SPOILERS: Book Five Discussion Thread

Pages : [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14

FoolOnTheHill
April 13th, 2003, 8:44 am
Glad you made this thread, Morgoth.

Well I hope this information is true, because I really like what I hear. I'm really excited about Ron being on the team. :clappy:

The part about "unbearable sacrifice" made me make this wierd sad-scared-yet-excited noise.... it makes me think the death is going to be someone pretty close to Harry, not just someone like Percy or something.

That's all for now.... my brain doesn't function so well at 1 a.m. .......

ahsweape
April 13th, 2003, 9:21 am
I'm intrigued by the comment about the impotence of the Hogwarts authorities. Who exactly counts as a Hogwarts authority? Are these all the profs or just Dumbledore and Mcgonagall? It's almost shocking to hear the word "impotent" used to describe them. I figured in book five you would see them being very proactive in the fight against Voldemort, and yet from this statement I see them sort of sitting around being ineffective. Perhaps all the statement alludes to is the difficulty of Dumbledore and the "old Gang" to go up against Voldemort when they don't have the support of the ministry.

dantares
April 13th, 2003, 9:28 am
I am disturbed by "unbearable sacrifice". I think someone important to Harry sacrifice his/her life for him. The question is who would?

Thayet
April 13th, 2003, 9:35 am
Any of his close friends, and Dobby. Ginny, Hermione, Ron. Hagrid. A long list.

As to the DADA teacher, with a personality like poisoned honey, could Snape have finally got the job, leaving a new potions master? Or perhaps its an old friend of his, someone not so nice..

Weatherby
April 13th, 2003, 9:47 am
Oh well I have no self control.. I've read these on ew anyway.

A venomous, disgruntled house-elf
Could this be Winky? I never thought house elves could be venomous.
Has Hermione freed the elves only to have Ron be right.. :wacky:

I think you could be right Thayet. Snape may not have the job but they could be a friend of his. I have the feeling they aren't a fan of Harry's.
The teacher will probably be one of those people who never mean what they say. I'm not sure how I feel about that one being spoiled. I'll be suspecting them from the off.

ahsweape
April 13th, 2003, 10:08 am
Originally posted by Thayet (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264172#post264172))
Any of his close friends, and Dobby. Ginny, Hermione, Ron. Hagrid. A long list.

As to the DADA teacher, with a personality like poisoned honey, could Snape have finally got the job, leaving a new potions master? Or perhaps its an old friend of his, someone not so nice..


Well it can't be Snape as we've been told that the new teacher will be a woman.

I think that the disgruntled house-elf is definitely going to be Winky. I think that she'll blame Dumbledore for the death of Crouch Jr. and be really upset that he "stole" all of the Crouch family secrets from Crouch Jr. I could see her saying that he's "nosing." As a Hogwarts house-elf, Winky has access to quite a lot of information. I wonder if she be a spy or something.

Alorra Spinnet
April 13th, 2003, 12:25 pm
I am fairly sure that the house elf would be Winky. She is certainly going to be out of sorts after what happened.
Ron being keeper was something alot of people were already figuring on anyway. With his head for strategy he will likely be captain as well. That would give him a bit of the spotlight for a change. However, if Ron turns out to be Quidditch captain as well as keeper, does that set up Harry as the 5th year boys prefect for Gryffindor? I think we are all fairly sure that Hermione will be the girls prefrect. Not likely that Lavender or Parvati would get it. :rolleyes:
The DADA teacher will naturally have to be watched closely. Except for Lupin, none of them were what we thought they were. And even Lupin had his secrets.
Harry's dreams are getting even stranger. Or is it visions? Is Harry a seer?

dumbleedore
April 13th, 2003, 12:34 pm
I was only thinking of Winky today. I'm re-reading book 4 (it's a long drive home from Dubbo) and I was thinking maybe with her having been with Crouch for so long, she'd know a lot of people, and a lot wouldn't know he was dead yet. It's an incomplete theory.

I'm just starting to puzzle over the dreams they mention Harry having, the door in the corridor. What's all that about?

TiKiElf
April 13th, 2003, 1:10 pm
hmm... yeah, also puzzled about that door. maybe-like alorra had said- harry could be a seer? maybe he's seeing the door in the supposed 'special' room that holds maybe a big secret. from the desciption of it, it sounds as if what Harry is dreaming about is actually what he will go through, just like the cover of the American version. ugh.. i've got a headache from trying to read Gof again to find clues and actually trying to read and enjoy it.

Filia Tenebrarum
April 13th, 2003, 1:13 pm
Alright, firstly this has sent my digestive system into chaos. I believe this is what's called blue whales in the stomach, as distinct from butterflies. If I'm this excited now, I may just explode on June 20th! Book five is coming! It's coming, it's coming, it's coming! Hurrah! [jumps up and down, giggling insanely]

OK, having got that out of my system...
"A Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey "
I assumed the Dada teacher for OotP would be Mrs Figg, but it doesn't sound like it. From what we know of Mrs Figg she seems kindly and trustworthy, if a bit overobbessed with cats.
It doesn't sound like Snape either, as Snape's personality is not so much poisoned honey, as just neat poison.
My best guess is that it will be someone appointed by the ministry of magic to try and prevent Hogwarts students from believing the truth about Voldemort's growing power. This would be against Dumbledore's wishes but he wouldn't be able to do anything about her spreading lies without the ministry sacking him.

"A venomous, disgruntled house-elf "
Winky, probably. She might blame, Harry, Dumbledore or another of the "good guys" for her master's death. We already know what chaos a house-elf can cause when he/she wants to.

"Ron as Keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team "
Oh dear. We know Ron can play Quidditch but is he good enough to play on the team? That'll be good fun to read, though.

"And of course, what every student dreads: end-of-term Ordinary Wizarding Level exams. "
Will these have a great part in the plot? Hmione will get full marks easily, Harry will do well, but Ron might find things hard under pressure from home. Otherwise, I can't see these being really important.

"he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor.
And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined. "
OK, I spot a reference to the American OotP cover. Does this have something to do with the Chamber of Secrets?

"He confronts the unreliability of the very government of the magical world, and the impotence of the authorities at Hogwarts. "
Dumbledore could never be described as "impotent". Perhaps he's sacked by the ministry? We know Fudge is unreliable, impotent and all the rest of it, that's no new news.

LewsTherin
April 13th, 2003, 1:55 pm
Well now, this is interesting, mostly because of "impotent" statement. If we cast out minds back to CoS, you'll recall that the staff, other than Dumbledore, were woefully inept at dealing with the threat. They did not know 1.) what it was 2.) where it was 3.) how to stop it. In other words - they were useless. Dumbledore was not, as I think he was on top of the situation, although barely. So that statement comes as no surprise to me, as I always saw the staff as sadly lacking when pitted against Voldemort. For any more proof, you just have to look at the way Voldemort pulled the wool over everybody's eyes at the Triwizard tournament. So, for me, this confirms my feeling that Hogwarts is in very, very deep trouble. On the other hand, it could mean that the authorities at Hogwarts will find themselves with their hands tied, unable to do anything in defence of the school.

The reference to the "poisoned honey" is also interesting. Sounds like another not-quite-who-it-seems person. Honey after all, is sweet, and you don't realise it's poisoned until it's too late. So, it's an agent of Voldemort perhaps? An agent of Fudge? My guess is this person will be an agent of Voldemort, albiet indirectly.

Ron on the Quidditch team is tantamount to suicide. My guess is he'll be spending lots of time in the Hospital - or he'll be brilliant.

As for the "sacrifice" bit; I think this will come from Hermione. Out of all the characters, she is the most loyal to Harry and the sacrifice seems to be connected with that, so I'm guessing she'll be the one doing the sacrficing. How? Perhaps putting herself in harms way and taking an attack meant for Harry? She's done it before, so she'll do it again.

Then Harry's dreams. I do not believe this would refer to the Chamber, but to something else. He could be scared of something evil, yes, but it could also be something else - maybe a source of power he is terrified of using. Maybe it could be the power within? I think it may represent a decision he does not want to make, or a task he does not want to do, because upon doing it, it may change him forever. I dunno, just my guess.

Well, those are my thoughs. Use 'em or loose 'em.

GrangerGal
April 13th, 2003, 2:03 pm
OK I have a WEIRD question b/c I think I am going crazy... didn't we have a bunch of threads on this when it was released on the Leaky Cauldron?! Then they just disappeared. I swear I read this on that website and there were actually a few different threads on each of the new information!? I am very confused where those went b/c I put some of my ideas on them. I thought I read somewhere that this info was just a joke and so I assumed that someone removed the threads b/c it was a joke. I hope I am wrong about it being a joke b/c I like the info. Could SOMEONE verify my illusions a/b the previous thread and verify this information so I don't feel like I am going crazy!? Thank you very much!

Tarawyn
April 13th, 2003, 2:15 pm
The threads were deleted because they violated a policy on non-official book 5 spoilers. This thread was set up after some talk, one concentrated area where we can keep an eye on all the spoilers, so you can talk here. There's a thread on the spoiler policy with policy in-body over here (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7626). :) Carry on.

GrangerGal
April 13th, 2003, 2:31 pm
Thank you SO MUCH! I thought I went crazy for a second. I guess this means the info is good... thank you I will start talking!

I think that we should discuss the fact taht Ron being on the Quidditch team is a WORRY of Harry's. Does this mean it will cause some friction between the two?

too_wicked
April 13th, 2003, 3:17 pm
Thank you for opening a thread like this mods!!!!

GrangerGal: I think you have a point there. Maybe Ron making it to the Quidditch team might create some tension between the two. Hopefully not.

About the sacrifice thing, I think it's going to be Ron. He sacrificed himself before in the chess scene in SS and proved it too in PoA. I think this will involve Ron.

Earendil
April 13th, 2003, 3:40 pm
My two cents--
I also found it odd that the fact that Ron is on the Quidditch team is listed under a "worry" of Harry's. Either this could mean that it's going to cause conflict between him and Ron, or that Ron is going to get seriously injured....

I keep thinking that the sacrifice is going to be on Hermione's part. This is the kind of plotline that really wrenches the heart, and I can't see JKR passing it up. If it were Ron, well, that would also be sad, but I think that Hermione's loyalty is a bit more solid than Ron's. After all, who deserted Harry after Harry was chosen in for the Triwizard Tournament?

The "poisoned honey" thing is interesting, because she could have said "POISONOUS honey", rather than "poisoned". Could this mean that the DADA teacher started out as on the good side, and then was poisoned by Voldemort, after she started at Hogwarts?

Frankly, these maddening clues make me twitch. :banghead:
June 21, where are you?? Hurry up before I spontaneously combust!!

Filia Tenebrarum
April 13th, 2003, 3:44 pm
"My guess is he'll be spending lots of time in the Hospital - or he'll be brilliant."
Or both.

"Maybe Ron making it to the Quidditch team might create some tension between the two. "
I was hoping Ron had kind of got the jealousy thing out of his system by now. Maybe it'll just be a worry of Harry's because Ron won't be very good. Or maybe it isn't so much a worry as just something that occurs and was bunged on the "worries" list by a blurb writer who didn't really know what s/he was talking about.

Ah! Just had a thought! (Call in the Daily Prophet! Sorry, bad joke)
LewsTherin suggested that the door might represent "something else - maybe a source of power he is terrified of using. "
That reminds me that Dumbledore did say that Voldemort had put some of his powers into Harry when Harry got his scar. Perhaps he gave Harry some dark power which is represented by this door...

dracofan
April 13th, 2003, 4:20 pm
The disgruntled houseelf I do believe will be Winky. She may help Voldie.

I too believe that the DADA teacher will start out to be on the good side (mrs. Figg) but something or someone will turn her bad. Maybe the house elf.

I think they'll be more bad things happening within Hogswart this book. With the house elf and the posioned DADA teacher, Voldie will have close ties within Hogswart.

The profs will of course be impotent as they always have been, except DD. But the authority of Hogswart are the directors. And Fudge I believe may be the head of it and we all know he doesn't believe Voldie has returned. or does he. He may be a supporter of Voldie.

I agree that Voldie gave Harry some very powerful magic but I also think that Harry was born with very special powers. I feel that is why Voldie wants Harry dead. I also think this has to do with Trelawny's vision. How else would Dumbledore know when Harry was an infant that we would be so very important. Other than surviving Voldie.

I think that Neville will put out the ultimate sacrifice. I think we will out exactly why Neville was put into Gryfinndor.

Also, I think that this book will be see more of the trio acting together as a unit, even when it comes down to Harry and Vodie.

Magpie
April 13th, 2003, 4:26 pm
Well, for the disgruntled house elf, there might be a new house elf coming into the scene. And maybe Ron always hurts himself during quidditch, and that's why Harry's worried? Just a thought.....

dantares
April 13th, 2003, 4:33 pm
Harry had tons to worry about. Two posionous characters!!

How posioned would they be?

I bet Winky will join the dark side. Two of her masters are dead and there's no shrink for her. I think she is the one that will use powerful magic to help dangerous creatures get into Hogwarts.

The DADA teacher. I bet she will only last a year. Poor thing. Mrs Figg is likely being poisoned (by Winky?) and may eventually goes mad. She may have a thing for Harry but gradually hate him more and more. Then she will just have to leave.

Filia Tenebrarum
April 13th, 2003, 4:38 pm
Incidently, what's going to happen after OotP comes out? (Yes, yes, I know, we'll all sit up til one in the morning reading it, that wasn't what I meant!)
I mean with discussion. Will there be a thread somewhere for posting spoilers and remarks of the "Oh my God, this is even better than bk4!" variety? Or will we use this thread?
And how long will it be before we're allowed to discuss bk5 material openly in the forums? (Not whining, just want to know.)

JediHermione
April 13th, 2003, 4:46 pm
Does anyone think that the unbearable sacrifice could mean death? I doubt any of the trio would die this early, and if they did, I imagine it'd be Ron. But does the unbearable sacrifice have anything to do with the death of a fan of Harry's that was hard to write? I'm thinking this might mean Hagrid. At the end of OotP or something.

The door first made me think of the American cover....but what's so horrible about it? Wonder what room it could lead to, if it's the room JKR said was mentioned in GoF but HArry doesn't know it's imortance yet....

Actually, it'd probably be good to put the list of confirmed facts about OotP here in this thread....

PotterIdentity
April 13th, 2003, 5:16 pm
I am still standing by my Hagrid theory. I think Robbie Coltrane admitting he knew "plot secrets" was something more than just a confirmation he received. Why would Rowling tipp off just an actor about plot secrets, while she won't even spill to Kloves for his screenwriting? There's seems to be something very significant here, but we shall see. Not to mention that Hagrid possesses a lot of traits that I believe could make him an "unbearable sacrifice." He's so loyal to Harry, Ron and Hermione, but he's especially loyal to Dumbledore. I sense that even if Hagrid was in extreme danger, if his decisions involved any betrayal of Dumbledore in any way, he still would not budge and die a loyal death.

I think it's really interesting that Neville was put into Gryffindor and this to me also says that he will end up showing great strength and courage at some point, but I can't see his death being the death Rowling is referring to as, "horrible to write." (I have this whole theory on Neville that I will post sometime when I can write it out) I just sense that at this point in time, Rowling is referring to a character that has immense weight in Harry's life and someone who we have all grown to love (so that pretty much eliminates Draco!). At the same time, I have a feeling a lot of casualties are going to be written into all of the future books, including more main characters, but I sense that the first big one like this, is just really going to be like the hardest chapter to read in the entire series thus far? I am trying to prepare myself...

At any rate, one detail, more explained in Book 2, always caught my attention and that is Fawkes the Pheonix. Harry and Voldemort both share Pheonix feathers and I thought it was interesting how Fawkes can die, but become completely reborn...just like Voldemort? Was there something else to why Voldemort never died that night the Avada curse backfired other than the fact that he was such a strong and "powerful" wizard? Will this theory of Fawkes come into play during Book 5, 6, and 7? Is this also why Harry did not die? (because he was destined for the other wand?) I think there's definitely something significant to the relation of the Pheonix to Harry's and Voldemort's wands and to currently why Dumbledore has Fawkes in his possession. Perhaps that night when Voldemort took blood from Harry's arm was also significant because Harry's blood will change his mortality now in the end and Harry will be able to triumph over Voldemort, despite the fact that their wands share the same power? I definitely think that one of the reasons to why Harry lived that night when the curse was first performed WAS because Lily was willing to sacrifice herself, but I think this was just an example to show us the strength, courage and love that was instilled in Harry, I do not think this is the sole reason to why he lived. Harry's life extends far beyond the theory of living just because he's a good person who came from a loving family. If this theory of the Pheonix proves to be accurate on some account, then this would also help to explain why Voldemort wanted to kill Harry. Remember, "the wand chooses the wizard," perhaps it's a more significant line than we thought? Does anyone have anything else to support this or go against this? What do you think?

sugarquill
April 13th, 2003, 5:25 pm
Maybe the poisoned honey will be directed at the bad side. She maybe a shadey character who doesnt inspire confidence at first but who will in the end. As for the evil elf, hmmm, maybe voldie had elves working for him and one will find its way into Hogwarts. I just dont see winky on a revenge mission for some reason.

too_wicked
April 13th, 2003, 5:58 pm
The new DADA teacher was described as "poisoned honey". I bet she's(yes I think she's a woman) an attractive teacher. And surely Ron and the other boys will have the hots for her which will make the "raging hormones fact" in the book humorous. Girls will be jealous of her because you know, she's pretty. But she must be really mean, meaner than Snape if you ask me. She may be mean but like Snape, she's in the good side and she's good in fighting the dark arts.

Venomous house-elf: I think this would be Winky. She was outraged with Hermione's spew and she was absolutely miserable when Crouch Jr. was discovered. I bet she'll be really mad at the good side.

Unbearable sacrifice: I bet it's going to be Ron or Hagrid. Ron proved he is willing to risk his life for Harry in SS and PoA. I think he'll be doing it all the again in book5. Hagrid, well, he's most likely to die (see the Book 5 Death Thread for details).

GrangerGal
April 13th, 2003, 6:38 pm
I wish we could split this into different threads! I want to discuss everything but now things are getting confusing.

1) I definitely think the House Elf is Winky b/c she lost both her masters (one murdered, and the other KISSED) and her famliy's secrets were revealed. Plus she refused to acknowledge Hogwarts as her new home and DD as her new master. However it could be Dobby who is bitter towards Malfoy and is trying to get back at them which could stir up trouble. Who is to say that the angry House Elf is against the good side. Look at what happened when Dobby tried to "help" Harry in CoS. He almost killed him! This could be happening again!

2) I can see tension or competion between Ron and Harry if Harry gets credit for winning a game or if Ron makes a mistake and Harry fixes... anything along those lines.

3) The Defense Teacher I have NO ideas for that one b/c I was sure it was Mrs Figg but she doesnt sound like poison!

Also PotterIdentity you have some really interesting ideas that I think are address in other threads and some aren't address anywhere else. You should look to see. I like your thoughts on Fawkes and I believe there is a thread to that! I think that there is more to Fawkes and the wands than we know.

Kendra
April 13th, 2003, 7:05 pm
Right, Lets look at all the DADA teachers we know about....

1) Quirrel - Looked cowardly but turned out Bad. Voldie's side
2) Lockhart - deranged coward. He wasn't good or bad, just a coward.
3) Lupin - Good, didn't turn out bad.
4) Moody. Turns out it was crouch, who's 'good' actions turned sinister. Ally to voldie

As you can see, so far we have had the good, the good yet evil, the spy and the useless.

Yet we have not seen someone in that role who looks bad but turns out to be good! Snape is the only other teacher so perhaps he does get the job?

I didn't notice until now that Ron being Keeper was down as Harry's worry, Interesting! Perhaps Ron is better than him which creates jealousy from Harry this time?

And I did suspect the house elf as winky. She was in a very bad state, and you didn't see a very nice side to her at times in book 4, so the events could turn her very nasty.

Now with the room, remember JKR says the Dementors are back, even more scary than before. I think this ties with the room. Remember Fudge says to Dumbledore "i will be in touch with you in the morning to discuss the running of this school", well perhaps he doesn't scrap the dementors and he puts them in school to keep an eye on Dumbledore. Now I know this doesn't make complete sense, as Dumbledore has a very strong Patronamus(sp?), but what if Fudge secretly hides them in this room that Harry keeps dreaming, and they allow Voldie to spy upon Hogwarts. This leads to the impotence of the staff because if snape went back to spy on Voldie, it probably failed, so he doesn't have a spy, and I expect Dumbledore does have to watch what he says in front of Fudge because he is in a higher position and has power over Hogwarts I expect. Therefore because Fudge doesn't believe he's back, Dumbledore can't do much!

Another possibility, the DADA teacher is put in by the ministry to spy on Dumbledore. Whoever the teacher is, I'm going to treat them with immense distrust.

As for the unbearable sacrifice, I too think it's Hagrid. When I watched CoS again last night Harry says "your a great friend Hagrid" and later "hogwarts won't be the same without you". JKR says that book 2 is the most key book, so perhaps that hints to his sacrifice? Also, remember we think Hagrid is off to get the gients on the good side, interfering with Voldie's plans!

Anyway, thats my 2pence worth of thought's, I'll be back!

JediHermione
April 13th, 2003, 7:32 pm
I think Harry would be somewhat relieved at the fact Ron made the team. He'd be happy for him, cause Harry knows how bad Ron thinks he has it. It's most likely because he's afraid Ron'll hurt himself or something. I was wondering if Ron gets a new broom, or if he has to use one of his old ones...I doubt it'd have much to do with the storyline though....

We know the new DADA teacher is a woman, so it can't be Snape...
We really don't know much about Mrs. Figg, but she's one of the 'old gang' so we know, like Snape, she has Dumbledore's trust. So if she is the new DADA teacher, I still think she'll be on the good side.

Which corridors would be silent? Dunno if it's of any importance, but it says he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor. This corridor might be out-of-bounds this year for some reason, like the third floor corridor was in SS/PS...

Shoujo Kitsune
April 13th, 2003, 7:43 pm
As for the 'incompitence of the teachers' thing, I think that the Board (which Lucius seems to have hold over) will suspend Dumbledore for making mention of Voldemort at the end of book 4, which can be an easy reason to pin on him, esp. if Lucius has Fudge's suport. Thus installing someone who is not willing to do the job.

As for the poisoned honey bit, I think that too_wicked was on to something with the raging Hormones that we are 'meant' to see....

House-elf:definatly winky...

The dreams: I think that Harry is a vissionary...as he is always seeing thing as they are happening, ex: he "was" the letter that Crouch Jr. sent by owl to Voldemort telling him that his father was taken care of, and Harry was whitness to all the events that did take place....

I am glad that Ron has made it on the team, but I do agree LewsTherin in the fact that he may go either way...or both, because we have not heard anything about the skill he has at playing, we see him and his brother (and Harry) play around, but there are no real details giving clues to how good he is, I hope they beat Slytherine, though!


BTW: I am so glad that this is up!!!!!! I don't think I can wait anylonger with out having a breakdown of some sort for the bopok to come out....:banghead:

fawkes_the_phoenix
April 13th, 2003, 8:02 pm
Originally posted by Filia Tenebrarum (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264268#post264268))
Alright, firstly this has sent my digestive system into chaos. I believe this is what's called blue whales in the stomach, as distinct from butterflies. If I'm this excited now, I may just explode on June 20th! Book five is coming! It's coming, it's coming, it's coming! Hurrah! [jumps up and down, giggling insanely]

OK, having got that out of my system...
"A Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey "
I assumed the Dada teacher for OotP would be Mrs Figg, but it doesn't sound like it. From what we know of Mrs Figg she seems kindly and trustworthy, if a bit overobbessed with cats.
It doesn't sound like Snape either, as Snape's personality is not so much poisoned honey, as just neat poison.
My best guess is that it will be someone appointed by the ministry of magic to try and prevent Hogwarts students from believing the truth about Voldemort's growing power. This would be against Dumbledore's wishes but he wouldn't be able to do anything about her spreading lies without the ministry sacking him.

"A venomous, disgruntled house-elf "
Winky, probably. She might blame, Harry, Dumbledore or another of the "good guys" for her master's death. We already know what chaos a house-elf can cause when he/she wants to.

"Ron as Keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team "
Oh dear. We know Ron can play Quidditch but is he good enough to play on the team? That'll be good fun to read, though.

"And of course, what every student dreads: end-of-term Ordinary Wizarding Level exams. "
Will these have a great part in the plot? Hmione will get full marks easily, Harry will do well, but Ron might find things hard under pressure from home. Otherwise, I can't see these being really important.

"he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor.
And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined. "
OK, I spot a reference to the American OotP cover. Does this have something to do with the Chamber of Secrets?

"He confronts the unreliability of the very government of the magical world, and the impotence of the authorities at Hogwarts. "
Dumbledore could never be described as "impotent". Perhaps he's sacked by the ministry? We know Fudge is unreliable, impotent and all the rest of it, that's no new news.



I agree pretty much with everything you said! And to add something, I think that Winky could be a threat. Like someone mentioned earlier, she probably knows many influential people. And since she is so upset with what happened to her master, I'm beginning to fear that she just may help the Dark Side. But that's just a theory.

And I especially like you CoS idea! I have always been an advocate of the CoS coming up again in the books and it being important, as I have expressed in "the 'important room' JK said" thread.
Nice Job! :coolblue:

pmb1290
April 13th, 2003, 8:10 pm
About the door and the corridor...
That is exactly what is on the cover of the american version of the book. As you may know, Mary Grand-Pre, the artist of the american books, is one of few people who have been allowed to read book 5.
Many people believe that room on the cover is round, but really it is just a corridor! (If you want to see the cover of the book, go to www.geocities.com/pmb1290/book5. It is the third cover.)
First look at the 3 candles on the bottom left, then the 3 on the bottom right. They are the same! If there is only one mirror, then the image you see is inverted. However, if there are two mirrors (on opposite sides of the hallway) the image returns as normal, but obviously is seen 3 times. There are 3 doors on the cover, but really I think there is only one, with a couple of mirrors in the corridor.

However, I do not know the significance of this. Even if I am correct about the mirrors, that really doesnt mean anything other than that the room on the cover is not actually round. It does show that this is a very significant part of the book, since it is both on the cover and in scholastics catalogue.

Actually, looking at the cover again, I am inclined to say that the door on the left is the real one, and the other two are mirror images of it. It looks like there is smoke or a wind coming from the door. Hmmm...

Just on a hunch, I am going to say that this is not Hogwarts, but rather the place that JK talked about. She said that Harry would go to a place that the reader hasn't physically seen, but has been mentioned.
The only places that I can think of are:
Godrics Hollow
Azkaban
Malfoy Manor
The Ministry
The Riddle House

Ok.. thats enough for now.

Peter

dracofan
April 13th, 2003, 8:18 pm
Peter: I agree that the cover of OoP is the coridoor mentioned in the summary. I also believe it is in another magical world. Another magical world is the key. Maybe a ghostly world. Or another time frame perhaps.

Again I feel that Draco and his fathers relationship will play big in the next books.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 13th, 2003, 8:20 pm
Originally posted by pmb1290 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264564#post264564))
About the door and the corridor...
First look at the 3 candles on the bottom left, then the 3 on the bottom right. They are the same! If there is only one mirror, then the image you see is inverted. However, if there are two mirrors (on opposite sides of the hallway) the image returns as normal, but obviously is seen 3 times. There are 3 doors on the cover, but really I think there is only one, with a couple of mirrors in the corridor.

However, I do not know the significance of this. Even if I am correct about the mirrors, that really doesnt mean anything other than that the room on the cover is not actually round. It does show that this is a very significant part of the book, since it is both on the cover and in scholastics catalogue.

Actually, looking at the cover again, I am inclined to say that the door on the left is the real one, and the other two are mirror images of it. It looks like there is smoke or a wind coming from the door. Hmmm...



I am in complete agreeance here Peter...

If you thinbk about it, Harry wand arm is right, but he is holding it in hia left...unless there is a mirror (which I have suggested in the important room JK said thread...) so then you would be right and there would only be one real door...which hints to his dream, because he only dreams of one door...(according to the spoilers:) )

So where is the room? I do not think that it is in Hogwarts, as it is discribed as a silent corridor, where in Hogwarts is it really silent???

JediHermione
April 13th, 2003, 8:38 pm
Hm...far-fetched theory...well actually I don't know if it fits at all, but what if it's the Malfoy manor? That secret place where Lucius hides his dark arts stuff that Draco mentioned to Harry and Ron after they drank the Polyjuice potion...JKR said important things happened in book 2, but now that I think about it, I think that detail was cut from the movie, and the movie had to have all the key stuff, so this probably isn't it.

lily28
April 13th, 2003, 8:39 pm
I just finished reading a book called the "Ultimate Unoffical Guide to the Mysteries of Harry Potter". In this book it answers a lot of the questions about Neville ( and it even raises more ) and what all the clues that JKR have given us about him might mean. If you look back at book 1 chapter 7 you will notice that the sorting hat took a long time before it sorted Neville into Gryffindor. There are clues about Neville through out the books like this that leaves me to believe that it will not be Neville who dies will in book 5 because he will be able to help Harry later on. I could continue with the list of clues - but I dont want ot ruin it if someone is reading this book!

MadMagic
April 13th, 2003, 8:52 pm
Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))


Lord Voldemort's rise has opened a rift in the wizarding world between those who believe the truth about his return, and those who prefer to believe it's all madness and lies - just more trouble from Harry Potter.

I think we all saw this one coming.


Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))
A Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey

What exactly is poisoned honey? I thought that the DADA teacher was sure to be Mrs. Figg, but now I'm not so sure. Hopefully the poisoned honey somment refers to the teacher seeming to be evil, but then turning out to be good. But like someone said, it could be someone appointed by the ministry, that with the rift, would be bad.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))
A venomous, disgruntled house-elf

As we only know 2 elves right now our obvious assumption would be Winky. But I am not ruling out a new house elf as the disgruntled one. Afterall, Wink seemed ok at the end of GoF.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))
Ron as Keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team

I think we all saw one of the remaining Weaslys being on the team. Again, I don't see the worry. Maybe Harry is captain and has to yell at Ron, which upsets him. Or Ron could be the captain and Harry doesn't like where he is taking the team. But I would have thought that them both being on the team would have brought them closer together.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))

And of course, what every student dreads: end-of-term Ordinary Wizarding Level exams.

Obvioulsy with everything else going on this would worry anyone, especially Harry, since he always seems to have more to worry about then the normal person.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))


And you know what Harry faces during the day. But at night it's even worse, because then he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor.
And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined.


I like the sound of that. I think it is probably a reference to the room on the cover of the American version. Also this is probably the important room JK mentioned. I have no idea what could be special and terrifying about this room that haunts Harry's dreams though. I am really excited about it though.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))
In the richest instalment yet of JK Rowling's seven-part story, Harry Potter confronts the unreliability of the very government of the magical world, and the impotence of the authorities at Hogwarts.

Of course the government is unreliable, it is run by Fudge. But the authorities at Hogwarts? Dumbledore seems pretty competent. It might be the board of governors though, who do seem to be easily corrupt.

Originally posted by Morgoth (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264145#post264145))
Despite this (or perhaps because of it) Harry finds depth and strength in his friends, beyond what even he knew; boundless loyalty, and unbearable sacrifice.

Boundless loyalty from Ron and Hermione, who have always shown it to him. The "unbearable sacrifice" both scars me and excites me. I think there are many people who would make a sacrifice for him. I think this could be the horrible death we have all anticipated. I really hope it isn't Ron or Hermione (I don't think it will be).

Rowena Ravenclaw
April 13th, 2003, 9:00 pm
Originally posted by LewsTherin (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264284#post264284))
Ron on the Quidditch team is tantamount to suicide. My guess is he'll be spending lots of time in the Hospital - or he'll be brilliant.

I agree. I think the tension's either going to stem from the fact that Ron isn't going to be able to live up to the responsibility, or will outshine Harry, turning one (or possibly both) of them into an insufferable jerk over it.

Either way, it's going to be a rough year for the Quidditch team. Without Wood, and considering if they haven't played in a year, I really wonder if they'll be able to pull things together and maintain the level they were at when Azkaban ended.

In other spoilers, I still can't see Winky going venomous, unless the Crouches' deaths drove her completely over the edge. I'd be more likely to believe the Malfoys' new house elf is going to be furious with Harry and Dobby for getting him into that position.

And anyone's guess on "poisoned honey" is as good as mine.

Katy Kedevra
April 13th, 2003, 10:50 pm
I can't wait to find out more about that silent corridor, and what's behind door #1! I think it either has to do with, as previously mentioned, a dark power in Harry that he's afraid to use, or, as said in an interview (not sure where to find it), a new magical world that we'll see, or perhaps it will be the door to Harry's family's past, and that terrifies him for some reason. As a quote from somewhere, "When digging up the past, you're only going to get dirty."

I also have been led to believe that Mrs. Figg is giong to be the new DADA teacher, so maybe she's poisoned honey because Harry used to find her sweet, but as a teacher she's really strict or something about her doesn't seem right, thus making his views on her poisoned. Just a theory...

pmb1290
April 13th, 2003, 11:04 pm
actually, dracofan, i agree about the ghost world idea. I wrote something about it in the "important room" thread (p17) a few days ago... Here it is:
"the room on the cover could be Azkaban or Godrics Hollow, but I have a feeling that it has to do with ghosts. JK has said that Harry will have to look at death in even closer ways. In CoS, at the deathday party, most of the stuff was blue and black, as is the cover of the book.
"The passageway leading to Nearly Headless Nick's party had been lined with candles, too, though the effect was far from cheerful: These were long, thin, jet-black tapers, all burning bright blue, casting a dim, ghostly light even over their own living faces."
"A chandelier overhead blazed midnight-blue with a thousand more black candles. Their breath rose in a mist before them; it was like stepping into a freezer."
The cover is just very... uh... ghostlike. It is just a gut feeling, but you never know."

So... thats that. By the way, Katy, im pretty sure that the quote is from Minority Report.

About poisoned honey, I think that either we are way over analyzing it, or it means this:
When I think of honey, I think of something good, sweet. So, I would say that somebody good (for ex. Mrs Figg) is the DADA teacher. But then the honey is poisoned. Voldemort somehow gets to her, with the imperius curse or something. I know that it has kind of been done before (mad-eye moody and crouch) but it is the only thing I can think of. Poisoned honey is such an odd choice of words, that i think it has some significance, mainly something sweet getting poisoned.
Peter

Shoujo Kitsune
April 13th, 2003, 11:09 pm
It i from Minority Report...( the guard syas it I think)

But back on topic...I think that it just might have something to do with Ghosts given that we are supposed to learn more about them as well, along with more on Lily and James....

though I am prone to over analyzing things, I think that the Honey definatly makes it a woman, but I still think that she is placed there on Fudges orders and as I have said in previous posts, I think Fudge is a DE, so that woul dmean that she is working for them....but those are just my thoughts...

FoolOnTheHill
April 13th, 2003, 11:10 pm
About these worries that Ron won't be good at Quidditch.....

To me it is too obvious that if Ron Weasley, out of all the Gryffindors in the school makes it on to the team, he has to be good! Although he's had a bunch of skilled brothers on the team, I don't think they'd let him on just because of that. They'll probably have some sort of try-outs thing going on and Ron is the simply the best one for the team. I think the worry for Harry will be something about Ron getting injured, perhaps feeling welcome/at-home on this team that hasn't had a new member for 4 years, or something to that effect. Sorry, I just love Ron and had to defend him. :D (And no, I'm not accusing people of hating Ron, so please don't bite my head off.)

Fuchsia
April 13th, 2003, 11:11 pm
I agree 100% with MadMagic's post. Just what I was thinking.

I think the poisoned honey thing means that she could be sweet but with a bad effect. Too much sugar being bad for you kind of thing. It'll rot your teeth blah blah.

What if he is protected TOO much? Lupin and Dumbledore let him figure things out for himself.

And Harry might be attracted to a mother figure and get lured in more than is good for him...It could feel ever so comforting.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 13th, 2003, 11:18 pm
You know I was thinking and there is not spoiler saying that there will be any reaction to Ron being on the team, thus Harry is not wooried (that we know) All it says is that Ron will be Keeper.......where is the tension thing coming from?

Rowena Ravenclaw
April 13th, 2003, 11:22 pm
Originally posted by mme.ravenclaw (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=264850#post264850))
You know I was thinking and there is not spoiler saying that there will be any reaction to Ron being on the team, thus Harry is not wooried (that we know) All it says is that Ron will be Keeper.......where is the tension thing coming from?


It's included as one of the "host of other worries for Harry," which implies things aren't going to go smoothly. Besides, it's supposed to be a rough year anyway--it'd be a surprise if Harry was able to find complete solace in any activity, particularly one that's been a source of pleasure to him beforehand.

Fuchsia
April 13th, 2003, 11:23 pm
mme, Ron being keeper was listed under "Add this to a host of other worries for Harry..." so there must be tension.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 13th, 2003, 11:42 pm
Oh! okay...that makes more sense...thanks....but well, ok....

GryffindorSeeker
April 13th, 2003, 11:51 pm
Okay, here is my 2 knuts worth.

I'm pretty sure that Ron on the Quidditch team won't affect his and Harry's friendship at all. If anything it'll make it stronger. The reason I think it's on Harry's list of worries is because Harr's probably sure that Ron is in danger. Not that he'll spend tons of time in the hospital wing (though I'm sure he will) it's that he's sure he's in danger by someone, that someone might hex him in a match, where it would be hard to tell who hexed him because of all the people, or someone might do a Dobby, and send a rogue bludger on Ron ( not trying to save his life, of course, just trying to end it.
Oh! another thought! (Oh my gosh! (sorry, kidding))
what if it were the ' disgruntled venemous house elf'?

any way....

I'm pretty sure that the DADA teacher will be someone who almost everyone thinks is really nice (the honey) but is actually not ( the poison). I'm pretty sure that alot of people will like her ( yes, I think it's a her), but Harry won't.
I also think that either Ron or Hermione won't like her either, but the other will ( causing some friction).

Also, the sacrifice and loyalty:
I'm pretty sure , both Ron and Hermione will both be extremely loyal to Harry, willing to sacrifice anything, and being really supportive and all that.
BUT... I 'm sure they won't die. I think that the big sacrifice thing will be done by the 'fan' who dies.

OWLs: Hermione will do REALLY well in that, of course, and Harry will actually worry about it and study and will do really well, too. BUT ( I seem to be using that word alot! Alas!) Ron will kinda worry as well but won't get very many OWLs, but at least more than Fred or George.

The 'Impotence'.... Harry will discover thathis teachers, no, all of the staff isn't quite as powerful as Harry once thought. Harry's not a little boy any more, things aren't as safe as he once thought.

The dreams: I actually think Harry's a type of seer. not the type of seer as in Divination, a different type, one whose dreams mean things and who dreams of things while they happen. ( not that all of them do.) I agree with.. uh.. i can't find it! (sorry!) I agree that the door represents some sort of power Harry got from Voldie, one that he's afraid to use.
Augh! I hope you don't mind reading long replies, this is my longest!

fuzzi95
April 14th, 2003, 12:07 am
Well, that's why I think the new DADA teacher may even be Fleur Delacour. She's so beautiful, but she's very stuck-up indeed. She may have treated Harry and Ron very nicely, but what does she think of Hermione? I know it probably won't be her, but it's still a possibility!

As to who will die, I don't think she'll kill off another student. They would have to close Hogwarts if that happened. I'm thinking maybe Dobby or Winky to go! :(

dracofan
April 14th, 2003, 1:21 am
It may be a woman who we haven't been introduced to yet. And yes, possibly the ministry puts her at hogswart.

Fuchsia
April 14th, 2003, 2:47 am
I hope it isn't Fleur. I don't want to reread all-of-the-guys-try-to-impress her scenes in addition to the reasons why she'd make a horrible teacher.

I stand with my previous post on this subject.

Magpie
April 14th, 2003, 2:57 am
I just thought of something while reading GryffindorSeeker's post. What if the new DADA teacher was really beautiful, not Fleur, but some other beautiful woman who's really horrible? Then Hermione and Harry wouldn't like her, but Ron will because of his superficial basis on looks. Just a thought....

xxquixx
April 14th, 2003, 3:01 am
hi all! i just signed-up, since OotP is just 68 days away. i am really excited especially with the spoilers coming out. hope i could have a great time here... =)

xxquixx
April 14th, 2003, 3:05 am
Originally posted by Magpie (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=265176#post265176))
I just thought of something while reading GryffindorSeeker's post. What if the new DADA teacher was really beautiful, not Fleur, but some other beautiful woman who's really horrible? Then Hermione and Harry wouldn't like her, but Ron will because of his superficial basis on looks. Just a thought....


i read somewhere in this site that mrs. figg might be taking polyjuice to hide her real identity. what if the new DADA teacher is mrs.figg on a disguise? just a thought... ;)

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 3:10 am
yeah, but JK has already used the polyjuice and DADA teacher thing, I think that Harry and the gang would catch on too quickly.

Turambar
April 14th, 2003, 3:18 am
I could see the "unbearable sacrifice" being either Hagrid's death or Hermione's parents dying because of her friendship with Harry. I also think it's strange that Ron becoming keeper is listed as a "worry".

Fuchsia
April 14th, 2003, 3:21 am
The unbearable sacrafice is going to be Hagrid's death for sure.

weasleygirl
April 14th, 2003, 3:37 am
I really like PotterIdentity's Fawkes theory...I think you have something there! it's an interesting theory for sure.
I also agree that the sacrifice will be Hagrid's....I don't think any of the trio will be killed off, at least not until later in the series. and Mrs Figg as DADA teacher sounds plausible to me.
as for Ron as Keeper, since it's listed as a "worry" of Harry's, they must be alluding to some sort of tension there....my guess is Harry as Captain and he doesn't like bossing Ron, or feels uncomfortable doing so.

SnowyOwl
April 14th, 2003, 4:03 am
Ahhhh...the benefits of COS forums. The idea of mirrors and a corridor hadn't even occurred to me. I like it!
The "poisened honey" DADA teacher could be someone Fudge places in the school, perhaps Narcissa? Nah. Of course even more far-fetched would be Rita Skeeter. If she does keep her pen to herself for a year (highly unlikely), she is going to need another job to bring home the bacon. One of the problems with her is the "honey" factor...

Mafic
April 14th, 2003, 4:35 am
I have been thinking about the new DADA teacher and I keep coming back to the part where it says her personality is like poisoned honey. It is talking about her outward personality not some major plot theory hinting that she may act good but turn out to be a death eater. My guess is that it is Ms. Figg and since Harry knows her and she has always been very sweet and kind too harry, but now that she is a teacher she does not have that luxury, and she has to be very very strict. Most of us out there, (I would think), have had at least one teacher, that was super strict in the class room but if you knew them out side of class they would be the most kind and gentle person you could know. Just a thought.

RonFan24
April 14th, 2003, 5:42 am
I was thinking that maybe the reason Ron on the Gryffindor team is listed under Harry's problems is that maybe Ron will become captin and the job will go to his head. Finally Ron will be higher up in rank than Harry and get some attention other than his 15 minutes after Sirius tried to "kill" him. His ego will inflate and maybe he will start to push his new found authority on Harry. Then if Harry tries to say something Ron will take it the wrong way and get mad. Don't get me wrong, I love Ron, but in his situation I think that's how most people would act.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 6:37 am
Maybe Ron gets a big head abou thte whole thing, we know that he is in dire need to be recognized and if he gets a little bit of attention then he might end up not talking to Harry again in protest of his newly acquired 'fame'...I love Ron, but I do think that maybe this might be the case...

lodlom
April 14th, 2003, 7:12 am
First off I totally agree about Ron becoming Captain and getting a big head....He might get a little over involved with bossing harry around.

I have two theories about "a single door down a silent corridor"

Harry has already inherited a couple of things from his parents....Its only reasonable to think that more than just there money and an invisibility cloke is left from lily and james. Im sure harry owns that house in godric hollow and he just doesnt know it yet. What if harry visits godrics hollow and its a door in that house.

seond theory which is completely different...
J.K.'s refrence to the magical room inside hogwarts....well i have always kind of thought that the magical room might be the kitchen....."broad stone corridor brightly lit with torches" could be the same place

Sirius83
April 14th, 2003, 7:24 am
That first theory sounds good, lodlom. We know Harry visits a new location, and it would make sense that it should be Godric's Hollow. His parents house wasn't destroyed as far as we know, Voldemort just came in and killed his parents, not demolish the house. He probably does own the house, and he has to visit somewhere - probably the house itself. We also have to learn a lot about his parents, perhaps behind the door has some stuff that will let Harry learn these things.

FoolOnTheHill
April 14th, 2003, 7:25 am
It would seem quite odd to me for Ron to become captain his first year on the team.... So I really doubt it's gonna be him. I agree though, I love Ron but the poor thing might get a big head about it. I hope not though

remo
April 14th, 2003, 7:49 am
Actually the house was destroyed. In chapter 1 of SS when Hagrid brings Harry to DD on Privet drive DD asks if there were problems. Hagrid replies "No sir- house was almost destroyed"
then Chapter four of SS when Hagrid tells Harry he is a wizard and the story of how his parents died he says " Took yeh from the ruined house myself"
So he can't return to that house.

dantares
April 14th, 2003, 8:26 am
Maybe Winky kills Dobby and the door to the house-elves gives Harry nightmares.

FoolOnTheHill
April 14th, 2003, 8:29 am
Unless it was magically rebuilt! DUN DUN DUNNNN!! Sorry, it's 12:30 a.m......

Yep. I was gonna say that remo, but I was too lazy to edit my last post. I'm really curious about this place too. My first thought was actually Godric's Hollow, but I ruled that out pretty quickly. I dunno... Maybe it's some place we've never heard of... Some Death-Eater hideout/meeting place... Could it be some place at or related to Azkaban? That would be a pretty frightening place. I've got no clue here, I'm just throwing out wierd ideas. :)

dddraco
April 14th, 2003, 8:44 am
I think the new DADA teacher will be Mundungus Fletcher... The reason for this being that when they described sumone as being poisoned honey or whatever, would mean that they were on the whole good but had some nasty sides to them. I dont know if anyone remembers in the second book when Arthur Weasly comes home from work talking about Mungus tryin to jinx him while his back was turned, but yet DD called Mundungus part of the old crowd prolly meaning that they used to be sort of a task force against old Voldie...

Now this is kinda off thread but i was wondering if anyone saw a MAJOR mistake in GoF... Well it occured when Cedric and Harry both touched the portkey (another sketchy topic) but when Voldie and Wormtail were walking towards them Voldie told Worm to "kill the spare" in the next paragraph it said "a shrill second voice screamed, 'avada kedavra'" so why was it that Diggory came out of voldies wand when he and Harry conected???

rotsiepots
April 14th, 2003, 10:11 am
Dddraco -- Wormtail killed Cedric using Voldemort's wand.

JKR has also stated that the new DADA teacher will be a woman, so you might want to rethink your Mundungus Fletcher hypothesis. ;)

dddraco
April 14th, 2003, 10:19 am
Well from what i have read mundungus fletcher has not been acknowledged as either a man or woman so theres still a chance that im right... the only thing we really know about him is that he/she is old... thats it...

ahsweape
April 14th, 2003, 10:24 am
Actually, in chapter 10 of book four Percy says:

"Mundungus Fletcher's put in a claim for a twelve-bedroom tent with en-suite jacuzzi, but i've got HIS number..."

Definitely male.

rotsiepots
April 14th, 2003, 10:26 am
Mundungus is referred to as a he in GoF:

Mundungus Fletcher's put in a claim for a twelve-bedroomed tent with en-suite jacuzzi, but I've got his number. I know for a fact he was sleeping under a cloak propped on sticks..."

smartypants
April 14th, 2003, 1:25 pm
"A Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey "

Aha, so maybe it IS Fleur! That's my first thought when I red book 4 *** first time. Then I saw the theories about it being Ms Figg, and that seemed more plausible, but if piosoned honey doesn't describe a Part-vella, I don't know what does. :p

Oooh, poor Ron, he has no defence against Veela-magic. He will not be able to concentrate in Dada-class... :)

"A venomous, disgruntled house-elf "

Oh, that's sad, I hoped Winky would get her act together when all Crouches where gone, but yeah, that would have been too easy...

"Ron as Keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team "

Excellent! That means he still has a chance of becoming Quiddich captain!

I'll bet ya he and Harry will play against Krum for England. Maybe not until after book 7, but still. :p

fuzzi95
April 14th, 2003, 2:35 pm
There's one problem Ron may have:

How's he going to afford a proper broom? Fred and George would buy him one, but that money is for their shop! Anyway, this could cause Ron to be harassed even more, and that would definately worry Harry!

I wonder if Winky is mad because of what happened to Crouch Sr.? I mean, he didn't get a proper buriel. I even have reason to believe Fang or Sirius ate him as the bone! That would make any house-elf upset!

smartypants
April 14th, 2003, 3:31 pm
Most of the teams probably fly on school-brooms. The Gryffindor team surely does. I'm sure they get to pick the broom they like the best from the all the school-brooms. Occasionally somebody (like Malfoy) will sponsor their team with better brooms, and it seems like Harry in book one was sponsored by the Gryffinder house. McGonall seemed quite desperate to win, so she may have take a bite out of her house-budget for this. It may very well have been that the broom thereby officially was a Gryffindor broom, and not actually Harrys personal property, but that doesn't matter, since it was smashed in Book 3 anyway. :) That way they also wouldn't have to bother about breaking the 'no personal brooms for first years' rule. It's not his, REALLY. ;)

The firebolt though, definitely is his. But that was payed for by Sirius.

So, even if Ron can't afford a really, really good broom, he can still have a decent one from the school brooms. Fred and George complained about the school brooms, so I guess they are flying them too. And if he is good enough, they'll still win. :)

fuzzy_muggle
April 14th, 2003, 4:25 pm
Originally posted by RonFan24 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=265493#post265493))
I was thinking that maybe the reason Ron on the Gryffindor team is listed under Harry's problems is that maybe Ron will become captin and the job will go to his head. Finally Ron will be higher up in rank than Harry and get some attention other than his 15 minutes after Sirius tried to "kill" him. His ego will inflate and maybe he will start to push his new found authority on Harry. Then if Harry tries to say something Ron will take it the wrong way and get mad. Don't get me wrong, I love Ron, but in his situation I think that's how most people would act.


Good point. Having a position in the quidditch team may inflate Ron's head since he is always overshadowed by his older brothers and not to mention his bestfriend always gets the center of attention. The fame and popularity he maybe getting could enter into his head causing another problem for harry.

But i wish the theory is wrong cause i like ron vey much:rolleyes:

About the DADA teacher..... i really have no idea! I thought it was Mrs. Figg but the "poisoned honey" description does not seem to fit her. I'm wondering if its Fleur but i can't think of anything she might do to become one of harry's problems. It might be a new personality, probably a teacher assigned by the ministry.

About the door thing.... can't think of something here. It says "you know what harry faces during the day, but at night its even worse bec he dreams of a single door in a corridor..." what does it means? what does harry faces during the day that is worse at night which is related to the door? and more terrifying than nightmares combined??? wow, seems really creepy to me...

Tarawyn
April 14th, 2003, 5:01 pm
Just a note on the Defense teacher - as of yet, every Defense teacher has been introduced earlier in the book (if "Moody" is teetering on the edge) but never in the previous books. If the pattern was to be continued - and I think it is - then both Figg and Fleur are out of the running. Not that I mind.

Having Ron on the Quidditch team could cause all sorts of problems, especially if Ron isn't half as good as he thinks he is. Even if he's a reasonable player, Harry is almost certainly going to be better. And that might be more than he could take.

IAMLORDVOLDERMORT
April 14th, 2003, 5:12 pm
I think the new DADA is either Mrs. Figgs or someone new. None else fits the description as good as her besides Fluer but I doubt if its here because I dont think she would be a good DADA teacher because harry a fourth year when she was a seventh year crushed her in the Tri-Wizard Tourney with a little help but still.

About the new place Harry Visits I think it will be the Ministry of Magic because from the summary it mentions alot about the MOM.

And about the "venemous and disgruntled houseelf" I think that it will be a new houself

SnowyOwl
April 14th, 2003, 6:40 pm
[i]Originally posted by Tarawyn
Having Ron on the Quidditch team could cause all sorts of problems, especially if Ron isn't half as good as he thinks he is. Even if he's a reasonable player, Harry is almost certainly going to be better. And that might be more than he could take.


What is this assumption based on? Did I miss where Ron thinks he's good at quidditch? I simply have the impression that Ron follows the professional leagues and enjoys the game. I can't remember when he voices any frustration or any other feeling about not being on the team at Hogwarts. :??:

I can't see that he is going to feel competitive about quidditch with Harry. He hasn't before. They work well together. Since Ron is on the team, I'm sure he earned his way.

Buttercup
April 14th, 2003, 8:03 pm
Ron's attitude in GoF was showing that he has some serious insecurities. These are going to be an issue in future books. Rons being on the team can play up these insecurites. He can very well try to compete with Harry and that might be very frustating to him. Boys at that age are VERY competitive. Harry is his best friend and might want to drop out of the quidditch team to save his friendship. That could be an 'unbearable sacrifice' on Harry's part (not probable, I still think it is a death but I had to throw that theory into the ring here).

I also thought that Draco's mom might be a new DADA teacher. Somebody mentioned her earlier. I don't think many will like her because of Draco at first but maybe she puts on a good act and gets some people to like her. Just a couple of thoughts.

Tarawyn
April 14th, 2003, 8:13 pm
Simple assumption mixed with a misphrase - making it on the team would be an ego boost, and if he wasn't that great, well, it'd be disappointing. Sorry about that. At any rate, that's the thing - maybe he'd have earned his way, and maybe it'd be because there was no one better for the job, which doesn't necessarily mean that they're great. The best choice doesn't have to be a good choice. And it's not the competition with Harry, but his skill in relationship to Harry's skill, "famous Harry Potter," something else Harry is better than him at, etc, etc...there doesn't have to be competition for there to be tension.

too_wicked
April 14th, 2003, 8:21 pm
Fleur becoming the new DADA teacher will be hilarious. Maybe she'll become a good teacher like Moody and Lupin but imagine all the boys' reaction to her especially Ron. But I really think it's someone new.

About Ron becoming Keeper, I really think it's a great idea except for the fact that maybe he plays really awful or he's too good Slytherins are trying to murder him before every single match. If he's really good, really good to overshadow the "youngest Seeker in the century", I don't think Harry will be bothered at all. Harry isn't the jealous, bitter type anyway.

Cheers

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 8:26 pm
ooo ooo! I just came from the "do the potter;s have a house elf thread"...gave me an idea *lightbulb going on*

What if there is a new house-elf that we didn;t know about...the Potter's houde-elf...and he would be disgruntled by not having the opportunity to take care of Harry...and he welll ya...

Filius Flitwick
April 14th, 2003, 8:28 pm
It'd make you wonder if there was a difference in a house elf who was respected versus one who was treated like a slave. If the Potter's did have a house elf, maybe it would be more independent.

Barbara Kennedy
April 14th, 2003, 8:30 pm
If Ron turns out to be a good Q player, I think Harry would be delighted, for Ron's sake and for the team!

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 8:32 pm
yaya! I think that the Potters (had they had a house elf) would have been much nicer to him or her....but Winky was a devoted house elf...even if she was not treated in the best of ways...I dono, maybe the potter's old house elf will make dobby mad and then he would be the discruntled one out of jealousy...

Filius Flitwick
April 14th, 2003, 8:36 pm
Especially if the Potters treated them well for a few generations, then they really would be more independent. I'd actually like to see a house elf that really thinks for himself/herself.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 8:38 pm
yaya...me too! I think that Hermione was on to something with the liberation thing...I'd like to see all of their powers...

too_wicked
April 14th, 2003, 8:38 pm
Dobby is obsessed with Harry then if he gets jealous over an old house elf Harry's never met before! But I like it. It will be very funny.

Shoujo Kitsune
April 14th, 2003, 8:40 pm
cute huh?

Filius Flitwick
April 14th, 2003, 8:45 pm
Things would be especially interesting if it were a female house elf. Great, then there would be a discussion of Dobby/Winky vs. Dobby/(Potter Elf). ;)

Buttercup
April 14th, 2003, 8:55 pm
Lets move this to the 'love' thread. 'Days of our Elfs'.

Unless a new elf is mentioned I will have to go with Winky being the bad elf. She was not having a good time in GoF and was having some emotional problems. She could very easily blame Harry for all of her woes.

Alorra Spinnet
April 14th, 2003, 9:34 pm
I think the DADA teacher could still be Mrs. Figg. Poisonous honey makes me think of sweet but dangerous/deadly. Someone who seems harmless when they are just the opposite. Does not mean that person will be evil though. You have a supposedly harmless,sweet, slightly eccentric old lady. May turn out to be a powerfull witch who can be very dangerous when she needs to be. Someone the death-eaters would think twice about tangling with. Dumbledore apparently had her keeping an eye on things on Privet drive. Surely she could handle anyone who might be able to find a way around the protections. At least keep them occupied until Dumbledore and/or the aurors could get there to help.

Buttercup
April 14th, 2003, 9:41 pm
Harry didn't really enjoy going to Mrs. Figg's house (photo albums can be so boring, can you imagine one dedicated to CATS?). So she could very well be the new teacher. But do you think she could really be 'bad'? Harry might not like her ('geez Ron she is going on about the cats AGAIN').

Filius Flitwick
April 14th, 2003, 9:47 pm
Maybe she went on about cats because she didn't want to discuss anything too out there. By talking about boring subjects then she wouldn't be tempted to talk about wizarding things. Anyone is liable to slip up if the subject matter is close in relation.

MadMagic
April 14th, 2003, 9:52 pm
I like Alorra Spinnet's idea about Mrs. Figg. I was convinced that the new DADA teacher would be Mrs. Figg and the poisoned honey could mean that she seems really sweet and not a very powerful wizard, but underneath she is really powerful and scary (but good). It would be yet a different personality of the DADA teacher at Hogwarts.

GrangerGal
April 14th, 2003, 10:17 pm
I like that idea about her too. She could also be strict but nice. Many teachers are very fair and very nice but like their classrooms to be run in a specific manner. If you cross her or step out of line she is no longer nice.

By the way Filius Flitwick, I think you are right on the money when you talk about why she went on about cats. Also maybe there is something significant about each of her cats. Or something significant about the pictures of her cats and things inside them that we will discover later on.

remo
April 14th, 2003, 10:34 pm
I agree with Alorra Spinnet's theory on the DADA teacher. I think the teacher may appear to be nice and even freindly to students at first. But once in class she will have a personality like Snape. Instead of encouraging them to keep trying she could be insulting them and stuff like that. But I had another wild idea about the new teaher.
What if it is Nevilles Grandmother? Now think about it, Nevilles father was an Auror, they are an old magic family. His Gran is probably a very good witch and she was around during the rise of Voldemort before. She could appear sweet and kind. We've always herad about sending the things Neville forgot and stuff like that. But we also know about the Howler she sent Neville and when Harry saw her in Diagon Alley and made the comment about he hoped she never found out he said he was Neville on the Knight Bus. It's kind of out there, but I think she could fit the 'poisoned honey' description.

For the disgruntled house elf, I hope it is Dobby and he's disgruntled with the Malfoys. He finds out Voldemort is back (house elves were treated horrible before when V was around) and he knows Lucius went back to V. So Dobby is disgruntled against the Malfoys and is causing problems for them. But these problems effect Harry as well.

I don't see how Ron on the team will be a bad thing and cause worries for Harry. I think Harry will be happy to have his best friend with him. I don't see how one playing their position better than the other would cause a fight since they play so differently in their postions. I can see it being a worry because I'm sure this will give Malfoy something else to make fun of Ron for. There also might be some arguments between Ron and his brothers since they are on the team. But I don't think it will cause a problem with Ron and Harry.

pmb1290
April 14th, 2003, 10:38 pm
About Ron and quidditch...
Although I dont get the impression that Harry has great leadership skills, he could be voted as the new captain. Perhaps it is the captain's responsibility to pick a new keeper. Ron would of course pressure Harry to pick him. Harry would do it, although there will probably be better canditates. He will get a lot of heat for that decision, and anything that Ron does wrong (hehehe ron-wrong.. hehehe) will be blamed on Harry. That would certainly worry me if I were Harry... Also, this would be one of the "easy but not right" choices that JKR always talks about...

As for Mrs Figg and her personality of poisoned honey... we might just be over-analyzing this. Mrs Figg clearly does not have a good personality. She lives for her cats.

For my theory where I over-analyze this, look on page 2.
Who knows, it might be significant...

Peter

Fleeper
April 14th, 2003, 11:03 pm
The clues we got from the scholastic thing are probably (well...obviously) important to the plot.

The Disgruntled Elf... When I read this, I thought of Winky too...she is a character that most definitely fits this description. But we have to keep in mind there are hundreds of other elves in Hogwarts, not to mention many more in home across the wizarding world.

The teacher like poisoned honey caught my eye. While I automatically thought... "oh, she'll be mean," it might not turn out to be that simple. Like someone pointed out before me (I'm too lazy to quote/look for the person,) it's poisoned, not poisonous. The teacher, I never really believed it woudld be Mrs. Figg or Fleur, most likely was nice, or sweet. They still could be; there are different ways to interpret this. They just may be under the imperious or some other spell/potion that makes them evil. Or they were drilled when they were younger to be mean. I doubt, while Dumbledore has been proven wrong, that he would find a Voldie-supporter as a teacher. He's most likely desperate, yes, but....I accept those theories. (Snape is mean....but he's not a deatheater anymore)

The sacrifice....I agree it most definitely could be one of the trio (not harry, obviously.) Hagrid, Colin, etc I'm not too sure about. They're not central characters... But of the more obvious ones, Hagrid is the most dear to Harry. He WAS Harry's first friend (disregarding his first year+ of life w/ his parents) from the magical world and muggle world. It could be a character we dislike, but they change and we soon like them. (Dursleys, Draco)

Ron getting on the team. I really don't see why Harry could get jealous. Harry IS the one who's always mad that RON gets jealous. He feels bad that Ron is always overshadowed. Jealousy doesn't seem to be part of Harry's attitude (maybe with Ginny if your a H/G shipper). He wasn't even jealous of Dudley when he had all those presents..what? 36...so then 38 in total.
-If the twins are feeling extremely generous with Harry's money ,they may BUY ron a broomstick...possibly a nimbus 2000/1.

Back to the sacrifice. Well, not sacrifice. the unbearable death of someone close to Harry. I was in the Mugglenet chatroom yesterday..and someone brought up a good point. No one really thought about McGonagall, have they? SHe bought Harry his first broomstick, and she's obviously fond of Harry (really big softie at heart..) and she's an authoratative figure at Hogwarts. She's also a mothering figure...she was worrying about Harry's wellbeing at the Dursleys in PS/SS. Everyone automatically thinks of Mrs. Weasley for the horrible death because of JK's mother....but seriously... I know I would be devastated if McGonagall died...:'(

GryffindorSeeker
April 14th, 2003, 11:08 pm
In the fourth and third book, Ron has gotten his moments of fame and look at how he reacted. (WHen Sirius tried to "kill" him, and the 2nd task) He got bigheaded. It's on the natural side, I guess. He's been overshadowed by his brothers all his life and one of his bestfriend has been famous since he was one, and the other is the top of his class. It's a possibility that Ron becomes bigheaded and bosses Harry around. But there's still the part about loyalty. :??: Where's book five when you need it!

lodlom
April 14th, 2003, 11:12 pm
I wasn't sure if this was already mentioned but what if the unbearable sacrifice and the "fan" death are two different things. What if the unbearable sacrifice is on Harry's part

GryffindorSeeker
April 14th, 2003, 11:14 pm
Well, wasn't that under what the friends would do?

Shi
April 14th, 2003, 11:22 pm
DADA Teacher: I still think it's Mrs. Figg, and I'm taking "poisoned honey" to be something like a split personality.

house-elf: I don't think it's Winky, I think it is an elf we haven't really met before (maybe the Malfoy's new elf, umm... I dunno)

Ron as Keeper: Yup, we guessed it. In my opinion, this is great for him because he will finally get some attention which will hopefully tone down the jealousy, and he won't be stuck alone with Hermione, who I'm sure will be very uptight freaking about her OWLS (agh! What a nightmare!). I also hope that he will get more accustumed to attention and not get as bigheaded as he did in previous books!

OWLS: I'm anxious to see how stressed Hermione gets!

Buttercup
April 14th, 2003, 11:56 pm
Ooooo Remo I never thought about Neville's grandma being the next DADA teacher. That is a good one. I really feel for the kid if that is so. She will make his life miserable.

But what can be considered an 'unbearable sacrifice'?. Death is the ultimate sacrifice so would that sacrifice be unbearable to the survivors? But what else can be unbearable? ...losing you home, your job, or someone you really loved? These wouldn't really involve a death but can they be considered 'unbearable'? Is a death the only answer? It really boggles the mind.

I think the only thing that could be considered 'unbearable' would be a death of some kind. But who and what sacrifice?

pegoheart144
April 15th, 2003, 12:28 am
The "impotence" of the Hogwarts staff intrigues me. What if Fudge pressures the Board of Governors to suspend or fire Dumbledore. Without him at Hogwarts, the incompetence or weakness of staff could be very glaring. I also think Dumbledore could die.

I'm also interested in the venomous, disgruntled house elf. I think the discussion about Winky being that character is interesting and probably right.

The turmoil caused by the rift in the Ministry of Magic and possibly Hogwarts would give Voldemort the chance to make a major move. He take over Azkaban and free all the Death Eaters imprisoned there. The Dementors will side with the Dark Side. My feeling is this won't happen until late in the book.

That's all for now. I'll think about the other points and comment on them later.

Earendil
April 15th, 2003, 12:30 am
Neville's gran! That would be fun...."Welcome to Defense Against the Dark Arts. I'm Mrs. Longbottom, but you can call me Neville-poo's granny."
Poor little fellow already has low self-esteem.
This "poisoned honey" business makes my head hurt. I understand what some of you have been saying that it could be Mrs. Figg because she may be good but mean, but why use the word "poisoned"? I mean, is this some random word that just popped into her head? Interesting choice, if so. She could have used, oh, I don't know, "Spoiled honey" or "nasty honey", so why "poisoned"?

dracofan
April 15th, 2003, 12:35 am
What if Harry was the one to do the sacrifice. Meaning, in order to save the school, he decides to leave his "home" for the good of everyone there since Voldie is after him alone.

To Harry, this would be an unbearable sacrifice on his part. This could lead him to the other magical world.

FawkesBox
April 15th, 2003, 2:59 am
With this visionary thing- I think it sounds very possible that Harry might be a "true seer" or whatever phrase is used- but I think it is interesting to note that he hates divination, not because it shows he is bad at it but instead to throw us off the tail of his immense talent in the subject.

FawkesBox
April 15th, 2003, 3:23 am
I am definitely getting a blonde vibe from the DADA professor position. As soon as I read the "poisoned honey" description I immediately thought of Fleur Delacour for obvious reasons- she's pretty, yet, not very nice. However, I just don't think that she's evil- just vain- and she did say she wanted to get a job to help her with her English.
The Narcissa Malfoy suggestion, however, is just pure gold! She may be pretty (although that dung-under-the-nose comment throws me off a bit) but her exterior could conceal a dark side _or_ what if she is secretly rebelling against her husband's evil ways- she wants to protect her only son. Just like with Harry, a mother's love can circumvent a great deal of evil.
I have a gut feeling that Narcissa will be an important character. I just don't think that JKR uses names or characters that are not going to be important. If she wasn't going to be important why name her? Why have her? --She could have "died in childbirth" or somesuch. Look at the way she drops Sirius Black's name in the first chapter of PS/SS!

Also, because of the description I am led to believe the DADA prof will not be Arabella Figg who really does seem like an old nice lady. I see her as more of a potions professor- note how her house always smells like cabbage (a la polyjuice potion.)

Katy Kedevra
April 15th, 2003, 3:30 am
I think that Ron could give Harry problems if, say, Harry becomes captain. And maybe Ron isn't practicing hard enough and could end up ruining their chances at winning and Harry has to talk to him about devoting himself or he might be kicked off the team. Ron could take it the wrong way and say that Harry just wants all the spotlight, but in the back of his head, Ron would know it's not true, but Harry would still feel bad about it and be worried about Ron's success.

Also, I think we may get to see just how powerful a house-elf can be. We got a taste of it when Dobby went up against Malfoy, but this time, I think it could be from the other side. I think Winky will turn to the dark side. What faith could she possibly have in the 'good' guys anymore anyway? She may use her powers to help Voldemort. Also, I don't think Malfoy will have a new house-elf. Didn't Dobby say that house-elves are tied to one family and one HOUSE for their entire lives? This would suggest that there are no other house-elves at Malfoy Manor. Unless I just mistook that line for something else... ;)

I also think that the DADA teacher will be someone mentioned, maybe just not confronted yet. I still think it's Mrs. Figg, but I could be wrong. However, I don't think it will be a new person completely because we're over halfway through the books and I don't think that JKR should introduce too many new characters, but rather develop previously mentioned characters even more. The only thing that makes me think it may be a new person is something mentionned in this thread. (I'm sorry, I don't remember who said this) They mentionned that every year there has been a new character important to that books plot as the DADA teacher. They also said that we would meet them at the beginning of the books, but not before the book, if this theory is true. I agree with this theory and yet I still believe that Mrs. Figg will be the new teacher. Wow, my head hurts... *collapses*

dddraco
April 15th, 2003, 5:04 am
Every thing u said is cool wit me exept for the DADA teacher... If JK wouldnt have said that it would be a woman i was thinking more on the lines of Mundungus Fletcher, or MAYBE even Sirius... How cool would that be.. but any way my theory is its Fleur Delacour... YES she just graduated but she did say in the fourth book that she was gettin a job at hogwarts or close to it so she can work on her english... Also JK described the teacher as being "poisoned honey..." i can definately see the honey part from what we hear about her in the book and she definately does have a bad attitude sometimes that would constitute to the poisoned part...

fuzzy_muggle
April 15th, 2003, 6:29 am
If the DADA teacher is going to be Fleur, can't wait to see the face of Hermione and the other girls:p Fleur is part veela so she has irresistible charms on the guys!

go_anna40
April 15th, 2003, 7:49 am
Fleur...with a poisoned honey character?
Well, I can't say it does fit.

Kirby
April 15th, 2003, 8:01 am
These are my theories:
The DADA Teacher- I think it will be Fleur as the 'poisoned honey' matches her sort of as she is part Veela. She 'poisons' the boys when they appear. And the 'sweet' comes from her personality, being nice.

Disgruntled house-elf- I like an idea I saw in an earlier post about Dobby being mad at Lucius for going back with Voldemort. I think Dobby could then do the same stuff to Draco and his family as he did to Harry.

Ron as keeper- I don't know how this will be classified as a worry to Harry, maybe just that Ron might be bad and might let down the team.

The door in the corridor- I think this may be where Voldemort is situated. It may be back at the house where he was before, or it may be at another place. I think Harry keeps dreaming about being in the place of Frank bryce, but as him, going up to hear what Voldemort and Wormtail are talking about.

Rowena Ravenclaw
April 15th, 2003, 8:15 am
I still say if they're going to hire Fleur, they may as well go ahead and hire Harry himself. After all, he can cast a Patronus, and even advanced wizards have issues with that. She can't handle a bunch of measley grindylows. Besides, I think the closeness in age would be too much of an issue.

jordmundt6
April 15th, 2003, 8:24 am
What '80s hair band had that song "Hot for Teacher"? Was it Van Halen? Yeah, there'd be serious trouble if Fleur took over as DADA Prof. Her method of discipline would involve a lot of her charm and none of the guys would be able to see straight (and you can bet it would annoy the gals after a class or two). Also, she might run into trouble using the equivalent of the Imperius Curse to keep order in her classroom. But I think the female DADA will be somebody new that we haven't met. What's latin for Poisoned Honey?

jordmundt6
April 15th, 2003, 8:27 am
Hmm. For disgruntled House Elf, I'd go with Winky. She's disgraced. Her master is dead, killed by his own son. She failed in her duty. And it's all because of Harry Potter. Enough to drive any good woman mad. Or it could be somebody new taking Dobby's new approach to the next level (aka the Goblin Level)

sirius_fan
April 15th, 2003, 9:19 am
DADA teacher: i go for the theory that it's mrs figg. "poisoned honey" probably means she looks kind and demure, but try messing around with her and you'll get it! i see the new DADA teacher as someone who is as strict as mcgonagall, and perhaps drips with sarcasm when she thinks you're not working hard enough or doing your work properly. hey never thought of neville's gran being the new DADA! can't discount that either. JK only said that mrs figg is arabella figg, not that she is the new DADA.

ron as keeper: i think harry's worries will probably stem from the fact that (i) ron gets so crazy about quidditch that he makes oliver wood seem like a cuddly teddy bear; or (ii) ron repeatedly gets himself into scuffles with malfoy during quidditch matches or practices. i can't see ron getting all big headed about being a keeper. ron enjoys the spotlight when it comes to one-off events like sirius black etc, but let's not forget that ron is a big quidditch fan. if he is the keeper, i can see him practising darn hard to be better at it (hey, he must be good if he got chosen as the keeper) not just to win the cup for his house, but also as part of a personal vendetta against malfoy. even if harry becomes the captain, i don't think that he would be pressurized to choose ron -- shouldn't the keeper be chosen by the whole team / mcgonagall / hooch?

disgruntled house elf: i think it could be dobby. i'm not sure who that elf is, but i think SPEW may backfire on hermione and end up dividing the house-elves into two camps? could be a dobby vs winky (plus the rest of the house-elves) scenario. question is will the house-elves help dumbledore or voldemort?

unbearable sacrifice: why do i keep thinking it's mrs wealsey??!? i hope it's not her since the catalogue mentions the unbearable sacrifice in the same vein as "friends". maybe it's hagrid. anyway, does anyone know why tom felton thinks draco will die in book 5?

smartypants
April 15th, 2003, 9:23 am
Originally posted by FawkesBox (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=266915#post266915))
With this visionary thing- I think it sounds very possible that Harry might be a "true seer" or whatever phrase is used- but I think it is interesting to note that he hates divination, not because it shows he is bad at it but instead to throw us off the tail of his immense talent in the subject.


Ah, well, Divination really has nothing to do with being a true seer. But McGonnall (and me) seems to be one of the few that realizes this. ;)

smartypants
April 15th, 2003, 9:26 am
"Poisoned honey" is something that tastes really good but is really bad for you. I don't see how Ms Figg can fit that description. I do see how Fleur could. Veelas are definitely poisoned honey. Remember Mr Weaslys advice "That's why you should never go for looks alone". ;)

Could be somebody completely new though. But of the characters in books 1 to 4, Fleur definitely is the one that is most like poisoned honey.

Kirby
April 15th, 2003, 10:02 am
Yeah, I totally agree with you, Smartypants. I've been thinking that as well.

Myrddin
April 15th, 2003, 10:32 am
I've just been researching 'Poisoned Honey' and this is what I have found. (Taken from the 'Wikipedia')

Honey is, however, not always healthy. Because it is gathered from flowers in the wild, there are certain times and places when the honey produced is highly toxic. Rhododendrons and azaleas have nectar that is highly poisonous to humans although harmless to bees, producing deadly honey. In some areas of the world the hives are emptied immediately after the flowering season and cleaned of any residue to prevent accidental poisoning. There are stories that poisoned honey was used in warfare in ancient times, but they are unverifiable.

The last sentence is perhaps the most interesting. Maybe the DADA teacher is once again an agent of Lord Voldermort's, which isn't much of a surprise now is it? *Hmph*.

The one story I found relates to an assasination attempt on a King. The King got wind of the plot and sent jars of poisoned honey to the suspected conspiritors. Naturally, everyone who ate it died, with the exception of one, a child of the gods. Sound familiar?

go_anna40
April 15th, 2003, 12:50 pm
My theories:

A Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey
I think it's going to be Figg (if she turns out to be a Witch), Snape, or some other new character.
Though I don't think Figg has a poisoned honey personality. And wouldn't she be very busy being in the Order at such a time?
I don't think Fleur is going to be the teacher, because, her personality during the Tournement wasn't very like poisoned honey.
Snape- we all know, is semi-evil.
And if Figg (which I doubt) isn't a Witch, and Snape keeps being the Potions Master, that only leaves an open spot for a new professor. And a new professor could really mean anything.

A venomous, disgruntled house-elf
Maybe Dobby, Winky or a new house-elf we will meet.
Winky- well, since GOF, she has been disgruntled, but not venomous. Mayber her anger towards herself would expand and reach others.
Dobby- well maybe, getting angry at Lucuis for "re-joining" Voldermort. Or maybe even hurting his old master. But I really doubt it, because Dobby isn't a slave to the Malfoys anymore, and Dobby wouldn't really...care.
And there's always the new character option open.

Ron as Keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team
Um....I've said this, but no. Ron becoming Keeper would be, to me, be very obvious. And when things are obvious, it doesn't seem so great. Maybe he'll become a reserve, or maybe he'll try out and become a finalist, but I really think it's going to happen.

And of course, what every student dreads: end-of-term Ordinary Wizarding Level exams.
Hermione, of course will pass with flying colours, but what would be surprising, a teacher failing her.
I think that Harry and Ron would spend a mass of time studying. But I don't think they'll fail, maybe just narrowly miss.
Maybe they won't have O.W.L'S at all.

And you know what Harry faces during the day. But at night it's even worse, because then he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor. And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined.
I think this is where Voldermort resides. I really am puzzled over this. It could be the door that leads to where Harry's parents were killed in Godric Hollow. I am really not sure on this one.

Myrddin
April 15th, 2003, 2:16 pm
Originally posted by go_anna40 (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=267739#post267739))
Snape- we all know, is semi-evil.


He is the diet-coke of evil. :)

Rowena Ravenclaw
April 15th, 2003, 2:23 pm
"Highly poisonous to humans, though harmless to bees..."...bumblebee...Maybe Dumbledore doesn't really know what the DADA teacher's like when he hires her? That seems an argument in favor of Mrs. Figg to me. He's so used to her, or remembers how invaluable she was as one of the "old crowd," it doesn't occur to him what she might be like around the students.

Wait, what am I saying? Dumbledore not know? Naah.

dantares
April 15th, 2003, 2:37 pm
I don't think the new DADA would be a servant of Voldemort. If it really is, I would be disappointed because it's almost reusing "old" ideas and I trust JKR more than that. I think it could be Aunt Petunia. Aunt Petunia may have showed some magic talent and she was hired to be a teacher with Mrs. Figg guiding her. She's may be only sweet to students she like (Slytherin) but poisonous to Gynfindoor.

Jaredd
April 15th, 2003, 3:11 pm
So let's talk about these spoilers:

New DADA teacher --- "poisoned honey" -- seems to me that JKR mentioned that we would find alot more about Lily in book 5. I know she's already used the DADA post in book 3 (Lupin) to introduce us to James' past, but I wouldn't put it past her to do it again, but maybe with a twist? Perhaps the "poisoned honey" could be an extremely nice teacher to all the other students but mean to Harry because of something between her and Lily back at Hogwarts? For that reason I'm not putting my money on Figg or Fleur, but wouldn't it be funny if Narcissa and Lily had been friends at Hogwarts? After all, Narcissa is about the right age and doesn't seem to be as wedded to the dark side as Lucius (doesn't she insist that Draco go to Hogwarts instead of Durmstrang?) Heck, she could even take the job to save her son from his father's fate. Maybe she secretly likes Harry but has to treat him with disdain in order to keep her son's trust?

Ron as Keeper. This one's easy. Any time he's found himself in the spotlight he's become bigheaded. My best guess is, Ron gets on the team and becomes unbearable, trying to take over strategy. This time the rift puts Fred and George on Harry's side.

Disgruntled house-elf. I know you all think it's Winky but I have to side with the few who say Dobby. After all, JKR always does what we least expect. In GoF, Dobby still punishes himself for speaking ill of his former masters. Perhaps in OotP he has finally overcome that hurdle and wreak revenge on Draco........even funnier, if Narcissa is DADA professor her as well........but somehow Harry starts getting the blame for a series of unfortunate events.

THE ROOM. I think it has to be the room full of chamberpots mentioned by Dumbledore in GoF. BUT: I think the room goes further back. I think it's also the room where Harry found the Mirror of Erised. Remember, Dumbledore mentions that perhaps the room can only be found when the "Seeker has an exceptionally full bladder". In other words, it is a room with special properties that offers the person who enters it just what they need at the moment. I'll let others go on from there, but just my 2 knuts.

DEATH: My money's still on Percy, but I've still got a small side bet on Mrs. Weasly.

Neville: Something's up with that kid. He shows all the symptoms of being the victim of an extremely strong memory charm. I wonder what he'll be like once it's lifted?

dracofan
April 15th, 2003, 4:57 pm
Yes, Neville will definately become a hero in the series at some point.

Hermione, just might not do well on her OWL and Harry may score higher.

I hope Draco doesn't die, I want to see him redeem himself in the series.

Filia Tenebrarum
April 15th, 2003, 7:13 pm
Oh, Jaredd, I can't believe I never thought of Neville being under a memory charm! Now you say it it seems so obvious! None of his family sound as if they were scatter brained! Has this theory been floating around for ages, or has it just occured to you?

Jaredd
April 15th, 2003, 7:26 pm
I know others have come the same conclusion about Neville independently, but I started making the connection in book 4. First, I kept trying to figure out why Neville never told anybody about his parents, even after 4 years together. Then I also started noticing similarities between Neville's forgetfulness and the language used to describe Bertha Jorkins in GoF. Bertha was only scatterbrained because the memory charm put on her by Barty Crouch had that effect. That's when I started making the connection. I'll bet the memory charm was put on him by his grandmother for his own protection, but his obsession with the Cruciatus curse in GoF appears to be breaking it down. I'll bet he starts to break through in OotP.

Buttercup
April 15th, 2003, 7:33 pm
OK here is my two cents worth about the DADA teacher. This is a REAL stretch but here is goes:

-the teacher will be a female. This we know.

-JKR has this fascination about female names that are after flowers. Honey is made from flowers thus the new DADA teacher will names be after a flower-Narcissa. Plus the fact she is 'blonde' doesn't speak much for her.

About the school and the MOM of magic. A few months ago when the 'clue' card about OotP was sold at that charity auction wasn't one of the words 'fired'? Could be DD gets fired.

I also wondered about the possibility of a sacrifice on Harry's part would be leaving Hogwarts. That would definitely be unbearable for him. Someone mentioned that earlier and that is a very good theory to me.

GrangerGal
April 15th, 2003, 8:27 pm
Originally posted by go_anna40:

A venomous, disgruntled house-elf
Maybe Dobby, Winky or a new house-elf we will meet.
Winky- well, since GOF, she has been disgruntled, but not venomous. Mayber her anger towards herself would expand and reach others.
Dobby- well maybe, getting angry at Lucuis for "re-joining" Voldermort. Or maybe even hurting his old master. But I really doubt it, because Dobby isn't a slave to the Malfoys anymore, and Dobby wouldn't really...care.
And there's always the new character option open.

- go_anna40 I think it is interesting that you think Dobby doesn't care about what the Malfoys do... I had just the opposite conclusion. I thought that now that he is free he will be more willing to go against them and the more years he has between him and the Malfoy's the more likely he will go against them. I wonder what makes you think he wouldn't care. I love hearing opposing arguments b/c they help me to either change my mind or to draw better conclusions.

Kendra
April 15th, 2003, 8:40 pm
The clue card contained the words (taken from bbc newsround website)...

Ron
Broom
Sacked (you're right!)
dies
might change
longest volume
Thirty-eight chapters
sorry
new teacher
house-elf

It seems now I look back we have heard most of these mentioned in that summary!

Bet that American who got that card is kicking him/herself in June when we get to know all!

Buttercup
April 15th, 2003, 8:41 pm
I think it would definitely be a 'worry' to Harry if Dobby took up a vendetta against the Malfoy's. Elf's do have powerful magic but Lucius has some seriously powerful friends too. What if Dobby talks Harry into going to the Malfoy Mansion for some reason or if Dobby goes there to get revenge and Harry tries to follow him to stop him. That could cause some problems.

I always wondered why Dobby went to Harry in the first place? He worked for Malfoy's for years and knew all the bad things they did and NOW (in CoS) he decides to do something good and help Harry. There is more to Dobby than meets the eye.

Edit: Thanks Helhorns for looking up the clue words. I thought it was 'fired' but was 'sacked'. Same difference I guess. In Britain does 'sacked' mean the same in USA?

GrangerGal
April 15th, 2003, 8:48 pm
Buttercup I totally agree with you. I like Dobby and I hope he is good but why now!? And if we recall CoS, Dobby didnt do much good "helping" Harry. So I think Dobby taking revenge on the Malfoys could do more harm than good especially if he leads Harry to the Malfoy mansion. This would also go along with people's theories about the doors on the cover being in the mansion.

lupinfan
April 15th, 2003, 9:06 pm
Hey Buttercup and Jaredd

Yes, sacked means fired here in UK!

Jaredd - fantastic work on Narcissa and Ron! I've been thinking a bit about Draco. The bit at the end of PoA when Dumbledore makes Sirius and Snape shake hands - I thought - Hmmm - one of those mirror scenes - I can see this being Draco and Harry some day. But I could never think how a boy whose father was so "dark" could not turn out the same way judging by the nasty comments he makes about mudbloods etc - such an obvious supporter of Voldie and all that. But now that you mention Narcissa I can see that there might be a possibility that Draco can be persuaded aginst Voldie. For instance, when the deatheaters were summoned to Voldie at the end of GoF only Lucius went, not Narcissa (I think). So maybe she's trying to keep Draco from becoming a Deatheater on the quiet.

It's all quite fascinating....

dracofan
April 15th, 2003, 9:21 pm
I hope Narcissa isn't the new DADA teacher. Anyway, didn't she have her nose stuck up in the air, doesn't sound very honey, I mean sweet.

I think Neville's gran is a great choice, even better than figg or fleur.

There was a theory a few months ago that suggested Neville was put under a spell by crouch jr. After that class he was very weird for the rest of the book.

Kendra
April 15th, 2003, 9:25 pm
he was probably just very disturbed, I think I would be, he isn't as strong mentally as Harry and his parents are still alive, they just can't reconise him, and he's finally seen the truth, I expect his gran's shaded him from things a bit.

Alorra Spinnet
April 15th, 2003, 9:47 pm
Hmmn, looking at this for more subtle hints. We have both poison and Venom mentioned in personalties. Snape was teaching them about antidotes the previous year, and wasn't one of Harry's summer assignments about undectable poisons?

MagpieOnaga
April 15th, 2003, 10:22 pm
Woooh. It's been a long time, but I'm here, and I'm all giddy about this new information!! I think I'll do a hodgepodge analysis of the summary...I'm sure all this will have been said before, but here goes:

...So spoke Albus Dumbledore at the end of Harry Potter's fourth year at Hogwarts. But as Harry enters his fifth year at wizard school, it seems those bonds have never been more sorely tested. Lord Voldemort's rise has opened a rift in the wizarding world between those who believe the truth about his return, and those who prefer to believe it's all madness and lies - just more trouble from Harry Potter.
Ok, so my interpretation of the last line here is that the wizarding world, after reading Rita Skeeter's gossip and slander about Harry all throughout the previous schoolyear, is beginning to think of him as "infamous Harry Potter," rather than "famous Harry Poitter." They've adopted a negativity towards seeing his name in the papers, perhaps. And, I'm assuming Harry will continue to support Dumbledore in trying to make the wizarding community aware of Voldemort's return. Yet some, as this quote suggests, aren't willing to face the facts. They'd rather slander Harry's name, calling him a liar and a troublemaker, than concede to the possibility of a repeat of the terror and fear they experienced 16 years earlier.

(not any real revalations here -- I'm just stating the obvious. so, onto the next line)


Add this to a host of other worries for Harry...

OK, big red flag here!! Everything that follows has to be negative. Negative enough to become a noticable obstacle for Harry in the books.

A Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher with a personality like poisoned honey

I'm not sure about this one. Like I said before, everything in this list is negative, and I interpret "poisoned honey" as being EXTREMELY negative. I think she'll be a lot like Snape to Harry, but with a sweet side to her that gets other students on her side.

As far as who she could be -- that's anyone's guess, but there do seem to be some likely candidates. Namely, Narcissa and Mrs. Figg. Neither of them seems to fit the bill, though -- Narcissa hardly seems like the type that could ever be described as sweet, and, conversely, "poison" doesn't seem to describe Mrs. Figg very well either. I must admit, though, that we really don't know anything about these two... so they're both definite possibilities.

My own personal inkling is that it will be someone completely new.

A venomous, disgruntled house-elf

This struck me as very odd, because I can't see either Dobby or Winky as being "disgruntled." I suppose, now that I think about it, Winky might fit that description, after what happened in book 4. She would be pretty angry at Harry for aiding in the dismantling of her happy home. So, yeah, I think it's probably Winky.

I can say one thing for sure -- I REALLY hope we don't get introduced to a NEW house elf. God, I can hardly stand the ones we know already!


Ron as keeper of the Gryffindor Quidditch team

Well, that's news! I'm excited to hear it....finally, Ron'll get his chance to shine.

The only question is, why was this listed as one of Harry's worries? Like many of you have said, the attention might go to Ron's head, and that kind of egotism always leads to something bad.

And of course, what every student dreads: end-of-term Ordinary Wizarding Level exams

I'm interested to see how Harry does on these -- are they graded based on ability, or knowledge? If the emphasis is on ability, then there's a good chance Harry may outshine Hermione! That would be something!

...and you'd know what Harry faces during the day. But at night it's even worse, because then he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor. And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined.

I'm a little confused by that first line. We'd know what he faces during the day? Does that just mean the usual -- nasty potions lessons, trouble from the Slytherins, annoyance by the Creevey brothers, difficult classes? I suppose so....but for some reason this line seemed a little confusing.

Anyway, as for the silent corridor thing -- I really have no idea, and I don't think anyone else does either. All we can do is make vague connections to the cover illustration, and to JKR's statement of a "special room," neither of which (or both) may have anything to do with the dreaded corridor. I'm glad of it, too -- more mystery to add to the anticipation while we wait!

In the richest installment yet of J.K. Rowling's seven-part story, Harry Potter confronts the unreliability of the very government of the magical world, and the impotence of the authorities at Hogwarts.

That comment about it being the "richest installment yet" made me absolutely giddy! That certainly puts down a lot of the fears I had earlier, that the book would be a dissapointment.

Anyway, the "unreliability of the government," isn't surprising -- undoubtedly, Fudge will make every effort to avoid facing the facts about Voldemort's return. They won't do much to help Harry, I'm sure.

The comment about the "impotence of the authorities at Hogwarts" was also intriguing. Maybe Harry will have to come to accept the fact that Dumbledore cannot solve every problem -- like a child who realizes his parents aren't perfect.

Despite this (or perhaps because of it) Harry finds depth and strength in his friends, beyond what even he knew; boundless loyalty, and unbearable sacrifice.

Though there is a possibility that this "unbearable sacrifice" might mean something other than death, I have a feeling this does refer to the "horrible death" JKR told us about earlier. No idea who it's gonna be, but for the sake of making some kind of guess, I'll bet it's going to be Hagrid.

Though thick runs the plot (as well as the spine), readers will race through these pages, and leave Hogwarts, like Harry, wishing only for the next train back.

I don't doubt that one bit! God, it's going to be a long two months....

GryffindorSeeker
April 15th, 2003, 11:04 pm
Originally posted by MagpieOnaga (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=268351#post268351))[

I'm not sure about this one. Like I said before, everything in this list is [i]negative, and I interpret "poisoned honey" as being EXTREMELY negative. I think she'll be a lot like Snape to Harry, but with a sweet side to her that gets other students on her side.



Yes, Thank you MagpieOnaga! That's what I was thinking about the DADA teacher! I was thinking about somethings in the SPOILERS. We got a good deal of clues, but if anything I think it's making the wait harder! But that's half good, half bad. You should know what I mean;)
Anyway, one to what I was saying. Buttercup, the thing about the flowers, about honey being made from them and the DADA teacher probably made from that. The adult women with flower names, who are alive, and aren't already at the school are:
*Petunia Dursley ( Maybe she is magic? but I don't see the HONEY part in PH)
* Fleur Delacour (she's not quite an adult but since she's of age)
* Narcissa Malfoy
Hmmmm... That is if they are flower named.
Other than that I find Mrs. Figg and Neville's Gran possibilities.
I really don't have any other ideas!:??:

dracofan
April 15th, 2003, 11:14 pm
Did you notice the summary didn't say anything about the hormones of Ron and Hermione.

So, I guess this will be back burner.

GryffindorSeeker
April 15th, 2003, 11:22 pm
Well, just because it isn't on the summary doesn't mean it won't happen. It just probably wasn't one of the more major worries of Harry if it does happen.

Jessica
April 15th, 2003, 11:48 pm
I'm a little confused by that first line. We'd know what he faces during the day? Does that just mean the usual -- nasty potions lessons, trouble from the Slytherins, annoyance by the Creevey brothers, difficult classes? I suppose so....but for some reason this line seemed a little confusing.

FYI MagpieOnaga

You have to read the sentence like this


Add this to a host of other worries for Harry... (yada yada yada)

...and you'd know what Harry faces during the day. But at night it's even worse, because then he dreams of a single door in a silent corridor. And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined.

The second part is a continuation of the first. I had to read it twice to get that part too.

I think we should all pitch in and get a time turner to June 21.

Katy Kedevra
April 16th, 2003, 12:04 am
I don't think that it's been mentionned before (so that's mainly why I'm putting this thought up on the boards for discussion), but what if the new DADA teacher turned out to be Rita Skeeter? We all know where the poisoned part would come from, but maybe she's poisoned honey because she is really trying to change but she ends up seeming like a bad jar of not-so-sweet honey? Hermione already (probably) destroyed her career in the paper. I mean, where's the fun in telling the truth about people? ;) Also, maybe Dumbledore knows about Rita, and knows she knows about the whole Voldemort thing and Sirius (just the thought of her openning her mouth makes me ill!!!) (besides, he seems all-knowing), so perhaps he wants to keep a close eye on her. Besides, she must have some magical abilities as a witch. I don't see her having dropped school because then I'd doubt she would make all those crude lies about other people when she's so vulnerable herself (and in a truthful way).

Buttercup
April 16th, 2003, 12:09 am
Rita Skeeter has been mentioned before. And she could fit the bill but I can't imagine her ever being 'sweet' like honey. She is just 'poisonous'. Besides she has to get out of Hermione's jar. I think Hermione would have a major fit if she shows up at school and has Ms. Skeeter as a teacher. I do think Ms. Skeeter will be back, she knows far too much and that scares me.

Katy Kedevra
April 16th, 2003, 12:15 am
She doesn't necissarily have to be sweet like honey. What I'm trying to say is maybe she's TRYING to be sweet but it backfires. If I were Harry, I'd definately be worried to have her as my teacher.

Jessica
April 16th, 2003, 12:40 am
Couple of questions:

1) If Arabella Figg is not the DADA teacher (as I suspect from the spoiler) how are we going to get to know her better? Obviusly she is part of the old crowd but it doesn;t seem to me that Harry would associate that much with the old crowd since he IS only 15.

2) How do Dobby and Winky know each other? Crouch Sr and Malfoy do not strike me as bosom buddies. Yet their house elves seem to have been good friends even before they were both sacked. What is the connection?

Katy Kedevra
April 16th, 2003, 1:59 am
Yah, the part about getting to know Arabella Figg better is the main reason why I still believe she's the DADA teacher.

I never really thought about it, but now that you mention it, jessicacarstens, I do wonder where they know each other from. Maybe those dark days where the House-Elves were slaves of Voldemort...

Earendil
April 16th, 2003, 2:00 am
:??: Good questions.

Figg definitely seems the likeliest choice when you put it that way. If Harry's going to be spending pretty much the whole book at Hogwarts, it seems logical that Figg would have to be there too, and there isn't really a good reason for her to be there other than as the DADA teacher.

As for your second question, well, I guess house-elfs have connections?? Possibly...both the Crouches and Malfoys being "respectable" families, they could live near each other and their servants would get to know each other??

FoolOnTheHill
April 16th, 2003, 2:06 am
In a thread called "Keeper of the Keys", they were talking about how in Book 1 we see that Hagrid is the Keeper of Keys at Hogwarts, but we never hear about it again. They were wondering if there is anything significant in this. Well, what if this has to do with the door Harry dreams about? Maybe Hagrid will have the key to it or something, and that somehow leads to his death? I don't know, it's just an idea. I don't neccesarily believe it but it's an idea.

Jessica
April 16th, 2003, 2:31 am
Originally posted by Earendil (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=268680#post268680))
:??: Good questions.

Figg definitely seems the likeliest choice when you put it that way. If Harry's going to be spending pretty much the whole book at Hogwarts, it seems logical that Figg would have to be there too, and there isn't really a good reason for her to be there other than as the DADA teacher.


I'm still not convinced she's the DADA teacher. I think she might have another role that we don't see coming.

[i]Originally posted by Earendil
As for your second question, well, I guess house-elfs have connections?? Possibly...both the Crouches and Malfoys being "respectable" families, they could live near each other and their servants would get to know each other??


Do you honestly think Malfoy lets his servants go socialize with the neighbors? I just don't see it.

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 2:43 am
I don't think Figg could qualify as "poisoned honey." This sounds like a description of a female embodiment of the worst attributes of the DADA professors he's had so far. She might be beautiful, but she's at least charming. She's talented, but she has Snape's sense of classroom terror. She has it in for Harry for reasons passing his understanding, but he's almost alone in disliking her. Her beauty wins over the guys and her talent makes her an icon for the girls. Uh-oh. That's not good.

MagpieOnaga
April 16th, 2003, 3:15 am
Sorry to go off track, but thanks Jessica, for making that connection for me. :)

dddraco
April 16th, 2003, 3:46 am
I have a theory about a DADA teacher but i need to know something first... Is Mundungus Fletcher a man or woman? I dont recall anyone ever specifying that... because if mundungus is a woman i definately think she will be the new DADA teacher...

ahsweape
April 16th, 2003, 4:34 am
Originally posted by dddraco (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=268794#post268794))
I have a theory about a DADA teacher but i need to know something first... Is Mundungus Fletcher a man or woman? I dont recall anyone ever specifying that... because if mundungus is a woman i definately think she will be the new DADA teacher...



I thought this question was put to rest, but Mundungus is definitely a man. Here's the quote from Goblet of Fire where he is referred to as a man:


"Mundungus Fletcher's put in a claim for a twelve-bedroom tent with en-suite jacuzzi, but i've got HIS number..."

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 4:56 am
Any theories on "poisoned honey"? No I don't think it's "that Skeeter cow" (best characterization of her ever). Dumbledore still controls who gets hired as Professors. No way is Skeeter going to get in as DADA teacher. Plus, what the heck does she know about DADA?

Filius Flitwick
April 16th, 2003, 5:00 am
Can somebody refresh my memory on where the term poisoned honey comes from? Is it in Goblet or something or from an interview?

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 5:02 am
It's in the officially sanctioned Bloombsbury summary. That phrase is used to describe the new DADA prof.

ginnycho
April 16th, 2003, 5:38 am
cant wait for the fifth book...eniways im sure that this is going to be one holla of a book...

by the way, why impotent authorities a t Hogwarts?...does that mean that Voldenmort's going to be in Hogwarts...thats not so good?!... *worried for Harry*....but im sure that Dumbledore is there so all things will go well.

and I am so glad that Ron will be on the Quidditich team...makes him more comfortable with himself because sometimes if you have a friend which is so famous ... u know!!..luckily Ron is such a nice guy...
all in all..im happy that Harry Potter is comiong out soon!!!

yahoo!!!

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 5:52 am
I think the point might be that Dumbledore is aging, he's lost his influence over Fudge (because Fudge is an idiot) so he won't be able to keep as tight a control of the school as he used to. Therefore, the school will be less safe. Notice that already we saw a chink in the armor. In Book 3 Dumbledore said "I'm afraid no Dementor will cross the threshold of this school while I am Headmaster." However, the very next school year, Fudge brought along a Dementor bodyguard who administered "The Kiss" to Barty Crouch Jr., effectively preventing him from giving evidence.

dantares
April 16th, 2003, 5:52 am
Originally posted by jessicacarstens (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=268548#post268548))

2) How do Dobby and Winky know each other? Crouch Sr and Malfoy do not strike me as bosom buddies. Yet their house elves seem to have been good friends even before they were both sacked. What is the connection?


Maybe all house-elves are friends. They have an annual meeting or something. I think Winky will get sacked and will want to kill Harry but kill Dobby instead.

ginnycho
April 16th, 2003, 6:03 am
what about if Dumbledore is really letting the Dark Side to come to Hogwarts? ... esp Voldy...

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 6:18 am
Dumbledore's not taking it lying down, but he's being stripped of his influence and Fudge won't see what's happening until he's on the business end of an Avada Kedavra. Without his full influence, Dumbledore can't keep the Death Eaters at bay.

Ellen
April 16th, 2003, 7:24 am
[quote][i]Originally posted by Jaredd In GoF, Dobby still punishes himself for speaking ill of his former masters. Perhaps in OotP he has finally overcome that hurdle and wreak revenge on Draco........even funnier, if Narcissa is DADA professor her as well........but somehow Harry starts getting the blame for a series of unfortunate events.

A Series of Unfortunate Events?

Dobby is Count Olaf?

jordmundt6
April 16th, 2003, 8:36 am
Sounds far-fetched to me too. I think its Winky gone round the bend in grief and booze who starts a one-woman crusade against Harry.

EvilRaven
April 16th, 2003, 11:12 am
Jk Rowling said that Harry would experience a magical world he had never physically entered before. Maybe I am wrong, but I think this door is some sort of doorway into this new world. Like an otherworld in celtic Mythology. However instead of it being a sparking paradise filled which magical creatures and cauldrons of plenty, blah blah blah. Harry will step foot into a scary domain, maybe even where Voldemort lurks. Perhaps a room which the Dark Lord wants Harry to face... maybe the OOTP exists in it.

EvilRaven
April 16th, 2003, 11:19 am
Originally posted by Earendil (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=268680#post268680))
:??: Good questions.

Figg definitely seems the likeliest choice when you put it that way. If Harry's going to be spending pretty much the whole book at Hogwarts, it seems logical that Figg would have to be there too, and there isn't really a good reason for her to be there other than as the DADA teacher.


I can't see Arabella Figg as being a back stabbing liar. If she is the DADA teacher I would be suprized. But, maybe she is and she might be ruthless... I shouldn't judge on what little the books have told about her. But I still think it's another person.

Katy Kedevra
April 16th, 2003, 1:38 pm
Evil Raven, that's exactly what I was talking about in a previous post, but after a while I began to believe that maybe I miss read information about a magical world. I think it's possible that world could be the setting for a final duel between Voldemort and Harry in the 7th book. Maybe it's an opposite world to the magical world we've already talked about and instead of being filled with happiness and delight, it's filled with fear and desolation. Welcome to the realm of Lord Voldemort...

Filia Tenebrarum
April 16th, 2003, 7:19 pm
Well, about the poisoned honey I'm still sticking to my theory at the beginning of this thread: the Dada teacher will be one appointed by the ministry to quell the rumours of Voldemort's return in Hogwarts, and to keep an eye on Harry and Dumbledore. I think it'll be someone we haven't met yet.
I have several things supporting this:
1)What is more like poisoned honey than a comfortable lie (that Voldemort isn't really back)?
2)If Dumbledore stays on as Headmaster then he's not going to manage it without making some concessions to Fudge. Fudge's statement in "the Parting of the Ways" -- "I will be in touch ...to discuss the running of this school" -- sounded ominous. If DD lets F appoint the new dada teacher that may convince Fudge not to sack him.
3)This teacher would provide a countering force to DD, keeping alive the rumours that Harry is deranged and possibly had more to do with Cedric's death than Voldemort. It would take a very charismatic person to do this, as DD is a very charismatic person himself. A woman with a honey-like personality would be ideal for the job.
4)DD's inability to check whatever lies the new teacher might be spreading would be an example of the impotence of the Hogwarts authorities.

Buttercup
April 16th, 2003, 7:30 pm
OOOOO FT you are too good. I like your reasoning. This would go with my far fetched theory that Narcissa goes to work at the school. Plus she is blonde and has a flower name (tying in the honey thing).

Jessica
April 16th, 2003, 7:46 pm
Okay on the "unreliabilty of authorities at Hogwarts" bit . . . it sounds to me like Dumbledore is going to get sacked again.

If this is the case then I can see him giving Harry the "what I should have told you five years ago" but right before he leaves Hogwarts.

Fduge may be appointing not only the new DADA teacher but the new headmaster as well.

Maybe this is where Arabella Figg comes in?

supernatural
April 16th, 2003, 8:31 pm
ok one thing thats bothering me is why everyone expects the people called "the old crowd" to come in as teachers??? i dont think they will, leaving the way open for mrs malfoy to be the dada prof- i cant see fleur having the ability to be in this position.
the reason she gets the position is because dumbledore is sacked (ala chat with harry as mentioned) and lucious paves the way for her in his own special way. (you know.. threats and bully boy tactics.)

ron as keeper- not much to say about that except i hope he does get some limelight which doesn't go to his head- the boy deserves some recognition but not become a **** because of it.

the door on a silent corridor- hmm intreguing. door to another magical world- even better, have heard suggestions that this door is to the potters ancestral home, therefore holding lots of answers for harry, which i like, and possibly a house elf...

disgruntled house elf... the potters house elf- disgruntled- hello V killed potters and they took harry away, we all know how protective house elves can get. ok, so this is a bit weak, good job i'm not the one writing the series then really isn't it. i just lie the idea... so many possibilities...
:coolblue:

GrangerGal
April 16th, 2003, 8:39 pm
I think it is quite possible that Dumbledore will get sacked. That would tie in with the card and the unreliabilty of authorities at Hogwarts piece. We have seen that Fudge doesn't want to believe DD and Lucius Malfoy doesn't want DD there. In fact all these two have to do is talk with one another and they will remove DD. The other thing that hints towards this scenario is that everyone always says "You are safe as long as Dumbledore is there" or "No one will do anything to Hogwarts as long as Dumbledore is there." If Dumbledore is removed than anything can happen!

FawkesBox
April 16th, 2003, 10:14 pm
It has been brought up that the DADA teachers are never mentioned in earlier books but always in the beginning of the book they are in. Have we seen anything from Cedric Diggory's mother? I remember his father being mentioned, perhaps JKR will do more with the Diggories

Kendra
April 16th, 2003, 10:31 pm
Originally posted by GrangerGal (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=269844#post269844))
I think it is quite possible that Dumbledore will get sacked. That would tie in with the card and the unreliabilty of authorities at Hogwarts piece. We have seen that Fudge doesn't want to believe DD and Lucius Malfoy doesn't want DD there. In fact all these two have to do is talk with one another and they will remove DD. The other thing that hints towards this scenario is that everyone always says "You are safe as long as Dumbledore is there" or "No one will do anything to Hogwarts as long as Dumbledore is there." If Dumbledore is removed than anything can happen!


I see what you mean, and it fits nicely, but we have already seen this storyline on a smaller scale in book 2, and I can't see her using it again! There is going to be someone sacked, and there is going to be trouble with Dumbledore and Fudge, it's obvious at the end of book 4! But I think that that theory, explanitory as it is, won't happen. I thought of this at first, but as I think more I get myself more confused!

GryffindorSeeker
April 16th, 2003, 11:22 pm
Ellen, I have a feeling that Dobby wouldn't be a Count Olaf. From what we know, that part just doesn't fit him!
For the venemous house-elf, it's either Winky or an elf annoyed with Hermione!

GrangerGal
April 16th, 2003, 11:42 pm
I understand what you mean helhorns but I feel like we are being set up for Dumbledore's removal whether it is him leaving, being fired, or dying. They say "Everything is ok with DD here." almost TOO much! It is like one of those scary movie rules "We will be safe in here as long as there is light or food or heat" And suddenly the light or food or heat disappears and all (you know what) breaks loose! I think Dumbledore is being set up to go... I think he will be fired but maybe he will be gone in other ways...

Jessica
April 16th, 2003, 11:51 pm
GrangerGal,

I agree completely. Between the reference to everything being okay without Dumbledore and the spoiler quote, I think SOMETHING is going to happen to Dumbledore.

Buttercup
April 16th, 2003, 11:52 pm
Harry's DD's safety net was sort of removed in book 4 and Harry did OK. DD really didn't do ANYTHING to help Harry in book 4. Maybe this is foreshadowing that Harry will not able to rely on DD in future books. If DD does die he might come back as a ghost to help Harry.

zoeydsngwrtr
April 17th, 2003, 12:08 am
I just don't see DD leaving, but that is because he is so dear to me, he is one of my favorite wizards; however, I do agree that there is a great degree of possibility that DD will not be able to be there for Harry in the future. DD is one of Voldemorts greatest enemys (outside of Harry) and will be a target.

dracofan
April 17th, 2003, 12:11 am
What if the door leads Harry into another magical world that he has to pass through. Kind of like a test. Maybe he has special powers we haven't read about yet and this is where he more or less becomes of age.

This is supposed to be a darker and more mature book.

Yeah, I see Dumbledore being sacked. I think Fudge and lucious Malfoy are working together.

I still trying to decide if the unbearable sacrifice means death or not.

If not, then I think Harry will be the sacrifice, perhaps leaving the school for the good of the students.

If it is death then perhaps the following could die; Mcgonnagal, Neville, Dobby, A Dursley.

Jessica
April 17th, 2003, 12:33 am
Yeah I think it means death. . . (sob)

There is obviuosly a whole thread on who will die already so we proabably shouldn't get into it here.

tutu_fairy
April 17th, 2003, 12:34 am
I don't know if someone else hit on this point in previous posts, but Malfoy was sacked as a school governor at the end of book 2. He should have no role in the running of the school.

I didn't hear the part about the dementors coming back stronger than ever, but I would imagine that they would come without anybody's permission. I just hope that they kiss Fudge.

Freezair
April 17th, 2003, 1:18 am
Let me just say that I, for one, think everyone's overanalyzing the "poisoned honey" thing. Am I the only one who takes it at face value as it just being a teacher who has both nice and bad things to them? If this blurb was written by JK herself, I'd be more suspicious, but as it's just written by a blurb writer I kinda roll my eyes about it. The rest of the stuff though...

Disgruntled House-Elf: I think it's gonna be a new elf. Dobby's just way too happy as of late, and if the incident with the butterbeer in Book 4 is any indication, Winky might be turning into some sorth of elfin alchoholic. So she might be too drunk to be on top of things.

Ron as Keeper: I definately agree with some other people that the worries will stir from Harry being worried for Ron's safety. I think Ron will get a big injury in the first Quidditch match and be out of the running for a while.

Single Door & Corridor: When anyone else heard the phrase "Corridor," did their minds fly to the off-limits Third Floor corridor from SS? No one ever told us what happened to Fluffy.

Katy Kedevra
April 17th, 2003, 4:15 am
...And this door is somehow more terrifying than every other nightmare combined.

When I think about the most frightful things introduced to us in the books, I think about the dementors and I can't help feeling that they might be involved with this door. Perhaps this door is located in Azkaban, but I think maybe this has to do with the 'other magical world'. Maybe that is a realm where evil lives (I've mentionned this in a previous post), and maybe it's also the realm where the dementors came from.

Otherwise, I'd say the door is a metaphor for Harry being afraid to 'open the door' to some dark powers he has subconciously(sp?).

SnowyOwl
April 17th, 2003, 4:36 am
Nope, can't see Dumbledore being sacked, but I can see his hands being tied so that he is ineffective. I see Arthur being sacked through Lucius' clout with Fudge. It seems obvious that Lucius is "working" Fudge.

I also cannot see Harry leaving the school for the good of the students. The books are, after all, titled Year 1 [at Hogwarts], Year 2, etc.

The horrible sacrifice has got to be death.

jordmundt6
April 17th, 2003, 4:36 am
I know it was written by a blurb writer, but I think they lifted that description from JK. As for the disgruntled house elf--Hmm. I think Winky was scared straight by what she saw happen to "Master's son." And I think she probably blames Harry for the death of her beloved Crouches. I can see it being her.

On the door being the door to "dark power," yeah that's a good idea.

Ron getting injured--Oh, I thought it was just Ron having a gigundus ego (he seems to have that problem when he gets some spotlight) and being an awful Keeper but refusing to listen. But yeah, between the two alternatives I'll take a Ron injury any day. Partially because I can't think of any wound that Madam Pomfrey can't heal with a little time.

Edit: And Tutu, much as I hate Fudge (the king of fools), I wouldn't wish the Dementors' Kiss on anyone but Voldemort.

By the way, why did the Dementor silence Crouch? Had Voldemort already gotten in touch with them and they're helping him cover up his return?

Second edit: Yeah Malfoy is sure "working" Fudge, but Fudge won't need any prompting from old Lucius to try to tie Dumbledore's hands after "The Parting of the Ways." Idiot

hedwig7
April 17th, 2003, 5:56 am
Freezair "When anyone else heard the phrase "Corridor," did their minds fly to the off-limits Third Floor corridor from SS? No one ever told us what happened to Fluffy"

Yes my mind flew to that straight away too! Also from what someone else said on this thread about the mirror on the American front cover it all fits- so somehow there is either another room on the third floor corridoor, or the blue candles signify it is somewhere in the basement where Harry fought Voldemort and got the stone at the end of book 1... the mirror- maybe it has more than the one power that Harry as the possible heir of Gryffindor can use......
Also thats also where Godric's Hollow could be because JK said there was one significant room where Harry has been in but doesn't know of its significance yet......

smartypants
April 17th, 2003, 10:39 am
Originally posted by Jaredd (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=267838#post267838))
Neville: Something's up with that kid. He shows all the symptoms of being the victim of an extremely strong memory charm. I wonder what he'll be like once it's lifted?


He does? In what way? He is shy, clumsy, forgetful and has had his relations trying to scare him into doing magic most of his life.

The forgetful part we know can be a side effect of a huge memory charm, because bertha Jorking became forgetful after she had one. But that's it. Is that "all the symptoms"?

I'm not saying it aint so, I just think it's a bit rash conclusion... :whistle:

Rounded Buddha
April 17th, 2003, 11:23 am
Maybe the new DADA teacher is Mrs Figg, |JK said we'd find out all about her in Book 5

Rounded Buddha
April 17th, 2003, 11:47 am
It is very likely that Dumbledore is going to tell Harry why Voldemort wanted to kill him because when Harry asked him in Book One, he said he'd tell him when he's older and now he's probably regretting it so he tells him now or Dumbledore has decided he's old enough

Rounded Buddha

Why can OOTP be out NOW? :censored:

Auri DeMeer
April 17th, 2003, 2:14 pm
Originally posted by Katy Kedevra (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=270760#post270760))
Otherwise, I'd say the door is a metaphor for Harry being afraid to 'open the door' to some dark powers he has subconciously(sp?).

That would agree with something I read about the meaning of doors in dreams: Ready to enter something / something to keep private. He might begin to be aware of other dark powers.

Disgruntled house elf: Winky; she may blame Harry for having destroyed her family.

Poisoned honey DADA teacher: Arabella Figg. I'd say she's a beautiful witch a bit bad-tempered but not "evil". Otherwise the quote would be "sweet poison" or so.

Ron Quidditch player: it may be a worry if Ron and Harry have a quarrel at some point in time and still have to play in the team together.

Sacrificed friend: it'll be Hagrid most likely.

Sacked person: I'd say Arthur Weasley from the MoM. And it'll be Percy the one who causes this event.

My two knuts, anyway...

Jaredd
April 17th, 2003, 2:33 pm
Smartypants,

The reason I said I thought Neville was under a memory charm wasn't just because he was forgetful (but isn't that the primary symptom?) but that JKR doesn't do things like that for no apparent reason. Think about it. Here we have a student who, from day one, JKR has taken every effort to establish a level of forgetfulness that no ordinary human being could have. According to Snape he can't even remember the simplest of spells (let's not even get started on passwords). Then, halfway through the series, we suddenly have another tertiary character who exhibits a similar legendary forgetfulness and we find out she's that way because of the side effects of a memory charm. Add to that the fact that Neville has NEVER mentioned what happened to his parents to ANYONE AT HOGWARTS in the FOUR YEARS he's been there despite what appear to be relatively close ties to the other Gryffindors. Could it be (surprise!) he doesn't remember? In my opinion JKR, who's not exactly known for red herrings, appears to be clubbing us over the head with a clue. I guess we'll just have to find out..........

And to follow up on jordmundt6's comment on why the dementors administered the kiss to Crouch: I've been suspicious about the loyalty of the dementors ever since the end of PoA when they attempted to administer the kiss to Harry BEFORE going after Sirius, who was supposed to be their primary target.

Things that make you go "Hmmmm"

Rounded Buddha
April 17th, 2003, 4:52 pm
Sorry, where does it say that someone gets sacked, I must have missed it.

Auri DeMeer
April 17th, 2003, 5:29 pm
It was one of the words in the "blue card" auctioned last year.

zoeydsngwrtr
April 17th, 2003, 5:39 pm
I don't see problems with Ron being a keeper. Nor much danger in it, after all, him and Harry have gotten themselves in worse situations than quiditch, and this time, it will be for fun.
I agree, I believe that the door is being used metaphorically, but I do not believe that it refers to Harry's dark powers, I think it refers to the world of the dead, we have heard a lot about how Harry learns lots more about his parents and their Ghosts ect.
Person getting sacked, definatly one of the Weasly's, something to do with Percy, possibly not much of a big deal, though I can see Percy going to the dark side. One of the weasly's is gonna wind up there, you just know it, I think so atleast, but that is my opionion.
DADA teacher, definatly Arabella Figg, think about the not so nice descriptions we've heard of her already.

Rounded Buddha
April 17th, 2003, 6:07 pm
I'm surprised the person who bought the blue card (whoever it was) hasn't released at least one thing from what it said. Maybe there was a secrecy clause he/she had to sign.

DarlingChild
April 17th, 2003, 6:16 pm
I didn't read all the posts here, so please excuse me if someone has already brought this up.

Perhaps the 'single door in the cooridor' will be the new place that Harry visits. I am most convinced on this one. But it could also be more flashbacks of the night his parents were killed.

I am so glad that Ron will be the new Gryffindor Keeper. He really deserves it. The question is: Who will be the new capitain? Ah, there's already a thread on that so I won't go into it.

As for the 'unbearable sacrifice' I am completely convinced that it will be Hagrid. Don't ask why, but it's just a feeling.

I also get from that bit of info that Harry, Ron and Hermione's friendship will grow stronger in this book, letting go of my fear that it will be weakened by 'love conncetions.' :smile:

Oh! Reading this makes me even more impatient! Somehow it seemed easier to wait when I knew hardly anything about this book! But now that there are more things to guess about, and more things being revealed, I feel like I will simply die of anticipation! Ahhh! JKR is trying to give me a brain anurism! That's it, I just know it! ;)

-edit-

Something I wanna respond to:
Originally posted by Jaredd

Add to that the fact that Neville has NEVER mentioned what happened to his parents to ANYONE AT HOGWARTS in the FOUR YEARS he's been there despite what appear to be relatively close ties to the other Gryffindors. Could it be (surprise!) he doesn't remember?

No, he remembers. In book 4 when Moody was teaching about the unforgivable curses, Neville gets upset and meekly volunteered the Cruciatus Curse.

I quote from pages 213-214 of the American Hardback Edition of Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire:

" 'Anyone else know one? Another Illegal curse?'
Hermione's hand flew into the air again and so, to harry's slight surprise, did Neville's. The only class in which Neville usually volunteered information was Herbology, which was easily his best subject. Neville looked surprised at his own daring.
'Yes?' said Moody, his magical eye rolling right over to fix on Neville.
'There's one -- The Cruciatus Curse,' said Neville in a small yet distinct voice.
Moody was looking very intently at Neville, this time with both eyes.
'Your name's Longbottom?' he said, his magical eye swooping down to check the register again.
Neville nodded nervously, but Moody made no further inquiries. "

Why else would he volunteer that information if he didn't remember what happened? Also, Moody mentioned that Neville visited his parents at the insane asylum with his Grandmother over holiday vacations. Why would he go if he didn't even remember? Also, Neville was saddeded after class, and watching what Moody did to the spider with the Cruciatus Curse. :yup:

I think I just disproved your theory :D