Book Two "Key" to Series?

The wand chose Tom Riddle, he became corrupted into Voldemort during his years in Hogwarts (his memory was saved in a diary from the time that the Chamber was opened). Who was the DADA teacher then? Could a relic of Slytherin have turned him?
Is it the desire to be more than a rejected child that sees his desire to be known as great, immortal. Could Percys desire to be important ultimately lead him to revolt against his family and seek out Voldemort.

Yeah, good point!.. I wonder who the DADA was at Voldie's time. Its also interesting that Dumbledore was transfiguration teacher, could be that transfigurations particularly that of humans could play an important part in coming books. The car, a wizard in disguise? ...

I really think that the part about Dumbledore looking more withdrawn and tired than he has in the past is a bit of foreshadowing.

or it could be one of many of Jk's red-herrings.

I think a clue that we find out is that Dumbledore was the Transfiguration teacher. With this I would think him to be an animagus, I know there is no proof, but I mean he is the most powerful wizard in the world and specialized in transfiguration, there is no way he never bothered to become an animagus. My guess is that he is a phoenix.

JKR has stated that "animagi reflects the personality" would Dumbledore have been an animal that was around a hundred years ago.
We have also seen Dumbeldore and Fawkes in the same scene, would a Phoenix tolerate another phoenix?
Could a key be the fact that Dumbledore gives people second chances...had he been given one in the past, could he owe his life to Voldemort...

I dont know if dumbledore is an animagi, especially a phoenix, Because I dont think that wizards can become magical creature animagi can they?

If anyone could become a magical creature animagus it would be DUmbledore, I am not saying he would have the powers of the magical creature, but that would be cool too. But I seriously doubt he is not an animagus, that would almost not make sense.

There was another weird scene in the book, where Harry and Ron go to see Hagrid justbefore he got sent to Azkaban. He opened the door with a weapon in his hand, why? Who was he expecting? I dount that he would be armed waiting for Malfoy, who did show up there, so who was Hagrid waiting for?

Could Hagrid have been waiting for Tom Riddle? He knew that it was Tom who framed him the last time that the chamber was opened, and could just believe that an arrow would kill him.
Is Hagrid aware that Tom Riddle is Voldemort?
Did Dumbledore fight to prevent Hagrid from going to Azkaban? He holds some sway over Fudge or is this an indication of Fudges poor judgement

I thought about that for a little as well. What I assumed was that he must have assumed a new heir had returned and perhaps would come and try to frame him again. However, when I think of it it still bothers me, he must of thought he was in physical danger...strange.

Maybe it was the memories of what happened to him the last time he was accused of opening the Chamber that led him to feel afraid. He really must be a gentle giant not to fight against returning to such a dismal place for a second time over something he didn't do.

What surprised me as well is that he had his crossbow ready, not his umbrella, where we all know the pieces of his wand are hidden. These leads me to believe that he was not expecting a wizard to come and attack him, but possibly an animal. Seeing that he did not know what the monster was that was kept in the chamber, I assume he must have thought the monster might be coming for him, and thus felt more safe with a crossbow as a weapon than magic.

He had the crossbow beacuse he wanted to kill whoever was coming. He could have still used his umbrella against an animal. No I think there was something personal in the choice of the crossbow..revenge maybe?

I think he expected a man. He was worried about what the Ministry was going to do in relation to the monster in the castle. He knew he would be suspected because of what had happened before. But the crossbow.........................hmmmm. Good question. I don't think he would kill anyone except Voldemort, and he would have been holding the umbrella. O.K. now I'm confused.

About DD being an animagi - if he is then he's an unregistered one. Which doesn't sound like a Dumbledore thing to do. Remember, Hermione has seen the list of registered animagi. If Dumbledore was one she's have mentioned it.

I like the idea about the Deathday party. The only problem I have is that it wasn't in the film. Which doesn't make it certain I know, but it lowers it's chances.

I've read a lot about Hagrid things in book 2. The shady business in Knockturn Alley and the corssbow. Could they be linked perhaps? Hagrid asking questions about Voldie and Death Eaters in Knockturn Alley and one turns up, Lucius Malofy perhaps? So he's prepared in the future when people come knocking after dark...

Perhaps the arrow is silver-tipped on the crossbow. For shooting vampires or other evil creatures. It could be relevant.

No matter who Hagrid was expecting (with the exception of Harry and Dumbledore) the crossbow makes more sense to me. Hagrid is concealing the pieces of his wand in his umbrella, and this is a secret. What would you think if you didn't know that and knocked on the door to his hut and there's this giant man blocking the door pointing a pink umbrella at you? A little too likely to draw attention to the umbrella, don't you think?

Originally posted by Essbee (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=178703#post178703))
About DD being an animagi - if he is then he's an unregistered one. Which doesn't sound like a Dumbledore thing to do. Remember, Hermione has seen the list of registered animagi. If Dumbledore was one she's have mentioned it.

I have just found out the hermione checked the list of animagus for the past 100 years. Remember that dumbledore is 155 or something like that, so he wouldnt have been on that list so there is the possiblility he is an animagi.

I dont know if anyone put this or not.
~CoS american hardback pge 204~
".....Harry saw a gleaming oak door ahead, with a brass knockerin the shape of a griffin.............."

THere is a griffin on the door. Griffin-Door Gryffondor.
I don't know I thought that was interesting.

Also I know someone posted this but I cant remember who) if u say Gregory Goyle a few times fast you get gargoyle.

Well there is a gargoyle statue where the stairs to DD's office starts. I donno how this helps but I thought it was interesting.

giant man blocking the door pointing a pink umbrella at you Beatric Bottbean I love it.
Hagrid normally goes into the Forest with his crossbow, so could it have been something from the Forest.

This really is not that imprtant, just something I thought was kind of interesting. In PS when harry and ron take on the troll on Halloween, JK uses some interesting word choice. My copy of PS is on the dhlef to far away from me so I won't quote it directly :yawn: Harry and ron locked the troll into a "chamber". They heard a scream. Then "they realized the chamber they had just locked the troll in was the girls bathroom!" I am sure the actual words in the book are much different, but my memory is not working too well righ tnow. Also later when they are in the girls bathroom it says something like "from across the chamber ron did..."

The thing that a find interesting is that she refers to this area as a chamber...when she does not do this so often aout other places. though it may have been a different bathroom than the CoS, it still was a girls bathroom. And the fact that she used something along the lines of "the chamber they had just locked the troll in was the....girls bathroom!"
Perhaps this is a sly way of foreshawdowing, something we could never notice, which I believe is more Jk's style. She likes to surprise us, but it can be linked to things that we would never ever consider as clues.

but it may not be the same bathroom, Myrtle would be very upset if a troll got in and i expect she would have shown herself to them and start crying or criticizing or aything.

Oh yea I know, I actually think it was a different bathroom. It is just the fact that she referred to a "girls bathroom" as "the chamber" a few times quite consistently, enough for me to read the passage again. But I do not think it was the same bathroom, just something interesting to notice whether JK did it purposely or not.

oooooo

Can't be a room as we know it, after all a large cavern under the castle which houses a basilisk is called a chamber of secrets

eh? :??:

soo the point is.......??? WHAT!!?!?!?! Its gonna be a normal room, because harry doesnt know the importance yet.

Essbee I think that you are absolutely right about Salazar not having any control over the fact that his heir is not a pureblood. I think this will be a key point in the upcoming books.

Beatrice I think you've got something going about the history between Arthur and Lucius. IDd they go to school together? They work together? What does Lucius do? Hmmm...got me thinking about that one. Also, I've thought about Bourgin and Bourkes. I know that you can't punish someone for selling and buying the goods but is the MoM watching him? What will Arthur do about the information?

I'vI've seen this posted somehwere and just can't find it. I think that Ron is going to play a key role in the future because he has an uncanny ability to judge people correctly, like Lockhart, Riddle, etc. I truly think that he will come up with a few more and we need to watch what he says about people. I just hope JKR starts to make Ron look less like a wheenie. I love his humor and his character but he sounded so goofy when it came to the spiders.

JKR said that Harry has a struggle between what is right and what is easy. I think that Lockhart summed it up when he said "Celebrity is as celebrity does" He's gotten a lot of attention for being Harry Potter but I think he's going to have to prove that there is smoething behind the name (it's not he hasn't) but he's going to have more public fights against Voldie.

I think this whole ghost thing is interesting. They can survive in water and be petrified. What other properties do they have that can help or hinder the fight? I also think about the portraits on the wall. They have some sort of power because they can open a door and talk to people. What is that about?

Why was Mr. Norris hanging upside down when she was petrified? That doesna't make sense to me. What was Colin doing and taking pics of when he was petrified. I understand what the other two where doing, but those tow have me confused.

Why doesn'at Hermoine get into trouble for doing magic in Diagon Alley. She performed underage magic in public. What happened to Arthur's inquiry at work? I don't remember hearing what happened with that.

I think that some of themes that were really overriding in the story was the pureblood vs mudblood, hidden traps set by Slytherin and Voldie to purge the mudbloods and rise to power in the future. Misjudgements of Malfoy and in CoS of Snape of being more in controlm of the evil happenings that what they were. So, power, hate, and romance....


June 21 :banghead:

Ron didn't judge Crouch correctly, though... :D

Originally posted by SusanC (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=180401#post180401))
Why doesn'at Hermoine get into trouble for doing magic in Diagon Alley. She performed underage magic in public. What happened to Arthur's inquiry at work? I don't remember hearing what happened with that.


I don't think Hermione got in trouble because she was in Diagon Alley. Only wizards and witches are there so it doesn't really matter if she does magic in front of them, the don't care.

Originally posted by EvilMeghan (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=180425#post180425))
Ron didn't judge Crouch correctly, though... :D


True. I stand corrected! But, his track record is pretty good.

:banghead: June 21

Originally posted by 1MelissaPotter5 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=180440#post180440))
I don't think Hermione got in trouble because she was in Diagon Alley. Only wizards and witches are there so it doesn't really matter if she does magic in front of them, the don't care.


yeah but not even students who live in all wizarding homes can do magic at home. But at the World Cup they did it too, but that shouldnt count because they only did lumos to lght up the path while running into the forest away from the masked ppl.

Do we have any evidence of students who live in wizarding homes getting in trouble for magic? Harry only got in trouble because there were Muggles over - Mr. Dursley's client/boss.

Yea Fred or George says on the train in book 1 i always hope they forget to give these out. So they are not allowed to do magic either

Not sure if this was mention before; it's about Snape! Harry has mention (twice, I think?) about Snape being a mind reader? Why keep bringing that up?

I would like to know you guys thoughts AND opinion on this matter.

its been mentioned at other threads like snape being a vampire. Mind reading is a vampires power.

I think to figure out this second book thing we have to look at what happened in the other books. Can anyone think of clues in earlier books as to what happened in books 1-4?

this is all i have thought of
1) (PS/SS) Since it is the 1st book, there really isn't that much. But I don't know, maybe I wasn't reading carefully enough, but I thought the first time I read it that the Quirrel-Snape switch was unexpected.
2) (CoS) I wasn't expecting Ginny to have opened the CoS either. It did seem like she knew something, but I didn't expect her to be the one. I can't think of any clues other than Malfoy briefly mentioning Azkaban, and people saying that the Malfoys were dark wizards.
3) (PoA) Same thing, I didn't expect Scabber to be Pettigrew. But Prof. Trelawney's prediction was something like Voldemort's servant will return to him and help restore him to full strength or whatever. I never realized this until I had read GoF and PoA again.

It's had to predict, and we will probably read OotP, then it will all make sense. I think there were clues for the other books, and if we look at those and try to see patterns and draw conclusions it will help. Post some ideas!

Right, I've got a lot to write about!

Um, about Dumbledore being an animagi. Well, yes Hermione looked at the list for the last 100 years, but even if he became an animagi over 100 years ago he's still one now! So he should dtill be on the list.

I don't think Snape can read minds. I also don't think Dumbledore can. They're just very good judges of character, and can therefore predict what a person is thinking better.

Perhaps (here's a wild theory) DD is actually a seer of sorts? That's how he knows what is going to happen, and that's why he knows which of Trelwany's predictions were real. He recognizes the trance from Harry's description, remember...

And I think you only get in trouble for using magic in front of muggles. Otherwise how could Fred and George have turned Ron's teddy into a spider when he was little? I doubt they got an adult to do it for them...

bit they are only a few years older than Ron. THey were probabally like 9 and got a hold of Daddys wand. If they were 9 Ron would be like7. Maybe it was even younger than that. I dont think Ron would still have a teddy at age12 or somthing LOL

Essbee, Meghan, HarryPotterGirl...

Good point about the no magic in front of muggles rules. It will be interesting to see what happens when Harry is 17 and legal behind the wand.

I also don't think that Snape and DD can read minds. But, as a potions master and master wizard, they can conjure something to help them see the future. I agree that if DD can entrance himself then he would recognize Trelawny's trance as real.

Something that was in PS/SS were the creatures of the dark forest and again we see them in CoS. Different ones but what will we see in Book 5?

:banghead: June 21

I also remember (vaguely) it being hinted that DD know "DARK MAGIC"!

It was "hinted" in PS/SS and then again CoS(?)! Is that another clue???

The DD and dark magic theory is certainly interesting. Now i apologise for not reading this thread before posting this but here goes.

I believe that Ginny's role in opening the Chamber of Secrets is what is so vital. Is it mere coincidence that Rowling says Ginny has a greater role in book 5 - and at the end of book 4, Voldemort made his big return? I believe there is more to Ginny and that chamber that meets the eye. Whatever Ginny's big role in book 5 is, its going to have something to do with what happened down in that chamber before Harry arrived. I'm almost sure of it.

It may not be that.......... Ginny could be innocent. MAybe if Mrs.Weasley dies, Ginny will be a stronger woman, and harry might "notice" her not just as Rons little sister :love:

Originally posted by Sirius83 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=181180#post181180))
The DD and dark magic theory is certainly interesting. Now i apologise for not reading this thread before posting this but here goes.

I believe that Ginny's role in opening the Chamber of Secrets is what is so vital. Is it mere coincidence that Rowling says Ginny has a greater role in book 5 - and at the end of book 4, Voldemort made his big return? I believe there is more to Ginny and that chamber that meets the eye. Whatever Ginny's big role in book 5 is, its going to have something to do with what happened down in that chamber before Harry arrived. I'm almost sure of it.


aaaahhhh, enlighten me! What is your theroy???? Come on...GIVE!!!
You've got me curious!!! I just stared reading your post and I got tingly all over! :??:

I'm not sure really, but perhaps she learned something about Voldemort down there that plays a significant role in book 5. I don't know what it could be though =\

Although Ginny could have been dead when Tom Riddle used her as bait to lure Harry down to the Chamber, he kept her alive pouring a little of my soul back into her.. and when she meets up with Ron he tries to hug herbut Ginny held him off sobbing.

Did that soul leave her body when the book perished or is it still there, waiting for Voldemort

Hmm, interesting thoughts.

DD and dark magic. Well, I reckon he does know some (like the unforgiveable curse for example) but he doesn't use them. But he could, if he wanted to. If he had to.

Oooh... evil possesed Ginny! Poor little mite, we're making her meaner and meaner by the day...

hermiones mum, very interesting!

But I don't think it was Ginny herself that held off Ron; wasn't it Harry? When he thought that Ron was going to hug her, he stepped in front of Ron, because she was still crying? I don't think Voldie is in her (God, I hope not! Ginny and Harry are going to be together!

Definately Ginny holding off Ron as he then says but you're okay Ginny...it's over now.

I don't think she was just holding out for Harry to rush over and comfort her!

He many not be inside of her totally, but as with Harry he left something behind. That something is the key to her being prominent in Book 5. Or as someone said there is something that she learned down in the chamber about Voldie that may help or hinder his defeat or rise. The question is what did she learn in her conversations with him through the diary. What spell did he cast over her to make her do those things. Does she remember any of it? What was that last scene exactly with Ginny and Ron? I loaned by book to someone...help.

Thanks guys!

I will have to go back and listen (once again, lent my books out; never to be returned) to my tapes again!

I really, really hope that Ginny is not going to be the down fall of Harry! I would love to see him and Ginny together!

I wanted Harry and Hermione together but that's not going to happen; so Harry and Ginny it IS! Then he and (if they are not already related, that is) could be related!!! Woohoo!!!

last scene with Ginny, Ron, Harry Lockhart, COS
After a few minutes progress up the dark tunnel, a distant sound of slowly shifting rock reached Harry's ears. "Ron" Harry yelled, speeding up. "Ginny's OK! I've got her!"
He heard Ron give a strangled cheer and they turned the next bend to see his eager face staring through the sizeable gap he had managed to make in the rock fall.
"Ginny!" Ron thrust an arm through the gap to pull her through first, "You're alive! I don't believe it! What happened?
He tried to hug her but Ginny held him off sobbing,
"But you're okay Ginny" said Ron beaming at her," its over now, it's - where did that bird come from?"
Fawkes had swooped through the gap after Ginny.

If Harry had to fight Ginny, how confused would he be? The Weasleys only daughter and his best friends sister.

Thanks hermionesmum. I forgot I downloaded copies of the books online. I found a different version! How are we supposed to woek this out with different versions?? Arg... Here's what I found.

"Ron!" Harry yelled, speeding up. "Ginny's okay! I've got her!"
He heard Ron give a strangled cheer, and they turned the next bend to see his eager face staring through the sizable gap he had managed to make in the rock fall.
"Ginny!" Ron thrust an arm through the gap in the rock to pull her through first. "You're alive! I don't believe it! What happened?" How - what -- where did that bird come from?"
Fawkes had swooped through the gap after Ginny.
"He's Dumbledore's," said Harry, squeezing through himself
"How come you've got a sword?" said Ron, gaping at the glittering weapon in Harry's hand.
"I'll explain when we get out of here," said Harry with a sideways glance at Ginny, who was crying harder than ever.

Well, that copy of the book you downloaded - its missing some lines...and apparently added in the bit with Ginny crying harder than ever.
The order is like this:

After a few minutes progress up the dark tunnel, a distant sound of slowly shifting rock reached Harry's ears. "Ron" Harry yelled, speeding up. "Ginny's OK! I've got her!"
He heard Ron give a strangled cheer and they turned the next bend to see his eager face staring through the sizeable gap he had managed to make in the rock fall.
"Ginny!" Ron thrust an arm through the gap to pull her through first, "You're alive! I don't believe it! What happened?
He tried to hug her but Ginny held him off sobbing,
"But you're okay Ginny" said Ron beaming at her," its over now, it's - where did that bird come from?"
Fawkes had swooped through the gap after Ginny.
"He's Dumbledore's," said Harry, squeezing through himself
"How come you've got a sword?" said Ron, gaping at the glittering weapon in Harry's hand.
"I'll explain when we get out of here," said Harry with a sideways glance at Ginny.
"But-"
"Later," Harry said quickly. He didn't think it was a good idea to tell Ron yet who'd been opening the Chamber, not in front of Ginny, anyway. "Where's Lockart?"

Perhaps the key will be that she'll learn parseltongue? And Harry and Ginny will have to teach it to others... I think it'd be a real blow to Voldie to have his 'special Salazar skill' being something that anyone could do.

Okay...see this is why I need to get my books back! I need tor eread them before 5. Thanks for the correction.

the key is that Harry and Ron go together to save Ginny, in book 5/6 it wil be the thing that tears at their friendship.

in GOF when Ron was about to ask about Sirius the line reads However,discussing him in front of Ginny was a bad idea. why if anyone would understand being framed it would be Ginny

Even so, I don't think they wanted anyone outside of themselves and Dumbledore to possess the knowledge that they were communicating with a "murderer." At that point, the less people that knew, the better.

Yeah, in case someone got captured and tortured or something...

If Ginny had heard this she could have also assumed that Sirius was influencing them much in the way that Riddle had once influenced her. Better to keep severe secrets like that to the ones who know the complete truth from their own eyes.

That's a good point - I hadn't thought of it that way, but you're right. And then Ginny mght've told someone that she thought Sirius was after Harry and co, and then there would've been allsorts of trouble.

okay...so we were watching CoS again. And something got me thinking. What is it about the wands. Ron's is broken and causes havoc and saves his life. Tom Riddle takes Harry's wand and uses it. Hagrid keeps his wand parts in an umbrella. The pixies use a wand. Ron gets one from his brother. So, how does all this relate to a wand choosing the wizard and why can some use it successfully broken and others cannot. Do you think that somehting will come up with Voldie and Harry and their wands? Is that going to be what makes or breaks the fight?

Hmmmmm...something to think on, SusanC! I never thought of that before! Yeah, I don't think anybody should be allowed to use somebody elses wand! They made a big deal about it in PS/SS!! Good point!!

Look at fake Moody...he used Harry's wand to conjure up the skull in the fouth book!


OFF TOPIC:

Wow, we are finding more AND new things to discuss ( even though-we've read and re-read the books for the millionth time, at least I have, ehhe) while waiting for the 5th book! I am sure there are more things to discover! Let's keep going! I think this will help me pass the time!!!

Going to listen to the CoS a couple more times---it's the book with the most clues; or at least that's what JK have said!


I have come up with a couple of things:

Could Snape be a mind reader?
Is Dumbledore Hedwig?
Is Ginny and Harry going to be together?
Will Percey Be bad?

There are a few more I would like to put down, but I am tired. So see you guys on the morrow!

Originally posted by SusanC (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=184616#post184616))
okay...so we were watching CoS again. And something got me thinking. What is it about the wands. Ron's is broken and causes havoc and saves his life. Tom Riddle takes Harry's wand and uses it. Hagrid keeps his wand parts in an umbrella. The pixies use a wand. Ron gets one from his brother. So, how does all this relate to a wand choosing the wizard and why can some use it successfully broken and others cannot. Do you think that somehting will come up with Voldie and Harry and their wands? Is that going to be what makes or breaks the fight?


I think the repetition of the focus on wands mainly is due to the fact that it is a dtory about witches and wizards, so to not see things with wands or things happening to wands would be strange. As far as the significance between Harry and Voldemort's wands I think we saw that in GoF where they would not work properl against eachother.

Could Snape be a mind reader?
Who knows, but why do you say this?

Is Dumbledore Hedwig?
Seriously doubt it

Is Ginny and Harry going to be together?
My opinion: No. If you're serious about it though, check the relationships thread for possible evidence of the H/Hr, R/Hr and H/G ships.

Will Percey Be bad?
Possible. I'm under the impression he may already be under the imperious curse. His 'anything for work' attitude may have allowed him the opportunity to be placed under the curse. This could be a very bad thing for the safety of the Weasley clan.

Very interesting about the wands. A possible guess is that only an experianced wizard can control a wand, and thats why Harry couldnt control the other wands in the wand shop.

I think part of the reason Ron's wand caused so many problems is because it was Charlie's wand originally. Being family members, they are all probably able to use each other's wands and get not bad results, but the wand of a sibling may not be specifically attuned to a person. Ron already has a wand that doesn't work to it's fullest abilities with him, so when it snaps, the wand becomes even harder to use than usual. Also, he is only in his second year and is probably not very advanced at focusing his spells. Hagrid has had 50 years to learn to focus with a few snapped bits of wood.

Wands are definitely very personal objects, though. Spells are traced to the area and the wand, not the caster. There has already been scenes showing what can happen if the wrong person uses a wand.

Originally posted by Zahri Seb Melitor (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=184868#post184868))
I think part of the reason Ron's wand caused so many problems is because it was Charlie's wand originally.

Maybe this is a JKR setup. Taking somehting that you can overrlook and make it integral. This could be why Ron doesn't reach his potential as a wizard. Charlie was headboy and a great quidditch player but didn't have things handed down to him. This could be part (not all, I think Ron has other issues) of Ron's problem.

With the wands - I agree with a lot of what is being said here. Also another possibility perhaps - the whole idea of using someone else's wand to frame someone?

Harry could use the other wands in Ollivanders, he just made a mess with them. If you remember.

Essbee, once again, I agree with you. If you remember when the gang was at the World Quidditch match and Harry's wand was used? It framed him for sending up the death eater symbol. I wonder if this is what JKR was talking about when she said that you can do magic without a wand it is just unfocused. It seems that its the same with using someone else's wand. I think a lot of it has to do with the experience and strength of the wizard.

Hey, I think you've forgotten some things:

Fawkes? More tears or transport? (too similar to Gwalagir in lotr)

Aragog? And the Anglia?

Myrtle would like to have revenge with Voldie ("it" killed her, didn't?)

Knockturn Alley? More terrible stuff? ("Mastercard, used by all the Dark Lords"; he's a for sure "frequent buyer")

What bout the Headless group?

Gilderoy? He remebers the Chamber stuff (hhelping Slkeeter to "Harry is crazy")

Skeeter herself? (actually now I'm remebering that)

I think one of the most over-looked facts of book 2 is when Harry's bag splits open and Malfoy happened to be there. The over-looked part however is that when Malfoy picks up the diary, he doesn't know what it is. This shows that Malfoy Sr. doesn't trust Draco enough with important things like that. Also, at Knockturn alley, when Harry sees Lucius and Draco, Lucius doesn't seem to be all too nice to Draco but that's just my interpretation...

Actually - thats an interesting point Kristus! Nice job spotting that one - Lucius really doesn't seem very pleased with Draco does he?

He doesn't tell Draco that Tom Riddle opened the Chamber of Secrets the first time either. Lucius says that it's so he doesn't look suspicious with so much information on what happened, but I wonder...

About Aragog and the Ford Anglia, JK has said that they will make a reappearence, though I'm not sure which book. So they are definitely 'key' points in the book.

Lucius probably feels the less Draco knows, the safer both Draco and Lucius' plans will be. Draco can't accidently tell something he doesn't know. It wouldn't matter if he was questioned by the people who run the school or the ministry.

JKR also talked about the little things that she discreetly slipped in. I just started HP2 again to look for them. Does anybody know any of these?

That's what this thread discusses. Check previous posts for ideas. There is a sort of feeling that it is these discrete things that make Book 2 the 'key' to the series.

I mite just be a morbid person, but i think Harry's gonnna die!! the main key in book two is how much Voldie and Harry r alike. Also, Dumbledore once said the scar connects Voldie and Harry. some ppl(i agree) think dumbledore had the hint of triumph in his eye because he new Voldie had enough human in him now, to die. but since harry is connected to voldie it will be like this movie i saw where one good person had to die so the bad person could die. i think harry is gonna kill himself by doing something to his scar!!! well rite me bac p.s. sum ppl say they would hate the books if he died but it would make them even better!!

It really makes sense that the second book is key to the series. When you look at what was the major theme or whatever in books 1-4 it was Voldemort coming back to power. But book 2 really doesn't fit in with that. Voldemort is only a memory in book 2 and him coming back isn't really mentioned. All of the rest of the books contribute more to how he came back.

We sort of have to realize this to think of how it is key, because book 2 can't be totally random and have nothing to do with it. And also if it doesn't fit in now, it could be more than small clues that are key to the series. The heir of Gryffindor thing makes the most sense with this theory, but there has to be something that we are overlooking.

:banghead: Were probably going to go crazy thinking about this and then it will all make sense later when we read the book.:o

:banghead: Were probably going to go crazy thinking about this and then it will all make sense later when we read the book.:o
[/quote]


I TOTALLY agree with that! I wish the book would just come out. :banghead: I'm sorry if something along thses lines has been posted before, but maybe some of the clues have something to do with a future realtionship between the Characters? It's more likely that they aren't, but it is definately a possibility!
I agree that Harry is probably the Heir to Gryffindor, but another twist might be that Crabbe or Goyle or maybe Pansy is the Heir to Slytherin! VERY VERY unlikely, but I'm just making guess on things like this! I'm sorry, but I could find no book reference to those guesses. :sorry:

So, I was thinking...It might be a good idea to see what from Book 2 developed in 3 and 4. Maybe we'll find a trend. Like the house elf theme or the constantly new DADA teacher.

Originally posted by FreckledApples (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=189485#post189485))
I mite just be a morbid person, but i think Harry's gonnna die!! the main key in book two is how much Voldie and Harry r alike. Also, Dumbledore once said the scar connects Voldie and Harry. some ppl(i agree) think dumbledore had the hint of triumph in his eye because he new Voldie had enough human in him now, to die. but since harry is connected to voldie it will be like this movie i saw where one good person had to die so the bad person could die. i think harry is gonna kill himself by doing something to his scar!!! well rite me bac p.s. sum ppl say they would hate the books if he died but it would make them even better!!


For the LAST time, HARRY WILL NOT DIE!! The "SCAR" thing might mean; it disappear at the end, it will be there as a reminder Or it will no longer hurt because Voldie is dead!!! Many, many other things!

Why would Dumbledore had a hit of triumph in his eye knowing that Harry must kill himself in order for Voldamort to die??? He loves Harry, and Harry having to KILL himself is ludicrous! Sorry, just my opinion. Just like it's your opinion that Harry will die.:sorry: Even so wouldn't Dumbledore come up with a way to NOT let that happen???


The triumph in the eye thing is that; Voldamort IS now vulnerable to magic!!!

FRED ASTAIRE, although I do not think that Harry will die, it is a plausible theory. The exact quote from GoF is:

"For a fleeting instant, Harry thought he saw a gleam of something like triumph in Dumbledore's eyes. But next second, Harry was sure he had imagined it, for when Dumbledore had returned to his seat behind the desk, he looked as old and weary as Harry had ever seen him."

DD could have had a moment of fleeting 'triumph' as he realised Voldie could now be defeated, but then, almost immediately, realised what this would mean (the death of Harry), which explains why he looks 'old and weary'. And sure, he'll try to come up with a way that it wouldn't happen; he could spend 3 books doing it, but Harry himself realises what he has to do, and sacrifices himself.

And we already know Voldie is vulnerable to magic, he says himself; "But I was willing to embrace mortal life again, before chasing immortal."

It's all possible... though I hope he won't die!!!

Why do you say Voldemort is now vunerable to magic?

Originally posted by Dessie (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=190432#post190432))
FRED ASTAIRE, although I do not think that Harry will die, it is a plausible theory. The exact quote from GoF is:

"For a fleeting instant, Harry thought he saw a gleam of something like triumph in Dumbledore's eyes. But next second, Harry was sure he had imagined it, for when Dumbledore had returned to his seat behind the desk, he looked as old and weary as Harry had ever seen him."

DD could have had a moment of fleeting 'triumph' as he realised Voldie could now be defeated, but then, almost immediately, realised what this would mean (the death of Harry), which explains why he looks 'old and weary'. And sure, he'll try to come up with a way that it wouldn't happen; he could spend 3 books doing it, but Harry himself realises what he has to do, and sacrifices himself.

And we already know Voldie is vulnerable to magic, he says himself; "But I was willing to embrace mortal life again, before chasing immortal."



Yeah, I guess so :( . But Harry WILL NOT DIE! I FORBID :angry: IT!!!!:grumble: :censored: I WILL NOT HAPPEN!!!!!!!

I do NOT want Harry, Hermione, ANY of the Weasley's (well, maybe not Percey-IF he turns on his family), Dumbledore, Snape, Hagrid, Prof's McGonagall, Lupin OR Sirius to die :angry: !!!

Here's a crazy theory. What if Harry dies and we find out that the books were written by Ron to celebrate his best friend? I just got the idea because Anne Rice writes her Vampire Chronicles sort of like this. Supposedly real Vampires write about themselves, but pass it off as fiction. Interesting premise.

Originally posted by sillygirlzam (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=190711#post190711))
Here's a crazy theory. What if Harry dies and we find out that the books were written by Ron to celebrate his best friend? I just got the idea because Anne Rice writes her Vampire Chronicles sort of like this. Supposedly real Vampires write about themselves, but pass it off as fiction. Interesting premise.




Nnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooo!!!



It can't be, because there are certain things that Harry NEVER told Ron or Hermione about his childhood! In the GoF when Diggory died; Harry did not tell Ron OR Hermione what REALLY happened. So, nope it's not a memory or a day dream by Harry himself. It can't be!

Hey, don't burst my bubble! :grumble: I want Harry AND friends to triumph over the :devil: baddie, you know??:sorry: :sorry: :o


God, is it 21st of June YET!!!!!!!!:rolleyes: Put me back in Cryogenic, WAKE me when it's time, sheesh!

I am tired of speculating! My head hurts!!!

Lol. I know how you feel!

21st June hurry up already!!!

My head hurts too! (You should try out the love thread...)

Why isn't it June already?!

Originally posted by sillygirlzam (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=190711#post190711))
Here's a crazy theory. What if Harry dies and we find out that the books were written by Ron to celebrate his best friend? I just got the idea because Anne Rice writes her Vampire Chronicles sort of like this. Supposedly real Vampires write about themselves, but pass it off as fiction. Interesting premise.


This is my first post in this thread after a long, long break. :)

Sillygirlzam, if the books were written by Ron to celebrate his best friend, we wouldn't know half the things we know about Harry now. Besides the books are from Harry's POV, not Ron's. If the books were written by Ron, I'd like to know how he read Harry's mind. :p

Okay, getting back to the Draco and Lucius theoyr. I think that you are right about Lucius' attitude towards the bouncing ferret. Do you think that Lucius could be setting up Draco or protecting him? The less he knows the better off Draco is for getting off the hook. But, by not telling him things he can more easily manipulate him and use him for his own gains. Any thoughts??

Maybe Ron's a seer? OK, maybe not...

Draco and Lucius. I don't think Lucius trusts Draco completely. I don't think he trusts *anyone* actually. Perhaps this will be what finally persuades Malfoy Jnr to come back to the light? He seems to care a great deal about what his Dad thinks of him, and Lucius does nothing but critisize that we've seen. Perhaps he'll go too far once and it'll upset Draco? He's very vindictive after all...

True but I don't know about going one too far after all he has been exceeding cruel to him. I think Draco enjoys the position his father provides him. I've said before that one of things that would make Draco go to the light is if his father lost his money and his power. That would make him turn pretty quick. Remeber what happened when Lucius was booted from the Board of Govenors, he became quiet humble.

Max-someone on another thread mentioned that possibly Ron is good at Diviniation (I don't know the arguement, just read it in passing). I don't know if it's true, but we don't know yet if Harry didn't tell Ron about what happened to Cedric, we might find out in book 5. I can't see how Harry could not share his experiences with his best friends, especially something that everyone is dying to know.

Hmm, yeah, but it would be pretty distressing to live through it more times than he has to. Like DD said.

As for Draco, perhaps he falls in love and Lucius does something to his potential gf? Love is a very strong motivation you know. Maybe that happens and he loses his power...

These are some things i found as i read HP2 i thought were interesting:

pg. 154(american) it says:
"scorch marks!" he said "Here--and here--"
what are the scorch marks from? surely the basilisk didn't make them.

pg. 183 it says:
"An old cauldron was perched on the toilet, and a crackling from under the rim told harry they had lit a fire beneath it. Conjuring up portable, water proof fires was a specialy of hermione's."
That is shown throughout the series.

pg. 198:
"He was walking toward them when somthing of what they were saying struck his ears, and he paused to listen, hidden in the invisibility section"
Invisiblity section, eh? very interesting...

pg. 204:
"They rose upward in circles higher, and higher, until at last, slightly qizzy, Harry saw a gleaming oak door ahead, with a brass knocker in the shape of a griffin"
Yes i was the first to bring this up. griffin-door may lead us to belief that dumbledore was in griffindor

pg. 207:
"They can carry immensely heavy loaads, their tears have healing powers, and they make highly faithful pets."
Why was faithful in italics? hmm

So what do yall think about these?

Originally posted by bubblesofdeath88 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=197457#post197457))
These are some things i found as i read HP2 i thought were interesting:

pg. 154(american) it says:
:"scorch marks!" he said "Here--and here--"
what are the scorch marks from? surely the basilisk didn't make them.

pg. 183 it says:
"An old cauldron was perched on the toilet, and a crackling from under the rim told harry they had lit a fire beneath it. Conjuring up portable, water proof fires was a specialy of hermione's."
That is shown throughout the series.

pg. 198:
"He was walking toward them when somthing of what they were saying struck his ears, and he paused to listen, hidden in the invisibility section"
Invisiblity section, eh? very interesting...

pg. 204:
"They rose upward in circles higher, and higher, until at last, slightly qizzy, Harry saw a gleaming oak door ahead, with a brass knocker in the shape of a griffin"
Yes i was the first to bring this up. griffin-door may lead us to belief that dumbledore was in griffindor

pg. 207:
"They can carry immensely heavy loaads, their tears have healing powers, and they make highly faithful pets."
Why was faithful in italics? hmm

So what do yall think about these?


I guess I can only spec on the FIRST one ("scorch marks" are caused by the all being moved? You know, so that the snake could get out? :??: :whistle: ) but the REST; beats me ;D ! But that was very good spotting!!

This thread is hilarious!

Fred Astaire, I wholeheartedly agree with you. HARRY WILL NOT DIE. Neither will Ron, Hermione, DD, Hagrid, Malfoy, Ginny, any of the other Weaselys, Snape, Sirius or Remus, or McG, or crookshanks, Hedwig or Pig. Sheesh, I don't even want Filch to die.

where does it say anything about a secret panel in malfoy's house i don't remember seeing that

Originally posted by Harvey16 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=198423#post198423))
where does it say anything about a secret panel in malfoy's house i don't remember seeing that



It's (Chambers of Secret when Harry and Ron took the Polly Juice) under the living OR family room floor!

It's under the drawing room floor.

Ya it says that they have some very valuable dark arts things under their drawing room floor.

ok so i am going back through this book to look for things that could be key..but could be easily over looked.

this is th first hing that struck my as odd..i never notcied it before

Dobby: Pg16
" Harry Potter must not put himself in peril. He is too important . sir."

at first i didnt think anything of this..i just figured dobby didn't want harry to get hurt because of his ledgendary greatness.

however the more i thought about it the more i seemed like JKR worded this very deliberatly, to be easily over looked...

the way dobby doesn't want harry to get hurt and the fact the he says "he is too imortant " implies that dobby knows something about harry's importance to the future...and therefore doesn't want harry hurt becasue he will be vital to the future fight between good and evil. we know that you know who targeted Harry for some reason..now we can assume that dobby knows why.

so why is harry so imortant to the future and how does dobby know this?

ideas:
harry is the hair of gryffindor and therefore is the only one who can defeet you know who or for some otehr reason is very vital to the future fight with volti. since dobby lived with the Malfoy's and could have heard Mr. Malfoy or other DE talking about why Harry was targeted buy you know who.

ok not sure if that makes any sence but i tired

Do the House elfs know about the centaurs prophecy?

Originally posted by sashapasta (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=200845#post200845))
ok so i am going back through this book to look for things that could be key..but could be easily over looked.

this is th first hing that struck my as odd..i never notcied it before

Dobby: Pg16
" Harry Potter must not put himself in peril. He is too important . sir."

at first i didnt think anything of this..i just figured dobby didn't want harry to get hurt because of his ledgendary greatness.

however the more i thought about it the more i seemed like JKR worded this very deliberatly, to be easily over looked...

the way dobby doesn't want harry to get hurt and the fact the he says "he is too imortant " implies that dobby knows something about harry's importance to the future...and therefore doesn't want harry hurt becasue he will be vital to the future fight between good and evil. we know that you know who targeted Harry for some reason..now we can assume that dobby knows why.

so why is harry so imortant to the future and how does dobby know this?

ideas:
harry is the hair of gryffindor and therefore is the only one who can defeet you know who or for some otehr reason is very vital to the future fight with volti. since dobby lived with the Malfoy's and could have heard Mr. Malfoy or other DE talking about why Harry was targeted buy you know who.

ok not sure if that makes any sence but i tired



I generally tend to question just how many people know exactly why Voldemort went after Harry, but this may not be the thread to do it in. However, I suspect that if Dobby knows this information about Harry it is because he found out from Lucius who, being a Deatheater, may have found out from Voldemort. OF course, he may not have. I wonder if Voldemort would advertise whatever it is that makes Harry such a threat to him. I tend to think not.

It maybe that Ginny will make sacrifices to pay for Harry's life.

http://news.lycos.com.cn/art_img/274923.jpg http://news.lycos.com.cn/art_img/274881.jpg http://news.lycos.com.cn/art_img/274807.jpg

Not really that important to the story, but Ron is exessively jealous of Hermione's fondness for Lockhart, while Harry is not.

[I do NOT want Harry, Hermione, ANY of the Weasley's (well, maybe not Percey-IF he turns on his family), Dumbledore, Snape, Hagrid, Prof's McGonagall, Lupin OR Sirius to die :angry: !!!


You are going to be extremely disappointed then because one of those persons will die in the very next book. Although I agree with you I don't want any of them to die eiether. But I have narrowed the death in Book 5 to 3. All of which are on your list. Maybe we'll both be happy and I'll be wrong but I don't think so.

Originally posted by ahsweape (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=201001#post201001))
I generally tend to question just how many people know exactly why Voldemort went after Harry, but this may not be the thread to do it in. However, I suspect that if Dobby knows this information about Harry it is because he found out from Lucius who, being a Deatheater, may have found out from Voldemort. OF course, he may not have. I wonder if Voldemort would advertise whatever it is that makes Harry such a threat to him. I tend to think not.


Good point. Here's the question though. Since Harry doesn't knnow why the Dark Lord went after his parents and he now knows that Snape was a DE. Why doesn't Harry just ask Snape what's really going on? Snape hates Harry enough to just tell him not being concerned about his feelings or emotional development which is why DD won't tell him.
Just seems the logical course to me. That's what I would have done.

Do you really think that Snape would know the full reason behind Voldemorts quest to get rid of Harry?

Yes, I really do. Snape was the one who told Dumbledore about Voldemort's plan to take out James. You don't think he would find out something like that without knowing why the Dark Lord wanted the Potter's out of the way? Besides DD knows where do you think he found out?

Something came up in the love thread that i thought may apply here too. In book 2 Lucius Malfoy gets a good look at Hermione's parents, and we also find out what he thinks of them. Hermione's character is currently in a lot of danger after the Daily Prophet article of her being Harry's "muggle born girlfriend". It is now known to the general public that Hermione is both muggle born and very close to Harry. She is in danger and this will probably play a role later on. Now that Lucius knows her family - could this be one of the key parts of book 2?

Well it was a little obvious that lucius didnt exactly like the grangers, but he couldnt do anything about it. But now that voldemort is back maybe one of his assignments could be targeting them.

come on lets keep this thread going!

Wow! This is a great thread!!! I probably have no clue about the key things in Book 2, but I'll try anyways. How about the flying car?? (I don't know if it's been mentioned.)

I dunno if someone already said this but whatever. I read in some website that in the 2nd movie you can catch Malfoy looking at Hermione once or twice. So maybe that means something I dunno :??:

Originally posted by DRaGoNoFiLlFaItH (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=208557#post208557))
I dunno if someone already said this but whatever. I read in some website that in the 2nd movie you can catch Malfoy looking at Hermione once or twice. So maybe that means something I dunno :??:

Yeah he doe's!I think he like's her.:love: he he:evil:

Maybe it has something to do with Gilderoy Lockhart and his honorary membership in the Dark Force Defence League, which is the organization that said Harry could have a violent personality in GoF.

Another possible clue from CoS is when Lucious refers to the Potters as "meddlesome fool". Why would he call them that, and what did they meddle in?

We are also introduced to the house elves and their power. Why are they so subservient to wizards. In the end Lucious seems to be frightened of Dobby. I wonder why, if Dobby scares Lucious, the house elves enjoy, what we assume is, enslavement.

Just a few thoughts for now.

I haven't been here for ages and I just have a question to ask. Did anybody notice that when Harry met Tom in the Chamber of Secrets his scar didn't hurt him? Tom Riddle and Voldemort are one. They are the same person but how come he didn't feel his scar twinge just for a bit? He met Voldemort in the first book and his scar hurt. Same is true in GoF in Voldemort's rebirth ceremony. But WHY didn't he feel his scar hurt in the Chamber of Secrets with TOM RIDDLE who happens to be Lord Voldemort? Is something going on or is something in there that made his scar hurt-free while battling Voldemort? Or did I just miss something? Okay I'll stop asking questions it's really getting annoying. That thing has been bothering me last week while doing my drawings for my plates due tomorrow that I just have to go online and post this in this thread.

When Harry encountered Tom Riddle in the Chamber, Riddle was still a memory. Certainly he was growing stronger by the minute through exploiting Ginny's life-force, but he wasn't technically human or anything associated with being human (ie alive).

Had Riddle the opportunity to finish his transformation from being a "memory" to being "alive" Harry's scar would probably have started hurting. As this never happened, it's quite hard to speculate.

That is something to go on, Some Wizards do posses a loathing of muggles and as we no know that Malfoy is a death eater perhaps the opertunity has arissen to act out against what they hate. A supportive environment to strike fear in to muggle born students and send them packing from Hogwarts, or have them removed from the school for their "own saftey" and protection. better to be in the dark about their powers than have death eaters chasing them down and killing them right?

Originally posted by too_wicked (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=209223#post209223))
I haven't been here for ages and I just have a question to ask. Did anybody notice that when Harry met Tom in the Chamber of Secrets his scar didn't hurt him? Tom Riddle and Voldemort are one. They are the same person but how come he didn't feel his scar twinge just for a bit? He met Voldemort in the first book and his scar hurt. Same is true in GoF in Voldemort's rebirth ceremony. But WHY didn't he feel his scar hurt in the Chamber of Secrets with TOM RIDDLE who happens to be Lord Voldemort? Is something going on or is something in there that made his scar hurt-free while battling Voldemort? Or did I just miss something? Okay I'll stop asking questions it's really getting annoying. That thing has been bothering me last week while doing my drawings for my plates due tomorrow that I just have to go online and post this in this thread.



I noticed! Was that a mistake or because it was only his memory???




Hey Animagi Girl, love your sig!! I am for Harry and Ginny too!!!;) ;)

Ya it was probably just because he was a memory. The real thing was off hidden at the time.

Yes i do think that malfoy has a little thing for hermione, because he calls her mudblood but that could just be to make others in slitherin think he hates her. But he really likes her.

He wasn't fully there, and being just a memory he could not actually hurt or kill anyone, especially Harry.

Okay...here is a shot in the dark. Aragon was going to have his sons and daughters eat Harry and Ron. Meat eating spiders sounds pretty ominous to me.

I think Draco has a little something for Hermoine. But, think of what Lucius would say. He needs to have someone socially acceptable (in the eyes of the Malfoys) on his arm. That certainly isn't Hermoine. Plus, calling her names is a way of hiding it.

I'm also thinking that the fight betwtween Arthus and Lucius is going to cause Arthur some problems. Plus, coupled with the fact that he thinks muggles are fascinating. Is he going to do something to help protect the Grangers?

I also want to know why Hagrid was in Knockturn Alley. He covered awfully fast with that flimsy excuse. Is he going to get his wand back? Which would be great especially if he's going to meet with the giants. Is someone going to coach him so that his magic improves? Since Fang is a pet of Hagrid's, does he have any magically properties?

Hmmmm

all spiders eat meat.flies and other insects.we do not consider them 'meat' but they actually are just very small.

hmmm, dunno if this has appeared in this thread but I figured something out after beginning book 4 yesterday.

In book 2, we learn about tom riddle being lord voldemort and being in an orphanage (sp??) and stuff.

But if we read the first 3 pages of GOF, we read Tom Riddle and his parents were killed (by avada kedavra probably)!!!

If this is the same Tom Riddle, and I have no doubt it is, then who is lord Voldemort? and what has the orphanage to do with him since he lived with his parents in book 4???

Anybody, any ideas???

If you remember Voldemort was cursed with his father's name. Voldemort killed his father and his grandparents.

Voldie was born. Its (it's not "he", is it?) mother witch died. His father had escaped, so Voldie went to the orphanage. Tom Sr got married with a well-muggle woman, and had muggle (or not...) children in the mansion. When Voldie Jr was round 18 it traveled to Little Whatever and killed them. Someone in the village saw him, remember?

Concerning Dumbledore's age. JKR did say he was about 150 years old in an interview I think. However, for some reason, I think he has to be older than this. His partner, Nicholas Flammel, is at least 700 years old at this time because of the philosophers stone. If Dumbledore helped him discover it, he would have to be WAY older than 150.

I had more to say, but its way too late, so I forgot.


Aria

hmm, okay but... why would voldies father name his 2nd son Tom as well? why would jk do that???

It actually never says that DD helped Flamel on the Sorceror's (Philosopher's) Stone. It just says that he worked on Alchemy with Nicolas Flamel. Perhaps this implies that they were working on something else for some time...

Also, Im pretty sure that Tom Riddle didn't name his second son Tom too...I think Moldywarts killed his grandfather that was named Tom Riddle and his father that was named Tom Riddle. I mean, it says "He killed the Riddles and their grown up son." If he had a son after Moldy, then he would still be in his teens, probly about 16 or 17 and wouldn't be called "grown up."

so then voldi must have been very young when he killed his father, since the dad is reffered to as their grown up son. How did voldi master the curse at such a young age?

Well Voldi's the heir of slytherin, plus he was probly in his seventh year or fresh out of it when he killed them. He was a strong wizard to begin with and he probably wanted to know everything he could about the unforgiveable curses. If he had just passed out of Hogwarts, it wouldn't be super hard to master the killing curse.

In book 2 Riddle said something like 'after ginny fed him her secrets he started pouring some of his soul back into her.' Any thought on that? Does that mean that she really could speak parseltounge?

P.S. I had to get this thread back to life.

Ya! I've thought of that too and posted it in different places it came up....I'm pretty sure she's gonna be a parselmouth...

i hope so! so then harry and ginny could talk to each other completely secretly in parseltounge, and nobody(but voldemort) would know what they are talking about;)

Originally posted by bjackm (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=63018#post63018))
And I know how difficult it was to get it all in there without drawing too much attention to the clues."


Another well-hidden clue is when we learn that Voldemort's got a sibling.

He had a sibling?! Where did it say that?

it says he was an only child, he says it himself to Harry when hes talking to him in the chamber of secrets. Tom says thats one of the things they have in common

Tom Riddle was very young when he talked to Harry in the Chamber. He found out later.

Originally posted by bubblesofdeath88 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=229128#post229128))
He had a sibling?! Where did it say that?


Harry asking Dobby if Voldemort's got a "brother": he practically answers "yes".

are you sure? what chapter says that?

First appearance of Dobby, by the beginning of Book 2

ok you gotta read the whole thing not just that line. It says:

''All right!" cried Harry, grabbing the elf's arm to stop him. "You cant tell me. I understand. But why are you warning me?" A sudden, unpleasant thought struck him. "Hang on - this hasnt got anything to do with Vol- sorry- with You know who, has it? You could just shake or nod" he added hastily as Dobbys head tilted worryingly close to the wall again. Slowly, Dobby shook his head. "Not - not He Who must not be named, sir-" But Dobbys eyes were wide and he seemed to be trying to give Harry a hint. Harry however was completely lost. "He hasnt got a brother, has he?" Dobby shook his head (meaning NO), his eyes wider than ever.

So he hasnt got a brother cuz Dobby said no. I think he was just getting Harry to think of the Malfoys. Tom Riddle told Harry they were both only childs. Theres no way he could have a brother cuz his mom died at birth and he killed his dad like it says in chapter 1 of book 4

Originally posted by DRaGoNoFiLlFaItH (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230299#post230299))
So he hasnt got a brother cuz Dobby said no. I think he was just getting Harry to think of the Malfoys. Tom Riddle told Harry they were both only childs. Theres no way he could have a brother cuz his mom died at birth and he killed his dad like it says in chapter 1 of book 4


If you look closer into Dobbys behaviour you'll see that when he shakes his head but opens WIDELY his eyes, he means "yes".

The fact that Voldemorts mother died when he was born, doesn't mean that she couldn't have had other babys before him, does it?

When he opened his eyes widely he was trying to tell harry that it wasn't voldemort but it was somebody just like voldemort LIKE a brothe, but not actually one. He was refering to voldemorts younger self when he widened his eyes.

When Harry asks Dobby to explain why he said no to that question, Dobby replies along the line of........

"Before he became Voldemort he could be named." That was suppose to be a hint to when Voldemort was known as Tom Riddle.

Facts:
1. Vol said he was an only child
2. His mum died during giving birth
3. the Dad abandoned Tom and his wife becuase he found out she was a witch...

I suppose you may say that Vol has a brother he didnt know about...
Think about it logially: How would Vol find out he had a brother? How would HP find out that Vol knew he had a brother? Also, this has no relavace to the basic plot of HP; it would be introdcing a new character, that was older than Vol; it just makes things unneccassarily (no matter how much I try, its always going to be a spelling mistake...) arkward (I do try and spell...)

Originally posted by Auri DeMeer (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230263#post230263))
Tom Riddle was very young when he talked to Harry in the Chamber. He found out later.



Harry asking Dobby if Voldemort's got a "brother": he practically answers "yes".


No he doesn't.

Dobby is trying to give Harry a hint about it involving Tom Riddle, that is Voldemort, but BEFORE he had assumed the name Voldemort. Tom Riddle CAN be named. So Dobby said that is do NOT involve "He Who Can't Be Named" while making little hinting gestures. Harry said "I don't understand. He doesn't have a brother, does he?" or something like that.

No, there is no indication anywhere that Voldemort has a brother.

Originally posted by smartypants (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230352#post230352))
Dobby is trying to give Harry a hint about it involving Tom Riddle, that is Voldemort, but BEFORE he had assumed the name Voldemort. Tom Riddle CAN be named.


I think Tom Riddle had already "assumed" the name Voldemort by the time we see him in the Chamber. He shows Harry the word game (I am Lord Voldemort vs Tom M. Riddle thing)

Ok, think about this. If Voldemort had an Older brother, then his mum would have told his dad about being a witch sooner and Voldemort would never have been born...

Why?

I mean, she could have had a baby, waited some years, be pregnant again and THEN tell his husband she was a Witch.

And probably the reason she had to tell him was, that the older child had begun doing magic.

Like, "Hey, how come Pepito our son is flying around the kitchen in that broom?"

"Oh, dear, I should have told you before, I can't deny it anymore, I am a witch..."

"Mmm... That explains things..."

Well I think it would be a bit more likely that she would tell them because most Wizards and Witches seem to have higher morals than muggles and wouldn't wait until the father finds out on his own that they must be a wizard or a witch...

Originally posted by Kristus_Vesanus (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230398#post230398))
Well I think it would be a bit more likely that she would tell them because most Wizards and Witches seem to have higher morals than muggles and wouldn't wait until the father finds out on his own that they must be a wizard or a witch...


If that was the case, she would have told him BEFORE getting married, and not afterwards.

Originally posted by Auri DeMeer (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230362#post230362))
I think Tom Riddle had already "assumed" the name Voldemort by the time we see him in the Chamber. He shows Harry the word game (I am Lord Voldemort vs Tom M. Riddle thing)


Not officially. Professor Dippet doesn't call him Voldemort, does he? :D

Dobby hints about Voldemort/Tom Riddle. He doesn't make a distinction between the two. Why should he? They're the same "thing".

ok to help clear all this mess on if voldemort has a brother:

CoS pg 339:
Harry to Dobby: " You told me that this (the trouble at Howarts) had noting to do with he who must not be named remember?
Dobby: It was a clue sir. The Dark Lord before changing his name could be freely named you see?
Auri DeMeer was right. Voldemort didn't/doesn't have a brother.

you mean smartypants is right, auri thought he had a brother. But what potterfreak said solves it

what about Voldemortt as the last remaining ancestor of salazar slytherin...typo or more to it?

She's admitted that was a typo, and it was changed in later editions.

she said it was a deliberate typo didnt she?

Just thought that i would try to bring this thread back to life.:)

Originally posted by Auri DeMeer (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=230413#post230413))
If that was the case, she would have told him BEFORE getting married, and not afterwards.


We are all assuming that they were married. Does the text actually say that they were? Could this be the true bitterness that exists ofr Riddle and why his Mom had to live poorly in the village? If they were married wouldn't there have been a settlement and some support? Can anyone clarify the marriage thing?

For those of you that havent seen the interview with JKR and the screen writer on the CoS DVD; she mentions that there are things that he wants to cut out, or change the words etc; but JKR sometimes says that the scene is important to what happens in book 6/7 etc.

I got the impression from what JKR said in the interview, that she meant the concepts of the second book - the way it introduces new ideas, eg, how many people thought that pure blood was better than muggle-borns; and Riddles history, and how his hatred of muggle-borns started. But Im sure there is much more to it than that; we wont find ot for a while though...

i need to buy the dvd.

Is Mrs. Norris really a cat? I think she's an animagus. Probably muggle-born coz she was attacked in CoS. She can't be attacked just because she is a squib's cat right?

That is a very good point actually, which makes it more convincing that Mrs Norris is an animagus! After all, people assumed that it was becuase Filch was a squib, but we do not actually KNOW that; and Slytherin is only described as hating Muggle-borns, and there was nothing about squibs.

A squib could be pureblood right. So, they shouldn't be related to muggle borns because squibs are complete opposites of muggle borns.

I also think there is more to Aragog than what we know as of now. He's back in the fifth book and so is the Ford Anglia. Maybe Ron and Harry and Hermione will go back to the forest to ask Aragog another thing. They love to meddle with things right? Hehehe. Just kidding.

Aragog and the Ford Anglia in the 5th book? Poor Ron... If they ever try to look for Aragog again, it must be because they have to ask "it" something very badly.

Or maybe they only happen to be in the forest and Aragog pops up, "I'm glad to see old friends around, especially at lunch time"...:)

LoL Auri. Dang I loved the car hated Aragog. I'm with Ron severe hate of spiders. Last unrealted thing, thanks too wicked now I have Lucius in my head saying and I would have gotten away with it too if it weren't for those meddleing kids! (Can't see volde saying that)
I think the fact that we learned that Tom was Volde and Tom lived in a muggle orphanage will be important. As well as that Volde gave Harry some of his power and Tom used Ginny so now she may have some of his power or know something important.
I would like to see someone from Tom's past that survived. Someone who was kinda important to him there must have been at least one person. I would love to see a muggle from the orphanage who was nice to him. Again there must have been at least one.

I don't think Mrs. Norris was attacked intentionally. She was snooping the halls when the basilisk came out of the bathroom. She just saw the reflection in the water. The Basilsik may not have even known the cat was there.
Or Jenny might have told Tom about the cat that snoops around. Tom may have been worried about that so the cat went first just so it couldn't snoop and possibly tell that it had seen a giant snake. I know cats can't talk, but Mrs. Norris seems to be able to tell Filch things.

I think I need to reread Book 2, then watch the movie again and take notes of things that were left in, exact wording, etc.

Originally posted by Lupins Ladee (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=263140#post263140))
I would like to see someone from Tom's past that survived. Someone who was kinda important to him there must have been at least one person. I would love to see a muggle from the orphanage who was nice to him. Again there must have been at least one.


I'd also love to know more about Tom Riddle, about the circumstances of his life hat made him what he is now. Many orphans are nice people, like everybody else when they grow up, willing to have a nice family of their own.

What was he like, before he even knew he was a wizard? Before knowing he was the Heir of Slytherin? I wonder.

In the Chamber of Secrets DVD, the interview with JKR was very interesting in that she pointed out a few things about the second movie which she believed were important. One such thing was the development of what she called "feelings" between the three characters which create more mature feelings leading to the fourth book. We all know that in the 4th book, Ron shows that he has some feelings towards Hermione and this may be what she is hinting at.

Sorry, I haven't read all of everyone's thoughts, 20 pages is just too much. First, I think the greatest thing is that Harry gets to see Voldemort and learn more of how he has some of his powers. The connection between Harry and Voldemort becomes more apparent. Also, I think it is significant that Voldemort (through Lucious Malfoy) chose Ginny Weasly to go through. On top of that, I forget the name of the dark valley, but the discovery of that and the dark secrets (a small amount of them) of Lucious is probably a big thing. Also, Harry was in Dumbledore's office for the first time, and show his belief in the old man. Maybe there is something against cats, with the one that was hurt by the basalisk, and Hermiane turning into one. If you remember later, Hermiane gets a cat. Also, though we have seen why it was important, we were introduced to the womping willow. There are so many other things but it is true, the second book does set up a lot of circumstances that could show the future. The first book developed the story, the second set the foundation, and then the third and fourth had amazing plots based off of many things in the second book. I think there is a lot more to Hagrid than we think. Remember, Voldemort turned against him, and also knew he had the spider, so how close were Hagrid and Voldemort?

NYCWitch920, the more MATURE feelings also might be hinting at H/Hr. But I know you've been in the love thread, I just responded to your post, so you should already know this. But this isn't the love thread, so I'm going to stop talking off topic.

just one thing I have always thought about...We see that animals are affected by the Basilisks stare (Mrs Norris), but how comes the Basilisk never gets petrified? He could look at his reflection in the water and get petrified himself...

It must be immune to its own venomous gaze.

the only strong link i think with book two is the close connection between voldemort and harry...at the end dumbledore says voldemort transferred some of his powers to harry...maybe more than parseltoungue...but i also think that Ginny and fawkes will play huge parts in the books...

I bet J.K. reads these forums to see if we're on the right track to guessing things about future books. If I were her, I would change the plot every time someone guessed it.

Something that caught my attention was that Tom Riddle wasn't a pure blood. How could he be the heir of Slytherin after everything that Salazar did to rid Hogwarts of half-bloods? If Tom had come back to life fully (if Ginny had died), would the basilisk still have listened to him just because he could speak parseltongue, or would it have gone after him as well? Why did he get to enter the chamber in the first place? How did he discover it when he first came to Hogwarts?

Originally posted by Madam Rosmerta (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=263688#post263688))
I bet J.K. reads these forums to see if we're on the right track to guessing things about future books. If I were her, I would change the plot every time someone guessed it.


Lol, that is a funny thought

i heard that she is on the internet...ALOT...secretely looking over conversations...LOL but that is cool becuase then she gets all the thoughts of her readers...

::shudder:: JK is watching you.....
haha she must be having a jolly good laugh, watching all of us fans tearing our hair out, mulling over her few cryptic hints endlessly...

I think Hagrid being in Knockturn Alley is of great significance. I don't think he was really getting something to kill what's killing the cabbages.

Also, Harry went into that store for a reason in Knockturn Alley. And I think that Hand of Glory will play in a big way in future books.

Do you think that Harry will go in to Knockturn alley on his own to purchase things to fight Voldie.


I also think the relationship between Draco and his father is important. It's as if he fears his father and wants to please him so much.

I agree with you on everything u just said Dracofan! :p

Why that store in Knockturn Alley? Why not one of the others.... and why did Harry grab that particular hand and not something else. I know that the hand sort of guards things, (at least it did in the CoS game). Perhaps we are just pondering over these questions that really won't have an significance.... only to fool us into believing things..... :??:

I think he just had to appear in some store, so JKR chose that one (it was also convient becuase we found out that Lucius has some things of Voldermorts, and other Dark materials). But I am sure we WILL visit Knockturn alley again, as that seemed more of an introduction to it, than an actual proper scene. He only really got to see that shop, and none of the other.

I did think that it was strange that Hagrid went to Knockturn Alley.

Ron bit his lip, then said tentatively "You met Hagrid down Knockturn Alley, didnt you, Harry?"
"He was buying a flesh-eating slug repellant" said Harry quickly.
(this is where Harry "realises" that Hagrid petrified people.) It does seem a bit strange to bring it up again.

What I wondered was that if Harry ever told Ron or Ron ever told his dad that the Malfoy's had a secret dungeon in their manor that Draco tells them (they were as crabbe and goyle).

I think that's important.

I was just thinking that maybe the fact that the board of governors were so quick to have Dumbledore kicked out of Hogwarts during the attacks is important. I think in CoS we see an introduction of how the wizard government can be manipulated by evil wizards, which I think will be important.

Earlier it was mentioned the Tom Riddle has green eyes....Can someone tell me where to find that information...thanks...

This thread is great (despite the facts that only about half the posts have to do with what is key in book 2 :lol: )

I personally think that it must be something not to obvious, that hasn't played a large role in books 3 or 4.

Some of my ideas (based only on what was in both the books *and* the movies, since JK said that all the key parts were in the movie):

-Lucius saying that Harry's parents were "meddlesome." We still don't know what jobs they held, or really much of anything about their past.
-Something about one of the minor characters that we haven't really seen that much, like Colin, Justin, and even Penelope. Although I can't think of how any one of them would be very important in the future...
-Aragog? Although, I'm kind of thinking this isn't one of the key details that will be important later, because
1)it would be pretty hard to leave Aragog out of the movie, and JK said in the COS DVD interview that she told the writer to leave in certain details that would be very important later, so it must have been something easy to leave out
2)JK has already told us that we will be seeing Aragog again, and she wouldn't have revealed this if Aragog was the "important thing in book 2 that will have something very important to play in the future books"
-and now that I think of it, the reasons for Aragog apply to the Anglia too, so I'm ruling that out too.
-I agree with dracofan, Hagrid's excuse for why he was in Knockturn Alley was kind of sketchy. I for one really didn't believe that he was looking for flesh-eating slug repelent...
-And perhaps the Hand of Glory will come into play later on...
-Something about Tom Riddle's schoolmates, Hagrid + Myrtle, could be significant. Perhaps they know something about Voldie that has yet to be revealed, since they went to school with him.
-Also, what about Dippet and Dumbledore (during his time as a teacher)? I mean, we know that DD is important, but maybe one of the key parts in the future is that he used to teach Voldie.


Okay, that's it for now. And didn't JK say that the important thing in book 2 will be very important in book *six*? If so, we have quite a long time to be pondering this... :(

Excellent posts wolfie and MadMagic. :)
I'm sure we'll learn why his parents were "meddlesome". :) (I hope so)

You are probably right MadMagic.
We will defeintly learn more about how corrupt the ministry is.
I think Arthur and Lucius' relationship at the ministry will continue into the series. We've seen more with each book. That seems to play a huge part with Fudge.
Arthur is held back because of their prejudice.
Lucius was kicked off the schoolboard but the MoM is still in his pocket.

Perhaps this was in the books, and I just forgot, but what house was Hagrid in? It just seemed odd to me how well Hagrid and Tom knew each other when Tom confronted and framed him. And he knew exactly where to find him. It also seemed to be someplace in the dungeon, but I could be wrong on that. If they were in the same house, then maybe you are all right saying that there might be more to Tom's old schoolmates. That has been bugging me, even more so when I add in the sketchiness of Hagrid looking for slug repellent in Knockturn Alley.

Well, anyway, I also think the store Harry flooed himself into will play an important role in the future. I don't think it was a simple coincidence that he arrived there.

Originally posted by harp230 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=265361#post265361))
Earlier it was mentioned the Tom Riddle has green eyes....Can someone tell me where to find that information...thanks...


I've only seen them as referred to as red eyes. I don't remember them being green.

Hagrid was in Griffindor. It hasn't been mentioned in the books but it's in the facts section of mugglenet.

It never says outright in the books, but I believe JKR has confirmed that Hagrid was in Gryffindor. (On the Mugglenet Book 5 Page, "Things Not Disclosed in the Books")

Hagrid and Tom probably knew each other the way other Slytherins and Gryffindors know each other: through classes they have together, i.e. Potions and CoMC. The dungeon thing is interesting, but maybe Hagrid just needed a damp and dark place to keep his spider.

I agree that Hagrid seems to be suspicious in CoS. I doubt if he's secretly on the dark side or anything, but I have a feeling that he was somehow involved with Tom Riddle, in a way that's going to come back and haunt him.

Well, In book two, Harry Finds an Alley he never knew of before. What if Harry runs into another Alley, one he doesn't know of?

What clues does book give us?
Here are a few which I thought of:

In the Forbiden Forest (can remember who said it but it was about the daed unicorn) 'It is alway the innocent that die.' Could it be that wizards with unicorn hair in their wand die? (Cedric did)

*The Chamber could hold more secrets
*The girls barthroom could play a role.
*Ginny being controled by Tom Riddle (Voldermort)
*Harry pulling out the sword.
*Tom saying that he and Harry were much alike. Could that play a role in later books? Harry could be faced with a situation where he has to chose. That choice could make a big change in his life.

That's all I can think of at the moment.

Originally posted by Hettie Hoffleboffer (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=63350#post63350))
I think that this is highly overlooked. I do remember reading something about JK mentioning that Ginny will play a bigger part in the books. I feel that Ginny being tapped by Voldemort will have great significance later on in the series.


I totally agree with this point. I think this may portend a division within the Weasleys (although I lean more toward Percy than Ginny);)

Originally posted by dracofan (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264443#post264443))
I think Hagrid being in Knockturn Alley is of great significance. I don't think he was really getting something to kill what's killing the cabbages.

Also, Harry went into that store for a reason in Knockturn Alley. And I think that Hand of Glory will play in a big way in future books.

Do you think that Harry will go in to Knockturn alley on his own to purchase things to fight Voldie.


I also think the relationship between Draco and his father is important. It's as if he fears his father and wants to please him so much.


I was thinking about that earlier today too, and I totally agree, I think that Nocturne alley and the presence of it in book to is extremely significant, and that it will play a large role in book 5 (not large, but maybe a step down from diagon alley) I just never connected it with this thread.

And I was also wondering the same thing helhorns. Why did they not go further into getting malfoy in trouble for the things he possed which he should not?

I do, however; believe that Hagrid's reason for being in Nocturn alley that specific time was not a lie.

And I definatly believe that Ginny will become a significant character in the future books, maybe one of the threesome (then a foursome)...kind of like the four friends back in the day....

Originally posted by dantares (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=63858#post63858))
I think it's Ginny since she is going to play a big part in the next book. Maybe she's a real parseltongue?


I agree with this because she would have to be to open the COS- maybe Ginny doesn't just have a cruch on Harry- maybe their connection goes deeper.

I just re-read CoS and the two thing which stayed in my mind were. That Harry pulled out the sword. And what Dobby said in the end about Voldermort before he became Voldermort was Tom Riddle. I think there two thing will play an important role in future books.

Dumbledore said that not many people knew that Tom Riddle had become Voldermort. It think that this will play a role in Voldermort's defeat. This is because people might not fear him as much if they knew who he really is.