James giving Dumbledore the invisibility cloak

[I heart Sirius]

Dumbledore said that James left the cloak with him before he died right?
But why?
I mean, what's the point of it, I know it's a rare item and all but was there really a point in that?
Or was it a 'just in case' sorta thing?
I know James knew Voldie was after him, but it seems to me that was was absolutely sure w/ out a doubt that he was gonna die...
Also, is there anything else that Jame and/or Lily made sure was in good hands before they died?

[Sinistra]

James may have left it with Dumbledore days, weeks, months or even a couple of years before he died. It wasn't necessarily immediately before.

Maybe Dumbledore confiscated it just before James graduated, and James never bothered to reclaim it because he was happy with Lily and then busy keeping safe from Voldemort. One can forget even a valuable item if one is very busy elsewhere. And once James was dead, and Harry at the Dursleys, Dumbledore may have decided to give it to Harry at his first Christmas at Hogwarts. Make things a bit less lonely. Just a surmise.

[pasalita]

Originally posted by Sinistra
James may have left it with Dumbledore days, weeks, months or even a couple of years before he died. It wasn't necessarily immediately before.

Maybe Dumbledore confiscated it just before James graduated, and James never bothered to reclaim it because he was happy with Lily and then busy keeping safe from Voldemort. One can forget even a valuable item if one is very busy elsewhere. And once James was dead, and Harry at the Dursleys, Dumbledore may have decided to give it to Harry at his first Christmas at Hogwarts. Make things a bit less lonely. Just a surmise.

I vibe with Sinistra. It could be that James left DD that Invisibility Cloak at the time he graduated from Hogwarts. You know - he'd no longer be using it to sneak around Hogwarts, which is what he probably used it for, and giving it to DD to "pass" on, or hold onto, in case any of his children went to Hogwarts, might have been a way for James to say, "It's been fun, but it's time to grow up."

What I've always found suspicious - Harry received the cloak at the time when it was most convenient to have it, i.e. when the trio were investigating the identity of Nicolas Flamel. Hmmmmm..... DD's sure keeping close tabs on Harry... :eyebrows:

[Sinistra]

Oh yeah! It's almost like Dumbledore is training Harry up to be able to directly face Voldemort by the time he graduates. Oops, he already has! Actually I think Dumbledore has done a lot of things deliberately and by design--starting with the Dursleys--and eventually we all will know why. Hopefully before we die.

[Daily Propheter]

All very coincidental if you ask me.... hey guess what!!! It's tomorrow!!! (LOL, where I am it's still the 23rd for the next ... 4 hours and 8 minutes, and not the 24th, like the thingy down there says!! Very Kool...)

[harryton]

James could probably see the future, and he probably saw that Harry Potter was going to need it. Becuase it is kind of weird, that he left it with him.

[owl post 1992]

Well, when you know death is near you most likely give things to people you trust, just in case you die, then it's something to remember you by. If you live, it's a sign to you the danger is gone. Knowing Voldemort was after them was like a death warrant, and like terminal disease and other deaths, there is no way to predict them.

[mrs_fawkes]

I have SS in front of me and this is what the letter said that was in with the cloak: 'Your father left this in my possession before he died. it is time it was returned to you. Use it well. A very Merry Christmas.'

Now my theory is this..........James, Lupin, and Sirius knew that there was a spy amongst them, but none of them knew who it was. When Sirius convinced James to use Peter as their secret-keeper instead of him, they must have thought it was Lupin. So Ii think that James was expecting some kind of attack , but from which quarter he didn't know. I think it is very plausible for James to give certain valuable and rare items into safe keeping with people he could trust without a doubt, and one person was Dumbledore. If there was anything else, we might find out about them in the up coming books.



:devil: ( My 5yr old wanted to put a face up.)

[pasalita]

Originally posted by mrs_fawkes
i have SS in front of me and this is what the letter said that was in with the cloak: 'your father left this in my possession before he died. it is time it was returned to you. use it well. a very merry christmas.'

now my theory is this..........james, lupin, and sirius knew that there was a spy amongst them, but none of them knew who it was. when sirius convinced james to use peter as their secret-keeper instead of him, they must have thought it was lupin.so i think that james was expecting some kind of attack , but from which quarter he didn't know. i think it is very plausible for james to give certain valuable and rare items into safe keeping with ppl he could trust without a doubt, and one person was dumbledore. if there was anything else, we might find out about them in the up coming books.



:devil: ( my 5yr old wanted to put a face up)

mrs_fawkes, may I just say - Nice catch! That clears up my argument, anyway. :tu:

[cbjedi]

Well, we know that James was a little bit of a trouble maker when he was in Hogwarts. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he did something that forced DD to confiscate the cloak.

Mind you mrs_fawkes's theory is just as plausible, if not more so than mine.

[Sirius Black]

I think James gave it to Dumbledore because Dumbledore needed to go on a special mission. He needed to sneak and go, not just walk up to the dark side. Or maybe Dumbledore confisticated it before graduation because James used it for a bad purpose. I don't know what that could have been. Any wild guesses?

[timmay]

James misbehaved and Dumbuldore confiscated it. I realize he's given it back to Harry a few times, but maybe he's gotten soft in his old age.

[Potterjohn]

I agree he gave it to Dumbledore when he left school, so he could give it to one of james children instead of james giving it because something might happen.

[cbjedi]

Sirius Black:

'I think James gave it to Dumbledore because Dumbledore needed to go on a special mission.'

I don't think that's likely. As Dumbledore already stated, he doesn't need an invisibility cloak to become invisible. More likely he confiscated it. At least that's what I think.

[JoFaye]

I love speculating about this stuff. I think James left it to DD
just in case. I also believe we'll find out more about it in #5.

Please J.K., Please you're 15 months overdue. It's time to
give birth to the book. (You can hold on to the baby for as
long as you want.)

[cbjedi]

Yeah, speculation is alot of fun, even if (like in this case) there isn't much to go on. Makes you wonder if any of us would be right about any of this. :p

[JoFaye]

I've gotten really carried away at times on the spec stuff, but
I think it's because I've been waiting so long for a new book.

At least it's something kind of new, Harry related.

[dumbleedore]

Originally posted by Sinistra
Oh yeah! It's almost like Dumbledore is training Harry up to be able to directly face Voldemort by the time he graduates. Oops, he already has! Actually I think Dumbledore has done a lot of things deliberately and by design--starting with the Dursleys--and eventually we all will know why. Hopefully before we die.

I have always believed that everything Dumbledore has done and things that he will do are all in relation to Harry and Voldemort. I have a full theory worked out, I am currently decoding my awful handwriting into typed words. It'll be ready when book 5 is ready.

[mrs_fawkes]

I do not beleive that Dumbledore confiscated the cloak from James. If he did, why would he give it to Harry? Dumbledore seems to know things about what students are up to, and now Harry has the cloak. Do you really think that Dumbledore wouldn't know what Harry was going to do with the cloak once he got it?

[Rosepetal]

I think it may have something to do with Trelawney's first prediction. It may have been complicated, with many details, and the cloak may play a critical part in a future book. It may save Harry's life, or help to bring Voldemort's demise. Just a thought.

[pasalita]

Originally posted by mrs_fawkes
i do not beleive that dumbledore confiscated the cloak from james. if he did, why would he give it to harry? dumbledore seems to know things about what students are up to, and now harry has the cloak. do you really think that dumbledore wouldn't know what harry was going to do with the cloak once he got it?

Hm. That's the funny thing: I think Dumbledore knew exactly what Harry would do once he gave Harry the Invisibility Cloak, especially at the time he gave it to Harry. So, yeah, I don't think that Dumbledore confiscated the cloak, but more-or-less passed on to Harry what was passed on (or returned) to him.

It's a bit eerie the way things are playing out for Harry, and eerier when one takes into perspective the idea that Dumbledore knows much more about Harry's potential than he is letting on to any of his collegues and Harry himself.

Just to throw another log on the fire, I don’t ever remember reading that James ever “inherited” the Invisibility Cloak as a result of his family fortune; we just know he had one to use. I mean, my memory may just be a bit foggy, but I think the reader is meant to assume James did have the cloak before his time at Hogwarts because of the fact that he used it for Lupin and because he was a mischievous little bugger at Hogwarts, thought it’s never been said out right that James had the Invisibility Cloak before he came Hogwarts. Did that come out right? I mean, in accordance to my previous theory – Could Harry have been prophecied? (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?s=&threadid=151&highlight=prophecy) - perhaps Dumbledore himself entrusted the cloak to James. Then, James could learn how useful the cloak was during Hogwarts, so that by the time he graduated and Voldemort began to threaten the Wizarding World, James could use the cloak during covert operations to help Dumbledore bring Voldermort down, if you will.

*sigh* I’m just thinking out loud, but I’ve always found that it sparks some interesting ideas from everyone else. :D

[MagpieOnaga]

Originally posted by pasalita
Hm. That's the funny thing: I think Dumbledore knew exactly what Harry would do once he gave Harry the Invisibility Cloak, especially at the time he gave it to Harry. So, yeah, I don't think that Dumbledore confiscated the cloak, but more-or-less passed on to Harry what was passed on (or returned) to him.

Hmm......you could be right, but didn't Dumbledore give it to Harry as a Christmas present? Maybe he just thought Christmas was a convenient time to send it as a "gift"?

Anyway, like I said, you could be right. I think Dumbledore was aware that Harry would be "up to no good" with the Cloak. Sometimes, I get the impression that Dumbledore just wants Harry to have some fun!

[pasalita]

Originally posted by MagpieOnaga
Hmm......you could be right, but didn't Dumbledore give it to Harry as a Christmas present? Maybe he just thought Christmas was a convenient time to send it as a "gift"?

Anyway, like I said, you could be right. I think Dumbledore was aware that Harry would be "up to no good" with the Cloak. Sometimes, I get the impression that Dumbledore just wants Harry to have some fun!

Truth be told, DD could have just given Harry the cloak as a great x-mas present. But, that was also the most opportune time for Harry and Ron to investigate the identity of Nicolas Flamel in the restriced section; even Hermoine hinted at it before she left for her holiday. Too coincedental, ya know?

And, yeah - DD is probably very aware of the cloak's double purpose. I mean, without it, Harry would never have been able to visit Hogsmeade during those first instances. (Kooky Dumbledore :D)Though, it's funny how Harry has used the cloak (except for the Hogsmeade instance) more for legitimate reasons. I mean, he's careful not to use the cloak just 'cause he can.

[JoFaye]

Harry and his friends are very ethical people. I have noticed
this over and over. I love these kids. I love J.K.

[Qeomash]

I'd belive that, sometime before James graduated, he got caught with the cloak. Dumbles confiscates it, and puts it in some dark corner of his office.

Some ten-twenty years later, Harry arrives at the school. Dumbles, being kind and giving, (and hoping to egg Harry into facing Voldemort at the end) returns the cloak anonomusly. (Think, if he had signed his name on the note, Harry probably would have been afraid to use it.)

[mrs_fawkes]

I still hold that Dd did not confiscate the cloak, and nothing will convince me otherwise ( I guess I can be a little hard-headed. lolololololol)


edit: got to thinking and I just can't imagine Dd getting soft in his old age. Harry had even noticed in GoF that Dd had a certain energy to him when he was angry. I do agree that Dd wanted Harry to have fun.

[Liz]

I think, like most people said..that James gave it too dumbledore because he was one of the people he trusted...

I don't know when he gave it too him, but I think it was way before that night, when James and Lily were killed. Maybe he thought Dumbledore could mind it till he needed it or something, maybe he didn't want Harry to find it and "disappear" and not take it off...

[Guinevere]

I know it seems to make sense that Dumbledore past the cloak on to Harry. But where in the books is this explicitely stated? I don't remember there being a name on the christmas card accompanying the cloak. And I wonder if it said somewhere else in the books?

Imagine this. What if someone else held on to the cloak for James? Could be interesting, right? I can't think of a logical person just now, but it seems possible to me.

[JoFaye]

Dumbledore tells Harry at the end of book #1, that James
left it with him and he was passing it along. He said James
mostly used it to sneak into the kitchens for food.

[timmay]

Why does everyone think that James was such a goody-two shoes?
He was hardly one to follow the rules. It's clear when Dumbles said "left it with me" that James had it taken off him.
Has no one heard of sarcasm??

None of this secret mission bull.

James was no saint.

[dorcasderr]

I am certain that James actually gave the cloak to Dumbledore because Dumbledore doesn't mince words and he SAID James gave it to him. Otherwise, I think he would have not only said that he had taken it from James but added a caution to Harry as to his use of it. Why would Dumbledore lie about how he acquired the cloak? I think that if James had done anything seriously wrong while using it that he would not have passed it on to Harry for fear he would follow in his father's footsteps. Instead, I think he HOPED he would follow in his father's footsteps.

[mrs_fawkes]

No one said that James was a saint. At the end of book one Harry had asked Dumbledore a few things and Dumbledore said that he would answer with the truth, but wouldn't answer if he felt Harry wasn't ready; but Dd said he would not lie to him.

So I do believe that James gave the cloak to Dd for safe keeping, because he knew there was trouble coming, but not when or from where.

So if Dd wouldn't lie to Harry about any of the questions Harry had, Dd wouldn't lie to Harry about his father.

[timmay]

OK. Some of you guys still haven't grasped sarcasm.
Sarcasm doesn't have to be a lie. Did I say it was??:banghead:
He "left" it in Dumbledore's possesion, just as the marauders map got "left" in Filch's possesion.

Obviously Dumbls has a soft spot for Harry; how many times has he returned it?

He's a grandfatherly figure who lets Harry enjoy himself and get up to mischief and no good, and look at all the useful things Harry has learnt and done to both his and Ddumbledore's benifit.poke:
Don't make me list them, because I will. :devil:

By the way I'm extremely stubborn, :rasp: especially because Ii know I'm right.

And its not a lie if it's the truth, is it??

[Daily Propheter]

He did add a caution... 'Use it well', remember?? Anyway, no one said James was a saint, it's true, but people mature more as thay age. Don't you think that a father of a brand new baby (and unless there's some weird hidden plot, his ONLY child) would be slightly more mature and responsible than someone who's 16-17 years old?? I think that James left it to Dumbledorefor safe-keeping, and because he thought Dumbledore could make more use out of it.
I also think that Dumbledore is prepping Harry (very subtly I might add) for something to do with Voldemort, and wants to teach him a few lessons before he has to face him. (Like, maybe he's afraid Voldemort will try to tempt him to switch over to the 'Dark Side' or something). So, when Harry comes to Hogwarts, Dumbledore gives him the cloak to help "prepare him" somehow... this isn't very well thought out, is it???Oh well!! I'm too tired to think right now.. if I can make it clearer I will. ;)

Oh yeah, and how many times in the whole series has Dumbledore ever been sarcastic? Um... NEVER!!! At least not about anything serious!!

[timmay]

Absolute truth there. People do mature with age ,well most do.
But the cloak may have been confiscated while James was at school still, perhaps before he became an anamagi? Like when he was 14 or 15 and still a little twerp.

There was no Voldemort when James was at school that I'm aware of,
at least not in his powerful threatening stage.:wacky:

[Dobby]

Sorry if this has been said before, because I did not read the whole thread. Maybe James was a seer?

[Daily Propheter]

hehehe, maybe (my bro thinks this, he can't post though...) maybe JKR needed a way to make Harry invisible and an invisibility cloak was convenient and it would be 'sentimental' if he inherited it from his Father.

[timmay]

True, that post.
But that is no fun. We can't speculate if we follow that line of thought.
:o

[Musicmaker]

Actually, my guess is pretty simple. He gave it to Dumbledore so that Dumbledore may give it to Harry, if anything might happen to them. A keepsake, something like that. James and Lily probably knew that if anything happened to them, Harry would be in the care of Dumbledore (or Dumbledore will be in charge of seeing to Harry's welfare). When Harry grows older, Dumbledore could give it to Harry to 'use wisely'. And if anything happened to all of them (if they all died, I mean), then Dumbledore would surely be the right person to have such an object, since he knows how to wisely use it.

And idea suddenly went into my mind: why not give it to the Marauders instead? Well...probably because all of them were secretly pointing fingers on who was Voldemort's spy, that James and Lily didn't know who to entrust the cloak with. Just an idea.

[Fuchsia]

Family heirlooms are family heirlooms. It might even be illegal to pass them onto someone else. Some jewels don't even belong to the family members themselves but the family estate and go to someone else when a child is of age.
And they *are* British.

[timmay]

This is all very repetitive, three people will say that the cloak was entrusted to Dumbledore, and then I say, no, it was confiscated....
The cloak was given to James by his father. Did he give it back to his father when he no longer had use for it?....
Nah, just a thought.
I don't think the cloak was given so, that in the event they were kileld, it could be given to Harry... they didn't know that they would be killed and Harry would survive. How could they, unless Trelawney's first prediction was their demise??
But then I still don't think the cloak would be intentionally given to Dumblys. He doesn't need it. The likely explanation is that it was indeed left in Dumbldore's possesion as he said, but it was taken from James rather than given by James.

All who doubt this, too bad, because I am the man and am right. So.

[Daily Propheter]

In any case, if there was some hidden reason for James leaving the cloak to Harry (besides the obvious ones of course...) we'll find out in later books.
I stand by what I said, that James GAVE the cloak to Dumbledore for safe-keeping. Dumbledore did not confiscate it. Maybe, because they knew Voldemort was after them, and they didn't know who they could trust (besides Dumbledore that is), they left the cloak to Dumbledore for safe-keeping, so that it wouldn't fall into the wrong hands.
I'm also thinking, James and Lily were openly working against Voldemort, right? And obviously, Dumbledore knew... Well, don't you think that if they were, Dumbledore would think a cloak would be useful, and would return it if it had been confiscated in school?? It seems to me that James didn't want it, for whatever reason. Besides, if it were something THAT valuable, a school (typically) wouldn't have a right to keep it after he had left.
I know what you're going to say. If they don't have a right to keep James' stuff, why didn't the Marauders get their map back from Filch??
Here's my answer: Filch thought it was no more than a scrap of Parchment. He couldn't prove it was a map, and if James (or any of the other Marauders) had gone out of their way to get it back, people would have gotten suspicious, somehow have found out it's secret and they would have gotten in BIG trouble, so they left things alone. Wow long sentence. And VERY off topic. Sorry. :angel:
OK, all this to say, and I cannot state this often enough, James left the cloak with Dumbledore, it wasn't confiscated. I've said it before, and I WILL say it again, if need be. :D

[timmay]

No. Sorry. I'M RIGHT! So :censored: can tse me winning this argument, so I'll settle for knowing that I'm right and you're wrong.

[mrs_fawkes]

If you go to the first page of this post, timmay, you will see what i had posted; and I'M correct. So there :p

[Daily Propheter]

Agreed. What you put up, Mrs Fawkes, seems to be the most reasonable theory of all the theories posted! (Mine comes in second, of course!! lol!!) Timmay, ur still wrong, hehehe!

[JoFaye]

As a fair and unbiased bystander I feel I must
say,

"You lost, Timmay. Lost, lost, lost. So wrong it
wasn't even close."

No offense.

[timmay]

all i got to say is tht wen im proven right ul all feel stink:p

im right and your wrong, im big and your small.

[JoFaye]

Great big L on the forehead, Timmay. Loser.

Once again, I say this from love. No offense.

[pasalita]

Okay, okay. Let's bring it back to topic: Theories on why James give Dumbledore the invisibility cloak.

Anymore ideas? Questions? Concerns? Bright thoughts?

[JoFaye]

Sorry, you're right Pasalita. Trouble is I can't think of
a good reason other than safety of the cape. Dd can
become invisible without aid from the cloak. But, if it was
just to keep it safe, why not put it in the vault at Gringotts?

I can't find a way for it to make much sense.

[Daily Propheter]

Because Hogwarts is safer than Gringotts (remember Vault 713...)!! James must have realized this and left it with Dumbledore at Hogwarts!!

[JoFaye]

Why would James voluntarily leave the cloak with
Dd? Dd can become invisible anytime he wants to.
For safety's sake he could have left it at Gringotts.

But why would he give it up at all, unless he could
become invisible at will. Otherwise, I would think
James himself could have used it to spy on the
Death Eaters.

[Daily Propheter]

True... if he were a spy...

[JoFaye]

Even if he was just spying for personal reasons.
The cloak could be useful in a ton of situations.

[Daily Propheter]

I guess so... maybe he knew that no one would be able to "see" him when they used the Fidelius charm thingy, and left it to Dumbledore... Or maybe he developed the ability to make himself invisible and gave it to Dumbledore to give to someone else... like someone else Dd knew he could really really trust or something... and Dd never did, cuz James died, and Dd felt really bad about that, and decided to give it to Harry when he came to Hogwarts....

[JoFaye]

O.K. DP I'll buy that one. It makes sense to me.

[Daily Propheter]

YAY!! Look at all the arguments I'm winning in this thread!!! Woo Hoo!! What a rare thing for me!! I'm gonna cry with joy!!!

[Chris]

Maybe James left a lot of his possesions to Harry, but Harry could only get them when he came to Hogwarts and when Dumbledore (the man looking after these items) thaught Harry could put them to good use!

[Godfather Sirius Black]

I have to go with the no use theorey. James clearly didn't require it once he became and adult and left it to Dumbledore, possibly to give it on to another student. Maybe Dumblerdore gave it James in the first place.

[JoFaye]

I'm so very sorry to disagree Sirius. (I have a crush on
the character in the book. (Blushing.) However, I think
the cloak is given to much prominance to be a throw away
kind of item. There is going to be some significance to the
way Dd received the cloaks in the book. Bet you a coke.

[mrs_fawkes]

Well, all I can say is this.............. Do wizards make out wills?
Like I had stated before, I believe James gave rare and valuable items to his most trusted friends and allies.
Maybe James had left instructions for the distribution of said items to Harry when they felt he was ready for them.

[timmay]

cloaks are not all tht rear.
thy get the material from which the cloaks are made from lack of a better term a sheep tht can make itself invisable.
some enterprising wizzard might farm them..

THATS HOW JAMES GOT HIS MONEY!!!!!!!!

still think it got confiscated:rasp:

[Daily Propheter]

and I still think you're wrong :rasp: :D

[Caenne]

Originally posted by timmay
cloaks are not all tht rear.
thy get the material from which the cloaks are made from lack of a better term a sheep tht can make itself invisable.
some enterprising wizzard might farm them..

THATS HOW JAMES GOT HIS MONEY!!!!!!!!

still think it got confiscated:rasp:

Ron makes a big deal about how rare the cloak is in SS when Harry opens it and they realize what it is. Also, if they are not rare, then why don't more of the Hogwarts students have them? I have to figure that if someone like Draco Malfoy doesn't have one, they are probably fairly difficult to get. True, there is no proof that he DOESN'T have one, but I think he'd be picking on Harry a lot more if he did. *On that note, why didn't Harry, Ron and Hermione just use the cloak to follow a Slytherin to their common room and sneak inside and listen to Malfoy in Cos? There may have been a reason, can't recall one atm, though, but that seems like it would have been easier than the polyjuice potion!

I always assumed that James had made arrangements for Dumbledore to get the cloak if something bad were to happen to him. Kind of like a will or something. Harry may not have been the only thing Hagrid picked out of the rubble that Halloween....

[Daily Propheter]

Cuz even if they could have followed him, they couldn't have questioned him... With the potion at least they could ask questions instead of relying on the chance that someone might just happen to say, "Hey Draco, you still killing off those Mudbloods?? Oh yeah, by the way, where's that Chamber of Secrets, and what kind of creature is in it??"

[timmay]

yeah but rons poor so he wouldnt have had an opertunity to see 1, good point on the malfoy thing though.

the problem i see with the whole wil thing is where is the rest of the stuff??
harry doesnt have anything else but the cloak...
hagrid made an extra effort to get the photos.
this leads me to think tht there isnt anything else bcoz the house got BLOWN UP!!!

seeing tht allmost every1 loves harry you would think they would return anything tht might have sentimental value to him.

[Fuchsia]

He inherited money. The house was destroyed. He only has the cloak because James left it with Dumbledore for safe keeping.
Their friends had photographs but who doesn't have photographs of their friends?

[JoFaye]

I believe Ron tells Harry the cloaks are quite rare. The
questioning point was very good.

DP you win again.

[Cheshire]

This has got to be the most hilarious thread I've ever read. LoL!!! And isn't my lil buddy, DP, a genius? She's awlays right, really, so don't bother arguing. Even if she's wrong, she'll fight untill she's "right". (Luv ya Age!)

[Daily Propheter]

I can't tell if that's a compliment or not...

[lanifiel]

It's a compliment, being able to argue your point no matter what is a great benefit in life...

[Daily Propheter]

lol, hehehe! I knew that! I really did!! Hehehe!! But it's also a lie!! I'm not always right! Just most of the time!!

[Cheshire]

But when your wrong, you persist until everyone around you gets exasperated (i just like that word :)) and gives up!!!
I'm only joking buddy! You usually are right, it's frusterating!!

[Daily Propheter]

:D Thank You Chesh!!! Ur so sweet!!! :D I Have the greatest friends!! :D Oh cool!!! The Trailer for HPCOS was just on TV!! Wicked...

[mrs_fawkes]

As far as to where anything else is that James might have had, who knows. There might not have been anything else since the house was blown up. But, with all the uncertainty at the time he was alive, James probably had other items that just haven't come to light yet.

[timmay]

but there must be more ?? surely. a pair of old socks??

[Daily Propheter]

Maybe there are other things that were meant to go to other people. Like maybe (if it hadn't got confiscated) the map would've gone straight to Harry too.

[JoFaye]

If he gave Dd the cloak, he could have given him
a will. Surely there is more to this.

[Fuchsia]

The cloak wasn't necessarily a will item. Dumbledore only wrote that he felt it was time to be returned to Harry. He could have held onto it forever and no one would ever be the wiser.

And as Sirius, Peter and Lupin are still alive why would Harry inherit the map? Is James the Kurt Cobain here? Did he own all of the map even though they helped make it?

[Caenne]

Nah, the map wasn't in ANY of the Marauders' possession after they left school, I bet. Remember, the twins stole it from Filch's office and then gave it to Harry before he ever knew anything about Prongs and Moony and Padfoot and Wormtail. And since we know or at least safely assume none of the other Marauders had children at Hogwarts (because of the ages, they would have almost had to overlap school years with Harry, who is too intelligent to miss something like that) I think it may have been a kind of Gryffindor 'heirloom', passed down to a younger housemate when an older one graduated, until it was finally confiscated. I don't think it was ever actually James' or Sirius' or Lupin's.

[Fuchsia]

That's another reason why it isn't a heirloom, yes. I was just responding to why Daily Propheter thought the map would go to Harry if it wasn't. :)

It belonged to all four of them so I think it should stay with the remaining members if they want it. Lupin and Sirius both love Harry though so they would want him to have it. I just don't think it should automatically go to Harry in a will or something.

[timmay]

Originally posted by Fuchsia
The cloak wasn't necessarily a will item. Dumbledore only wrote that he felt it was time to be returned to Harry. He could have held onto it forever and no one would ever be the wiser.



bwaa ha ha ha
finaly a little evidence in support for dumbledore having the cloak but not having been"given" the cloak.

i expest that there was a rush to get into hiding so there was little time to plan these things.
they didn't know that they were going to die Lilly and James thought they were safe from Voldemorte, hidden with their secret keeper.

i dont think they would have had any reason to make plans for what if they died and harry didn't,
how could they know that only they would be the ones too get zapped?

[JoFaye]

Dd said James left the cloak with him. Nuff said.

[Daily Propheter]

And why would Dd lie?? Huh?? WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY????
(Sorry, hyperness...)
And...
they didn't know that they were going to die Lilly and James thought they were safe from Voldemorte, hidden with their secret keeper.
i dont think they would have had any reason to make plans for what if they died and harry didn't, how could they know that only they would be the ones too get zapped?

They thought they were safe from Voldemort, and yet they knew that they'd get zapped...hmm...
Don't ya think that if they thought they were safe, they'd have assumed they'd live nice long lives, and that they'd be able to leave Harry things when they passed on??

[steel phantom]

i sincerely believe the invisibility cloak was confiscated by dumbledor when jaMES WAS AT SCHOOL:evil:

[timmay]

hell yeah steel phantom thank you

he DIDN'T LIE!!!!!!!!
it was a play on words, "left it in my possesion"
and before any1 says tht dumbledore doesnt mince words he does have a sense of humour.

[JoFaye]

Give it up, Timmay. D.P. is right once again. Dd did not lie.
How wany points is D.P. winning by now?

[Justin Etre]

maybe DD is james potters dad, or his godfather? godfather makes more sense...or maybe he is lilly's dad, i know we all THINK she is muggle born but maybe she isnt???

[Daily Propheter]

Lots!!! :) I love this thread!!

[Cheshire]

I am so proud to say I'm one of DP's bestest friends!

[apples]

I haven't read the whole thread, so if this has already been said just ignore me. :)

Remember in the Sorcerer's/Philosopher's Stone movie? Lily and James are seen hiding out as muggles. (Rowling actually wrote in a new chapter for those books so Kloves could write that into the script.) If they were supposed to be muggles, they would have to give up all of their magical posessions, right? James would have left that in the hands of Dumbledore for safe keeping until they could return to the magical world.

[timmay]

DP do you ever read your own posts??

My point exactly.
They thought that they would live a lot longer than they did; therefore they didn't have any reason to make provision for Harry's future.

Because as you put it "they'd be able to leave Harry things when they passed on" or while they were alive, as Harry needed things they would provide him with what ever he needed.

oh wait they are dead, so objects that belonged to them i.e. the cloak that were "left" in others possession are returned to Harry. if there was a will with provisions for Harry it would not have been in the house but in safe hands, Gringots or Dumbledore.
Therefore there would be a whole lot more for Harry to inherit than just some money and a cloak. Where are the letters explaining things to him?
Or telling him how much they love him?

There aren't any, which supports the theory that the cloak was "misplaced" and ended up in Dumbledores possession.

What would you rather hear?
"I found this with your fathers smoldering corpse, here have it back."
or "Your father left this in my possession"

The cloak may have come to Dumbledore after Lilly and James's death and Dumbledore is just being tactful. That is not to say that he is lying because I don't believe he is, its just his way of protecting Harry.

I will continue to support this theory until somebody provides some decent evidence to the contrary.

[Daily Propheter]

Ok guys!! Chalk one up for timmay, he won this round!!


But I still don't believe it was confiscated!

[Cheshire]

:wow: OMG timmay your the first person to ever have DP say she's wrong. CONGRATULATIONS! :tu: :tu: :bigtu: :bigtu: ;D
This is a moment that will live on forever...wow...

[Daily Propheter]

Oh, come off it Chesh!! You know very well I'm not THAT bad!! But I give up!! I'm tired of coming up with different ways of defending the same PoV!! I quit!! (For this thread anyway!) **Unsubscribes**

[timmay]

Sweet.
I am still open to arguments to prove otherwise

[I heart Sirius]

o.o...Whoa, I never thought this topic would get so much discussion. Cool!

[lanifiel]

Dumbledore, in my opinion, is the kind of person who would be up front with how he aquired the cloak. If he got it after James death Dumbledore would say "After your fathers death, I aquired his invisability cloak, it seems only fitting you got it". I agree he wouldnt say, "oh yeah, here, this was found inteh smoking fetid remains of your father".

I dont believe Dumbledore would lie, but I do think he might hold back some of the truth if it was for his own purposes...

^_^

[mystically_mad]

Originally posted by apples

Remember in the Sorcerer's/Philosopher's Stone movie? Lily and James are seen hiding out as muggles. (Rowling actually wrote in a new chapter for those books so Kloves could write that into the script.) If they were supposed to be muggles, they would have to give up all of their magical posessions, right? James would have left that in the hands of Dumbledore for safe keeping until they could return to the magical world.

good thinking apples. that makes sense.

honestly i cant see dumbledore confiscating the invisibility cloak and then keeping it after james graduated. maybe james could have forgotten about it but DD would not have.

[lanifiel]

Perhaps James was part of the Order of the Phoniex and he gave it to Dumbledore for a mission that he was preparing to undertake. I know Dumbldore said he has other ways of going Invisible but I do think it would still drain his strength to do it, thats why he wanted to borrow the cloak...

[mystically_mad]

i was going to suggest something like that but i didnt know how to put. :bigtu:

[timmay]

sorry mad wrong window gone now.

agreed dumbls is not one to minc words but has been known to be vague especialy when dealing with Lucious Malfoy, he knew what had been gong on but chose not to say right out what he knew in fact to be true.
another egsample is when he is acting as an intermediate between Harry and Snape.
His twinkling eyes and hints of smiles.

[mystically_mad]

eggzactly (sorry)

[Sirius Black]

Dumbledore wouldn't say anything because he's clever. He's not like Harry, saying the truth and getting into trouble. And he doesn't want anyone to hate him either.

[nimbus2006]

Yes, but in the books it states multiple times that james and lily (really harry) were attacked at Godrics hollow. I am positive that this is not a muggle dwelling.

*also* the cloak could not have been taken away from james at hogwarts. We know that he usually used it to sneak out with sirius and peter. If dumbledore confiscated it, he would have known about being animagus and going to see lupin, or something to that effect.

-ps- for those few of you who said that dumbledore had the cloak because he needed it for a mission, don't you think that voldemort could see through an invisiblity cloak like dumbledore can? (CoS.. In hagrids hut) Also, in ch. 12 of SS, Dumbledore told harry that he doesn't need an invisibility cloak to be invisible.

Happy Speculating :)

[hplover_ginny]

i think maybe the cloak was in james's will or somthing ? am i wrong? :)

[FRED ASTAIRE]

Why doesn't Dumbledore need the invisibity cloak to become invisible? It was stated in the first book--re-listening to it again so that by the time the fifth comes out, I will be up to dated!

I was also wondering if Harry's aunt Petunia is REALLY is aunt! In the mirror of Erised, we see all of Harry's DEAD family right? They all have red hair and green eyes, with the exception of his father OR did I just misread that? Here is another thouhgt: If Dumbledore (I surely hope NOT) dies and Harry goes back and look in the mirror, will he see Dumbledore there?

Forgive me for being so dunce, these are some of my thoughts and I want to put it here and see what you guys thing! I love to read all your theories; makes interesting read!

[timmay]

my argument against the will is that where is everything else?
there would be more than just a cloak, the same is true if they gave up ALL of their magical possesions so that they could live as muggles where is everything else.
All im saying is that it may not have been Dumbledore who took the cloak but it came to his posesion after james death.
I can't see enough evidence in support of the cloak being given to dumbledore so that it could be returned to Harry.
It could not have been organised before hand because they didn't know that they would die and Harry would live how could they?
They had the perfect secret keeper to protect them.

[Professor_Lupin]

Yeah..... i personally think that James knew there was going to be trouble with Voldermort. Not knowing what would happen to himself, perhaps suspect that Lily and Harry would be safe. He wanted to leave something behind for Harry where he knew it wound be safe. So he left his cloak with Dumbledore and told him to pass it on to Harry when him came to Hogwarts. A sort of safety precaution so he could pass something on to he's son if something happened.

[timmay]

Yeah but if you were going to leave a cloak which true has cash value why not leave something that would have emotional value such as a letter, photos a family heirloom, ok so a cloak could well be a heirloom but it is rather impersonal.
Ok so there is also no proof that there is not anything else that is in safe keeping until it is thought that Harry has the maturity to use and understand what has been left for him.

[mystically_mad]

the cloak is very valuable, thats true and it is a family heirloom. i dont think it is impersonal at all. james got it from his father, now harry has something from his father, something very rare and valuable at that.

[GodricSlytherin]

Well As he got older he must have gotten more responsible knowng that he was going to be killed by VOldy. I think we would all mature if we were getting chased down by VOldy. And well, I think he must have tried to have fun and jokes but also had his serious side. And maybe James figured that it may come in handy in the future, and instead of losing it. He gave it to Dumbledore to keep in Hogwarts for safekeeping.
I wonder if HArry has other valuables. Like in the vault. Where did they get the key for Harry? IS there anything else in there other than money or transfigured to look like money. And why did DD take the Stne out of the vault and then all of a sudden coincidently it was broken into. I think a few of our characters can see into the future. And HArry has visons as well. BEcause of his connection with voldy and maybe because of an inhertience of being able to see visions.

[mystically_mad]

hey i forgot about the key. DD must have had that as well as the cloak. maybe he has more things for harry as well. he could have said to DD ' keep these safe for me JUST IN CASE'

[GilyAnn]

Ok, I know what JKR says "We will not see "Live" Lilly and james Potter." (Notice the " ") So don't bit me off!!!!

The reason is he gave her the cloak and the Gringotts Key AFTER he got "killed". Yes his body got killed, I do believe that but not him entirely. Think of it, how did Dumbledore got the key to Gringotts. I mean they still needed to go there. I understand you give away certain things but there are others that are well! rather important like getting money!. Dumbledore got the key an everything else After the incident.

[mystically_mad]

So who do you think is a ghost? Because, well you had a she in there.

[EvilMeghan]

Originally posted by FRED ASTAIRE:
If Dumbledore (I surely hope NOT) dies and Harry goes back and look in the mirror, will he see Dumbledore there?

Probably not, considering Harry's deepest desire is to see the family he has never known, and even in the strange event that Dumbledore and Harry are related, Dumbledore wouldn't be in the mirror because Harry has already met him.


I think when the Potters went into hiding, they hid everything valuable in either Gringotts or Hogwarts - that way, if something happened, Dumbledore would know where to find the stuff and if nothing happened, they would still be able to get it.

And Doubledore DID NOT confiscate the cloak from James, or else he wouldn't give it back to Harry - that just wouldn't make sense!

[mystically_mad]

Exactly Meghan

[Ashkins]

Dumbledore does speak about how close James and he were so close both while he was a student and later as an adult.
So it does make sense James would trust Dumbledore with all this possesions.

[mystically_mad]

Yes it does if James trusted DD like Harry does.

[timmay]

James and Lilly went into hiding at godrics hollow. That leads me to think that that is not there home nor where they lived before Voldemorte came after them.

You think that their house may still be around and full of their stuff or was the house sold and all the poters belongings put into storage?

If the Potters are a long line of money it would stand to reasion that the house was grand and if James had no siblings then he would have alot of stuff.
All so after the Deaths of Lilly and James the entire wizarding world went all soft and slushy, which leeds me to thinik the house would have been left as is for Harry when he was older.

[mystically_mad]

Yeah, I hope it all still there. Wow timmy you are getting into all the threads.

[timmay]

Got a feeling that old Sirrius will be cleared in this book so he will give Harry the chance to return to his home (Harry's not Sirrius's) to have a look around. Or Harrya t least will be given the oppentunity to travle somewhere to relive and or experience his family.

What if the mirror of erised can be charmed to act as a gateway to your desire much as a pensive is a gateway to somebodies memories.

[sugarquill]

Ok heres my theory. The Potters knew that their lives were in danger, hence the hiding. So they put all their valuables in gringotts and gave DD the key for safe keeping. Wheres the confusion here?

[Butterfly]

I agree with you sugarquil. Voldemort was the darkest wizard of time and he could kill anyone. So the Potters knew they were bound to die. Therefore, they kept everything safe.

[JoFaye]

The Potters were aware they were being looked for by Voldemort. Why wouldn't James keep the robe in an attempt to hide his family?

[Puffskein]

It sounds like they thought the Fidelius Charm would be enough to protect them. James could have had all sorts of personal reasons for giving Dumbledore the cloak.

[Animagi Girl]

Perhaps Dumbledore confiscated it while James was at Hogwarts? James did break a lot of rules at Hogwarts. Dumbledore would have had a lot of reasons for confiscating it.

[FoolOnTheHill]

Originally posted by JoFaye (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=209558#post209558))
The Potters were aware they were being looked for by Voldemort. Why wouldn't James keep the robe in an attempt to hide his family?


Well...... I think an invisibility cloak wouldn't fool Voldemort. He's way too powerful.

I agree that the Potter's knew they were in danger, so they put their valuables in safe hands. You can't get much safer then Dumbledore. I think...:whistle:

[timmay]

There must be more! I don't believe no one has given harry a sense of his family yet. What is the big dark secret they don't want him to know?

[Picko]

Well...... I think an invisibility cloak wouldn't fool Voldemort. He's way too powerful.

Hmm...I don't know. Could Dumbledore do so? I don't believe it says anywhere that he can so maybe Voldemort would be fooled too. That said James probably didn't need or use it because he thought he was completely safe with the secret keeper.

[timmay]

Dumbledore has developed a sixth sense as such perhaps. Or is he able to see Auras as they are not visable to the naked eye the invisability clooooack has no effect on them.

[Picko]

Perhaps we don't really know.

Does anyone think the fact that Dumbledore can turn himself invisible naturally might play a part in the series?

[go_anna40]

Originally posted by pasalita (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=48693#post48693))
I vibe with Sinistra. It could be that James left DD that Invisibility Cloak at the time he graduated from Hogwarts. You know - he'd no longer be using it to sneak around Hogwarts, which is what he probably used it for, and giving it to DD to "pass" on, or hold onto, in case any of his children went to Hogwarts, might have been a way for James to say, "It's been fun, but it's time to grow up."

Um...I also lean the same way.

Or maybe Dumbledore confiscated it.

Or James had a...eh...vision and gave to DD just in case. Like a gut feeling.

I'm not sure myself.

[sugarquill]

I dont think that the cloak was a novelty item Ron said that it was very rare. No I still think that it was left in gringotts with the rest of the valuables besides I agree with all who said that it wouldnt fool voldi he'd see right through it.

[mystically_mad]

Thats a good theory sugarquill. James left all his valuables possesions in DD hands before the Fidelius Charm was performed.

[timmay]

But it was thought that the Fidelus charm was fool proof, they were safe, there fore no reason was neded to make allowences for the big "What if"
Using Petter Petigrue was thought to be a stroke of genius.

If anyone is going to start saying that things were left in safe keeping for Harry later on there the problems assert themselves.
a) How could they know that they would be betrayed?
b) How could they know that Harry would survive and they wouldn't?
c) If you are going to leave a cloak, why not anything else?

So did they know that they were going to die (Trewlawny's first prediction?) then why fulfill the prediction, I know they might have made the effort to beat it by changing their secret keeper and moving to a secret location. but then if they thought that they were indeed safe why bother leave anything in safe keeping?

Dumbledore doesn't need a cloak to be invisable.

If a harmless blank piece of parchment can be confiscated (The Marauders Map)
why not an invisability cloak.

Invisability cloaks are extremly valuable, James's family is old money, old money= old house/mannor/Castle.
Voldemorte killed tham at godrics hollow in a cottage.
So Harry's home is still standing allong with the rest of his parents possesions as he doesn't have any other family.(That we know)
And are too good to just leave in someones keeping to wait for a good home. Even someone in need.

[mystically_mad]

Maybe Filch confiscated the Cloakand DD found out and meant to send it to James but didnt. Maybe thats why he goes on about the 'whats right and whats easy' thing because it was easier not to send the cloak to James but it wasnt right and then James was killed.

[timmay]

I could agree with that theory. It has merit.

[Scotlandking85]

Everyhting is possible until one is proved true.

[Scotlandking85]

Personally I think that James could of left many valuable items with DD.

[timmay]

Then where are they?

[lanifiel]

Still in Dumbledores possesion until he decides Harrys ready for them?

[timmay]

A ha...
But why leave valuable items with value to Harry if your not going to give him them... wouldn't they make excelent birthday and christmas presents? So why not cough them up at apropriate times for the last 4 years.

And if they are so great why not let Harry have them so that he is familar with them and their uses?

[sugarquill]

What if the Potters had other vaults at gringotts the stuff could be kept there seperate from the money vault. Also even if the fidelus charm was foolproof, and we know that nothing is really, it was also prudent to keep all the valuable items away in a bank, after all thats what most people do and their lives aren't under mortal threat.

[Phoenix_Fawkes]

I think james just "grew up" he dosnt really need an invisibility cloak anymore hes a wizard that could turn himself invisible if he wantd like dumbledore perhaps? He probably gave it to dumbledore to give to harry so when harry went to hogwarts he could enjoy it like he did. Thats my veiw on it anyways.

[JoFaye]

Harry is always leaving the cloak somewhere. Maybe James just forgot it and didn't bother looking for it because he could become invisible without it. Some people have the power to see people in invisibility cloaks. Maybe if you become invisible without it, they can't see you.

[mystically_mad]

That could be it. I cant see James leaving it with DD to give to Harry when he went to Hogwarts because why couldnt he give to Harry himself?

[PeterDB]

Why of why would Dumbledore confiscate an item, an item that can be used for more than enough troublemaking from one of the best students' to ever be taught at Hogwarts? A close friend and ally? Would he not have given it back at the end of James' school life? And arguments like "He forgot it" won't pass. The cloack had a lot of value to James.

For Dumbledore to then return it to his James' son to cause more trouble? Sorry timmay but if you like to remain stubborn in your own ways without an ounce of common sense you will never see that your theory is flawed on every level.

James obviously, at some point for some reason left it in Dumbledore's possesion. Whether it was to pass down to Harry I don't know, but it certainly wasn't confiscated.

[EvilMeghan]

The Potters knew they were in danger, and presumably, left some of their possesions with people in case one or all of them came out alive. I don't think they took most of their stuff with them when they went into hiding, but I could be wrong. It is possible, then, that Dumbledore has other items of James' and will give them to Harry when he feels Harry is ready for them.

[timmay]

Dude I so gave up on Dumbledore confiscating the cloak months ago...
It always pays to read contemporary posts.

Dumbledore likes a little cahos that much is quite obvious why else would he be so leniant on rule brakers, and let Peeves get up too his own devices.

Its true that I am often stuborne untill I see compeling evidence to the contrary, then I am more than willing to adjust my views.
No one personal can be right all the time, but neither can they be wrong.

[mystically_mad]

Besides we cant say anything is definite until JK says its definite so you shouldnt chastise someone for sticking to their own views.
I think that the Potters would have left their valuables in the bank account and given the key to DD. Then after they were killed he might have taken it out except for the money. After all 'aint no place safer to keep anything; cept maybe Hogwarts;.

[JoFaye]

Well, I hope Dumbledore will explain this to Harry in the next book. The scholastic site has a couple of quotes from the new book, and DD says to Harry something like.

"Sit down, Harry. There are things I need to tell you."

Similar to that anyway. So maybe the cloak will be one of them.

[mystically_mad]

"Sit down Harry. Im going to tell you everything I should have told you 5 years ago" or something similar to that.
I cant wait to find out what everything is.

[Evreka]

OK, so... I have only read the first page in this thread, not all 6 of them. I hope that's OK, and that I won't say exactly the same thing as someone else, but I simply don't have time to go though all posts... :( unfortunately.

I thought quite a bit about this, and I've come up with more question marks than answers... but just the same. To begin with and as a very late comment based on other comments on the first page: I don't believe the Cloak was condfiscated. To begin with obviously, I think, James had a very good relation to Dumbledore. Why else would D. have offered to be his Secret Keeper? So, no, I don't think a very rare and valuable object that belonged to the Potter family was confiscated at Hogwarts. Also, in that case the Cloak wouldn't have "been left in D:s possession", you simply don't formulate it as such if it was confiscated. So James gave it to Dumbledore willingly. But why? Think of the situation at hand:

James gave it willingly to Dumbledore while he was alive, ie when Voldemort was going strong.

So far, IMO this inclines that James gave it away when (or shortly before) the Fidelius Charm was carried out. If the Charm worked, they wouldn't need the Cloak themselves, if it didn't the Cloak wouldn't help them. So they didn't need it, for the time being. But... James believed that Sirius was his true friend, even if he wasn't sure of Remus, he was 100% sure of Sirius loyality. And Sirius was thinking of going into hiding himself. Peter, Potters secret keeper, too (officially). So, why didn't James lend the Cloak to either Sirius or Peter, who might have needed it to hide from Voldemort? Why, instead, give it to Dumbledore who didn't need it to become invisible (See PS/SS)????

Let's do a little thinking experiment. Suppose this situation occured: Harry doesn't need the Cloak for a year - he knows that. Ron *must* hide from something. If Harry lend him the Cloak, he'll be safer. But of course there isn't any garuantee that it'll be enough to help him. However without it Ron doesn't stand but half the chance he has with it. If Harry lends him the Cloak and it isn't enough, he'll not only loose Ron, but also the Cloak itself. Harry's alternative is to keep the Cloak safe. What does Harry do? Do you really think that he'll rather keep the Cloak safe than try to help Ron? Does it seem the least bit likely?

Well, the thing is... IMO this is the choice that James had. And he preferred to give the Cloak to Dumbledore for safe keeping (presumably) instead of putting it to use!!! And I ask myself: WHY???

What are your thoughts on this?

[Yadiami]

Evreka: That's very interesting. If James valued more the Cloak than his friends lifes, that won't say much about him. (Could it be that Snape was right in that point? I don't think so, but you never know.)
But maybe Sirius, Lupin and Petigrew knew how to be invisible by themselves, so they didn't need it, although we've only heard of DD doing that and I don't think other wizards know how to do it.

[IAmAPotterHead]

Ok everyone thinks that Dumbledore gave Harry the Invisibility Cloak, but I don't. I think that it was Snape who gave it to him. Both James and Snape knew that it was a very powerful item and didn't want to find out what the consequences would be if Voldie got his hands on it. So James gave it to Snape, because he was his arch nemesis and no one would suspect him, while Voldie was in power and after him. He told him to hold onto it and that he would come back later. And then Snape was like ok what do i do with it if you don't come back? And James told him to give it to his
son. So when Harry came to Hogwarts, Snape gave him the cloak. Also, everywhere you go, Snape either has or knows about the cloak. It's kinda like Harry wanting to do something incredibly sneaky. So who would he turn to? Malfoy

[mystically_mad]

Originally posted by Evreka (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=228786#post228786))

Let's do a little thinking experiment. Suppose this situation occured: Harry doesn't need the Cloak for a year - he knows that. Ron *must* hide from something. If Harry lend him the Cloak, he'll be safer. But of course there isn't any garuantee that it'll be enough to help him. However without it Ron doesn't stand but half the chance he has with it. If Harry lends him the Cloak and it isn't enough, he'll not only loose Ron, but also the Cloak itself. Harry's alternative is to keep the Cloak safe. What does Harry do? Do you really think that he'll rather keep the Cloak safe than try to help Ron? Does it seem the least bit likely?

Well, the thing is... IMO this is the choice that James had. And he preferred to give the Cloak to Dumbledore for safe keeping (presumably) instead of putting it to use!!! And I ask myself: WHY???

What are your thoughts on this?

Maybe James did lend it to Sirius and Sirius knew he would be arrested because he was framed so he sent it to DD but said it was from James and told DD to give it to Harry when Harry was ready for it. Then DD thinks it was from James.

[hermiones mum]

Had James seen that Harry would survive an attack but would need extra help until he was confident enough to depend on his natural talents to evade/defeat Voldemort.

But giving the cloak to Dumbledore, does that mean he thought Harry would be looked after by him, rather than the Dursleys?

[timmay]

Which leads to an interesting point, did Voldemorte only wish to kill Hary and not his Parents, but we still do not know why it was that Voldemorte wished to kill any of the Potters in the first place.

And I still believe that the point I made some time ago that Dumbledore retrieved the cloak after the death of Lilly and James could hold truth.
Harry has lead an extremly sheltered existance, concerning what he has been allowed to learn about his family and the surcumstances surounding their deaths.

[mystically_mad]

I think Moldie Voldie wanted to kill James and Harry, but Lily didnt have to die.

[timmay]

That was stated in the books by Voldemorte paraphrasing"She needent have died..." or too that effect.

Much is not known but perhaps soon will be.

Did the Potters hide in plane site? In their home or did they move away?
I want to know if their house still stands, or that of Harry's Grandparents?

[mystically_mad]

I hope Harry goes to see Godric's Hollow.

[JoFaye]

Originally posted by IAmAPotterHead (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=229165#post229165))
Ok everyone thinks that Dumbledore gave Harry the Invisibility Cloak, but I don't. I think that it was Snape who gave it to him. Both James and Snape knew that it was a very powerful item and didn't want to find out what the consequences would be if Voldie got his hands on it. So James gave it to Snape, because he was his arch nemesis and no one would suspect him, while Voldie was in power and after him. He told him to hold onto it and that he would come back later. And then Snape was like ok what do i do with it if you don't come back? And James told him to give it to his
son. So when Harry came to Hogwarts, Snape gave him the cloak. Also, everywhere you go, Snape either has or knows about the cloak. It's kinda like Harry wanting to do something incredibly sneaky. So who would he turn to? Malfoy

Dumbledore tells Harry that he sent him the cloak in book #1.

[Evreka]

From PS/SS
Harry said, "And the invisibility cloak - do you know who sent it to me?"
"Ah - your father happened to leave it in my possession, and I thought you might like it." Dumbledore's eyes twinkled. "Useful things... your father used it mainly for sneaking off to the kitchens to steal food when he was here."
Sirius couldn't have sent it from Azkaban, if he had had it then, he would have used it to escape - to get to Dumbledore and explain.

But there is another possibility, I guess. What if the Cloak is sooo valuable that it is MORE important to keep it safe, than to put it to use. Only thing is ;) that I can't come up with any plausible reason for this...

[EvilMeghan]

Originally posted by Evreka (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=231202#post231202))
What if the Cloak is sooo valuable that it is MORE important to keep it safe, than to put it to use. Only thing is ;) that I can't come up with any plausible reason for this...

So dangerous in the wrong hands that they would rather not risk losing it to the dark side?

[Evreka]

Originally posted by EvilMeghan (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=232582#post232582))
So dangerous in the wrong hands that they would rather not risk losing it to the dark side?

Only problem is, we know that aurors - or at least Alistair Moody, the genuine guy - can look straight through it... so it can't be for the Invisibility in itself... or can it? What if not all aurors can see through it....?

[timmay]

Not all Aurors just those that have a magic glass eye, that looks real freaky.

And Dumbledore can't see through them either he just waited long enough to see Harry take his off.

[Potter80]

James knew he was in danger so he left his cloak with Dumbledore just in case anything happened.

[smartypants]

If he knew he was in danger it makes more sense to keep it. I think Dumbledore or somebodye else in Dumbledores vicinity, needed it for some reason.

[mystically_mad]

Originally posted by Evreka (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=231202#post231202))
Sirius couldn't have sent it from Azkaban, if he had had it then, he would have used it to escape - to get to Dumbledore and explain.


I meant he sent it before he was captured.

[FlyingPhoenix]

It´s a realy good question, but after some thinking. I have a theory.
James have to see DD before the Hiding Charm(I don´t know how the name is, maybe fibulus.) performed. He give the Cloak to him, while he could`nt use it anymore. Why haven´t he take it to the Bank? If he was in danger, he would´nt go in the Diagon Alley. I think at this time was it very dangerous walking there around, so he gave it to DD. I don`t think that James was thinking he would be killed no matter what. Why should he and his Family go hide? What about his father, why haven´t he give the cloak to him? May be he was already death. I think at this time he and Harry was the last Potters and Lilly´s Parents are death either.

[smartypants]

So what's wrong with the simple explanations? Why must everything be so complicated all the time? :)

[timmay]

Too true.

Magic

[Picko]

I think at this time he and Harry was the last Potters and Lilly´s Parents are death either.

Well the Dursley's are recognises as Harry's only living relatives at the start of PS and Lily's parents are muggles so they wouldn't be death eaters.

[FlyingPhoenix]

I haven´t mean to say that they deatheaters. I wanted say that they death. There is nobody who would take the cloak. Thats why DD have it.

[mystically_mad]

I think you mean dead, not death flyingphoenix.

[timmay]

Which begs the question why are all Harry's magical relitives "dead"?

I don't think they are just that Harry was given to the Dursleys because the magical comunity is far to close nit to keep him safe,
And then of course Dumbledore didn't want him to get a big head from being famous, he says so to McGonagal before he leaves harry on the Dursleys door step.

[mystically_mad]

Still i think that the Dursleys are probably his closest relatives alive.

[Potter80]

I think James would have gotten his cloak back after he left school.

[timmay]

but not if it was not Dumbledore who confiscated it but another teacher or Filch, could have been at the same time as the marauders map was taken away.

It is most likley that the cloak came into Dumbledores possesion after James death, something to remember him by.

[Potter80]

James knew he was in danger. Dumbledore volunteered to be the Potters secret keeper. Perhaps James gave Dumbledore the cloak then.

[timmay]

Dumbledore doesn't need a cloak to be invisable.
And they were safe there was no need to put anything in safe keeping.

If they had there would be more than just a cloak, think about it.

If it was Dumbledore that confiscated it at school then he would have returned it when James finished or at the end of the school year bot hold onto it.

[Potter80]

James might of known Harrys great destiny and wanted to give it to Dumbledore to give to Harry when Harry went to school.

[mystically_mad]

Yeah, a memento.
But DD says that Jamesleft it in his keeping before his death.

[Potter80]

O.K. maybe James did get it confescated and when Dumbledore wanted to give it back he told Dumbledore to give it to his son when he went to school.

[mystically_mad]

I dont know, I just dont think it was confiscated.

[Potter80]

I don't really think it was confiscated either. There are just so many ways he could have got the cloak I don't want to rule out any. I just wonder why if he didn't know Harry was going to be there. It just seems he knew he might be in trouble.

[mystically_mad]

There are so many possibilities that we will have to wait.

[Potter80]

Yah, we will have more info in a couple of months. I can hardly wait!

[mystically_mad]

Me neither. I am so going to use my new sleeping bag and camp on the front door lol.

[Potter80]

Sounds fun

[Rien]

I actually have no idea where this belongs, so the Misc forum is as good as any. :tu:

Well, I was watching the Sorcerer's Stone tonight to ring in Harry and JKR's birthday, and when Christmas came 'round, a lightbulb flared over my head. Okay, Dumbledore gives Harry his father's Invisibility Cloak with the attached note that reads: "Your father left this in my possession before he died. Use it well." Aside from the normal 'well that's a strange letter' vibe that scene always sent me, the note itself is just weird because, I thought, why would James leave his prized cloak to DD to pass to Harry? Seems like he would have left it with Sirius (who he could have never guessed wouldn't be able to perform his godfather duties) or someone a bit closer if he REALLY wanted it passed to Harry if he died, which he didn't really expect to, I don't think. ANYWAY, I started thinking about the note again, and I think JKR was hinting at the OotP -- alluding to the reason why James and DD seemed to be in such close company -- in this movie (and indeed, Book 1) by wording the note that way: James did in fact leave his cloak with DD, not specifically because he wanted it passed to Harry on the offchance he died, but as a contribution to the Order. He 'donated' it to the Order's cause -- remember, they have 2 (?) invisibility cloaks in Book 5 -- but when he died, it became sole property of the Order. When the Order "broke up" after Voldemort's fall, I assume DD was in charge of either keeping up with everything or delegating responsibilities to various members ("You're in charge of holding onto these notes, you're responsible for not losing these maps, etc"). It was therefore Dumbledore's perogative to pass the cloak from the Order's safekeeping on to Harry, who was it's rightful recipient anyway.

Erm, I don't suppose this post had any real point except to share my excitement (heh) with y'all and see if maybe someone understands where I'm coming from here. Sorry it's so long, I tend to ramble when I'm sleepy. :D

[sophieke]

I think you are right~~lovely theory.
I mean, DD was the leader of the Order before Voldey fell, so James must have lend the Order his cloak. After he died, I guess DD just kept it safe with him, and when the time came, he passed it on to Harry.

[Ch0 chang]

maybe SB called DD to passs it to harry?

[roz]

maybe SB called DD to passs it to harry?

He can't have because in PS not even Dumbledore knew that Sirius was innocent.

Roz.

[saz]

Thats good theory but i don't agree. I think James gave it DD because he thought Siruis might give the cloak to Harry when he was to young.

[rotsiepots]

I'm going to merge this thread with a topic entitled James giving Dumbledore the invisibility cloak (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=1860).

:)

[cruplover]

Sturgis had one of the cloaks when he was taken, right? And Moody has the other. If, in the small group "we" know as the Order, there are three cloaks (including Harry's), are they really THAT rare?

That doesn't necessarily fit the thread, but I wonder...

I think Dumbledore is much more aware and involved in the general wizarding world than we've seen. I think this is what JKR was implying when she mentioned that Dumbledore travels via thestral on long trips. Maybe he picked up the cloak in the ruins of the Potter home, knowing that in ten years, young Harry would be at Hogwarts. Maybe he's a seer too?

[Mander]

James could have had a will. I mean, the order should have them, shouldn't they? The weasley's especially. They maybe not be the wealthiest, but seven kids....I mean, they're gonna need stuff if anything should ever hppen to them (God firbid) but yeah...James and Lilly plus the rest of the order could have had wills.

[mystically_mad]

I agree with Rien, thats a pretty good theory.