Book Two "Key" to Series? [Archive] - Page 6

FlyingPhoenix

January 1st, 2004, 11:28 pm

There one or two things in that book what is confusing me slightly. See I have no problems with book1, 3 till 5. But COS there are some things which are strange. Its at first conected to Hermione . As Hermione had been petriefid. We don't know how she got petriefid. Thats my problem by every other victim it was luck that there was anything to reflect. Like that water, camera, Ghost but Hermione did use a mirror to look around the corners. This say she had to hear the Basilisk or at least Ginny. But why then ripp out a page, why find Penelope. Let look at it. Hermione must have go to the Library as she saw Ginny or heard her this include Hermione might have some suspicious thoughts because of her. Then she did run into the Library and found Penelope this girl had a mirror. Did I say its quiet a large mirror which you normaly don't wear around? Well, Hermione did rip that page and (Imagine in front of a prefect) then looked with that mirror around the corners.
So my problem is that part with Ginny. We all know not a single one saw her as she was possessed and did those things. Thats already strange enough, whats with Filch? We do know he run around in that castle, Professors do this, too. Someone else had to know about Ginnys strange doing but nobody does thats strange. By Mad Eye in GoF I do buy it that nobody get it but by Ginny? I mean someone, anyone had to know it was her. I do not believe nobody did know what was going on. How is it possible that nobody knew? Then its interesting Hermione was the only one who wasn't petriefid by luck rather by knowledge. Riddle/Ginny wanted to kill her. I have there really a problem.

Then the next bit again Hermione, as she was halftransformed into a cat. I wonder why? See I do not understand why. For which plot-reason JKR let Hermione out and overall why like that? I don't understand it

thinkpink38

January 2nd, 2004, 2:15 am

snogoddess

January 2nd, 2004, 4:56 pm

snogoddess

January 2nd, 2004, 4:59 pm

literally small, did JKR mean?

how about the Hand of Glory Draco wanted his father to buy for him?

well, the Polyjuice Potion was introduced here as well (has this been mentioned already? eep. :p )

greeneyes27

January 3rd, 2004, 7:02 pm

[FONT=Garamond][B]
I don't think Lily turning teacups into mice (or whatever the magic was) is a big deal ... there was defintiely a change in the law. I don't have the books n front of me, but im pretty sure i nthe 5th book McGonnagal or someone says something to the effect of "That's exactly what Dumbledore was afraid of," with the context that Dumbledore didn't like the restriction on underage magic because then students couldn't protect themselves (as Harry did against the Dementors) ... so that shows that there was a change made at some point that Dumbledore was against. So Maybe the restriction wasn't in effect when Lily went to school. Or, maybe she did it in her later years of school ... Fred and George seem to be able to do magic without any problems - making the jokes, Apparating, moving their trunks with magic - esp. in the 5th book when they are in their 7th year ...

I really like the idea of Ginny's involvement with the Chamber of Secrets being expanded upon in later books. I'm re-reading them right now to get ready for when I go to see the movie, and I was just thinking of how JK Rowling sort of glosses over the effect that finding this diary and having an evil wizard act through her body has on Ginny. I think it'd be really interesting to see this played up a bit more in future novels.

As for how Lily was able to do magic on holidays... I think it's from the first book, but maybe there's been some change of rules since she was at Hogwarts, possibly having something to do with Voldemort's reign of terror?

Essbee

January 3rd, 2004, 9:32 pm

Firstly, there is a whole discussion on the Hand of Glory (and other hands mentioned in book two) within this thread. If you're interested then delve in and read it. I realy don't want to repeat myself again on that point.

Secondly, house elf magic is different to wizard magic. They don't 'apparate' as such, they have their own method of moving from place to place. I reckon Hogwarts only defends against wizard-magic. After all, Dumbledore needs the elves to be able to get around quickly inside the castle to do their job effectively, and to pop in and out quickly if they need to get stuff from outside Hogwarts.

Having said that, I can see it being used to someone's advantage in the future, when they 'tag along' with a house elf to get into/out of Hogwarts in a rush without being seen. Whether it's Harry and Dobby or a Death Eater and his house elf I don't know, but I reckon that it will happen.

roseweary

January 27th, 2004, 5:16 pm

I think this is an interesting point, okay, In an interview concerning book two, Rowing said that something very small in book two would become very big in book six, right. Ever since Rowling introduced Apparation in book three, it has been made clear that no one can apparate into, or out of Hogwarts. How then did Dobby apparate out of Hogwarts while Harry was regrowing his arm bones? I believe that Voldemort and his Death Eaters have found some way to invade Hogwarts, and will do so in book six.

That house elves use a different sort of magic (teleportation that does not qualify as "apparation") has already been discussed.

But, if the big hint from COS involves a means of penetrating Hogworts - then consider how Fawkes entered and escaped from the Chamber of Secrets.

In the movie he flies into the COS after the snake-locked door clearly closes. Then he flies Harry, Ron and Lockhart out through a cave which seems to be some distance from the school.

To invade the school the DE need only enter the cave to get into the pipes of the school. From there they can get around the school as easily as the Basalisk seemed to do.

The Hogworts plumbing will consitute an important setting later in the series.

But, as for access I don't think the DE need even this elaborate a scheme.

Harry and Ron flew a car to Hogworts without a problem. The DE can surely fly their brooms.

Crouch walked to Hogworts. The DE could similarly walk there.

It doesn't seem like getting to the school would be that much of a problem for the DE. Upon arrival they could just walk in as Ron and Harry did in COS. Nevertheless, if they need to get in and move about secretly, the plumbing will be ideal for them.

Pucko

January 27th, 2004, 5:45 pm

It doesn't seem like there is only one thing in bk two that is the key to the series. It's the whole book. The first book introduces characters and begins explanations. But it's in bk two that we begin to see social problems like racism and slavery, we learn about the ancient falling out among the founders of the four houses. Stuff like that.

i'm totally with you on this one....i think the falling out among the houses is really important, cuz ya know the hat sang about it in OotP and DD said be strong from within, and it all ties back to slytherin leavin and them all splittin up and schizz

TheGift

January 27th, 2004, 8:21 pm

This theory has probably been thought of allready but here goes anyway:-

Having just read Book two again a couple of weeks ago i found a paragraph at the top of p140 in which it reads; "Harry smiled feebly. Deliberately causing mayhem in Snape's Potions class was about as safe as poking a sleeping dragon in the eye".

Now the school moto is, "Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus". (Never tickle a sleeping dragon) Is this another one of JK's key cryptic clues to the mystery that surrounds Snape?

GryffindorGr

January 28th, 2004, 12:45 am

That house elves use a different sort of magic (teleportation that does not qualify as "apparation") has already been discussed.

Still, it doesn't make sense. Just because house elves have teleportation, would they be able to teleport in and out of hogwarts? I mean, we're talking about Hogwarts here with it's fortress against magic. Isn't that the same thing as apparating in a way because that would mean house elves could bring in something not so nice inside of hogwarts? I guess i'm not sure how i can word it but there is a reason for the rules of not being able to do those things in hogwarts. Its a protection or a shield from outside forces.
It's like giving "free reign" to house elves and having them be out of the Rules and regulations of Hogwarts. sounds really iffy and doesn't make sense.

Adalbert Waffling

January 28th, 2004, 2:02 am

Maybe it has something to do with Lockhart. Can't see what though...Maybe not. Probably not. Very slim chance.
Also, perhaps House Elves "apparition" of sorts is a magic exclusive to themselves alone. That would be bad if Voldemort (my idol) got his death eaters house elves to invade the ministry or Hogwarts. Obviously, house elves have a very powerful form of magic. I mean, Dobby stopped Lucious Malfoy from killing Harry. He threatened Mr. Malfoy, and Malfoy seemed pretty nervous.

iamshahin

January 31st, 2004, 4:14 am

That house elves use a different sort of magic (teleportation that does not qualify as "apparation") has already been discussed.

But, if the big hint from COS involves a means of penetrating Hogworts - then consider how Fawkes entered and escaped from the Chamber of Secrets.

In the movie he flies into the COS after the snake-locked door clearly closes. Then he flies Harry, Ron and Lockhart out through a cave which seems to be some distance from the school.

To invade the school the DE need only enter the cave to get into the pipes of the school. From there they can get around the school as easily as the Basalisk seemed to do.

The Hogworts plumbing will consitute an important setting later in the series.

But, as for access I don't think the DE need even this elaborate a scheme.

Harry and Ron flew a car to Hogworts without a problem. The DE can surely fly their brooms.

Crouch walked to Hogworts. The DE could similarly walk there.

It doesn't seem like getting to the school would be that much of a problem for the DE. Upon arrival they could just walk in as Ron and Harry did in COS. Nevertheless, if they need to get in and move about secretly, the plumbing will be ideal for them.
Thats seems about right! Its a little too easy but hey if harry and his friends can get into the ministry then the DE's can surely get into hogwarts with all the dark magic they have. If any one reads north tower , the editorials from maline on mugglenet, she suggests that a war at hogwarts is in the future of books 6 or 7 (maybe) :agree:.

purplehawk

January 31st, 2004, 4:25 am

Thats seems about right! Its a little too easy but hey if harry and his friends can get into the ministry then the DE's can surely get into hogwarts with all the dark magic they have. If any one reads north tower , the editorials from maline on mugglenet, she suggests that a war at hogwarts is in the future of books 6 or 7 (maybe) :agree:.

I can't get too excited about anything in her article, most of which seems to have been lifted from the pages of the three Prophecy threads here. :td:

shanobyl

February 8th, 2004, 4:12 pm

um im just wondering if ron's fear of spiders will lead to something big. his fear was introduced to us in CoS and was shown in greater detail in GoF during Mad Eye Moody's lesson on the Unforgivable curses. i am reading GoF for the second time so his immense fear of spiders caught my eye.

whizbang121

February 11th, 2004, 7:43 pm

I found this info about the Hand of Glory. Notice the references to Mandrake in the last two paragraphs.
The Hand of Glory (http://www.themystica.com/mystica/articles/h/hand_of_glory.html)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This was a right hand of a murderer that was severed while the corpse was still hanging from the gallows. It was then used as a charm or in black magic practices after being magically perserved. It is also believed robbers often used the hand when breaking into buildings and homes.

Preferably the hand was cut off during the eclipse of the moon. Afterwards it was wrapped in a shroud, squeezed of blood and pickled for two weeks in an earthenware jar with salt, long peppers and saltpeter. Then it was either dried in an oven with vervain, an herb believed to be able to ward off demands, or laid out to dry in the sun, desirably in the hot dog days of August.

When the hand was ready, candles were fitted on it between the fingers. These were called the "dead man's candles" were made from another murderer's fat, with the wick being made from his hair.

Another method of curing the severed and dried hand was dip it in wax. After this process the fingers themselves could be lit.

The hand with burning candles or fingers was shocking when coming at people. It froze them in their tracks and rendered them speechless. Burglars lit the hand before entering homes. A warning sign was that if the thumb would not light it meant there was someone in the house who could not be charmed or made afraid. It was believed once the hand was lit nothing but milk could extinguish it.

Homeowners attempted to fight back. To combat the hand of glory all sorts of ointments were smeared on the thresholds. The compositions of these various ointments consisted of everything from the blood of screech owls, the fat of white hens, or the bowl of black cats. Perhaps these concoctions worked if they were slimy enough to trip up the burglars.

The hand of glory was linked to witches during the witch-hunt period. There are two noted incidences. One, in 1588, of two German women, Nichel and Bessers, that were accused of witchcraft and exhuming corpses. They admitted poisoning helpless people after lighting the hands of glory to immobilize them. John Fian, after being severely tortured during his witch trial in Scotland in 1590, confessed to using a hand of glory to break into a church where he performed a ceremony to the devil.

The term the "hand of glory" is believed to be derived from the French "main de glorie" or "mandrogore" and be related to the legends of the mandrake. The mandrake plant was believed to grow under the gallows of the hanged man.

Belief in the efficacy of the Hand of Glory persisted as late as 1831 in Ireland. It is described or mentioned in the chapter of "The Folk-lore of the Hand" in "The Hand of Destiny" by C. J. S. Thompson, London, 1932. The belief in the Hand of Glory was the subject of "The Nurses’ Story" one of the "Ingoldsby Legends" of Thomas Ingoldsby (Rev. Richard Braham, 1837).
A.G.H.

GryffindorGr

February 11th, 2004, 9:31 pm

I believe one of the keys in CoS were related to the “possession” of Ginny Weasley. This also goes to the relationship of why DE’s are chosen by Voldemort. Ginny was chosen, imo, because she has an affinity to Harry Potter. Her possession of her “heart” and so therefore, it was easier to bewitch her.
In PS/SS: Ron says to Harry p.82,PS, British Edition,
They were some of the first to come back to our side after you-know-who disappeared. Said they’d been bewitched. My dad doesn’t believe it. He says Malfoy’s father didn’t need an excuse to go over to the Dark side.”

And we all know this:
Viridian, Vindictus - author of Curses and Countercurses (Bewitch your Friends and Befuddle Your Enemies with the Latest Revenges: Hair Loss, Jelly-Legs, Tongue-Tying and Much, Much More)
Now what I’m trying to connect is why DE’s go over to Voldemort. If Voldemort was able to get Ginny to do his bidding and the reasons why is Ginny’s heart was vulnerable to Harry. So why Quirrell? Why Lucius Malfoy? Lucius’s involvement…now is it truly because he was just wanting power or that he doesn’t really want like all purebloods in Slytherin to want the muggles going into the WW? Is that all? Or is it family pride? Protection? Bellatrix? What’s her agenda? Crouch jr? How much bewitchment or befuddling does Voldemort use?
Now this is another one of my strange crazy theories that also connect to my belief of the mirror theory. Voldemort is trying to kill off his father’s side and I wonder through out the series why Harry’s father side has never been mentioned.
Actually this is really layers deep and quite complicated because it goes back to Voldemorts primary hate: His muggle born father. I always wondered why he told Harry that Lily needn’t have to die. And was it in the movie or in the books that Lily begged that she’d do anything? What if she had made a deal? Would that be too far off? Possible? Also, if we look at the mirror theory, who are the opposites? A pureblood father and a muggle born witch right?
Is there something here that Voldemort is trying to prevent which would therefore tie up to the prophecy as well? To prevent something from happening again? To find out who they are? Remember that Voldemort didn’t know who was the chosen one: Neville or Harry. So would he not know the future of the next muggle born and pureblood couple? To destroy himself and Harry? To make my theory understandable and why CoS is such a big basket of clues and importance, it has to be written out why the phoenix, the opposites, the war, etc are going on. This is all about the reason behind Voldemorts hate. He revealed so much in CoS that I’m prone to believe not everything is black and white. I don’t know how accurate Voldemorts history is in this site but it gives us a bit of insight: http://www.harrypotterintl.com/voldemortbio.shtml

The term the "hand of glory" is believed to be derived from the French "main de glorie" or "mandrogore" and be related to the legends of the mandrake. The mandrake plant was believed to grow under the gallows of the hanged man.

Whizbang121, that was very interesting.
Mandrakes growing underneath the hanged man. Upside down.
Symbolic? It sounds like it.

GryffindorGr

February 17th, 2004, 1:53 pm

Sorry to DP but I have another "key" point to book 2.

Why would Dobby come to warn Harry Potter?
CoS, British Edition:
In the beginning of the chapter 2 we are introduced to Dobby:
The little creature on the bed had large, bat-like ears and bulging green eyes the size of tennis balls.
So far in canon, we’ve seen only a few house elves, which are tied to pureblood families. Black: Kreacher, the Malfoys: Dobby, now supposedly free (there have been speculation as to why he takes orders from Harry)
Also Winky, who in canon shows us truly the fierce loyalty of a house elf. So why does Dobby go out of his way to warn Harry Potter? This makes us think that Dobby is rebellious but it goes against the rules of a house elf. Now there have been speculations that it was either Draco or Narcissa that sent Dobby to Harry. Although in canon, Dobby tells Harry that he went on his own:
Dobby will have to punish himself most grievously for coming to see you, sir. Dobby will have to shut his ears in the oven door for his. If they ever knew, sir—..” p.16, CoS.
Yet here is a good little briefing on house elf on Dobby:
http://www.hp-lexicon.org/house_elves.html
Now Dobby uses magic to enchant a bludger, again going against his family. Really? I find it highly coincidental that Dobby would do this and yet we have hidden “holes” to Dobby’s disappearing act within Hogwarts during his visit to Harry in the hospital room while Ms. Granger tells us again and again that you cannot apparate within Hogwarts grounds. There are discussions that say perhaps House elves have powerful magic that defies this rule. But that is only speculation and no canon proof that house elves can over ride apparition, which is a basic regulation in History of Hogwarts. If so, then why not the DE’s house elves go in and do some spying for them, eh? It doesn’t make particular sense.

In CoS, JKR stated that this book was the key book to the series as well as GoF. Why? What makes this book so special? Because of the diary? The introduction of Dobby and house elves and why Hermione knits hats?
Is it because of the basilisk?
Now through the Hplexicon, we know that the basilisk can only be born from a chickens egg, laid by a rooster yet killed by a roosters calling. The red markings atop the basilisks head are the same as seen in a rooster. Ginny Weasley has been killing the roosters so that the basilisk would continue to go through the pipes and kill “mudbloods”, yet Tom Riddle states its not mudbloods he’s after, he’s after Harry Potter. Taking no interest in muggle borns.
Haven’t I already told you,” said Riddle quietly, “that killing mudbloods doesn’t matter to me any more? For many months now, my new target has been—you.” p.230.
Imagine my surprise that it fits directly to my mirror theory that Riddle and Harry is one. Because why would Dobby warn Harry in the first place not to come to Hogwarts? Because if he came, for instance, he’d open up the chamber of secrets. It is through Harry Potter’s presence and his “eyes”, his parsel tongue, everything---that makes some sense in why he was warned away. If Harry were not to have come to Hogwarts would the chamber of secrets be opened?
Again to this theory and I’ll jump ahead here—going to OotP, where Harry sees through his “eyes” that he is a snake and had bitten Arthur Weasley. He had seen and felt that it was him. And again, there have been speculation as to why and how did the presence of Sirius Black been found out? Was it not Harry who went to Grimmauld place12 and seen with his own “eyes” that Sirius was there? Is there a reason why Dumbledore had made Harry stay away?
Going back to the theme of the story: The muggle born father of Voldemort and his witch mother, very similar to Harry Potter’s own family, yet opposite of the mirror, is his muggle born mother and his wizard father. Harry having green eyes and the only one in canon who speaks parsel tongue. These are huge key points in CoS and so far with 5 books no one else has been shown to have the same qualities with Harry that direct him to Tom Riddle.
The other theme of the story in CoS is the bewitchment of your friends and the befuddled of your enemies. Now again as I’ve left some clues to what I’ve found around some threads, because I’ve been highly curious as to why DE’s would want to side with Voldemort, I find more than just pure blood values of eliminating muggleborns from witchcraft/wizarding world. There’s got to be a deeper psychological effect that would bound them to the cause of Riddle’s plan. Again, I stress the bewitchment of Lucius….why? Because in canon we’ve seen how he is very family oriented (this can be your greatest weakness) although as an outsiders view we see him as the terrible wizard whose lofty air comes off as a mean spirited man, yet here we have Draco who defends his father despite what we think of his father’s background and stance. We have the parallels in the book of Percy treating his family terribly because of his "ambition" and yet we have speculations as to perhaps he has been polyjuiced, or he has been acting as "spy", personally I'd like to believe that he in a dangerous position and therefore acting as a spy, who knows.
Then what struck me later on is the hole in my theory with the “name” of Harry Potter, if he is revived again and again as a living construent in this life time to save “himself”, his continual saving people must be a connection to him saving himself and his family lineage because if he were to have “killed” off his family, then there would be no more Harry Potter.
p. 231
“You see?” he whispered. “It was a name I was already using at Hogwarts, to my most intimate friends only, of course. You think I was going to use my filthy Muggle father’s name forever? I, in whose veins runs the blood of Salazar Slytherin himself, through my mother’s side?

Interesting. Yet complicated. Do you see the words I underlined and bolded?
Through his mother’s side. For those who understand what I’m getting at, kudos!
If not, well, its only a theory that connects to all my theories.
Nothing is set in stone of course, but it's fun to speculate :)

Vigilance

February 17th, 2004, 5:20 pm

Imagine Tom had managed to completely come out of the diary. Do you think that Tom would have been able to use Harry's wand against him in the CoS since Fawkes was on Harry's shoulder? I wonder if Fawkes pearched so protectively on Harry's shoulder because Fawkes recognized Harry's wand in Riddle's hands and was prepared to prevent wand magic from Riddle harming Harry. DD knew that Harry's wand contained Fawkes's feather, after all. Perhaps he wanted to prepare for more than one (Harry needing to be healed) eventuality?

purplehawk

February 17th, 2004, 6:02 pm

He did come out of the diary at the end of the book, didn't he? Or are you saying it wasn't a complete escape from the pages of the diary? I think Fawkes was there for the sole purpose of neutralizing some of the fire-power of the basilisk. Harry had to be able to see and as long as the basilisk's eyes were still able to be used as a weapon, Harry couldn't open his own eyes, could he? Your question is intriguing to me! I wonder... would Fawkes have taken a blast from that wand as he did for Dumbledore in OotP?

Vigilance

February 17th, 2004, 6:14 pm

That's exactly what got me thinking about this. I was listening to the audio books of CoS and rereading OotP (don't ask why I over-do this sort of thing :elaugh: because I've no idea!), conjecturing about Fawkes's hit, which I imagine wasn't quite as horrible because the magic from VD's wand is directed through one of his tail feathers. Then, I wondered, what if Tom had been fully liberated (meaning Ginny was dead), and thus able to really use magic?--I assume that he didn't use magic against Harry because he wasn't able to do so. I relistened to the way Fawkes comes in to the chamber and then perches on Harry's shoulder. Tom already has Harry's wand. I thought Fawkes might have been preparing himself for an attempt by Riddle, should Harry talk too long and allow Tom to completely emerge.

phoenixsong

February 17th, 2004, 6:23 pm

I do think that Fawkes was prepared to help Harry in whatever way necessary, including intercepting a curse, should one have been directed at Harry. But more to the point, Fawkes does seem to be ready-made for whatever would have been directed at Harry: the perfect opponent for the basilisk's stare, the perfect antidote for the basilisk's poison, and the perfect shield against Riddle's curses. Fawkes, and Harry (or perhaps, Fawkes, as an extension of Harry), are the anti-Voldemort.

bubblesarah

February 17th, 2004, 6:25 pm

The muggle born father of Voldemort and his witch mother, very similar to Harry Potter’s own family, yet opposite of the mirror, is his muggle born mother and his wizard father

BUT what your forgetting is tho lily is mugglke born she was a witch riddles father wasn't!

yes they r connected we know th@ but the same spirit i dunno, yeah they have similarities but they r complete opposits. harrys can speak parseltounge but only because voldemort transferred some powers 2 him he put a bit of himself in harry the night lily and james were killed remember the prediction of harry's birth applied to two boys born so he could have chosen nevile u never know do u? they are merged because of harrys scar not in spirit, it was the curse that binds them togather fqate and destiny all yhave a part to play the final war of god and evil is going to be fought in the next book and wil be finished in the 7th.

and as for fawkes getting into the chamber think ahout how he travels in OOTP thats how he got into the chamber the same way h4e left dumbledores office, he can transport himself around like the houseleves can HAS NO1 CONSIDERED THIS? honestly

(sorry 4 lack of puncuation but hell i was typing fast

look @ this thread it might explain something http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=15888

phoenixsong

February 17th, 2004, 6:40 pm

and as for fawkes getting into the chamber think ahout how he travels in OOTP thats how he got into the chamber the same way h4e left dumbledores office, he can transport himself around like the houseleves can HAS NO1 CONSIDERED THIS? honestly
Actually, they have. On this thread Apparating at Hogwarts (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=6338)

(sorry 4 lack of puncuation but hell i was typing fastWell, thank you for the apology, but please try to use correct english spelling and punctuation, not only for the forum members for whom English is not a first language, but also for the rest of us, who find it difficult to read that sort of IM "English".

Vigilance

February 17th, 2004, 7:11 pm

:agree:

It took me ten minutes to figure out bubblesarah's post. Fast for you is slow going or practically illegible for the rest of us.

bubblesarah

February 17th, 2004, 7:25 pm

i'm still looking 4 the clues

phoenixsong

February 17th, 2004, 7:33 pm

bubblesarah: I suspect that I am not alone in not knowing what you are talking about. Which clues? On what subject are you posting? I'm not trying to "bash" you here, but between the IM-speak, and not indicating the subject of your post, it is very difficult to respond to you and to keep the conversation moving.

whizbang121

February 17th, 2004, 7:35 pm

Now this is another one of my strange crazy theories that also connect to my belief of the mirror theory. Voldemort is trying to kill off his father’s side and I wonder through out the series why Harry’s father side has never been mentioned.
Actually this is really layers deep and quite complicated because it goes back to Voldemorts primary hate: His muggle born father. I always wondered why he told Harry that Lily needn’t have to die. And was it in the movie or in the books that Lily begged that she’d do anything? What if she had made a deal? Would that be too far off? Possible? Also, if we look at the mirror theory, who are the opposites? A pureblood father and a muggle born witch right?
Is there something here that Voldemort is trying to prevent which would therefore tie up to the prophecy as well? To prevent something from happening again? To find out who they are? Remember that Voldemort didn’t know who was the chosen one: Neville or Harry. So would he not know the future of the next muggle born and pureblood couple? To destroy himself and Harry? For that to be accurate, Tom Riddle Sr would have to have been a muggleborn wizard. Voldemort has one magical parent and one muggle. Harry, like Tonks, has two magical parents, one of whom we are told, is muggleborn. I know I'm beating a dead horse, and Dumbledore said otherwise, but to me Harry is a first generation pureblood. But whatever, Harry is, he's not a half blood "like Voldemort." His parents were both magical.

Now, if Lily and James were both half blood .............. :huh:

phoenixsong

February 17th, 2004, 7:40 pm

You're not beating a dead horse, whizbang. It is important to point out that Riddle and Harry do not exactly mirror one another, there is a difference between having one magical (I hesistate to say "pureblood" because I'm not entirely sure that Riddle's mom was pureblood - we only know that she was a witch and that she was the descendent (or should I say ancestor!?!?) of Salazar Slytherin) parent and one non-magical parent, and having two fully-qualified magical parents. Of course, pure-blood ideologues wouldn't agree. For them, a muggle-born witch is the equivalent of a muggle, with respect to the purity of bloodlines.

bubblesarah

February 17th, 2004, 7:42 pm

ok which clues are we looking for?
at the end of the day we can only speculate how is book two a key book?
we didn't know it was till JKR mentioned it was!
now all we are doing is throwing up random theories.
how do we know if we're right she hasn't told us all we have is red herrings and real clues how do we tell the difference?
my question is Whatt are wq.e looking for?

whizbang121

February 17th, 2004, 7:45 pm

Apparently, we have been so lucky as to have someone come and litter our threads with "clues." Hmmmmmm ................

Litter or raid? Such generosity. I'm going to the arcade. I dislike feeling used.

GryffindorGr

February 17th, 2004, 7:49 pm

For that to be accurate, Tom Riddle Sr would have to have been a muggleborn wizard. Voldemort has one magical parent and one muggle. Harry, like Tonks, has two magical parents, one of whom we are told, is muggleborn. I know I'm beating a dead horse, and Dumbledore said otherwise, but to me Harry is a first generation pureblood. But whatever, Harry is, he's not a half blood "like Voldemort." His parents were both magical.

Now, if Lily and James were both half blood .............. :huh:

Do we really know Tom Riddle sr. background? Even as much as James potter being assumably a "pureblood" by HP standards? or by what it says about Harry's lineage so far?
Harry says in Cos,
My common Muggle-born mother, p. 232.
then why would RIddle state in CoS,
Both half-bloods, orphans, raised by Muggles.
And yeah, DD said otherwise, yet we question this. It's like Hermione saying to Ron in OotP when Ron suspciously accuses Snape to "opening"up Harry's mind to Voldemort. And Hermione saying if we can't trust DD than who can we trust?

by bubblesarah
ok which clues are we looking for?
at the end of the day we can only speculate how is book two a key book?
we didn't know it was till JKR mentioned it was!
now all we are doing is throwing up random theories.
how do we know if we're right she hasn't told us all we have is red herrings and real clues how do we tell the difference?
my question is Whatt are wq.e looking for?

this is a thread for those who find "clues" and connect them, for JKR did say CoS was a key book.

Random theories? Nothing is set in stone until JKR says so but she did say that if we are clever we can find them. However, that doesnt stop the rest of us for trying to connect them, however strange they may sound.

purplehawk

February 17th, 2004, 10:45 pm

zoeydsngwrtr

February 17th, 2004, 11:09 pm

Sorry, I have not read everything...but on the subject of the crucio curse, I believe that this will turn out to show great importance, it's in book two, which does seem to be very important, it's what happened to Neville's grandparents, and then its importance in book five. Isn't that the curse that Harry used? What is going to be the consequence for that?

Starrlight

February 19th, 2004, 4:11 am

jasper

February 19th, 2004, 11:35 am

Why does Snape have Draco conjure a snake in the duelling club? Why does he look at Harry in a shrewd and calculating way after Harry reveals that he can talk to snakes? Did Snape suspect--what's Snape up to here? Could this be a key to understanding Snape and his motives?

Oh. Does he tell Malfoy to conjure a snake? Or does he just tell him to go with his spell early instead of waiting for the count? He could have just said, "Cast your spell before Potter is ready," without telling Malfoy what to cast.

GryffindorGr

February 19th, 2004, 11:52 am

Oh. Does he tell Malfoy to conjure a snake? Or does he just tell him to go with his spell early instead of waiting for the count? He could have just said, "Cast your spell before Potter is ready," without telling Malfoy what to cast.

I think it's the suggestion that Snape and Draco in CoS, p.145 secretly know, Snape moved closer to Malfoy, bent down and whispered something in his ear.

Then Draco raises his hand, saying Serpensortia and the long black snake shot out.
Then funnily, Snape says, Dont move, Potter, said Snape lazily, clearly enjoying the sightof Harry standing motionless

now it looks to us that Snape told Draco to conjure up that snake, secretly knowing what possibilities Harry could do. There is something Snape knows more about Harry than possibly Harry himself does.

purplehawk

February 19th, 2004, 11:55 am

We can't know for sure as Snape's instructions were whispered to Malfoy. I believe the "serpensortia" spell was his suggestion, however. Dumbledore knew what was required to open the Chamber of Secrets - he said as much when they brought Colin Creevey into the hospital wing. "The question is not who. The question is how... " He suspected Voldemort had transferred some of his powers to Harry all along, as he later explained at the end of the book, and perhaps he had shared this hunch with Snape. That would explain the calculating look he gave Harry.

cruplover

February 19th, 2004, 8:11 pm

GryffindorGr

February 19th, 2004, 8:21 pm

<<We can't know for sure as Snape's instructions were whispered to Malfoy.>>

Purplehawk, that's all very true, but I still suspect that Snape did indeed suspect Harry might able to talk to the snake. It sheds a whole, new light on things when we wonder if Snape knows more about Harry than Harry knows about himself. In some respects, that's a given, because Snape knew Harry's parents, which is more than Harry can say. That's unsettling. I've been trying to figure out how many clues I've missed along the way, and now all of a sudden, I'm wondering (for the zillionth time) who Snape is, and where his loyalties truly rest!

Not to mention all the times Harry has attempted to do things and Snape was right there knowing something has happened or about to happen. Odd.

There's plenty of Snape theories:
http://www.geocities.com/severusnapefc/severus_snape_theories.htm

including the one of him being a vampire.
Snape was not in Slytherin, etc...
Even as far as him being the one kissing Florence when Bertha was hexed.
(of course some of them are ridiculous but hey, even the ridiculous may come true!)

It's true. There's a thousand little clues but it's not obvious, which JKR did say, that they are so subtle you wont notice them.

purplehawk

February 19th, 2004, 8:56 pm

<<We can't know for sure as Snape's instructions were whispered to Malfoy.>>

Purplehawk, that's all very true, but I still suspect that Snape did indeed suspect Harry might able to talk to the snake. It sheds a whole, new light on things when we wonder if Snape knows more about Harry than Harry knows about himself. In some respects, that's a given, because Snape knew Harry's parents, which is more than Harry can say. That's unsettling. I've been trying to figure out how many clues I've missed along the way, and now all of a sudden, I'm wondering (for the zillionth time) who Snape is, and where his loyalties truly rest!

Hi cruplover! I too agree Snape knew what he was doing when he suggested that spell to Draco. The spiel about Dumbledore was more to draw the conclusion Snape probably learned that information from Dumbledore around the time of the Colin Creevey incident. Dumbledore may even have asked him to keep an eye out. Remember, Justin was petrified shortly afterward and Dumbledore asked Harry if there was anything he wanted to tell him? I assume, by that point, Dumbledore had heard about the snake incident at the dueling club. I'm surprised at the reaction to this! It's not the first time I've put forth the idea on these forums.

phoenixsong

February 19th, 2004, 9:37 pm

I believe the "serpensortia" spell was his suggestion, however. Dumbledore knew what was required to open the Chamber of Secrets - he said as much when they brought Colin Creevey into the hospital wing. "The question is not who. The question is how... " He suspected Voldemort had transferred some of his powers to Harry all along, as he later explained at the end of the book, and perhaps he had shared this hunch with Snape. That would explain the calculating look he gave Harry.I'm not entirely sure, purplehawk, though it is a distinct possibility. I think that serpensortia was entirely Snape's idea, a "sorting" of Harry using a serpent (to take the name of the spell at its most literal). This was the first indication that some of Voldemort's powers may have been transferred to Harry that night in Godric's Hollow. And it may be that the information came from Snape to Dumbledore, rather than vice versa. In fact, Snape may have been involved in the very set-up that caused the backfiring of the curse, way back when. (I know, I know! If the curse indeed backfired!) But Snape may have been in a position to suspect the transfer of powers even earlier than Dumbledore, or perhaps Snape and Dumbledore have an open relationship in which they discuss these possibilities.

whizbang121

February 19th, 2004, 9:58 pm

<<We can't know for sure as Snape's instructions were whispered to Malfoy.>>

Purplehawk, that's all very true, but I still suspect that Snape did indeed suspect Harry might able to talk to the snake. It sheds a whole, new light on things when we wonder if Snape knows more about Harry than Harry knows about himself. In some respects, that's a given, because Snape knew Harry's parents, which is more than Harry can say. That's unsettling. I've been trying to figure out how many clues I've missed along the way, and now all of a sudden, I'm wondering (for the zillionth time) who Snape is, and where his loyalties truly rest!That's an old idea. I think it evolved from the magic dishwasher at hp4gu. Basically, the dueling club was a setup by Dumbledore to find out if Harry could speak parseltongue, or to alert Snape as well as Harry and his friends to the fact. The magic dishwasher is an interesting theory, as is Redhead Forever.

GryffindorGr

February 19th, 2004, 10:56 pm

I guess this would be clue in book 2?
Since Malfoy sr. and Weasley have this "féud" going on in CoS.

My friend Terri found this direct link to Draco's name:
http://www.bartleby.com/61/44/D0374400.html
(exceedingly harsh, severe)

now to go further, there was an Athenian politician (as said in the link) who codified the laws of Athens...then linking to Vendetta
http://www.bartleby.com/65/ve/vendetta.html

I find this: (excerpts: feud between members of two kinship groups to avenge a wrong done to a relative. Although the term originated in Corsica, the custom has also been practiced in other parts of Italy, in other European countries, and among the Arabs. It generally reflects a society where the family is the only social unit with authority or where there is no centralized government to compel order. After a society attains cohesion and will no longer tolerate private vengeance, composition for offenses may be compelled. In time the state itself punishes antisocial acts, and a system of criminal law takes form....The most striking form of the vendetta is the blood feud, or the taking of a life for a life.

I dont know if this has any significance but it is very interesting.

Vigilance

February 19th, 2004, 11:21 pm

You forgot to say what you think this means in the CoS context (why it's a clue and a clue to what?)

whizbang121

February 20th, 2004, 1:36 am

You know, a clue (http://newclues.mugglenet.com/)

Vigilance

February 20th, 2004, 4:44 am

whizbang121

February 20th, 2004, 5:13 am

purplehawk

February 20th, 2004, 6:53 am

:sad: Same link, Whiz...

GryffindorGr

February 20th, 2004, 9:47 am

I don't get it, Whiz :huh:

A clue serves as either evidence in a mystery or a guide to a conclusion. I wondered if GryffindorGr ws saying that she thinks the Weasleys and Malfoys are closely related, if they have a blood feud, or if Draco will gain power, or what. What is this evidence of or guide to? I wanted to hear her idea...

Oh i thought about that when i posted my links. I realized i left out this one:
http://www.bartleby.com/65/dr/DracoAth.html
Athenian politician and law codifier. Of his codification of Athenian customary law only the section dealing with involuntary homicide is preserved. From this and from later accounts in the writings of Aristotle and Plutarch it appears that in Athens the penalty of death was prescribed for the most trivial offense. The code adopted the principle that murder must be punished by the state and not by vendetta.

well, the Weasleys and Malfoys are related by Narcissa's side, marriage, just like Sirius was related to Molly by marriage through Arthur. So everyones related in the "pureblood" world. lol.
My thoughts are not coherent right now because i hadn't had my coffee. (or orange juice) lol.
I'll come back with this.

More connection to Harry being revived by the phoenix:
p.239, CoS:

Harry reached out and took hold of Fawkes strangely hot tail feathers. An extraordinary lightness seemed to spread through his whole body, and next second, with a whoosh, they were flying upwards through the pipe

Also, p.174 Almost as though Riddle was a friend he'd had when he was very small,
indicative of imaginary friend? probably nothing but since we know hardly anything of his life before PS/SS, I guess just grabbing bits and pieces of his time with the Dursleys are enough.
I'm just curious because of the your mother borrowed 12 years for you deal.

NashiraErato

March 23rd, 2004, 4:48 pm

I don't know if this has been mentioned here before, I did a quick search and didn't find anything...

This is from CoS, pg 117 "The Writing On The Wall".

"That's where Filch has been keeping guard," Ron muttered.
They looked at each other. The corridor was deserted.
"Can't hurt to have a poke around," said Harry, dropping his bag and getting to his hands and knees so that he could crawl along, searching for clues.
"Scorch marks!" he said. "Here - and here -"

What made the scorch marks? I can't figure out anyway that the basilisk could...or Mrs Norris. Maybe I'm missing an obvious explanation or maybe something or someone else was there somehow scorching the floor?

Pegasus

March 23rd, 2004, 5:19 pm

If the basilisk kills at a glance and Colin's film got melted, the basilisk's gaze would have left the scorch marks. his eyes "burn."

MagicianGirl

March 23rd, 2004, 7:32 pm

Perhaps there is more to that diary still it is still intact and where is it now?
If I remember correctly Lucius Malfoy has it. Harry gave it back to him when he freed Dobby.

I might add - but how on earth did you get out of there alive, Potter?'
Is she not happy to see them get out of they’re alive or was she expecting them not to come back by saying that?
I think McGonagall was expecting them not to survive. But the question is do the staff know what's lurking inside the Chamber?

Also the fact that J.K.Rowling uses the word vanished does not mean dead or vanquished but just missing. So where is 16 year old Tom?
Another thing is when Harry stabbed the Diary and Riddle disappeared, Ginny regained her consciousness. The physical attribute of the diary was destroyed but what happened to the essence of the diary, did it went to Ginny since Riddle got her soul to regain his body for a brief moment but Ginny got it back after Harry destroyed the physical part of the diary. Does Ginny carries the essence of that Diary? Does she now have Voldemort's memory when he was 16? So many questions for JKR to answer.

I think that book 2 will indeed be the key to the series. The events of what happened in book 2 was touched in Book 5 and I think that it will be again in the upcoming books.

JKR said in her recent chat that we will learn about Voldemort's childhood so apart from Dumbledore, who may have possibly know something with regards to his childhood. That's right; it's Ginny. Remember when Riddle mention that he pour out some of his secrets in her. The possibilities are endless.

whizbang121

March 23rd, 2004, 8:48 pm

We know Voldemort's weakness. Fear. His fear of death, of Dumbledore, of Harry, of being abandoned by his followers, of being sent back to a muggle orphanage, of being out of control. He needs to control everything, even death. That's what have to work with.

koli

March 23rd, 2004, 9:26 pm

I think that the Gryffindor Sword part could have something to do in further books. What ever happened to Salizar Slytherin, did he and Godric Gryffindor ever fight (where Salizar met his downfall? well of course after he had his family) Harry could have Gryffindor blood in his veins, and Voldemort being Slytherins heir they could just be "history repeating itself"

MagicianGirl

March 23rd, 2004, 9:42 pm

Yes but we do not know how to use it to defeat Voldemort. The information must have gone somewhere. I mean what happened to the memory of 16 year old Tom because it was only vanished from the pages and not destroyed. There must be a reason for it to just vanish and not be obliterated instead.
I think it went to Ginny. Where else could it be? The diary was destroyed and in order for Ginny to live she has to get back her soul from Riddle. On the other hand, in order for Riddle to somehow continue to exist the Diary must remain intact. However, Harry destroyed the physical part of the Diary and imo the essence went to Ginny.

Dumbledore states that there is something far worse than death and Voldemort knows this so you would expect him to fear that more than death itself. Perhaps if Harry could show Voldemort himself as 16-year-old Tom and how different the Dark Lord looks compared to what he is at the moment then the shock might do what Dumbledore stated about what can happen if you see yourself in a different time frame. May be the effect of seeing yourself so different in a different time frame leads to something worse than death?
Which is why I said in my previous post that aside my Dumbledore, Ginny may be the other person who knows Voldemort's first 16 yrs of his life. She may have been the key to the secret of Voldemort's childhood that he despised.

zoeydsngwrtr

March 25th, 2004, 11:28 pm

Wow, those are some very intresting thoughts.
First, the diary was basically killed or the magic soul or however you want to put it...by the venom from the baselisk, that is why Harry stabbed it, it was poisened, and destroyed, at least that is the way I look at it.
As for DD referring to Voldemort as Tom, he does that, not because he thinks of him as two seperate entities, but to show that he knows who Voldemort is...He knows Tom Riddle, and he will even admit that he was a brilliant student. I think it even says that somewhere in OOTP, but then I am not posotive. Remember, these are just my opinions.
As for Mcgonegal being suprised that Harry made it, well I would be too. I just can't see her being bad, but then again, she could be if you really try hard to look for it, maybe the aurors that stunned her knew it.
I would definatly like to see more of the Gryffendor Sword.
Sorry about my spelling, bit tired at the moment.
Finally, yes I believe that it has been mentioned that the Weasley's and Malfoys are related through someway. The idea of there being bad blood between the family's sure makes sense, being that there is, but I wonder where it all started, we know it is because the Weasley's like muggles, and the Malfoys detest "mudbloods". I wonder what happened, I hope we get to find out. As for the fighting between ron and Malfoy in CoS, it never dawned on me. That is an intresting idea, I can definatly see Ron taking on Malfoy, the possiblility of Malfoy becoming a death eater is extremely high, and the possiblity of him fighting Harry and Ron is known, because that is the way he is, but Malfoy was a Prefect, and so was Ron, so...they seem to be on the same level, I can see a major part of the plot having to do with a war between Malfoy and Ron, not just Malfoy and Harry, Harry has bigger problems, and larger enemies...like Voldemort for example.

story

March 26th, 2004, 10:35 pm

I think the thing worst the death the Dumbledore refers to is becoming a ghost - always to half live and never to die. There is so much more to ghosts

shanobyl

April 18th, 2004, 12:50 pm

a couple of things that i have noticed in CoS.

there is a zoo analogy which reads: "he dreamt that he was on show in a zoo, with a card reasing "underaged wizard' attached to his cage". the last time we were taken to a zoo was in book one, with the boa constricter in it. i dont know.. i just feel like there's something about it.. but im not quite sure what.

also, within the same page, i get a feeling of time lapse. this may be supportive of the theory that time is a factor in the series. dobby tells harry that he knows about "the plan" for months. harry just came back from hogwarts not long before dobby made his appearance. and why would malfoy be planning something that could be easily accomplished for months? or did he know when riddle's diary will come to life?

OmarGama

May 9th, 2004, 5:04 pm

Well, I think that all the clues are on the 5th book!

And also I think that the clues are the Chamber of Secrets!

HarryPotter

May 9th, 2004, 5:33 pm

I think that even if it seems a little thing, in the movie, in the Burrow, the fact of having a kitty sitting in one sofa behind Ginny, when she asks for her jumper and her mother replies "Yes, dear, it's on the cat."
Also the fact of Draco Malfoy ripping off a page of a book and keeping it, and also when being at the Slytherin Common Room and grabbing that box and keeping it for himself...
The famous hand at Knockturn Alley...
There are many elements in the movie that seem to point at something...

Godrics_Heiress

May 9th, 2004, 6:39 pm

Although I doubt we can use movies to dig up some evidence, those are pretty interesting theories nonetheless. What I always thought of as the key has to do with the Chambers of Secret. It might be used by Voldemort and his gang as their entryway to Hogwarts. It also might be the place where Harry and Voldemort do their final battle.

Starrlight

May 9th, 2004, 6:45 pm

Perhaps the simplist answer is the best--the key to the series is that it's our choices that determine who we are, not where we come from. For Harry--the most important lesson of all? All of the destiny and prophecy stuff is just a red herring--it's the choices that Harry will make that will be most important.

Luna27

May 9th, 2004, 7:09 pm

I don't know how many people have already seen this, but I found this very interesting interview with JK on IGN Filmforce. The main purpose of the interview is JK's opinion on the second movie, but she also reveals that, "Key things happen in book two. No one knows how important those things are... yet. There's a lot in there. And I know how difficult it was to get it all in there without drawing too much attention to the clues."

Just needed the exact quote as a reference.:) Okay...from what JKR is saying here, she means that there are several things in Book 2 that will be critical in later books. Let's not forget that this question began in 2002...so I'm guessing her interview was in 2002? I think we've already seen a LOT of the clues in book 2 play out, or at least begin to.

-Harry tells Tom that his mother died to protect him and that's why Voldie couldn't kill Harry that night...this led to Voldie using Harry's blood in the potion in GoF
-Dobby is introduced and house elves in general which plays out more with Winky and Kreacher...Dobby also helps Harry to win the second task in GoF (gillyweed). He also tells him about the room of requirement...I think he may also be able to tell some more details regarding the Malfoys at some point.
-Riddle's mother died giving birth to him...he says he was told she lived just long enough to name him Tom Riddle in book 2...I'm sure this will be important later on
-We see Tom who has his father's name...this occurs in book 4 with Barty Crouch Jr.
-We learn about polyjuice potion...crucial in book 4 and perhaps later as well
-The Whomping Willow...important in book 3 (Lupin)
-We meet Fudge in book 2...we see a bit of his prejudice in thinking Hagrid (a half wizard half giant) is responsible for the attacks
-We learn a brief amount about Azkaban
-We meet Fawkes...whose feather is in both Harry and Voldie's wands per book 4...also eats the killing curse in OotP to save Dumbledore
-We see Nearly Headless Nick's deathday party and meet Myrtle...the begginings of us learning more about ghosts which play out in both books 4 and 5
-The dueling club...where Harry learns the disarming spell useful against Voldie in book 4
-HUGE...the whole mudblood/pureblood debate begins here, obviously a huge theme throughout all the books
-Harry also says to Tom that he doesn't know why he didn't die...but he does know why he was struck powerless. JKR has already said that the reason Harry and Voldie both lived that night was important...we also have the prophecy now so I think that is part of the explanation

So I don't think she was referring to one huge thing as we have already seen all of these things from book 2 reappear.

whizbang121

May 10th, 2004, 3:20 am

The one big thing, I believe, is that in Harry presence Fawkes bursts into flame and is reborn from his ashes. This could signify the end of one age and the beginning of the new age. Phoenixes have long been associated with the cycles of World Ages.

Culte Ventosus

May 10th, 2004, 10:51 pm

JKR said we would enter the Chamber of Secrets again, and I mentioned somewhere before, other than HP & his Mum, only Dobby has green eyes. Therefore, I agree with those of you who believe these are "clues"...

whizbang121

May 10th, 2004, 11:46 pm

JKR said we would enter the Chamber of Secrets again,Can you post the quote and the link to it?

Luna27

May 11th, 2004, 5:23 am

Hey guys...I just realized something after posting some of JKR's interview with Steve Kloves in another thread. I'll post the part I'm referring to here:

And there are so many rich details in the books. Could you tell us how you decide what goes in and what stays out?

Steve:
Well, I will suggest to Jo... "You do seem to shine a bit more light on this one than the other details..." and sometimes I'm wrong but often she'll nod and say "Yes, that is going to play out." and there's one thing in Chamber that Jo indicated will play later in the series. The hardest thing for me is that I'm writing a story to which I do NOT know the end. I'm not going to lie to you, I spend some times in my own originals but I assume I will find an end! With this it's just I'm writing a story over a decade, and I keep waiting, you know, keep hoping that Jo will really slip-up and actually tell me something.

Okay...from what Kloves is saying here...he would make the decision of what to cut by asking JKR if something would be crucial to the future plotline. Kloves is the screenwriter for those who don't know.:) Anyway...I don't think he was one of the editors, but I would think that they have the same kind of relationship with JKR...they would want to know what happens in CoS that is really crucial to future movies...that would help them determine what to edit. Or at the very least Kloves is with them when they're editing the film.

That being said, I think it is reasonable to assume that if it was cut out of the movies...it isn't something major. I know some people mentioned the fact that Harry overheard the Malfoys when he was in Knockturn Alley might be important later on...but it was cut from the movie. Also, in the movie Snape isn't the one who tells Draco to use the serpensortia spell...Draco comes up with that on his own...so perhaps the question of DD setting up the dueling club to test Harry isn't an important subplot either. Someone else said they thought that Harry asking Dobby if Voldie has a brother might be a hint that he does have a brother and it would be important later on...but again it's not in the movie. So I think the movies are useful to some degree. It could help rule out some theories and strengthen others because if something was in the movie that seems fairly unimportant...it may be important later on and we just don't know it yet. Like Harry popping up in Knockturn Alley and the stupid hand...even though they left out the store owner's explanation of what it was.

Buckbeak2004

May 11th, 2004, 7:38 pm

M-Y-R-T-L-E!!!

I cant believe most of you havent thought of myrtle before. She seemed to know alot about the chamber.

whizbang121

June 18th, 2004, 8:12 pm

No she didn't. She didn't know anything about the chamber. Only where she had seen the eyes that killed her.

She knew a lot about the prefect's bathroom, though. :eyebrows:
Myrtle is interesting. She was a mudblood who wore glasses, like Harry and James. Hmmmmm.......

GryffindorGr

June 19th, 2004, 8:49 pm

M-Y-R-T-L-E!!!

I cant believe most of you havent thought of myrtle before. She seemed to know alot about the chamber.
Interesting that she's not allowed there or is she? I think ghosts can only roam in certain areas so I'd be surprised if she's allowed to go into the Chambers itself.

by Culte ventosis
JKR said we would enter the Chamber of Secrets again, and I mentioned somewhere before, other than HP & his Mum, only Dobby has green eyes. Therefore, I agree with those of you who believe these are "clues"...
Oh this would have been interesting if there was actually a quote available. :whistle:

I think it would be a good idea to keep quotes handy just in case they disappear into some kind of "void"....
I know this happened to me when there were quotes I saw and swear I've seen it and never found it again. Never again....*remembers favorites section*
If something would play out in the Chambers again, that "one" thing JKR said, maybe it's Fawke's saving Harry? Or the mandrakes? I can imagine them being very important later in the series. It's like that scene in OotP when Ginny stopped the music box and everyone was near a "daze", and if the mandrakes are deadly to the ears, maybe there's some kind of connection there? All this "siren" discussion in GoF and something to do with "music"....like in PS/SS when they played music to the 3 headed dog, Fluffy. There's a connection with music. Not that I think the mandrakes "song" is music though. lol..

Charmed Cheese

June 19th, 2004, 11:31 pm

GryffindorGr

June 19th, 2004, 11:46 pm

One thing that bugs me about book 2 is Hermione turning into a cat.

Why? Wouldn't the plot have worked out just the same if Hermione turned into Milicent? Was it just for a laugh? Hermione's cat transformation seemed like a pointless episode unless it will be more important later on. Perhaps Rowling didn't want her in the slytherin common room. Also, why did they do it in the movie as well? It seems like it would be something Rowling insist they keep in.

I think that's it, CC. That JKR didn't want Hermione in the Slytherin common room and you know how JKR loves Hermione and warns us that Hermione is very very vulnerable. I recall one of her past interviews saying how she wonders why everyone is so upset about Ron being the next death victim while it's Hermione people should be worrying about?? or something in that vein.

If therés a way for Hermione to stay away from the Slytherin area, then that's one of the ways. Remember, Draco Malfoy wanted her "dead" in CoS, so having Hermione be Milicent wouldn't be much help.

ETA: Although everyone's speculated that Polyjuice would play a part and it did, in GoF....I think that's as far as that polyjuice plot went....and it was a BIG part.

As for other things in CoS that would play later in the books, could there be more playable things from CoS to extend in both 6 and 7??

xMagic

June 20th, 2004, 3:35 am

I think Harry recieving Godric's sword definately was important, and it could happen again in book 6 or 7.

Scarlet Tears

June 20th, 2004, 5:05 am

CharmedCheese, that's a really interesting point. In fact, the entire scheme with the Polyjuice Potion was a bit irrelevant to the story, since the only thing Harry and Ron discovered was that Draco was not the Heir of Slytherin. Yet this dead end in the Chamber of Secrets proved to play a crucial role in the Goblet of Fire, since Crouch Jr. was using it to impersonate Moody the entire year. Having Hermione transform into a cat is even less significant to the plot of the individual book, but it could be an important clue to what will happen in books 6 and 7. The theory about preventing Hermione from entering the Slytherin common room is interesting. But it would have been easy enough for Hermione to just stay behind and keep a lookout while Ron and Harry went inside. Maybe the fact that Millicent Bulstrode had cat fur on her clothing is the point Rowling was trying to get across. It could be because she owns a cat, or it could be something more. I highly doubt that Millicent is an animagus, and at the same time it would have been much easier for Rowling to casually point out that Millicent's cat was wandering the halls instead of going as far as making Hermione turn into a cat. I also noticed that there have been many references to cats throughout the series, such as McGonagall turning into one, Mrs. Figg owning many, Ginny acting "catlike," Crookshanks, Mrs. Norris, and the fact that Hagrid is allergic to them. I believe that there is definitely a possibility of Hermione's cat transformation being significant later on.

Siriusly

June 20th, 2004, 12:58 pm

Essbee

June 20th, 2004, 10:00 pm

Maybe it's a foreshadowing thing, and was either forshadowing Hermione getting a cat (Crookshanks) or Hermione later on becoming an Animagus, who transforms into a cat. So many parallels are drawn between Hermione and Prof McGonagal, so why not sharing an Animagi form? I think Hermione would make a very good Animagus - she could study at it for ages to get really good and is certainly intelligent enough to do it.

Oahu

July 1st, 2004, 7:03 pm

Ressurecting this thread d/t the mods closing the one I created about Book two Secrets.
For those in the know, who have been to the site, JK has made reference to the secrets of book two again.

I'd like to point out that Godric Gryffindor's sword, plus the fact his parents lived at Godric's Hollow, are major clues I think. I wonder what the benefit of being heir of Gryffindor might be, besides a cool sword...

Any other info on the heir of Gryffindor?

Essbee

July 1st, 2004, 10:05 pm

Oooh, I'm glad someone ressurected this thread -it's a favourite of mine!

We know very little about the heir of Gryffindor, but it's possible that he could have been a half blood and that's why Salazar fell out with him. Anyone who knows the book six title will get what I'm driving at here...

Gryffindor is always described as the founder who prized bravery above all else. I think I read a discussion somewhere where they were talking about him being realted to King Arthur in some way, make what you will of that.

To get back to Hermione, I've since had a discussion with people and got to the conclusion that maybe it's a hint towards the identity of Mrs Norris? I have a theory that Mrs Norris is actually a witch, someone close to Filch (for that red sister or girlfriend of something) who got stuck as a cat, through either a failed transfiguration or some really strong Polyjuice potion with too much cat hair in! After all, Flich was very, very upset when she was petrified...

Sweetie

July 1st, 2004, 10:15 pm

I always thought that turning Hermione into a cat was just a way of getting her out of the way for a bit. Cats are the only pet allowed that would leave a hair that Hermione would mistake for a human hair, so it was the logical animal to choose. I do think that cats are very important in the books, of course, but I never took that particular section as more than that.

emerald eyes

July 1st, 2004, 10:47 pm

Essbee

July 1st, 2004, 11:43 pm

Myrtle - yes, she's an enigma.

Ghosts usually can't move or touch anything, yet she seems to be able to manipulate water and be manipulated by it. I wonder why she's such a special ghost? Maybe she was so determined to return (as she says so herself, something about taunting Olive Hornby) that she is closer to being alive than dead, only a sort of immortal half-alive-ness...

OK, I know, I'm rambling now... ;)

amy_gamgee

July 1st, 2004, 11:46 pm

Why oh why does my mother-in-law *still* have my copy of CoS???? I desperatley need to re-read it!

I'm with a lot of people that Godric's sword is going to play a major role in book 6 or book 7 (or both). I also think that Dobby and the houselves are going to be of major importance, and they were introduced in CoS.

Maybe it's a foreshadowing thing, and was either forshadowing Hermione getting a cat (Crookshanks) or Hermione later on becoming an Animagus, who transforms into a cat. So many parallels are drawn between Hermione and Prof McGonagal, so why not sharing an Animagi form? I think Hermione would make a very good Animagus - she could study at it for ages to get really good and is certainly intelligent enough to do it.

That's very true, Essbee. For all we know, Hermione could have been studying to become an animagus for the past year ... I mean she did manage to keep the time-turner a secret. But, if she does become an animagus, she would be doing it illegally, which doesn't seem like something Hermione would do (even if she has become a bit more "rebellious" lately!) :) And I don't know how Hermy being an animagus would be a "key" to the series. Then again, I am not JKR...

EDIT: (I have more to say!) lol

~NHN's Deathday party - Just seemed so long not to have some importance. I think Nearly Headless Nick is important to the story in some way.

Emerald eyes - that is such a good point, I didn't even think of Nearly Headless Nick! I recall that NHN is one of the first characters JKR came up with (after Harry of course). She came up with him on the same train ride she came up with Harry on... it always struck me as odd that she would create the character of a (seemingly) unimportant ghost in the very beginning stages of the novel. I agree that he must have a significance and I hope we find out about it in HBP.

numenor

July 1st, 2004, 11:46 pm

I think the last 2 books will have at least something in them about the stuff that Lucius Malfoy was selling at Borgin & Burkes. I mean, it wasn't that big of a scene and they could have easily cut it out of the movie, but they hyped it up instead. Plus I think that one poison he was selling could have something to do with the plot :lol: maybe...

emerald eyes

July 1st, 2004, 11:52 pm

I knew there was something from book 2 I was forgetting - Dobby! Don't ask me how I did - Probably lack of sleep among other things.

But I meant to put him on the list as well. We've got to find out more about just how and why the house elves are enslaved.
And thinking somemore about Mrytle - I was just remembering all the water movement she does in book 4 as well. What is the deal with her?

I too wonder about the stuff Malfoy was selling! :wow:

story

July 3rd, 2004, 12:43 am

Who else has read Tom Riddles diary? - you see, I suspect that someone has told the diary some piece of information that would help Voldemort. JK has really told us this is the case on her website. Mr Malfoy? Is he all he seems?

Culte Ventosus

July 3rd, 2004, 1:00 am

More than once, Harry thought he saw the stone snakes in the chamber move...
If an animagus transforms into the same animal as the one which their patronus appears as, Hermione would become an otter. JKR said we would enter the chamber again, and that it held more than one secret...

LuvRed

July 3rd, 2004, 1:23 am

I just finished rereading COS and to me what really stick out as important key parts from book 2 include:
~NHN's Deathday party - Just seemed so long not to have some importance. I think Nearly Headless Nick is important to the story in some way.
~Meeting Mrytle - There's just something about her unlike/different from other ghosts.
~Intro to the whole Mudblood/Pureblood issue - Well ultimately its what Voldemort's problem is.
~The Chamber itself - I think it hasn't revealed all its secrets yet. I mean come on, it seemed rather big and elborate to be just the home for a giant, nasty snake.

Great, I would include some more keys from CoS:

1. Squibs are defined
2. Ginny starts Hogwarts
3. The Malfoys have a chamber under the drawing room, in the manor.
4. Knockturn Alley is introduced into Diagon Alley
5. The Hand of Glory is defined
6. Professor Binns explains/defined Hogwarts founders history.
7. Sir Patrick Podmore is introduced
8. The Burrow-Harry learns what Ron's family is like
9. Dobby is set free
10. Fudge puts the wrong man in Azkaban
11. Mundungus Fletcher tries to hex Arthur Weasley
12. Percy is a perfect
13. Parseltongue is defined
14. We learn wands can be replaced if they break
15. Howlers are defined
16. Walking through a ghost is like walking through a freezer[Dementers make things feel very cold and depressing, so what do ghost and dementors have in common??]
17. Ployjuice potion is used and defined.

CoS is set up to explain why a war is coming. I am going to read OotP to get more of a glimpse into CoS, just to see if I can decipher more information.

glugunkwen

July 3rd, 2004, 1:08 pm

This probably isn't very significant, but it occured to me last night that in CoS we get a pretty thorough description of Arthur Weasley's job with muggle artifacts. It made me wonder if Arthur's job would become important in future books. We are also introduced to the fact that Lucius Malfoy has more 'illegal' things hidden in his house. It makes me wonder what would be found if Arthur's office did a raid on Lucius' house.

Although why that would happen, I don't know - unless it was believed that Lucius had muggle artifacts in his house. Though technically, that's what Tom Riddle's diary was.

Oahu

July 4th, 2004, 4:36 pm

latiem

July 4th, 2004, 5:06 pm

Well, that could mean that any of the Weasleys might be important in defeating the Basilisk, which could eventually save Harry and/or help defeat Voldemort. It might be Ron, Harry's best friend. It might be Ginny, who is destined to be more important. It could be any of the other Weasleys.

If defeat of the Basilisk resulted in one of the Weasleys dying, that would be a significant turn in the book, no matter which one died, since Harry is becoming like a member of the family.

Ooh It might be Percy becuase I remeber JK saying something about upcoming events that will redeem the actor playing Percy.

latiem

July 4th, 2004, 5:11 pm

I don't know why Hermione turning into a cat is so important except that it gives JKR another chance to show us Myrtle. The whole polyjuice potion was important to show us Myrtle and the bathroom where the entrance to the chamber was.

JKR SAID THAT MYRTLE WAS COMING BACK IN FUTURE STORY
interesting guess Siriusly.

P.S. sorry I have two posts after eachother I just get excited about things like this.

The people who think the sword of Godric are right on because in book five one of the members of the DA club asked Harry if it was true that he pulled out the sword that was resting in DD's office that one of the portraits told him about it.

Other clues that might be of importance-
How JK said that there is going to be a new Minister of Magic is related to book two when Ron told his father what Draco said to them about his fathers personal stash. This would work well with the theory of Arthur being the new Minister also that "someone who can not be bought by the likes of Lucius Malfoy" (I don't remeber who said it.)

whizbang121

July 4th, 2004, 6:59 pm

I'm rereading book two now, almost done, and I have to say that I am noticing the amount of attention JK gives to Percy's similarities to Voldie. Anyone else? Is there a thread on this? If so I can't find it.
This one might interest you.

http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=25401&highlight=percy

Essbee

July 4th, 2004, 11:29 pm

rjade829

July 4th, 2004, 11:36 pm

3. Harry has a dream about being in a cage labelled 'Under-Age Wizard' sleeping on a bed of straw and Dudley rattles the cage bars and Dobby ignores Harry's protests and leaves him where he is 'safe' to protect him. Since Harry's dreams seem to usually come true in some way, what does this say about the future?

Sounds like prison...I guess that would go along with some people's theories about Harry going to Azkaban. I personally don't have an opinion on the chances of that happening, but who knows.

whizbang121

July 5th, 2004, 12:40 am

I'm re-reading book two at the moment as well, to try and glean what I can from it.

In the first few chapters I noticed the following...

1. Dobby mentions twice how important Harry is, and how he can't be risked at getting hurt. Does Dobby know about the prophecy in some way?

2. Mr Dursley is described as advancing on Harry 'like a Bulldog'. Any relationship with Marge's dogs, and Ripper in particular? Maybe it's just me, but I always get suspicious when people are described as animals...

3. Harry has a dream about being in a cage labelled 'Under-Age Wizard' sleeping on a bed of straw and Dudley rattles the cage bars and Dobby ignores Harry's protests and leaves him where he is 'safe' to protect him. Since Harry's dreams seem to usually come true in some way, what does this say about the future?
I wonder if this dream is telling Harry that he's safe in his "cage" at the Dursleys. Maybe the label "Under-Age Wizard" means that the protection will be gone when he's of age. Seventeen, right? Now we know that Dumbledore put a charm on Harry using the Blood Bond Shield created when Voldemort killed Lily. Was the dream trying to reveal this to Harry? Sirius was supposed to be safe at Grimmauld, too. Safe in magic cages. Dobby ... and socks.

Anyone remember a poem called Custard the Dragon?

azza

July 5th, 2004, 10:31 am

i don't think the dream is of real importance as JKR said everything important was in the movie and that wasn't. I think it's just harrys frustration at not being able to do magic, as well as his feeling that people always look at him (which is of course true), also theres harry's feelings that dobby would do anything to protect him( including causing him pain (bludger) or keeping him locked away

latiem

July 5th, 2004, 7:39 pm

Thanks Whizbang for the link about Percy Its interesting to see what people think about that. I don't believe he is a death eater though, what JK said had an impact on me. whats the saying directly from the birds song or something like that, I really believe there's more to what happened with the Weasleys and his role in future books/movies.

Anyway back on topic:
I beleive that Dobby has some importance to the six book because after all he did serve a death eater, but I can't see any more relevence to the Dursleys, what happens after he finishes Hogwarts isn't he entitiled to finally start his life in the wizarding world where he belongs, I hope JK resolves that at the end of the series.

DarkMark

July 5th, 2004, 7:48 pm

What happens after he finishes Hogwarts? isn't he entitiled to finally start his life in the wizarding world where he belongs, I hope JK resolves that at the end of the series.

I have read somewhere on this site that JKR has stated that she will tie up all the loose ends and show what the characters end up as, so we should find out what happens after Hogwarts.

Back to Topic:
I noticed that Dobby was a very predominant figure in COS (book 2)and GOF (book 4). Maybe he will be key to the storyline of book 6. I am fairly interested in the powers Dobby and the other house-elves display which we saw in CoS. He can become invisable and do spells so i think he will and the other house-elves be inlisted by Dumbledore in the upcoming war.
There is more to Dobby than meets the eye!

hpfan47

July 5th, 2004, 7:54 pm

J.K. has said in an interview that Moaning Myrtle was her favorite character and that we would definatly be seeing more of her. Also, ever since the title for book 6 came out i have wondered if Mark Evans was originally going to be the oldest Creevy brother but the name was later changed because that needed to be in book six. But as far as clues book two gives us, I definetly think that Moaning Myrtle will play a more important role. She was killed by Voldemort (Tom Riddle) after all.

latiem

July 5th, 2004, 8:10 pm

Hey DarkMark did you read book 5 I don't want to say anything if you didn't so not to ruin the story for you.

As for Moaning Myrtle I read somewhere on this forum that she was coming back in book 6. I beleive that she will help Harry with something that will give him a hint to a problem or that she will talk about death (her favorite subject) to Harry dealing with the death of Sirius.

"Oh Harry if you die you can share my toilet with me if you like" -Moaning Myrtle- Chamber of Secrets

DarkMark

July 5th, 2004, 8:17 pm

Hey DarkMark did you read book 5 I don't want to say anything if you didn't so not to ruin the story for you.

Nope, i've read it. If you think that because i didn't say anything about Dobby being in book 5, it was just because i didn't think the role he had was as important in the story as it was before.

DerHalfBlood

July 5th, 2004, 8:42 pm

Yeah I agree that Moaning Myrtle might be a little more keen to discuss death with Harry than Headless Nick. The only problem with that is it seems Nearly Headless Nick didn't actually know all the details about dying and passing along because he chose to stay. Since Nearly Headless Nick didnt know, how would Myrtle know? I really don't know, but she would probably be the one for us to find out who becomes ghosts, etc. from.

GiannaOllivander

July 5th, 2004, 8:53 pm

One thing that bugs me about book 2 is Hermione turning into a cat.

Why? Wouldn't the plot have worked out just the same if Hermione turned into Milicent? Was it just for a laugh? Hermione's cat transformation seemed like a pointless episode unless it will be more important later on. Perhaps Rowling didn't want her in the slytherin common room. Also, why did they do it in the movie as well? It seems like it would be something Rowling insist they keep in.

Reading your post, it occurred to me that Hermione turning into a cat and therefore being unable to accompany Ron and Harry could be a clever subterfuge to hide the fact that (perhaps) Hermione wouldn't have been able to enter the Slytherin common room (being Muggle-born). Wouldn't it be fitting with all we've learned of Salazar Slytherin that he'd enchant his common room so that no Muggle-borns could enter? And maybe you're right- JKR didn't want Hermione to try to go to the Slytherin common room (yet) because she didn't want us to know (yet) about the enchantment. Just a thought!

LuvRed

July 6th, 2004, 3:18 am

CoS, key to the series, hmm...CoS was not my favorite book; here are some keys points I got from re-reading CoS:

1. Harry goes to the Burrow (Burrow means refugee) by a rescue squad, Fred, George and Ron.
2. Harry meets the Weasley, particularly Ginny.
3. He is introduced to the Floo Network, PolyJuice Potion, house elves, Lockhart, squibs, and Aragog.
4. Harry and Ron are rescued by the Ford Anglia.
5. Harry, Ron, and Hermione start Herbology Room 3.
6. Harry exposes his talents, Parseltongue.
7. Harry deals with fame
8. Harry saves the day with his faithful side kicks, Ron and Hermione ( The trio are teenagers growing up, not grow ups yet).

Summary of CoS:
Harry is pretending not to exist at the Dursley's. Dobby comes and reeks havoc on the Dursleys business dinner; so Mr. Dursley imprisons Harry. Harry, in which, is rescued by the Weasleys and goes to their refugee camp, the Burrow. Harry and Ron cannot get onto the Hogwarts Express, someone sealed the platform. The Ford Anglia is used fly to school and so is crashed into the Weeping Willow that attacks Harry and Ron, who are stuck in the trees branches until the car magically breaks free. This illegal use of magic, gets them detention. Ron gets a Howler from dear ole Mum. Harry is harrased by G. Lockhart. The Chamber of Secrets is open by the Heir of Slytherin, the non-pure blood wizards are in for trouble. The trio, Harry, Ron, and Hermione set off to find out who the heir is, mostly to protect Hermione, who is muggle born. Conflict, Harry is Parseltongue, so other Houses think he is the heir ( the not everyone believes him theme again). Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Harry is not the heir, nor is Malfoy or Hagrid. Hermione is petrified by the Basilisk, and still is able to assist Harry and Ron realize the creature is a snake, and Harry is not mental. Ginny Weasley is taken to the chamber. Ron tries, but Harry saves the day, and Gryffindor gets the House Cup.

Prediction:
1. Harry will leave the Dursley's house and go into hiding.
2. Harry will get to Hogwarts only to discover another "special" power that makes folks believe he is evil or crazy.
3. Moaning Myrtle and Dobby will clue Harry in on some terror that's planned.
4. The CoS is reopen by the HBP.
5. The new DADA arrives.
6. Harry will play Quidditch with Ron, who may be kicked off the team for some reason.
7. Muggle borns will be targeted again.
8. Draco will get revenge on Harry, Ron, Hermione, and the rest of the DA members.
9. The House will unite for something "big".
10. Nearly Head Nick will invite the trio to an important Deathday party for him.
11. Ron will face a Really Big Spider again, poor fellow.
12. Hermione, the insufferable know-it-all, will forget something and get hurt
13. Harry will save everyone's life, that he can, and be called a Hero [or a show off if the Slytherin's have to call it].
14. The Weasley boys go DARK for Harry, Fred, George, and Ron.
15. The trio prepares for Career Courses that lead to NEWT's (The trio are grown up and nearly adults of age)

The Hand of Glory will be bought by the Weasleys brothers, FGR, and the will find a huge treasure that my land them in hot water with Mundungus, who smells like a toilet. Oh, and follow the toilets and spiders, Dark creatures like hiding Dark stuff in the plumming. Why are Weasleys a bit "Dark"? They know how to break into Muggle houses with ease and finesse. Ron looks up to them, so he will tag along. And everyone who has read the books know Fred has a dark side. George is a bit more reserved, and Ron is noisy. FYI, the Hand of Glory is a fable item used by thieves; the items allows the thieves to steal w/o waking up the victums. In Cos, Mundungus tried to hex Arthur Weasley. In OotP, FRG brothers are very into dealing and learning from Mundungus. Who's side is Mundungus on, eh?

GabrielTurner

July 6th, 2004, 5:45 am

Harry & Tom's reaction to Dumbledore's questions. Both denied there was something wrong or had something to offer the debate. It shows a part of Harry is unduly influenced by Voldemort's power.

Harry really questions his powers and where he's from in the book, causing a conflict of feelings about where he belongs. Dumbledore teaching Harry about choices is a key point. Harry has choices to make for good or bad, but it maybe that he'll make a bad choice in later books that affects his conscience.

The emergence of the House Elves. Key players in future books and a possible unlikely ally to Harry in a possible conflict. I can see the Elves having a great impact on a battle with the Dementors.

Aragog and the spiders. Again, Hagrid's bond with the spider may prove useful especially if Hagrid is the character killed off as many think. Aragog's reaction could be quite deadly for his killers.

The Chamber of Secrets can still be used by those wanting access to Hogwarts. Voldemort may well use it as a base in later books.

Godric's sword indicates Harry maybe related by blood to the Wizard.

You are really smart. I already like you... :tu: :tu:

I like that idea of House Elves vs. Dementors. Rowling kept putting out there that House Elves had magic of their own. And it seems that Dementors feed off of Humans. If House Elves serve the Humans why not be equipped with Magic to protect them? For all we know poor winky ( :upset: ) could become quite useful later on.

Considering the title of the next book I think its pretty important that we look into the scenes with Tom Riddle as a young boy and Harry Potter. Even the one with Tom Riddle and Dumbledore in the journal, well the journal over all is important...

But for now thats what I got...

Essbee

July 6th, 2004, 3:35 pm

Dobby in particular could be very useful. I can see a duel between Dobby and Kreacher, or a wizard, over Harry's life.

I also love the idea of a hundred-strong army of house elves all wearing Hogwarts tea-towels marching on Voldemort... So cool!

I have a mini-theory that perhaps the power that Harry has that Voldemort doesn't know about is compassion - this would fit with the way Harry frees Dobby in this book. he doesn't do it for himself, he does it for Dobby, but it may turn out to help him later on.

panthera

July 6th, 2004, 5:21 pm

Just a little addition about Dobby : I think that the fact he worked for the Malfoys made him a precious mine of informations.
Think about Malfoy's past, family, house, relationship...

MagicianGirl

July 8th, 2004, 1:28 pm

Ginny's possession with Riddle. According to JKR IF Ginny had died and Riddle escaped from the diary, the present day Voldemort would've gotten considerably stronger and she said that she can't answer further than that until all 7 books are finished. There must have something significant about Ginny if her death could've strengthen Voldemort. After all, it was her life-force and power which made Riddle come back to form even for a short period.

Lucybird

July 8th, 2004, 2:33 pm

She says about this on her site... I think maybe Harry being able to speak to snakes is important

jactay

July 8th, 2004, 5:26 pm

jactay

July 8th, 2004, 6:05 pm

What i meant to add was that the chamber itself could be the key to the HP series. Could there be more secrets beside the basilisk (which is dead) ? I don't agree that the Chamber could be another entrance to Hogwarts. Its a chamber within the school not a passage connecting to outside of the school. Fawkes could appear or disappear anywhere in Hogwarts, as it had done so in DD's office before. :welcome:

panthera

July 8th, 2004, 6:08 pm

I am new in messaging and just enrolled here. Like most of you, i can't live a day without reading something about Harry Potter and co. Have you guys discussed what in the Chamber of Secrets (place, not book) ? JK called it the Chamber of Secrets and not the Secret Chamber? I've been searching around for a thread like this but couldn't find one. Anyone care to comment ?
Hey :welcome: to you Jactay. All relevants reflections and new clues are welcome and you have a good one :thumbsup: Make me think.
Sometimes in few threads (especially in Divination studies) we talk about the chamber of secret but I'm not sure there is a particular thread to it.

Essbee

July 8th, 2004, 9:47 pm

GryffindorSeeker

July 8th, 2004, 10:00 pm

I'm pretty sure we'll see the Chamber in the next book. I'm almost positive, since the title of this one was almost the title of CoS.

I'm guessing this is why book two is "key."

Trishg19

July 8th, 2004, 10:49 pm

I agree that the 2nd book didn't seem to follow the same lines as the others so it makes sense that a lot of foreshadowing happens in this book. A lot of things that have been said could possibly be what Jo was talking about but somehow I think that the important things that happend in book 2 will not be involved in book 6 (i.e. parseltongue, chamber of secrets, ect.) Just because it would be too obvious. I think it will be more subtle than that. But then again who knows? I can't wait to find out

Essbee

July 9th, 2004, 11:06 pm

MollyWeasley01

July 10th, 2004, 1:36 am

I agree with jactay. I also think that there is more to the chamber than we have seen so far. It is called the chamber of secretS, not secret. It's plural. That makes me think that it has more hidden than we have found so far. Just a thought.

JoFaye

July 10th, 2004, 2:46 pm

I actually now think that the Godric Gryffindor/Salazar Slytherin will be very important. For reasons I can't really elaborate on here, but think the title of book six and you'll get where I'm heading (my money's on Godric!).
I SOOOOOOOOOOO agree with you. I always hate posting stuff like that first because.........well, I just do. :angel:

whizbang121

July 14th, 2004, 4:11 am

Chamber of Secrets is the book that presents the struggle between the founders that led to Salazar Slytherin leaving the school in a snit after creating the Chamber of Secrets. The explanation of the division of ideologies concerning whether to educate muggleborns or exclusively pureblood wizards is central to the story, as is the concept of oppressed races represented by Dobby. Remember, JKR's heroine is Jessica Mitford, a civil rights activist.

ComicBookWorm

July 14th, 2004, 8:57 am

Here we see key themes of good vs. evil, and prejudice vs. tolerance being developed as part and parcel of the same issue (good wizards seem more tolerant, bad wizards are intolerant). The mistreatment of magical beings is also highlighted here as part of the intolerance.

The following also became important:

1. Roots of prejudice run deep
2. Hagrid & Aragog & the other acromantulas
3. Ginny's possession
4. TMR backstory
5. Fawkes and GG's artifacts (the hat, the sword)
6. There are hidden rooms and passages in Hogwarts
7. You are revealed by the choices you make
8. The rift between the founders
9. Basilisk is ancient and deadly
10. Harry is a "true Gryffindor"
11. Parseltongue is a unique and rare skill
12. Polyjuice potion

Of all of the items above, only the Polyjuice may be dispensible. It has been done twice now. The Basilisk may not show up again either.

MagicianGirl

July 14th, 2004, 9:40 pm

The title of Book 2 itself will be important Chamber of Secrets. Why is it title as such and the Secret Chamber. What other secrets lies within the chamber since the title suggests that there is more than one?

Elrod Ubramowic

July 14th, 2004, 9:48 pm

I think JKR has gotten everyone to overlook how prevalent socks are to the story. In CoS we first see the power of socks when Harry uses one to free Dobby. This would just be an amusing anecdote if it weren't for Dumbledore's response to Harry's question about what Dumbledore sees in the Mirror of Erised. Dumbldore told Harry he saw himself holding a pair of wooly socks, and he lamented that another Xmas had passed without receiving any as a gift.

In PoA reference was made to a pair of Uncle Vernon's old smelly socks that Harry got as a birthday present. Harry also used a particularly smelly pair of Uncle Vernon's old socks (possibly the same pair, but JKR implies Harry had more than one pair of Uncle Vernon's old socks) to muffle the sneakoscope on the Hogwarts Express. Ron got some maroon socks for Xmas.

In GoF there is the mutual exchange of socks at Xmas, and Harry buys Dobby more socks as reward for helping him in Triwizard Tournament. Moody comments on the socks Harry got from Dobby for Xmas.

I don't have my copy of OotP handy so I couldn't think of any sock references in it, but if there are they've got to have some significance.

Rae

July 15th, 2004, 3:22 am

Yes! Yes! jactay and Essbee finally articulated what I was thinking as I was reading through this thread...finally someone sees the logic!

CoS seems to not quite fit in with the other books and seeing how 'The Half Blood prince' was the original title, obviously the themes of prejudice will be carried over into the sixth book. We don't learn that much specifics about Salazar and Godric, and I think Salazar left plenty of secrets in his little chamber.

Hoops4eva

July 15th, 2004, 3:29 am

just think back to all the people that had been petrified....will they become victims of Lord Voldemort???.....perhaps!??!?!?

whizbang121

July 15th, 2004, 3:36 am

I've often wondered why Harry didn't think to use the Chamber for DA meetings. OK, so the Room of Requirement was ten times better, but before they knew about that... I would've thought it would have been perfect - only Harry can open the chamber because only he can speak Parseltongue. So there's no chance of them or any lists (lol) being discovered in there. Umbridge certainly wouldn't be able to find them! Perhaps because of the precitious several mile drop to the bottom into a nasty pile of yuck and the need of a phoenix to get back out again?

gymmuggle

July 15th, 2004, 3:37 am

ComicBookWorm

July 15th, 2004, 3:46 am

CoS has always been my least favorite of the books so far ( not that i dont like it, because i love Harry Potter, its just that CoS is not my most fav. of the series) but now I've just realized that the reason is because the story of CoS is kinda out there and doesnt really have key componets to the 3rd 4th and 5th one.

It gave us great backstory about TR and Hagrid and established the theme of wizard intolerance. It served its purpose. Throughout the series JKR has been struggling with inventing interesting ways to give us the immense amount of backstory we need to understand this rich world. The use of Pensieves was another one of her fascinating backstory conventions.

What it seemingly didn't do was advance the current plotline, so in that way it seemed like a detour. Although I suspect that CoS advanced the current plotline more than is readily apparent, but we just can't see it clearly. I've liked PoA best of the stories so far, but I was fascinated with the glimpse into the past that CoS gave us and was left wanting more.

jactay

July 15th, 2004, 7:07 am

Hi all, and thanks panthera for the warm welcome. I really enjoy reading all the discussions in all these threads. I have learnt plenty of things.

Whizbang121 mentioned that JKR's heroine is Jessica Mitford, a civil rights activist. I don't know very much about JK's personal life except whats at her website, But if she does feel strongly about civil rights, then Harry's liberation of Dobby the house-elf may be an important event in Book 2.

It could be so, since we can all see in later books that more house-elves Winky and Kreacher were introduced, Hermione set up SPEW though it hadn't been very effective so far; Hermione spent so much of her precious time in OWL year knitting hats for the elves though they disappear only because Dobby took them all, Dumbledore employs Dobby and pay him wages and benefits.

If the liberation of the house-elves is a major theme (not just tolerance of them as slaves but helping them to be free from enslavement), then it would follow that this liberation thing would succeed. Don't forget Hermione wants to pursue SPEW as a career (I don't think she is joking). And Hermione is always right, almost always except her Polyjuice Potion incident.

It is hard to see the liberation "movement" making much headway in the current situation, but things could very well be different if there is indeed going to be a new Minister of Magic.

Just thinking aloud. Have a nice day. :cool:

story

July 15th, 2004, 12:41 pm

Memory charms must surely play a part in the last two books

Elrod Ubramowic

July 19th, 2004, 7:47 pm

I'm surprised no one has cought this before now. Colin Creevey is ost definately a mudblood. When he first speaks to Harry we find out that Colin's father is a milkman and that he didn't know that pictures moved. These are traits of a mudblood or muggleborn. Justin-Finch Fletchley also a definate mudblood. Remeber he was supposed to go to Eton. Now I'm American but even I know that's a prestigious school in England somewhere. I also know that it actually exists. Therefore not a School of Magic thus Justin = mudblood. The Cat cannot explain that. Nearly Headless Nick. It's possible he was a mudblood. We really don't know that much about him. Personally though I think that was a case of wrong place at the wrong time. Remeber Nick and Justin were found together.

I think people are overlooking JKR's acknowledgement of social classes in England, and how magical ability can come from all classes. I think the signifcance of pointing out Colin Creevey's father is a milkman is to show that wizards can come from the working classes too. Justin Finch-Fletchley, being down for Eton, represents the upper class. And Hermione, who's parents are dentists, represents the middle or professional class. All are Muggle-born. Their magical abilities gives them a common interest that unites them that is more compelling than the barriers of social class that would keep them separate in the Muggle world.

marcasitevah

July 21st, 2004, 12:35 am

Personally, CoS was my favorite of the books.

I always thought that no one could easily get back into the chamber after what happened that night between Harry, Tom and the basilisk. Besides, the room of requirement, while easier to find than the chamber, came with everthing they needed for the DA.

As for the chamber itself, what other secrets could it hold? Maybe Slytherin placed other weapons there to get rid of muggle born students, but what they could be I have no idea.

codswallop

July 21st, 2004, 1:47 am

Thought on book 2, also my least favorite book.

things that stick out:

1. It's our choices versus abilities (wormtail)

2. the fact that house elves can apparate/disapparate within hogwarts

3. Colin Creevy

4. Tom Riddle is a half-blood

5. The background of the houses

6. Fawkes

7. The significance of ghosts

8. Dooby's promise to never try to save Harry's life again

Elrod Ubramowic

July 21st, 2004, 3:47 am

Hmm, good thought about the Chamber of Secrets.

I've often wondered why Harry didn't think to use the Chamber for DA meetings. OK, so the Room of Requirement was ten times better, but before they knew about that... I would've thought it would have been perfect - only Harry can open the chamber because only he can speak Parseltongue. So there's no chance of them or any lists (lol) being discovered in there. Umbridge certainly wouldn't be able to find them!

It makes me wonder if it won't be mentioned again... I like the idea that it holds more surprises for Harry and co. Of course, I'm also in the 'second basilisk' camp, so that's a big part of my ideas... :)

As for Dobby, I've also wondered whether he's told anything about the Malfoys. Not that there's too much to be gained from it now I wouldn't think, what with Lucius in prison and all!

Sneaking that many students into and out of Moaning Myrtle's out-of-order bathroom would have been very difficult given its location in a well traveled corridor. Also, how would the students get up the pipes from the CoS to the bathroom? Fawkes would not likely be available as a taxi service. Only Harry, the parselmouth, could open the entry in the restroom and at the end of the passageway, and it would be difficult to coordinate with arrivals and departures meant to be kept clandestine. Finally, we don't know what other enchantments, more likely curses, Slytherin may have left on the CoS. I don't think the CoS would have been a practical place to conduct DADA training,

As far as Dobby spilling Malfoy family secrets, I think Winky's loyalty to young Barty Crouch, who has just admitted killing his father, is meant to demonstrate just how powerful the magic is that binds house-eves to their masters. She wouldn't betray one family member despite his betrayal of the family. Dobby's self-imposed punishments for revealing cryptic information about his master's plan also provides evidence how difficult it is for Dobby, the most independent thinking house-elf, to provide hints about his master. I don't think Dobby will be asked for additional information on the Malfoys as he will have to punish himself to reveal it.

Evelien19

July 21st, 2004, 4:06 am

LilyEvare

July 21st, 2004, 4:34 am

One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned is Celestina Warbeck. Rumours are flying everywhere about her and she was first mentioned in book 2.

"Books were stacked three deep on the mantelpiece, books with titles like Charm Your Own Cheese, Enchantment in Baking, and One Minute Feasts- It's Magic! And unless Harry's ears were deceiving him, the old radio next to the sink had just annouced that coming up was 'Witching Hour', with the popular singing sorceress, Celestina Warbeck" ~CoS UK verison pg. 31 (Ch. 3 The Burrow)

Even though some characters mentioned in passing are nothing (Mark Evans) others are important (Sirius Black and Mrs. Figg) Normally I would not have thought twice about Warbeck being mentioned. However on JKR's site in the rumours section there is an ad stating:

"The Singing Sorceress: Celestina Warbeck in concert! The sorcerers saucepot is offering 3 additional tourdates on the 11th, 12th, and 13th of this month. Anti Muggle Scurity"

There is also a "no-smoking" style image stating no muggles. Also in those ads is one for Borgin and Burkes and for the book "Charm Your Own Cheese" (though I can't imagine the book being anything crucial.) Still the mention of 3 things in passing that are now being advertised on her site is a bit odd.

(Quick note in regards to other books that mention her. She is mentioned briefly in Quidditch Through the Ages because of her recording the Puddlemere United team anthem to help St. Mungos which does not seem to be the most trustworthy of places.)

delvine2001

July 22nd, 2004, 8:14 am

I don't think Moaning Myrtle was killed by the Basilisk because she would have seen it through her glasses and as Colin saw it through his camera, Hermione used a mirror and Justin saw it through Nearly Headless Nick, she should not have been killed just petrified.

If this is true then Harry could not have possibly been killed by the Basilisk just petrified, because he has glasses.

katie

July 22nd, 2004, 8:23 am

However it would still have been pretty unpleasant to be petrified so i can understand why he made sure he didn't look at the basilisk ;)

Tom Bombadil

July 22nd, 2004, 1:38 pm

Some things that I think might be influential:

1) Hagrid being framed by Tom
2) Ginny being possesed by Voldemort
3) Fawkes
4) Gryffindor's sword

There's that Hand of Glory too, the one which Malfoy was eying in the shop in Knockturn Alley. Maybe it will show up again...

I think the hand is significant. It was mentioned in the shop and also, when Lupin was doing the boggart thing someones, I can't remember who, boggart was a hand twitching and curling on the ground. Besides the fact that it has a name, that part in the movie where Dumbledore said something about turning on a light and the hand being a light to only the holder is significant.

Essbee

July 23rd, 2004, 8:57 pm

You know, I always wondered about glasses. Because surely, if wearing glasses stopped the Basilisk from killing you then Dumbledore would have just told all the students to wear glasses? I'm sure that Dumbledore figured out what was in the Chamber if Hermione did. Maybe it has to be a certain thickness before it dilutes the Basilisk's powers enough.

I know that the Chamber wouldn't have been an ideal place for meetings, I was just surprised that Harry didn't even think about it. Even if only to dismiss the idea again due to impracticality - I still think he should have thought about it.

If you watch the CoS film then Harry really has a thing about hands in general. Everytime he comes across someone petrified he examines the hand - Justin and Hermione, and he examines the Hand of Glory too. I'm sure it means something, though I'm not sure what...

Turiya

July 24th, 2004, 4:07 pm

Uhm, glasses won't protect you against the basilisk. The persons who were merly petrified all saw only the Reflection of the Basilisk.
Glasses don't show you an reflected image, wereas a camera does (At least the good ones, where you look through the seeker (is it called so in english?) and the light gets projected by two mirrors and then through the same lenses which take the Image.).

Elrod Ubramowic

July 25th, 2004, 8:43 pm

Sharpturn

July 25th, 2004, 8:49 pm

I think it might be the heir of Slytherin thing. It was the secondary focus of the book if you look at it the right way. Maybe whoever turns out to be the heirs of the other houses will be a main part of books to come. Like they all have to save the school.

The heir of Gryffindor, would probably be Ron, as Harry would most likely be heir of Slytherin for the sake of the book because he has a connection with the Dark Lord. Also, it cannot be Hermione, because she's a mud.. I mean muggle-born.

But thats just me. Go and believe what you want

aggiefan1206

July 26th, 2004, 3:43 am

Well as far as the movie goes Ron/Hermione is being foreshadowed big time. Some of Rons comments in the book could be foreshadowing. Snape i dobut will get the DADA any time soon. Mabe the part Harry says about being in sixth year mabe he will get into snapes class. SOmething in the chamber will most likely be something important.

I agree with alot of what yall have said I definatly think that Ginny and Fawkes. Great job to everyone so far its hard to think of other things that could be clues

Essbee

July 26th, 2004, 1:27 pm

But Justin, who saw the Basilisk through Nearly Headless Nick, wasn't seeing a reflection, was he?

Nrv4evr

July 26th, 2004, 3:52 pm

I didn't really have the time to read 38+ pages, so forgive me if I'm posting an already formulated theory.

Slight spoiler warning:

Having just read the official site, some interesting things have come up. The biggest being the significance of HBP to the series. Rowling has said that HBP is basically an overall story of the present plot, with revelations to unsolved questions in ALL the books. The connection between Chamber and HBP has nothing to do with the actual person, rather, it's just a little discovery Harry made in Chamber that foreshadows a big event in HBP.

So, I think it opens up a whole new way of thinking for us, and perhaps new clues will turn up. Good will hunting, guys, and godspeed. :p

Again, I apologize if anyone else has already come across this theory, I tried search but I can only search for threads, not posts within threads.

Nrv4evr

July 26th, 2004, 3:53 pm

If you read the website at jkrowling.com, she pretty much told us that Tom is not the HBP.

SiriusBlack22

July 26th, 2004, 4:01 pm

Isn't it obvious that the reason it's key to the series is because Tom Riddle was a big part in it; He is the HBP; He will come back and turn into LV once again. That would be why she wanted to call CoS HBP...

PS/SS and HBP are the only titles w/o an 'of'

wavy

July 26th, 2004, 4:07 pm

If you read the website at jkrowling.com, she pretty much told us that Tom is not the HBP.

Not true. Unless something has changed in the last couple weeks, she said it wasn't Harry or Voldemort. Who's to say that rules out Tom Riddle?

We got a lot about Tom Riddle in COS but she left out how exactly Tom Riddle became Voldemort. Was it as simple as telling folks - "uh, guys, I'm going to go by Voldemort now, so if you call me Tom, I won't answer you" - or was it something more involved, like a transformation. If so, the HBP could have been Riddle prior to the transformation.

I'm with SiriusBlack22 on this. I think that is exactly right.

GreenEyedGoddes

July 26th, 2004, 4:07 pm

Sorry I have not read through this whole thread, if I say something that has been said many times before (in the words of brian Adams) "Please forgive me, I know not what I do, Please forgive me I can't stope lov'n you..." Um sorry. Yeah any way.

Cos is by far my least favorite book. It has always felt different then the others in the series whenever I deside to read it. So I wasn't at all surpised that it holds alot of the keys to the sereis. Some of the keys are fairly obvious.

1. Introduction to the bigotry inside the wizarding world towards "mudbloods" and such.
2. House elves make their first appearance.
3. Harry goes to the Burrow for the first time.
3. Tom Riddle comes into play.
4. We meet Fudge and hear of Azkaban.

But other things also may be very important that we only glanced but didn't here about again.

1. Knockturn Alley. (Even if the hand of glory doesn't come into play I pretty sure the Alley it's self will.
2. The Granger's. Are first and as of yet only meeting with Hermione's parents.
3. The creepy spider thing, and the flying car.

So those are the clues :D. Can't wait to see which ones are right.

skistar123

July 26th, 2004, 6:04 pm

JKR said about a discovery in the chamber of secrets which will link to a discovery in book 6.
He discoveres that Tom Riddle aka Voldemort was the Heir of Slytherin- the last decendant of Slytherin (is that right?). Maybe in book 6 he discovers that he's the Heir of Gryffindor.
I think that maybe there's a possibility that Gryffindor and Slytherin, when they had their argument, tried to destroy one another. Maybe it is Harry and Voldemort's job to finish of this battle.
Rather than being a battle just between these two, it has become something that everyone feels involved in.

1. Introduction to the bigotry inside the wizarding world towards "mudbloods" and such.
2. House elves make their first appearance.
3. Harry goes to the Burrow for the first time.
3. Tom Riddle comes into play.
4. We meet Fudge and hear of Azkaban.

But other things also may be very important that we only glanced but didn't here about again.

1. Knockturn Alley. (Even if the hand of glory doesn't come into play I pretty sure the Alley it's self will.
2. The Granger's. Are first and as of yet only meeting with Hermione's parents.
3. The creepy spider thing, and the flying car.

Although i agree with what you are saying, in my opinion, alot of this is general things about the wizarding world that are being introduced to us. It is only the second book so we still don't know as much and i think JKR was just trying to inform us.

I don't agree with what you have said about the Grangers, i recently read the fifth book and Mr Weasley is seen talking to the Grangers at the end of the book.

We met Fudge and heard of Azkaban in book 2 as a preparation for book 3, likewise we 'met' Sirius in book 1 to prepare us for book 3.

It is possible that that is what Knockturnalley is doing in the second book and i think we should expect to hear about it again.

rjade829

July 26th, 2004, 6:11 pm

Not true. Unless something has changed in the last couple weeks, she said it wasn't Harry or Voldemort. Who's to say that rules out Tom Riddle?

Well she updated her FAQ today, and made it pretty clear that Tom Riddle is not the HBP.

wavy

July 26th, 2004, 6:28 pm

Not true. Unless something has changed in the last couple weeks, she said it wasn't Harry or Voldemort. Who's to say that rules out Tom Riddle?

DOH!! Wouldn't you know it. Foiled again! :grumble: :p

Well, at least Mark Evans is out, too and we don't have to speculate about that any more.

ComicBookWorm

July 27th, 2004, 1:25 am

But something Harry discovered in CoS will lead to the HBP. So what is that? The hat, the sword, the Hand of Glory?

bem5449

July 27th, 2004, 1:39 am

The thing I saw as most important is dumbledore telling harry that Voldemort had transfered some of his powers to him. Quote

"Voldemort put a bit of himself in me?" said Harry said, thunderstruck.

"It certainly seems so" Dumbledore

ComicBookWorm

July 27th, 2004, 1:47 am

JDR237

July 27th, 2004, 2:03 am

The hand of glory is a good possibility as far as being important in book 6. I think that the Malvoy's secret passage under the drawing room and the valuable dark magic items within may be too. I still don't understand how folks are suggesting Tom Riddle is the HBP...He IS Voldemort, they're the same person...all Riddle did was change his name when he became the dark lord. Snape has a secret too, love potions were mentioned and isn't there something JKR said in an interview about him and a romance. By the way, he's probably a vampire, the Chamber of Secrets is where he was referred too as swooping down on a group of students like a bat.

H4V0K

July 27th, 2004, 2:32 am

what is the hand of glory

ComicBookWorm

July 27th, 2004, 2:48 am

Essbee

July 27th, 2004, 10:07 am

The way I interpret JK's latest hint, I think it means that Harry discovers something in CoS that will affect something in the storyline in book six, but not something to do with the HBP himself - another plot in the book, so-to-speak.

So we're left with, I think:
1. Hermione turning into a cat using the polyjuice potion. This could be foreshadowing Mrs Norris (though I doubt it) or Hermione or someone else becoming an animagi. Or something about Crookshanks or one of Mrs Figg's cats.
2. Hagrid in Knockturn Alley
3. An object that appears in this book that will come back, i.e. Godric's sword, Riddle's school things, the Chamber, the hand of glory...

Shadowed Sphinx

July 27th, 2004, 3:12 pm

I don't know! Harry also finds out about Aragog! I have been thinking and I really think it is some thing to do with the sword though!

Ginevra Molly

July 27th, 2004, 3:16 pm

Counting on JK, the thing that Harry found in the chamber will be something that none of us would have thought would have any significance. The only think I think would, would be Godric's sword. But I'm not making any predicitions...

Dachs

July 27th, 2004, 3:17 pm

I think it's the sword, and Dumbledore's saying that only a true Gryffindor could've pulled that out of the hat.

Tonks04

July 27th, 2004, 4:23 pm

I think Fawkes coming to Harry and the sword.

Mumps

July 27th, 2004, 4:31 pm

The only think I think would, would be Godric's sword
I agree, we have been reminded about time-turners in book 5 and also, at one of the DA meetings about "the sword" in Dumbledore's office.

I don't think the hand of glory is a likely one, but maybe.
I think from the wording on JKR's web site is that it's something he finds in the actual chamber (I could be wrog though). The only things he finds in the chamber are:
Ginny
Diary
Tom Riddle [Memory]
Basilisk
Salizar Slytherin statue
Godric Gryffindor's sword
He knew about the Basilisk (Hermione's note) and Ginny (writing on the wall), so he was expecting to find those. The diary was destroyed, as was the Tom Riddle memory. Which leaves the statue and the sword. I think the sword is more likely...and we were reminded of it in OotP.

roseweary

July 27th, 2004, 4:39 pm

JKR said something Harry discovered in the Chamber foreshadows the events of HBP.

FIRST IDEA:
In the Chamber of Secrets, Harry discovered that revenge against Harry has become the most important thing to Riddle/Voldemort. To quote: "Haven't I already told you... that killing mudbloods doesn't matter to me anymore? For many months now, my new target has been - you."

This is perhaps very obvious, but this seems to clearly foreshadow things to come when Voldemort regains power.

SECOND IDEA:
The passage where Riddle explains his... Mmm "relationship" ... with Ginny is interesting. "I was patient. I was kind. Ginny simply *loved* me.... I've always been able to charm the people I needed.... I grew stronger on a diet of her... fears, her darkest secrets... Powerful enough to start feeding Miss Weasley a few of *my* secrets, to start pouring a little of my soul into *her*..."

This discovery of how R/V works could also foreshadow events to come. Maybe we won't see an all-out war as it seemed happened last time. Maybe this time R/V will try to sieze power through politics.

THIRD IDEA:

As many others have said that the fact that Harry and R/V are very similar and that the only difference between them are the choices they make. This could be the big discovery that foreshadows book 6.

codswallop

July 28th, 2004, 12:33 am

I have a theory (a bit far fetched) about the events in the chamber.

LV's dad deserted LV mother because she was a witch. The Riddle's were snobby muggles who hated magic. Ironic to the Pure-blood's view of muggles. Maybe that is why Petunia has not been honest with Vernon, due to his attitude towards her sister? (I soooo want Petunia to be a witch)

story

July 28th, 2004, 1:02 pm

Could Riddle be stating a fact. Through fear he is able to make himself, Voldemort, grow stronger, and in turn corrupt the minds of those around him who are afraid - wormtail for instance. Is this some sort of spell or charm he has cast?

Is Harry perhaps able to do the opposite, and make those around him less afraid, more caring, etc. Is this a power his mother had, that she too could charm people , but not in the way Voldemort would?

Nagisa

July 28th, 2004, 5:19 pm

I've been thinking about how there are supposed to be clues hidden throughout the second book as I've been rereading it. Rowling seems to think that we'll never get it, so it must be something obscure. At the same time, it was probably in the movies -- she would've insisted. Here are three very obscure details:

One thing that occured to me was Nearly-Headless Nick and the Headless Hunt. The hunt is run by a guy named Sir Patrick Delaney-Podmore, possibly related to Sturgis Podmore. The reason I don't think this is another Mark Evans is because they went out of their way to mention his name and his connection to Nick in the movie. I mean, they cut out the whole Deathday Party, but they still hired John Cleese to do the scene, deliver his few lines, and got the special effects team to animate him. why bother. What's so important about the Headless Hunt?

Another minor detail is in the book, not the movie -- ghouls sure come up a lot. We discover that the Weasleys have a pet ghoul, Lockhart claims to have defeated a ghoul by squeezing it through a tea-strainer, and Hermione is about to launch into an explanation of shapeshifting Chameleon Ghouls when Ron cuts her off.

The third thing I noticed was something called the Homorphus Charm. I would never have picked up on it before I found out about Lupin. It's a charm that lifts the curse of the werewolf, which Lockhart claims to have used in Weekend with a Werewolf. Now, Lockhart's a fraud, but he's supposed to have stolen his stories from other wizards, so there may be an old wizard somewhere who knows how to cure werewolves. Can't remember if this is in the movie.

No one would notice any of these things unless they were looking for them.