Book Five Predictions: Who Will Fall in Love with Whom?

I don't quite understand what you're trying to get across, dep999.

Originally posted by Ame:
I reconginize that statement as well. But wasn't that statement directed towards book 4? Perhaps I'm wrong. Someone correct me if I am. But I personally have always taken it as:
Hermione and Krum... NOPE!

Harry and Cho... Sorry Harry... NO WAY.

As for Ginny and Harry maybe that is wrong. I'm still so up in the air with this pairing. I'll be thankful when June 21st gets here...


Ame, I think you are probably right, but, in book 4, Hermione wasn´t really in love with Krum, and Ron was only in love with Fleur because she was part veela. And Ginny is definately in love with Harry, lol :)

Originally posted by allanronald127
Ame, I think you are probably right, but, in book 4, Hermione wasn´t really in love with Krum, and Ron was only in love with Fleur because she was part veela. And Ginny is definately in love with Harry, lol


Yeah, I suppose Ginny is the only one in love... but I use the term 'love' loosely with a group of 13 and 14 years olds.

Anyway, I had said earlier in this thread that I wouldn't be surprised if Neville developed some crush on Ginny. I think it would be hilariously cute in that I highly doubt Ginny would return any of the affection towards him. But of course she wouldn't be brutal when letting him down.

I think is important that Ginny is Hermione's girl best friend. Their friendship is bigger in each book. Ginny is the only person who know she will go to the ball with Krum. I think Hermione in geting into that age when girls need to speak with another girl. So probably if Hermione and Ron become more than friends, she will do what she can for Harry ans Ginny to end together.

After staying at the Dursleys for a while, Harry would spend the rest of the summer at the Burrow (Weasleys' home) as was mentioned in the latter part of Book 4. Ginny and Harry would then have an opportunity to get to know each other better there.

atleast I hope we all can say one thing

Ron and Ginny won't get togather :lol:

Yes. At least that!;D ;D

Originally posted by dep999
atleast I hope we all can say one thing

Ron and Ginny won't get togather :lol:

That's for sure, and I'm willing to bet on it. :D

never count anything out JKR could find a way

Maybe Ginny being Harry's little sister adoted by Weaslys?

Originally posted by dep999
never count anything out JKR could find a way

Yeah. ;) Like we find out that several years ago, Mr. & Mrs. Weasley had 6 boys and were so frustrated that they can't have a baby girl. So they adopted one - red-haired and freckled, too of course. And since Ron and Ginny are not really related, he and Ginny could get together.

What are you people talking about?! Ginny with Ron?? Where did this theory come into effect????

Ginny was not adopted, it doesn't seem as likely...

Originally posted by min
I think is important that Ginny is Hermione's girl best friend. Their friendship is bigger in each book. Ginny is the only person who know she will go to the ball with Krum. I think Hermione in geting into that age when girls need to speak with another girl. So probably if Hermione and Ron become more than friends, she will do what she can for Harry ans Ginny to end together.

Why would Hermione do that? She's not the type to play matchmaker with her friends.

PS: Grammar, min, grammar.

The arguments made on all sides are interesting, but a bit irrelevant because book 5 is written. What’s going to happen will happen. People are trying to pin certain characters down with personality quirks, to pin them down within a certain spire; I think it’s a somewhat misplaced to do that. Ginny may have hero-worshipped Harry in the past; however, it may not be so in the future. These characters aren’t stagnant. They’re ever-changing because of aging and the situations that are placed in front of them. Experience and maturity changes people.

I had to pop into this thread again; it seems to be the most popular and impassioned debate going on. And why not? In today’s world, it seems a person’s worth is defined by falling in love, being loved by someone, anyone. Being with someone seems to be the be all and end all. At least, that’s what Hollywood would have us think. You have the American Pie movies, for example, which define a loser as one who is a virgin and the winners are those who have sex. That is the message of love we have in this day and age. We have reality dating shows in which male (or female) suitors compete for the affection of one. Of course, genuine love has nothing to do with these shows. It’s all about narcissism; it’s all about being on tv; it’s all about ‘winning’ a contest. You even have a movie like The Matrix, something I thought came very close to being a decent story; at last, Hollywood almost made something viewable, but in the end, it all came down to ‘love’ saving the hero. Then there’s Titanic, a movie very popular with young teenagers, that glorifies premarital sex. You know, sometimes I just throw up my hands; I get fed up.

True relationships cannot be that plastic, that contrived, the way Hollywood and network tv would have you think. True love is patient, humble, and kind; it’s certainly not boastful, it’s not about ‘winning.’ I have no doubt that whatever JKR plans to do with these characters, it will be treated with care and handled sincerely. True love isn’t built on demi-god heroism or hyper intense moments; it many times comes at the quietest moments, the most surprising moments. Love is not arranged by fabricated situations; it’s built on shared experiences, trials, small moments of kindness, and of course sacrifice.

Furthermore, love isn’t the be all and end all of emotion. There are other sorts of relationships, you know. You don’t see a lot of movies or tv shows in which the lead female and male are just good friends. Harry isn’t a ‘loser’ if he doesn’t ‘end up’ with Hermione; it just means they have a different kind relationship.

Loving someone doesn’t mean you have to be in love with that person.

That was really nice, Robfather.

People were saying earlier that JKR has deliberately hidden Ginny in the background as a future plot device.
I wonder if the same could be true to a lesser extent of Hermione.
We do know alot about her character and values but there's a lot about her thoughts and emotions that are in the murk. As IIeyki put it, her feelings for the boys are baffling.

People convinced the romance is already happening don't agree but I maintain that quite a lot of the fighting with Ron in GOF was to do with Hermione thinking through new ideas occurring to her rather than because of a crush.
I realise there's a certain tension created when one person knows the other person will drop in a line to deliberately tease and provoke and is therefore on edge to respond. But if you read the Dark Mark chapter, for instance, Hermione is simply furious about the treatment of Winky and Ron is simply saying things that reflect a different point of view and they clash. He is not saying things to get a rise out of her.
As to the physical side, it's clear Hermione doesn't mind touching both boys - there are numerous examples of her doing so - it was only Ron who felt awkward about Hermione hugging him in POA.

Hermione's maturing and developing quickly, which we only get glimpses of in GOF. In the first book the person she most resembles is Percy. In GOF they argue over Winky and JKR has a little passage in which she says Percy was taken aback because Hermione had always got on fairly well with Percy "better, indeed, than any of the others". It's just a subtle pointer to the fact that Hermione has grown in different ways.
It is almost as though the adventure she goes on with Harry at the end of POA will turn out to have been very important in terms of building her confidence, putting her skills to practical use. There was that comment by the fake Moody in GOF that she should think about a career as an Auror: "Mind works the right way."
We know very little about her background apart from the fact that her parents are Muggle dentists and they are well off enough to go abroad in summer.

The reason why I mention all this is that there's an obvious, serious plot development involving Hermione which is ripe to explode (maybe on June 21!). It involves Voldemort, the Malfoys, Mudbloods and Hermione in danger.
The polyjuice potion was dealt with in a fairly lighthearted way in COS and then became a major plot point in GOF. The Mudblood theme was introduced in COS and then came back into the picture as soon as Lucius Malfoy loomed into view in GOF. "Mr Malfoy's eyes had returned to Hermione, who went slightly pink, but stared determindly back at him. Harry knew exactly what was making Mr Malfoy's lip curl... they considered anyone of Muggle decent, like Hermione, second class."
Later Draco makes a point of saying that Hermione would be in trouble if the Death Eaters got hold of her. We later get Rita Skeeter's articles about her Muggle heritage. At the end of GOF Malfoy is back with Voldemort as his faithful Death Eater.
Surely there's a real chance they will try to get to Harry through Hermione.
If they do it could combine with the old "raging hormones" and Ron's jealous streak into one huge plot/relationship twist.
Hermione, don't go to Bulgaria!

Originally posted by Turambar
Hermione, don't go to Bulgaria!

Yeah, Hermione and Krum (otherwise known as 'crumb') shouldn't be together, but JK put them together for a reason ...

... to show that they started to have interest towards the opposite sex.. It's normal.

... to show that they started to have interest towards the opposite sex.. It's normal.

too true. and not just krum. there's fleur and of course cho chang. haha! i don't know why but im so sure harry won't end up with her!!!! :clappy:

Originally posted by Ash_Key
... to show that they started to have interest towards the opposite sex.. It's normal.

Naaah, thats not it. It was to **** off Ron :D

Naaah, thats not it. It was to **** off Ron

oh yeah! of course that's a reason. i almost forgot.

QUOTE]Originally posted by snitch14
What are you people talking about?! Ginny with Ron?? Where did this theory come into effect????

Ginny was not adopted, it doesn't seem as likely... [/QUOTE]


Of course, Ginny's not adopted. We were just joking around. :)

but come to think of it.. what if ginny really is adopted? and ron ends up with her?
eeew. freaky.

Sorry, Max, i know my grammar is awful. All i can say is that i'm from Spain. I left the school a lot of years ago and i have not time to study grammar again.

Have you seen that when a girl date with a boy a lot of times her best friend date with her boybriend's best friend?

Sorry, Max, i know my grammar is awful. All i can say is that i'm from Spain. I left the school a lot of years ago and i have not time to study grammar again.


Originally posted by min

Why would Hermione do that? She's not the type to play matchmaker with her friends.


Have you seen that when a girl date with a boy a lot of times her best friend date with her boybriend's best friend?

Originally posted by Max
Sorry, Max, i know my grammar is awful. All i can say is that i'm from Spain. I left the school a lot of years ago and i have not time to study grammar again.:sigh:



Have you seen that when a girl date with a boy a lot of times her best friend date with her boybriend's best friend?

What? :??:

Nothing. Best forget it. I musn't try to write when i'm slept.

Min try not to double post the mods dont like it...If you need to add something press EDIT it is near the top of your post just click there and you will be able to EDIT!!:D

I posted a bit earlier my personal desire to see Ron and Hermione get together. I just think that JKR has set things up for this. But, I also agree with those who think that other choices are possible. With literature there are many different interpretations possible. We'll just have to wait and see how everything pans out. Whoever ends up with whomever, I'm sure I won't be disappointed.

Whoever ends up with whomever, I'm sure I won't be disappointed.
hope it doesn't really disappoint readers with these romance stuff jkr is going to write.

snowangel, i also want to see ron and hermione together because i know that if hermione ends up with harry, ron will be devastated! you've seen it all in gof. he freaked out when hermione went to the ball with krum and if you were ron, and you just found out your bestfriend has the hots for the girl of your dreams, won't you freak out?! i mean, i would!

:angry:

it would definitely ruin harry and ron's friendship!
honestly, id rather see harry, ron and hermione end up with other people than see them ruin their friendship just for falling with one another.

I think the majority of people hope Ron will end up with Hermione. And that's what I think will happen. On the contrary, JKr might play with us a bit. Maybe put Hermione with someone else, to **** Ron off. Maybe even with Harry to make Ron seem like a pain, and also make Harry seem like a pain. So that'll make us more anxious in a way. In the end, Hermione ends up with Ron. That's what I'm predicting.

hey, i was wonering...do u reckon hermione & percy could get together?? i know there's a bit of an age difference but they both seem so similar in personality. i think it'd be an interesting twist!

it won't happen

hey, i was wonering...do u reckon hermione & percy could get together?? i know there's a bit of an age difference but they both seem so similar in personality. i think it'd be an interesting twist!
no hard feelings but the idea just freaks me out. ron's bawling with percy will reach an all time high! talk about sibling rivalry.

Snaperules, here's a tip. If you write small posts like it without giving a reason, you lower your chances of getting into Hogsmeade.

I used to think that queengumby. It could happen but I doubt. For one thing about the age difference, Viktor was about Percy's age and they were together. But I think it'll be Ron. Percy already has a girlfriend, and he never minds Hermione. And Hermione seems to like Ron, and she hardly notices Percy. So if it did happen, it'd be a defenit twist.

yeah, twist is the word and i agree with sirius. it's just got to be ron and hermione. and percy has penelope.
but what the hell happened to penelope? i really want to know. is she still there or did she just vanished from percy? i kinda like her character. she likes percy even if he is a bit pain in the ***. kinda sweet if you ask me. :)

Actually, I wonder why people like Ron and Hermione so much. I mean, Ron likes Hermione, but JK could use that for many many purposes. It's like a stick of dynamite ready to explode any minute. And when JK lights the fuse, who knows what will happen.

ron is a wacko and hermione is just so ron's opposite. opposites attract. you know that stuff. besides, they fight a lot. they fight like they're married. maybe that's why a lot of people like them both.
about the dynamite thingy, you're right there max. maybe jkr wrote about ron's affection for hermione to develop new angsty stuff for the future books. we might not know, maybe harry likes hermione and that's one thing that would explode between the threesome. imagine that. your bestfriend falling for your flame. i smell riot. but i keep my fingers crossed that none of that's going to happen between them.:p

I am hoping JK introduces more kids Harry and Company's age to spice things up like she did with Krum. It puts a new twist on things which is more like real life than just fictional life.

At this point I do see Ron and Hermione together at least for a little while.

I bet that we'll see some students from Beauxbatons and Durmstrang (and possibly the Salem Witchcraft Institute) in the future.

Some thoughts:

1) It's interesting that people tend to see Hermione's relationships through the viewpoint of a) what it means for someone else e.g if H/Hr happens what about poor Ron or b) what's best for the whole e.g. R/Hr + H/G = one big family.
What about considering it more from her point of view. Unrequited love already seems a theme in the books, who's to say it won't happen to Ron?
By the end of book 4 she knows for sure she has one guy interested in her, who has told her that no-one else has interested him as much; she has probably noted that Ron's interest in her has revved a gear; and possibly she's aware of a few changes in her relationship with Harry.
She's got some options.

2) People love saying opposites attract but when you look at successful long-term relationships there's usually some common values and viewpoints involved.
It's interesting that in GOF it is Harry who raises the house elf issue which is then carried on by Hermione.
It is Harry who really loses his rag over Rita's outing of Hagrid and then Hermione feeds off that anger and becomes passionate about it herself.
That is quite a curious bit of writing.
Ron is pretty quiet about it throughout because he has a conventional wizard's reservations about Hagrid's giant blood. Hermione is initially low key and Harry unusually provokes her. Normally he's pretty non-confrontational. He snaps at her the way he does in the POA time turning scenes and preparing for the first task in GOF.
"Look at this!" Harry snarled, and he shoved the Daily Prophet article under Hermione's nose.
Then later: "You do want him back?" he shot at Hermione. And: "I do want Hagrid back, of course I do," Hermione added hastily, quailing under Harry's furious stare.
Then after Harry publically challenges Rita in the pub, Hermione really fires up. And it comes after a quote from Rita where she twists her Hagrid target into a Hagrid/Harry target: "How about giving me an interview about the Hagrid you know ... your unlikely friendship ... would you call him a father substitute?" In other words a chance for Rita to have another go at Harry while writing again about Hagrid.
Hermione is effectively sticking up for both of them there. But it whole passage shows how intense the H/Hr relationship can get and also illustrates common ground between them.
Also it's subtely done but there's several occasions in GOF where JKR makes a point of showing that Harry has read Hermione's mind, to show them becoming more mentally in tune.

3) It's interesting how the Hermione/Krum relationship mirrors the Harry/Cho one. Hermione has at least some interest in Krum. We get descriptions of the physichal symptoms. When she talks about Krum inviting her to his home she "blushes scarlet" and when she talks about his feelings for her it says "Hermione was going so red now that Harry could almost feel the heat coming from her." She is also apparently flustered when Krum asks her for a chat at the end.
What's really so different between that and Harry stammering over Cho or some of Ron's behaviour towards Hermione.
People might say, she's embarrassed about talking about it with the boys and part of the attraction is probably flattery that a famous person has taken notice of her. But she actually commented on Krum being brave at the quidditch world cup and she was quite dismissive of Krum's library groupies.
My point is that if the H/C and Hr/K relationships can be dismissed as temporary attractions (which they usually are and I agree) all that can really be taken from the R/Hr relationship in GOF is that Ron has a developing interest in Hermione but there's no guarantee it's returned.
By the end of GOF they appear to have jointly resolved not to talk about the awkwardness that happened between them and the relationship appears pretty normal. If she was interested why not raise the subject in a non-threatening way; why not at least kiss Ron on the cheek goodbye to encourage him?
Some people point to the scene where Ron asks Krum for his autograph and "Hermione turned away, smiling at the horseless carriages" as some sort of sign that she likes him.
But is she smiling at what's going on or what Krum has said to her in private? What if she's smiling at the fact that Ron has been able to overcome his jealousy enough to ask for the autograph. Is that necessarily good news for Ron? It could mean afterall that Hermione now feels Ron would be more accepting of a relationship between herself and Krum. He'd get over it.
One more point re K/H/Hr. When Ron accuses Krum of just asking Hermione to the ball to get info on Harry (what a prat, honestly!) Hermione answers "for your information, he hasn't asked me one single thing about Harry, not one." The when Krum talks to Harry about Hermione he says she "talks about you very often".
This means a) she is bringing up the subject of Harry with a guy she is actually interested in and b) she's not talking about the guy she's supposedly mad keen about.
I think all these attactions are temporary. The lake task chapter was really the writing on the wall for H/C and Hr/K. It's a matter of them realising that the other meant more to them than the person they are attracted to at the moment. The only relationship that has a chance of being long-term is Harry/Hermione.

4) Is it just me or are Bill and Charlie easily the most interesting Weasley's? I hope they get bigger parts in the next books.

5) This is totally off-topic but did anyone else notice that when Karkaroff meets Harry for the first time he seems to know who he is before he sees the scar? I wonder if this means he's had some run in with James Potter previously and saw the likeness first.

Originally posted by too_wicked
yeah, twist is the word and i agree with sirius. it's just got to be ron and hermione. and percy has penelope.
but what the hell happened to penelope? i really want to know. is she still there or did she just vanished from percy? i kinda like her character. she likes percy even if he is a bit pain in the ***. kinda sweet if you ask me. :) I believe Penelope graduated after Prizoner of Azkaban the same as Percy.

Originally posted by The Robfather
Furthermore, love isn’t the be all and end all of emotion. There are other sorts of relationships, you know. You don’t see a lot of movies or tv shows in which the lead female and male are just good friends. Harry isn’t a ‘loser’ if he doesn’t ‘end up’ with Hermione; it just means they have a different kind relationship.

Loving someone doesn’t mean you have to be in love with that person.

I totally agree! We can't force two people to be together just because we think they would match or look nice together (except in the case of arranged marriages in some cultures, of course). More importantly, nobody can force them to fall in love with each other. That would be up to the couple and attraction definitely plays a part -- viewing the other as a potential romantic partner or a mate and not just as a friend. I don't think that Harry and Hermione are attracted, or going to be attracted, to each other but that should be alright. At least, they love each other as friends. A good platonic, "just friends" relationship like what JK Rowling says Harry and Hermione have, isn't a bad thing to have at all.

Another great post, Turambar :tu:

You brought up some valid and interesting points there. I noticed that JKR wrote that Hermione talks about Harry a lot. Is it possible that Hermione has a crush on Harry but doesn't want to jeapordize their friendship?

I notice that a lot of people dismiss the possibility of H/Hr because it's too cliche. Personally, I see that as rubbish. Why not allow H/Hr to have their own relationship and see how it works out? Besides, Harry never really felt love before; he needs someone who understands him for who he is, and to me, that person is Hermione.

Even though Harry/Hermoine would be the perfect, classic couple, it's not happening.

I just don't see Hermoine and Harry together. They don't seem to click. For Hermoine and Ron, it's perfect, because opposites attract. I guess you could say that Hermoine and Harry are alike because they are both smart and opinionated and all that, and so they have alot in common, and yeah, I guess you could build a relationship on that. But somehow, that just doesn't work for me.

Ron clearly likes Hermoine, regardless of whether or not he shows it. At the Yule Ball, Ron is jealous of Krum. He says that Hermoine shouldn't attend the ball with Krum because Krum is Harry's enemy in the tournament, but it's clear that he's using that as an excuse. So then why didn't he ask her to the ball? Well, that's pretty obvious. He's just too shy and embarassed to ask her himself. :o

Originally posted by bekki791
Even though Harry/Hermoine would be the perfect, classic couple, it's not happening.

I just don't see Hermoine and Harry together. They don't seem to click. For Hermoine and Ron, it's perfect, because opposites attract. I guess you could say that Hermoine and Harry are alike because they are both smart and opinionated and all that, and so they have alot in common, and yeah, I guess you could build a relationship on that. But somehow, that just doesn't work for me.

Ron clearly likes Hermoine, regardless of whether or not he shows it. At the Yule Ball, Ron is jealous of Krum. He says that Hermoine shouldn't attend the ball with Krum because Krum is Harry's enemy in the tournament, but it's clear that he's using that as an excuse. So then why didn't he ask her to the ball? Well, that's pretty obvious. He's just too shy and embarassed to ask her himself. :o

Opposites attract? Not necessarily.

It's obvious that Ron likes Hermione, but does Hermione like Ron? I don't think so.

But Hermoine does like Ron. Remember what she said when they were arguing after the Yule Ball? She asked Ron why he didn't ask her to the ball. Now, that could just be a comeback. But I see it as a proposal.

Originally posted by bekki791
But Hermoine does like Ron. Remember what she said when they were arguing after the Yule Ball? She asked Ron why he didn't ask her to the ball. Now, that could just be a comeback. But I see it as a proposal.

Not to be rude but you make it sound like you are wishing that it would be true. But I dont think Hermione likelikes Ron right now. I think she is still confused about the whole process, and I think she has to sort out her feelings for Ron,Harry and Krum. She seems interasted in all three boys, so she has to sort out her feelings and find who she truly likes. And also even if she did have more feelings for Ron, Ron would not admit it he also will probably be to shy to ask her out...he might ask others because they are not his bestfriend and the girl he likes it might be easier for him to ask someone else out also. I think they both need to admit they like each other or they should sort out there feelings and see were that leads them.


She asked Ron why he didn't ask her to the ball. Now, that could just be a comeback. But I see it as a proposal.

I think she was just using that because he was using her and Ginny as a last option because they both got rejected...that probably ****** her off so she got mad at him...and wouldnt you?? Thats just what I think you can still think that but I think you should first read Turambar post it explains alot what Im trying to say but Turambar put it in much better words:D

I do want Hermoine and Ron to be together for a lot of reasons. A big one is that Ron usually is left in Harry's dust; Harry is famous and a hero, great at Quidditch, and is now the Triwizard Champion. Ron is none of these; he is the youngest boy in the family and has a lot to live up to. If Harry got Hermoine when Ron is showing so clearly (or what I think is so clearly) that he likes her, that would be one more thing that Harry has over Ron (not that Harry ever shoves his accomplishments in Ron's face--he doesn't.)


But I dont think Hermione likelikes Ron right now. I think she is still confused about the whole process, and I think she has to sort out her feelings for Ron,Harry and Krum. She seems interasted in all three boys, so she has to sort out her feelings and find who she truly likes.

That is completely true. Obviously, right now Hermoine is with Krum. I do think that that one won't work out, mainly because they live in separate countries. But she can't get with Ron or Harry until she decides whether or not she wants Krum. If she chooses Krum over Ron, I know for a fact that he would be devastated, and would be furious with Hermoine. I still don't think that Hermoine likelikes Harry. That kiss at the end of the fourth book proved it; usually you are at least a little nervous around your crush, but Hermoine was comfortable enough around Harry to kiss him.

The last thing I want to do is offend anyone, but I just can't see Hermoine and Harry together. I'm not even quite sure why. I just have this feeling....

[i]Originally posted by bekki791 [QUOTE][i]
I do want Hermoine and Ron to be together for a lot of reasons. A big one is that Ron usually is left in Harry's dust; Harry is famous and a hero, great at Quidditch, and is now the Triwizard Champion. Ron is none of these; he is the youngest boy in the family and has a lot to live up to. If Harry got Hermoine when Ron is showing so clearly (or what I think is so clearly) that he likes her, that would be one more thing that Harry has over Ron (not that Harry ever shoves his accomplishments in Ron's face--he doesn't.)

Your right Ron is always left in Harrys dust...he should his true jelousy in GoF and Hermione tried to comfort both, Ron has to live up for to alot...he is the youngest boy and he as alot to live up for: Bill was head boy...Charlie was a great Qudditch player...Percy was head boy prefect and just plain perfect!!....Geogre and Fred are hilarous...Ron has to live up to soo many people he has to be great at everything because of his brothers before him...it isnt as hard for Ginny because she is the only girl so she dosent really have to live up to her brothers standerds...[i]
If Harry got Hermoine when Ron is showing so clearly (or what I think is so clearly) that he likes her, that would be one more thing that Harry has over Ron (not that Harry ever shoves his accomplishments in Ron's face--he doesn't.)

Your right Ron might get furious and do something he would regret in the future...it is obvouis he likes her but he is to shy to ask her out...and Harry seems to not really care so...i dunno...Also Ron might think Harry rubs it in but he dosent Harry would probably give anything to be a normal kid...

>>Opposites attract? Not necessarily.

Yes, opposites don't always attract but in Ron and Hermione's case, it's one of those many cases where opposites do attract. My parents are good examples of this as well. My dad is quiet, practical, a bit pessimistic. My mom is talkative, a daydreamer and optimistic. There were some adjustments to make at the beginning of their relationship but now it is smooth-sailing. They've been together for 30 years now. The most important thing is they're in love with each other and so they're willing to accept each other's differences and became more mature in the process. Another good thing when opposites attract is that they complement each other. What one lacks, the other makes up for it.

>>It's obvious that Ron likes Hermione, but does Hermione like Ron? I don't think so.

I think Hermione may like Ron, too but that she hasn't been as obvious as Ron in revealing her feelings. There are some parts in Goblet of Fire that may show her feelings, though like in the following:

Hermione: "Just because it's taken you three years to notice, Ron, doesn't mean no one else has spotted I'm a girl!"
"Next time there's a ball, ask me before someone else does, and not as a last resort!"

And remember when Fleur kissed Ron and Hermione was furious?

Interviews with JK Rowling revealing clues regarding Ron and Hermione's relationship:

From Oct 1999 National Press Club Author's Luncheon
Question: Do Harry and Hermione have a date?
JKR. "No. They're very platonic friends. But I won't answer for anyone else! Nudge nudge, wink wink."
-->Who else can this be but Hermione and Ron? It couldn't be Harry and Ron, right? :-P

From Barnes and Noble Chat (Oct 20, 2000):
Question: Is it just me, or was something going on between Ron and Hermione during the last half of Goblet of Fire? I love your books, by the way, and two of them I've read straight through cover to cover in under 24 hours.
JKR: "Well done on the reading speed! yes, something's "going on," but Ron doesn't realize it yet. Typical boy."
-->Something's "going on" between Ron and Hermione but only Hermione has noticed it. Ron hasn't noticed it before but in Goblet of Fire, it looks like he finally started to notice it and now he sees Hermione as a girl.

Barnes and Noble Chat October 20, 2000
Will Ron ever get a girlfriend?
I'm laughing again.... Why wouldn't he?! Though he's not doing too well at the moment, is he? But then, Fleur Delacour was really aiming a bit high.
-->So Ron would very likely have a girlfriend in the future. Who else can this be besides Hermione? We know that Fleur would be impossible. There could be a new girl but I doubt that it would be her.

Sydney Morning Herold Interview October 28, 2001
I want Harry Potter and his friends to grow up as well as older, though I'll keep it all humorous, well within the tone of the books. I want them eventually to be truly 17 and discover girlfriends and boyfriends and have sexual feelings - nothing too gritty. Why not allow them to have those feelings?
-->Rowling will keep the growing up process and romance angles humorous so I don't think there'd be a love triangle and resulting resentment or hostility between Harry and Ron. I think that if Ron and Hermione get together, it would indeed be humorous. Look at their interactions in Goblet of Fire particularly regarding the Yule Ball and Viktor Krum. I thought they were quite funny and amusing.

Cheers, Max!

I wonder if some people find it hard to get their heads around the idea of falling for someone you've been friends with for a fair while.
From personal experience it can happen when you decide at the start that the other person isn't your type and is just a friend so you sort of let your guard down a bit. Then as you get to know them you find more and more things to like and admire about them so it just seems to creep up on you. By the time you've woken up to the fact it's too late! With other relationships there's more obvious surface chemistry of course.
I may be completely wrong and it could be just because I want it to happen but I do see a few signs of this in GOF such as Harry's respect for how Hermione handles the Rita articles; the signs of more intensity in their relationship; reading her mind more; standing up for her against Malfoy, the way she really enjoys his successes. Then again when Snape threatens him with the truth potion he worries he might spill about his feelings for Cho, and that's after the lake task so he hasn't digested it yet.
Another thing I thought of was JKR has all these different types of relationship in the books: hero worship, little sister crush on brother's friend, unrequited love, a bit of lust with Fleur and Roger Davies, the stanger fantasy. There's another obvious one missing: the good girl attracted to the bad boy.
Trouble is Malfoy has really gone beyond just being a nasty git to being almost irredemably bad. Can she really bring him back from where he is at the end of GOF, gloating about Cedric's death?

i know 2 people that have been friends for years, and theyve been going out for 9 months now and are the one of the happiest couples ive seen!

as for 2 people hating each other to be attracted...

well its happened to me hehe *blush*

>>I wonder if some people find it hard to get their heads around the idea of falling for someone you've been friends with for a fair while.

As for me, falling for someone you've been friends with is not a problem at all. I think that your friendship would even strengthen your relationship if you get together. But then again, some friends do remain just friends and that's what Harry and Hermione are. I don't think they would be attracted to each other and I'm basing this on what Rowling said but if that ever happens in the future, then that wouldn't be a problem with me at all.

As for Ron and Hermione, they've got both friendship AND attraction/ chemistry going on for them. Maybe the attraction from Hermione's part is not yet that obvious as Ron's but you can sense it like when she got furious when Fleur kissed Ron, etc. Ron and Hermione are also friends. They have fun together even if it's just the two of them. They're also loyal to each other and defend each other.

Like I said, some friends become more than friends but some friends remain just friends.

Interesting posts since I was last here. Great ideas as usual Turambar. Before I start I want to say thanks to Max and others who had really nice things to say about my posts. It was sweet.:) Okay this post will also be long. I guess it might help if I start posting more often instead of waiting for when I have alot to say. Anyway to the discussion at hand.

(1) I have never made a secret of the fact that I pay little attention to all these JK interviews and quotes. My feeling is unless she'll tell me exactly how they'll get rid of Voldemort and whether or not Harry'll die in the end(only two things I really want to know), I see no point. That said alot of people still want to use these interviews as ironclad proof of a R/Hr coupling. However, to use lawyer speech, most of it is rather circumstantial evidence.

(2) Oh yes the famous "Harry and Hermione are strictly platonic but I won't speak for anyone else" quote. Unless I'm mistaken that quote was in 1999, upon the release of POA and again unless I'm mistaken, Harry started liking Cho in that book. So the anyone else could have been referring to them. Also, are Harry, Hermione and Ron the only characters in the series? Not speaking for anyone else could have been referring to Hermione dating Krum in GOF or maybe Fred or George will start dating someone. My point is she never exactly says that "no H/Hr won't happen but Hr/R will". People are assuming that's what she meant and you know what they say about making assumptions.

(b)Oh yes the quote of something going on between Ron and Hermione at the end of GOF. Bluemagic loves emphasising the word 'between'. However, that again doesn't say anything concrete to a future romantic relationship between the two. Something is going on between Ron and Hermione in GOF. Ron has started to see Hermione as a 'girl' and Hermione I'm almost positive is very aware of Ron's changing feelings for her(call it a woman's intuition:) ). The statement of Ron being a typical boy and not seeing that again is true. Ron isn't aware of exactly why he got on so stupidly about Hermione coming to the dance with Krum. He being a typical boy hasn't realised that his feelings for her have changed. Again, that is not a statement that in no way cements the R/Hr coupling.

(c)Okay so JK says Ron would get a girlfriend and that translates to R/Hr how? Is Hermione suddenly the only girl in Hogwarts? Ron did go to the dance with Padma and while she wanted to kill him the whole night(and one can hardly blame her), JK did make a point of mentioning her paying more attention to him after the second task. There's also Lavender and Parvati and while I think these pairs probably may not happen it just proves that that statement in no way says that R/Hr will happen. Besides Ron could work very well with any of these girls better than Harry ever could; based on the simple point I made once before. He's a typical teenage boy; a relationship with any of those girls would be like any typical 15yr olds having their first real relationship.

(d)Okay so JK says she wants to explore relationships with Harry and his friends and that somehow says that R/Hr will happen? All that statement suggests is that she is going to make them all grow up and get into relationships with the opposite sex. Honestly didn't we all know that was going to happen? Also I'll give that the whole R/Hr/K thing was funny at times, but there were times when Ron was rather childish and annoying. However, given his age that was pretty normal I guess.

Some people place so much emphasis on quotes made by JK and I honestly can't believe that a woman who is as secretive as she is would give anything away that easily. The woman is like the bloody CIA when it comes to the plotlines of these books. Honestly reading these quotes, JK simply strikes me as most authors in that she answers questions but never really gives anything away. It is a brilliant strategy. I mean what's the fun in letting people know what's to come.

(2) Okay not to be rude, but honestly people are still using that Ron should be with Hermione because Harry gets everything reasoning? Honestly do some of you realize how pathetic you'll make Ron sound? Oh poor, pathetic Ron, let him have Hermione because he really has nothing else in his otherwise pathetic life. People need to realize that whether or not R/Hr get together, they along with Harry will still be the same people. Meaning Ron will still have an inferiority complex and he will continue to be overshadowed by Harry and Hermione. I'm sure Ron will love that; his best friend who outshines him and his g/f who is smarter and more accomplished than him. Ron has issues within himself that he needs to work through. Also, people need to realize that the only way Ron being with Hermione is going to be some sort of victory over Harry is if Harry starts having feelings for Hermione himself. Oh and just for the sake of those who seem to have a mental block against the idea, I'll say it again. Yes Ron is poor and is outshined by his brothers and best friend(how tragic) but that in no way compares to Harry who has no parents, is physically and verbally abused by his only relatives, has to live with the knowledge that his parents were murdered and that he himself may die any day. Yes I could see how Ron has life so much harder and it's not like we the readers ever forget since he never stops whining about it.

(3)The people saying Hermione does like Ron; honestly I could almost see some of you stamping your foot "of course she does, why else would she say next time ask me first and not as a last resort". Oh yes that quote. Honestly I know how hard it is for us to be objective when we really want something to happen(you should have seen me arguing Felicity was better for Ben and not Noel). However, people need to look at this on an honest level. Your best friend states that he would rather go to the dance with someone who wasn't nice as long as she wasn't ugly. Then a few days later when he is turned down he turns to you and says "hey you're a girl"(four years after knowing you) like the idea is so foreign to him. Then when you inform him you already have a date, he scoffs at the idea(because after all who would ask you), and spends the entire dance brooding and pouting at you and your date. Then he proceeds to accuse you of everything from conspiring with your date against one of your best friends. We don't know what sparked the argument in the common room because Harry entered towards the end, but I'm willing to bet Ron said something to Hermione. Now combine all those previous factors and he says something else to you and you wouldn't explode? You wouldn't snap and inform Ron to next time not treat you as a last resort which is what he did? You as a girl with pride, would just say "oh well I don't like him that way, so whatever". Man, some of you are better than I am.

(4) I am so glad Turambar that you brought up the fact that Hermione mentioned in her argument with Ron(at the dance) that Krum never asked her about Harry. I think I mentioned that once myself. People need to remember that one thing JK specialises in alot; is attention to the subtle. Anything too obvious is usually that; too obvious. Everyone says "but look how Hermione scowled when Fleur kissed Ron". That she did; but I just find it interesting that everytime Fleur kissed Ron, JK made a point of having her kiss Harry too. Ron is jealous of Krum because he has Hermione's attentions and we have Krum jealous and suspicious of Harry for the same reason. JK spends so much time making Ron's feelings so obvious but chooses to end on Hermione kissing Harry. Something she has never had done and interestingly only does so after Krum talks to her and she comes back with an impassive look on her face. Krum the same person who strongly suspects that something is going on between her and Harry. What is the real purpose of Rita Skeeter? I mean it added a little comic relief and it let people know Hagrid was a giant but really what was her purpose? I mean even if she was there to be annoying, was the articles and comments about Harry and Hermione being a couple REALLY necessary? I mean honestly think about it; was it? Now we should know by now that JK never just places something for no reason. Just like our infamous kiss. So many use the" it was purely for friendship"excuse. Yes could be; but call me old-fashioned , I'm still confused as to why she didn't just hug him. I know when I've been through alot, what I crave more than anything is a hug not some kiss on the cheek.

Okay I really need to stop now. Again these are my views and I'll happily accept if I'm wrong. However, I can't understand how some people act like R/Hr is fact when Hermione has yet to show ANY signs of romantic affections towards Ron. My feeling is that most of these couples are still very much up in the air.

I strongly believe that it will be Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermione in the end. One or both couples may not really come together until Book 6 or 7, though. I still think and feel that those are the pairings that JK Rowling has in mind. I could be wrong or right but I just wanted to share that it's my unshakeable theory - and no one could convince me otherwise, probably except Rowling herself. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions anyway. Each side has its own good points. I can't wait till June 21 comes so we can read the new book. I'm sure that some of the things regarding the pairings will be made clearer there.

Hm... remember when JK said that all (or is it almost?) the character in HP will fall in love with the same person...?

I hope it's Ginny, though..

Excellent points as usual, lleyki. I think A LOT of 'shippers take Ron/Hermione as a foregone conclusion when they really shouldn't (I know I did the first time through the books). This is JKR we are reading here, queen of the red herring. For all we know, none of the main three will end up together.

I put this in the thread about The Kiss, but I'll stick it here too. I've been thinking about this kiss. I think it can be interpreted either way -- as a romantic kiss OR a sisterly kiss. If you consider the emotions behind it -- the horrible things Harry has just been through, the fact that he came closer to death than he has since Voldie tried to kill him as a baby, the fact that Voldie is now on the loose and Harry is in the greatest danger ever -- the kiss isn't all that unreasonable. From either point of view. Hermione was seeing Harry off. She wouldn't see him again for several weeks at the very least. He'd come through this horrific experience and his life was in danger. I think if it were someone I loved (as a lover or a friend) I think I would be overcome in that moment and be more demonstrative in my affection than I would be under normal circumstances. EVeryone says she did it because he's a friend and therefore more comfortable with him. Well, I think in that moment, the normal 'crush' behavior and way of thinking goes out the window. She wasn't thinking of what Harry might think, it was a moment of pure emotion and impulse. IF you consider what Hermione must have been going through, nearly losing someone so close to her, not getting to see him for several weeks, her behavior is perfectly normal no matter the nature of her love (romantic or sisterly).

My personal gut feeling (and I could be wrong) is that the way things currently stand, Ron has feelings for Hermione, Hermione has feelings for Harry and Harry has got bigger fish to fry. The fact that Hermione can't stop talking to Krum about Harry, to the point that Krum truly thinks they might have something going on, I think really says something. I could always tell who my friends were really crushing on because the couldn't shut up about the crush. No matter how much they denied it. It is simply human nature. I think it is obvious to everyone that Ron is crushing on Hermione. Poor Ron. I knew from the beginning that was going to happen. Since the book is from Harry's POV, we know he isn't crushing on anyone (well, except Cho). He does notice Hermione in a few different places, but he just remarks about how she looks, he doesn't really reveal any feelings. I don't think he has any beyond close friendship. At least not yet.

I don't know where it will go from there, I'll be staying up late reading Book V in the wee hours of 6/21. I like both of the main 'ships (I won't be in the least bit upset if it ends up Ron/Hermione), but the H/H ship seems to be the underdog so that is the one I like to defend. I think the reason I like it maybe a wee bit better than R/H is because Hermione complements Harry so well. Harry needs someone who is strong, a true equal and partner. Someone he can stand shoulder to shoulder with, who won't shrink away from all of the difficulties he has to face by virtue of who he is. Hermione really has that. She is quite powerful magically in her own right. I like the R/H 'ship too, and the whole fire and ice, Han Solo/Princess Leia, opposites attract thing makes for a really exciting read. If Ginny really steps up in the next few books and turns out to be more than she has been so far, I might be in favor of a Harry/Ginny 'ship. It is just too early to tell.

I'm glad you mentioned about those quotes IIeyki. For all we know they could be real pointers but I've never thought they were obviously flagging R/Hr or ruling out H/Hr.
I guess Rita's articles have a few functions: a) giving an outside peek at the trio's relationship to get away from Harry's POV b) stirring up conflict c) comic relief d) publising Hermione's Muggle-born status for future conflict (rather how the photo of Scabbers was used as a plot point in POV) and e) making Fudge suspicious of Harry.
I was also interested that Molly jumped to conclusions about Hermione pretty quickly after the Hr/H/K article. She's had the girl to stay, she knows her to some extent. I don't think she was bothered about Harry supposedly being interested in Hermione (i.e. wanting Hermione for Ron) because her feelings towards Harry didn't change. It may not be anything.

Originally posted by Turambar
I guess Rita's articles have a few functions: a) giving an outside peek at the trio's relationship to get away from Harry's POV

Anr Ron wasnt mentioned...

(Insert dramatic and forlorn music here)

However, that might just be because Ron is not newsworthy... or at least, not yet

I have to say this is my opinion but I really want to see Ron and Hermione ever sine the end of CoS. And after reading some fanfic, I realy want Ginny and Harry together!

Greetings RonFan24, welcome to the boards! :welcome: In accordance with the rules and codes of conduct of the board, images within signatures must not exceed 300x300. Which yours does...

Why Ginny and Harry? It would be like dating your sister...

I've been thinking about the mirror of Erised in Book 1. Ron's deepest desire was to be Head Boy, have good looks and to be Quidditch Captain. Obviously, he wants to shine above the rest. Ron just doesn't appreciate what he has: a happy family, etc. I think that JK put Ron as 'the youngest Weasley brother who's so poor and stupid that he could never ever be greater than Harry Potter or Hermione Granger'. The way he sees it, he's nothing compared to his two best friends. He's poor, doesn't do as well as his two friends, doesn't play Quidditch for the Gryffindor team and is outshined by his older brothers.

Ron likes Hermione, so let them get together for a while, and when Hermione leaves him and gets together with Harry, Ron'll just overreact and blame Harry for everything. That's what Ron's character is like.

Poor Harry will have to face his problems among his friends, and also Voldemort.

Max: You do get the impression that Ron could wind up a tragic figure if he doesn't grow up a bit and fast. The key really is for him to find something he's particularly good at that gives him a bit of confidence. And probably it needs to be something different to what his brothers were good at. It would be interesting to know what Bill and Charlie were like at the same stage.

I think there is a reason why so many people ‘want Ron to win.’ Granted, it’s a horrible way to phrase it and I certainly don’t think Ron conceives of Hermione as some sort of prize to beat Harry out of. He isn’t that shallow.

Here’s a simple little fact I think is true at all times: In a heroic story (or movie, or tv show), the reader wants the hero to know of humility, to experience humility. There’s a thin line between being protagonistic and antagonistic, especially as the story goes on and the hero continues to defeat villains. The sense of peril is lost, there’s no danger involved anymore, and the hero is no longer a normal person. He’s now approaching demi-god levels, a Superman in effect.

What happens in a narrative that told from the hero’s point of view is that the reader begins to naturally question some of what’s going on. Why is Snape always portrayed as being unfair? Why is Slytherin portrayed as being all bad? And why is that Harry Potter kid portrayed as being brave, loyal, and trustworthy? Is the narrator trying to deceive me?

Remember, we are reading about, essentially, a jock. He’s the star quarterback because of his own natural talent. It’s not as if flying his broom stick is something he had to train or develop; there was no hard work involved, it’s just something that came natural to him. I always thought it would have been a good idea to have him lose a game of Quidditch to the Slytherin.

Fairly.

No jinxes or insidious plots to get Potter either. Just Slytherin played the better game. Not only would it teach Harry a bit about humility, it would also really add some heat to the competitive spirit between houses. My gosh, this game is really hard! Slytherin is a tough team! Boy, I really want to beat them!

You don’t get any of that in any of the first three books when reading the Quidditch chapters. It’s like watching the Harlem Globetrotters. The first couple times it’s fun, but after awhile, I began cheering for the Washington Generals. People like the underdog; I like the underdog.

Did anyone watch the Rockets/Lakers game last week? The Houston crowd broke out into a “Beat LA!� chant during overtime. That chant has been around for awhile. Why? Because the Lakers have won the last three NBA finals.

People don’t like domination; it’s natural to cheer for the underdog, even if the underdog is supposedly a villain.

That brings me to Draco who is, at this point, a poor cartoon villain. I can almost envision him twirling a thin black mustache with his finger, as his mind thinks of ways to torment Harry Potter. Of course, this guy is just here to be turned into an animal and kicked around throughout the hallways. Why not let him grab the golden snitch and win a game? If we’re supposed to take him seriously as a real rival, he has to have some skills beyond mouthing off. As it stands now, he is to Harry Potter as a mugger is to Spiderman… no threat at all.

Here’s another point that could be made. Sirius Black as a student played a cruel and malice joke on Snape. A joke that could have easily cost Snape his life. And from my reading of book 3, Black is completely unapologetic on that point, there’s no remorse at all. Sirius seems to be a rather popular character, but I can’t understand why. He strikes me as something of a bully. The reason is, of course, Black isn’t played up in the text as being an antagonist. Harry doesn’t see him that way. There is a bit of hypocrisy in that Harry many times looks down on the Slytherin house as being full of bullies, but he’s not even able to see that Black has a history of bullying also.

And what happens if Harry were to start to dating Hermione? Things will happen in turn. There has to be a reaction. It’s clear from reading the books, Ron fancies her. I don’t think anyone would deny that. He wouldn’t bite his lip and think, “Well, as long as my best friends are happy.� Ron isn’t passive; his emotions dictate his actions for the better or worse. His reaction would have to follow and it wouldn’t be a positive one. Ron would fight for the affection of Hermione, no doubt about it.

If we’re going to say that Harry ends up with Hermione and Ron’s attempts to win her over failed, where does this leave Ron? It is a fair question because now he’s the third wheel. Does Harry and Hermione give him the classic “lets still be friends� speech? I can’t see Ron going for that (or any guy with an ounce of pride for that matter.)

Not only does Harry get the girl, but he also maintains the friendship of his wacky sidekick, poor pathetic Ron. Can anyone see this happening? It’s overkill. It would mean the destruction and humiliation of Ron’s character and the total transformation of Harry from a protagonist to a complete antagonist.

I’ve read in several places were people have suggested turning Ron to the dark arts. That’s the total copout. Only a lazy and uncreative writer would use this idea. Not only does Harry get the girl, but also he has to save her from a jealous, psycho wizard. And to top it off, Harry Potter possesses so much virtue, he would mourn the passing of his former friend, Ron Weasley, and remember him for what he was before the dark side grabbed hold of him. Gag! What a horrible, horrible idea.

However, if the story leads to Ron/ Hermione, it avoids a lot of this silly teenage angst and none of the characters get compromised or humiliated. Harry and Hermione are just close friends. I said it in an earlier post. Loving someone doesn’t mean you have to be in love with that person. How does Harry react to them as a couple? He’s happy for them and, in fact, surprised they didn’t get together earlier.

This isn’t about Ron ‘winning’ out over Harry; it’s about the integrity of his character and Harry’s character, for that matter. Stories have paths and characters react differently to those paths. The Harry/Hermione path is messy because now Harry as the heroic centerpiece of the story is thrown off. Heroic stories are balancing acts. The hero can’t be too successful at everything or guess what? Inadvertently, he’s become a villain and someone people enjoying cheering against.

Hello 'The Robfather' (love the name!!), did you copy and paste that from somewhere? IE wordpad? I'm just wondering about all the characters changes :)

You make some great points though!! Keep it up!!

I guess I’ll have to admit it.

My deepest shame comes out. I am a horrible speller. :'(

When I post on message boards, I type it all up in Microsoft Word, make heavy use of it’s Spell Checker, and then copy and paste my post into the reply box. I realize some characters my not carry over on some computers, like quotation marks. Hopefully, it’s readable.

P.S. I like my nick also. :cool:

hehe dont worry about it, sometimes I make use of my Live Journal inputer to check my spelling its good for the grammer and text usage of most computers :)

Originally posted by The Robfather
I guess I’ll have to admit it.

My deepest shame comes out. I am a horrible speller. :'(

When I post on message boards, I type it all up in Microsoft Word, make heavy use of it’s Spell Checker, and then copy and paste my post into the reply box. I realize some characters my not carry over on some computers, like quotation marks. Hopefully, it’s readable.


I consider that to be the quality of a careful and considerate poster, not a shameful thing. It's nice that members really want to take time over their posts and go to the effort of making sure it's readable. :)

Robfather, you're posts are rivalling Illeyki's and Turambar's in length. :)

I have to disagree on a few points in your post, Robfather. First, Harry didn't win all of his Quidditch matches. He lost to Hufflepuff in his 3rd Year, didn't he? Wasn't he completely humiliated when he found out that he lost? Yes, Harry is a natural flyer, but his skill as Seeker comes from many long hours of training. Draco Malfoy is a natural flyer, but he couldn't beat Harry because he isn't as well trained.

On the Harry/Hermione issue:

Who's ever said that JK took the easy route? Harry/Hermione will be messy, but Harry will finally have someone who truly cares for him, someone who recognizes him for who he really is, not just his fame. We don't know if Ron is really in love with Hermione, or if it's just a little crush. If Ron and Hermione get together, Harry will feel like the third wheel. Since he feels isolated, Hermione will surely come along and spend some time with him, and Ron, being his usual jealous self, will suspect that there's something going on between the two, which would lead to a big fight between Ron and Hermione.

Some R/Hr shippers argue that Harry could spend time with Ginny, therefore leading to a Harry/Ginny relationship. The problem with this is that Ginny just sees Harry as the "big hero who's survived you-know-who and will save the world again" and not who he really is. Harry knows too little about Ginny to have a serious relationship with her.

I totally agree with you, Max. And, I’d like to add something else. Some R/Hr shippers think that Hermione expresses her feelings for Ron more clearly in the second half of GoF, but you must always remember how is Hermione’s true personality, she just may be doing all those things get Harry jealous, but Harry simply doesn´t notice.

My only ambition, lately, has been to emulate the marvellous Ileyki and Tarembar.
So here goes…

I’m inclined to agree with LizardLaugh: ‘Ron likes Hermione, Hermione likes Harry, Harry has bigger fish to fry’. That’s the way I see it, as well.

Ron liking Hermione is obvious. In fact it is probably a little too obvious, even to the point where I felt it was kind of annoying. I almost started disliking how his character was developing.
He just doesn’t really know how to act gentlemanly at all. He had nothing at all to do with getting Padma as a date for the Yule Ball, but when Dean and Seamus are impressed that he and Harry have ‘the best looking girls in the year’ he responds as if it was all down to his charm, (although I do expect this is said as a joke). And then, he has this pretty girl, who has blindly agreed to be his date, and he is nothing but rude to her all evening. Yes – he may have been annoyed that Hermione’s attention was elsewhere – but that is no excuse for how rude he was.
To be honest, I got the impression that Ron doesn’t so much as like Hermione, but rather he likes the idea of having Hermione. Let me explain.
Ron wants to have things –
Money (that’s obvious)
Good looks, fame and authority (Mirror of Erised, PS)
Popularity and attention (when he thinks Sirius was going to stab him, PoA; and after the second task, GoF).
And now he wants affection - he wants people to be interested in him, and that includes Hermione, but it’s not limited to just her.
Even after all the jealousy and arguments etc about Krum, he is still trying to get friendly with Fleur. e.g. When Fleur goes to thank Harry for saving her sister, then asks if Ron helped, how does it describe him – he is ‘hopeful’, he just saw Harry get kissed and he wants it too.
If he honestly liked Hermione, he should at least show her the decency of not flirting with everybody he can. How often are we given the impression that Ron respects Hermione for her personality, intelligence and loyalty? But we do get the impression that when things are not going his way, then he becomes rude to Hermione.

You probably all think that I hate Ron. True – I do not like that he is becoming angrier, jealous and shallow – to me he has always been cheerful, loyal, thoughtful and some of the best bits of the books involve his readiness to sacrifice himself for his friends.
If he hooks up with Hermione it will be a mistake.

Hermione likes Harry. For all the reasons mentioned by Ileyki, Tarembar, Max and others who have shared insights that, to be honest, I am starting to favour. Just a couple of things though.
When Harry notices it is Hermione at the Yule Ball, his jaw drops, then he describes her in detail and then Hermione says ‘hi, Harry’, so she is clearly looking at him. I think it is very possible that she was watching Harry as he very obviously gazes at her hair, then her dress, then her smile and even her posture. And I bet she liked seeing Harry looking at her open mouthed.
What follows – eye contact and grinning over dinner. Every spare moment together preparing for the second task. No interest in Krum once out of the lake, only Harry. Constant talking about Harry to Krum. Pleads with Harry to be careful to the point of desperation (after Sirius’ letter). Putting aside studying for exams to help Harry for the third task (this is critical, I think), and then the kiss. Yes – it is just a simple kiss on the cheek, but I think she wants Harry to know that she REALLY cares about him.
Long term – Hermione and Harry might just work out.

Harry has bigger fish to fry. Absolutely. Keep him single. For a couple of years at least. Does he care about Hermione – of course. Does he respect her – definitely. Does he recognise her abilities – obviously. But does he like her – I don’t see how he couldn’t.

A couple of pages ago, Robfather posted a great piece about love, rather than mere infatuation or physical attraction. I completely agree. I don’t believe that Harry is capable of having any kind of relationship that is not based on sincere feelings, he is just so careful with his emotions.
But I do see him sharing those moments Robfather talked about – quiet moments, moments of kindness, patience and understanding – with the girl who has only ever seen him for what he is – her friend.

Later.

wow! im beginning to wonder why i used to consider lleyki, turambar and max's posts are the best here but hey! i really find all of the posts here amazing! tcboo, very very nice. you'll be following lleyki and turambar's steps any day now!:D

:grouphug: hehe.

anyway, back to the thread. im neither a R/Hr nor a H/Hr shipper but i think both ideas are good and very possible. and after a while, i learned to like the harry-ginny idea too. even if yeah, i still see something wrong with them. but at least i learned to love ginny as much as i love hermione even if i said before she is a whiner! i didn't realize she's so sweet! i apologize to all H/G shippers out there who got offended when i said she whines a lot.

:sorry:

moving on, harry and hermione. hermione clearly is perfect for harry. harry enjoys hermione's company even if sometimes she annoys him. besides, she understands harry and correct me if im wrong but i really think she likes harry just as how she likes ron. why? well, it's not just ron whom she got irritated when the veelas appeared in the world cup. when harry was staring at the veelas she was the one who pulled him back to his seat in a very irritated manner. and when harry said "they make them (girls) okay at Hogwarts," and starts staring at Cho, she snapped at them. yeah i know some may say hermione is a T (Thinking person-one who considers facts rather than feelings) and harry needs an F (Feeling Person- the T's complete opposite). [i happen to read them all in another site]. ron is the F in the trio. he understands harry's emotional wants and needs. when he's upset ron automatically shifts harry's thoughts to quidditch which really makes harry forget all about his problems. but when you see it, hermione is also an F. she was with harry throughout the Triwizard tournament even if almost everyone in the school hates harry for that. i don't know if you agree with me but it's just my thoughts.

now, hermione and ron. ron amuses and at the same time annoys hermione. ive read the four books for a number of times and i noticed that ron usually makes hermione laugh and giggle. i just didn't notice harry making hermione laugh. if there's something in the book, kindly tell me. and of course hermione likes ron. she likes both guys! hard to choose if i were her. she's really annoyed when ron's jaw drops whenever fleur is in the great hall. and of course, when fleur kissed ron. she just scowled. well, opposites attract. i have to agree with that. i myself experienced that. when i met my boyfriend, i hated him. i despised him. he laughs at the fact that i love reading books and rather stay with my computer than go to parties. i hate him for that. but he still managed to make me smile and blush even if i have a very big problem. that just made me fall for him. :o ok enough of that. sorry but i just had a sudden mush attack.

so there. ron likes hermione and hermione likes both guys. i still believe harry will notice hermione. and the conflict begins. if ron finds out harry has a thing for the girl he swoons, complete riot. and personally, id rather see them end up with another person than see them ruin their friendship. that's all.

ginny and harry. harry is perfect for ginny. her knight and shining armor (makes me wanna puke saying that) but hello girl! talk to him! but about the idea that they end up together, hmmm.. it makes me smile really when i think of that. the girl is in love with the guy for what? practically half of her adolescent life?! and the guy manages to fall head over heels in love with her. romantic right? fairy tale ending right? too perfect. but that's not harry potter. the series is not all about happy endings. and besides, as of now harry considers ginny his little sister. but im not saying i would be disappointed if they end up together.

well, i think this is my longest post! i didn't realize i have a lot of thoughts about this romance thing.

comments anyone? id be happy to read all of your comments may it be negative or positive. :)

If JKR named Hermione after the mythological character who was in love with two men then the HP series is going to get very interesting indeed - hopefully though, not too "90210-ish".

I don't care for the R/H pairing at all; I feel it should be H/H. However, if I had my way, I'd rather JKR concentrate on the main story in the next 3 books & keep the teen angst to a minimum.

Okay I wanted to respond to Robfather's last post. No offence Robfather; but have you been influenced by that article written awhile back about how there is nothing special about Harry and he is nothing but a pampered jock? Some of your attitudes or words I should say, mirror that same line of thinking. Personally I thought that entire article was ridiculos and I got the sense the journalist was trying to make a name for himself by being different and shocking. Anyway, in response to some of your points;

I absolutely agree with the issue of a hero needing humility. Yes, and as far as I can see Harry has plenty of it. What was Dumbledore's reasoning for placing Harry at the Durlseys when he himself or any good wizard family could have raised him? He didn't want him to be affected by all the fame and have to grow up with being famous and everyone knowing who is. Now personally an orphanage might have been a better idea than the Dursleys, but I digress. The point is famous Harry Potter grew up as humble and downtrodden as someone could get and if ever he's inclined to get too cocky with all the fame he has at school; he has the Dursleys to return to every summer. I'm sure JK considered that whole issue of overkill and didn't want Harry having everything too perfectly. Thus, we have the Dursleys. We laugh but things like Aunt Marge giving him dog biscuits for Christmas isn't really funny, especially when you consider how young Harry was. Harry doesn't lack humility or compassion and it is largely to all the pain he has suffered.

Now honestly people have talked about how famous Harry is and all he has and how he gets everything; but think about it, hasn't Harry's fame cost him more sometimes? Let's face it, people were sure he was the heir because he was found near the victims and the fact that he destroyed a powerful dark wizard as a baby had some convinced of how powerful he could be. Really hasn't Harry had a number of struggles in the wizarding world even where he is famous Harry Potter? In his first year, most of the Gryffindors along with the Hufflepuffs and Ravenclaws were mad at him for losing the 150 points. Then there was the issue of being Slytherin's heir in COS and let's not of even discuss GOF. Harry had hate from almost everyone for an entire month(imagine working under these conditions), insults hurled at him, the stares, Rita's articles, etc.

Finally how perfect has JK really made Harry? Besides being really good at quidditch and famous for something he doesn't remember, what has she really given him? I get the sense that while Harry isn't stupid(actually he seems very smart, just doesn't apply himself enough), he certainly doesn't perform that well. Remember Malfoy's reaction to Rita's statement that he was one of the top students? Then there were the ways 'he saved the day'(for a lack of a better expression), he was helped by Ron or Hermione or both. Using their strengths along with his they solved the problems. Therefore Harry isn't this amazing, powerful hero. If anything and personally my feeling for why I really love him; is that Harry is a very human and normal character alongside extrodinary events. We saw him struggling in SS to understand a world a few months earlier he knew nothing of; so my feeling therefore is the perfection or all-too powerful hero thing certainly doesn't fly in Harry's case.

On the issue of the quidditch matches; excuse me but didn't Slytherin win in SS? The season was cancelled in COS and POA was the first time after playing for TWO years did Harry and his team finally win. Also JK made a point of mentioning that Slytherin had won the House Cup seven years in a row in SS. Therefore if there was any domination, it was by them. Plus from discussions of the other teams(especially POA), we get the sense that the only team who matches Slytherin is Gryffindor, so I'm sorry but that argument definitely doesn't work. If anything, by POA I was starting to wonder when or if the Gryffindor team would ever win that bloody cup. Plus Wood was getting rather desperate and pathetic.

Finally(two posts in a day and I'm still long. I give up.), I absolutely don't agree that Sirius was a bully. What Sirius is, is someone with a violent temper. That is not the same thing. A bully signifies someone who picks on weak, innocent, defenseless people just for kicks. Kind of like Malfoy and his two idiot friends. Sirius is simply someone who reacts very violently to anyone who he feels threatnens him or anyone he loves. Snape seemed to be very determined to get Sirius, James and the others expelled. That in Sirius' eye would be someone who was threatning himself and others he loved. I do believe it is his downfall; I mean people would hardly believe a guy who could slash the Fat Lady the way he did would be innocent. However, I honestly do not agree with the assessment of him being a bully during his schooldays. Besides we don't know enough of them in school to make that assessment.

Okay before I go, I need to say something. Some people think, there are persons who don't like Ron purely because he isn't a the hero and thus isn't good enough for Hermione. I don't agree with that; but I have to say there are times when Ron's complaining does start to bother on whining for me and I really don't like whiners. There are times(namely GOF) when I wanted to yell; yes I get it you're poor but for crying out loud there are more important things going on.

These are my feelings on the Ron/Hermione pairing as well as GoF in general from another thread:


I loved the main story about how Voldemort was reborn & I liked the Triwizard Tournament, but unlike the other three books, GoF didn't flow as well for me. SS, CoS & PoA were all so fluid that I found them utterly engaging. But GoF just got very tired about a third of the way through.

Ron & Hermione arguing chapter after chapter got old real quick. Also, I felt there were way too many contrived moments - they just seemed like it had to happen to serve the script. Like Ron's behavior - since when has he acted like such a jerk towards his friends. Yes he's frustrated with his life, but c'mon. He was basically negative throughout the entire book.

Also, with the exception of Mad Eye Moody, I thought every new character was awful. Maxime, Karkaroff, Krum, Delacour, Cedric & Cho were poorly or barely fleshed out and Winky, Bagman, Crouch were kind of boring. Rita Skeeter was an awful character but she served her purpose of causing mayhem at Hogwarts through her Daily Prophet stories so I could deal with that.

I'm also shocked that no one on these boards has taken issue with an 18 year old character [Krum] taking an underaged 14 year old [Hermione] on a date & saying that he like her. That seemed a little on the inappropriate side to me even though apparently nothing happened.

I've also notice people clamoring for a Ron/Hermione pairing - as if 14 year olds should be having romantic relationships to begin with but that's a whole other issue - but I can't believe no one's noticed the disturbing pattern in that little relationship. Ron treats Hermione pretty badly throughout GoF [mocking her S.P.E.W. campaign, basically yelling at her during & after the Yule Ball, etc] and yet she still likes him apparently?

Now I'm a man, but I've never been comfortable with the idea that a guy can treat a girl poorly & in turn she winds up having romantic feelings and/or a crush on him. To me, it says something about that girls self esteem. I always felt Hermione was a very strong female character, but she was a lightning rod for Ron's bitter & harsh feelings throughout GoF. I think it would have been better if Hermione had instigated a few of the arguments as well so that their bickering would've been a little more balanced.

Some teen angst is okay as the characters grow & change, but it got a little too "Dawson's Creek" for me. For me, the main story took a back seat to it & I felt it suffered as a result.

Also, I'm tired of the romantic cliche of having characters argue constantly with one another even though they secretly harbor a crush on the other person storyline - it's been done to death. I personally thought JKR would be a little more original than that. I loved however how she fleshed out Harry & Hermione's friendship. My favorite scene in the entire book is when Ron hasn't been talking to Harry for awhile & Hermione brings Harry some toast & ask him if he wants to take a walk.

In terms of character development, that was beautifully written. It showed how thoughtful Hermione was & just how much she not only cared for Harry, but how much of a friend she is to him. And let's face it, at that point in time, he really needed one. I think if there are going to be any feelings between characters, it should be between Harry/Hermione because it's not often you see two characters who genuinely care and respect each other fall in love. As we all know, love born out of friendship is usually the purest love there is.

Yes opposites attract, but it rarely [key word here] last. If Ron & Hermione ever have a "relationship", it'll be the kind that ends when they graduate from Hogwarts. However, Harry/Hermione could share a more deeply rooted spiritual connection. They seem to be soul mates - if you will. Plus, Hermione might be the only girl - in the wizarding world - who would love/like Harry for who he truly is - flaws & all, as opposed to what he is [a famous wizard].

Oh well, that's just my opinion.

Originally posted by Mad Eye Mike
Yes opposites attract, but it rarely [key word here] last. If Ron & Hermione ever have a "relationship", it'll be the kind that ends when they graduate from Hogwarts. However, Harry/Hermione could share a more deeply rooted spiritual connection. They seem to be soul mates - if you will. Plus, Hermione might be the only girl - in the wizarding world - who would love/like Harry for who he truly is - flaws & all, as opposed to what he is [a famous wizard].

Oh well, that's just my opinion.

Where do you get this from? Your post contains why you think Ron and Herimone are not suited and that its bad they argue. But I have never seen the possibility of two 14-year-olds sharing a "deep spiritual connection"...

Wow! You go away for a while and it all happens in your absence. Some great posts.
IIeyki and Max have answered Robfather well. I think it's a mistake to look at the books in a very general plot/character overview. There's a lot of complexity, subtlety and humour in the books but you have to get under the skin. There's a lot of real life messages in there. JKR has taken a lot of care to give her three main characters believable flaws and problems.
If Ron is an underdog, a battler - and I really don't think he's got it so bad - it's up to him to battle his way through his problems and develop as a person. The guy is 14, is it really such a problem for him at the moment that he's poor? His father and brothers are working, he won't have to work for several years. Unlike Harry he's got the financial and emotional support of a loving family.
Tcboo made a great point about Ron's possessiveness towards Hermione. Ron's feelings and attitudes to girls are confused - as you'd expect from a typical 14-year-old boy. I can't see it as some deep-seated love for Hermione.
I would think Hermione, being far more mature, understands what he's going through, though of course it didn't stop her being outraged at his behaviour. What would she really get out of a relationship with Ron, until he grows up more himself?

Hello lleyki,

Thanks for responding.

Just wanted to say, I don’t know anything about an article and my posts are based on my thoughts alone. I never said that there wasn’t anything special about him, nor did I ever say that he was a pampered jock. I did say he was a jock who had natural talent, but I didn’t say that he was pampered. Furthermore, my main thesis was that a hero--- any hero--- must know humility and must not win all the time, or the audience will turn against him. I just wanted to make that clear.

Whether are not you consider Sirius a bully depends on the definition. In many ways, he’s probably worse than a bully because a bully’s tactics usually don’t rise to the level of extreme violence. True, we don’t know everything that went on with Black during his schooling, but I think I know enough to make an assessment. The true definition of someone’s characters is illustrated by the way he treats his enemies. Sirius failed miserably in that regard. He may have had good intentions, wanting to protect his friends from being expelled, but good intentions are many times the catalyst for bad results. Good intentions don’t justify horrible actions.

If Sirius Black had shown some remorse, some regret, then I’d say he’s a decent human being—but hasn’t—in fact, he wanted to murder Wormtail in Book 3. He’s learned nothing. That’s the extraordinary thing; after all that time, he’s learned nothing. Compassion and mercy, those are the qualities people should show their enemies, not spite and vengeance. Harry knew this lesson when he had his chance to get revenge on Wormtail. It’s amazing these simple life lessons that Sirius apparently refuses to learn; it makes him quite a pathetic character. Of course, Snape isn’t innocent either. He allowed himself to become mired in victomhood; he has quite a bit of growing up to do also. I wonder how it felt for both these men, having to shake hands at the end of Book 4.

As for Slytherin’s supposed dominance, that’s where the weakness in the writing comes out. There’s a difference between ‘telling’ and ‘showing.’ Show us how resourceful Slytherin is; show them winning; then I’ll take them seriously. Telling us how great they are, only to have them lose ‘on screen’ all the time is lame. The rivalry between houses isn’t very compelling as it stands, which is a shame.

Originally posted by lanifiel
Where do you get this from? Your post contains why you think Ron and Herimone are not suited and that its bad they argue. But I have never seen the possibility of two 14-year-olds sharing a "deep spiritual connection"...


I said & I quote:

However, Harry/Hermione could share a more deeply rooted spiritual connection. They seem to be soul mates - if you will.

I said "COULD" which means that as they grow up, they can possible develop a deep spiritual connection because of what they've been through - and what they will go through. Also I never said that R/H arguing was bad, I said it was too frequent throughout GoF & that I found it too cliche. It would've been okay in spurts, but it happened almost everytime they were together in scenes.

I don't think that the infatuations of 14-15 year olds should become the focus of the HP series, but as they get to year 6/7 [16/17 year olds], I wouldn't mind seeing Harry & Hermione's deep friendship grow into a more mature romantic relationship. As opposed to R/H's constant snapping at each other. Also, like I said, I think it would be nice to see two people form a relationship out of respect & friendship rather than the supposed "passion" that people generally associate with arguing.

I think it'd be a nice change of pace to see a deep, passionate, loving relationship develop - not out of petty childish bickering, but out of genuine respect & friendship.

But that's just my opinion.

I can agree with what you said, but whats wrong with Ron and Herimone realising (More Ron) how much the other means to them and so a relationship blossoms like that, without the snapping because now, since they are in 6th year they are a little bit more mature?

By the way, Mad Eye Mike Welcome to the boards! :welcome: I hope you enjoy your stay!! :)

Originally posted by The Robfather
I guess I’ll have to admit it.

My deepest shame comes out. I am a horrible speller.

When I post on message boards, I type it all up in Microsoft Word, make heavy use of it’s Spell Checker, and then copy and paste my post into the reply box. I realize some characters my not carry over on some computers, like quotation marks. Hopefully, it’s readable.

Don't worry! Whenever I post, I re-read my post at least 4 times to make sure that I make some sense, and that I didn't make too many spelling/typing errors. Sometimes, though...there are a few that I miss! :D

Ok, I'm bringing two threads together to make a point. Bear with me :)

After someone special is killed in book Five Harry will need comfort from someone who has also felt this type of loss, thus Cho would seem like the perfect person for Harry to talk to about what happens. It is through this, Cho seeing Harry at his most vulnerable, that she learns to like him as more than a friend and not as a celebrity!

There we go, another lanifiel theory! Don't worry, I'm sure I'll think differently this afternoon :)

Obviously some of you did not read the interview where JKR clearly stated and it is true that Harry is NOT A NORMAL boy. His years of neglect by his relatives have made him an old soul; he has to battle depression and a lot of other things that NORMAL teenagers would not face.

Unlike Ron that is a NORMAL 14 year boy. YES! It is a problem for him being poor, and it would be to anybody!!!! All of you have either forgotten or are not thinking like a 14 normal boy. Imagine going into a ball where all your friends are wearing the perfect clothes, brand new and pretty and you are wearing some third class, wear down thing that looks more like your sister dress than your own clothes!!!

I MEAN, COME ON!!! Do not say you wouldn’t care, because in fact I bet some of you would not go at all!

Also JKR CLEARLY stated that just because you are a very smart person does not mean you are good at everything. Meaning that the choices of Hermione up until know on men have not been wise (Lockhart, Krum). She was clear on that Hermione is insecure because she comes from another world and acts and tries to knows as much as possible to cope in with her insecurities. You all talk the way Ron treats Hermione but she treats him the same way back. In fact the way she acts around him sometimes is down right nasty! When Crosshanks was attacking Scabbers her answers of ‘that’s what Cats do’ was not only mean but also really annoying!! Imagine if it was your pet, but since it is Ron’s pet I Imagine it will be ok for most of you. It took her a long time to apologize for it or even care about it! Most people I talk about it, including myself, thought that was really mean of her.

Yes Hermione is strong character, (and for the fact I like her character) but I can’t wait for her to lighten up like JKR said she would, her attitude sometimes is really nerve racking.

I can completely respect that you want Harry/Hermione to be together but it does not justify putting so much Ron down. All the characters, including Harry himself, have their flaws. JKR said that in GoF, Ron had been a loyal friend for three years and all that Harry cared was his problems, he was too proud to talk to Ron about what was bothering to both of them. All of them have flaws and their bound to have their problems. It does happen in real life too.

Finally Ron issues around Harry and his money are in my point of view, very understandable. When I was in high School my best friend had money(she still my best friend if you are wondering). It was a bit weird sometimes. You are angry at your economic situation. You don’t need pity. Remember that sometimes a friend is someone that listens to you; the fact that Harry would like to fix Ron’s problems it makes Ron feel little. It is a normal reaction, if you are able to transport yourself at that time. Even if you are poor you still like to have some dignity.

Wonderful post, GilyAnn.

Originally posted by lanifiel
Greetings RonFan24, welcome to the boards! :welcome: In accordance with the rules and codes of conduct of the board, images within signatures must not exceed 300x300. Which yours does...

Why Ginny and Harry? It would be like dating your sister...
Sorry about that! For some reason, I was thinking it was under! I guess because it's only 60 high. I'll change it!

As for Ginny and Harry, I've been reading some pretty good fanfic dipicting a relationship between them. When I read PoA and GoF, I was kind of cheering on Harry to get Cho. But the way the G/H thing I was reading had an innocent sweetness to it. As for it being like dating your sister, I don't know because it seems like Harry and Ginny aren't very close, just Harry and Ron. And I'm sure Ron would be furious at first (like in the fanfic I read), but maybe he'd warm to the idea. :)

Originally posted by lanifiel
Ok, I'm bringing two threads together to make a point. Bear with me :)

After someone special is killed in book Five Harry will need comfort from someone who has also felt this type of loss, thus Cho would seem like the perfect person for Harry to talk to about what happens. It is through this, Cho seeing Harry at his most vulnerable, that she learns to like him as more than a friend and not as a celebrity!

There we go, another lanifiel theory! Don't worry, I'm sure I'll think differently this afternoon :)

But what if it's Cho who dies? Hmm interesting new theory. The death of Harry's crush would certainly make him examine death. Sorry, this isn;t the death thread, please ignore my ramblings :D

Originally posted by RonFan24
Sorry about that! For some reason, I was thinking it was under! I guess because it's only 60 high. I'll change it!

As for Ginny and Harry, I've been reading some pretty good fanfic dipicting a relationship between them. When I read PoA and GoF, I was kind of cheering on Harry to get Cho. But the way the G/H thing I was reading had an innocent sweetness to it. As for it being like dating your sister, I don't know because it seems like Harry and Ginny aren't very close, just Harry and Ron. And I'm sure Ron would be furious at first (like in the fanfic I read), but maybe he'd warm to the idea. :)

You've read H/G fanfics? Not to be rude, but fanfic authors sometimes twist the plotlines of the previous books to fit what they want in their story. Ginny, the little background character becomes wonderful, sweet Ginny who happens to be the prettiest girl in school. And besides that, Ron and Hermione finally 'understand' each other and have a relationship. Sometimes it's just so perfect that I feel like I was going to puke.

Fanfics, if properly written, are wonderful reads, but for 99% of them, that's not the case.

All I've found from most fanfics are the authors deluded hopes that a relationship forms with the character they feel they identify most with...

Originally posted by lanifiel
All I've found from most fanfics are the authors deluded hopes that a relationship forms with the character they feel they identify most with...

I agree. But if you dig deep enough you might just find one of those rare fanfics which are just ... excellent.

*cough cough* read mine *cough cough*

Okay I had to respond to a couple of things;

Robfather I never said your thoughts weren't yours or those statements were made by you. The article I made reference to caused quite a stir last summer and some of your ideas simply seemed to mirror the author's line of thinking. It was a simple inquiry, not an accusation.

Okay I'm not going to spend another long post arguing this whole quidditch thing. Personally, the game is interesting, the house interactions fun but is it really that essential to the plot of the novels? The plot being all the issues with Voldemort. I personally don't think so. So JK puts in some detailed quidditch match and the Slytherins win fair and square. Goody and the point would be what exactly? There are so many twists and turns with the mysteries of the books; do we really need to now indulge some intense quidditch house matches too? Personally I find all that's been written of the houses playing was nice and interesting and see no reason to elaborate. It is what it is. I should probably say that after awhile I got bored reading that long detail of the World Cup Quidditch finals in GOF. I found it too long, so you could see why I wouldn't jump to making some bigger deal of the house matches.

The issue with Sirius; again I don't want to linger. You see things as you see it and good for you. I stand by my assessment that Sirius is a case of a violent temper rather than bullying. I found it interesting you said that bullying doesn't amount to violent incidents. Again this isn't a criticism, but do you watch the news alot? There are countless cases of bullying that goes too far. Personally I find Snape more of a bully than Sirius. Honestly someone will say that the way Snape treats Harry and the other Gryffindors; especially Neville isn't bullying? No wonder Sirius isn't sorry for what he did. It's not like Snape changed for it. If anything he just became nastier, meaner and more bitter. The issue of Wormtail, again that was his violent temper. React first then ask questions later. In case it's forgotten, Lupin himself(who seems like a very calm man) was ready to kill Wormtail too as soon as he admitted what he did. The reality is people like Harry and his father are rare. We exist in a world that believes in retaliating against those who've hurt us. Compassion and mercy like Harry and his father possess is both rare and admirable. However, it's not the norm, rather the exception. Therefore to call Sirius a bully because he wanted to hurt the man who took his freedom from him, killed his friends and betrayed so many is a weird use of the word.

Okay onto more important issues. Why do some people act like criticsm against Ron is driven by hatred for the character? I certainly don't hate Ron. The only character in the books I find highly annoying is Ginny; for reasons too numerous to mention. That said I have to comment on somethings said by Gilyann.

Nobody is saying that Ron isn't normal in his reactions, including that of the way he looked at the dance. That said, the problem is he always complains about it. We've been hearing it since SS. Now I could understand if Ron and Harry were two normal 14yr olds and Ron had only to deal with the fact that he had a rich, successful friend. Okay he'd be entitled to brood. However, the fact that Ron was there with Harry searching for the stone in SS, his sister was almost killed in COS, all the drama in POA; should by now have given him a clue that there are more important things going on. This isn't a joke or a game; people could die and he's still whining at every turn about his being poor. Okay, having to wear that robe at the dance was hard but honestly did he really have to get on AGAIN when he found out the goblin gold disappeared? The fact that he immediately remembered the World Cup when he found out the goblin gold disappeared made me wonder if Ron ever thinks of anything else. One more thing; jealousy at that age is normal but it is not normal to let it eat and destroy you. Once again it is one thing to feel embarrassed about an outfit but I'm sorry standing there and watching while MALFOY attacked Harry was just disturbing.

Interesting that you brought up how mean Hermione sometimes is to Ron. I mentioned that because I find so many R/Hr shippers like to convince themselves that every argument is a demonstration of some deep passion the two have. However, there's been many times when I get no sense of passion between the two but just downright criticism by Hermione. Honestly someone will say that when Hermione accused Ron of being part of "those people who prop up unjust systems because they're too lazy to work themselves" that was romantic passion talking?

Okay I have a serious problem with that statement that in GOF all Harry cared about was his problems and refused to talk things out. Excuse me, I can accept sympathy for Ron but I absolutely will not accept criticism of Harry when it comes to his friendship with Ron. Honestly what was he supposed to do in GOF, chase Ron around like a lapdog? Please. Harry was completely justified in his reaction. He explained what happened and until Ron was willing to admit that he was wrong and that Harry was telling the truth; what would be the point? What kind of friendship would it be with Ron still believing that Harry had put his name in the Goblet? He had to come to the realization on his own. Honestly I can't understand that statement that all Harry cared about was his problem. Yes, how inconsiderate and out of line of Harry to be stressed about the fact that someone put his name in, most likely to kill him. I mean come on, Ron is upset(AGAIN) about being poor; of course that should take precedence over everything else. Harry has been an excellent friend to Ron. From their first meeting, he was willing to put out all the misery of his life to make Ron feel better about his situation. A ploy that worked because Ron was actually cheered by the person's misery. After all that, when all was said and done, Harry didn't even need him to say he was sorry. Better than me, caused he'd ****ed sure say it, if it was me. Ron is a good friend to Harry but there's been too many times that Harry is made to feel bad for things he has no control over. Even when they were friends again, Harry noted that when Ron said girls would ask Harry to the ball because of who he was; he was keeping the bitterness in his voice to a minimum. I'll repeat, jealousy is normal but not healthy to let it eat at us. Not to get too deep here, but it is after all one of the deadly sins. It is a feeling and emotion that can destroy us very easily if not checked.

lleyki actually the statement was made by JKR herself. Yes Harry had HUGE problems but he still was "too proud" as JKR herself said to talk Harry just didn't want to talk. JKR stated this and explained that even Harry has his flaws. She didn't create Harry perfect (how good would it be, if he would be perfect) Yes he explained but it is hard to believe that your name 'happens' to be drop in there. Ron was not mad at Harry for being poor he was mad because not even Fred and George were able to get into the tournament and Harry was able to. The fact that he was poor had nothing to do with this. Interesting point you bring out that Harry didn't need Ron to say he was sorry. But did Harry said it NO!. Ron still felt bad about not talking to Harry (incident of Fred and George). When you have a fight with one of your friends and everything is settle even when is not your fault you value the friendship so much that you also apologize because in a fight there is always grounds to say your sorry. You say things you didn't need too. Like... even Mad at Harry Ron still showed his concern about him. (Stairs incident.) Ron tried to be nice to Harry but Harry just snarled at him. Ron was worried for him comes looking for him and Harry just snaps at him. He had to provoke Ron saying all kind of nasty things. Ron didn't know what he had interrupted. This made grounds for a small and insignificant Sorry! Harry is not a perfect character. JKR said it herself not me.

About the Malfoy incident I could not remember so I actually had to look it up. I assuming it is the incident on where Malfoy gets the badge and mocks at Harry. YES he didn't defend him but he didn't laugh at him either. Another trully rotten very jealous person would have joined the rest of the class at least on laughing. Ron didn't do anything he didn't defend him but he didn't laught at him either. No Ron didn't sit down with him when everything pass but he was still angry at Harry.

I am not saying that Ron is perfect he is NOT. But then Harry isn't either and certainly not Hermione. JKR created this characthers with flaws. And seeing from the point of view of a writer, every characther has to have his flaws otherwise you wouldn't have a story!

Very good post lleyki!! There as long as Turambars and Blues!!:evil: lol!! I havent read all of it but I will make sure I do!! Because Im sure there veryvery good and of good quality!!

I would say ron & hermione definetely, maybe harry & cho(unless she's still all weepy over cedric) and, although this may sound stupid, Dumbledore & McGonagall(tho they're kinda old)

Here's my reasons for a few couples.

Ron+Hermione=I've supported this couple since, gee, I think CoS. It's kinda hard to explain why. Ron always seems to cheer Hermione up someway or another . Also, in PoA, when Hermione told Harry and Ron about Buckbeak, she cried on who's shoulder? Ron. Also, she was really down that Ron had been ignoring her. She also could tell when Ron was jealous of Harry, ect. ect. I just feel they're right for each other.

Harry+Hermione=Possible, but in my opinion less prossible then R/H. I've never really found evidence that they liked each other in that way.

Harry+Ginny=Never ever considered this couple. Ginny just has a little obssesion over Harry because he's famous. Harry hardly notices her.

Harry+Cho=I see this more of a friendship realtionship then a love relationship(though I like it alot more then the other H/somebody couples). Cho needs someone who she can talk to about Cedric's death, she needs someone to be there for her. I think Harry would do that. But I don't think she'd get over Cedric for a while. Maybe after that...

So in my opinon, R/H, H/C, H/Somebody New :D Hehe, Harry/Hermione/Ron love triangle....I have seen way too many triangles like that *coughANIMEcough*

Originally posted by tintinboy
I would say ron & hermione definetely, maybe harry & cho(unless she's still all weepy over cedric) and, although this may sound stupid, Dumbledore & McGonagall(tho they're kinda old)

OMG!! I wanted McGonagall and Dumbledore to hookup!! I cant believe someone agrees with me!!lol!!


But tintinboy you should read lleyki's post it explains some reasons why NOT Hermione and Ron...also Harry shouldnt really go out with Cho the reason for this is that in previous posts some other memeber have said that in POA when the demontors come(sorry if I spelt it rong) but she just points and says "OHHH!!"( I think Malfoy and Crabbe Goyle and Flint our dressed up as them Im not to sure) and some members thought that was rude of her....Also she seems to be more interasted him as a friend more then get in a relentionship... I also think that they wouldn't be a very good couple because they hardly no anything about each other Cho only knows that Harry is famous he defeated you-know-who a couple of times, he is an excellent quidditch player he is bestfriends with Hermione and Ron. He also is very tight with Dumbledore.
And Harry only knows that Cho liked Cedric, she is a fairly good quidditch player she plays for the Ravenclaw team she also is fairly popular and he finds her attractive...these are the only things he know about her and she knows abiout him...

These are some reasons why they shouldn't get together they know nothing about each other......You should also read some of lleyki's posts!! they will tell you some things why the couples you have choosen shouldn't be......

GilyAnn you are quite right that the dress robes would have been embarrassing for Ron. It would have been a problem for him.
Fair enough, Ron deserves some sympathy for being poor and having to live up to the deeds of older brothers, but other characters have problems and haven't whinged about it the way he has.
Hermione for instance has had to enter a completely new world on her own, not knowing anyone, completely away from her parents and having to cope with some people who dislike her simply because of who her parents are. Her response to that challenge? Dive right in and try and find out as much about that world as possible to help her survive in it. She doesn't whinge about it.
Ron at least knows about that world and has three brothers and a sister at school with him during the course of the books to help him settle into and get through school. He's still got parents who provide for him. Maybe they can't give him the best of everything but they are goodhearted people.
And what about Harry's problems? For example, I'm sure Harry found it difficult having to sit in class on his own because his friend wouldn't talk to him and having to put up with the dislike of other students without his friend supporting him. Is having to wear some less than top-line clothes worse than that?
And that's without getting into the more significant facts of Harry not having any parents, being brought up by people who hate him and being in real constant danger from an evil wizard.
I like Ron as a character, I find him funny and like I've said previously he's mostly loyal to his friends.
But sometimes he doesn't seem to realise that Harry isn't an ordinary friend, that Harry needs more support than an ordinary friend would.
Which also means he needs to realise that Harry's problems make his pale into insignificance.

Very nice points there. ;D Kinda complicanted, but nontheless good.

Originally posted by Turambar
GilyAnn you are quite right that the dress robes would have been embarrassing for Ron. It would have been a problem for him.
Fair enough, Ron deserves some sympathy for being poor and having to live up to the deeds of older brothers, but other characters have problems and haven't whinged about it the way he has.
Hermione for instance has had to enter a completely new world on her own, not knowing anyone, completely away from her parents and having to cope with some people who dislike her simply because of who her parents are. Her response to that challenge? Dive right in and try and find out as much about that world as possible to help her survive in it. She doesn't whinge about it.
Ron at least knows about that world and has three brothers and a sister at school with him during the course of the books to help him settle into and get through school. He's still got parents who provide for him. Maybe they can't give him the best of everything but they are goodhearted people.
And what about Harry's problems? For example, I'm sure Harry found it difficult having to sit in class on his own because his friend wouldn't talk to him and having to put up with the dislike of other students without his friend supporting him. Is having to wear some less than top-line clothes worse than that?
And that's without getting into the more significant facts of Harry not having any parents, being brought up by people who hate him and being in real constant danger from an evil wizard.
I like Ron as a character, I find him funny and like I've said previously he's mostly loyal to his friends.
But sometimes he doesn't seem to realise that Harry isn't an ordinary friend, that Harry needs more support than an ordinary friend would.
Which also means he needs to realise that Harry's problems make his pale into insignificance.


OMG!! You are so right Turambar!! Ron has many people to support him he has 9 other family memebers who love and support him...Hermione has two but as you said she is facing a dangerous new world with suprises at every turn. Also she has Malfoy to look after and has to deal with Snape glaring at her every time she answers a question right. And Harry he has only his two bestfriends along with Ginny,Hagrid and Dumbledore to support him...The Weasley family supports him also...but yet Hermione and Ron are the people he would probably die to save.... Ron has the most love and support out of all of them...Ron dosne't reliexe it but I'm sure Harry would trade all of his fame and glory to have the love and support Ron has.
Ron might be poor but he has a greater rich...that is love...and yet all he is worried about his how much money he has he acts greedy when he dosent relieze that his bestfriend would give all the gold in the world to have what Ron has...he dosen't relieze that he is rich in his own way he has a loving family and two bestfriends and yet he gets jeleous when Harry gets his name put in the Goblet of Fire it take Harry almost DIEING to relieze it....and that isn't right if Harry has to almost die to make Ron believe him...Ron has to get over his jelouesness and relieze that Harry loves him like a brother that Harry will give anything to have the support and love and family Ron has...Ron is a great character but he does need to relieze that he has something that is far more valuable then riches he has love and happeness....

That's right! I really hate it when Ron shows how jealous he is of Harry's fortune. But wait, what fortune? Harry is an orphan... I get sad by saying that.. hehe.

Ron must treasure the love he has from his family and friends. That's beautiful... Uhh...*cough* yeah.

Originally posted by snitch14
That's right! I really hate it when Ron shows how jealous he is of Harry's fortune. But wait, what fortune? Harry is an orphan...

What I mean by fortune is that Harry has more money then Ron...and Ron gets jealous at this and acts in differnent ways....

Yes, but Harry isn't happy with his money. He more wishes to have a normal family. Ok, that's it, back to the subject of the thread. hehe :-P

I'm not so sure Hermione's response is the best one, either. Yes, she's doing something productive about her issues, but I have to wonder if she wasn't trying to hide from them behind her schoolbooks rather than confronting them, at least at first. Look what happened when she finally snapped in Azkaban. Maybe if she'd let out a complaint or two from time to time, she wouldn't have felt the need to physically assault Malfoy. (Okay, granted, it's Malfoy; he probably would have deserved it anway. :p)

Besides, I think Ron's getting blamed a bit unfairly. Remember how surprised Harry and Hermione were when he admitted he hated being poor? That sounds to me like someone who at least makes an effort to cope.

More importantly, I don't think someone should have to support a friend completely at the expense of his or her own needs. Ideally, it should be mutual. Maybe that does mean that Ron needs to do more for Harry than vice versa, but however insignificant Ron's problems may be in comparison to Harry's, they're still going to be there.

Okay, I think I've dragged this way off topic. :o Um...so who thinks Millicent's going to get a boyfriend this year? :p

Originally posted by snitch14
Yes, but Harry isn't happy with his money. He more wishes to have a normal family. Ok, that's it, back to the subject of the thread. hehe :-P

I know Harry isnt Happy with his money as I said in my previous post that Harry would give anything to have what Ron has...lol maybe we should make a thread about this!!

Yes back on topic...

I think that Ron and Herimone might be a good choice but maybe...they wouldn't be a good couple some reasons is that they fight and maybe that isnt for passion maybe that is because they are irrated with each other...

Hermione and Harry wouldn't be a good possibilty I think that kiss at then end of GOF was more of a friendly kiss I think that Hermione is more comfortable around Harry then Ron maybe because she likes Ron and maybe that why she was to shy to kiss Ron...as I think Turambar or lleyki have posted that Harry should be alone...I think that he should be alone is because I think he will die at a young age...most likely maybe 20....reason for this is that is a interview(Blue I think posted it) A reporter asked: Will you write about Harry's childern? or his life after hogwarts? and she replied: Are you sure he will even live that long??

So maybe this means that Harry will die in his early years...Also this might mean that Harry will die...

Please raise your hand if you think people are making too big a deal over who will 'hook up' as Harry Potter is neither a soap opera nor a sappy teen romance story.

*raises her own hand*

Hey, doesn't matter what it is. If there are male and female characters, somehow I always find myself trying to pair them up. :o

You're probably right DC, it's got a bit out of hand!
I understand what you are getting at Rowena about Ron's needs but it got a bit extreme. In reaction to Harry's name coming out of the goblet, he lets Harry become more isolated just as most of the school turn on him and stands by as Malfoy attacks him.

Originally posted by DarlingChild
Please raise your hand if you think people are making too big a deal over who will 'hook up' as Harry Potter is neither a soap opera nor a sappy teen romance story.

*raises her own hand*


I agree I think we all are treating this like a friggen soap oprea!!! I know I have but I'm starting to think it's a lil pathetic!!lol! We should all just wait for it to happen...I mean come on!! I don't think were going to guess the exact plot!! And I dont think we all will all agree on which couple or who dies...But still I think it is fun to argue and make fun of it before it comes out!! I bet we all will be on this forum after we read it saying " I can't believe so and so hooked up!!" " Omg!! I cant believe so died!! I was crying!!" :rotfl:

It will be amusing to see these posts!!:P


* raises hand*

AHHHH!! SOAPIES!!!

*runs out of the room*

Originally posted by DarlingChild
Please raise your hand if you think people are making too big a deal over who will 'hook up' as Harry Potter is neither a soap opera nor a sappy teen romance story.

*raises her own hand*


Well, people are probably making a big deal out of who's going to pair up because JKR devoted so much time to it in GoF. If the teen angst had just been relegated to a small subplot, then maybe no one would really care. But since it was given so much time in the book, that's what fans are going to talk about.

I like the Ron character, but based on how JKR has written Hermione, I don't see any reason whatsoever why she'd like him.

But since it dominated the book so much, then that's what fans are going to talk about.

When was it that teen angst dominat the book?

Out of hand or not... we are going to keep talking about it. Because like someone stated earlier, it was given a hefty amount of attention in GoF. Besides, that is the point of this whole thread, isn't it? To talk about potential romances in the HP Universe. Why we like one shipping over the other, proof, analysis, etc. If we stop we defeat the purpose of the thread... and then it may eventually get closed. And the way I see it... if your tired of the subject than don't view/reply to the thread. It's that simple. :sigh:

...I dunno if I want to continue this discussion... If I keep thinking about it too much I might disappointed with the result when the book come out...

Originally posted by DarlingChild
Please raise your hand if you think people are making too big a deal over who will 'hook up' as Harry Potter is neither a soap opera nor a sappy teen romance story.

*raises both hands.

include me in the list. goodness! hp is not a freakin' soap opera and it's definitely not dawson's creek! hp is not cheesy for goodness' sake! can you imagine hermione acting like joey potter in that show?! NOT!!!

:grumble:

and about the H/G fan fics, ive read a couple of them from other sites and whoa. a bit too impossible if you ask me. so soap opera-ish. so Freddie Prince-ish. :yawn:

Originally posted by Max
You've read H/G fanfics? Not to be rude, but fanfic authors sometimes twist the plotlines of the previous books to fit what they want in their story. Ginny, the little background character becomes wonderful, sweet Ginny who happens to be the prettiest girl in school. And besides that, Ron and Hermione finally 'understand' each other and have a relationship. Sometimes it's just so perfect that I feel like I was going to puke.

Fanfics, if properly written, are wonderful reads, but for 99% of them, that's not the case.

No offense taken, I noticed it too. The stuff I read was good, not great, and not anything near Rowling's stuff. Ginny did all the sudden became this really confindent perfect match for Harry. It was a little unrealistic, but I think I'm so desperate for something new to read from the Potter Universe, I've been reading anything and everything. In fact a lot of things in the fan fin I've been reading have been bothering me...Most of the wrting isn't very strong. Maybe I've grown to the H/G ship because I too know the pain of haing a crush on your older brother's best friend... ;D
Although I must say, the fic I read did a good job with R/H because they didn't just ALL the SUDDEN get it. Yes, eventually in a later story (same author) they did get together, they did a good job keeping their realationship realistic and true to the real R/H ship.
And saying that authors take pervious plot lines and manipulat a story to their liking, well that's the whole point of fanfic.

Originally posted by RonFan24
And saying that authors take pervious plot lines and manipulat a story to their liking, well that's the whole point of fanfic.


I am so happy you said that RonFan24!! I would have said that myself, but you beat to the punch... good job. ;)

I prefer H/Hr fanfics over R/Hr and H/G ones. The reason for that is that I've noticed that the number of quality fics for H/Hr is generally higher than the number of quality fics for R/Hr. I haven't read every fanfic ever written, so I may be mistaken, but all of us judge something from our own views and opinions, and because of that, each individual's judgement of something differs.

Good fics are few and far between, but they're worth the effort of differentiating between the good fics and the great fics.

Ok! I feel like being Hermione today so I hope you can all bear with me� I will try to make things logical and objective. To start with, these are my PERSONAL VIEWS.

I would like to say it again that I am a canonical shipper and NOT a preferential shipper. I ship what JKR ships. I`m one of those who are objective and serious readers. I personally find it easier to discuss because I DID`N`T invest feelings to my ship. I will say it again, to those who have shipping preference other than mine, I honestly accept and respect their shipping preferences. I`ve read somewhere mentioning open-mindedness. i will just define it. It is accepting, considering new ideas, suggestions and opinions ; there`s tolerance. BUT agreeing AND disagreeing are the results after considering these ideas/opinions. It is not that if one agrees to the argument given means she/he is open-minded and the one who disagrees is narrow-minded and can be regarded stubborn. One has a EVIDENT counter-argument or a reason to disagree and it is the turn of the other to consider why….to be open-minded. Minds work differently. Lastly, disagreeing DOESN`T mean that the person is against to the idea. I just hope that everybody knows the difference.


For me, it is important as a reader to LOVE and VALUE each character or whatever I can find from Harry`s character down to the Blast-Ended Skrewts for EACH has a purpose,symbolism, significance, uniqueness and has equal importance. And again NO character is created perfectly. Anyway, I TRULY believe that every writer like JKR took time to give PROPER distinctions to EACH of her characters. That is why, sometimes, a reader, will find one character so close to his/her heart because somehow she/he see herself/himself through this character. But then, I think it is NOT a reason to wish the other character to be like the other because as I`ve said EACH has a purpose to complete the story. There will be no longer distinction and the purpose of that character will not serve well. Like in real life, one person is not like the other and we have different purposes in this world. I truly trust JKR as author.She is the reason why I`m reading HP. I will say it again that what we`re discussing are characters in the BOOKS in which the author created wonderfully and NOT real life characters. We can somehow CLEARLY predict what will happen next if we will treat them equally and see the SENSE of character of each PLUS finding all the CLUES.

REGARDING THE STORY (let us establish first the fact):
The story is about Harry Potter….not Ron Weasley , not Hermione Granger….not Draco Malfoy etc…So I think it is objective if we will make him the significant factor and the deciding factor in every situation..
Harry is the hero. Ron AND Hermione are his two sidekicks..
One of the themes in the story is FREINDSHIP. Harry, Ron and Hermione, the trio, are best friends.
Narrator - Third person( yes! the author), following Harry
Point of view - Although the narrative is written in third person(yes! the author again), we see from Harry's point of view, and we witness his private thoughts. This the reason why I`ve said, it`s objective to make Harry the significant factor.

PREDICTION REGARDING ROMANCES

We`re discussing about NOT real life relationships. We`re identifying CLUES in the Harry Potter books (I DON`T mixed up with HP movies and NOT fanon) and trying to figure out what will happen next with regard to relationships. This is NOT necessarily going to follow real-life patterns. In real life, people will NOT ever think or even consider if the same hair color is a factor to have a GOOD romantic relationship BUT in books the AUTHOR will consider it. We can`t use “sufercial, unrealistic, sort of words, for a response or explanation since what were discussing is actually NOT real .Yes! This is the wonderful essence of literature.The contemporary world of JKR. I just trust her.

REGARDING H/G

I want to make it clear that my previous posts is NOT to prove that Ginny is perfect girl for Harry. It`s about a very OBJECTIVE H/G evidences which is according to LITERARY/ STRUCTURAL REALM or LITERARY TECHNIQUES AND PATTERN.

I have read this recently that H/G follows Victorian boarding school pattern.
An orphaned boy who grew up in unpalatable background goes off to boarding school
the boy has a best guy friend
the best guy friend has a younger sister
the boy is good at sports
the boy becomes a hero through an extraordinary act of bravery and/or moral sacrifice
the hero and best guy friend's younger sister gets together and marry thus making the hero and the best guy friend brothers by law.
These are pretty interesting pattern.. It seems to me that JKR is fond of classic literature references and H/G can make suitable literary ending for the HP series .
By the way, I HONESTLY admit that some evidences/ideas are NOT made by me since my “literature knowledge� stuck up already but through researches and exchange of ideas I had with EXPERIENCED and PROFESSIONAL writers themselves. It`s like I`m having a review course in writing techniques again but what is important for me that I LEARNED, BROADENED, SHARPENED my knowledge.I am NOT shy to admit it for I always love to learn new things. I`ve even once encountered a very humble person who shared her expertise to me and only to find out in the end that she had just finished her masters in literature with highest honor.I truly admire them for improving and reviving my knowledge. it`s starting to be a hobby already.:D But at least, I find these H/G evidences VERY objective.;)
Anyway, *if* ever H/G will happen, I don't think H/G will get together in book 5 (though my feeling is Ginny becoming a friend to Harry) or married at the end of book seven. (Perhaps in epilogue). Ginny`s character (as of GOF) is still flat but NOT boring so to speak , undeveloped character and a poor match for the all-rounded Harry. But since Ginny will play a larger role in book five as what JKR has promised, I'm hoping that she'll flesh out enough to become a match for Harry in future series. I`m sure she will play a significant role (remember the magical bond between H/G). Perhaps she can somehow help Harry which can be related to the main plot so at least the existence of her character will be more interesting and not just to make Ron and Harry brothers.


REGARDING GINNY


Ginny`s character is not YET develop. As I`ve mentioned before, I believe it`s one of JKR`s intention for keeping Ginny`s character underdevelop….keeping her in the background so that Harry will NOT develop sisterly/brotherly love for her.
Yes, she is not YET interesting. Yes, her appearances are rare YET, but I believe JKR will not expect her readers to see Ginny as a boring character . …. to say somewhat she screams, she defends, she blushes etc..I think that is too underestimated interpretation. But I respect that. I will say it again that her character has a purpose and her purpose DIFFERS from other character`s purpose like Hermione. I REALLY love Hermione not only because she reminds me of my younger self but she serves her purpose so well. And like all other characters, Hermione is NOT perfect. Harry is NOT perfect. Ron is NOT perfect etc. They all have their own flaws and faults. Like in real life….nobody is perfect. But Hermione is really a stand out since her character is well-developed. But this DOESN`T stop me to see a little BIT importance or essence of other characters like Ginny. I believe, despite of Ginny`s very less appearance compared to Hermione, we can SOMEHOW see the SENSE of her character. Example! Let`us just analyze one scene In Flourish and Blotts:.

Yes!she stood up for Harry in front of Draco Malfoy. We see her COURAGE – how many of us will reprimand an older boy whom we didn’t know at the age of 11? Later, we found out that Ginny being sorted in Gryffindor house…the house known for BRAVERY. So the sorting hat is right about her. There is connection. Just in this one scene, we know already that Ginny DIDN`t like Harry because he is famous that makes her different from other characters.. She is brave. She is transparent and emotional. She is defensive. Actually, throughout the HP series, I NEVER think of her character as sweet. Maybe in fanon but NOT in canon.. And I am ONLY dealing with HP books.

Yes!Ron AND Hermione may have followed Harry through his adventures, and have THEIR friendship to keep them together, but there`s something that they CANNOT shared or connect with Harry that ONLY Ginny does. Ginny is said to be “looking nearly as bad as Harry felt� in PoA(hmmm…another forshadowing by the author) Ginny is the ONLY one who truly understands what Harry is going through on the train, because she like Harry had to face Tom Riddle/Voldemort. In GOF, We see Harry detaching himself from Ron and Hermione more frequently as the series progresses(think ‘The Scar’, and when he escapes to the Owlery to avoid Ron-Hermione sniping), yet he still needs friends more than ever Again, I think, in book 5, Ginny will become Harry`s friend.

There are lots to know about her despite of her rare appearances and I will say it again, being fair, objective, intuitive will not do harm to see a LITTLE bit the sense of her character. And what makes her differ from other characters….Harry save her personally. It`s even described in COS how Harry felt when she`s captured. “ it was probably the worst day of Harry`s entire life� AND “Harry could see the sun sinking, blood red, below the skyline. This was the WORST he had ever FELT.� Did in other books explained this intense about Harry`s feelings to anybody?As for Harry noticing Ginny? Of course!

Regarding the comment on “we never hear Harry remembering that SAVING incident�
Well, We don’t see Harry suddenly becoming attracted to Pettigrew, or Snape to Harry, do we?

Regarding boring and insulting character if she start dating Harry is insulting as a woman.

Well, if *ever* there will be dating, it will be in book 7 or in epilogue.
I will say it again that every character has a PURPOSE. I believe it`s one of the author`s intent that Ginny`s affection and devotion will be identified with Harry. To make things clearer, I will use myself as an example in real life.

I am a VERY career-oriented woman. I have my OWN convictions and beliefs. Actually, I can say that , I am Hermione-like in many ways. And it`s my choice to be this way and I believe my choices serve one my purposes in this world.. But this DOESN`T mean and NEVER I think of myself that I am a better person or woman so to speak compared to a woman who chose to be a housewife…to be solely DEVOTED to her husband and her children. This kind of woman has also her own convictions and beliefs. A woman who wish to be identified to her family is also her choice and she believes that her choices serve one of her purposes in this world. I REFUSED to believe that is insulting as a woman But to those who believe it, I just can simply accept it.But for me, I have respect to those women too since I believe it`s not also an easy task. I believe in equality the way I respect and believe in choices.This reminds me Prof. Dumbledore`s words "It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities,"

Anyway, going back to Ginny`s devotion to Harry, we`re aware that “The story of Harry Potter is the story of a boy in SEARCH of a family. In Mirror of Erised (book 1),we see that Harry's greatest desire is to see his past parents and other relatives back which of course he can't have BUT he can still have a FUTURE family of his own. Maybe with Ginny`s DEVOTION to Harry , she will be able to fulfill his desire ….to complete his story

Again, I am not defending Ginny`s character here but just putting a little bit SENSE of her rare appearances or proving H/G but all my evidences and clues are just objective.

And if one will say that H/G pair will always resemble the dashing hero with his little, delicate lady as a cliché which is one of the most annoying ones. Actually, any writer can`t avoid to have a cliché. R/H, H/H, H/D, H/S is also a cliche. But I think what is important is that JKR follows her own patterns. If H/G happens, it might be JKR`s taste of romance. It`s not that I like it but I care about her way she writes romance.


On Ron as a character with inferiority complex, jealous, stupid , childish and annoying,

Well, My view on Ron`s character is far different from this. But to those who see Ron this way , they`ve already established that `they don't like Ron as a character. What I remember, JKR said that although she hadn't specifically patterned Ron after anyone but he turned out like her *best friend* and even dedicate the COS book to him. Do anyone really think that she sees her best friend that way? And I will say it again Ron like Harry,Hermione, Ginny etc is created to serve a specific purpose.
And lastly, Ron is NOT jealous about Harry`s accomplishments but his popularity. Being famous. He`s NOT even jealous of Hermione`s accomplishsments, in fact, even PROUD of her.


Regarding JKR makes a point of showing that Harry has read Hermione's mind.

Oh yes! even Ron/Harry, Ron/Harry/Hermione, Ron/Hermione, and Harry/Ginny:D


I want to EXPLAIN more especially with that of "literary criticism".. why Hermione is not the right girl for Harry" which I`ve mentioned before. I * KNOW* something is need to explain but I will do it next time:-)
but I just want to reply this one


“there is nothing special about Harry and he is nothing but a pampered jock?

The “literary criticism� is NOT about Harry`s specialness but “Why Hermione is not suited to be Harry`s girl�.which is HEAVILY supported by TEXTUAL examples in HP books. …which is according to Harry`s point of view. ….as we witness his private thoughts…..as JKR wrote it. Well, is it Harry`s fault (or JKR?) if Hermione doesn`t fit to be his girlfriend ? Friend yes but girlfriend not. Morever, this "literary criticism" , doesn`t need to convince me about this. From book 1, I see it already. ;)
:D

Again, these are just my "thoughts for this morning. I hope I can find more time to reply.Busy with my class:(

Here`s Bluemagic...silently waving Harry and Hermione`s friendship flag ;) Cheers to all!

Bluemagic, I think that was just a little bit TOO long. Please forgive me for not reading all of it.

No doubt you make some excellent points and offer very valued insight, but once you started talking about Victorian Boarding School Patterns and Structural Realms I kind of lost interest.

I have read some of you other posts and I am confident that I already know what your opinions are, without needing to read the same things all over again.

No offense intended.

I say, let's just hope Harry, Ron and Hermione all stay single.

Dear holy smurfs Blue, when does your first book come out?

:D

Rowena Ravenclaw and bluemagic Excelent post I can hardly add on to that!

GilyAnn, lanifiel, tcboo :D

I know! I know! I`m guilty.Sorry people! and thanks for the remarks .Yeah! I DIDN`T (as if) notice it`s really long. I just type and type. Well, I know discussing "literary structural realm" is not quite appealing to some.Personally, I`m interested according to writer`s point of view. I was once frustrated writer:D Only to realize that my "purpose" in life is not wriitng. he he he I`ve just thought, maybe some are interested especially to those who are inspiring writers. Anyway, we`re predicting so at least it can also give as hints. and they`re evident, aren`t they? At least we didn`t limit ourselves. :D

Anyway, I`ll *try* to post shorter one next time if I can find the time.(crossing my fingers). I still have to reply to some posts.

just to tell a secret... I`m sneaking just to use the computer. Whew!

cheers to all! ;)

GilyAnn I enjoyed reading your posts too. I REALLY like and admire the line of your thinking. I have JKR`s biography book and I`ve read there also what you`ve previously mentioned ;).

And other posters too...minds think differently... anyway ;)

I believe that this is your first post in this thread for a long time, Bluemagic.

Originally posted by bluemagic
Yes!she stood up for Harry in front of Draco Malfoy. We see her COURAGE – how many of us will reprimand an older boy whom we didn’t know at the age of 11? Later, we found out that Ginny being sorted in Gryffindor house…the house known for BRAVERY. So the sorting hat is right about her. There is connection. Just in this one scene, we know already that Ginny DIDN`t like Harry because he is famous that makes her different from other characters...

I'll have to disagree with a few points there. Mind you, I still respect your views and opinions; we're all entitled to express our own thoughts, aren't we? I agree that Ginny is brave, as you said, how many 11 year olds would stand up to someone who's older than her? However, that scene does not have anything that suggests that Ginny sees Harry beyond his fame. She could have defended Harry purely because she has a crush on him.

Not to sound rude, but in your post, it seems as if you are trying to convince yourself that H/G is going to happen. And about Harry's feelings when he found out that Ginny was taken inside the chamber: wouldn't you do the same if you were in Harry's position. Harry is a very caring and compassionate person. He would give his life to save others. Ginny is his best friend's little sister; even if he didn't have feelings for her, he still cares for her just as he cares for any other friend.

And lastly, Ron is NOT jealous about Harry`s accomplishments but his popularity. Being famous. He`s NOT even jealous of Hermione`s accomplishsments, in fact, even PROUD of her.

Ron is jealous. He wants to be Quidditch Captain, Head Boy and to shine above the rest. Ron isn't proud of Hermione, he snaps at her some insignificant matter every ten seconds, and she copes with it. I don't know how I could be friends with someone who is as childish as Ron. He needs to grow up before his friendship with Harry and Hermione is ended. Even Harry is growing tired of Ron. He said in GoF that he doesn't want to 'go after Ron trying to get him to grow up.'

We'll just have to wait for June 21st before we know anything for sure. And then the cycle will start again. I could just see it: Book 6 Predictions: Who will fall in love with whom?

im so glad somebody here finally said that ron is jealous. because he is! no offense but you don't have to be a genius to see that the guy is jealous with his bestfriend.

about harry and ginny, please. it's unlikely to happen. ginny is just a little sister to harry. yeah i know it's hard for the girl but the guy's just like that so to ginny "go find another black-haired, green eyed someone who'll definitely fall for you and won't treat you as a sister."

i don't deny i like her now but she's just not harry's type.

I disagree that Harry feels that Ginny is like a little sister. He treats Hermione more like a sister.

It is true that Harry may have felt that way initially but I think things are changing. They're all growing up. They're changing physically as well as emotionally.

We'll have to wait and see.

You're right, Harry doesn't treat Ginny like a sister. In fact, he hardly notices her at all. I believe that you support R/Hr and H/G, pegoheart144.

I definitely support Ron/Hermione. I'm still not certain what will happen with Harry but I think we'll know a lot more after this next book. There is a foundation laid for something to happen with Harry and Ginny but we'll have to see if anything develops or it peters out.

Uh huh. Why don't you try reading some of Illeyki's and Turambar's posts about why Harry and Hermione are rather compatible with each other. Also, it would help if you state the reason you think R/Hr will happen.

I've stated before the reasons I think something will happen with Ron and Hermione. This relationship has been building ever since they met. It's evident in the tension between them and how they're at each other all the time. Even though they're very different from each other they are well suited.

Well, you should really read some of Illeyki's posts. They are very well written and explain why it shouldn't be Ron/Hermione.

Originally posted by Max
I prefer H/Hr fanfics over R/Hr and H/G ones. The reason for that is that I've noticed that the number of quality fics for H/Hr is generally higher than the number of quality fics for R/Hr. I haven't read every fanfic ever written, so I may be mistaken, but all of us judge something from our own views and opinions, and because of that, each individual's judgement of something differs.

Definitely agreed on that last point. Most of the H/Hr fics I've read, while they may do a decent job of pinning down Harry and Hermione, seem to do some ridiculous stuff with Ron--either he turns insanely, melodramatically jealous, or he's just shunted off to the side. Of course, plenty of the R/Hr fics do the exact same thing with Harry. Whatever happens with either of those relationships, Rowling's going to have a real balancing act on her hands.

That is true. But J.K. did hint on R/Hr thing. They will DEFINATELY have sometin but I still have faith that it might not work out. I mean, COME ON, they fight like every other chapter. But what do I know?

i don't remember who posted it, but someone said that if any relationships do surface, it will probably be stated in the epilogue. i agree. it's obvious that feelings have been developing throughout the books between ron, harry, hermione, and ginny. but seeing as that harry usually has help from friends when he's going after voldemort, any romantic feelings between them will have to be pushed aside if they're going to defeat the dark lord. i think that until voldemort is defeated, there won't be any definite boyfriend/girlfriend relationships.

But, go back. Harry needs someone to help him keep his mind off the terrible things once in a while. Friends are not gonna help much, Harry needs someone like sorta a gf.

I'm REALLY not sure bout what I said but I think Harry needs a girl.

So close to finding out the truth now... drool. I do agree here thou, if anything happens, it will eventually have to take a back seat to the developing story with voldemort. I just don't see a plot where Ron and Harry are not friends like normal in a showdown towards the end of the book. Harry and Ron had that fight in bk4 and neither one of them enjoyed it at all so I do not see huge sections of the story with them doing their seperate thing. Harry and Hermione have always been at a more relaxed understanding level of friendship and I do not see how they could possibly fight. They just get along well, too well.

Originally posted by Ame
I am so happy you said that RonFan24!! I would have said that myself, but you beat to the punch... good job. ;)
Thank you, thank you very much. ;)


http://thechalkallran.net/users/RonFan24Butterflies.JPG

Cheers Max. Other people like yourself have come up with some really good posts, and there was some excellent early posts from people like Muse and Lizard Laugh. IIeyki's just stand out in particular because even though they are long they are logical, concise, well-argued and she backs up her arguments. And I'm not saying that because I invariable agree with what she has actually said. I edit a lot of opinion pieces in my work and if an article is written well enough you can enjoy it even if you broadly disagree with what the person's saying. Especially if you can feel the passion in the writing. For instance (this is totally off topic, but anyway) yesterday I had to edit two articles on whether there should be war against Iraq - one for and one against. They were so wonderfully argued that you could shut off your own opinion while reading and understand what each was saying and see merit in both cases. And it's not like I don't have strong personal views on that subject! It's great to read stuff that makes you think.

Originally posted by Turambar
Cheers Max. Other people like yourself have come up with some really good posts, and there was some excellent early posts from people like Muse and Lizard Laugh. IIeyki's just stand out in particular because even though they are long they are logical, concise, well-argued and she backs up her arguments. And I'm not saying that because I invariable agree with what she has actually said. I edit a lot of opinion pieces in my work and if an article is written well enough you can enjoy it even if you broadly disagree with what the person's saying. Especially if you can feel the passion in the writing. For instance (this is totally off topic, but anyway) yesterday I had to edit two articles on whether there should be war against Iraq - one for and one against. They were so wonderfully argued that you could shut off your own opinion while reading and understand what each was saying and see merit in both cases. And it's not like I don't have strong personal views on that subject! It's great to read stuff that makes you think.

Thats a really good post Turmabar!! Also BlueMagic post really good post!!:) Same with Ame!! I enjoy reading shorter posts!!lol!! But if the point is well argued(lleyki's) I enjoy reading them!! It is a pleasure seeing all of these posts!!

back on topic.............

I think that a R/Hr or a H/Hr would not be good...I no that I wish Harry Ron and Hermione to get together with someone but if one of the two pair up...what about the third?? The third will be the odd person out the 3rd wheel...and being the 3rd wheel is no fun..in some R/Hr fan fics Harry is left alone and starts to spend time with other people...I no that is a good thing that Harry is uh..."expanding his horizions" but they have been Bestfriends since they met and that would be throwing away a really good friendship!!:( I also think that as lleyki have said that Harry seems he shouldnt be getting in a relentionship..(read one of lleyki's post I think in the high 60's and 70's...) Also Harry shouldnt get in a reletionship because I think that he will probably die in his early years(of course after he gradutes Hogwarts) this reason he shouldn't have a g/f or kids because he would die early and that would be hard for kids growing up with out a dad...

But I don't want Harry growing through is older years single so I do want Harry to have atleast two or more girlfriends...maybe it could be Cho??

Also I don't think Harry and Hermione getting in a relentionship because when they break up wouldn't it be akward?? They would most likely fell akward around each other and they wouldn't be as close as friends as they were when they were younger....

I agree, SaRaH 23, but with the dark lord gone (Harry and friends would surely defeat him in the seventh book), how could Harry be killled? Sure, he could crash his broomstick or fall off a building, but those are not very likely to happen to Harry. Harry and Ron and Hermione will eventually pair up with someone who's right for them (Hermione's already been with Krum, right?), and when that happens (perhaps in the epilogue), it'll all fit into place. Remember, Rowling has the entire series planned out, even before she wrote HPPS, so we'll all just have to wait and see.

Originally posted by Max
I agree, SaRaH 23, but with the dark lord gone (Harry and friends would surely defeat him in the seventh book), how could Harry be killled? Sure, he could crash his broomstick or fall off a building, but those are not very likely to happen to Harry. Harry and Ron and Hermione will eventually pair up with someone who's right for them (Hermione's already been with Krum, right?), and when that happens (perhaps in the epilogue), it'll all fit into place. Remember, Rowling has the entire series planned out, even before she wrote HPPS, so we'll all just have to wait and see.

Thx you for agreeing with me Max....Your post is very good!! And ya a heard the JK has planned the whole thing out the only thing is piecing it together....Harry Hermione and Ron will find someone who is PERFECT for them we just have to wait and see:D

Yeah, Harry needs some love in his life.

yeah, harry does need some love, i just dont know if he can balance it in with his current life style. everything is hectic for him. along with school and quidditch, he'd have to balance his time between friends and his girlfriend, and on top of that, voldemort is back in power. anyone close to harry is in danger of becoming a target. i don't know if harry can handle people close to him becoming a liability to him.

Maybe because of all this going on, Harry won't actually have a girlfriend. Just someone who he has a crush. And he'll find out if that person likes him as well. But won't really take another step to make thing more complicated especially with all this uprising of Voldemort.

but jkr once said in an interview that she wants all characters to be truly seventeen. you know discover and have girlfriends and boyfriends and stuff.

maybe we will be able to meet harry's girlfriend in the seventh book. they're 17 in that book and i bet jkr will be writing something like that.

Sorry I didn't read all 86 pages of this thread, but it seems interesting from what I did skim.

Unfortunately, I think Harry is going to remain loveless, at least in Book V. My crystal ball tells me of a short fling between Ron and Hermione, nothing more.

I don't think anything major is going to happen in the love department. Better start looking in the romance section of the grocery store...

On a side note that I just thought of right after I clicked submit (doh!)...

I'd wager Draco will have a girlfriend, for show if nothing else. He's always looking to one-up Harry in any category, why not love? Draco and Hermione, there's a match for you. It sounds wild, but I've been reading too much fanfiction! They'd be a great bridge between rival factions.

:welcome: Welcome to the boards, draco_domiens! I hope that you've read the forum rules (you better follow them; the mods are a little picky). Draco and Hermione? It'll be a miracle that JK could do that realistically. Remember, no double posting. If you have something to add, just click that edit button at the top left hand side of every post.

Draco already has a girlfriend. Or at least he went to the Yule Ball with her. That is Pansy Parkinson.

Remember, Rowling has the entire series planned out, even before she wrote HPPS, so we'll all just have to wait and see.

that's it. jkr already planned everything from the very start. she knows who harry will end up with and i really think we should just wait for the last three books to answer us all. and whoever she is, there's really nothing we can do about it!:D

just one more thing that's bothering me, what do you guys think of the people who say that there will be some kind of homosexual thing that's going to happen in the books? i don't discriminate gays (i happen to have gay friends who have same sex relationships) but i just don't think homosexuality and harry potter should get together.

just a thought.:)

I think JK won't put any in the Potter stories. It would attract too much attention and draw focus away from the main story. The love relationships aren't supposed to be the focus of the story, IMO, and a homosexual relationship would just increase the focus for the wrong reasons.

And it would also make many fans angry. More than half the people reading HP are little kids, would she actually wanna go to homosexuality?

No offense to homosexuals, of course! :whistle:

theres no way she would put gayness into the book....its a bunch of 3rd graders readin it anyways

Originally posted by snitch14
But, go back. Harry needs someone to help him keep his mind off the terrible things once in a while. Friends are not gonna help much, Harry needs someone like sorta a gf.

I'm REALLY not sure bout what I said but I think Harry needs a girl. Very true. Harry needs to have some time when he's just being a teenager. There needs to be some lighter moments to balance the burden that's on his shoulders. The Quidditch playing and possibly any little romances will help in that regard.

If he doesn't, Voldemort in some ways wins. He wants everyone to be totaly terrified of him and put their lives on hold.

If Harry does get a girlfriend, she'd be at the top of Voldemort's hitlist. Voldemort could also abduct her and use her to lure Harry to him.

Actually Voldemort could use any of Harry's friends that way. It wouldn't necessarily be his girl friend.

I am a shipper to both Ron/Hermione and Harry/Ginny, I do not supprt Harry/Cho because that just doesn't seem the way she would have it turn out...

and I agree with pegoheart144 about using any of his friends.

:welcome: Welcome to the boards, RonWheezyRox! I hope that you've read the Forum Rules (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1885). I highly recommend that you read some of lleyki's and Turambar's posts for a different opinion on the R/Hr issue. You should also state the reason you support R/Hr in your posts.

Hope you have a great time at the boards! :D

Yeah Ronwheezybox, Max's right. And pegoheart, you're right about Voldemort using Harry's friends, but who would be closer to Harry?? His friends or his girlfriend??? I mean, the friends would resist more right? But if it's just a girlfriend, she might resist less. In Ginny's case, she might not resist at all if Harry is going after another girl, and Ginny, jealous and tired of being ignored, might help Voldemort.

Sirius, you've just touched on the key problem with trying to match Harry with anyone else but Hermione: who could mean more to him? It's not like he's going to have the time to get to know another girl as well as he knows Hermione. Ginny is still an unopened book to him - after four books and with only three to go.
He's preoccupied with the physical reaction he gets around Cho but his close friend means more to him, the lake task scene showed that.
If his feelings for Hermione don't become more romantic, he may be attracted to someone else in the same way as Cho. But probably it would be more honest to leave him on his own.

I've been thinking about this for a while ...

If JK was going for a H/G relationship, she would have developed Ginny's character more during the first four books. With just three books left, the only new characters that JK could introduce wouldn't play a very important part, and would only stay in the background. The only book in which Ginny was given a bigger role is Book Two, in which Ginny didn't really play a part until the end. If Harry/Ginny does happen, I would like to see how JK does it.

Yes, I've got a bit of a mad theory about Ginny, that she's there primarily as a diversion tactic and possibly as one of the 'good' people to be killed off.
First JKR come up with the idea of a hero imbued with a quality she particularly admires, bravery; a lead female based, she said, largely on herself; and their best mate, based, she said, on an old, long-time friend.
It must have been pretty clear early on that the obvious end result - as people love to point out - was for the hero to end up with the heroine if he ends up with anyone.
But she's eternally secretive about her plot. She loves to keep people guessing. She imbeds little clues to suggest a whole lot of possibilities. Possibly in this case (this could all be wishful thinking) to keep readers' eyes off the ball.
I also think there's got to be a reason for the basic set-up: a trio of two male and one female friends who have been off-limits to other students for four books, which makes the likelihood of romance within that trio more probable.
What makes me suspicious of Ginny is that after four books she's still more of a symbol than a character. Shall I spell it out again? The-little-sister-with-the-crush-on-brother's-best-friend.
If Ginny was a real option, wouldn't she at least give us a hint of something remarkable? I don't get a sense of what she means. Is she smart, good at charms, good at sports, a future career woman, a homebody? Who would know.
When you look at how good JKR is with even minor characters and also the truely classic characters she has created and compare that to how thinly Ginny's been sketched ...
Of course in the next book Ginny could turn out to incredibly fascinating, with a winning smile, a brilliant mind and a sparkling personality.
Can't wait.

You all say that JKR has written four book and only three to go and so she's too far through to introduce anybody of too much importance.

But Book 5 is about as long as the first three books put together. We may only be a quarter way through the story. Books 6 and 7 could be HUGE.

True tcboo.
But she's spent a lot of time developing Hermione as a character and Hermione's importance to Harry and Ron (and I also think in the plot as a whole with the Mudblood theme). A girl who ends up with Harry has to more than match that.
Also, in terms of where we're at with the story, we are now entering the dark period where Voldemort is back and his followers you would think will start attacking people. They plan to make use of giants and dementors. Logically Harry's going to be preoccupied with that. It could be that the relationship entanglements merge to some extent with the main plot say if Ron, his family and Hermione are endangered.
Also there's the factor of emotional investment. We know the trio, anyone else feels like an outsider. They mean more than other characters, even obviously nice ones like Cedric and Cho. We like the way the three of them work together. If somebody new comes along they have to break into the club.

I agree, Turambar. Your posts are getting shorter! :p

With Voldemort back, Harry doesn't have much time to socialise with anyone other than Ron and Hermione. If someone joins the trio, that person would feel very awkward there as his/her friendship with the others just isn't as strong.

This'll be even shorter! Agree entirely. Just as illustration, I spent my late teens to mid 20's hanging around with two great mates, a guy and a girl. Platonic except that they had a brief fling at one point and I was with someone for a short while. But mostly we didn't really allow other people to get close to us. Eventually we all did meet other people through changing jobs and moving around and drifted apart.

Oh, I absolutely agree, with both of you, and I certainly hope that JKR does not try to pull anyone else into the ‘club’. Don’t worry – you already have me convinced that Harry/Hermione are the most suitable together.

But what I do think is interesting – everyone is always going on about what quotes have been made by JKR etc. To me, she obviously gives out mixed messages about her future books - that's probably part of the enjoyment of being a writer - teasing the reader.
For example in the same interview that she said something might be going on between R/H and nothing going on between H/H, she also plainly said that the fifth book would not be as long as the fourth - and that is definitely not true anymore.
So she obviously has developed ideas, changed scenarios, altered some thoughts and improved some themes.

We can’t take what has been said to be set in stone. I think it is clear that it is going to be a rather busy School Year, but I think that the trio will still be the focus and everyone else will still be in the background.

One thing I wonder about that, tcboo, is whether the movies will have any influence on JKR.
I liked the idea of H/Hr long before seeing the COS movie and thought they were much better suited than R/Hr, though I'm expecting some sort of love triangle. The only one I really don't want to see is H/G because I think it would be artificial and unworthy.
But anyway after seeing COS I just feel I would find a R/Hr screen romance unbelievable. That's just me, I'm sure others would love it. I'm sure Emma and Rupert would do a great acting job, but I bet it would be missing the right sparkle - the kind of sparkle that made Titanic so popular.
Conversely COS the movie made me more actively wish for H/Hr and totally confirmed my preference for it.
I'd love to know what JKR thinks of it.

Personally, Turambar, I think that the films will have an influence, maybe not a lot, but some. Obviously though JKR cannot say that they do or else she just opens herself up for loads more questions.
But, just as you said, as soon as we see something on the screen then we automatically picture those people, hear those voices and imagine other interactions with the same chemisty etc. Surely JKR can't be immune to that.

Whenever I read PoA or GoF, the Harry, Ron and Hermione in my head look, sound and interact as Dan, Rupert and Emma do on screen. Does that make sense?

As you say, watching the films make Harry and Hermoine more believeable and Ron and Hermione less so.

You made me laugh then. I hear and see them all in my head when I'm reading those books now just like you said. Esp the the way Rupert says "Are you mad!"

in one interview, when rupert was asked what he thinks if ron falls for hermione, he says "kill me first before i kiss hermione."

hahaha! :D

Originally posted by Turambar
I bet it would be missing the right sparkle - the kind of sparkle that made Titanic so popular.

I have no doubt—should the theme become more significant— that future Harry Potters movies (and novels) will treat the subject love with care and sincerity. We do not need any more 'love' stories like Titanic and I’m not looking for any 'sparkle' in the Harry Potter movies if it’s inspired by that movie. What a horrible, dangerous movie. It was the essence of a trashy romance novel and at its core, blatantly immoral because it glorified premarital sex. A horrible theme, considering the movie marketed itself to young teenage girls.

The entertainment industry has a responsibility. What kind of themes are they are peddling to the public? What kind of values are they promoting? I’m not saying Titanic was the worst offender, but there is a demonstrated pattern on the part of Hollywood to ridicule traditional values and promote the very themes most families are trying to keep from their kids.

Lets not compare Harry Potter to filth like Titanic. I think it’s a disservice to the wonderful books and movies.

What are you all going to do if the pair that you want DON'T happend?

It is so hilarious!!!! Seriously, what are you all going to do if H/G happens or H/H and it seems most likely to stay that way? But is not the shipping you back out. Are you going to stop reading or keep going? Will it turn off your passion for the series? I'm just wondering.

For the record JKR it is great writter, but I'm sorry to say that she has some old cliches inserted in the books.

The HP books, no matter who ends up with who, will always be HP. If H/Hr doesn't happen, fine. Though I'd be a bit disappointed, I'd still cheer when Harry catches the snitch, laugh when Ron makes a joke, and compliment Hermione on her superior intellect. Harry Potter will always be Harry Potter, and though you may leave the book on the shelf for a while once you find out that the pairing you support doesn't happen, you'd still sit down and finish it one day because of the undeniable fact that keeps drawing us to JK's books -- the fact that we all want to see it through till the end.

Robfather, I agree with you. I am fairly confident that JKR will not lower the tone of HP and bring in any kind of cheap romanticism. I don't think that Turambar was hoping to see any pre-marital intimacies on the screen either. I could be wrong.

And though I completely agree that we should have a greater sense of morals and much higher values, particularly in regard to children, I will say that you come across a little self-righteous.

After all, what is your name: 'The Robfather', I presume a reference to 'The Godfather', and that's not exactly family viewing!

No offense intended

I STILL think it will be R/Hr. I'm not sure about Harry, but R and Hr are perfect for eachother!!

Would H/G really make sense? Ron wouldnt talk to Harry for WEEKS if Harry broke it off and hurt Ginny. And, from what I hear, dating your bfs sister is just WRONG.

I'm not gonna leave the books just cause sometin I hoped about didn't happen. That's kinda stupid, really. o.O

Calm down Robfather. All I meant by the Titantic reference was that the two lead actors had a good on screen chemistry! I don't know how you could dredge all that up from a very simple comment.

I consider The Godfather and The Godfather Part II to be two of the very best movies ever crafted. The difference is, those are movies made for adults, marketed to adults. The themes presented in those movies wouldn’t be appropriate in Harry Potter, based on the tone those books have carried thus far.

I thought the performances by the leads in Titanic were simply ghastly. It had brilliant editing, visual and sound effects, but everything else was simply horrible.

Robfather, I was not referring to the themes of Titanic or the quality of the acting. I simply said that the two leads had good on-screen chemistry. That's my opinion. I'm sure you disagree!
And just to make it clear I don't think there will be sex in HP. I think I suggested an attraction triangle in an earlier post which is probably a more accurate description than love triangle which I mention recently.
And no, I won't stop reading the books whatever ships sail in.

titanic really sucked =/...sorry...but i thought a REAL movie was scarface...robfather i know u like this one right ? =D

Yeah, Titanic really really sucked. I wonder how it made so much money.

TheLostWeasley, use proper spelling; it's you, not u, and please use proper capitalisation.

Nuh uh! Titanic was a great movie. Leo DiCaprio is so babealicious in it :crush:

I notice you're both males...ahh...men. They never appreciate a wonderful "chick flick." :D

They always jump to conclusions too...hmm...;)

D'you like Titanic purely because DiCaprio was "babealicious" in it?

Anyway, not all men jump to conclusions! I guess it's just human nature *shrugs*

No, I thought it was a great movie...DiCaprio just happened to be babealicious in it :)

It was so sad, I cried at the end. Plus, I find the Titanic and all that stuff very interesting, so of course I liked it.

Ok that didn't make any sense, but....:smile:

Hey has anyone else noticed that Kate Winslet (Rose) hasn't done a movie since Titanic? :lol:

She didn't? Hmm ... never noticed ...

Trying to get off the the subject of Titanic (lol). I hope that Harry and Ginny will have some "romance" or al least more friendship interaction. And I alos want Ron and Hermoine to get together. I know signuture says I am Draco/Hermoine shipper because I am but only in fanfiction. Because I REALLY don't think that will happen and it might be weird if it does happen seeing it through Harry's POV.

Again (whew! I sound like a broken record), I hope that you read some of lleyki's and Turambar's posts a few pages back. Read Turambar's long posts, not her short ones.

I didn't read every post in the 70+ pages in this topic, but I'm surprised in the H/Hr vs R/Hr arguments, no one has mentioned that Krum himself told Harry that Hermione talked about him very often. When one person likes another, they usually wind up talking about them to other people completely unaware that they're doing so. It appears that Hermione did this as well.

Er, actually Mad Eye Mike, someone has mentioned that. I think that either lleyki or Turambar said something about that.

I stand corrected, no biggie.

No harm done :p

But isn't Ron the one with the somewhat crush on Hermione? Just look at him when he noticed that Hermione became friends with Krum!

Yeah. Any idiot with half a brain would notice that (no offence). What about Hermione's and Harry's feelings? You can't just cast them aside in favor of Ron.

What about Hermione's and Harry's feelings?

Um, what feelings? We know very little about Hermione's feelings, she gives almost nothing away, so I'm open to the possibility she feels something. But Harry, on the other hand, has shown no sign of feelings towards Hermione. Twice in Goblet of Fire there is an opportunity for him to notice Hermione, and he doesn't do so.

First, when he and Ron aren't talking to each other, he spends a lot of time with Hermione. His reaction? Not "wow, I never realised how much she and I have in common", but rather "There was much less laughter, and a lot more hanging around in the library when Hermione was your best friend".

Second, after the Yule Ball, he notices what's going on with Ron and Hermione ("...but he somehow thought Hermione had got the point much better than Ron had".) Is he in any way jealous or upset? No, he seems quite unmoved by it all.


I am not a R/Hr shipper. I am not trying to play down the possibility of a H/Hr pairing (in fact I think it's quite likely), I'm just pointing out that Harry does not appear to have any feelings for Hermione yet.

And before someone tells me to read Ileyki's and Turambur's posts, I have read them, and they actually changed my opinion. I used to be in favour of R/Hr, but they convinced me I could be wrong.

I think all sides have exhausted all arguments because we seem to have gotten to the point were people are telling others to go back and read this or that post.

I still think it will be R/Hr, based on interviews by the author and clues given in the books. That’s my view; others may feel differently. No biggy.

We’ll just have to wait and see when the 5th book finally comes out.

Originally posted by Dessie
I am not a R/Hr shipper. I am not trying to play down the possibility of a H/Hr pairing (in fact I think it's quite likely), I'm just pointing out that Harry does not appear to have any feelings for Hermione yet.

Except for friendship. There is no physical attraction. The relationship between Harry/Hermione is like JK's relationship with her real life friend, Sean. They're good friends, have been since school days and always will be. I believe they're both married to different people but they're still good friends.

Yeah, it seems as if everything's been discussed after 74 pages of H/Hr, R/Hr and the occasional person who supports D/Hr. Dessie, I think you misunderstood me -- I didn't say that Harry and Hermione have feelings for each other; I just pointed out that Harry and Hermione's feelings (not necessarily towards each other) should not be ignored. Maybe in book 5 we'll see that Hermione has a crush on Harry.

harry barely talks about hermione when she's not there, not like how ron does. when harry's like we're goin to the chamber tonight, the only thing that makes ron go is the fact that hermione isn't there, he looked at her empty seat before he said anything to goin to the chamber. in book four, i think that hermione didn't tell them that she was goin to the yule ball with krum so that ron wouldn't feel bad because she knows that ron likes her but she didn't want him to feel like another famous person was being chosen instead of him, like harry and the goblet and stuff. but hermione does feel stronger for ron than for harry, because i think she feels like ron needs her for support, and she feels that harry doesn't need anyone, when he actually does, he's almost been killed 5 times. i dunno maybe hermione just pitties ron, and that's why she's mushy when ron feels sad. i dunno.