what his favorite movie is, date...Nevermind.

Dumbledore can do a lot but animagi and mind reading and all that stuff he doesn't need to do. He isn't power hungry.

In the very begining of the first book he approaches Minerva in her animagi form. How come he just goes about in muggle town looking as he does? If he had the power would he use it?
Minerva does *all the time*.

Originally posted by Fuchsia
Did it mention a time frame that they did their transformation in?
I can't seem to remember exactly but it wasn't in the first year.

James, Peter, and Sirius managed to complete the Animagus transformation in their fifth year.

Originally posted by Fuchsia
In the very begining of the first book he approaches Minerva in her animagi form. How come he just goes about in muggle town looking as he does? If he had the power would he use it?
Minerva does *all the time*.

He could probably be more inconspicuous if he wanted to be. J.K. Rowling said he appeared so suddenly that it was as if he came out of nowhere. I think he apparated, if it's possible to put a silencing charm on apparation. For that matter, transforming into an animal makes a pop too.. Hmm.
It's possible that he is an animagus. He's certainly very powerful, so I'm sure he could do it. He never has been a stickler for rules, has he? He actually asked an Auror to do an unforgivable curse on students.
Knowing him and his fight against the Dark Arts, it might have been more useful to him if he could go animalistic at an unexpected time when necessary without his opponent knowing what was coming.

According to Lupin during that epsiode in the Shrieking Shack, " It took them the best part of three years to work out how to do it. " "Finally, in our fifth year,they managed it." So they started working on it in their 2nd year?

Thanks Romulus_Lupin.

Amy, you're right. Dumbeldore is probably an animagi and just didn't put his name down. It won't go terribly wrong for him. He doesn't need to be regulated (though a little hypocritical and thinking himself above rules if he does this).

If he is an Animagi then he probably did it before he was 50 and wouldn't be from the last century. Meghan, I think your theory sounds better than him just not reporting it. It seems like only people who have something to hide would be the ones that don't report they are one. Kind of like the Flamel thing, Hermione just didn't check that far back.

I sincerely hope that there are NO more animagi in future books. Having the Marauders as animagi, that was cool. But I think JK rowling took it too far making Skeeter an animagus. I envisioned the marauders as brilliant ppl, somehow finding out how to make themselves animagi. But when Skeeter was one, it totally ruined the image I had of becoming an animagus being such a daunting task. Skeeter somehow made it seem...simple :). Also, if anyone else is revealed to be one, I think the concept would be overused :)

I am wondering why more wizards don't do it though.
Is it really *that* hard when students can do it?
Wouldn't they want to try every aspect of magic that they can?
Especially one of the dark wizards. It just wouldn't be
realistic if Lucius didn't do it. Not that I want to read about
Lucius giving messages to his son in snake form or anything.

if anyone else is revealed to be one, I think the concept would be overused
I totally agree. However, the idea of Dumbledore becoming an Animagus before last century is pretty brilliant, too, cos it would settle all those report conflicts. And his name is conspicious...though I have to say, it just seemed to fit for his character anyway, you know,like bumblebees are not really dangerous,and look kind of nice fat and funny.Wouldn't they want to try every aspect of magic that they can? Especially one of the dark wizards.
I could imagine that to change into an animal you have to be emotionally close to it in some way, which is why it to some degree reflects your personality. Now many of the Death Eaters don't seem close to any living creature so perhaps the Animagus spell wouldn't exactly be their way of transforming.

It's quite possible that they are. We haven't learned very much about them at this point. However, it seems to take a long period of time to work the spell, and the Death Eaters wouldn't have that time if they were in Voldemort's command--and an ordinary working person wouldn't either. The boys had the option of roaming around a very good library in the dead of night; most adults don't. And for the ones who don't want to break the law, registering is probably an annoyingly long process.

Dumbledore, an Animagus? It's possible...but there really isn't much truth to support it either way. He probably wouldn't need to be an Animagus; he's a powerful wizard and there are probably more precise ways of keeping out of sight. And the Animagus theme would be a little dry at this point.

Peter had an affinity towards rats. He's not good by any means or sensitive to the plights of others except for them. He relates.

Lucius could relate to a snake.

They did have an awful lot of downtime while Voldie was gone.
We know they didn't go look for him as he reminds us daily.
Whine whine whine no one looked for me whine whine whine.
Lucius is busy though. Bad example. Karkaroff runs a school.
If they weren't all such powerful men!
Any losers in the bunch? Oh wait that's the old crowd.
They are all so focused. Draco isn't focused enough. I can see him
wasting all his time on that. Crabbe could do it with him and become a flobberworm.

More about the nuances of animagi....
If someone were another creature would they be effected
by the same types of magic? Like a toad couldn't be turned into a werewolf? Or what?
This is probably going to lead nowhere.

I actually think he is. People often bring up Hermione saying that there were only a few in the last century to become animagi. But, Dumbledore is 150, so he most likely could be an animagi. JKR could have made Hermione say the he wasn't at all, but only a century? Fishy, fishy.

EDIT: I didn't read the post, but I saw that some people already brought up Dumbledore being over a centruy old.

actually, dumbledore being an animagus would be cool. although there are hardly enough facts to support this.

i wonder what the requirements for being a transfiguration teacher is? why was dumbledore a transfiguration teacher in the first place? somehow, all of the facts in the books eventually led to some future revelation. i guess this will also answer if dumbledore is indeed an animagus

Being a transfiguration teacher doesn't necessarily mean you are an animagi. They could just be good at that. Out of a bobby pin? Transfigure something.

i guess you're right. but i still wonder on the choice of subject for dumbledore. if he's the transfiguration teacher, he must be real good at transfiguration, it must be his specialty. but then again, maybe he taught that because it was the only one available at that time. looking at the lockhart business, sometimes hogwarts hire people because there's no other applicants. not that i'm saying that dumbledore is incompetent. he's one of the greatest wizards of all time.

I have no doubts that Dumbledore could be an animagi if he wanted to.
He sets his mind to things and gets it done.
But being able to do something and doing them are two different things.

I agree with some of the points raised here.... Dumbledore is such a powerful wizard that being an animagus is almost a given.... however, unless stated in the story.... I'm sticking to his not being an animagus... and I don't believe that he can turn into a phoenix... although I believe that his patronus is probably a phoenix.... as Harry's is a stag...

Dumbledore was Riddle's transfiguration teacher. I've never known a transfiguration teacher who wasn't an animagus.

That's because you only know one other transfiguration teacher...

He's either a bumblebee (if you take his name literally - as with most Harry Potter characters), or an Owl. I can't imagine him being anything else.

still....

he might be a dragon. i mean, dumbledore is the only wizard voldemort fears, and dragons are feared...

anyways, we have only know ONE tranfiguration teacher, who happens to be an animagi. that does not mean every teacher before or after her time HAS to be one.

If he is an animagi I think he is a Phoenix. He has a very strog relationship with Fawkes it seems. He could be.

samething i thought a pheonix, i think he can talk to falwkes maybe....

Yea, cedric, thats what I was thinking- he could talk to Fawkes, maybe he told Fawkes to save Harry in CoS.

There is a little bit of a possiblility of the bumblebee. He did say to Harry that he had ways of knowing what goes on around the place. Though if this were true he'd be registered. He's not the kind of wizard (i.e Sirius) to go about it the illegal way. So maybe he was some other way around the place.

I thought you were going to ask who Dumbledore was, lol. I was ready to scream at you "read the book!" before I came in here. Anyway, I think, if anything, Dumbledore would be a phoenix...but I would hate for him to be; the whole "secret unregistered animagus" thing has already been done to pieces.

If Dumbledore was an Animagi, we would know by now. Hermione would have definately spilled the beans. She read a list of every registered Animagi in the country (or was it world?) this century, and I think she would recognize Dumbledore's name. I highly doubt that he's unregistered - he may not agree whole-heartedly with the MoM sometimes, but I don't think he would be doing things illegally. Yes, it is possible that he registered in the 1800s (he is, like, 150?), but the whole secret Animagi thing has been done before. Too predictable for JKR.

Dumbledore was Riddle's transfiguration teacher. I've never known a transfiguration teacher who wasn't a woman...

Sorry, couldn't resist :D
Anyway, I think I recall JKR saying there won't be any more surprise animagi in the books.

I'd heard somewhere, though I can't say I recall where, that Dumbledore was very likely an animagus. I can't see why he wouldn't be - he's darn near everything else. He's old - and he's brilliant.

He might be a moth. Though that could be *very* dangerous around all those owls. It would not surprise me in the slightest if he turned out to be anything - owl, bee, whatever. I'm sure he is.

I would wonder when the animagus registry was even started? He very likely predates it.

-zora

hermione only looked up registered animagi for this century. He could have registered before that, he is 150 years old after all...

I think, if he was an animagus at all, it would be something totally opposite to Slytherin's snakes, like a phoenix or a rooster whose crow kills the basilisk.

The only way he is not an animagus is that he doesn't want to be, but I seriously doubt that. I think the fact that we found out he was the Transfiguration teacher means something. Even if he wasn't I would still think he could be animagus. He is themost powerful wizard in the world, and the idea that Rita Skeeter, and Pettigrew, as well as many others are animagus, but some how DUmbledore just can't figure it out...riiiiiiiight. No way, he is an animagus. My bet is he is a Phoenix, and possibly he too may rise from ashes after he temporarily leaves us through death. However, that may come to close to mirroring LOTR. But I am pretty sure he is a phoenix.

Dumbledore is an old wizard who is the current guardian of the Phoenix.
He was the transfiguration teacher before he was headmaster....James's wand was excellent for transfiguration. I believe that he is related to Harry and that is why he was able to decide what happened to Harry. Also why a family heirloom like the invisibility cloak was returned to Dumbledore.

I agree with the fact that the mention of dumbledor being the transfiguration teacher is very telling, But i'm toying with the idea of him being able to transform into something other than an animal, perhaps liquid or mist. Too far fetched? I dont know they do transfigure soiders into buttons in the novels. I wonder if there a registery book for all those who can transform into things other than animals?

I don't think he's an animagus. Because Hermione checked out the list of registered Animagus Wizards, unless he wasn't registered which I doubt, with a wizard of his class. So, he probably isn't an animagus.

IMO there is now way he isn't some sort of animagus. It is just silly to think that in the 150 years he has been alive, and how ever many years he was the transfiguration teacher, not to mention how long he has been the most powerful wizard in the world, that he never ever bothered to learn how to transform into an animal. It is not like he would have trouble with it. As for the list that Hermione read...there are so many ways JK could mess with that. When it was written, who wrote it, we do not know the terms under which one must register. For all we know, the ministry purposely keeps some wizards off the list. Dumbledore is also 150 years old, and I believe (but i am not sure) that the list Hermione read was only 100 years old. This means that if Dumbledore registered before the age of 50 he would not be on the list Hermione saw. Another possibility is that he too changed his name when he bacame a powerful wizard, or maybe for some other reason, and his birth name was on the list and therefore Hermione did not recognize it. And finally he could just not be registered...what are they gonna do throw him in Azkaban...I don't think so.

He may not ever have wanted to be. Perhaps he'd rather be a human all of the time? It's not unlikely. He may just have never felt any need or desire to be an animal, especially if he has other ways of doing things that even we don't know about.

But in relation to the story, it may not work either. He has no traits of one specific animal, like the other Animagi do. He has no purpose to be an animal, like Rita Skeeter did. And as wonderful an idea as Animagi are, I think someone turning out to be one might get a bit repetative, even if it's not important to the plot.

Originally posted by banyopp (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=178282#post178282))
IMO there is now way he isn't some sort of animagus. It is just silly to think that in the 150 years he has been alive, and how ever many years he was the transfiguration teacher, not to mention how long he has been the most powerful wizard in the world, that he never ever bothered to learn how to transform into an animal. It is not like he would have trouble with it. As for the list that Hermione read...there are so many ways JK could mess with that. When it was written, who wrote it, we do not know the terms under which one must register. For all we know, the ministry purposely keeps some wizards off the list. Dumbledore is also 150 years old, and I believe (but i am not sure) that the list Hermione read was only 100 years old. This means that if Dumbledore registered before the age of 50 he would not be on the list Hermione saw. Another possibility is that he too changed his name when he bacame a powerful wizard, or maybe for some other reason, and his birth name was on the list and therefore Hermione did not recognize it. And finally he could just not be registered...what are they gonna do throw him in Azkaban...I don't think so.


I don't agree with this, first of all, it's not a must for a wizard to become animagi. Voldemort isn't one and he was one of the most powerful wizards ever to live. There is no evidence supporting what you just said, about 100 years old list and all. And I don't think he changed his name, because he had a brother who was called Aberforth Dumbledore. Both of them couldn't have changed their names.

But this has led me somewhere else, if Dumbledore is 150 years old, that means he was borned in the 1850s. That's cool. Did wizards interfere in the World Wars?(Probably not, since this is just a story)

Hermione doesn't tell Harry and Ron everything she knows. Dd might be in the register.
But I agree that Dd perhaps never felt a need to be an animagus. there seems to be some confusion abt this word. It's latin and therefore one animagus and many animagi.
Dd defeated Grindelwald back in 1945. I think this means the wizarding world was inwolved in ww2.

Yeah, maybe Grindewald was someone like Hitler. And in the 1990s, Voldemort rose. Saddam. And now, he's risen again. This seems to fit in with today's situation. Coincedence or conspiracy?

It must be coincidence because JKR made up the whole plot long before PS was published in 1997. But let's not name Voldie lookalikes in this forum. Because that might rise temberature too much, and I wouldn't appreciate flames out of my computer screen when I log in

I don't actually think Dumbledore changed his name, I throwing random junk out sometimes because it spawns other ideas. I can totally understand how Dumbledore coul not be an animagus by choice. I always assumed he was. The only thing is we were told that he was a transfiguration teacher. I really do think there was a reason we found that out. We are supposed to know that his specialty is transfiguration. We have yet to see any of Dumbledore's transfiguration skills, this is what i am interested in. I honostly don't care if he is an animagus or not, I also think that JK won't repeat some surprise animagus thing, she has done that.

As to Dumbledore turning into something else besides an animal I think this could be possible. They turn inanimates objects into animals, and animals into inanimate objects. So couldn't they do it with people?

Oh i had a question to throw out. I thought that the in mythology there was one and only one phoenix. But i thought Dumbledore adressed the phoenix in a plural reference, maybe not. I don't really remember.

It would be cool if it is revealed that he is an animagus like in Book 6 or Book 7 when the "unregistered animagi" subject has faded. Maybe there will be a point where we are supposed to thing that Dumbledore has died when in reality he has just switched to his animal form. If he was an animal I would guess:

-Phoenix
-Bumblebee
-Dragon
-Lion(Gryffindor)

I think that Dumbledore is related to Harry too. It is possible to be related w/out changing names, for example, Dumbledore could be an uncle of some kinf.

Originally posted by 1MelissaPotter5 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=177527#post177527))
If he is an animagi I think he is a Phoenix. He has a very strog relationship with Fawkes it seems. He could be.

Melissa...I support your idea strongly....And I do think Dumbledore is an Animagus

:'( :'( MY guitar broke apart today...I'm desolate :'( :'(

I've merged the thread "What is Dumbledore?" with the previous "Dumbledore, an Animagus?".

I reread some of the posts, and I think I want to add something...

Dumbledore doesn't actually *do* a remarkable amount of magic of any kind in the books. He does use the ennervate spell, I think more than once, but it's more that he's "everywhere" that he needs to be. He knows WAY more than someone who merely putters about in his office would normally so I expect that he's flitting around the school in some other form.

He did say to Harry that he didn't need an Invisibility cloak to move about unseen. I don't remember if that was only in the film, or if it was in the book - I'm only on my first re-read of the 1st book. But I know I recalled it, and it was mysterious at the time, but putting it into place with this discussion, it would lead me to believe that yes, he's some kind of *small* or *innocuous* animal. A mouse, bee, sparrow, owl... Owls are always around.

In the first few minutes of the *film* version, they distinctly show an owl flying into the same forest where he appears for the first time, I don't know if that was something that the director just slipped in, or if JKR had something to say about it. It'd be a strong clue to find that out.

But either he is completely adept at going invisible, sneaking around silently, or casting spells that act like Webcams all over the place... (which are all likely, anyway) I think he must be something small and pervasive that wouldn't get noticed. Another phoenix flying around might be a bit too ... conspicuous.

--zora

Dumbledore wouldn't be an animagi, or else he'd turn into one like how Prof.Mconagall does. Just because he was the transfiguration teacher, doesn't mean he has to be animagi. And I don't think JKr would use her same old tricks again, she's too original.

Sirius I understand that you don't think he is an animagi and that Jk won't repeat her tricks. I agree with the fact that Jk will not use any of her methods used in book four to surprise us. I think that if we were to find out that Dumbledore was an animagus it would not be some big surprise, but more like...oh yea of course he is. I picture Harry asking him if he is and DD replying "Why yes." Then Harry would asking why he never told him or how no one knew and he would simply say "no one ver asked me". That would be that, no big huge surprise no real questions answered, except that obviously the greates wizard in the world who specializes in transfiguration can become an animagi if he so chooses.

I think not, if he were an animagi, it'd be in his profile. Though many people think he's an animagi, I disagree. Why doesn't he ever turn into an animal then??? And Hermione did check the list of Animagus wizards, and she'd have told Harry and Ron that Dumbledore was one very excitedly if he was. Does anyone wonder though, who the other animagus wizards are?? And if they'll ever be mentioned?

Originally posted by zora_domina (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=179612#post179612))
I reread some of the posts, and I think I want to add something...

Dumbledore doesn't actually *do* a remarkable amount of magic of any kind in the books. He does use the ennervate spell, I think more than once, but it's more that he's "everywhere" that he needs to be. He knows WAY more than someone who merely putters about in his office would normally so I expect that he's flitting around the school in some other form.

ZORA!!...That's an interesting theory that I can buy!!!..I have always believed that Dumbledore could transform into a phoenix, but what you said could make sense.
By the way...It was in the book where Dumbledore said that he doesn't need an Invisivility Cloak. :)
Best...Jofp

Sirius, I will agree to the fact that he may not be an animagus, if you agree to the fact that if he wanted to he cretainly could be :p .

However, I must say there is a connection between Dumbledore and the phoenix. Something binds them that we have yet to loearn of I believe.

I also noticed where DD says he does not need an invisibility cloak to be invisible, however at the time I figured there was an advanced spell to make yourself invisible. If that does not exist then I believe there is a nice surprise regarding DD's talents.

Dumbledore has many skills that I believe we have yet to learn. He appears to never do magic whereas I believe he is doing magic constantly, however it is a type of magic we have not yet learned of because it is very difficult and takes someone of DD's skill to master.

There will be a time where we see Dumbledore in full power, he will show is ability and it will be unforgetable.

I too have wondered about Albus! I oft wondered if he isn't Hedwig!

Does Albus in Latin means White??? If so, more proof for me :clappy: :whistle:

That's an intriguing theory Fred, however... Hedwig has been referred to as female consistantly in the books. I can't say for sure but they've had to appeared together at least once. *shrug* but I can't be certain of that.

I wonder if an Animagus would be able to shift gender? I would say that changing into another human shape would be another power entirely - and not an easy one considering how the Polyjuice spell takes so long to make and tastes so awful...

So, kudos for an interesting theory, but I don't think that's it. (But it wouldn't surprise me if he turned out to be an owl in general.)
And yes, Albus does mean white.

White bumblebee. Hmn. :)

-zora

zora_domina, thanks!

Yeah, come to that, I don't remember Hedwig's gender being mention before! Maybe I just missed it???

Am I being complacent with the books and tapes? Since I have listened and re-read them so many time, I might have missed that bit of info?


There are a couple of things that makes me wonder:- I don't remember seeing Dumbledore or Hedwig together (that's a biggie for me), it's pure white (so-so) and Albus is Latin for white...white beard?? Hagrid (with Albus instruction) got it for him so that (Albus) can watch over him at the Dursley's? These and many other (well...not so many) have be bugging me for a while now.

Originally posted by zora_domina (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=181111#post181111))
That's an intriguing theory Fred, however... Hedwig has been referred to as female consistantly in the books. I can't say for sure but they've had to appeared together at least once. *shrug* but I can't be certain of that.

I wonder if an Animagus would be able to shift gender? I would say that changing into another human shape would be another power entirely - and not an easy one considering how the Polyjuice spell takes so long to make and tastes so awful...

So, kudos for an interesting theory, but I don't think that's it. (But it wouldn't surprise me if he turned out to be an owl in general.)
And yes, Albus does mean white.

White bumblebee. Hmn. :)

-zora

I wanna add that I don't think DD is Hedwig...In GoF, Harry sent Hedwig to Sirius and it took her a very long period of time to get back....So...People would wonder where could have been DD in that time....don't you think so?
I'm still supporting the Phoenix theory

The teachers MIGHT know that Hedwig is Dumbledore, therefore they would know. There is other things protecting Harry besides Mrs. Figgs!

Do we know where the teachers go for the summer or for that matter where they go...PERIOD???

Still think Albus is Hedwig and he could also be Harry's great-great (150 yrs old(?) ) grand father??? I feel he is some how related to Harry! It could be from his mum or dad side! But no matter what; Dumbledore is protecting (he himself) Harry!

I love this theory, even though I think it may not be true, I really like it. One thing though when Hedwig is making th elong journeys to Sirius and she returns and Harry does not give her a treat, she gets all cranky and sulks and tries to bite him. That seems more like an animals reaction than a wizard. But hey DD may have wanted an owl treat! lol

Oh one more thing, how can you tell an owl's gender, if someone told Harry "Hedwig is a girl", do you think he would flip her over and search for proof, probably not. I really like this theory the more i think about it.

Hedwid is a girl's name. Yes she is female. I don't think that JKR would mess things up allowing animaguses to change gender.

It's also hard to believe that Dd would spend the whole summer with Harry as Hedwig. He ought to have other things to do.

I don't understand why everyone should be everyone's relative. All members of the old crowd would feel they owed Lily and James to protect their son. And Harry, as the boy who lived, is a very important symbol for hope that Voldie perhaps could be finally defeated. That's reason enough to protect him.

Originally posted by Alastor D (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=181720#post181720))
Hedwid is a girl's name. Yes she is female. I don't think that JKR would mess things up allowing animaguses to change gender.


Alastor!!
poke: ....Hedwig is the name of a medieval saint. I guess is a last name of that saint...So it has not gender, and in any event the saint was male. So, I wouldn't be surprised if Hedwig ends being male though it's traeted in the books as female and you have the perception that is female...But is only perception!!! Rowling plays a lot with that!!!...You perceive Sirius as the bad guy and it turns to be the opposite!!!
Best...Jofp

Dumbledore is definitely capable of bieng an animagus. He probably isnt as phoenix, since he alredy has one. The ministry probably doesn't allow people to turn into magical creatures. Imagine if the death eaters all could turn into maticores? Terrible thought.

I can't imagine Harry as a Stag.... It just occurred to me that his father *was* an animagus, with the same animal as his Patronus.

What have we seen was DD's patronus? That might give a good clue. (sleepy. Can't go quoting like I usually do because I'm so sleeeepy. And my cats are tearing up the bed and getting their claws stuck in my blankets...)

so, someone else go look that up. :)

-zora

I read a quote from JK somewhere that said "Harry will not develop the skill of animagus as his father did." :( I will try and find it again, I just don't remember where I saw it.
-bany0pp

Originally posted by JofpGallagher (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=182299#post182299))
Alastor!!
poke: ....Hedwig is the name of a medieval saint. I guess is a last name of that saint...So it has not gender, and in any event the saint was male.


I'm sorry Jofp. You got that from an unreliable source. Hedwig is a first name and a womans name. Any speaker of Scandinavian or German languages can confirm that. It's a well known name currently in use.
Quite confusing, I admit because Ludwig = Ludovic (Bagman) = Louis is a mans name.

Are You sure that saint was male?

Yes, JKR plays a lot, but would she really contradict herself like that in order to make us so cunfused we don't understand anything?

Hedwig is from the very beginning referred to as female. And Crookshanks as male. I believe in that until JKR herself says I'm wrong.

... Wouldn't it be horrible to be a cat Animagus and then get stuck, found by some well-meaning Crazy Cat Lady (tm) and NEUTERED???

Aaaaiiiiee!

Sorry, I really should learn to post here EARLY in the day instead of right before bedtime. LOL!

... I can't see Dumbledore being a phoenix, really. I'd hold out for owl.

Heh. Maybe he's Pigwidgeon. hee! I mean, let's face it, Pig IS the bumblebee of the owlery.

*snork!*

-zora

Originally posted by Alastor D (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=183303#post183303))

Are You sure that saint was male?




You are right, the saint was female.

Originally posted by Alastor D (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=183303#post183303))
I'm sorry Jofp. You got that from an unreliable source. Hedwig is a first name and a womans name. Any speaker of Scandinavian or German languages can confirm that. It's a well known name currently in use.
Quite confusing, I admit because Ludwig = Ludovic (Bagman) = Louis is a mans name.

Are You sure that saint was male?

Yes, JKR plays a lot, but would she really contradict herself like that in order to make us so cunfused we don't understand anything?

Hedwig is from the very beginning referred to as female. And Crookshanks as male. I believe in that until JKR herself says I'm wrong.

Well...I don't remember whre I found the meaning of Hedwig as a saint, but I went to http://www.behindthename.com and I have found that Hedwig is a German name with two meanings..."Contention" (Hedu) and "war" (Wig)...I don't know what to think. I have found also a movie that is calle "Hedwig and the Angry Inch" and Hedwig is a transexual..hehehe...that doesn't help in order to establish gender of the name...In any event..I have always believed that Hedwig is she...
thanks...:)

Yes Jofp. You are on the right track. I am afraid I'll be told to go somewhere else very soon because this thread was supposed to be abt Dd as animagus. But I'll take the chance and try a shortened translation from a very useful and very old dictionary I have (sorry for the bad English):
HEDVIG, german womans name (ancient Haduwic, from Hadu the god of war-luck, norse Hödr. and wic, norse vig = battle, fight. Hence Lucky soldieress, victoress. Quite a good name for a fierce creature like a Snowy Owl, isn´t it?

In order to add confusion it seems they used a male one to play Hedwig's role in the PS film. A female shouldn't be that white, but should have been even bigger. (There were some good photos in National Geographic Dec. 2002). (nationalgeographic.com/ngm0212) But then again, the film is not canon.

I don't know about mediaval saints, but a book named "The magical worlds of Harry Potter" by David Colbert says:
"Hedwig: A saint who lived in Germany in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries. An order of nuns established under her patronage chose as its work the education of orphaned children - like Harry."

I think that Dumbledore is an Animagus, and that his alternate form is a bumblebee.

1. He was the transfiguration teacher.

2. He has a considerable sweet tooth (don't insects like sweets a lot?)

3. JKR made so many of the names mean something that it has always bothered me that there was no obvious connection regarding the fact that Dumbledore means bumblebee. After all, she went to the trouble to give him a first name that has a very telling connection to the name Severus. Why would she leave his last name up to chance? I think that the translation is a very important clue, and that it most likely means that he is an Animagus bumblebee.

4. As for his being an Animagus not being generally known, how do we know that it isn't? People are forever talking about how great a wizard he is, but they don't enumerate every one of his skills. For all we know, every adult wizard and witch in the wizarding world might know that he is an Animagus. Let's face it, it wouldn't be the first time that Harry, Hermione and Ron were completely in the dark about some commonly known fact.

5. I think the fact that Hermione only looked up wizards registered in this century is a probably clue to Dumbledore being Animagus. After all, why would she say "in this century" instead of "every living Animagus?" It seems to me to be the kind of tiny addition an author would use to divert her readers from the truth. Her whole game in these books is to make us look one way and then surprise us with the other hand. [Note the magician allusion.]

6. Regarding Dumbledore's closeness to Fawkes, how old do you think Fawkes is? He lives, he grows old, he bursts in to flame, and then he lives again. This could go on indefinitely. Depending on how long he's been in Dumbledore's keeping, they could have a relationship stretching back over a hundred years. With that long of a close association, is it any wonder they are so close? My cats are three and can practically talk to me.

Obviously, however, this in only IMHO.

-- Nice work! I forgot about the sweet tooth thing...

And, in the movie (and the book?) he takes the Bott bean and gets "earwax". Now, yeah, that's a stretch, but wax, bees, ... hmn.....

What is the connection between Severus and Albus, then? Namewise? I don't get where you're going with that. Do you just mean that in Snape's case both names are important, and therefore Albus is important to Dumbledore as well (white bee?)...

think think think. lol! Say.... Richard Harris kinda sorta sounded a little like Pooh, too. :P

-zora

Dumbledore is an animagi, but he is a normal owl.

The normal bit about the character determining what animal they could become....a wise old bird.

He would be able to fly around to wizard houses very inconspicuously, it would just be the post.

He would be able to chat with the other owls or read their messages to keep up to date with all information going in and out of the school.

In Chamber of secrets he did say that he thought he had passed the owl message from Hermione summoning him.

*BUMP*
[another animagus thread]

well! i think that dumbledore is not an animagi. fawkes is his phoenix and i think he couldnt turn to an animal. well! we'll be surprise if the next book tells that he is an animagi..... but if he is what kind of animal does he transform?

Hello every one just arrived in this thread... Ive been discusing Dumbledore being animagi since I can remember with my friends.

All clues (which are few) point to him being an animagi... and most likely a Pheonix because in the movie and I think also in the book he does say he thinks their facinating and he might have chosen fawks as a pet to keep him company when he tranforms. Order of the Pheonix might be a resistance group against voldemort wich dumbledore started and named pheonix to honor his animagi form and his facination with pheonixs

I like the thought of DD an animagus. Ever since i've read CoS i always thought of him being an animagus and that he can transform into a phoenix. And i was also thinking that he is fawkes. Maybe that phoenix in his office is not really fawkes. He just said it to Harry so that he can hide his real identity.

We have seen Dumbledore and Fawkes in the same room at the same time on several occasions.

I doubt he's an animagus. I think that it's not like JKR to make her headmaster an animagus when the Deputy Headmistress is already one. It would be too predictable.

Hmmm...DD as an animagus would be a very wise, cautious, and fair creature. I imagine an owl would be more likely, if he is.

quote Prof.Aze:
"I like the thought of DD an animagus. Ever since i've read CoS i always thought of him being an animagus and that he can transform into a phoenix. And i was also thinking that he is fawkes. Maybe that phoenix in his office is not really fawkes. He just said it to Harry so that he can hide his real identity"

you know i like that. Dumbledore is really fox and he took the sorting hat to harry in the chamber and he uses a different pheonix (the one in his office) as a decoid, so is not to reveal his identity as a pheonix...
but then he would have been killed when he saw the basilisc

My sisters and I believe that Dumbledore is a mouse. His name does mean white. Cheers:yawn:!

I think and probably alot of people wrote this that it is crookshanks.

Dumbledore sitting for ages in a pet shop waiting for Hermione to buy him?

he may turn into a bee..

I don't think its impossible that he's an animagus. I doubt he's a Phoenix. But if Voldy is animagus why wouldn't Dumbledore be one? He's supposedly the greatest wizard alive. Not that you'de have to be an animagus to be a great wizard, but it just seems logical.

However I have not really any proof to say one way or the other. So its really up in the air. I've heard maybe he could be an owl, but that is also open to speculation.

So I'm not sure. Maybe he is and maybe he isn't. Maybe we'll find out in the next two coming books if he is, what he is ect., ect. :D Oh, and he was a transfiguration teacher before being headmaster too. Lets not forget that. :D

First of all, Dumbledore is powerful. I don't think that animagus is necessarily a sign of being powerful. I think it must be an incredibly tedious task becoming an animagus if only 7 have occurred in the last century. 11 if you can't the unregistered ones. I figure James, Sirius, Peter wouldn't have learned if it hadn't been for Lupin. I don't figure Dumbledore needs to be an animagus to teach transfiguration. I think when he made the statues come alive he showed that he was more than capable of transfiguring well enough to teach. Dumbledore is one crazy old man. I don't think he needs to be an animagus, animagus usually implies stealth and secrecy to me. Dumbledore usually isn't one to hesitate.

First of all, Dumbledore is powerful. I don't think that animagus is necessarily a sign of being powerful. I think it must be an incredibly tedious task becoming an animagus if only 7 have occurred in the last century. 11 if you can't the unregistered ones. I figure James, Sirius, Peter wouldn't have learned if it hadn't been for Lupin. I don't figure Dumbledore needs to be an animagus to teach transfiguration. I think when he made the statues come alive he showed that he was more than capable of transfiguring well enough to teach. Dumbledore is one crazy old man. I don't think he needs to be an animagus, animagus usually implies stealth and secrecy to me. Dumbledore usually isn't one to hesitate.
You get me wrong. I'm just saying that I wouldn't leave the possibility out. But I don't really see him being one. Since Rita, James, Sirius, and Peter are all(or were)unregistered animagi there must be A TON of other unregistered ones around the world. Because they want to do it without being known, being able to sneek about. And I guess like you said animagus usually implies secredy or stealth that prolly leaves ol' DD out. However what about the times he'd been sneeking about Harry and co. without their knowing? Obviously he can be stealthy and secretive when he wants.

But I know you don't have to be animagus to be a transfiguration teacher. I'm just saying since he was one that obviously he's good at it and would have no problem becoming a animorphimagus if he wanted to.

But who knows. Chances are he's not. And like someone else said it would seem a bit obvious if he was one. He has many other aces up his sleeve besides that. He's a ******* genius really. hehe But anyways Its like people wanting Harry to be a metamorphimagus which he is not. I mean there's absolutely no actual proof(And Harry making his hair grow back is definitely not any proof at all considering young wizards always unwillingly perform magic. Its a common thing.). And same goes for the theory of DD being a animagus.

I wouldn't think there is a whole lot of animagus running around. Sirius, Peter, and James only learned because they had a reason to. The loved Remus and they wanted things to be easier on him. Otherwise they don't put in 5 hard years of extra studying in order to become animagus. As for Rita, well if you haven't noticed, she doesn't exactly have many journalistic skills, so it was either be poor and have nothing or learn how to become an animagus. It was just something she was good at, similar to Lockhart and his memory spells. I wouldn't think there would be very many if any animagus out there. It just doesn't seem that easy to do first of all so it would take lots of time to do. Most people don't have that time. Easier to mix a potion for it. I think Dumbledore can prolly do anything if the situation arose. I am sure he could cast a spell to make himself look like Ron Weasley if the situation required it. I still think of Dumbledore as more of a Fred and George type person. Dumbledore seems incredibly good at toeing that thin line.

DD is so strong he has to be an Animgaus. I don't think he would be registered because he is the secrety type and needs to keep his image on the down low. He is one of hte strongest wizards in the wizarding world he has to be an Animagus and i think he is a bumblebee. Fits the name.

JK said (sorry cant quote, cant remember where i read it) in an interview that she chose the name Dumbledore because it means bumblebee in old english so it is a possibility that he can transform into one.

my goodness! I made a thread on this ages ago and finally someone believes me lol! I thought he was a phoenix too... my main reason is that he actually is fawks. I get that just because it says that his eyes always look they have a blue flame as if they were on fire... and I swear to god .... look on the movie covers and on DD's prophecy chapter in OOTP and you'll see he has a lightning bolt scar above his right eye! I bet he got it from fighting the Gindewald or whatever that evil wizards name was... and maybe had the same fate as Harry or.... he got hit by the avada kadvra spell (sounds like abra cadabra lol) and rose again like a phoenix from the ashes lol...... You have no idea how long I have waited for a post like this to come up again! Im not crazy after all! But... Im not sure about the theory anymore.... Madam Hooch has yellow like eyes and we still dont know if she's an eagle animagi! As for more on DD I also thinks he can read minds with that legimens spell or whatever! How else would he kind of have an idea that Tom opened the chamaber of secrets and that Harry was hiding some things from him..... ahhhhhhhhhhh relief!

All of the animagi we've encountered so far have transformed into non-magical animals. McGonagall is a cat, Rita Skeeter a beetle, Sirius a dog, James a stag etc etc.

Perhaps Dumbledore is a special kind of shape-shifter than can turn into a magical animal? I'm sure he's something more than an animagus.

He could be the giant squid...

Allright, Dumbledore's secret is he is a centaur. Go ahead laugh. Think about it he has that strange watch with the planets, centaurs are into astronomy. JKR always talks about his eyes and she always talks about ferinze's eyes they both have blue twinkling eyes. Dumbledore seems to see through invisiblity cloaks like in CoS (that part was in the movie like the other critical parts). He went into the forest and got Dungbridge, oops i mean Umbridge without a problem. He just uses polyjuice potion to appear human. And yes i know the potion is only for humans but centaurs are part humans. Oh yeah and he seemed to know ferinze was in a fight with other centaurs and ferinze knew about the sorceres stone. And the statue in the MoM of the centaure guarded harry.

i could see dumbledore as a pheonix... :)

i'm not sure about what form he would take, but i think he definately is an animagus, he's only the most briliiant wizard of the time and he was highly good in transfiguration, he was a transfiguration teacher, and madame marchbanks said he had done things on his O.W.Ls she had never seen before.

I don't doubt Dumbledore's ability to be an animagus, but I don't see what purpose it would serve. It seems to me that most people have a purpose. Rita Skeeter is a spy, Lupin's friends were keeping him company...But then, we don't know yet why McGonagall is a cat, and if we find that out, it could give Dumbledore a reason, too (something for the order?).

Well, for someone who "majors" in Transfiguration, it would really be a crowning achievement. So that makes sense for McGonagall.

It would also make sense for Dumbledore, as he used to be a Transfiguration teacher, and considering that he was reading "Theories in Transubstanial Transfiguration" (or something like that) it seems to be somewhat of his specialty.

The reason why I don't think he is an Animagus, however, is because if he registered, Hermione would have said something, and I can't imagine him not having registered.

Did Hermione read every name in the registry, or did she simply check to see if Rita was on it? I wonder how she got the registry, anyway...Is there a yearly publication? Do they have some sort of Wizard internet, where you can look up public registries? It's not like she has a lot of opportunity to look up public records at the Ministry. Hmm...Maybe I overlooked something in Book Four.

Maybe he wasn't registered in this century...

I'd have thought the register included every registered living animagus, whatever century they became one.

Hermione certainly checked to see whether McGonagall was on the register in her third year and checked again to see if Rita Skeeter was in her fourth year. I think if Dumbledore registered his abilities as an animagus, Hermione would have found him on there, so either he isn't an animagus or he's an unregistered one.

What I meant to say was maybe Hermione looked up only the seven people who had registered this century. When Hermione talked about McGonagall being among the seven, she could have mentioned Dumbledore too but didn't. Maybe the list is sorted by centuries and she didn't look up the previous ones, just like they once overlooked Nicholas Flamel because he wasn't "recent".

Of course, we'll never actually find out unless someone asks and Rowling gives a direct yes or no answer--or, more likely, until she reveals it in the books. For it to appear in the books, it would have to be relevant, and I'm still not sure what purpose it would serve, though it is interesting to speculate.

There is no doubt in my mind that Dumbledore is an Animagus. It seems like every power it is possible for wizards to have, he's got it. I mean, he doesn't even need an Invisibility Cloak to become invisible!

But I don't know if it's important to the story that JKR mention every little power Dumbledore has. What if his Animagus form just doesn't have any relevance?

My favourite theory is that Dumbledore is a bumblebee, though. It ould be very easy for him to spy on Harry that way. Although we've definitely already gone through the bug thing, with Rita Skeeter.

Is it possible to have your Animagus form be a magical animal, like a unicorn or hippogriff?

wow, it would be so cool if an Animagus could be a magical creature . . . maybe that's what Dumbledore is. You know, he's so powerful that it could be possible. If he isn't, well, then the animal he would make sense to be, would be an owl.

Hermione doesn't always tell the boys everything she reads. (Lupin being a werewolf for instance) I think Dumbledore is an animagus myself.

Question- can "half-breeds" become animaguses? I still think Dumbledore is part demiguise.
I think that Dumbeldore is a wasp. I don't have my books with me now, but I remember there being some "clues" in books 3 and 5. Being a wasp would allow Dumbledore to keep close watch on the students (especially Harry). And did you know that Dumbledore is a german word meaning "bumblebee"???

Curious...very curious...

i re-reading The Order Of The Phoenix RIght now and when harry is taking his exams this is whut harry says/thinks.............
WPW*

Harry stared fixedly at the first question . It was several seconds before it ocurred to him that he had not taken in a word of it; there was a wasp buzzing distractingly against one of the high windows.

I PERSONALLY THINK DUMBLEDORE IS A WASP animagus AND HE WAS CHECKING UP ON THE SCHOOL... whut do u think :clap: :cool: :tu: :rotfl:

dangit they beat me to it!

we need more ppl on here

:welcome: jenniweasley, but please don't multiple post. :)

DD probably is an animagus, but I doubt it's a phoenix. He's powerful enough to be an animagus, and I can't see why he wouldnt be one. Just not a phoenix. I think he would be an eale, or another great and noble animal.

This is reopening an old thread, but I had some thoughts on it that I wanted to share. I think that DD is an animagus and that the form he takes is a phoenix. Throughout books 3-5, Jo emphasizes that the form wizards take as an animagus is very important (indicative of their personalities.) Jo shows us time and time again that Fawkes the phoenix is very important to DD and is often seen with him. Could this mean something about DD- maybe that he is able to be reborn time after time?

Now before you start laughing at this theory, I offer the following as something to think about: In Book 2, ch 18 DD says that Riddle was "probably the most brilliant student that Hogwarts has ever seen." How does DD know this? He hasn't been around the past 1000 years...or has he? :)

Love to hear your thoughts about this. :)

Dumbledore may be an Animagus, only time will tell. However, if he is, I very much doubt he becomes a Phoenix, as some here have speculated. Wouldn't that, in theory at least, make him immortal? Whenever he was about to die, he could just transform and get reborn rather easily.

In Book 2, ch 18 DD says that Riddle was "probably the most brilliant student that Hogwarts has ever seen." How does DD know this? He hasn't been around the past 1000 years...or has he? :)


He has all the old headmasters and headmistresses portraits chattering away to him in his office. They could easily of compared notes and decided between them that Riddle was the most brilliant student ever.

He has all the old headmasters and headmistresses portraits chattering away to him in his office. They could easily of compared notes and decided between them that Riddle was the most brilliant student ever.Oooh! Good catch Albusdaughter! I was only thinking about the portraits from what they could currently do/tell DD, but you are right on about the information from the past that they could share as well. Good job! :clap:

I do believe that Dumbledore is an Animagus. The reason why is, So far in the 5 books I have read. Dumbledore has been able to do every magical power that has been mentioned and just because he is not registered really does't mean much. The first time we hear about the registry list is in POA. And already up to the 5th book we know about 4 unregistered Animagus (James, Sirius, Peter, & Rita Skeeta) I do not know if Voldemort is registered or not.

Although I do not think Dumbledore turns into Fawkes!

I think it is possible he is one, but I don't see the real point of him being one I guess. I mean he is a very intelligent wizard and could do almost anything I suppose (not just because he is intelligent just ...) but I don't see the point of now mentioning he is one if we didn't learn about it earlier...who knows...

well 50 years ago it says that dumbledore was a transfiguration teacher..........is it possible that dumbledore is an unregistered animagi? (possiblly and probably registered......however hermione says there are 7 registered animagi she doesnt mentione who they are tho?) anyways is it possible he could be an animagi and this is his way of knowing how everything that happens to harry and co??? or hes possibly able to transfigure himself into other things? orrrrrrrrrr maybe hes a metamorphagi...this might explain the bartender in hogs head (alleged to be albus' brother in a different thread) that harry said he got a feelin he knew him....this might be how he knew of the DA in oOtp?? just a possibilty??

I was wondering about this myself. dumbledore is 150 years old and hremione says that there were only seven register animagi in the last century, so dumbledore wouldn't have been on that list if he was one. and maybe the records in the school only go back 100 years. I think it could be a possibilty, but i have no idea what sort of animal he could be, just not a pheonix.


I know DD is highly accomplished at transfiguration. His examiner for NEWTS said he "did things with a wand I have never seen before." While it is true that only seven animagi have been registered in the last century that doesn't mean that DD wouldn't be on the complete list. If DD was an animagi, Hermione would know it. But your point about school records/etc is a good one. I am going to sit on the fence on this one, too. There is a good argument for both sides. Especially since Dumbledore means bumblebee. I just know for sure he wouldn't be an "unregistered" thus illegal animagus!

I think that Dumbledore could be an animagus. My sister and I were thinking about it the other day. Maybe Dumbledore could be Hedwig on some occasions. IT is just a thought. It would make a lot of sense since he was a transfiruration teacher in the past and he would probably not be registered under this centuries Animagi.

If Dumbeldore was an animagus it wouldn't be against his character to be an unregistered animagus - he doesn't mind breaking rules.

But here's an interesting question for everyone (related to discussion above) Can a wizard transform into a magical creature. All I remember animagi ever turning into is non magical creatures... (cat, dog, deer, rat, beetle, ...) So if they can't transform into a magical creature, then there's no way Dumbledore could turn into a phoenix.

I wouldn't think that it would be possible to change into a magical creature.

If Dumbledore is a phoenix, what for?? I mean...for some reason..??
Anyway, I don't know where, but Hermione says she looked at the list of animagus, and she only found McGonagall...I'm not sure..
see ya..

All right Jo!! Jo has now said that DD's patronus is a Phoenix. Since we know that patronuses and animagus forms are closely related, we can deduce that IF DD is an animagi, he would transform into a Phoenix. Very interesting! Here (http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/uk/newsid_3566000/3566714.stm) is the link to the new interview. Thanks Jo! :clap:

So if Dumbledore transforms into a Phoenix, then he can't die because he'll just be reborn every time.

So if Dumbledore transforms into a Phoenix, then he can't die because he'll just be reborn every time. See my post #137 below. It just a theory, but it would certainly explain why DD is as strong as he is; he's had a long time to increase his knowledge and ability! :lol:

Doubtfull. Dumbledore is a prestigious person, and though he has his own way of doing things, he wouldn't so blatantly disobey Wizarding Law. Therefore, he would be registered in the list that Hermione found of living animagi, and probably would have mentioned him.

Could dumbledore have a troubling past that no one knows about and that is why he made himself an unregistered animagus. That would also explain why he would be something other than a pheonix. Maybe at the time he made himself one he wasn't as noble or good. Because it doesn't mention DD ever being a animagus and Hermione said she checked. But that would be nothing for him, i mean he sets up unregistered portkeys all of the timeandlupin said that is worth more than their life.

Has anyone ever wondered about the wasp that was buzzing outside the window when Harry was writing his History of Magic exam in OoftP. It's an off hand comment, he just hears the buzzing of a wasp at the window - but that's what made me notice it. Some have said Dumbledore's name mean's bumblebee is some languages etc. or as an anagram etc. Maybe it wasn't a wasp, but a bumblebee buzzing outside the window and maybe it was Dumbledore? I'm very wary of the illegal animagus thing, but I can't believe either than Dumbledore was the transfiguration prof, but he himself cannot transform...

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Dumbledore is an Animagus. He is such a powerful and gifted wizard. I believe he was the Transfiguration teacher before he became headmaster. So he has that going for him too.

I also remember that Hermione said there was a list of all the registered Animagus in the 100 years. Well if Dumbledore is 150 I believe, perhaps him being registered as one was never carried over? Just a thought ...

I wouldn't be surprised either. Dumbledore is probably the most powerful wizard of the age. If he can do all these complex spells than becoming an animagus is certainly not beyond his reach. He was also the transfiguration teacher back in his day so I don't doubt that he probably is one.

I am sure if Dumbledore wanted to be an animagus he could, but maybe he doesn't see the point of it since he can do pretty much anything he wants without being an animal. Or maybe being an animagus is like forming a patronus, you have no control over what you become and Dumbledore's animal is really inconvenient like an elephant or a goldfish. . .or something extinct that he couldn't just go prancing around as without people going "hey look at the do-do bird over there". Or maybe his animagus form is. . .human. . .after all we are animals too. I have a feeling this is just one of those things we are never going to know because it won't help develop the plot of the last two books, but you never know.

i think that he could if he wanted to but he has no use for it he can find other ways of hiding himself and he has enough power on his own without needing to change.





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I watched HP1 yesterday and noticed something weird. Everyone's talking about Dumbledore being a phoenix... but I think maybe he's an owl. At the very beginning of the movie, you see an owl fly along Privet Drive, and disappear behind an old cabin-like structure. Next thing we know, Dumbledore is emerging from where the owl disappeared. I know this could be just the movie, but I'm sure JK would've said something about Colombus having an owl disappear and Dumbledore reappear.

I think Dumbledore is more than an animagus. If he can become invisible without a cloak (book 1) then I am not sure Animagus is needed.

But, I think you might have a point. JK Rowling said the Animagus she has planned for Hermione is what her patronus is (an Otter).

But Harry will not be a animagus, I am assuming this is because he is a metamorphmagi (this is only my prediction).

When did JK say that Hermione was going to be an animagus?

It kind of makes sense for Dumbledore to be an animagus considering he is powerful enough that it would be like a walk in the park for him to become an animagus. And since the ability to become an animal is a pretty valuable talent there's no reason why he wouldn't but that slight amount of effort into it.

To be a transfiguration teacher, you have to be an animagi

To be a transfiguration teacher, you have to be an animagi

Where does it say that? We know McGonagall is an animagus, but I can't recall ever reading it was a requirement. We know there are hardly any registered animagus (I think 7 in the past century - but don't quote me on that number).

In all probability Dumbledore is an animagus. He is one of the most powerful wizards that ever lived and why wouldn't he want something like that to add a little to his power. Not to mention it could come in handy in a pinch. Ya never know.

I wouldnt doubt it...Dumbledore is so powerful, I think he would be capable of almost anything. Plus I think he would like it for the fun of it :D

In all probability Dumbledore is an animagus. He is one of the most powerful wizards that ever lived and why wouldn't he want something like that to add a little to his power. Not to mention it could come in handy in a pinch. Ya never know.

I totally agree that DD has the power in order to be an animagus, but considering that DD is the 'epitomy of goodness', according to Jo, do you really think that DD would be an unregistered animagus? I suppose it's a possibility that he wants to keep it a secret, if he uses that power for something like spying, or any number of other things. We have seen that he isn't afraid to violate the law a bit if it is in the best interest of.... well, the greater good I suppose. (I'm referring specifically to the scene where DD 'stuns' Fudge and everyone else in his office when Fudge wants to arrest him.) So, he obviously will violate the law if it is for a reason. But, if he became an animagus long ago, I imagine he'd have been registered. We know that about 50 years ago he wasn't even headmaster yet, he was a professor. But, we also know that is around the time he defeated Grindewald. I sure hope we learn more about that defeat, I wonder if it all ties in somehow? So many questions...no answers. I guess I always just imagined DD had other methods of doing what needed to be done, rather than transforming into an animagus, much like he doesn't need a cloak to be invisible. Although, I definitely would not rule out the possibility that he is an animagus, I'm just not sure it is necessary. If that makes any sense! :p

Personally , I think Dumbledore is one and I believe he is Hedwig (Harry's owl) . Being that he was a gift from Hagrid , Perhaps Hagrid knew . Just my opinion ... but you never see in the books where they are present at the same time .

He might be able to turn into the Weasley's Ford Anglia. . . :lol:, but I haven't heard anything about him being able to turn into a Phoenix. It'd be cool, though.

If dumbledore could turn into a pheonix, why use fawkes to escape in OotP?

I like the idea that he can turn into a bee, because his name does mean Bumblebee, and there has been speculation that he is the bee that refocuses harry's attention on the Exam...

It also seems that turning into a pheonix would involve a great deal of difficulty. And unless you could inherit the same magical properties, it seems it would be a total waste of time.

I'm am curious whether or not wizards get to choose the form they take, or if it some sort of critique on their general nature? Was Wormtail naturally a rat, or did he choose to be a rat so he could push the knot on the Whomping Willow? certainly it seems suggested that they can choose, since rita skeeter is a bug, and that is a very advantageous form for her, but perhaps she discovered her animagus talent before she got into being a reporter.

Since Dumbledore's Patronus form is a Phoenix (JK Rowling said so in a recent interview), I don't think that his Animagi form would be a Phoenix too. I've heard a lot of people say that they think that he is a bumblebee. I hope that this isn't true. I just think that a bumblebee is so lame for someone of his power. I do think that he is an Animagus though, because I think that he has mastered just about every thing there is to master in magic -- apart from a lot of the Dark Arts, of course.

Personally , I think Dumbledore is one and I believe he is Hedwig (Harry's owl) . Being that he was a gift from Hagrid , Perhaps Hagrid knew . Just my opinion ... but you never see in the books where they are present at the same time .

But if DD is Hedwig, and Hagrid bought her in the pet store, why would DD in animagus form be hanging out in the pet store? If that were true it would make much more sense if Hagrid delivered Hegwig to Harry once he was at school, or even at the Dursleys. I can't picture DD haning out on a perch in a pet store waiting for Hagrid and Harry to arrive, IMO. :)

Plus, Hedwig is a girl. Just because you can change into an animal doesn't mean you would change your sex. I really hope that DDs animagus form is not a bumblebee. His name just has a certain appeal to it and really reinforces the off but brilliant character that Jo established him as in SS. Dumbledore is an extremely gifted wizard, and given the fact that pettigrew was able to become an animagi, I am quite sure that DD would be able to work it out, too. However since DD has already stated that he is able to become invisible at will, I can't imagine putting forth the time or effort to learn to become an animal. It would be cumbersome and unadventageous compared to his other abilities.

Well even in the book , I dont recall Hagrid actually going into the store to buy Hedwig . He just simply said that there was something he wanted to pick up for Harry on his birthday . As for Hedwig being a girl , that is true that it is said Hedwig is a girl , but who's to say that if Dumbledore did not want anyone to know that he was Hedwig he could simply change his sex as well ... after all he is mysterious . Maybe that is how he gets by with out anyone knowing what he is . :)

Ill have to go look it up but I am pretty sure that there is a passage where DD is eating in the main hall and Hedwig brings in the mail.

Plus Hedwig stays locked up all that time at Privet Drive, I can't imagine DD staying in a cage when there is much work to be done.

That is a good point .. I didnt think about the holidays , with Hedwig being cooped up . However the only thing that gets me there is , the only time Hedwig was ever set free during the holidays , was the only time he never came back till the end of the holidays and DD later stated that he had been rather busy during the Holidays electing prefects , which was in book five .

But you could very well be right . :)

bumblebee!!!That would be the worst thing for the greatest wizard-Dumbledore.He was a transfiguration teacher and if he is not an animagus then I don't think anyone else should be.Yeah!I am sorry that I am going too far but its little annoying.

Dumbeldore can be a unicorn.Just as beautiful and magical.My second option is phoenix.

Its the animagus form (animal/bird/reptile etc.) that chooses the wizard/witch and not the other way.For instance Wormtail aka Peter was not a great wizard so he rather became something like a rat(small and worthless).So,Dumbeldore has to be something magnificent in his animagus form so as to match his personality.

hmm I don't think so some how

One clue as to whether Dumbledore is Hedwig as an animagus might be found in the book (forgive me for not having this handy) where Hedwig was attacked and returned injured. Was there any information regarding Dumbledore and an injury at the same time?



There are a couple of things that makes me wonder:- I don't remember seeing Dumbledore or Hedwig together (that's a biggie for me), it's pure white (so-so) and Albus is Latin for white...white beard?? Hagrid (with Albus instruction) got it for him so that (Albus) can watch over him at the Dursley's? These and many other (well...not so many) have be bugging me for a while now.

Is it stated anywhere that your animagus and patronus are the same? or different? I feel like somewhere it was stated that they come out the same animal....whch would lead credence to the Dumbledore is a phoenix animagus. They are both telling of the wizard's character which leads me to believe they are the same animal (but, i've no proof that i can think of!)

But I think JK rowling took it too far making Skeeter an animagus. I envisioned the marauders as brilliant ppl, somehow finding out how to make themselves animagi. But when Skeeter was one, it totally ruined the image I had of becoming an animagus being such a daunting task. Skeeter somehow made it seem...simple :).

Possibly, but even pettigrew did it eventually and he was still in school when he did. I think that there are a lot more animagi out there that wouldnt bother registering, i mean why would you? There is almost no way that you could be caught unless a ministry official or a very 'Percy like' wizard saw you transforming. Peter lived with the Weasley's for 12 years and they never noticed. So basically my point is that I don't think that being an animagi is that difficult, but for four fifteen your old boys this was probably a thing that set them apart and made them 'cool', they thought it was really difficult to do because noone at hogwarts had tried it. So this made them place a lot more importance on the fact that they were animagi than being an animnagi actually entails.

I do think Dumbledore is an animagus. Who knows why he isn't listed in the registry, perhaps he used a different name...he has enough of them, maybe it's under Brian :-) He was the transfiguration teacher...I think JKR mentioning that in CoS was a clue for future books. I highly doubt he is Hedwig, particularly because of the holidays where she is cooped up. And, a side note...I also believe that Harry will be a metamorphmagus (or however you spell it) but not an animagus. I'm hoping Ron will be an animagus, poor guy needs some kind of special talent that neither Hermione or Harry have!

I have mixed feelings on this. I mean, I agree with WitheredShadow, that Dumbledore wouldn't be an illegal Animagus--and it has been kinda worn out already by Rita and the marauders.

The other issue about Animagi that's been bothering me lately is this: Can animagi transform into a magical animal? I've kind of been bordering on no, seeing as the ones we've seen so far are normal ones, but anything's possible. However, it seems kinda doubtful to me, just because... erg, I dunno. I need opinions on this.

We know that his Patronus is a phoenix, so it seems kind of unlikely to me that he could also transform into a phoenix. He does have Fawkes for that, anyway, who is doing a magnificent job for him so far.

So, I'm stuck. Yea.

Has anyone ever wondered about the wasp that was buzzing outside the window when Harry was writing his History of Magic exam in OoftP. It's an off hand comment, he just hears the buzzing of a wasp at the window - but that's what made me notice it. Some have said Dumbledore's name mean's bumblebee is some languages etc. or as an anagram etc. Maybe it wasn't a wasp, but a bumblebee buzzing outside the window and maybe it was Dumbledore? I'm very wary of the illegal animagus thing, but I can't believe either than Dumbledore was the transfiguration prof, but he himself cannot transform...

OMG! I think that's totally right, because why would Harry just conviently notice a wasp, plus, aren't wasps usually outdoors?

Given that DD was previously the transfiguration professor, as well as being the most powerful wizard of his day, I can't imagine he isn't an animagus.

I've read a lot of speculation that DD was actually that bee/wasp that Harry saw during his exam. However, given that JKR told us that the person's animagus form chooses them by what suits them best, I have a hard time equating DD with a wasp. I'd think of him as something more..... dignified. I think a phoenix would suit him perfectly, but that may be too obvious.

kelly_holland: When you turn into an Animagus, can you choose what animal you become? Or does this get "assigned" to you?

JK Rowling replies -> No, you can't choose. You become the animal that suits you best. Imagine the humiliation when you finally transform after years of study and find that you most closely resemble a warthog.

DD would be an anigamus... a wizard of his level... its hard to imagine if he isnt.

in our fifth year they managed to be one.

Given that DD was previously the transfiguration professor, as well as being the most powerful wizard of his day, I can't imagine he isn't an animagus.

I've read a lot of speculation that DD was actually that bee/wasp that Harry saw during his exam. However, given that JKR told us that the person's animagus form chooses them by what suits them best, I have a hard time equating DD with a wasp. I'd think of him as something more..... dignified. I think a phoenix would suit him perfectly, but that may be too obvious.

Dumbledore means 'Bumblebee' and I think that would be a suitable animagus form for Dumbledore; like a Bumblebee, Dumbledore is hard working, helpful and very protective. I think there is also a parallel between when a bee stings and dies, to Dumbledore and Harry. It is sacrificing to protect.

I think Dumbledore could very well be an animagus, and that his form could be a bumblebee, or something close to it. It would also help explain his 'dissapearing' act from his office in book 5.

I think Dumbledore could be an animagus as he was a Transfiguration teacher, but not neccesarily a Phoneix. He could also be any other animal, and remember he keeps a close watch on Hary at Hogwarts, so he could be a pet of one of Harry's friend, like Trevor the toad.

But does it matter? DD is too powerful, would he need to disguise. He would know better ways of hiding if he wants to!

But does it matter? DD is too powerful, would he need to disguise. He would know better ways of hiding if he wants to!

Yes you are right, he definitely knows better ways. So you don't think he is an Animagus?

But does it matter? DD is too powerful, would he need to disguise. He would know better ways of hiding if he wants to!

Remember his famous phrase to Harry, along the lines of: "Unlike you, I do not need a cloak to become invisible." That could be one of his ways of hiding, but I don't know how effective in terms of detection it is against other powerful wizards such as him.

I guess I've sort of taken for granted that DD is some sort of animagus. We know he's an incredibly powerful wizard, he's 150 years old so he'd have plenty of time to learn, and since he's so old he may be a registered animagus - just registered in the previous century so his name wouldn't be on Hermione's list. Also as the previous transfiguration teacher he may have been the one who taught mcgonogal to do it. We also know he has ways to become invisible that don't require a cloak - maybe he transforms into something small, unnoticible, like a wasp or bee as mentioned above.

somehow i don't think dumbledore would need to be animagus, he has abilities other wizards don't. They use the animagus to blend in, but in the 'Philosophers Stone' he even says to harry "i don't need a cloak to become invisible' so why would he need to be an animagi.

The most powerful wizard at time, a former transfiguration teacher, [can even become invisible without a cloak - I don't know, but it sounds real hard ]....animagus? Probably.

http://nimbo.net/quiz/slyth.gif

i belive that Dumbledore is an animagus... a pheonix perhaps, i think Fawkes has a big role in the future (COS- saving harry...) but a bumblebee...that would make alot of sense...small, and useful...

I think he MIGHT be an animagus (I'd really like him to be, at least) but that it won't be majorly relevant to the plot. I really can't amke up my mind as to what he'd be though - in my mind, he's either a phoenix or a bumblebee.

Just a thought - some people were saying earlier on that Dumbledore is meant to represent good and so wouldn't break the law unnecessarily in becoming an unregistered animagus. I've always wondered this about him: was he always such an epitome of goodness? We have no idea what his life may have been like before Hogwarts and Harry's arrival so he might not have really cared about breaking the law at the time.

Hmmm... I wish Jo would let slip a comment as to whether an animagus can turn into a magical animal or not...hmmm

I think Dumbledore could definetly be one if he isn't already. He is the most powerful wizard after all. I wouldn't put it past him! ;)

In the very very beginning of the very first book DD and McGonagall meet up on Privet Drive to meet Hagrid. Other than the fact that Hagrid was coming, why did DD have to use the Light Putter Outer, if he could just transform into something and go somewhere where he and McGonagall could talk in secret. Of course when Hagrid came, there would be a need for there to be no lights, but....

Dumbledore wouldn't have a problem with being an unregistered animagus. He regularly breaks laws, or at lease doesn't report rule breaking, when it is for a good purpose - the biggest example is where he encouraged Hermione to use her Time Turner for an unpermitted purpose (I assume she was under strict instructions to only use it for classes) to free both Buckbeak and Sirius. If he believes that being an unregistered animagus will allow him to fight the dark forces, he will do so. Contrast him to the registered animagus Professor McGonigall, who is in charge of disciplining Griffindor students for rule-breaking.

Thats what I like about him! I have often wondered one thing, there do seem to be more unregistered anigami than registered ones

I think Dumbledore could very well be an animagus, and that his form could be a bumblebee, or something close to it. It would also help explain his 'dissapearing' act from his office in book 5.
He didn't dissapeard, he just used Fawkes to run out of Hogwart.

I think that Dumbledore as a bumblebee would be possible, but he's got style! He would change into more "special" animal like phoenix or unicorn.
And Hedwig, like Marcy said, is a girl so I don't think that that is Dumbledore animagi form (but maybe we don't know everything ;)).