Ron and Hermione - Where to from here? v5 [Archive] - Page 6

meesha1971

January 1st, 2007, 3:08 am

Well, however it happens, Harry has to be a witness to it - everything is seen through his point of view (POV). I liked your scenerio, ronplushermione, but I must say that I think Krum is gone from the story physically - he was just there to agitate Ron, and it worked. It also set Hermione up for romance because she now knows what it's like to date.

How does Hermione know what it's like to date? She's only had one date at the ball and that was pretty much a disaster because she argued with Ron. :huh:

And Jo has said that we will see Krum again. He'll have something to do in DH - we just don't know what. It could be to facilitate Ron admitting his feelings - it could also be something to do with the main plot. We'll find out when DH is released. :)

As for who is more mature, I must say that Hermione is. She's more open about her feelings, and she wasn't the one who made out with someone every evening in front of everyone just to prove that they have kissed someone other than their aunt. Yes, she did take revenge on Ron for making her jealous, but I don't think it was as bad as Ron's move with Lavender.

I'm going to have to go with equality here. They both behaved badly over that. However, I would point out that Ron was doing more than proving a point to Ginny. He had given up on being with Hermione and that point. He was wrong - he should have talked to Hermione about what Ginny said - but his actions were about him giving up - not just proving a point. He didn't think Hermione would ever return his feelings so he settled for someone who did like him. Kind of a "I can't have what I want so I'll accept what I can have" attitude.

What we have is one big misunderstanding between them. Hermione doesn't know about the argument with Ginny. From her point of view, Ron decided he didn't want to go out with her and chose to date a "pretty girl" instead. From Ron's point of view, Hermione had lied to him and didn't believe in him - therefore she would never feel the same way as he did.

This is something that remains unresolved at the end of HBP. They did try to put it behind them after Ron was poisoned, but they haven't talked about it. That's something they need to do - although that will probably occur off page with just a mention of it to Harry. But it is something that needs to be resolved. Hermione needs to know why Ron started dating Lavender and Ron needs to know that Hermione didn't lie to him. Then they can move forward and put the whole thing behind them completely.

RWeasleysgirl

January 1st, 2007, 3:09 am

Welcome to the forums, Ron+Hermione!

Lol, well that's a nice scenario, but I don't think it's going to play out just like that. I can't see Ron pulling Viktor aside to confront him for some reason. I think it would be more likely that Ron would talk to Hermione, or possibly even say something to Viktor where they stood, but I'm not sure I can see him having a little heart-to-heart like that.

And I would agree with you, Smartamy, but Jo has told s that Viktor will be back, and one possibility wiis that his purpose will be serving as an aid in getting Ron and Hermione together.

Also, I agree with Meesha on the maturity issue. They were both acting pretty immature, but they were seventeen, in a new and confusing situation, and they were hurt, so I think under the circumstances, immaturity is forgivable. They just need to talk about it.

P.S. Happy New Year soon

ronplushermione

January 1st, 2007, 3:17 am

Lol, well that's a nice scenario, but I don't think it's going to play out just like that. I can't see Ron pulling Viktor aside to confront him for some reason. I think it would be more likely that Ron would talk to Hermione, or possibly even say something to Viktor where they stood, but I'm not sure I can see him having a little heart-to-heart like that.

If Ron is jealous enough you must think he will do anything. While he was jealous he brought himself to snog with a girl (other than Hermione) in public. A jealous Ron is a determined one.

RWeasleysgirl

January 1st, 2007, 3:33 am

If Ron is jealous enough you must think he will do anything. While he was jealous he brought himself to snog with a girl (other than Hermione) in public. A jealous Ron is a determined one.

Exactly my point. If Ron is only jealous, but not jealous enough finally to go and take Hermione for himself (we know she won't protest), then he'll sit on the sidelines and watch angrily as Viktor dances with his girl. This situation is unlikely, as it's already happened once, and Ron's learned since then that he needs to take a chance to get Hermione. If Ron is jealous enough to confront Viktor, he'll do it in front of everyone. Personally, though, I think if Ron shows jealousy, it won't really be like in the past, where we knew he was hurt but he only expressed anger. He would probably confront Hermione, and not so much snap at her like before, but in a more "I'm fed up with waiting, you should be with me!" kind of way.

ronplushermione

January 1st, 2007, 3:37 am

RWeasleysgirl

January 1st, 2007, 3:44 am

Good point, I am glad I joined this forum, the people here are smart and logical.

You think you've seen smart and logical yet? Wait until you get to know everyone else here, there are some REALLY smart people on these forums. Like Meesha, and Deevo, and Potterposse, and Ronjalina, and FaceofBoe, and.... *goes on forever and ever*

But yes, you'll find a lot of great views on these forums. :agree:

I just think that if Ron's that jealous he'll act on impulse, and probably admit that he's the one that should be Hermione's boyfriend.

sparkly

January 1st, 2007, 4:05 am

If Ron is jealous enough you must think he will do anything. While he was jealous he brought himself to snog with a girl (other than Hermione) in public. A jealous Ron is a determined one.

Not only was Ron jealous, he had just emerged from an argument with Hermione where he thought she didn't believe in his Keeping skills and needed Felix to save any goals. In addition, his argument with Ginny revealed his inexperience with girls to his best mate Harry, who at least had kissed Cho. Ron snogged Lavender not only because he learned that Hermione had snogged Viktor and he was jealous, Ron thought he had to catch up to his friends and his sister in experience with the opposite sex, and he had to prove to Hermione that someone (Lavender) believed in him even if he thought she didn't.

JKR brilliantly brought all these elements together to push Ron into snogging Lavender. Jealousy was a factor, but there were several others.

potterposse

January 1st, 2007, 4:09 am

Exactly my point. If Ron is only jealous, but not jealous enough finally to go and take Hermione for himself (we know she won't protest), then he'll sit on the sidelines and watch angrily as Viktor dances with his girl. This situation is unlikely, as it's already happened once, and Ron's learned since then that he needs to take a chance to get Hermione. If Ron is jealous enough to confront Viktor, he'll do it in front of everyone. Personally, though, I think if Ron shows jealousy, it won't really be like in the past, where we knew he was hurt but he only expressed anger. He would probably confront Hermione, and not so much snap at her like before, but in a more "I'm fed up with waiting, you should be with me!" kind of way.

I agree.

Ron and Hermione have the idea now that they belong together, so even if Ron didnt admit it (but i think he'll be first), Hermione wouldnt take Krum....She'll admit the feelings knowing he wants to, but for some reason wont spit it out..she'll save him the trouble.....either way, we know they'll hook up and be happy. Victor is x-out of the (was) "love" triangle. (If this makes sense how I wrote this, lol)

You think you've seen smart and logical yet? Wait until you get to know everyone else here, there are some REALLY smart people on these forums. Like Meesha, and Deevo, and Potterposse, and Ronjalina, and FaceofBoe, and.... *goes on forever and ever*
Awww....thanks!
Add yourself on the list RWeasleysgirl! :)

HAPPY NEW YEARS!!!!:clap:

meesha1971

January 1st, 2007, 5:15 am

Awww shucks, RWeasleysgirl. You're making me blush. :blush:

HAPPY NEW YEARS EVERYONE!!!

maze

January 1st, 2007, 8:54 am

This is my first post. I hope they get together as soon as possible as its driving me crazy....They are perfect for each other.

Harsh_Potter

January 1st, 2007, 9:44 am

maze

January 1st, 2007, 1:11 pm

I would be deeply dissapointed if we don't get the "big romantic moment". After 6 books, i doubt JKR would do that to us. Even though she has mention in the interview that "its Ron and Hermione",i hope she will give them their moments on page. If that doesn't materialise, I just have to rely on fanfic...sob...sob...

Deevo

January 1st, 2007, 1:17 pm

How does Hermione know what it's like to date? She's only had one date at the ball and that was pretty much a disaster because she argued with Ron. :huh:
I always got the impression that their argument began toward the end of the night and that prior to that Hermione at least was having a grand time.

Personally I thought the events leading up to the Yule Ball pretty much followed this sequence:

Hermione had figured from Prisoner of Azkaban that she had feelings for Ron and was hoping he'd invite her to the ball.
Viktor asked her, I don't think she initially accepted hoping that Ron would act.
'A couple of Trolls'. Ron's classic adolescent insensitivity combined with Hermione's own lack of self confidence convinced her that Ron didn't feel the same way about her that she felt about him (ironically an almost diametrically opposite situation that occurred to them in Half Blood Prince). With this in mind she gave up on him and accepted Viktor's invitation.
When she witnessed Ron's reaction to her date, she must have realised that jealousy prompted it (even if he didn't), even Harry 'got the point' after their row.
The next day they declared a truce and so the issue went ignored and unresolved.

And Jo has said that we will see Krum again. He'll have something to do in DH - we just don't know what. It could be to facilitate Ron admitting his feelings - it could also be something to do with the main plot. We'll find out when DH is released. :)
We'll see him, though I don't think he'll have anything more to add to the romance subplot. Still they might wish to contact him to question him discreetly on his dark arts knowledge (as Karkaroff taught them at Durmstrang) or alternatively he may even take up a teaching post (DADA perhaps?) at Hogwarts. They are after all now two teachers down, DADA and Transfiguration.

I'm going to have to go with equality here. They both behaved badly over that. However, I would point out that Ron was doing more than proving a point to Ginny. He had given up on being with Hermione and that point. He was wrong - he should have talked to Hermione about what Ginny said - but his actions were about him giving up - not just proving a point. He didn't think Hermione would ever return his feelings so he settled for someone who did like him. Kind of a "I can't have what I want so I'll accept what I can have" attitude.
That's why it's almost an opposing repetition of the Yule Ball. In each instance one was looking for some recognition beyond friendship from the other, an argument including a third party had incorrectly convinced them that the other wasn't interested so they both went with another third party that had shown interest. The difference being that the first instance was only an overnight 'fling' while the latter was a month’s long relationship.

At the end of it all though it was really two ends of the same, unresolved, argument. The difference now being that they are both mature enough as well as intelligent enough to realise the causes and realise that they can't continue without it being resolved or at least out in the open between them.

What we have is one big misunderstanding between them. Hermione doesn't know about the argument with Ginny. From her point of view, Ron decided he didn't want to go out with her and chose to date a "pretty girl" instead. From Ron's point of view, Hermione had lied to him and didn't believe in him - therefore she would never feel the same way as he did.

This is something that remains unresolved at the end of HBP. They did try to put it behind them after Ron was poisoned, but they haven't talked about it. That's something they need to do - although that will probably occur off page with just a mention of it to Harry. But it is something that needs to be resolved. Hermione needs to know why Ron started dating Lavender and Ron needs to know that Hermione didn't lie to him. Then they can move forward and put the whole thing behind them completely.
:agree: Exactly, there are too many unknown factors, too many unresolved tensions for them to carry with them now.

You think you've seen smart and logical yet? Wait until you get to know everyone else here, there are some REALLY smart people on these forums. Like Meesha, and Deevo, and Potterposse, and Ronjalina, and FaceofBoe, and.... *goes on forever and ever*
Oh not at all, I just make all of this stuff up as I go along ... really. :eyebrows:

But thanks for the compliment, I'm all embarrassed now. :blush:

But yes, you'll find a lot of great views on these forums. :agree:

I just think that if Ron's that jealous he'll act on impulse, and probably admit that he's the one that should be Hermione's boyfriend.
:agree: And he's smart enough to realise that they can't go on without these things being out in the open. It's ironic really that with the single exception of the issue of their mutual feelings toward one another Ron and Hermione are possibly the best communicators, with the possible exception of Fred and George, of all of the students we've seen.

Not only was Ron jealous, he had just emerged from an argument with Hermione where he thought she didn't believe in his Keeping skills and needed Felix to save any goals. In addition, his argument with Ginny revealed his inexperience with girls to his best mate Harry, who at least had kissed Cho. Ron snogged Lavender not only because he learned that Hermione had snogged Viktor and he was jealous, Ron thought he had to catch up to his friends and his sister in experience with the opposite sex, and he had to prove to Hermione that someone (Lavender) believed in him even if he thought she didn't.

JKR brilliantly brought all these elements together to push Ron into snogging Lavender. Jealousy was a factor, but there were several others.
Indeed, almost from the moment they arrived at school Hermione was being unintentionally cool toward Ron, I think in her efforts not to be too obvious. Likewise, almost from the time they arrived at school Lavender had been openly flirting with him. Like I said above I think that Ron honestly didn't think Hermione saw him 'that way' and decided to settle for the girl that did, heavily prompted by Ginny's not to subtle prodding.

This is my first post. I hope they get together as soon as possible as its driving me crazy....They are perfect for each other.
Hi and :welcome: aboard, that also applies belatedly to ronplushermione by the way. :D

Yes I suspect that they'll get together sooner rather than later. Jo may spin things out with some comedic interruptions but I doubt they'll be apart once the wedding has come and gone.

Ok, great posts everyone!

I have been wondering if we'll get a "big romantic" moment about Ron/Hermione in DH or not? Some people think not...since the books are from Harry's POV and there's too many things to show(for JKR). So, I have come across many Good shippers saying that, most probably, we'll get either Ron or Hermione telling Harry that they're finally together or Harry coming across them, snogging.
That really would disappoint me a lot since JKR has set them up from the beginning and developed the pairing so carefully. Especially, in HBP, even though it was Harry's POV...the book still managed to have an equal amount of R/Hr moments with H/G moments. And this makes me hopeful, that we will have a great R/Hr moment when they get together and not just Harry seeing them snogging.

What do you all think?
There will be an 'outing' moment; Jo is unlikely not to write one. Whether it'll be restricted to Harry's vision or be a more public display really remains to be seen but I doubt we'll miss it.

potterposse

January 1st, 2007, 3:44 pm

Ok, great posts everyone!

I have been wondering if we'll get a "big romantic" moment about Ron/Hermione in DH or not? Some people think not...since the books are from Harry's POV and there's too many things to show(for JKR). So, I have come across many Good shippers saying that, most probably, we'll get either Ron or Hermione telling Harry that they're finally together or Harry coming across them, snogging.
That really would disappoint me a lot since JKR has set them up from the beginning and developed the pairing so carefully. Especially, in HBP, even though it was Harry's POV...the book still managed to have an equal amount of R/Hr moments with H/G moments. And this makes me hopeful, that we will have a great R/Hr moment when they get together and not just Harry seeing them snogging.

What do you all think?

I think J.K will leave at least a brief moment of Romance for Ron and Hermione, she lead us to believe that...

believe:huh: lol.

I think we'll get to read about Harry walking in on a kiss between the two. And he then leaves with a smirk of relief on his face.:cool:

I honestly dont care how Jo hooks them up, I will be happy with her decision! :tu:

--*Even if she decided to hook them up in a way like Ron is filfthy from dumpster diving or Hermione screams "I love you!" while bungie jumping, or one of them sings in front of thier window at midnight or something wierd like that:D *

That's why it's almost an opposing repetition of the Yule Ball. In each instance one was looking for some recognition beyond friendship from the other, an argument including a third party had incorrectly convinced them that the other wasn't interested so they both went with another third party that had shown interest. The difference being that the first instance was only an overnight 'fling' while the latter was a month’s long relationship.

At the end of it all though it was really two ends of the same, unresolved, argument. The difference now being that they are both mature enough as well as intelligent enough to realise the causes and realise that they can't continue without it being resolved or at least out in the open between them

Exactly Deevo :agree:

They will be like Frank and Marie on Everybody loves Raymond...They are always arguing, but love each other till death, no matter what odd thing happens during the day...:cool:

Frank is dead....HE was a great characer! :upset:

RWeasleysgirl

January 1st, 2007, 5:11 pm

Welcome all new posters!!!

I know, I cried when I heard that Frank(I can't think of his real name... Peter something?) died!

But anyways, back on topic, I'm confident that we'll get some good R/Hr moments in DH. They've become characters just as beloved as Harry, and really the series has always been about a trio, not just Harry. Ron and Hermione never really seem to remember that there are other people in the world when arguing, so I think it's possible that they'd get just as caught up in a confession and share a very public first kiss or something. Come on, Jo, give us SOMETHING!

lol. I think, (and hope) that through book seven we'll see the same Ron/Hermione as before, but a little bit more couple-ish. They won't be all disgustingly lovey-dovey like Bill and Fleur, but in times when they're not in mortal danger (hopefully they won't be for the entire next book...) I think they might have a chance to enjoy each other's company a little, even if we only see a little cuddling or hand-holding.

ronjalina

January 1st, 2007, 7:16 pm

Thank you RWeasleysgirl. I´m flattered. *blushes worth two Ron Weasleys*. But as potterposse said, put yourself on the list.

Ok, great posts everyone!

I have been wondering if we'll get a "big romantic" moment about Ron/Hermione in DH or not? Some people think not...since the books are from Harry's POV and there's too many things to show(for JKR). So, I have come across many Good shippers saying that, most probably, we'll get either Ron or Hermione telling Harry that they're finally together or Harry coming across them, snogging.
That really would disappoint me a lot since JKR has set them up from the beginning and developed the pairing so carefully. Especially, in HBP, even though it was Harry's POV...the book still managed to have an equal amount of R/Hr moments with H/G moments. And this makes me hopeful, that we will have a great R/Hr moment when they get together and not just Harry seeing them snogging.

What do you all think?I do think JKR will give us a "big romantic" moment. I think every possible "Ron and Hermione getting together" scenario will be romantic, no matter how she writes it. But she will give us the crucial moment so to say. As you said yourself, though the books are from Harry´s pov, we have seen all the big R/Hr moments and a considerate amount of smaller moments as well.

A slight possibility is still that she gives us a short passage from Ron and Hermione´s pov. She has already done that in PS, during the second Quidditch match. I´m sure she can find some plot related reason to do so again. I have a tiny bit of hope for it, not much really, but a bit. :lol:

smartamy15

January 1st, 2007, 9:26 pm

And I would agree with you, Smartamy, but Jo has told s that Viktor will be back, and one possibility wiis that his purpose will be serving as an aid in getting Ron and Hermione together.

Ah, I did not know that Krum was going to return! Then yes, I agree that he will probably aide (unintentionally) in getting Ron and Hermione to sort out their misunderstandings, jealousy, etc. so they can finally realize the truth!

And I would agree with you, Smartamy, but Jo has told s that Viktor will be back, and one possibility wiis that his purpose will be serving as an aid in getting Ron and Hermione together.

Ah, I did not know that Krum was going to return! Then yes, I agree that he will probably aide (unintentionally) in getting Ron and Hermione to sort out their misunderstandings, jealousy, etc. so they can finally realize the truth!

meesha1971

January 1st, 2007, 9:42 pm

I always got the impression that their argument began toward the end of the night and that prior to that Hermione at least was having a grand time.

My point was that one date that started off well and ended badly doesn't really qualify for Hermione knowing what it's like to date. Of the four of them, Hermione is the one who hasn't really had any experience - and that really shines through on page in certain situations. But, overall, I think that's a good thing. Hermione is the girl with all the answers regarding pretty much everything else, but she can't know everything and being inexperienced equalizes the balance somewhat between her and Ron. Kind of lIke the reference to chess in PS/SS - it was the only thing Hermione lost at and became something that Ron and Hermione bonded over apart from the troll incident. Ron - and Harry - thought it was a good thing for her and they were right. One of the lessons that Hermione needs to learn is that she can't be right about everything all the time. Even in HBP we see that she still has a tendency to get very upset/defensive when she's wrong about something. Hermione is generally more mature and somewhat more sensitive than Ron, but Ron is the one with actual dating experience - creating a balance between them.

Personally I thought the events leading up to the Yule Ball pretty much followed this sequence:

Hermione had figured from Prisoner of Azkaban that she had feelings for Ron and was hoping he'd invite her to the ball.
Viktor asked her, I don't think she initially accepted hoping that Ron would act.
'A couple of Trolls'. Ron's classic adolescent insensitivity combined with Hermione's own lack of self confidence convinced her that Ron didn't feel the same way about her that she felt about him (ironically an almost diametrically opposite situation that occurred to them in Half Blood Prince). With this in mind she gave up on him and accepted Viktor's invitation.
When she witnessed Ron's reaction to her date, she must have realised that jealousy prompted it (even if he didn't), even Harry 'got the point' after their row.
The next day they declared a truce and so the issue went ignored and unresolved.

That's close to how I see it as well. I think Hermione had a crush on Ron from the beginning, but I agree that she probably didn't fully realize her feelings until POA. I wouldn't say that she completely gave up on Ron after the "couple of trolls" comment. Ron was only 14 at the time. But she did decide that he wasn't going to ask her to the ball and that's what prompted her to accept Viktor's invitation.

But I definitely agree that Hermione "got the point" when Ron showed jealousy. That gave her hope. The two situations do mirror each other to some extent, but I think Ron's reaction was a bit more extreme because they were older and there was a difference in the trigger. Hermione's trigger in GOF was thinking that Ron would prefer a "pretty girl" over her. Ron's trigger in HBP was a combination of Ginny making fun of his lack of experience, believing that Hermione had lied to him about Krum, and thinking that Hermione didn't have any faith in his abilities. We can also toss in Hermione being somewhat cool towards Ron because she didn't want to be too obvious. So, while they are similar, the situation in HBP was more complex and Ron did completely give up on Hermione ever returning his feelings.

But both did result from the same unresolved issues and, even if that occurs off page, I think they will resolve that at the beginning of DH.

We'll see him, though I don't think he'll have anything more to add to the romance subplot. Still they might wish to contact him to question him discreetly on his dark arts knowledge (as Karkaroff taught them at Durmstrang) or alternatively he may even take up a teaching post (DADA perhaps?) at Hogwarts. They are after all now two teachers down, DADA and Transfiguration.

I go back and forth on that. I do think it's possible that Viktor will serve as a catalyst of some sort, but not to the same extreme as HBP. I think it would be more subtle - like Ron finding out Viktor will be around and that making him determined to "ask her first" this time around. It could also be as simple as Viktor's presence bringing the issues up and serving as a catalyst for Ron and Hermione finally resolving them.

But I don't think that would be his only purpose to the story. Jo put him in Durmstrang and mentioned the school's reputation for teaching the dark arts for a reason. I think he'll help the trio regarding the Horcruxes somehow.

:agree: And he's smart enough to realise that they can't go on without these things being out in the open. It's ironic really that with the single exception of the issue of their mutual feelings toward one another Ron and Hermione are possibly the best communicators, with the possible exception of Fred and George, of all of the students we've seen.

Oh definitely. And the fact that they have gone through all of this before even becoming a couple will make their relationship even stronger. They know and understand each other very well - they just have to realize that. :)

Yes I suspect that they'll get together sooner rather than later. Jo may spin things out with some comedic interruptions but I doubt they'll be apart once the wedding has come and gone.

There will be an 'outing' moment; Jo is unlikely not to write one. Whether it'll be restricted to Harry's vision or be a more public display really remains to be seen but I doubt we'll miss it.

I agree. With all the build up and suspense Jo has put into this relationship, I simply can't imagine her wrapping it all up with an innocuous mention - "Oh, by the way Harry, Hermione and I are together now." They deserve a big romantic moment and Jo had so much fun writing Harry and Ginny's moment, I'm betting she'll do something along those lines for Ron and Hermione as well.

A slight possibility is still that she gives us a short passage from Ron and Hermione´s pov. She has already done that in PS, during the second Quidditch match. I´m sure she can find some plot related reason to do so again. I have a tiny bit of hope for it, not much really, but a bit. :lol:

I would love that. It would be nice to see things from their point of view. And Jo could do that. We discussed that to some extent before and, while it remains a very slight possibility, it is still possible.

I've been thinking of ways that Jo could make that work and the Time interview - where Jo mentioned that she "cues up" the end of HBP at the beginning of DH - gave me another idea there. I think there is a reason that Jo cut HBP off where she did. Something is going to happen before they go to the Dursleys - either at Hogwarts or on the train. In that event, Jo has the opportunity to pick up from Ron and Hermione's point of view. DH could very well start with Dumbledore's funeral and give us Ron and/or Hermione's perceptions of the situation and what was going on with them while Harry was talking to Scrimegeour. Or she could pick up from the end and have someone come get Harry - like McGonagall - giving Ron and Hermione an opportunity to talk before leaving.

the_legilimens

January 1st, 2007, 9:51 pm

I agree. With all the build up and suspense Jo has put into this relationship, I simply can't imagine her wrapping it all up with an innocuous mention - "Oh, by the way Harry, Hermione and I are together now." They deserve a big romantic moment and Jo had so much fun writing Harry and Ginny's moment, I'm betting she'll do something along those lines for Ron and Hermione as well.

I feel the moment would be more private than Ginny/Harry in the common room. Not only has JKR used the kiss infront of anyone, Hermione is shown to be the most private of the trio and a kiss infront of everyone is not something I feel she will be comfortable with. I can see them talking like in the greenhouse-just the three of them and possibly Ginny as well, withHarry being embaressed (but secrety pleased) and Ron and Hermione both being oblivious to the people around them.

meesha1971

January 1st, 2007, 9:55 pm

I feel the moment would be more private than Ginny/Harry in the common room. Not only has JKR used the kiss infront of anyone, Hermione is shown to be the most private of the trio and a kiss infront of everyone is not something I feel she will be comfortable with. I can see them talking like in the greenhouse-just the three of them and possibly Ginny as well, withHarry being embaressed (but secrety pleased) and Ron and Hermione both being oblivious to the people around them.

Oh definitely. We've discussed the possibility of it happening on the train as well - giving Harry the opportunity to witness it. I simply meant that it will be a big romantic moment between them. Jo could drag it out to the wedding and do another big kiss in front of everyone with different circumstances or she could scale it down some and have just a few people - at least Harry - present. If she sticks with Harry's POV, the trick will be setting up a situation for Harry to witness it without intentionally eavesdropping or seeming like a voyeur.

smartamy15

January 1st, 2007, 10:18 pm

I feel the moment would be more private than Ginny/Harry in the common room. Not only has JKR used the kiss infront of anyone, Hermione is shown to be the most private of the trio and a kiss infront of everyone is not something I feel she will be comfortable with. I can see them talking like in the greenhouse-just the three of them and possibly Ginny as well, withHarry being embaressed (but secrety pleased) and Ron and Hermione both being oblivious to the people around them.

That is a very good point - Hermione is the only one who we have not literally seen in the middle of a kiss. Harry runs into her after she escapse from Cormac under the mistletoe. But we don't walk in on her, like we do on Ginny and Dean, and we don't see her kissing in front of everyone like Lavender and Ron, or Ginny and Harry. It's also just implied that Hermione and Krum kissed. We don't know for sure (although they probably did). So I agree, Hermione is much shyer than Ron, Ginny and Harry. Hopefully, she'll get around that when the moment is right.

RWeasleysgirl

January 2nd, 2007, 12:21 am

I feel the moment would be more private than Ginny/Harry in the common room. Not only has JKR used the kiss infront of anyone, Hermione is shown to be the most private of the trio and a kiss infront of everyone is not something I feel she will be comfortable with. I can see them talking like in the greenhouse-just the three of them and possibly Ginny as well, withHarry being embaressed (but secrety pleased) and Ron and Hermione both being oblivious to the people around them.

I agree, I don't think it would be as public as Harry and Ginny's first kiss, but it's still possible it won't be entirely private. We get the story from Harry's point of view, and Harry is someone they have become very comfortable with, I can see them not caring that he's in the room, and possibly some other people as well. As has been said many times, they tend to get caught up in the moment during arguments (the Herbology scene in HBP, for instance) it's very possible they'd be just as passionate about this.

Ok, ok. *by popular demand, RWeasleysGirl has been added to the list of smart people on CoSforums.* :P lol

potterposse

January 2nd, 2007, 3:06 am

That is a very good point - Hermione is the only one who we have not literally seen in the middle of a kiss. Harry runs into her after she escapse from Cormac under the mistletoe. But we don't walk in on her, like we do on Ginny and Dean, and we don't see her kissing in front of everyone like Lavender and Ron, or Ginny and Harry. It's also just implied that Hermione and Krum kissed. We don't know for sure (although they probably did). So I agree, Hermione is much shyer than Ron, Ginny and Harry. Hopefully, she'll get around that when the moment is right.

I agree.(but I dont think Hermione kissed Krum, I think she realized he wasnt a fit after the whole name lesson she gave him...)

I agree, I don't think it would be as public as Harry and Ginny's first kiss, but it's still possible it won't be entirely private. We get the story from Harry's point of view, and Harry is someone they have become very comfortable with, I can see them not caring that he's in the room, and possibly some other people as well. As has been said many times, they tend to get caught up in the moment during arguments (the Herbology scene in HBP, for instance) it's very possible they'd be just as passionate about this.

I want them to have a public kiss, but, I could also see it being in a more private place and someone like harry walks in...but again, I just want them together!
*around train or wedding, I haven't dropped the title for Both-ers..lol*

The Herbology scene Is in the top ten of R/Hr moments on my list.(obviously, its in my sig.) :p

Ok, ok. *by popular demand, RWeasleysGirl has been added to the list of smart people on CoSforums.* :P lol

Yay! :cool:

JimmyPotter

January 2nd, 2007, 3:30 am

Maybe it will be something where Harry (and perhaps Ginny) sees Ron and Hermione start kissing and then walks away to give them privacy.

RWeasleysgirl

January 2nd, 2007, 4:04 am

I don't know, I think Harry will probably be caught in the kind of position where he can't get up and leave, or he's too taken off-guard to get up and leave.

ronjalina

January 2nd, 2007, 6:17 pm

I go back and forth on that. I do think it's possible that Viktor will serve as a catalyst of some sort, but not to the same extreme as HBP. I think it would be more subtle - like Ron finding out Viktor will be around and that making him determined to "ask her first" this time around. It could also be as simple as Viktor's presence bringing the issues up and serving as a catalyst for Ron and Hermione finally resolving them.Oh, I really hope we don´t see another "jealousy over Krum" scenario. That´s old news. It would somehow contradict the situation between Ron and Hermione at the end of HBP. Ron still thinks Hermione and Krum kissed and he seems to have accepted that. I see Krum returning as a good opportunity to show how much Ron has learnt and matured. His reaction to Krum could be completely different than in GoF. That would be another mirror-scene, JKR likes to use. Either, Ron, who still might have doubts whether he has messed up his chance with Hermione due to the Lavender thingy, will think Hermione likes Krum and get´s all sympathetic about it (which gives Hermione the opportunity to say: "I don´t fancy Krum, you prat, I never have") or Ron just behaves perfectly polite towards Krum which would definately impress Hermione. This all under the assumption that they are not yet together when Krum turns up. But I am still for the train ride home. :love:

But I don't think that would be his only purpose to the story. Jo put him in Durmstrang and mentioned the school's reputation for teaching the dark arts for a reason. I think he'll help the trio regarding the Horcruxes somehow.Yes, I think/hope that is Krum´s (main) purpose. JKR will not have a character return just for the romantic sub-plot. Your idea of Krum being a catalyst as well is not out of the realm of possibility of course. Whatever makes Ron and Hermione finally getting together is fine by me. :D

I would love that. It would be nice to see things from their point of view. And Jo could do that. We discussed that to some extent before and, while it remains a very slight possibility, it is still possible.:agree: *cross fingers*

I've been thinking of ways that Jo could make that work and the Time interview - where Jo mentioned that she "cues up" the end of HBP at the beginning of DH - gave me another idea there. I think there is a reason that Jo cut HBP off where she did. Something is going to happen before they go to the Dursleys - either at Hogwarts or on the train. In that event, Jo has the opportunity to pick up from Ron and Hermione's point of view. DH could very well start with Dumbledore's funeral and give us Ron and/or Hermione's perceptions of the situation and what was going on with them while Harry was talking to Scrimegeour. Or she could pick up from the end and have someone come get Harry - like McGonagall - giving Ron and Hermione an opportunity to talk before leaving.Oh, I would really love that. I know we have talked about that scenario before. I always thought, DH will begin the latest during the train ride home, but I am more and more convinced that it will start directly after Dumbledore´s funeral.

I feel the moment would be more private than Ginny/Harry in the common room. Not only has JKR used the kiss infront of anyone, Hermione is shown to be the most private of the trio and a kiss infront of everyone is not something I feel she will be comfortable with. I can see them talking like in the greenhouse-just the three of them and possibly Ginny as well, withHarry being embaressed (but secrety pleased) and Ron and Hermione both being oblivious to the people around them.I have always thought she will not reiterate the grand public kiss she used for Harry and Ginny. Although it would fit for Ron and Hermione, since they do tend to get caught up in themselves. But I think it will be different. Having a small audience, just Harry and Ginny, maybe even Luna and Neville will be possible. Ah, I see, the train ride home fits better and better. :D

RWeasleysgirl

January 2nd, 2007, 6:53 pm

:agree: And Ginny would be shocked, as it seems she's completely oblivious to Ron and Hermione's feelings... Although she probably won't care much, until the opportunity to tell her twin brothers presents itself. Then she'll enjoy that. I'm not sure I can see her worrying about them teasing him, like she was when she caught Percy in the same situation...

meesha1971

January 2nd, 2007, 8:56 pm

Oh, I really hope we don´t see another "jealousy over Krum" scenario. That´s old news. It would somehow contradict the situation between Ron and Hermione at the end of HBP. Ron still thinks Hermione and Krum kissed and he seems to have accepted that. I see Krum returning as a good opportunity to show how much Ron has learnt and matured. His reaction to Krum could be completely different than in GoF. That would be another mirror-scene, JKR likes to use. Either, Ron, who still might have doubts whether he has messed up his chance with Hermione due to the Lavender thingy, will think Hermione likes Krum and get´s all sympathetic about it (which gives Hermione the opportunity to say: "I don´t fancy Krum, you prat, I never have") or Ron just behaves perfectly polite towards Krum which would definately impress Hermione. This all under the assumption that they are not yet together when Krum turns up. But I am still for the train ride home. :love:

I don't think it would be the same reaction now. I think Ron probably does feel as though he ruined his chances with Hermione because of the whole Lavender thing. In that event, I can see him taking the "she deserves somebody like Krum/I just want her to be happy" stance and Hermione correcting him of that notion. Or I can see him not giving much outward reaction towards Krum, but Krum's presence - or impending presence - helping him find the courage to make a move. Not so much a jealous rage, but remembering and taking Hermione's advice to "ask her first". ;)

One possibility out of many.

:agree: *cross fingers*

Oh, I would really love that. I know we have talked about that scenario before. I always thought, DH will begin the latest during the train ride home, but I am more and more convinced that it will start directly after Dumbledore´s funeral.

That's what I got from that Time interview. If she "cues up" the last scene from HBP, then DH will most likely start where HBP left off. If she starts out from another POV, she could even backtrack a bit.

I have always thought she will not reiterate the grand public kiss she used for Harry and Ginny. Although it would fit for Ron and Hermione, since they do tend to get caught up in themselves. But I think it will be different. Having a small audience, just Harry and Ginny, maybe even Luna and Neville will be possible. Ah, I see, the train ride home fits better and better. :D

That's true, but as you said, Ron and Hermione do tend to get caught up in the moment and forget they have an audience. Even if it did happen at the wedding in front of everyone, I don't think it would be exactly the same as Harry and Ginny. For one thing, it would be in front of the Weasley clan - not just classmates. For another, Ron and Hermione aren't just going to kiss out of the blue - something would happen to lead up to that. Similar scenario, but different because of the people involved.

However, I am leaning more towards the train ride home simply because it would be difficult for Jo to drag it out for another couple of months. At the very least, something will happen on the train to set things in motion I think. :)

:agree: And Ginny would be shocked, as it seems she's completely oblivious to Ron and Hermione's feelings... Although she probably won't care much, until the opportunity to tell her twin brothers presents itself. Then she'll enjoy that. I'm not sure I can see her worrying about them teasing him, like she was when she caught Percy in the same situation...

That's true. Ginny enjoys teasing Ron almost as much as the twins do. But she will definitely be gobsmacked when it happens. :agree:

potterposse

January 2nd, 2007, 10:18 pm

Well, I am still weary on the whole "Ginny knows/doesn't know fact"...I'll just wait to seee her reaction in Deathly Hallows.

RWeasleysgirl

January 2nd, 2007, 10:32 pm

I don't think she knows simply because of the argument between her and Ron. I think that would have gone so much differently if she knew.

meesha1971

January 2nd, 2007, 10:56 pm

I don't think she knows simply because of the argument between her and Ron. I think that would have gone so much differently if she knew.

Definitely. Not to mention her whole attitude during the three months that Ron and Hermione were not speaking. She came across as pretty clueless regarding Ron and Hermione.

Deevo

January 3rd, 2007, 1:12 pm

Definitely. Not to mention her whole attitude during the three months that Ron and Hermione were not speaking. She came across as pretty clueless regarding Ron and Hermione.
Before Half Blood Prince I would have disagreed, I liked the notion that Hermione and Ginny were attached in a 'best girl-friend' kind of way. On reading through Half Blood Prince though and seeing in it that Ginny has on the whole her own seperate peer group to the trio is seems more likely that Hermione would in some ways have a slightly more parental or older sibling like relationship with Ginny, similar to that she has with Harry though without the same close contact. Not that I'm saying she's at the same condecending level as Fleur is, just she looks at her as a junior. Mind you I think that has begun to change toward the end of Half Blood Prince and the two of them are beginning to get closer to a more 'best girl-friend' type relationship.

Still I'm hoping we get to see Ginny's reaction when she finds out that Ron and Hermione have a mutual interest in each other, it will be bloody priceless.

meesha1971

January 3rd, 2007, 3:10 pm

Before Half Blood Prince I would have disagreed, I liked the notion that Hermione and Ginny were attached in a 'best girl-friend' kind of way. On reading through Half Blood Prince though and seeing in it that Ginny has on the whole her own seperate peer group to the trio is seems more likely that Hermione would in some ways have a slightly more parental or older sibling like relationship with Ginny, similar to that she has with Harry though without the same close contact. Not that I'm saying she's at the same condecending level as Fleur is, just she looks at her as a junior. Mind you I think that has begun to change toward the end of Half Blood Prince and the two of them are beginning to get closer to a more 'best girl-friend' type relationship.

Still I'm hoping we get to see Ginny's reaction when she finds out that Ron and Hermione have a mutual interest in each other, it will be bloody priceless.

I never saw it, to be honest. I always felt that Hermione saw Ginny as Ron's little sister as opposed to one of her peers. It's not the same condescending level as Fleur, but Hermione is somewhat patronizing towards Ginny at times. I think that has the potential to change over time, but I'm not so sure they would ever be best friends. Not to the same extent that Hermione is best friends with Ron and Harry anyway.

But I agree about Ginny's reaction when she finds out about Ron and Hermione. It will be priceless and I really hope Jo shows that on page.

DarkSquirrel

January 3rd, 2007, 4:39 pm

But I agree about Ginny's reaction when she finds out about Ron and Hermione. It will be priceless and I really hope Jo shows that on page.

Well HBP changed my perception on their friendship a bit, but I never really thought they were that close to begin with.
But that part intrigued me a bit. As you say Ginny's actions show us that apparently she didn't know about Ron and Hermione's mutual feelings, but that is really hard to believe. Even if for some reason Hermione never told her ( which is in character for Hermione), or she didn't notice the previous years (doubtful), they spend all the summer together at the Burrow in HBP, that's a lot of time with only themselves to talk and interact with. Even if Ron and Hermione aren't rally open about their feelings and are careful not to show anything, you have to notice something. If it didn't surprise (well, not much) Harry when Hermione asked Ron, someone who is a lot less clueless about those things had to have noticed.
So I think that either Ginny is more vicious and cares less about Hermione than I initially thought or I'm missing something here. It wouldn't be the first time.

Harsh_Potter

January 3rd, 2007, 6:15 pm

RWeasleysgirl

January 3rd, 2007, 6:34 pm

I don't think Ginny really cared enough about her brother's love life to notice. I doubt she pays much attention to the way he acts towards girls in general, and she really doesn't spend much time with him besides in the summer. As for his saying her name in his sleep that time, she could have dismissed that as him dreaming about his friends or something. But I definitely think that, whatever the reason she hasn't noticed, when she finds out it will feel kind of like... *slaps forehead* Duh!

ronjalina

January 3rd, 2007, 7:54 pm

I don't think it would be the same reaction now. I think Ron probably does feel as though he ruined his chances with Hermione because of the whole Lavender thing. In that event, I can see him taking the "she deserves somebody like Krum/I just want her to be happy" stance and Hermione correcting him of that notion. Or I can see him not giving much outward reaction towards Krum, but Krum's presence - or impending presence - helping him find the courage to make a move. Not so much a jealous rage, but remembering and taking Hermione's advice to "ask her first". ;)

One possibility out of many.Exactly, we won´t have Ron being jealous of Krum again. If he turns up for the wedding (which I still kind of doubt), chances are that Ron learns of Krum´s appearance prior to that. That would give him the chance to invite Hermione "before anyone else does and not as a last resort". If Krum´s appearance is somewhat of a surprise, he would be kind of devastated but he would act polite. We would probably, through Harry, see little signs that Ron feels uneasy about it, but he would not let it out on someone.

That's true, but as you said, Ron and Hermione do tend to get caught up in the moment and forget they have an audience. Even if it did happen at the wedding in front of everyone, I don't think it would be exactly the same as Harry and Ginny. For one thing, it would be in front of the Weasley clan - not just classmates. For another, Ron and Hermione aren't just going to kiss out of the blue - something would happen to lead up to that. Similar scenario, but different because of the people involved.

However, I am leaning more towards the train ride home simply because it would be difficult for Jo to drag it out for another couple of months. At the very least, something will happen on the train to set things in motion I think. :)Yeah, still all for the train. A Dursley scenario could be very interesting as well. If JKR drags it out until the wedding, we will see most probably a public outing of some kind. Whatever it takes, I will be happy. :love:

Before Half Blood Prince I would have disagreed, I liked the notion that Hermione and Ginny were attached in a 'best girl-friend' kind of way. On reading through Half Blood Prince though and seeing in it that Ginny has on the whole her own seperate peer group to the trio is seems more likely that Hermione would in some ways have a slightly more parental or older sibling like relationship with Ginny, similar to that she has with Harry though without the same close contact. Not that I'm saying she's at the same condecending level as Fleur is, just she looks at her as a junior. Mind you I think that has begun to change toward the end of Half Blood Prince and the two of them are beginning to get closer to a more 'best girl-friend' type relationship.Yep, I never thought they were friends, but for the rest of what you said, I agree. It would make sense for Hermione and Ginny to have a elder sister/younger sister relationship, since Ginny is the younger sister of one of Hermione´s best friends.

Still I'm hoping we get to see Ginny's reaction when she finds out that Ron and Hermione have a mutual interest in each other, it will be bloody priceless.Not to forget the twins and Molly. And if it happens publicly at the wedding, I want to see Hagrid dabbing his eyes in a tablecloth (assumed he is invited).

Well HBP changed my perception on their friendship a bit, but I never really thought they were that close to begin with.
But that part intrigued me a bit. As you say Ginny's actions show us that apparently she didn't know about Ron and Hermione's mutual feelings, but that is really hard to believe. Even if for some reason Hermione never told her ( which is in character for Hermione), or she didn't notice the previous years (doubtful), they spend all the summer together at the Burrow in HBP, that's a lot of time with only themselves to talk and interact with. Even if Ron and Hermione aren't rally open about their feelings and are careful not to show anything, you have to notice something. If it didn't surprise (well, not much) Harry when Hermione asked Ron, someone who is a lot less clueless about those things had to have noticed.
So I think that either Ginny is more vicious and cares less about Hermione than I initially thought or I'm missing something here. It wouldn't be the first time.Hermione is very reclusive generally, and she puts exceptianally much effort in not letting on that she has feelings for Ron. That goes so far that she is even dismissive and cool towards him.
Ron was only kind of open with his feelings for Hermione to Harry. He never lets anything out when others (especially the twins :p ) are present. Although, I do think one can notice their mutual attraction by observation, but I can imagine for Ginny it is a "who would fancy my brother Ron" thing. And Hermione is Ron´s best friend, therefore it is natural that they like each other anyway. The only one who I think could have noticed something by observation is Molly. Mothers do have a special sense for that. :D

Ok now I'm more convinced that Ginny didn't have a single clue about Ron/Hermione in HBP.
But what do you think was she thinking during that time when Ron was poisoned and they were all huddled around him and he blurted out "Er-my-nee". Fred and George were also there and granted, they were all pretty shocked as hell at that time, but it would be just like the twins to store it up for future reference(and torment..hee hee)

What would Ginny have thought of all that? She's got to have got some clue, don't you think??? Also, gossip spreads faster amongst the girls and the Lavender-Ron-Hermione..."issue" must have been generally known too. Plus their very public break-up. There must have been some rumours circulating about Ron and Hermione at that time as well. Ginny's got to get some clues...she's not thick.:D

I don't think she'll be that gob-smacked!:DWe don´t even know who heard Ron muttering "Er-my-nee". Harry heard it, that much we know. The others, including Hermione, might only have heard that Ron mumbled something in his sleep. Although, I do think Hermione heard it as well, or did she not?

And I really doubt Ron and Hermione had been school gossip. Hermione didn´t throw a temper-tantrum in public (apart from the canaries, and that was only in Harry´s presence) because of Ron and Lavender. She just left the room when the two turned up, but that was not really something exceptional. Hermione and Ron had fallouts before, and Hermione often retreats into privacy to learn.
Lavender was suspicious, during the time she dated Ron she noticed there was something more than friendship going on between Ron and Hermione . But she would not have gone public with that. Other than to Parvati she would not have talked to someone else about it. Therefore, I think their school mates are quite oblivious to the fact that Ron and Hermione have feelings for each other.

RWeasleysgirl

January 3rd, 2007, 9:36 pm

Deevo

January 3rd, 2007, 9:38 pm

I never saw it, to be honest. I always felt that Hermione saw Ginny as Ron's little sister as opposed to one of her peers. It's not the same condescending level as Fleur, but Hermione is somewhat patronizing towards Ginny at times.
:agree: You're right, it probably wasn't anything beyond that but then prior to Order of the Phoenix she (Ginny) was, on the whole, basically excluded from the trio's lives.

I think that has the potential to change over time, but I'm not so sure they would ever be best friends. Not to the same extent that Hermione is best friends with Ron and Harry anyway.
I got the feeling that they were heading toward a 'two couples' group toward the end of Half Blood Prince, their casual hanging out together in the common room when they had the tatoo discussion got me thinking that. Where that leads will depend on her level of involvement with the trio's activities in Deathly Hallows.

But I agree about Ginny's reaction when she finds out about Ron and Hermione. It will be priceless and I really hope Jo shows that on page.
Ginny seems for the most part to be a pretty sensitive and perceptive character toward others but I suspect she has a more than a little bit of a blind spot (like any sibling) when it comes to seeing her brothers involved in romantic situations.

I don't think Ginny really cared enough about her brother's love life to notice. I doubt she pays much attention to the way he acts towards girls in general, and she really doesn't spend much time with him besides in the summer.
:agree: Agreed, I also think she has a huge blind spot about seeing any of her brothers in that way.

As for his saying her name in his sleep that time, she could have dismissed that as him dreaming about his friends or something. But I definitely think that, whatever the reason she hasn't noticed, when she finds out it will feel kind of like... *slaps forehead* Duh!
I'll have to re read the scene to see if it specifically mentions who was where in that setting but it may well have been possible that only Hermione and Harry were close enough to actually make out what he said.

Exactly, we won´t have Ron being jealous of Krum again. If he turns up for the wedding (which I still kind of doubt), chances are that Ron learns of Krum´s appearance prior to that. That would give him the chance to invite Hermione "before anyone else does and not as a last resort". If Krum´s appearance is somewhat of a surprise, he would be kind of devastated but he would act polite. We would probably, through Harry, see little signs that Ron feels uneasy about it, but he would not let it out on someone.
Like I said earlier I think they're past the stage where we'll see any huge displays from Ron prompted by Viktor, if anything we may see his prescence causing an interruption or two but I think Viktor's role in Deathly Hallows will be more related to the main story.

Yeah, still all for the train. A Dursley scenario could be very interesting as well. If JKR drags it out until the wedding, we will see most probably a public outing of some kind. Whatever it takes, I will be happy. :love:
Frankly I'd just like to see them out in the open, or at least confirmed as such to the readers. Whatever way Jo writes it the scene will be worth reading.

Yep, I never thought they were friends, but for the rest of what you said, I agree. It would make sense for Hermione and Ginny to have a elder sister/younger sister relationship, since Ginny is the younger sister of one of Hermione´s best friends.
Hermione is a pretty isolated character in general, beyond Harry and Ron we don't really see too much of her having any real friendly relationships with too many other people. Still I would have thought that she might have sought out a closer relationship with Ginny as much for having someone to share a girl's perspective on things as anything else. She certainly seems to be pretty distant (even prior to the Lav Lav debacle) with her dorm mates.

Not to forget the twins and Molly. And if it happens publicly at the wedding, I want to see Hagrid dabbing his eyes in a tablecloth (assumed he is invited).
Definately, could be fun.

Hermione is very reclusive generally, and she puts exceptianally much effort in not letting on that she has feelings for Ron. That goes so far that she is even dismissive and cool towards him.
Ron was only kind of open with his feelings for Hermione to Harry. He never lets anything out when others (especially the twins :p ) are present.
I think Ron was relatively open in Half Blood Prince, certainly moreso than in previous books. This time around I think it was Hermione that was unintentionally cool in trying to be not too obvious. Unfortunately she was so much so that Ron felt that she wasn't interested.

Although, I do think one can notice their mutual attraction by observation, but I can imagine for Ginny it is a "who would fancy my brother Ron" thing. And Hermione is Ron´s best friend, therefore it is natural that they like each other anyway. The only one who I think could have noticed something by observation is Molly. Mothers do have a special sense for that. :D
:agree: Absolutely, Ginny seems to have a definate blind spot in that area with her brothers. I don't know about Molly though in Goblet of Fire that may have been the cause of her coolness toward Hermione.

We don´t even know who heard Ron muttering "Er-my-nee". Harry heard it, that much we know. The others, including Hermione, might only have heard that Ron mumbled something in his sleep. Although, I do think Hermione heard it as well, or did she not?

And I really doubt Ron and Hermione had been school gossip. Hermione didn´t throw a temper-tantrum in public (apart from the canaries, and that was only in Harry´s presence) because of Ron and Lavender. She just left the room when the two turned up, but that was not really something exceptional. Hermione and Ron had fallouts before, and Hermione often retreats into privacy to learn.
Lavender was suspicious, during the time she dated Ron she noticed there was something more than friendship going on between Ron and Hermione . But she would not have gone public with that. Other than to Parvati she would not have talked to someone else about it. Therefore, I think their school mates are quite oblivious to the fact that Ron and Hermione have feelings for each other.
I think that Lavender may have suspected for a while but Hermione's apparent coolness at the beginning of Half Blood Prince may have encouraged her to 'try her luck' as it were. Still she must have known from the aftermath of the poisoning that there was no chance as that's when she started to go all clingy.

RWeasleysgirl

January 3rd, 2007, 9:53 pm

Yeah, I don't really remember where everyone was, or even if it says, but I think Hermione was sitting right next to his bed. I assumed Harry and the others were pretty much standing in the same position since they were all having a conversation. But I mean, if your brother called for his best friend, (who happened to be female) in his sleep, you wouldn't necessarily think, "Ooooh, he's in love with her!"

potterposse

January 3rd, 2007, 11:32 pm

I never even thought about Hagrid's reaction... I wonder if he'd ever suspected anything...Doubt it, but it might still be cute to see his reaction.

As for the gossip, I think she meant more like, the fact that Ron had allegedly cheated on Lavendar, and that the girl he was in the dormitory with was none other than Hermione Granger. Especially since Lavendar is one of the biggest gossips in the school.

Oh, I think Hagrid has some idea...He has seen Ron be defensive and how they fight, and Hermione upset with Ron...he I think suspected it...

wow...Lavender..Her new nickname is Regina from mean girls!

Yeah, I don't really remember where everyone was, or even if it says, but I think Hermione was sitting right next to his bed. I assumed Harry and the others were pretty much standing in the same position since they were all having a conversation. But I mean, if your brother called for his best friend, (who happened to be female) in his sleep, you wouldn't necessarily think, "Ooooh, he's in love with her!"

she was...But, she was also talking, he probably just said it because she was there, when she wasnt talking to him for a while, it probably just made him feel better to know she was still friends with him or somethinmg along those lines....

I didnt neccessarily think it was a love thing the first tim eI read that, then again, I can be oblivious to things. :p

RWeasleysgirl

January 3rd, 2007, 11:39 pm

I don't think he would have done that much reasoning when he was unconcious. I do think it's possible hearing her voice triggered it, but it was because it was Hermione. Personally, I think a guy calling out a girl's name in his sleep is a huge indication he has feelings for her.

potterposse

January 3rd, 2007, 11:46 pm

Yeah...possibly...it is Ron and Hermion after all ;)
I think it could have been either one that triggered Er-my-nee...

RWeasleysgirl

January 3rd, 2007, 11:56 pm

I just mean that in his sleep he isn't going to be thinking and reasoning. Hearing her voice isn't going to make him think "I thought she'd never speak to me again... she must forgive me!"

meesha1971

January 4th, 2007, 12:14 am

Well HBP changed my perception on their friendship a bit, but I never really thought they were that close to begin with.
But that part intrigued me a bit. As you say Ginny's actions show us that apparently she didn't know about Ron and Hermione's mutual feelings, but that is really hard to believe. Even if for some reason Hermione never told her ( which is in character for Hermione), or she didn't notice the previous years (doubtful), they spend all the summer together at the Burrow in HBP, that's a lot of time with only themselves to talk and interact with. Even if Ron and Hermione aren't rally open about their feelings and are careful not to show anything, you have to notice something. If it didn't surprise (well, not much) Harry when Hermione asked Ron, someone who is a lot less clueless about those things had to have noticed.
So I think that either Ginny is more vicious and cares less about Hermione than I initially thought or I'm missing something here. It wouldn't be the first time.

Well, Ginny never really spent that much time with the trio, particularly at school. I think Ron and Hermione both did a good job in hiding their feelings from everyone but Harry. And Harry only noticed because he spends more time with them than anyone and he witnessed things that others did not. If Ron and Hermione were obvious in any way, then the twins would have been teasing Ron mercilessly since GOF about Hermione.

The other factor is that Ron and Ginny are siblings. Ron had been hoping that Harry would get with Ginny - implied in OOTP - but he was completely gobsmacked when it actually happened. Once he recovered his reaction was to give Harry a shrug and a look that indicated "if you must". Typical sibling response.

In that light, I see Ginny having a very similar reaction to finding out about Ron and Hermione. There may have been gossip after Ron and Lavender broke up because Lavender did cause a scene. However, it is unlikely that anything came of that because Ron and Hermione did not get together after that. If there was gossip, it never reached Harry - and he was dating Ginny soon after that. I think if she had heard gossip, she would have mentioned it to Harry.

But, going back to the sibling reaction, I don't think Ginny would have paid much attention to gossip regarding Ron and Hermione because Ron is her brother and nothing has happened in her presence to suggest they have feelings for each other. I think Ginny would attribute any gossip following Ron and Lavender breaking up to the fact that Ron and Hermione are friends and thinking Lavender just misunderstood and overreacted. We saw a similar situation with Cho and Harry in OOTP. That would make more sense to Ginny than someone actually being attracted to her brother.

In the end, I think her reaction will be similar to Ron's reaction to Harry kissing her in HBP. Initially, she will be gobsmacked - then will come dumbfounded acceptance. :)

HP4evr1807

January 4th, 2007, 3:42 am

Well, Ginny never really spent that much time with the trio, particularly at school. I think Ron and Hermione both did a good job in hiding their feelings from everyone but Harry. And Harry only noticed because he spends more time with them than anyone and he witnessed things that others did not. If Ron and Hermione were obvious in any way, then the twins would have been teasing Ron mercilessly since GOF about Hermione.

The other factor is that Ron and Ginny are siblings. Ron had been hoping that Harry would get with Ginny - implied in OOTP - but he was completely gobsmacked when it actually happened. Once he recovered his reaction was to give Harry a shrug and a look that indicated "if you must". Typical sibling response.

In that light, I see Ginny having a very similar reaction to finding out about Ron and Hermione. There may have been gossip after Ron and Lavender broke up because Lavender did cause a scene. However, it is unlikely that anything came of that because Ron and Hermione did not get together after that. If there was gossip, it never reached Harry - and he was dating Ginny soon after that. I think if she had heard gossip, she would have mentioned it to Harry.

But, going back to the sibling reaction, I don't think Ginny would have paid much attention to gossip regarding Ron and Hermione because Ron is her brother and nothing has happened in her presence to suggest they have feelings for each other. I think Ginny would attribute any gossip following Ron and Lavender breaking up to the fact that Ron and Hermione are friends and thinking Lavender just misunderstood and overreacted. We saw a similar situation with Cho and Harry in OOTP. That would make more sense to Ginny than someone actually being attracted to her brother.

In the end, I think her reaction will be similar to Ron's reaction to Harry kissing her in HBP. Initially, she will be gobsmacked - then will come dumbfounded acceptance. :)

I think that Ginny might be picking up on hints now though. Even though Ron and Hermione didn't offically get together afterwards, I believe that those close to the two of them, may have picked up on different hints. Harry started to notice it as well, as shown in the greenhouse scene in HBP.

I don't think that Ginny will be quite surprised when it actually does happen. And ever since she got together with Harry in HBP for awhile, I don't think she will be that surprised.

meesha1971

January 4th, 2007, 4:32 am

I think that Ginny might be picking up on hints now though. Even though Ron and Hermione didn't offically get together afterwards, I believe that those close to the two of them, may have picked up on different hints. Harry started to notice it as well, as shown in the greenhouse scene in HBP.

I don't think that Ginny will be quite surprised when it actually does happen. And ever since she got together with Harry in HBP for awhile, I don't think she will be that surprised.

I honestly don't think she has. Ginny comes across as clueless regarding Ron and Hermione and, as much as she was shown to tease Ron in HBP - following the twins lead - I think she would have teased him at least a little about Hermione if she suspected anything. She just hasn't been around during the times that the clues were given so I don't believe she has seen anything that would clue her in.

She might have heard some gossip after Lavender broke up with Ron, but I don't think she would have paid too much attention to it because Ron is her brother and he and Hermione are friends.

ronjalina

January 4th, 2007, 6:29 pm

Ginny seems for the most part to be a pretty sensitive and perceptive character toward others but I suspect she has a more than a little bit of a blind spot (like any sibling) when it comes to seeing her brothers involved in romantic situations.:agree:

I'll have to re read the scene to see if it specifically mentions who was where in that setting but it may well have been possible that only Hermione and Harry were close enough to actually make out what he said.I think the twins and Ginny were there alongside Harry and Hermione. If the twins had recognized what Ron said, they would have teased him afterwards about it, wouldn´t they? Come to think of it, they haven´t seen Ron between his birthday and Dumbledore´s funeral and on both occasions it was not really appropriate to tease him. Maybe we will hear about it in DH when the trio turns up at the Burrow for the wedding.
Ginny never indicates she has either heard "Er-my-nee" or drawn any conclusions from it. Hermione: I alway thought she had recognized what Ron mumbled and drawn the right conclusion.

Like I said earlier I think they're past the stage where we'll see any huge displays from Ron prompted by Viktor, if anything we may see his prescence causing an interruption or two but I think Viktor's role in Deathly Hallows will be more related to the main story.Absolutely. As I said in a previous post, JKR wouldn´t let a character make an appearance just for the romantic sub-plot.

Hermione is a pretty isolated character in general, beyond Harry and Ron we don't really see too much of her having any real friendly relationships with too many other people. Still I would have thought that she might have sought out a closer relationship with Ginny as much for having someone to share a girl's perspective on things as anything else. She certainly seems to be pretty distant (even prior to the Lav Lav debacle) with her dorm mates.Possible she would have liked a female perspective but Ginny is after all two years younger than her. And from reading the books, I never had the impression they were close. They shared a room when Hermione was at the Burrow, but Hermione then spent her time there almost exclusively with Ron and Harry. We never see Hermione going off to meet Ginny or something. But there is actually a thread dealing with the relationship between those two.

How close are Hermione and Ginny? (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=98044)

I think Ron was relatively open in Half Blood Prince, certainly moreso than in previous books. This time around I think it was Hermione that was unintentionally cool in trying to be not too obvious. Unfortunately she was so much so that Ron felt that she wasn't interested.That is definately true. My point about Ron was, that he was open about his feelings only infront of Harry. I doubt any other Gryffindors paid much attention when Hermione gushed over Harry about how fanciable all the girls think he was and Ron was desperately trying to get her attention (and appreciation). And I don´t think their school mates have witnessed the greenhouse conversation either. I always had the impression what they were dealing with during that class (have forgotten the plant´s name) was a violent and loud business, therefore only Harry, who was working together with Ron and Hermione, witnessed it. I don´t think anyone other than Harry really had an inkling about what was going on.

I think that Lavender may have suspected for a while but Hermione's apparent coolness at the beginning of Half Blood Prince may have encouraged her to 'try her luck' as it were. Still she must have known from the aftermath of the poisoning that there was no chance as that's when she started to go all clingy.Yes, that´s what I think as well. However, I still think she would not have talked to anyone about her suspicions except Parvati. And, although Parvati seems to be the gossiping kind, she would only gossip with Lavender and not about her.

RWeasleysgirl

January 4th, 2007, 9:32 pm

I agree that only Harry probably knows. Ron is only really semi-open about it with him. Other non-students might suspect. And possibly Luna, just because it would be kind of like her to figure it out, though she probably wouldn't even realize it was a secret.

meesha1971

January 4th, 2007, 9:51 pm

:agree:

I think the twins and Ginny were there alongside Harry and Hermione. If the twins had recognized what Ron said, they would have teased him afterwards about it, wouldn´t they? Come to think of it, they haven´t seen Ron between his birthday and Dumbledore´s funeral and on both occasions it was not really appropriate to tease him. Maybe we will hear about it in DH when the trio turns up at the Burrow for the wedding.
Ginny never indicates she has either heard "Er-my-nee" or drawn any conclusions from it. Hermione: I alway thought she had recognized what Ron mumbled and drawn the right conclusion.

The twins and Ginny were there, but there is no indication that they found anything significant in Ron mumbling "Er-my-nee" in his sleep. And, really, why would they? Hermione is one of his best friends and she had just spoken. Without knowing all the details of what had been going on for the past few months, they would have no reason to find that unusual or read anything into it.

Harry and Hermione - on the other hand - do know what has been going on and would read something into that. Especially Hermione. ;)

Absolutely. As I said in a previous post, JKR wouldn´t let a character make an appearance just for the romantic sub-plot.

Definitely. If Krum does show up again, he will have another purpose in the story. However, his presence could be used in the romantic subplot in addition to that - but that would not be his only purpose, IMO.

Possible she would have liked a female perspective but Ginny is after all two years younger than her. And from reading the books, I never had the impression they were close. They shared a room when Hermione was at the Burrow, but Hermione then spent her time there almost exclusively with Ron and Harry. We never see Hermione going off to meet Ginny or something. But there is actually a thread dealing with the relationship between those two.

How close are Hermione and Ginny? (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=98044)

That's true. I think Hermione would be more likely to go to an adult for advice. She looks up to authority figures so I could see her going to McGonagall, Mrs. Weasley, or even her mum depending on the situation. But, at this point, I don't think Hermione has sought or received advice from anyone. Most of her mistakes are things that could have been avoided if she had someone to talk to.

That is definately true. My point about Ron was, that he was open about his feelings only infront of Harry. I doubt any other Gryffindors paid much attention when Hermione gushed over Harry about how fanciable all the girls think he was and Ron was desperately trying to get her attention (and appreciation). And I don´t think their school mates have witnessed the greenhouse conversation either. I always had the impression what they were dealing with during that class (have forgotten the plant´s name) was a violent and loud business, therefore only Harry, who was working together with Ron and Hermione, witnessed it. I don´t think anyone other than Harry really had an inkling about what was going on.

Exactly. :agree: Most of Ron and Hermione's "anvil sized hints" are things that have occurred in Harry's presence. They might have been in the Great Hall, common room, or class, but the scenes usually reflect that the three of them are somewhat separated from the other students at those times. I don't think it is common knowledge that Ron and Hermione like each other.

Yes, that´s what I think as well. However, I still think she would not have talked to anyone about her suspicions except Parvati. And, although Parvati seems to be the gossiping kind, she would only gossip with Lavender and not about her.

I agree. I think Lavender's suspicions were brought about from Ron and Hermione's behavior. Ron was angry with Hermione when he started dating Lavender and Hermione stopped speaking to Ron after they started dating. I would say that Lavender probably figured it out after the canary attack. She might not be the brightest bulb in the pack, but it wouldn't be that difficult to realize that a girl does not attack a guy for no reason. And I would have to say that she didn't miss the change in Ron's behavior after Christmas either - or after he was poisoned. I think that's why she became so clingy.

Lavender probably talked to Parvati about it, but I don't think Parvati would have spread that around either. Doing that would only serve to cause notice of the situation and cause Lavender more pain. Parvati would have kept that between the two of them. Although that does make me wonder if Parvati might have tried to talk to Hermione because she was worried about Lavender.

In any event, I don't think it is as obvious to the other students that Ron and Hermione like each other as most people seem to think. The trio has been somewhat isolated from the other students because of their adventures. Because of that, I think their getting together will come as a surprise to most people.

I agree that only Harry probably knows. Ron is only really semi-open about it with him. Other non-students might suspect. And possibly Luna, just because it would be kind of like her to figure it out, though she probably wouldn't even realize it was a secret.

Luna I can see. Possibly Neville as well. They are the "outcasts" to some degree and often get overlooked. Luna in particular is very observant and notices things that others might miss. And Luna was the one who tried to comfort Hermione when she and Ron were fighting. I think it would be cute if Luna was the one to say something to them. She does tend to state the obvious. :)

RWeasleysgirl

January 4th, 2007, 9:57 pm

I don't think Lavendar was there for the canary attack, but I do think she suspected not long after that that she had competition.

potterposse

January 4th, 2007, 10:06 pm

Well, I think she had some idea then..Hermione had to walk out at some point (which she did, crying), and Lavender was around....maybe..:shrug:

Luna I can see. Possibly Neville as well. They are the "outcasts" to some degree and often get overlooked. Luna in particular is very observant and notices things that others might miss. And Luna was the one who tried to comfort Hermione when she and Ron were fighting. I think it would be cute if Luna was the one to say something to them. She does tend to state the obvious.

:agree: I think Luna knows, Neville, its possible, I could see it happening...

RWeasleysgirl

January 4th, 2007, 10:14 pm

I doubt Neville would even give it much thought.

meesha1971

January 5th, 2007, 1:21 am

I don't think Lavendar was there for the canary attack, but I do think she suspected not long after that that she had competition.

Actually, Lavender was there at the beginning. Ron and Lavender came into the room - Ron stopped when he saw Hermione and Harry and realized that Hermione was crying. Ron's attitude changes and he behaves awkwardly. Lavender steps out - Hermione goes to leave and sends canaries after Ron.

The first thing is that Lavender would have had to have noticed that Hermione was crying. Ron becoming awkward wouldn't be all that suspicious by itself because boys in general tend to get awkward when girls cry. Lavender steps out at that point, but she had to have seen Hermione leave and see that Hermione was really upset. And she would have either seen the tail end of the attack or - at the very least - the results of the attack. Ron did get scratches from the canaries.

So I would say that Lavender realized that first day - or evening? - that Hermione had feelings for Ron. There is a bit of a "rub your face in it" attitude from Lavender towards Hermione during that time. However, I think that she didn't realize that Ron had feelings for Hermione until later - after Christmas is possible and definitely after Ron was poisoned. While Ron and Hermione were not speaking to each other, she didn't see anything to worry about. But when they became friends again, her attitude changes. She becomes the clingy, jealous girlfriend.

RWeasleysgirl

January 5th, 2007, 1:24 am

potterposse

January 5th, 2007, 1:58 am

Well, I call her "Regina" from mean girls for a reason.:elaugh:

JimmyPotter

January 5th, 2007, 2:44 am

Yeah, but I thought that she would have walked away, at least turned down a corridor or something, because otherwise I would think she would help the boy she'd just been snogging fend off the crazy birds...

I think that Lavender had already left the room when Hermione sent the birds at Ron. Therefore, Lavender did not know about the bird attack until seeing his wounds afterward.

Lavender did not start to show her suspicions about Hermione until after his poisoning. One can only wonder what Lavender would have thought of Ron exclaiming "Ermynee" after his poisoning.

meesha1971

January 5th, 2007, 3:57 am

Yeah, but I thought that she would have walked away, at least turned down a corridor or something, because otherwise I would think she would help the boy she'd just been snogging fend off the crazy birds...

I think she was standing outside the door - either waiting for Ron to come with her to find another room or waiting for Harry and Hermione to leave. Hermione slammed the door as she left and was sobbing so, even if Lavender had wandered a bit, she would have heard that. The scene cuts off there so we don't really know if she tried to help Ron or not. Either way, she would have noticed that Hermione was crying and heard her sobbing as she slammed the door. And she would have seen the results of the canary attack - if not the actual birds.

However, I don't think Lavender viewed Hermione as competition until Ron was poisoned. A great deal changed at that point. Ron was always "asleep" when she visited but Harry tells her that Ron is awake when he visits and she knows that Hermione is visiting him. Ron's behavior towards her changes overall - even when he gets out of the hospital wing, he tries to avoid her. I think it was at that point that Lavender started to realize what had happened - though she probably didn't know the full story. But even without knowing all the details, it wouldn't have been difficult for her to figure out that Ron had feelings for Hermione and had started dating her because of whatever had happened between him and Hermione.

Something I've been wondering though - Harry doesn't mention Lavender at the end at all. I wonder if she was one of the students who went home early or if she was still at Hogwarts and present at Dumbledore's funeral? There could be an interesting scene on the train in DH if Lavender is present. That's yet another possibility of how Jo could create a public scene that would lead to Ron admitting his feelings.

RWeasleysgirl

January 5th, 2007, 9:32 pm

Yeah, that is a good possibility. :agree: But then, by now we have a lot of good possibilities...

I'm just anxious for it to happen

potterposse

January 6th, 2007, 5:25 pm

I think she was standing outside the door - either waiting for Ron to come with her to find another room or waiting for Harry and Hermione to leave. Hermione slammed the door as she left and was sobbing so, even if Lavender had wandered a bit, she would have heard that. The scene cuts off there so we don't really know if she tried to help Ron or not. Either way, she would have noticed that Hermione was crying and heard her sobbing as she slammed the door. And she would have seen the results of the canary attack - if not the actual birds.

However, I don't think Lavender viewed Hermione as competition until Ron was poisoned. A great deal changed at that point. Ron was always "asleep" when she visited but Harry tells her that Ron is awake when he visits and she knows that Hermione is visiting him. Ron's behavior towards her changes overall - even when he gets out of the hospital wing, he tries to avoid her. I think it was at that point that Lavender started to realize what had happened - though she probably didn't know the full story. But even without knowing all the details, it wouldn't have been difficult for her to figure out that Ron had feelings for Hermione and had started dating her because of whatever had happened between him and Hermione.

exactly Meesha.:agree:

Something I've been wondering though - Harry doesn't mention Lavender at the end at all. I wonder if she was one of the students who went home early or if she was still at Hogwarts and present at Dumbledore's funeral? There could be an interesting scene on the train in DH if Lavender is present. That's yet another possibility of how Jo could create a public scene that would lead to Ron admitting his feelings.

Huh, :huh: Good question..It'd be interesting If she was still at Hogwarts, and saw Ron holding Hermione at the funeral...I agree it could lead to something, if there was an encounter on the train. I am still keeping options open, I'll add this to my options.

Same here RWeasleysgirl!

RWeasleysgirl

January 6th, 2007, 5:32 pm

You know, that idea kind of reminds me of when Harry saw Cho on the train home in Order of the Phoenix. Kind of a reassurance for the readers that there were no feelings left over. I'm not sure if that's necessary with Ron, though, because we know he's loved Hermione since way before he even dated Lavendar, he had no real feelings for her. Maybe we'll see her on another boy's arm, just to let us know that she's over Ron and she's ok. Maybe McGlaggen, that would be kind of funny...

ronjalina

January 6th, 2007, 6:21 pm

Lavender did not start to show her suspicions about Hermione until after his poisoning. One can only wonder what Lavender would have thought of Ron exclaiming "Ermynee" after his poisoning.If she had heard it, or learnt about it somehow, she would probably have ended the "relationship" earlier. I don´t think Lavender is stupid. She might come across as a bit shallow, but I don´t think she is daft. She just chose the wrong boy, but hearing him exclaim another girl´s name in his half-coma would have told her sooner that there was really no chance.

The first thing is that Lavender would have had to have noticed that Hermione was crying. Ron becoming awkward wouldn't be all that suspicious by itself because boys in general tend to get awkward when girls cry. Lavender steps out at that point, but she had to have seen Hermione leave and see that Hermione was really upset. And she would have either seen the tail end of the attack or - at the very least - the results of the attack. Ron did get scratches from the canaries.
So I would say that Lavender realized that first day - or evening? - that Hermione had feelings for Ron. There is a bit of a "rub your face in it" attitude from Lavender towards Hermione during that time. However, I think that she didn't realize that Ron had feelings for Hermione until later - after Christmas is possible and definitely after Ron was poisoned. While Ron and Hermione were not speaking to each other, she didn't see anything to worry about. But when they became friends again, her attitude changes. She becomes the clingy, jealous girlfriend.I think that´s what happened. Lavender might have had an idea that something could develop between Hermione and Ron long before. We already talked about it. It seemed that at least Parvati thought Ron could invite Hermione to the Yule ball back in GoF. Although she could have referred to it as a pity date, Parvati is not wondering why Harry isn´t inviting Hermione. So there might have been some speculation going on between Parvati and Lavender about Ron and Hermione. But then nothing happened for two years and Lavender might have decided to just give it a try. As you said, on the very first night she must have realized that Hermione had some feelings for Ron. Why else should she send canaries after him moments after he had started snogging Lavender? I think Lavender knew about Hermione´s feelings, but wasn´t sure about Ron´s. Hermione ignoring Ron afterwards only suited Lavender too well. I think she was quite clingy right from the beginning. Not so much like after Christmas or after the poisoning, her clingyness surely increased. But, as Harry noted, she seemed to consider every moment she did not snog Ron as a wast of time. I think that´s where I got the impression from that it was Lavender who initiated the PDAs and Ron just got along with it.

After Christmas Ron was much less enthusiastic about his "relationship" with Lavender (did he ever thank her for the necklace? :lol: ) and when on top of that Hermione came back into the picture after the poisoning, I think she knew her days as Won-Won´s Lav-Lav were numbered. But there was probably hope against hope. Otherwise she would have confronted him earlier about Hermione. But the last straw was when she saw Ron and Hermione coming out of the boy´s dormitory.

DarkSquirrel

January 6th, 2007, 7:49 pm

meesha1971

January 6th, 2007, 8:09 pm

If she had heard it, or learnt about it somehow, she would probably have ended the "relationship" earlier. I don´t think Lavender is stupid. She might come across as a bit shallow, but I don´t think she is daft. She just chose the wrong boy, but hearing him exclaim another girl´s name in his half-coma would have told her sooner that there was really no chance.
I think that´s what happened. Lavender might have had an idea that something could develop between Hermione and Ron long before. We already talked about it. It seemed that at least Parvati thought Ron could invite Hermione to the Yule ball back in GoF. Although she could have referred to it as a pity date, Parvati is not wondering why Harry isn´t inviting Hermione. So there might have been some speculation going on between Parvati and Lavender about Ron and Hermione. But then nothing happened for two years and Lavender might have decided to just give it a try. As you said, on the very first night she must have realized that Hermione had some feelings for Ron. Why else should she send canaries after him moments after he had started snogging Lavender? I think Lavender knew about Hermione´s feelings, but wasn´t sure about Ron´s. Hermione ignoring Ron afterwards only suited Lavender too well. I think she was quite clingy right from the beginning. Not so much like after Christmas or after the poisoning, her clingyness surely increased. But, as Harry noted, she seemed to consider every moment she did not snog Ron as a wast of time. I think that´s where I got the impression from that it was Lavender who initiated the PDAs and Ron just got along with it.

I agree. And that's what I was saying before. It did seem like Lavender was aware of Hermione's feelings and there was kind of a "rub your face in it" vibe. Not so much that it felt like Lavender was trying to be cruel, but enough that it felt like she was trying to make sure Hermione knew that Ron was hers.

But I definitely was left with the impression that it was Lavender who initiated the PDA's and Ron just went along with it. And that contributed to the feeling that Lavender was "marking her territory" so to speak. You could be right that Lavender and Parvati speculated about Ron and Hermione as early as GOF. Although I still think that Parvati was suggesting a pity date because she knew they were friends. I just had the impression that Parvati thought that neither of them could get a date on their own.

But, as we discussed before, Padma is a factor as well. She had a horrible time with Ron at the ball and witnessed the beginning of the Yule Brawl. So it is very possible that Padma talked about that with Parvati and then Parvati discussed it with Lavender. However, after two years with nothing happening between them, Lavender very likely came to the conclusion that Ron wasn't interested in Hermione and decided to go for it. But I do think that Lavender was aware that Hermione had feelings for Ron - at least after the canary attack - if not before. There is also the bit after the Quidditch tryouts when Hermione goes to congratulate Ron and Lavender goes off with Parvati looking disgruntled.

After Christmas Ron was much less enthusiastic about his "relationship" with Lavender (did he ever thank her for the necklace? :lol: ) and when on top of that Hermione came back into the picture after the poisoning, I think she knew her days as Won-Won´s Lav-Lav were numbered. But there was probably hope against hope. Otherwise she would have confronted him earlier about Hermione. But the last straw was when she saw Ron and Hermione coming out of the boy´s dormitory.

Ron was definitely less enthusiastic after Christmas. I do wonder if anything happened over the necklace. Ron certainly didn't wear it and you would think Lavender would have asked him about it. Although, Ron could have just pretended that he forgot it at home and acted upset over it. :lol:

The tide definitely turned after Ron was poisoned. Lavender became increasingly bitter over Hermione. She complained about it to Harry and she also made that scene after Ron was released from the hospital wing. “Why didn’t you tell me you were getting out today? And why was she with you?”

I got the feeling this was an ongoing issue with Lavender - at least after Ron was poisoned. It doesn't appear that Lavender kept quiet regarding her concerns about Hermione. I think that may have been part of the reason that Ron started avoiding her and hiding whenever he thought she was coming. It does appear that Lavender was jealous of Hermione and confronted Ron about it - twice that was shown on page and likely other times.

However, I still don't think it was common knowledge. I think the majority of their house mates probably thought Lavender was overreacting because Ron and Hermione weren't behaving any differently. Hermione had gone up to the boys dorm with Ron and Harry before - that wasn't unusual behavior. So I still think the majority will be surprised.

Lilkittikat

January 6th, 2007, 9:27 pm

I think that the reason that Ron was less enthusiastic after Christmas was that it was just a physical thang and Christmas kinda cooled it down, if that makes sense. It would also have given him time to think about Hermione.

Deevo

January 7th, 2007, 2:29 am

I felt really bad for Lavender more than once in HBP. Even if she is not my type of girl Ron did everything wrong with her, and with Hermione, and she didn't deserve it.
No she didn't and the whole episode was quite a learning experience for him. If nothing else Ginny was spot on when she told Ron he had no experience in that area and it really spurred him on to take the initiative.

Hermione wasn't that great either.I hope they learned something at least.
True, as has been said before in her efforts to not be obvious she camouflaged her interest from everyone including Ron himself. In that respect she can shoulder at least a part of the responsibility for Ron hooking up with Lavender.

I agree in part that Lavender was in a way the innocent party here yet in some respects toward the end of their time together she bought a bit of it on herself. I think that maybe after Christmas but definitely after his birthday she recognised that Ron wasn't interested yet in becoming increasingly clingy she was making it more and more difficult on Ron to end things in any way but badly. To his credit, though it may have been part in fear and part uncertainty, Ron seemed to recognise where things were headed yet didn't want to compound the damage already done by making it harder on her (Lavender). Unfortunately her possessive nature made that inevitable.

It's curious how previoulsy clueless Harry did almost everything right with Ginny, not giving in to his jealousy and respecting her relationship, not going out with other girls because he wanted her, taking Luna to the party and kissing the girl when she wanted to be kissed. Let's see how Ron and Hermione manage the real thing in DH, I'm still not sure they are going to be together at the end, thoug they are going to try.
Oh I'm almost certain they will be, both couples.

RWeasleysgirl

January 7th, 2007, 3:22 am

I felt really bad for Lavender more than once in HBP. Even if she is not my type of girl Ron did everything wrong with her, and with Hermione, and she didn't deserve it. Hermione wasn't that great either.I hope they learned something at least. It's curious how previoulsy clueless Harry did almost everything right with Ginny, not giving in to his jealousy and respecting her relationship, not going out with other girls because he wanted her, taking Luna to the party and kissing the girl when she wanted to be kissed. Let's see how Ron and Hermione manage the real thing in DH, I'm still not sure they are going to be together at the end, thoug they are going to try.

Ok, I felt a little bad for her too, but the point is that Ron and Hermione needed that experience to appreciate each other more. It's exactly why they will be able to be together at the end. They have become absolutely perfect for each other and ready to be in love together. Ron and Lavendar were never going to be anything more than a fling; she'll get over him. What Ron did was not good, he made a lot of bad decisions, but a lot of that came from lack of experience. Harry seems to be easily better with girls than Ron is, but that doesn't mean that Ron can't learn.

He made mistakes, they both did. Ok. The thing is, these characters are TEENAGERS! Do adults make mistakes? Sure, but teenagers... we haven't made enough to learn from yet, so we make a lot of mistakes, and most are forgivable because they were made just because we don't know enough to foresee the consequences. Ron didn't sit there thinking..."if I use this girl to get back at Hermione and prove a point to Ginny, I could really be hurting the girl I love and someone else who doesn't really deserve it..." he just acted on the moment. That wasn't a good decision, and afterwards he saw that. He clearly learned from his mistake, and that's all that really matters.

potterposse

January 7th, 2007, 3:26 am

:agree: Forgive and Forget...(okay, I cant forget that...no one can...)

No one is perfect...Its the way God made us.

RWeasleysgirl

January 7th, 2007, 3:28 am

Exactly

DarkSquirrel

January 7th, 2007, 4:36 am

Ok, I felt a little bad for her too, but the point is that Ron and Hermione needed that experience to appreciate each other more. It's exactly why they will be able to be together at the end. They have become absolutely perfect for each other and ready to be in love together. Ron and Lavendar were never going to be anything more than a fling; she'll get over him. What Ron did was not good, he made a lot of bad decisions, but a lot of that came from lack of experience. Harry seems to be easily better with girls than Ron is, but that doesn't mean that Ron can't learn.

He made mistakes, they both did. Ok. The thing is, these characters are TEENAGERS! Do adults make mistakes? Sure, but teenagers... we haven't made enough to learn from yet, so we make a lot of mistakes, and most are forgivable because they were made just because we don't know enough to foresee the consequences. Ron didn't sit there thinking..."if I use this girl to get back at Hermione and prove a point to Ginny, I could really be hurting the girl I love and someone else who doesn't really deserve it..." he just acted on the moment. That wasn't a good decision, and afterwards he saw that. He clearly learned from his mistake, and that's all that really matters.

Well, yes, I didn't say otherwise. But good rant anyways.

And yes Ron problem was that he didn't think about Hermione's feelings, or Lavender's, at all.

RWeasleysgirl

January 7th, 2007, 4:44 am

I wasn't ranting. We obviously don't seem to get along, but if you're not going to consider my posts could you at least show some mannes?

I agree, he didn't show any consideration for their feelings, but he made a mistake. That's forgivable.

DarkSquirrel

January 7th, 2007, 5:32 am

I should have added an smiley, like this :), I wasn't trying to offend really.

meesha1971

January 7th, 2007, 9:03 am

Well, yes, I didn't say otherwise. But good rant anyways.

And yes Ron problem was that he didn't think about Hermione's feelings, or Lavender's, at all.

Now there, I have to disagree. I'm not going to say Ron is sensitive - he is blunt and honest and that can be hurtful. However, I would not say that he did not consider anyone else's feelings at all.

With Hermione, Ron didn't believe that he could hurt her. After the argument with Ginny, his point of view is that Hermione lied to him. She told him that she and Krum were just friends. I'm not getting into whether or not Ginny was telling the truth or any of that. I'm just looking at it from Ron's point of view and what that made him think at that time.

He was angry with Hermione because he thought she lied to him. On top of that, there are other issues he's trying to deal with. His self esteem is very low because of the problems with Quidditch - the argument with Ginny - and so on. All of that builds up throughout that week - culminating at the final practice the night before the game where Ron scrapes bottom. He tells Harry that he's pathetic and he's going to resign after the game. Nothing Harry says makes Ron feel any better about himself. Harry comes up with his plan to use Felix Felicis to help build up Ron's confidence.

Now, that was a good plan - and it certainly did help Ron's self esteem regarding Quidditch. However, Harry made a big mistake there. He didn't let Hermione know what he was up to. That was understandable for the first part of the plan. He needed Hermione's reaction to convince Ron that he slipped something into his drink and Hermione is a terrible liar. However, Harry should have told Hermione what he had done after that. It wouldn't have been that difficult for him to pull her aside and explain it before he went to the pitch.

Because Harry didn't tell Hermione what he had done, she ended up sticking her foot in her mouth. She was upset with Harry and, in yelling at him because she thought he did something illegal, she implied that she didn't believe Ron could play well. What should have been a moment of triumph for Ron - confirmation that he could play well cause he did it all on his own - is ruined. On top of everything else - thinking Hermione lied to him about Krum - the argument with Ginny - being embarrassed in front of Harry regarding his lack of experience - it now appears that Hermione has no faith in him at all. All of that together leads him to question what Hermione intended in inviting him to Slughorn's party and he comes to the conclusion that she only asked him because they were friends and Slughorn had been ignoring him.

The result of all this is that Ron gave up. If Hermione lied to him and had no faith in him, then she wasn't ever going to feel the same way about him that he did about her. Why would she be interested in him, if she could have somebody like Krum? He compared himself to Krum and - in his own mind - he fell short. He gave up and decided he could never be with Hermione so there was no point in waiting around. He decided to go with someone who did like him - Lavender. She had shown interest - she had complimented him and flirted with him. He needed an ego boost and she gave it to him.

What we end up with is a misunderstanding. Ron did not believe that he could hurt Hermione. If she didn't have any feelings for him, then what would she care if he snogged someone else? Of course, he found out he was wrong, but that was after the damage had been done. And then he had two situations to deal with. He was wrong about Hermione's feelings and he had hurt her - he felt guilty about that. But he had also started dating Lavender. How was he supposed to handle that?

He couldn't very well tell Lavender - "thanks for the snog, but Hermione does like me so I'll see you around". And there was still the issue of him believing that Hermione had lied to him - he was still angry about that. He had to deal with his own hurt feelings as well. Eventually, he does get over it and, after Christmas, he begins trying to fix things with Hermione. But she's still hurt and angry.

For me, it says a lot about Ron's character that he didn't dump Lavender and go after Hermione. Lavender hadn't done anything wrong and he didn't want to hurt her. That's why it dragged out so long. Ron was trying to figure out a way to end things with Lavender without hurting her as well. I agree that he handled it badly, but I think his intentions were good. He had already unintentionally hurt Hermione because he didn't realize that he could. He didn't want to hurt Lavender on top of that.

Hermione realized that as well. After Ron was poisoned and they made up, her attitude changes. She doesn't have all the facts yet, but she realizes that the situation is not what it seems. Ron is not happy with Lavender but doesn't know how to end it. Now, Hermione could have helped him there - similar to how she helped Harry with Cho. But I think she realized that it was important for Ron to figure this out on his own. There were lessons that Ron needed to learn and that whole experience helped him learn those lessons.

For that matter, it was important for Hermione as well. She needed to realize that she couldn't ignore Ron and hide her feelings but expect him to know she had feelings for him and act on that. She took Ron for granted and learned her lesson as well. There is a marked difference in how she treats Ron after they make up.

They both made mistakes and they hurt each other because of those mistakes. But they also learned important lessons because of that experience. The end result is that they will have a stronger relationship because of that. That's the kind of thing that ends most new relationships. Jealousy - hurt feelings - miscommunication. Ron and Hermione have dealt with all of that and they haven't even become a couple yet. Their relationship will be stronger because of that.

Deevo

January 7th, 2007, 11:39 am

Now there, I have to disagree. I'm not going to say Ron is sensitive - he is blunt and honest and that can be hurtful. However, I would not say that he did not consider anyone else's feelings at all.

With Hermione, Ron didn't believe that he could hurt her. After the argument with Ginny, his point of view is that Hermione lied to him. She told him that she and Krum were just friends. I'm not getting into whether or not Ginny was telling the truth or any of that. I'm just looking at it from Ron's point of view and what that made him think at that time.
:agree: And it went deeper than that too. Aside from the argument with Ginny and Hermione's, albeit unintentional, put down after the quiddich match there's the fact that she'd been, again unintentionally, cool toward him right from the start of term. While she'd been very encouraging and openly supportive of Harry, understandably so given their almost sibling like bond, in doing so she's been alomost dismissive of Ron. We know from Order of the Phoenix and even earlier that Ron has terrible confidence issues, especially when people are putting him down, but this treatment, though trivial, must have been sinking him by inches. Opposite that we have Lavender openly flirting with him, again almost from day one, so the stage was set pretty early on in the piece.

Personally I believe that after the events of Goblet of Fire in particular, Hermione was keeping her cards much closer to her chest about whom she was interested in and this manifested itself as an almost dismissive attitude toward Ron.

He was angry with Hermione because he thought she lied to him. On top of that, there are other issues he's trying to deal with. His self esteem is very low because of the problems with Quidditch - the argument with Ginny - and so on. All of that builds up throughout that week - culminating at the final practice the night before the game where Ron scrapes bottom. He tells Harry that he's pathetic and he's going to resign after the game. Nothing Harry says makes Ron feel any better about himself. Harry comes up with his plan to use Felix Felicis to help build up Ron's confidence.

Now, that was a good plan - and it certainly did help Ron's self esteem regarding Quidditch. However, Harry made a big mistake there. He didn't let Hermione know what he was up to. That was understandable for the first part of the plan. He needed Hermione's reaction to convince Ron that he slipped something into his drink and Hermione is a terrible liar. However, Harry should have told Hermione what he had done after that. It wouldn't have been that difficult for him to pull her aside and explain it before he went to the pitch.

Because Harry didn't tell Hermione what he had done, she ended up sticking her foot in her mouth. She was upset with Harry and, in yelling at him because she thought he did something illegal, she implied that she didn't believe Ron could play well. What should have been a moment of triumph for Ron - confirmation that he could play well cause he did it all on his own - is ruined. On top of everything else - thinking Hermione lied to him about Krum - the argument with Ginny - being embarrassed in front of Harry regarding his lack of experience - it now appears that Hermione has no faith in him at all. All of that together leads him to question what Hermione intended in inviting him to Slughorn's party and he comes to the conclusion that she only asked him because they were friends and Slughorn had been ignoring him.
Interesting thought, had Harry confided with Hermione on his plan before the match it could have produced a very different result. Of course Hermione goes into full 'I told you so' mode before knowing the full story and classically buggers it up.

For me, it says a lot about Ron's character that he didn't dump Lavender and go after Hermione. Lavender hadn't done anything wrong and he didn't want to hurt her. That's why it dragged out so long. Ron was trying to figure out a way to end things with Lavender without hurting her as well. I agree that he handled it badly, but I think his intentions were good. He had already unintentionally hurt Hermione because he didn't realize that he could. He didn't want to hurt Lavender on top of that.
:agree: Indeed, unfortunatelt for Ron, and at least a part of this has to lay at Lavender's feet as well, she (Lavender) wasn't a girl that handled rejection well.

Hermione realized that as well. After Ron was poisoned and they made up, her attitude changes. She doesn't have all the facts yet, but she realizes that the situation is not what it seems. Ron is not happy with Lavender but doesn't know how to end it. Now, Hermione could have helped him there - similar to how she helped Harry with Cho. But I think she realized that it was important for Ron to figure this out on his own. There were lessons that Ron needed to learn and that whole experience helped him learn those lessons.
Thru to a certain extent but I also think that Hermione didn't want to be seen as a rebound date as well. She resumed a friendly relationship with Ron but seemed a tad reluctant to go into it too much further till Ron had sorted out where he stood.

For that matter, it was important for Hermione as well. She needed to realize that she couldn't ignore Ron and hide her feelings but expect him to know she had feelings for him and act on that. She took Ron for granted and learned her lesson as well. There is a marked difference in how she treats Ron after they make up.
Yes there is, they may well have moved forward if it hadn't been for the main plot getting in the way and short circuiting things again. Hopefully they'll be able to straighten things out and get on the same page before too much longer.

They both made mistakes and they hurt each other because of those mistakes. But they also learned important lessons because of that experience. The end result is that they will have a stronger relationship because of that. That's the kind of thing that ends most new relationships. Jealousy - hurt feelings - miscommunication. Ron and Hermione have dealt with all of that and they haven't even become a couple yet. Their relationship will be stronger because of that.
:agree: I think it already is, they've just got to take one step closer now.

ronjalina

January 7th, 2007, 8:39 pm

Wow, meesha, phantastic analysis. :clap: I agree and have nothing to add because Deevo has already done a good job with that.

As hard as it must have been for Hermione to wait, it was a clever decision of her to let Ron resolve things with Lavender by himself. Unusual for her not to butt in and give her advice. She is still very reluctant and careful about the whole issue. One more reason why I think Ron will be the one to make the first move.

We don´t know exactly what was spoken during the breakup, we only know Lavender yelled and therefore conclude she was the one who ended it. But maybe Ron had his say as well. I think that was on our infamous list of questions we kind of have lost over the last pages.

potterposse

January 7th, 2007, 11:08 pm

Meesha, That was a Great analysis like ronjalina said. Have you thought about writing books? You'd be good at it.:cool:
As hard as it must have been for Hermione to wait, it was a clever decision of her to let Ron resolve things with Lavender by himself. Unusual for her not to butt in and give her advice. She is still very reluctant and careful about the whole issue. One more reason why I think Ron will be the one to make the first move.
I agree Ron will speak up. :agree: I think because Hermione did try last time, he is next to step up... He I think if not an "I love you" right away, it will be a complement like, Ron telling her she looks pretty or nice.

I wondered this recently:I was looking through Ootp, at the part where Hermione tells Harry where he was wrong on his date with Cho. She brought up the statement that he should have said she was ugly. Harry said she wasnt and then she said "Oh, Harry.. Your'e worse than Ron." I know Ron thought she was pretty at the ball, but did he ever tell Hermione that she was pretty at some point after that, like in thier fifth year? Tell me if I am wrong in this at all. it was a thought. :shrug:

:relax: I love this new smile! and this one!:rockon: *sorry, random*

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 3:00 am

:agree: And it went deeper than that too. Aside from the argument with Ginny and Hermione's, albeit unintentional, put down after the quiddich match there's the fact that she'd been, again unintentionally, cool toward him right from the start of term. While she'd been very encouraging and openly supportive of Harry, understandably so given their almost sibling like bond, in doing so she's been alomost dismissive of Ron. We know from Order of the Phoenix and even earlier that Ron has terrible confidence issues, especially when people are putting him down, but this treatment, though trivial, must have been sinking him by inches. Opposite that we have Lavender openly flirting with him, again almost from day one, so the stage was set pretty early on in the piece.

Personally I believe that after the events of Goblet of Fire in particular, Hermione was keeping her cards much closer to her chest about whom she was interested in and this manifested itself as an almost dismissive attitude toward Ron.

Exactly. :agree:

One thing that tends to get overlooked is that Hermione is also very insecure. She just shows it in different ways. Ron comes to school thinking that nothing he does will matter because his brothers did it all already - his response is that he doesn't try very hard because he doesn't believe it will matter to anyone. After the fight with Harry and the events of the Yule Ball in GOF, this turns into Ron questioning himself and his abilities.

Hermione comes to school and, from the beginning, shows an almost desperate need to prove herself. She has to be right about everything. She has to be the one with all the answers. She has to be the best in their year. Her greatest fear is failure. As she gets older, we get a glimpse into some insecurity about her appearance. She gets her teeth fixed in GOF and reveals that she has wanted to do that for ages, but her parents wanted her to wear braces. She gets very upset when it appears that Ron is only interested in "pretty girls". I think that played a part in the effort she put into her appearance for the ball. She wanted Ron to see her differently. But he didn't say anything and the next day, she says it's "too much of a bother".

Basically, you have the same thing occurring with both of them. Ron is telling himself that Hermione wouldn't be interested in him because he's poor - he's not very smart - and so on. Hermione is telling herself that Ron wouldn't be interested in her because she's not pretty enough - and so on.

We see Hermione display this insecurity in GOF with the Yule Ball. She doesn't want to tell anyone who her date is because she is worried that she'll be made fun of. And her fears - like Ron's - are not completely unfounded. Parvati and Lavender are shocked that Hermione was able to get a date. We see that in people's reactions to the change in her appearance - primarily unflattering disbelief. Even Harry was shocked and didn't recognize her at first. However, their fears are irrational in terms of how they would each react to the other. Hermione doesn't care that Ron's family is poor and she has more regard for his abilities than she shows. Physical appearance is subjective and Ron does find Hermione attractive.

What I see with Hermione is that she is afraid of rejection just as much as Ron is - albeit for different reasons. She worries about being made fun of so she plays it close to the vest. She guards her reactions around the twins, Harry - pretty much everyone - because she doesn't want anyone else to figure it out and tease her. And she is confused about Ron's feelings as well because, after he showed jealousy, he didn't do anything about it. So she guards herself there too - just in case she is wrong. And that left Ron confused. Hermione went too far in the opposite extreme in her efforts to hide her feelings and not be too obvious.

It ends up being a catch 22 situation. Hermione hides her feelings and questions Ron's feelings because he never makes any kind of move. Ron doesn't make any kind of move because he questions Hermione's feelings because she doesn't give any outward sign that she's interested. HBP broke that cycle. Hermione finally let her feelings show and Ron confirmed his. Now they just have to do something about it.

Interesting thought, had Harry confided with Hermione on his plan before the match it could have produced a very different result. Of course Hermione goes into full 'I told you so' mode before knowing the full story and classically buggers it up.

I think it would have been very different. They still would have argued, but it would have been a different argument. Hermione confronting Ron about why he got upset over it could have potentially led to him admitting his feelings. One possibility for them getting together in DH if Hermione finds out about it.

:agree: Indeed, unfortunatelt for Ron, and at least a part of this has to lay at Lavender's feet as well, she (Lavender) wasn't a girl that handled rejection well.

Definitely true. That was something Ron had to learn. Sometimes you can't avoid hurting someone. Lavender was going to get hurt no matter what he did. But I do think it shows a lot about his character that he tried not to hurt her.

Thru to a certain extent but I also think that Hermione didn't want to be seen as a rebound date as well. She resumed a friendly relationship with Ron but seemed a tad reluctant to go into it too much further till Ron had sorted out where he stood.

Oh definitely. That's one of the reasons I don't believe they got together in HBP. I think that would have been important to both of them because they both demonstrated just how much their friendship meant to them. I think Ron realized that first. Once he began to deal with his hurt and wasn't angry anymore, it really bothered him that he had lost Hermione's friendship. We don't see it with Hermione until after Ron is poisoned, but she comes to the conclusion that, even if Ron is dating Lavender, she doesn't want to lose him as a friend.

Given that it was Hermione who made the first move - vague and confusing, but a move- and was seemingly rejected, I think she will be reluctant to do so again. I think she will wait for Ron. Though it does appear that she has at least realized that her own behavior played a part in that and we do see her begin to treat Ron differently after he was poisoned.

Yes there is, they may well have moved forward if it hadn't been for the main plot getting in the way and short circuiting things again. Hopefully they'll be able to straighten things out and get on the same page before too much longer.

:agree: I think it already is, they've just got to take one step closer now.

:agree: At this point, I think they just need a little nudge. The question is, what will that nudge be? There are just so many different ways Jo could accomplish it. We've come up with some really good ones, but who knows what Jo decided on. :)

RWeasleysgirl

January 8th, 2007, 3:23 am

It ends up being a catch 22 situation. Hermione hides her feelings and questions Ron's feelings because he never makes any kind of move. Ron doesn't make any kind of move because he questions Hermione's feelings because she doesn't give any outward sign that she's interested.

:hmm: I'm dizzy... lol, When you put it that way it's really quite complicated. More complicated than it is to the naked eye lol.

Really though, even more than that, think of what they're risking? They have an uncommonly solid friendship.

sparkly

January 8th, 2007, 3:50 am

Well, you're going to be a fun one, aren't you?

The most effective response to trolls is to ignore them - they hate that.

RWeasleysgirl

January 8th, 2007, 3:52 am

Yes, but I don't always hate them. They can be amusing.

unagiboy45

January 8th, 2007, 4:14 am

i hope they get married....

RWeasleysgirl

January 8th, 2007, 4:16 am

i hope they get married....

:agree: Many of us do. And welcome!

kingwidgit

January 8th, 2007, 4:18 am

Remember to keep posts polite and be respectful of other members opinions.

i hope they get married....Quite a few fans do too. ;)

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 4:28 am

Thank you, kingwidgit. :)

:hmm: I'm dizzy... lol, When you put it that way it's really quite complicated. More complicated than it is to the naked eye lol.

Really though, even more than that, think of what they're risking? They have an uncommonly solid friendship.

It is complicated and, as I said, there fears were not completely unfounded in terms of how they perceive others' opinions of them. They just needed to realize that their own opinions of each other are going to be higher than those who don't really know them that well. :) The risk of losing their friendship is a factor as well and a large part of the reason they have both been cautious - overly cautious in Hermione's case.

But we see that changing at the end of HBP. Hermione is more open and less cautious around Ron after they make up. I think she began to realize what her mistakes were. Now she just needs to learn that a little flirting never hurt anybody. ;)

Yoana

January 8th, 2007, 10:33 am

I think the process of groeing up to being ready for one another is copmlete now. There is nothing left for them to do but be together. Although I'm not sure they will manage it perfectly.

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 2:58 pm

I think the process of groeing up to being ready for one another is copmlete now. There is nothing left for them to do but be together. Although I'm not sure they will manage it perfectly.

Well, they still have issues that need to be resolved so I would have to agree that they won't manage it perfectly. There will likely be some bickering involved - especially when Hermione finds out about Ginny spreading rumors about her. But they'll get there. :love:

DarkSquirrel

January 8th, 2007, 3:47 pm

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 4:42 pm

Yeah, they have resolved a lot of issues and matured quite a bit, but I think they have added new ones, so in addition to everything that has been said I'd like to add a few things. Before HBP they could have been insecure about their feelings and afraid of the changes in their friendship but they didn't really know much about relationships. Now, after their "crisis" they have seen how bad it can be if things go wrong and how much it can affect not only their friendship but the trio as well. And now they know that things can go wrong, that no relationship can be perfect, that's part of their maturing process. More reasons to be afraid, and not only that, but after Dumbledore death they can feel that they were too distracted preoccupied with their own silly problems and that they failed somehow because of it, so it's possible that Harry is not going to be the only one to suffer from the "now it's not the best time to be dating" thing.
And another thing is that they now have a past,a bad experience. Harry and Ginny both learned about relationships from different people, Harry with Cho and Ginny with Corner and Dean, but Ron and Hermione had their bad experience with each other. That has to make you weary somehow.
I have no doubt that they will get over all this, but I think this is part of the problems they are going to face.

We've touched on this some in the discussion. They do still have issues to resolve - both old and new. Ron has to deal with the fact that, even though he didn't think he could, he did hurt Hermione. I think that may cause him to think he ruined his chance - or at least worry about that. He's dealt with quite a bit of his insecurity, but he's not completely confident in himself. We've already seen Hermione beginning to deal with the issue of how she treated Ron in the past and there is a huge improvement there.

However, I don't think that they "failed" because of distractions. There wasn't anything they could do up to the end, and at that point, they had made up and Ron was not dating Lavender anymore. Basically, there were no distractions when it came time for action and all them did their best there. That's not to say that each of them aren't thinking about how they could have handled the situation differently, but not because of distractions - just in what they actually did that night.

I think the events of HBP would more likely serve to spur them forward. They've wasted enough time and Dumbledore's death drives home the point that any of them could die at any time. Knowing you could die tomorrow gives you a different outlook on what you what to accomplish today.

DarkSquirrel

January 8th, 2007, 4:55 pm

However, I don't think that they "failed" because of distractions. There wasn't anything they could do up to the end, and at that point, they had made up and Ron was not dating Lavender anymore. Basically, there were no distractions when it came time for action and all them did their best there. That's not to say that each of them aren't thinking about how they could have handled the situation differently, but not because of distractions - just in what they actually did that night.
I don't think they failed either, I said that they might feel like they somehow did. Let's not forget the whole "dismissing of Harry's suspicions all through the year" part. It's their wake up call, for Harry too, they are in a war, Harry is a central player, and they haven't been acting like it. We understand them perfectly but they might be thinking "what have we been doing this year?", and one of the answers they might cme up with is that they were too caugh up in their own dramas.

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 5:08 pm

I don't think they failed either, I said that they might feel like they somehow did. Let's not forget the whole "dismissing of Harry's suspicions all through the year" part. It's their wake up call, for Harry too, they are in a war, Harry is a central player, and they haven't been acting like it. We understand them perfectly but they might be thinking "what have we been doing this year?", and one of the answers they might cme up with is that they were too caugh up in their own dramas.

Actually, that was Harry's failure - not theirs. Harry wasted too much time worrying about something he couldn't do anything about. Ron and Hermione both agreed with him that Malfoy was probably up to something but there was nothing he could do about it. They both told him he would do better to concentrate on what Dumbledore had asked him to do - and they were right. Harry's time would have been better spent concentrating on getting that memory from Slughorn rather than wasting time trying to get into the Room of Requirement. There was no way for him to do that and he wasted valuable time in attempting it.

Dumbledore told Harry there was no purpose in them meeting any more until he had Slughorn's memory. He needed that to confirm his suspicions about the Horcruxes. Only then could they move forward. What did Harry miss out on learning because he wasted so much time? That could be significant as well.

We do see that they are all thinking about how they handled things that night. Ron wonders if there might have been a way to stop Malfoy if he hadn't got the drop on them with the darkness powder. Hermione wonders if she might have been able to stop Snape. Harry will go over and over his failed duel with Snape trying to figure out what he could have done differently.

But the rest of the year was just a waiting game. There wasn't anything for them to do until that night. There was no way to figure out what Malfoy was up to unless he told them and he wasn't telling anybody - not even his accomplices. Hermione knew that and so did Ron. So, I can see Harry realizing it was a mistake for him to waste so much time worrying about Malfoy, but there's no reason for Ron or Hermione to because they did the right thing - in spite of their distractions. If Harry had listened to them, things might have gone down a bit differently.

DarkSquirrel

January 8th, 2007, 6:48 pm

Actually, that was Harry's failure - not theirs. Harry wasted too much time worrying about something he couldn't do anything about. Ron and Hermione both agreed with him that Malfoy was probably up to something but there was nothing he could do about it. They both told him he would do better to concentrate on what Dumbledore had asked him to do - and they were right. Harry's time would have been better spent concentrating on getting that memory from Slughorn rather than wasting time trying to get into the Room of Requirement. There was no way for him to do that and he wasted valuable time in attempting it.

Dumbledore told Harry there was no purpose in them meeting any more until he had Slughorn's memory. He needed that to confirm his suspicions about the Horcruxes. Only then could they move forward. What did Harry miss out on learning because he wasted so much time? That could be significant as well.

No, they where wrong, you can only say this because you have more information than them and suspect some sort of plan, from their perspective they failed their friend. And even then let's not forget that thanks to Harry's suspicions and lack of absolute trust in Dumbledore (more than understandable from Harry's perspective, and healthy, Dumbledore should be treated like a person), there where more people fighting the death eaters that night (and thanks to felix felicis they where effective). From what we see from that battle Dumbledore measures where not near enough, he didn't know exactly what Malfoy was doing, just that he wanted to kill him. Many more people could have died that night.

Hermione and Ron only did the right thing if you consider distancing yourself and let others take responsability the right thing, it's a moral thing, completely independent of the results, they weren't like that before. Considering what they know about Harry and his situation I don't thing they did the right thing as friends. But that's it's a personal feeling. I find it hard to explain my thoughts on this. Harry, despite his past, everything that he has agaisnt him and his huge responsability and terrible destiny, never stops trying and fighting, and for that I would never think he failed. to me, and to Dumbledore for what he said, that he keeps fighting its his biggest victory. I think there is a big difference between Harry andboth his friends when judging their actions, the diference between knowing the road and actually walking it.

I was going to say that this was alittle off topic but I guess there is more to discuss about Ron and Hermione than their romantic feelings.

meesha1971

January 8th, 2007, 7:15 pm

No, they where wrong, you can only say this because you have more information than them and suspect some sort of plan, from their perspective they failed their friend. And even then let's not forget that thanks to Harry's suspicions and lack of absolute trust in Dumbledore (more than understandable from Harry's perspective, and healthy, Dumbledore should be treated like a person), there where more people fighting the death eaters that night (and thanks to felix felicis they where effective). From what we see from that battle Dumbledore measures where not near enough, he didn't know exactly what Malfoy was doing, just that he wanted to kill him. Many more people could have died that night.

No, they were right and they know that. Hermione told Harry that she did agree that Malfoy was up to something but there was nothing he could do about it. And she was right about that. She knew that then and she knows that now. There was no way for Harry to get into the Room of Requirement and she tried to tell him that. Harry wouldn't listen and he wasted valuable time in trying. Ron and Hermione both tried to tell him that, but he wouldn't listen to them.

They did not fail Harry. He failed himself because he was too stubborn to admit that he was wrong. Not that Malfoy was up to something, but that he could do anything about it. Dumbledore also told Harry to let it go and concentrate on more important matters and Harry didn't listen to him either. That's something Harry has to live with and, hopefully, he will take heed of that in the future.

In the end, Malfoy was irrelevant. There was no way that anyone could have prevented what happened. Malfoy used their own past schemes for inspiration - the Room of Requirement - the enchanted coins - even Fred and George's trick for getting love potions into the school. There was no way for Harry to get into the room to see what Malfoy was up to. Even if he had gotten into the room, he wouldn't have had any idea what Malfoy was doing because it was the hiding room - the one that was the size of a small city. It was pointless and Harry wasted time. He should have listened to Ron and Hermione.

As you said, Harry's suspicions did serve a good purpose and Ron and Hermione did not ignore him about it. They both agreed that Malfoy was up to something. When there was something that could be done, they acted. Ron, Ginny, and Neville kept a lookout at the Room of Requirement and Hermione and Luna kept an eye on Snape. That quick thinking prevented Malfoy and the Death Eaters from catching the Order by surprise. But all that time Harry spent trying to get into the Room or Requirement - or trying to find Malfoy on the map - that was just wasted because there was nothing he could do.

Trying to stay on topic - I don't think that will have any effect on how/when Ron and Hermione get together. Dumbledore's death will have more of an impact simply because it drives the point home that any of them could die at any time. The result of that will most likely be that they will not want to waste any more time and resolve the issues between them and get together.

sparkly

January 8th, 2007, 7:26 pm

No, they where wrong, you can only say this because you have more information than them and suspect some sort of plan, from their perspective they failed their friend. And even then let's not forget that thanks to Harry's suspicions and lack of absolute trust in Dumbledore (more than understandable from Harry's perspective, and healthy, Dumbledore should be treated like a person), there where more people fighting the death eaters that night (and thanks to felix felicis they where effective). From what we see from that battle Dumbledore measures where not near enough, he didn't know exactly what Malfoy was doing, just that he wanted to kill him. Many more people could have died that night.

Hermione and Ron only did the right thing if you consider distancing yourself and let others take responsability the right thing, it's a moral thing, completely independent of the results, they weren't like that before. Considering what they know about Harry and his situation I don't thing they did the right thing as friends. But that's it's a personal feeling. I find it hard to explain my thoughts on this. Harry, despite his past, everything that he has agaisnt him and his huge responsability and terrible destiny, never stops trying and fighting, and for that I would never think he failed. to me, and to Dumbledore for what he said, that he keeps fighting its his biggest victory. I think there is a big difference between Harry andboth his friends when judging their actions, the diference between knowing the road and actually walking it.

I was going to say that this was alittle off topic but I guess there is more to discuss about Ron and Hermione than their romantic feelings.

I think you might be saying that Ron and Hermione allowed themselves to be distracted by their personal issues during HBP while Harry remained focused on Voldermort and the Death Eaters. If so, I would agree with you. They need to put their personal lives aside, just as Harry did, and concentrate on finding and destroying the Horcruxes and helping Harry in his final confrontation.

Hermione and Ron, by not speaking to each other, deprived Harry of their assistance. Ron and Hermione are better together than apart, and during HBP they were definitely apart. They failed Harry in that respect because they paid too much attention to their own issues.

Ron and Hemrione need to resolve their differences quickly in book 7 so their relationship is no longer a distraction. Harry needs them to be focused on the task at hand, not squabbling over who kissed who. I think they've started that process, but there are still some lingering issues they need to discuss.

ronjalina

January 8th, 2007, 8:01 pm

I think you might be saying that Ron and Hermione allowed themselves to be distracted by their personal issues during HBP while Harry remained focused on Voldermort and the Death Eaters. If so, I would agree with you. They need to put their personal lives aside, just as Harry did, and concentrate on finding and destroying the Horcruxes and helping Harry in his final confrontation.

Hermione and Ron, by not speaking to each other, deprived Harry of their assistance. Ron and Hermione are better together than apart, and during HBP they were definitely apart. They failed Harry in that respect because they paid too much attention to their own issues.

Ron and Hemrione need to resolve their differences quickly in book 7 so their relationship is no longer a distraction. Harry needs them to be focused on the task at hand, not squabbling over who kissed who. I think they've started that process, but there are still some lingering issues they need to discuss.I agree. I would like to add that I don´t blame them for dealing with their own issues. They are not the hero and the heroine of this series but thankfully, JKR has written them as well-rounded three dimensional characters which have each their own character development.

I see it like this: Ron and Hermione do love each other and they want to be together. Not being together has caused the distraction for Ron and Hermione in HBP. Therefore, I think they have to resolve their issues, talk everything out and start a relationship, because that´s what these two want. As soon as they are together, the UT will decrease or even completely vanish. They will still bicker, but less in fervency and frequency. Anyway, their bickering never has been much of a problem for the main task at hand, IMO. It is the big fallouts that caused problems.

That´s the reason (or one of the reasons) why I think they will get together early in DH. No dragging it out any longer. While they won´t be able to date and do lot of the typical couply things other´s do (but Harry and Ginny couldn´t do that either), they can be together and draw confidence and strength from it.

RWeasleysgirl

January 8th, 2007, 9:23 pm

potterposse

January 8th, 2007, 10:01 pm

Exactly. Its an advantage...it wont change the fact that the world is a gloomy place, but it will make them have a stronger love towards each other.

ronjalina

January 9th, 2007, 7:00 pm

Ron and Hermione finally being together will definitely be an advantage. I don't think they will have a problem with focusing on the horcrux hunt and all that in Deathly Hallows, because their personal issues should be resolved by then, but in fairness I doubt they realized how hard it was on Harry to have them fighting. They were still trying to help him with what he needed to get done, just seperately.That´s what I wanted to say. If we presume they really have matured significantly by the end of HBP, and I think JKR has all three of them where she needs them to be able to achieve what has to be achieved by the end of HBP, Ron and Hermione will not let themselves get distracted from supporting Harry by their own issues. Because they will be resolved. And they won´t let themselves get distracted from supporting Harry by being a couple neither. They do know that they will not have the quality Ron/Hermione time like they would if there was no war going on and their best friend was not the "Chosen One". But they will still know how the other feels and that they belong together (and that they have to get some sense into Harry to correct his mistake of breaking up with Ginny :)

RWeasleysgirl

January 9th, 2007, 10:04 pm

That´s what I wanted to say. If we presume they really have matured significantly by the end of HBP, and I think JKR has all three of them where she needs them to be able to achieve what has to be achieved by the end of HBP, Ron and Hermione will not let themselves get distracted from supporting Harry by their own issues. Because they will be resolved. And they won´t let themselves get distracted from supporting Harry by being a couple neither. They do know that they will not have the quality Ron/Hermione time like they would if there was no war going on and their best friend was not the "Chosen One". But they will still know how the other feels and that they belong together (and that they have to get some sense into Harry to correct his mistake of breaking up with Ginny :)

Exactly. And it will be enough of a relief for them just to know that they will be able to really be together after everything is over with (if they both survive) they won't need to be all distracted by anything.

potterposse

January 9th, 2007, 11:10 pm

:agree: Then they could get married and live HAPPILY EVER AFTER! FOREVER AND EVER AND EVER AND EVER........
*Really, it'd be a relief to all of us...not just them. ;)*

meesha1971

January 10th, 2007, 1:40 am

RWeasleysgirl

January 10th, 2007, 9:24 pm

Er, welcome! Hopefully, if both of your predictions come true, their kids and Harry's and Ginny's will look very different.

potterposse

January 11th, 2007, 3:26 am

Wait, I just read this in the H/G thread, and before RWeasleygirl's post. :huh:

Well, I dont think Cho will be a chosen name. I think they will name one of thier kids Arthur (aww, how sweet to use your dads name) and one of them Billius *missspelled?* (then Ron as a middle name :P) for boys names. (Then Harry as well) Girls names, well they are somewhat trickier...guess they'll just give them names like Renee or Chelsey or Emily or Sara, or (if they want to do so, It'd be sweet) name one Molly.

I am naming fic. Characters kids....wow.......err......

RWeasleysgirl

January 11th, 2007, 3:28 am

You know, as long as we're on the subject of naming their kids, I would hope no one names anyone after other characters, unless said character is dead. Otherwise it's just wierd and confusing.

JimmyPotter

January 11th, 2007, 3:37 am

RWeasleysgirl

January 11th, 2007, 3:39 am

Ok, Portage, you might want to stop posting things like that over and over again, you're really not supposed to.

ronjalina

January 11th, 2007, 3:39 pm

You know, as long as we're on the subject of naming their kids, I would hope no one names anyone after other characters, unless said character is dead. Otherwise it's just wierd and confusing.Whatever it is, I´m pretty sure 'Lavender' is no option. :lol:

But we don´t know of course how far into the future JKR will lead us in the epilogue. If it´s only two or three years... okay, that´s enough for either pair to have at least one child. And I stick by my gut feeling...I think Ron and Hermione will have twin boys (maybe named Fabian and Gideon?) :relax:

portage

January 11th, 2007, 5:05 pm

I think that Ron and Hermione get married have kids all redheads. they are James ,Harry ,Albus,Lupin,Ron jr.,Bill ,Fred <george,Ginny ,Hermione jr.,Flure ,Tonks,Cho. they have ther wedding at hogwarts . :gryff:

sirena

January 11th, 2007, 5:06 pm

I think they'll definitely be together, and sometime in the future also get married. I don't believe they'll have many children though. Hermione seems a very ambitious person, she even said she's thinking of politics. And Ron, having felt very insecure about not being able to *beat* his brothers in anything (they already did everything, what could he possibly do to be better than them), probably wouldn't want the same fate for his children. I think 2, 3 the most, and not right away either. First Hermione has to bring the rights to house elves :)

Harry and Ginny though, that's a completely different story. Harry always wanted a big family, they'll probably have at least 5 children.

Deevo

January 11th, 2007, 9:19 pm

Whatever it is, I´m pretty sure 'Lavender' is no option. :lol:
Somehow I doubt it. :err:

But we don´t know of course how far into the future JKR will lead us in the epilogue. If it´s only two or three years... okay, that´s enough for either pair to have at least one child. And I stick by my gut feeling...I think Ron and Hermione will have twin boys (maybe named Fabian and Gideon?) :relax:
I don't know, I always got the impression that twins ran on the mother's side of the family so I thought that if twins made an appearance they might have been Harry and Ginny's and be named James and Sirius. :p

As for Ron and Hermione, I think they'd go down the middle. Hermione being an only child herself will want more than one and Ron being from a huge family won't want a tribe so I'm anticipating three of four. The image of Tim and Jill's three boys from Home Improvement come to mind.

RWeasleysgirl

January 11th, 2007, 9:24 pm

I don't know, I can see Ron wanting a big family. He complains a lot, but I think he loves his brothers.

potterposse

January 11th, 2007, 10:40 pm

I do to. Hermione I'd think would have a bundle of kids, since she's an only child.

Whatever it is, I´m pretty sure 'Lavender' is no option

:rotfl: Yeah, off the list.

setting: at home.
Hermione: (rubs stomach) I want her name to be important. I want it to mean something!
Ron: Hmmm...How about Lavender? As in the Flower?
Hermione: Funny you pick that name...Not as in ex. girlfriend? (jealous glares)
Ron: (odd look) Lavender who? The name just came to my head.
Hermione: Just came to your head, yeah, sure....
Ron: Well, I am sure the lavender I met was ugly. I married you, didnt I?
Hermione: WHAT IS THAT SUPPOSSED TO MEAN?
Ron: What? Its a complement!
Hermione: Prettier than your ugly ex. girlfriend? thats a compliment?
Ron: Well, yeah? I guess...look I meant you were pretty!
Hermione: Pretty? not....beautiful?
Ron: Same thing, right? Look I love you! Stop it...okay?
Hermione: I'll stop....*quieter* If you admit you remember Lav-Lav.
Ron: I really dont...Look, couldnt have been that good of a girl if I forgot her, right?
Hermione: if you did "forget" her....then yes, i guess.
Ron: good, then no...Lavender. (pause)I do love you.
Hermione: (smiles) I know you do.
(kiss)
Ron: (pauses)How about Rosmerta? that name sounds cool!
:rolleyes: :whistle:

RWeasleysgirl

January 12th, 2007, 12:22 am

Lol, cute Potterpose!

folly54

January 12th, 2007, 1:15 am

I do to. Hermione I'd think would have a bundle of kids, since she's an only child.

:rotfl: Yeah, off the list.

setting: at home.
Hermione: (rubs stomach) I want her name to be important. I want it to mean something!
Ron: Hmmm...How about Lavender? As in the Flower?
Hermione: Funny you pick that name...Not as in ex. girlfriend? (jealous glares)
Ron: (odd look) Lavender who? The name just came to my head.
Hermione: Just came to your head, yeah, sure....
Ron: Well, I am sure the lavender I met was ugly. I married you, didnt I?
Hermione: WHAT IS THAT SUPPOSSED TO MEAN?
Ron: What? Its a complement!
Hermione: Prettier than your ugly ex. girlfriend? thats a compliment?
Ron: Well, yeah? I guess...look I meant you were pretty!
Hermione: Pretty? not....beautiful?
Ron: Same thing, right? Look I love you! Stop it...okay?
Hermione: I'll stop....*quieter* If you admit you remember Lav-Lav.
Ron: I really dont...Look, couldnt have been that good of a girl if I forgot her, right?
Hermione: if you did "forget" her....then yes, i guess.
Ron: good, then no...Lavender. (pause)I do love you.
Hermione: (smiles) I know you do.
(kiss)
Ron: (pauses)How about Rosmerta? that name sounds cool!
:rolleyes: :whistle:

:lol:

jaymz

January 12th, 2007, 1:58 am

I believe they'll live happily ever after actually... And have a baby named Harry :D

meesha1971

January 12th, 2007, 3:08 am

Somehow I doubt it. :err:

Yeah, I don't see that suggestion coming across very well. I think Ron's had enough canaries and is smart enough not to mention that idea. :lol:

I don't know, I always got the impression that twins ran on the mother's side of the family so I thought that if twins made an appearance they might have been Harry and Ginny's and be named James and Sirius. :p

True, but we don't really know if there are any twins in Hermione's family anywhere. For all we know, her mom or dad could be a twin.

But, from what we know, it is more likely that Ginny would have twins.

As for Ron and Hermione, I think they'd go down the middle. Hermione being an only child herself will want more than one and Ron being from a huge family won't want a tribe so I'm anticipating three of four. The image of Tim and Jill's three boys from Home Improvement come to mind.

You, for all his posturing and complaining, Ron does love his family. So I can see him wanting a big family of his own - maybe not quite as big, but a good size family. Three or four is a pretty good size - but things don't always work out the way you plan. I don't think Arthur and Molly actually planned on having seven. :lol:

I do to. Hermione I'd think would have a bundle of kids, since she's an only child.

:rotfl: Yeah, off the list.

setting: at home.
Hermione: (rubs stomach) I want her name to be important. I want it to mean something!
Ron: Hmmm...How about Lavender? As in the Flower?
Hermione: Funny you pick that name...Not as in ex. girlfriend? (jealous glares)
Ron: (odd look) Lavender who? The name just came to my head.
Hermione: Just came to your head, yeah, sure....
Ron: Well, I am sure the lavender I met was ugly. I married you, didnt I?
Hermione: WHAT IS THAT SUPPOSSED TO MEAN?
Ron: What? Its a complement!
Hermione: Prettier than your ugly ex. girlfriend? thats a compliment?
Ron: Well, yeah? I guess...look I meant you were pretty!
Hermione: Pretty? not....beautiful?
Ron: Same thing, right? Look I love you! Stop it...okay?
Hermione: I'll stop....*quieter* If you admit you remember Lav-Lav.
Ron: I really dont...Look, couldnt have been that good of a girl if I forgot her, right?
Hermione: if you did "forget" her....then yes, i guess.
Ron: good, then no...Lavender. (pause)I do love you.
Hermione: (smiles) I know you do.
(kiss)
Ron: (pauses)How about Rosmerta? that name sounds cool!
:rolleyes: :whistle:

:rotfl: That's really good! You really should participate in the COS Writing Contest.

RWeasleysgirl

January 12th, 2007, 3:23 am

Maybe both parties will have seven kids... and maybe all the other boys will have a bunch of kids with their future wives... imagine the family reunions! Imagine the poor babysitters!!!!

JimmyPotter

January 12th, 2007, 4:25 am

My guess would be that Hermione would want 3 kids, only because that is how many Rowling herself has, and we all know that Hermione is in part based on Rowling.

Deevo

January 12th, 2007, 10:33 am

setting: at home.
Hermione: (rubs stomach) I want her name to be important. I want it to mean something!
Ron: Hmmm...How about Lavender? As in the Flower?
Hermione: Funny you pick that name...Not as in ex. girlfriend? (jealous glares)
Ron: (odd look) Lavender who? The name just came to my head.
Hermione: Just came to your head, yeah, sure....
Ron: Well, I am sure the lavender I met was ugly. I married you, didnt I?
Hermione: WHAT IS THAT SUPPOSSED TO MEAN?
Ron: What? Its a complement!
Hermione: Prettier than your ugly ex. girlfriend? thats a compliment?
Ron: Well, yeah? I guess...look I meant you were pretty!
Hermione: Pretty? not....beautiful?
Ron: Same thing, right? Look I love you! Stop it...okay?
Hermione: I'll stop....*quieter* If you admit you remember Lav-Lav.
Ron: I really dont...Look, couldnt have been that good of a girl if I forgot her, right?
Hermione: if you did "forget" her....then yes, i guess.
Ron: good, then no...Lavender. (pause)I do love you.
Hermione: (smiles) I know you do.
(kiss)
Ron: (pauses)How about Rosmerta? that name sounds cool!
:rolleyes: :whistle:
:clap: Oh my, that was priceless. :rotfl:

ronjalina

January 12th, 2007, 6:37 pm

potterposse, that was hilarious. :rotfl:

I don't know, I always got the impression that twins ran on the mother's side of the family so I thought that if twins made an appearance they might have been Harry and Ginny's and be named James and Sirius. :pI´m not that much into genetics. Is it really impossible? Idk, I just love the image of Ron and Hermione finding out they expect twin boys and Ron´s reaction to it. :lol: Most probably he´ll faint.

Yeah, I don't see that suggestion coming across very well. I think Ron's had enough canaries and is smart enough not to mention that idea. :lol:Well, Hermione could counter with the suggestion to name their son Viktor.

You, for all his posturing and complaining, Ron does love his family. So I can see him wanting a big family of his own - maybe not quite as big, but a good size family. Three or four is a pretty good size - but things don't always work out the way you plan. I don't think Arthur and Molly actually planned on having seven. :lol:I also think that Ron, despite his complaints once in a while, does love his family and I can imagine he would feel a bit weird in a small family. He is used to live with many people, first at the Burrow, later at Hogwarts. Hermione would want more than one, I´m sure. Lets JKR surprise us with what she has planned for them. As I said in my previous post, maybe she doesn´t even go so far into the future in her epilogue.

RWeasleysgirl

January 12th, 2007, 9:14 pm

Well, Hermione could counter with the suggestion to name their son Viktor.

Or Cormac. lol

potterposse

January 12th, 2007, 9:58 pm

Thanks everyone! :blush:

Maybe both parties will have seven kids... and maybe all the other boys will have a bunch of kids with their future wives... imagine the family reunions! Imagine the poor babysitters!!!!
:lol: OMG! That would be so great! :rotfl: yeah...poor babysitters!

Or Cormac. lol

:lol:

RWeasleysgirl

January 12th, 2007, 10:00 pm

They'd have to rent out a daycare center...

potterposse

January 12th, 2007, 11:29 pm

lol! :rotfl:

Imagine a family reunion at Chucky Cheese with all those kids!

RWeasleysgirl

January 12th, 2007, 11:31 pm

Birthday parties!!!! Ugh, and there'd be one every weekend!

meesha1971

January 13th, 2007, 12:40 am

Well, 7 is a magical number. ;)

Let's see - 7 Weasley children get married and they all have 7 kids each.

49 grandchildren for Arthur and Molly. Yep, a birthday every week is very possible. Add in the adults birthdays and you've got quite a few parties to attend each year.

Wow - the Weasley family is capable of building up the population of wizards all by themselves! :wow:

Jessica

January 13th, 2007, 12:42 am

Any way we could get this back on a slightly more serious track?

RWeasleysgirl

January 13th, 2007, 12:46 am

That would be more than one birthday every week if you count the adults...

*sigh* if you insist, Jessica

potterposse

January 13th, 2007, 2:09 am

Wow. A lot of Birthdays...cant complain, get cake and Ice cream all the time! :D

Technically we were on topic...with the whole kids thing...;) kind of...welll...no. :shrug: fine, back on topic. :err:.

RWeasleysgirl

January 13th, 2007, 3:34 am

We were on topic. Ron and Hermione's kids would be part of their future, which is what "Where To From Here?" is all about. But there are many more serious things we could talk about...

potterposse

January 15th, 2007, 10:57 pm

I suppose. but the kids are fun to talk about. :whistle:

I just cant wait for DH! I cant take the waiting much longer!:argh:

ronjalina

January 16th, 2007, 4:31 pm

I suppose. but the kids are fun to talk about. :whistle:

I just cant wait for DH! I cant take the waiting much longer!:argh:Nor can I. :relax:

I am still for the train as a possible scenario for Ron and Hermione to FINALLY get together. The more I read on other threads, dealing with other scenarios, the more I am convinced DH will begin at Hogwarts and there will something important (for the main plot mind you :) ) happen. Not an attack, but Harry finding out something. Talking to McGonagall again. Maybe even talking to Dumbledore´s portrait. Saying good-bye to Hagrid. That means we will be well into the book, until Harry and friends enter the Hogwarts Express. And Ron and Hermione will have had some time on their own probably to .... talk. Ah, well, if they talk about something incredibly important Horcrux related, it is still possible JKR will give us a few paragraphs from their pov. They will be in a good-bye mood. Good-bye from Hogwarts. Especially Hermione, I can imagine, will be very sentimental about not returning (as she will think at that point in the story) to her beloved library. Maybe Ron can comfort her. He has some routine with that by now. :)

potterposse

January 16th, 2007, 10:09 pm

ronjalina

January 16th, 2007, 10:27 pm

I think the very beggining would be good, and its reasonable. But the wedding is also another good spot, for witnesses among family members. Both senarios I think are great..If at the train , there will have to be another R/Hr moment for the wedding...I am a both-er for that reason.
Well, in that regard, I´m a both-er as well. Even if Ron and Hermione get together on the train (or at the Dursleys, would be for once a good thing happening at Privet Drive 4, wouldn´t it?), they have to out their relationship publicly so to say. I don´t want to suggest there would be some kind of announcement, but the family will catch on the fact that they are together. It will be... I don´t know how to describe it, obvious is not the right word...noticeable, yes noticeable seems to be best for the moment. It will be noticeable that they are a couple. Not because they will kiss publicly (although, I wouldn´t object to it :) ), but how they behave around each other. I definately reckon with Molly sensing it. And as soon as the twins realize it, well, maybe they will surprise us with hitherto unknown seriousness. I mean, Ron has now fought DEs twice and survived, doesn´t he deserve some respect from them by now? :lol:

RWeasleysgirl

January 16th, 2007, 10:36 pm

Lol, I would hate to see Fred and George not react to it. I man, I wouldn't consider what they do disrespect, just fun. But anyway, I definitely agree. I doubt they would try to hide their feelings any longer, and really, after all these years, they shouldn't have to.

lovenogood

January 16th, 2007, 11:08 pm

Well, in that regard, I´m a both-er as well. Even if Ron and Hermione get together on the train (or at the Dursleys, would be for once a good thing happening at Privet Drive 4, wouldn´t it?), they have to out their relationship publicly so to say. I don´t want to suggest there would be some kind of announcement, but the family will catch on the fact that they are together. It will be... I don´t know how to describe it, obvious is not the right word...noticeable, yes noticeable seems to be best for the moment. It will be noticeable that they are a couple. Not because they will kiss publicly (although, I wouldn´t object to it :) ), but how they behave around each other. I definately reckon with Molly sensing it. And as soon as the twins realize it, well, maybe they will surprise us with hitherto unknown seriousness. I mean, Ron has now fought DEs twice and survived, doesn´t he deserve some respect from them by now? :lol:

Here is how I would like it to happen:

The book starts at Horgwarts just after the funeral, Harry comes back to the gryffindor place and walk on the 2 kissing, I'm not saying a huge snogging session just a shy kiss. Afterall R and Hr were very close at the funeral so a kiss can say slip (but a snogging session would be kinda rude). I would say only Harry knows at that point (maybe Neville). Then on the train they discuss the Krum/Lav-Lav thing and end up blushing heavily though nothing more. This way Ginny might have an idea but can't be sure. Then they go direct to the Dursleys, at that point R and Hr sort of settle they relationship more (become more open) it can be made with very few words actually. Then come the wedding and there they come out publicly as you say. And of course Fred/George/Ginny teasing will be priceless

JimmyPotter

January 17th, 2007, 2:02 am

I would rather see Ron and Hermione make it official at Bill and Fleur's wedding. Maybe Krum will be dancing with Hermione and Ron walks up to them. Harry is concerned that Ron will make a scene. Instead, Ron politely asks if he may cut in. Krum graciously bows out and Ron starts dancing with Hermione. Krum then goes up to Harry and says something to the effect that Ron and Hermione are made for each other. At that point Ron and Hermione share their first kiss.

ronjalina

January 17th, 2007, 6:49 pm

To be honest, lovenogood and JimmyPotter, I love both of your scenarios. I always said, whatever it takes for these two to get finally together, I will be glad. :lol:

RWeasleysgirl

January 17th, 2007, 9:19 pm

I like both scenarios as well. Though I would say Luna is more perceptive than Neville, she would probably figure it out before he would, despite her absense up until book five. She probably wouldn't even realize it ws a secret, though. I love the scenario that Luna would create one of her signature awkward moments, which would result in the revealing of Ron and Hermione's feelings.

hermyweasly

January 18th, 2007, 12:41 pm

I think Ginny will tell Fred and George about them in the wedding and also if the danced together, I think Mrs Weasley will notice that..

RWeasleysgirl

January 18th, 2007, 9:15 pm

I'm not sure how Ginny will tell Fred and George about them unless she witnesses something first.

potterposse

January 19th, 2007, 6:30 pm

ronjalina

January 19th, 2007, 6:50 pm

She'll probably just stand in a temorary shock, then get exiceted and congratulate them..then tell her two "favorite" brothers.

If she does know, she might get in a little stage of jealousy, because they are together, then that will lead to her and Harry getting on an arguement about how they should/n't be together...though that would probably happen anyway even if she didnt know and just found out....I am really not sure about Ginny´s reaction. She is completely clueless about Ron and Hermione at the moment, IMO. She likes Hermione much and I think she wouldn´t object to her being with Ron. But it is still possible she would be a bit "Why him?". I mean, being friends with each other is one thing, being in love on top of that another. So, while Ginny has no problems accepting that Hermione wants to be friends with Ron, she could have difficulty to understand why Hermione would be romantically interested in him. On the other hand, Ginny has taken the Won-Won/Lav-Lav thing quite stoically. Other than making a mock remark about his kissing technique and telling the twins about it, she didn´t seem to spare additional thoughts to it. Therefore, after the first shock is over, she will be glad about it.

I don´t think Ron and Hermione finally being a couple will lead Ginny to debate with Harry. She is not that kind of girl, IMO. She seemed to be very understanding at the end of HBP. She knows that Harry has to do things his own way. That does not mean, she would not try more subtly to convince him of getting back together. I just don´t think she would get jealous about Ron and Hermione (maybe a bit sentimental), and I don´t think she would argue with Harry about it.

jam1

January 19th, 2007, 7:44 pm

This has probably been discussed already but what do you think will be the order of the events after HBP? The way Ron says it, it seems that the wedding of Bill and Fleur will be very soon.. do you think it's before Harry even goes back to visit the Dursleys?

As for Ginny, I think she's pretty clueless about Ron & Hermione, everything points to that IMO. It'll be fun to see her reaction when they inevitably get together.

RWeasleysgirl

January 19th, 2007, 9:22 pm

ronjalina

January 20th, 2007, 5:49 pm

I doubt seeing Ron and Hermione will provoke any jealousy. Ginny would be happy for them.

Jam, I think that the Dursleys will probably come first, mainly because of Ron's wording at the end of HBP. Harry lists all the things he wants to do, starting with the Dursleys and then Godric's Hollow, and Ron and Hermione say that they will accompany him to his Aunt and Uncle's, and then go wherever else he plans to go, but they would have to attend Bill and Fleur's wedding before even Godric's Hollow. Since Godric's Hollow is not the first thing on the agenda, that would imply that they will be going to the Dursleys before the wedding.That´s how I see it as well. I guess, Harry has to go back to the Dursleys before his 17th birthday to renew the blood protection. And I think he wants to get that out of the way before he does anything else. Plus, from a dramatization point of view it would be best: Dursleys - Burrow (wedding) - Godric´s Hollow. At the latest, the very latest, when they go to GH, Ron and Hermione will have resolved their issues and be together. I don´t see much of romance in DH generally, the open question will be when Harry and Ginny get back together, and I am inclined to think that will be around the middle of the book. Ron and Hermione have to be resolved early, for all of them (and us readers :lol: ) to concentrate on Horcruxes, founders, Hallows, deathly or not, all the additional information we will get, and the defeat of Tom Riddle.

HHr4eva

January 20th, 2007, 6:10 pm

graceful_me

January 20th, 2007, 8:07 pm

cgold

January 20th, 2007, 9:14 pm

Here is how I would like it to happen:

The book starts at Horgwarts just after the funeral, Harry comes back to the gryffindor place and walk on the 2 kissing, I'm not saying a huge snogging session just a shy kiss. Afterall R and Hr were very close at the funeral so a kiss can say slip (but a snogging session would be kinda rude). I would say only Harry knows at that point (maybe Neville). Then on the train they discuss the Krum/Lav-Lav thing and end up blushing heavily though nothing more. This way Ginny might have an idea but can't be sure. Then they go direct to the Dursleys, at that point R and Hr sort of settle they relationship more (become more open) it can be made with very few words actually. Then come the wedding and there they come out publicly as you say. And of course Fred/George/Ginny teasing will be priceless
As much as I would wish it, I just don't see Ron and Hermione starting out that smoothly in Deathly Hallows no matter how much they've matured. However, it would certainly make my day if JK started out the book with them kissing. Would probably have to read the book the next day because I was so happy (well...not really).

Cheers :tu:

meesha1971

January 20th, 2007, 9:19 pm

Now wait just one minute...
JK might have said this and that, and you might have 6 books of quotes and theories to back it up with, but don't count your chickens before they hatch...
R/Hr could happen, but might not last due to the glaring difference in the maturity of both characters...and JK said two main characters were destined to be dead...Ron could be one of them, or Hermione, which I'd not like to see, or the whole debate becomes pointless...

I'm just saying, on paper, it might look perfect for you, and it does for me, wanting HHr together, but let's not be rash...after all, the outcome is at the mercy of JK's quill...

The whole point of Ron dating Lavender in HBP was to give his character emotional growth and development. And I would disagree about the maturity differences being all that great anyway. Hermione has not handled everything very maturely either. By the end of HBP, they are fairly equal in that regard and have both matured to the point where they're ready for a committed relationship. The trials and tribulations that they have gone through before even becoming a couple will serve to make their relationship even stronger.

And then we have the dinner party question from the reading in New York last August. Jo slipped up there. They asked which characters she would invite to dinner and she immediately named Harry, Ron, and Hermione. Then she hestitated and Stephen King suggested Hagrid - to which she responded that she knew who was going to die. She was told it could be anyone and she added Hagrid and Dumbledore. That revealed that she thought the question was asking about survivors. Since she rattled off the trio immediately, the implication is that the three of them will survive. Doesn't look very good for Hagrid though. :(

As far as main characters - according to Jo, there are 40 main characters. That would include Hagrid, Molly, Arthur, the twins, Percy, etc... And, because that statement was made in regards to changes she had to make to the final chapter - which she wrote 15 years ago while working on PS/SS - she could be referring to a death that has already occurred - that goes for the reprieve as well. We won't know for sure until DH is released, but I think the trio is safe.

Even if Ron did die in DH, it wouldn't really change anything. Harry and Hermione would still be incompatible romantically and not attracted to each other. Without Ron as the "hub", they would be hard pressed to maintain a friendship. His death could possibly serve to drive a wedge between them.

In the wake of HBP's release and the Mugglenet/TLC interview, it was questioned why Jo would shut down the shipping debates when there was still one book to go. Some questioned the validity since she had allowed the shipping debates to go on for several years - and seemed to enjoy them. It wasn't long before things came back around to "she's just trying to mislead", etc...

However, Jo gives us the answer herself when she said that she would allow lines of speculation that were entertaining and fun, but shut down any line of speculation that was not productive. The shipping debates had become unproductive and were producing bad feelings on both sides. This was compounded by excessive character bashing - specifically towards Ron and Ginny - with Ron getting the worst of it. In that same interview, Jo said that the abuse that Ron's character suffered at the hands of certain fans disturbed her. So that's our answer. Jo ended it and told us who the couples were going to be because it was no longer productive and she was disturbed by all the Ron bashing.

Jo has never lied to the readers. She wasn't vague about that at all and very clearly said that Ron and Hermione will be a couple. HBP was the set up to reveal that - along with Harry/Ginny - and DH will tie it all up. There will be too much going on in DH for Jo to change it all up and rewrite the romances. DH will not be an episode of "Hogwarts Creek" or "The Young and the Magical" with the romances getting turned around and shifted. There simply isn't time for it. Jo put her efforts into building Ron and Hermione up as a couple from PS/SS. It's too late to turn around and change that now. It wouldn't be believable and it would take away from the main plot. DH will tie the romances up quickly from the existing build up and then move on. Ron and Hermione will get together in the beginning and Harry and Ginny will get back together somewhere around the middle or end.

cgold

January 20th, 2007, 9:26 pm

Ron and Hermione will get together in the beginning and Harry and Ginny will get back together somewhere around the middle or end.I haven't been following the thread so maybe this has been answered before but why are you now convinced that Ron and Hermione will get together in the beginning of the book. I'm still inclined to believe that a viable scenario is that they will come to an understanding during the book but not really get together until the end.

Cheers :tu:

RWeasleysgirl

January 20th, 2007, 9:57 pm

cgold

January 20th, 2007, 10:12 pm

Well, we have many reasons to believe this, but mainly because it's just time. Their getting together has been drawn out for a very long time for important reasons, character development, believability, etc. but now, they're ready. At the end of Half-Blood Prince they were so close to being a couple, it would be pointless, and even redundant to have them go over the same issues and prolong their waiting even further. They have reached a point where they don't need a big event to provoke their getting together, they're right there. The longer these feelings go hidden the more difficult their journey will be, their lives will be. It's hard to focus when you have something like that to hide, and that's probably what's caused a lot of their bickering: unresolved sexual tension, that UST we keep referring to. Not that they won't bicker when it becomes resolved, but it shouldn't be nearly as bad as it was before. There is no good reason for it to wait until the end.I guess I just don't think Ron and Hermione are there yet. I'm sure they'll not be handling everything as badly as they did in HBP and GoF but I do expect some sort of friction before they can finally admit their feelings. It would just seem weird if it went easily for them because it hasn't been easy for them so far. I guess I would find that a little unexpected. I'm not saying it couldn't happen or won't happen just that it's not how I would expect it to happen.

Cheers :tu:

RWeasleysgirl

January 20th, 2007, 10:29 pm

Well, the purpose of whole Lavendar fiasco, and Ron's near-death experience was to get them there. There very well may be some kind of heated discussion about that to push them together, but they have become much more respectful and appreciative of each other by the end of HBP, (if you read the rest of the thread you will see a lot of discussion on that subject) so I think they will just be ready to accept each other regardless of the past. Ron is over whatever Hermione did or didn't do with Viktor, and I think Ron's being poisoned terrified Hermione and really put things into perspective for her. Not to mention Dumbledore's sudden death, that's the kind of thing that makes people realize that life can be short (ok, he was about 150, but you know what I mean) and that if you keep putting things off for tomorrow, eventually tomorrow won't come. So that's why I think they won't need a push, they're ready.

meesha1971

January 20th, 2007, 11:56 pm

HHr4eva

January 21st, 2007, 1:30 am

meesha, you're right...ron did receive a lot of bad press and bashing from certain shippers, but it's a fact that both sides have their rotten eggs...I should reveal some ugly words said towards harmony, but I'm above such nonsense...

and another thing...JK is known to be misleading in her interviews, and just because she said it'll be R/Hr should be no comfort...my message is, don't be so rash to eat out of her hand, because she could be feeding you poison and lull you into a false sense of security...
I do remember one shipper I no longer keep in contact with, but she was a fervent Neville/Luna supporter...not sure why, but when JK disproved that ship with a dreaded "No", she was quite upset, and ever since...no bone nor hide of her...
I'm just saying, be prepared for disappointment if things happen to go out of track...

Like when I was expecting HHr to get together in HBP, but quite the opposite happened...and that proves JK's irregularity in her books...a twist out of nowhere that derails logic in every sense...

RWeasleysgirl

January 21st, 2007, 1:35 am

Jo can mislead us, yes, but she's never flat-out lied to us. She told us forever ago that Harry/Hermione wasn't going to happen. She straight out said it, and more recently she flat out said that it's Ron and Hermione. Jo's books are some of the most regular I have ever met, and she's shown little or no evidence supporting a relationship between Harry and Hermione. It was not a twist, at all, that Ron and Hermione got so much closer in HBP, the majority of the readers have been expecting it for a long time now.

And remember, this is NOT a shipping discussion. If you do not believe in their relationship, fine, but if you are going to post on this board then you are supposed to be talking about what will happen to Ron and Hermione in Deathly Hallows, not whether we should rely on Jo's word or not.

meesha1971

January 21st, 2007, 2:29 am

meesha, you're right...ron did receive a lot of bad press and bashing from certain shippers, but it's a fact that both sides have their rotten eggs...I should reveal some ugly words said towards harmony, but I'm above such nonsense...

It was the Ron bashing that Jo addressed specifically - she said that really bothered her. But it was getting unproductive on both sides and that was why she ended it.

and another thing...JK is known to be misleading in her interviews, and just because she said it'll be R/Hr should be no comfort...my message is, don't be so rash to eat out of her hand, because she could be feeding you poison and lull you into a false sense of security...
I do remember one shipper I no longer keep in contact with, but she was a fervent Neville/Luna supporter...not sure why, but when JK disproved that ship with a dreaded "No", she was quite upset, and ever since...no bone nor hide of her...
I'm just saying, be prepared for disappointment if things happen to go out of track...

Yes, Jo can be misleading or vague in answers. But she doesn't directly lie. This was not a misleading or vague answer. She gave a direct answer and when she gives a direct answer, we know she is telling the truth.

Jo shot down H/Hr years ago when she said that they were platonic friends. But the same thing occurred - claims that she was just trying to mislead - pulling out dictionaries to define platonic. She was being straight with us then and she was straight with us in the Mugglenet/TLC interview. She never had any intention of putting Harry and Hermione together and never laid any clues towards that. It was always supposed to be Ron and Hermione.

When the author says that people need to re-read because they misinterpreted, the meaning is clear. It's Ron and Hermione. That's how she planned it from the beginning and she planted the clues accordingly.

Like when I was expecting HHr to get together in HBP, but quite the opposite happened...and that proves JK's irregularity in her books...a twist out of nowhere that derails logic in every sense...

Well, I never expected that because there was never anything in the books to point to it. No attraction - no jealousy - incompatible personalities. That would be such a disaster. They wouldn't last a day and would end up hating each other. They make good friends as long as they have Ron to run interference, but that's about it.

Ron/Hermione didn't come out of nowhere. Jo has been building that relationship up since PS/SS. She showed that they have a different dynamic in their relationship from the beginning. Ron cares about Hermione for more than her ability to help with homework or the fight against Voldemort. He worries about her - if she's eating right or getting enough sleep or working too hard. He notices the little things that Harry doesn't - like when she got her teeth fixed. They are attracted to each other - they get jealous - they're personalities are almost identical. They've weathered trials and tribulations that end relationships and come through it with a stronger bond between them.

HHr4eva

January 21st, 2007, 2:48 am

hoopsterdiva42

January 21st, 2007, 2:59 am

more skirmishes...they already fight like an old couple, why they just don't make it official is beyond me but all the same, they could very well go out:tu:

meesha1971

January 21st, 2007, 4:02 am

Hmm, the type of relationship HHr are in...how can I describe that...
ok, I'll try it a different way...

Harry likes to stay out of the spotlight...numerous times has he said how he hates to be the center of attention...
Hermione has a similar tendency...she likes her privacy too

Not quite accurate. Harry enjoys the spotlight when he has earned it. He doesn't like being the center of attention just for being "the chosen one" or people thinking he was Slytherin's heir. But he quite enjoys the attention he gets from doing well at Quidditch and had fantasies of the whole school cheering for him in the tournament.

and you get two people, whose deep friendship isn't quite so obvious...well, except to them...hermione is the first person harry runs to when he has a problem or a question...
she helps him out, and he does too...not as often, but it's there...

Also not accurate - Ron and Hermione are who Harry turn to when he has a problem. He thinks of them both on equal terms.

Which is another sign of friendship and not romantic compatibility. Harry has always looked at Hermione as someone to help him with school work or Voldemort. He often takes advantage of that. Hermione talks down to Harry and treats him like a child - she behaves like a parent towards him. And that is where the conflict comes from.

both of them together make an amazing force to reckon with...she works out details, he puts it together and acts...often with her on his side...on some occasions, there's no ron ;)

Definitely not. The three of them together are a force to be reckoned with. When Ron's not around - not so good. Hermione didn't do anything in POA. She had the time turner, but she hid in the woods and in Hagrid's cabin while Harry did all the work. In OOTP, she fell apart and nearly got Harry killed with her scheme to lure Umbridge to the Centaurs. They were extremely lucky that Grawp showed up when he did. And then they were stuck in the forest unarmed. And Harry called Hermione on her mistake and pointed out what a bad plan that was. But Ron came to the rescue there - having led the escape from the Inquisitor squad and bringing them their wands.

Hermione is good with advance planning and research. She's really bad at thinking on her feet and coming up with something on the fly. That is where Ron is needed because that is his strength.

They argue rarely, but when they do, it's about something that truly matters...in ootp, it was about a person's life...not something useless and trivial, as it's often the case with R/Hr...

The only reason they don't argue is because Harry avoids it like the plague. He agrees with Ron the majority of the time but chooses to stay out of it because he doesn't want to argue.

And that's not a healthy relationship. It leads to Harry lying to her - ignoring her - and avoiding her simply to avoid confrontation. Issues build up and eventually he just explodes in anger.

to conclude, they're much more in step with one another...she can read his moods better than anyone else, and they can't even lie to each other...tell me, isn't that worth something in a relationship? jealousy doesn't even have a place...or it does...when Harry's with another girl ;)

They lie to each other all the time. Harry lied to Hermione about using the cloak to go to Hogsmeade in POA - he lied to her about figuring out the egg clue in GOF - he lied to her and Ron about what was really bothering him in OOTP and let them think it was Cho - just to name a few. Hermione doesn't know when Harry is lying and Harry doesn't know when Hermione is lying. It was Ron who figured out that Hermione was keeping something from them in POA - not Harry.

Jealousy is a literary device used to show attraction. We know that Ron and Hermione are attracted to each other because they get jealous. Ron gets jealous of Krum and McLaggen - Hermione gets jealous of Fleur, Padma, and Lavender. We know that Harry and Hermione are not attracted to each other because they don't care if the other one dates. Hermione didn't get jealous of Cho and tried to help Harry work that out. She didn't get jealous of Ginny and was thrilled when they got together. Harry could care less if Hermione kissed Krum or McLaggen or anyone else.

This is part of the reason why they are not compatible. It would not be a healthy relationship because Harry would lie - ignore - and avoid her simply to avoid confrontation. It would get to the point where being in the same room with her would be an irritation because small issues would build up into big issues. This is one of the main causes of divorce - no communication at all.

R/Hr would be much too...wild. Ron'd flaunt Hermione around and be loud about his relationship...and Hermione isn't the type to enjoy snogging in front of everyone...she also requires finesse, which, forgive me, ron just doesn't have...

:lol: It was Lavender who initiated the public displays - not Ron. Ron got sick of it and it became an embarrassment that she behaved that way.

Hermione doesn't require finesse. She requires honesty. Ron will always be honest with her and will never lie just to avoid confrontation.

and arguing? It'd be like a dog versus a cat...before long, Hermione'll want to talk about something important, and ron's reaction...no different. Then follows the silent treatment, more fighting, and before long...a breakup.

No, that's called a healthy relationship. You get issues out in the open - argue if need be - and resolve them. That is what Ron and Hermione do. Ron doesn't shirk away from discussing things that are important and, for the most part, Ron and Hermione agree on what's important. What they don't agree on, they argue about and eventually resolve.

Why should she go through all of that? I think Hermione'd prefer stability and peace with the occasional adrenaline adventure rather than being in a useless relationship...

Boring, dull, and unhealthy. Stability and peace mean nothing when they come from lying, ignoring, and avoiding important issues just to avoid an argument.

I think Hermione deserves someone who will always be honest with her no matter what - even at the risk of an argument. She needs someone who can stand toe to toe with her and challenge her because she thrives on confrontation. Harry can't give her that because he hates confrontation and does whatever he can to avoid it. She deserves someone who cares about her well being and not just what she can do for him. She deserves the guy who will make sure she eats right and doesn't work too hard. She deserves the guy who loves her and is attracted to her. Because those are the things that really matter in a relationship. Adventures won't hold a relationship together any more than lies will.

jam1

January 21st, 2007, 4:04 am

and another thing...JK is known to be misleading in her interviews, and just because she said it'll be R/Hr should be no comfort...my message is, don't be so rash to eat out of her hand, because she could be feeding you poison and lull you into a false sense of security...

I've never noticed her trying to mislead.

Like when I was expecting HHr to get together in HBP, but quite the opposite happened...and that proves JK's irregularity in her books...a twist out of nowhere that derails logic in every sense...

JK flat out said that the relationship between Harry and Hermione is only platonic but there's something more between Hermione and Ron. And the events in the books only supported this. There have be no "twists out of nowhere". I honestly think people who thought HHr any chance before HBP were seriously deluding themselves. I mean, from GoF and onwards it was obvious that JK will pair Ron and Hermione and even before that there were heavy hints that this is *the* couple.

blimie

January 21st, 2007, 4:32 am

For me...I think it would be sort of a let down if they were "just together" in the first part of the seventh book. I have enjoyed thier fights and tension in all of the books begining with ss and i feel it would be a bummer if there was not a big romantic revelation (they deserve it too) to finally join them together as boyfriend/girlfiend :love:

ronjalina

January 21st, 2007, 7:28 pm

I guess I just don't think Ron and Hermione are there yet. I'm sure they'll not be handling everything as badly as they did in HBP and GoF but I do expect some sort of friction before they can finally admit their feelings. It would just seem weird if it went easily for them because it hasn't been easy for them so far. I guess I would find that a little unexpected. I'm not saying it couldn't happen or won't happen just that it's not how I would expect it to happen.

Cheers :tu:I personally think they are there already. As others have said, they were so very close at the end of HBP. They even behaved like a couple already. Okay, I admit, they have always shown couply behaviour, speaking for each other ('us', 'we'), completing each others sentences, bicker like an old-married couple, cooperating .... But Ron asking Hermione for admission to beat up Percy has a special quality, IMO. :lol:

I don´t think Ron and Hermione getting together at the beginning of DH would come unexpected. I mean, we have seen it coming for a few books now. Their behaviour towards each other has already changed after the poisoning. This was a turning point experience for both of them. They bicker less, I can´t even remember if they bickered at all after that. They have replaced their fierce fighting with gentle teasing. Hermione is much more supportive and appreciating towards Ron, she even compliments him.

From a narrative point of view it would make no sense to prolong it either, IMO. Dragging out their getting together would become a bit unbelievable. They have had two big fights and a blazing row, and dealt with it. They have had their mutual jealousy, and dealt with it, although the issues of Krum and Lavender still have to be addressed.
I don´t see JKR reiterating the jealousy plot device. I don´t see her coming up with yet another misunderstanding. And what purpose within the plot would it serve to do that? Harry needs both, Ron and Hermione, to fully support him in his quest. That is what DH will be about, searching for the Horcruxes and defeating Voldemort. Ron and Hermione need to resolve their issues, to resolve the tension, to be able to concentrate on Harry. I think JKR has dealt with romance in HBP, that was her romance book (hasn´t she even said this somewhere in and interview?). I don´t see much romance in DH, a little, but not much, and most of it will deal with Harry and Ginny. Dragging out the Ron and Hermione romance will put too much emphasis on this issue, IMO. Therefore, I reckon it will happen sometime at the beginning. Not the first two or three chapters, but more to the beginning than the middle of the book.
It will not go easy, but it will 'go' early. :love:

Deevo

January 21st, 2007, 8:48 pm

I haven't been following the thread so maybe this has been answered before but why are you now convinced that Ron and Hermione will get together in the beginning of the book. I'm still inclined to believe that a viable scenario is that they will come to an understanding during the book but not really get together until the end.

Cheers :tu:
Well I can't speak for anyone else but I agree with Meesha that we'll see some resolution between them fairly early on in the piece. Why do I see it that way, well there are a few reasons. (The following is all IMO of course)

I feel that both Ron and Hermione are now aware that they have feelings for the other.
I also feel that they may currently feel that the other had feelings for them but they are uncertain as to whether or not these feelings are still present. Ron because he realises he's hurt Hermione severely with the Lavender debacle and may feel he's 'blown his chance'. Hermione because she feels that Ron may not find her attractive, again following the Lavender debacle.
I think that Ron in particular, given his established tactical accumen, is going to realise that they can't go forward with what they are planning to do with this level of tension unresolved. Even if he doesn't anticipate a positive outcome I think he'll tell Hermione how he feels toward her, maybe as early as on the train home but almost certainly before or at the wedding.
Such a declaration from him will almost certainly result in them 'making it official' which will I think be of inestimal aid to Harry in what he needs to do as with that final obstacle between them out of the way they'll prove themselves to be a formidable couple in the making.

I guess I just don't think Ron and Hermione are there yet. I'm sure they'll not be handling everything as badly as they did in HBP and GoF but I do expect some sort of friction before they can finally admit their feelings. It would just seem weird if it went easily for them because it hasn't been easy for them so far. I guess I would find that a little unexpected. I'm not saying it couldn't happen or won't happen just that it's not how I would expect it to happen.

Cheers :tu:
I think Jo has played out the Ron / Hermione 'friction'. Yes they'll still bicker, it's their main means of communicating, but I don't think there'll be (if there ever really was) any friction in said bickering. In the six books to date they've had only two real fights, Cat/Rat in Prisoner of Azkeban and Yule brawl/Lav Lav (I still consider these two halves of the same deferred blue) in Goblet of Fire and Half Blood Prince. They've been all but an old married couple in the way they relate since they were in first year, what more do they need to do?

I've always been convinced that they would get together in the beginning - at least by the wedding, if not before. At this point, Jo would be scraping the bottom of the barrel to keep them apart. Another misunderstanding would not be believable. A series of interruptions could work as a temporary measure, but not for very long. Ron and Hermione are too close at the end of HBP for it to be believable that they don't get together soon.

Now, I'm not talking about together in the sense of going out on dates - flowers and chocolate frogs - and so on. But they'll reveal their feelings and at least one kiss will be shown on page. Being a couple won't interfere with what needs to be done. We'll probably see some minor changes in their behavior towards each other - holding hands - cuddling is possible - maybe a kiss goodnight here and there. Just those little intimate details that show they are a couple.

They'll put serious dating, etc... on hold until it's all over, but that doesn't stop them from being a couple. Going out on dates is not what makes two people a couple. It's the feelings involved and how they behave towards each other. There's no reason for them to put that on hold - and every reason for them not to because they could be killed during all this and they know it.

Well, I don't think it will be easy. I don't see them just falling into each other's arms. But there really isn't much more Jo can do to drag it out as I said above.

I think there will be some awkwardness. Ron has to deal with the fact that he hurt Hermione and I'm sure he's wondering if he ruined his chances because of that. I think Hermione will be hesitant to make a move again - she took some initiative with the invitation to Slughorn's party and that backfired on her. And I think she knows that it's an important step for Ron to take the initiative this time. And they still need to resolve the whole Krum - Lavender issue - what happened, why, etc...

But they've reached the point where they're ready to do that. I don't think they'll need a push, but maybe a little nudge to get them moving. ;)
:agree: On the whole the players are in position, the moves leading up have been made and it's time for the final move.

RWeasleysgirl

January 23rd, 2007, 9:48 pm

I think they've realized that they're at a point by now where they really have nothing to lose. They both know how the other one feels, or at least did feel, and they know the other knows. I'm sure they've realized that their making a move should not compromise their friendship.

potterposse

January 23rd, 2007, 10:58 pm

exactly RWeasleysgirl.

RainyDays

January 24th, 2007, 12:13 am

harrypotterluv

January 24th, 2007, 1:30 am

I feel that both Ron and Hermione are now aware that they have feelings for the other.
I also feel that they may currently feel that the other had feelings for them but they are uncertain as to whether or not these feelings are still present. Ron because he realises he's hurt Hermione severely with the Lavender debacle and may feel he's 'blown his chance'. Hermione because she feels that Ron may not find her attractive, again following the Lavender debacle.
I think that Ron in particular, given his established tactical accumen, is going to realise that they can't go forward with what they are planning to do with this level of tension unresolved. Even if he doesn't anticipate a positive outcome I think he'll tell Hermione how he feels toward her, maybe as early as on the train home but almost certainly before or at the wedding.
Such a declaration from him will almost certainly result in them 'making it official' which will I think be of inestimal aid to Harry in what he needs to do as with that final obstacle between them out of the way they'll prove themselves to be a formidable couple in the making.

I think Jo has played out the Ron / Hermione 'friction'. Yes they'll still bicker, it's their main means of communicating, but I don't think there'll be (if there ever really was) any friction in said bickering. In the six books to date they've had only two real fights, Cat/Rat in Prisoner of Azkeban and Yule brawl/Lav Lav (I still consider these two halves of the same deferred blue) in Goblet of Fire and Half Blood Prince. They've been all but an old married couple in the way they relate since they were in first year, what more do they need to do?

I agree with everything you just said.
The fights they;ve had have ben small, short fights, except for the Cat/Rat in POA, the Yule Ball in GOF and the Lav Lav in HBP.
I think they will get together before the train home, though. JKR has been giving clues since GOF, she won't give us little of Ron and Herione's relationship.
I'm thinking they'll utter "I love you" to each other at the wedding. They'll watch Fleur and Bill, realize what true love is and get together:love:
I pictured them getting together before Harry sets to get Voldie, but now that I think about it, the wedding makes more sense to me. :tu:

RWeasleysgirl

January 24th, 2007, 1:50 am

I think there's a chance for a relationship beyond their friendship. But there is always that threat of ruining the friendship they once had [i.e. sort of like Ginny and Harry]. I don't know, guess we'll just have to wait and see. If nothing else, I think it would be best to have a friendship that'll last despite all odds.

Harry's and Ginny's friendship is not over. And Ron's and Hermione's relationship is not at risk, because they're both in love, and nothing will be able to break them up, because they've been through most anything that a couple breaks up over, and are still in love.

darklordspal

January 24th, 2007, 2:50 am

There is another reason to have Ron and Hermoine settle their "relationship" early in HPDH, and that is so that JKR can explore a loving relationship in the midst of turmoil.

My expectation is that H\G is on hold for a little while at least. Harry has things other than romance to deal with right now... like the undead Lord of Evil out to kill him and enslave the world.

So if JKR wants to say anything about romance, Ron and Hermoine are going to be the vehicle to do so. I expect it will be told in a very entertaining way, as always.

RWeasleysgirl

January 24th, 2007, 2:53 am

Very true, however I'm not thinking of a relationship in terms of romance, I'm thinking of love. Love is a powerful theme in these books, and it can certainly do a lot

potterposse

January 24th, 2007, 2:59 am

I agree...

Love is a stronger and more powerful word (and thing) than hate is. its enough to get anyone through...so if hope. Hope is another thing to always have on your side. So, if they keep the two things, they'll get through..

RWeasleysgirl

January 24th, 2007, 3:05 am

:D Exactly

Deevo

January 24th, 2007, 10:39 am

Love is a stronger and more powerful word (and thing) than hate is. its enough to get anyone through...so if hope. Hope is another thing to always have on your side. So, if they keep the two things, they'll get through..
Actually I've always felt that love and hate are two sides of the same coin, to be able to feel one you must be able to feel the other. I don't think Voldemort feels either, he seems more driven by ambition and fear than anything else.

That's one of the main reasons why I see Ron and Hermione (and Harry and Ginny) coming through this encounter.

ronjalina

January 27th, 2007, 7:16 pm

Well I can't speak for anyone else but I agree with Meesha that we'll see some resolution between them fairly early on in the piece. Why do I see it that way, well there are a few reasons. (The following is all IMO of course)

I feel that both Ron and Hermione are now aware that they have feelings for the other.
I also feel that they may currently feel that the other had feelings for them but they are uncertain as to whether or not these feelings are still present. Ron because he realises he's hurt Hermione severely with the Lavender debacle and may feel he's 'blown his chance'. Hermione because she feels that Ron may not find her attractive, again following the Lavender debacle.
I think that Ron in particular, given his established tactical accumen, is going to realise that they can't go forward with what they are planning to do with this level of tension unresolved. Even if he doesn't anticipate a positive outcome I think he'll tell Hermione how he feels toward her, maybe as early as on the train home but almost certainly before or at the wedding.
Such a declaration from him will almost certainly result in them 'making it official' which will I think be of inestimal aid to Harry in what he needs to do as with that final obstacle between them out of the way they'll prove themselves to be a formidable couple in the making.
Very good and accurate assessment Deevo.

I agree on them not being 100% sure of the other´s feelings for them. I imagine Hermione must be a bit more sure. She has heard Ron mumbling 'Er-my-nee' while he was unconscious (assumed she, and not Harry alone, has heard it). She has seen his lack of real interest in Lavender after the poisoning. She has heard his slip up of 'I love you, Hermione' when she helped him with his essay.
Ron on the other hand, has surely sensed Hermione´s more appreciative and encouraging behaviour towards him, leaves the question if he can draw the right conclusion from Hermione´s still very subtle hints. Her sending canaries at him was a hardly to overlook sign that he was able to hurt her, that she indeed was interested in him. But, as you said, he can´t be sure if he hasn´t messed up with his Lav-Lav entanglement since then. Neverthless, although less sure, I agree that it will be/has to be Ron who makes the move.
Heck, he is a full-fledged Weasley and a true Gryffindor. Go Ron! :D

ep300

January 27th, 2007, 7:42 pm

Ron/Hermione didn't come out of nowhere. Jo has been building that relationship up since PS/SS. She showed that they have a different dynamic in their relationship from the beginning. Ron cares about Hermione for more than her ability to help with homework or the fight against Voldemort. He worries about her - if she's eating right or getting enough sleep or working too hard. He notices the little things that Harry doesn't - like when she got her teeth fixed. They are attracted to each other - they get jealous - they're personalities are almost identical. They've weathered trials and tribulations that end relationships and come through it with a stronger bond between them.

i completely agree. frankly, once i got into the whole HP deal, i was actually shocked to find that some people actually shipped H/Hr.! i mean, i guess there are some reasons why some people would think that they might end up together, but my understanding as a new reader, reading all the books for the first time, was that R/Hr. had an unspoken attraction to one another. its the classic love/hate relationship.

as for when they'll finally get together in the final book, i read an editorial a while back about the return of Viktor and how that will affect R/Hr. relationship. the author said they believed that Viktor may come to Bill and Fleur's wedding (they were in the GOF tornament together, and he a supposed to be this famous Quidditch player), and that this may push Ron to declare his feelings to Hermione. Now, will this actually happen in the 7th book? I don't know. But JK did say that Krum's character would make an appearance in the final book, and i think it may be at the wedding...

but even if that doesn't happen, i don't think ron and hermione will just be together at the beginning of the final book. its been building far too long, and i think a lot of R/Hr. shippers (myself included) would be disappointed in that. i want details! :agree:

i think that we will be at LEAST a few chapters into the book before they finally get together...

RWeasleysgirl

January 27th, 2007, 8:56 pm

Well, welcome to this thread, first of all.

We have discussed Viktor a lot. I think that if Viktor is coming for the wedding, then Ron will definitely make his move beforehand. I actually think it's quite likely that he will be at the wedding simply because Jo loves to give us those mirror scenes so much, and this would give us a chance to see how Ron's behavior has changed since GoF, and a chance for him to "ask her before somebody else does".

Deevo

January 27th, 2007, 9:37 pm

Well, welcome to this thread, first of all.
:agree: :welcome:

We have discussed Viktor a lot. I think that if Viktor is coming for the wedding, then Ron will definitely make his move beforehand. I actually think it's quite likely that he will be at the wedding simply because Jo loves to give us those mirror scenes so much, and this would give us a chance to see how Ron's behavior has changed since GoF, and a chance for him to "ask her before somebody else does".
I think that Ron and Hermione are going to be secure enough between themselves so that when Viktor does return to the scene he won't be much of an influence on them. I suspect though that he may have a more direct role in the main plot either by contributing directly via his own knowledge to the trio's search for horcruxes or perhaps by taking on a teaching role at Hogwarts. Either way his prescence is unlikely to have a huge romantic influence on Ron and Hermione saving perhaps a comical misunderstanding or two.

RWeasleysgirl

January 27th, 2007, 9:46 pm

That's exactly what I'm saying. Two years ago, Viktor had a major impact on Ron's and Hermione's relationship mainly because of Ron's reaction to him, but we will see a big change in Ron's behavior if he is there. It would serve little purpose to have two parties three books apart, and show the same behavior. I would really like to see Ron acting civilly toward Viktor, and I think that's the only purpose he could serve to that part of the story. I think he is more likely to have a real role in the story, too, but all of his past pupose has been involved in the Ron/Hermione storyline, so I think it's possible he could at least have a little subtle involvement.

ronjalina

January 28th, 2007, 8:39 pm

We have discussed Viktor a lot. I think that if Viktor is coming for the wedding, then Ron will definitely make his move beforehand. I actually think it's quite likely that he will be at the wedding simply because Jo loves to give us those mirror scenes so much, and this would give us a chance to see how Ron's behavior has changed since GoF, and a chance for him to "ask her before somebody else does".I absolutely like the idea of a mirror scene. JKR has used them with Harry, and she even used it with Ron and Hermione already. The awkward hug between Ron and Hermione when they made up after the Cat/Rat fight is mirrored with their comforting embrace at Dumbledore´s funeral.

I think JKR could use a mirror scene again with Ron and Viktor. Ron will behave differently than at the Yule Ball. If Ron and Hermione are not yet together at that point, that will be the incentive for Ron to talk things out with Hermione... and then they will be together. :love:

RWeasleysgirl

January 29th, 2007, 12:38 am

Yeah. I think they will be together already, but if not I think he will definitely handle the situation much better. There would be no reason to have poor Ron spend two parties throughout the series watching his girl dance with someone else and not do anything about it. He won't snap at her like last time or anything like that. I think we'll see a noticable improvement in his behavior.

Magdalene81

January 29th, 2007, 1:15 am

This may be an awful theory, but recently I've come to think that Hermione will be the one who goes on to be a Hogwarts professor. I think she will decide to do this after Ron is killed.

Has this already been predicted? What are your thoughts?

tuer_lisse

January 29th, 2007, 1:27 am

I dont think that they will have much time for romance while fighting against an all powerful evil... I dont even really think that after all Ron has put hermione through that she will even want to go out with him...

meesha1971

January 29th, 2007, 1:35 am

:agree: :welcome:

I think that Ron and Hermione are going to be secure enough between themselves so that when Viktor does return to the scene he won't be much of an influence on them. I suspect though that he may have a more direct role in the main plot either by contributing directly via his own knowledge to the trio's search for horcruxes or perhaps by taking on a teaching role at Hogwarts. Either way his prescence is unlikely to have a huge romantic influence on Ron and Hermione saving perhaps a comical misunderstanding or two.

I agree that the primary purpose for bringing Krum back into the story would most likely have something to do with the main plot. He supposedly learned the Dark Arts at Durmstrang so he would be a valuable source for information. And I like the idea of him coming to Hogwarts to take on the DADA position.

However, I think his presence will have some influence on Ron/Hermione. Not necessarily a huge impact, but more like a subtle nudge. Remember, there are still unresolved issues there. Ron still doesn't know exactly what the nature of their relationship was and Hermione still doesn't know why Ron got so mad at her. If nothing else, Krum's presence could serve as a catalyst for those issues being discussed and resolved.

I've gone back and forth on whether or not Krum would be at the wedding. While he and Fleur were both in the tournament, we don't know if they became friends. It doesn't seem likely that Fleur would invite Krum. However, Hermione could. If Krum's purpose in the story will be to help the trio, then it would be plausible for Hermione to invite him as a cover to give them the chance to talk to him.

In that event, we could have a slight misunderstanding. I used a scenario like that in this story (http://www.checkmated.com/story.php?story=6767). Just a little nudge in the right direction. I think we could have a sort of mirror situation to the Yule Ball with Ron asking Hermione first this time around.

HarryFan

January 29th, 2007, 3:43 am

Actually I've always felt that love and hate are two sides of the same coin, to be able to feel one you must be able to feel the other. I don't think Voldemort feels either, he seems more driven by ambition and fear than anything else.

That's one of the main reasons why I see Ron and Hermione (and Harry and Ginny) coming through this encounter.
yeah and that leads to the whole Love/Hate relationship they have! (R/H)

jam1

January 29th, 2007, 8:36 am

I've gone back and forth on whether or not Krum would be at the wedding. While he and Fleur were both in the tournament, we don't know if they became friends. It doesn't seem likely that Fleur would invite Krum. However, Hermione could. If Krum's purpose in the story will be to help the trio, then it would be plausible for Hermione to invite him as a cover to give them the chance to talk to him.

I don't think Hermione would invite Krum, it's not really her place to hand out invitations to Bill & Fleur's wedding. The only way she could invite him would be as her date and by now she must know that it would hurt Ron and she's not going to risk it.

If I'm correct the wedding will take place fairly early in the book and I'm not sure the trio has figured out by then that they will need his help (if that is indeed the reason Krum will appear).

meesha1971

January 29th, 2007, 12:52 pm

I don't think Hermione would invite Krum, it's not really her place to hand out invitations to Bill & Fleur's wedding. The only way she could invite him would be as her date and by now she must know that it would hurt Ron and she's not going to risk it.

Not really. Hermione is considered part of the family. It wouldn't be that big of a deal for her to invite a friend - or make the suggestion that he be invited because he is her friend. I don't know if Krum will attend the wedding, but that's one plausible way. Harry could also invite him.

If I'm correct the wedding will take place fairly early in the book and I'm not sure the trio has figured out by then that they will need his help (if that is indeed the reason Krum will appear).

That's true. However, they were looking for information about Horcruxes in HBP and had no luck because it is a forbidden subject at Hogwarts because it is very dark magic. Durmstrang has a reputation for teaching the Dark Arts so it's possible that Krum knows something about Horcruxes because of that - or at least he might know where they could find information about them. Looking at it from Hermione's point of view, she would be thinking of ways they could get more information.

Other possibilities include Krum being offered the DADA position, being in England because he joined the Order, or they go looking for him to get information at some point. We also discussed the possibility of Charlie bringing him to the wedding as a friend instead of a date. And we can't rule out the random, chance meeting.

However Jo decides to do it, I think Krum's reappearance would lead to that issue being resolved between Ron and Hermione. There have been suggestions of Krum showing up to make another bid for Hermione's affections, but I think Hermione has made it pretty clear to him by now that all she was ever interested in was friendship. :)

potterposse

January 29th, 2007, 8:41 pm

I agree that the primary purpose for bringing Krum back into the story would most likely have something to do with the main plot. He supposedly learned the Dark Arts at Durmstrang so he would be a valuable source for information. And I like the idea of him coming to Hogwarts to take on the DADA position.

Well, I actually had a theory consisting of a dark betrayal where Krum is actually a Death Eater and he betrays the trio...Where the Irony of Rons jealousy in book four telling Hermione he cant be trusted comes to reality. *How very nice of me*

ronjalina

January 29th, 2007, 9:15 pm

I dont think that they will have much time for romance while fighting against an all powerful evil...While I agree that they will most probably not have much time to do romantic couply stuff like going out, they can still be together. Having confessed their feelings and being a couple.

I dont even really think that after all Ron has put hermione through that she will even want to go out with him...I think, their behaviour towards each other after the poisoning and after they made up speaks a clear language. They care a lot for each other and I interpret it as they want to be together. Their comforting embrace at Dumbledore´s funeral is - beside the kiss between Harry and Ginny - the most intimate gesture of the whole series.

Why should Hermione not want to be together with Ron? What is all this that Ron has put Hermione through? Sure, Ron acted immature and childish not to ask Hermione about Krum, giving her the cold shoulder and then starting a relationship with Lavender. But that all was for a reason. It didn´t come out of the blue, and Ron definitely didn´t set out with the intent on hurting Hermione. He acted that way, because he was immature and insecure.
There were a lot of misunderstandings involved, that led to what happened in HBP. Hermione (unintentionally and unknowingly) hurt Ron as well, since she behaved dismissive to him the whole school year in her effort not to show how much she cares. Then Ron learns that Hermione supposedly has snogged Krum. To Ron, that looked like Hermione has lied to him about the nature of her relationship with Viktor. Hermione always had insisted on just being friends with him. That is one issue that still has to be addressed.
And then the next blow: It seemed as if Hermione had no trust in Ron´s Quidditch abilities. 'He took Felix Felicis, that´s why he saved everything' (paraphrased). Of course she didn´t mean it that way, but it came across that way. I think Ron had convinced himself that Hermione was not romantically interested, therefore he gave it a try with Lavender, who was openly flirting with him since the beginning of the school year.

I don´t say Ron was the sweetest thing on earth during their following fallout. But Hermione was not completely innocent either, IMO. So all in all, we can say they both give as much as they take, but in the end they both know how much they care for each other.