Paganism

[Kobila]

Definition of Paganism:

A polytheistic or pantheistic nature-worshipping religion which incorporates beliefs and ritual practices from ancient traditions.

There are quite a few threads on Christian beliefs and the Christian God but I'm curious if there are any fellow Pagans out there? I for one believe in the Mother Earth in something like a "blanket" pressence around earth that we are all conected to, this describes it simply in words better than mine

1. Love for and Kinship with Nature. Reverence for the life force and its ever-renewing cycles of life and death.

2. A positive morality, in which the individual is responsible for the discovery and development of their true nature in harmony with the outer world and community. This is often expressed as 'Do what you will, as long as it harms none'.

3. Recognition of the Divine, which transcends gender, acknowledging both the female and male aspect of Deity.
The Pagan Federation.

There are vast difference from one Pagans belief over anothers so if any one wants to ask questions of discuss there beliefs please post away! But be kind and open minded, what sounds odd to you is another persons religion.

Some of you interested might want to check out this link
Pagan in Christianity (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=22015&highlight=pagan) My apologies if another thread is available for discussion, I didn't find one.

[SilverStar]

You did a search?

Anyway, woohoo! I'm learning this religion.

[Kobila]

I did do a search silver, did you find a thread?! Oh no!

What have you heard about so far?

[SilverStar]

No I didn't search, but I can for you, I was checking to see if you did!

Well, what you said sums up if up, pretty much. I've actually been getting information from Wicca sites.

[Kobila]

There are some difference between Wicca and my beliefs I dont actually practise magic, I.E chants or visualazation. It is more of a "nature" pagan. I draw energy from the air the wind the earth and water. I worship the Female the giver of life, and feel the presence of her all around and in everything that lives.

[SilverStar]

That's neat, and I actually like the sound of that path. And I know there are some differences, but these sites give some basic insight into Pagan beliefs. Any website you can provide for us?

[Kobila]

sure here you go

pagans path (http://www.paganspath.com/aware.htm)
heres a forum where ppl have asked and answered questions
pagan circle (http://foolmoon.com/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB8&page=0&view=expanded&sb=5&o=)

[SilverStar]

Thanks! Those will help not only me but others who come in here with questions. :)

[Kobila]

Thats if other come in here with questions :eyebrows: I suppose its a good indication im with in the thread rights hasn't been closed. :clap:

What do you believe in silver? One God, many gods, are arent sure?

[SilverStar]

Yes, lol. We'll find out.

I'm not really sure, I was raised as a Christian, and so that is set in my mind no matter how I try to alter it. I do believe in a Goddess, though.

[Kobila]

Do you believe she is a seperate entity from the ChristIan God? A lot of pagans look at them as one complete package a sort of personification of male and female quilities. I dont neccasasry believe the stories told about my pagan Gods, I look at them as personifications of the different sides of my God. Do you understand what I mean? The idea of birth, and death, is the Mother. The violence and murder is the Male, there are more examples but I can't think of any more

[SilverStar]

No I understand what you mean. I think of her as a separate entity, yes, but that's mostly because of my Christian upbringing. I suppose I could learn to think of her differently.

[Kobila]

Picture this, and please bare with me its hard enough to explain in person let alone in writting,

The earths ozone, its this aura of energy essentially , and it encircles the earth. Now picture a completly different energy like an Aura that also encircles the earth. This is something like a life force, an Energy Of Souls, all of earths life forces are connected and a part of this "Aura". The "Aura" is the Mother.

There are of course different levels of existence with this aura, but essentially we are all conected.

[SilverStar]

I understood that, and you made sense! That's an interesting way of looking at it, as opposed to the personified version most people see.

[thethirdman]

I've been studying a mixture of Shinto Buddhism and Paganism for the past year. I do a bit of magic like engery channeling, transfering and manipulation. I combined the two together because I like the Buddhist principles along with the Pagan beliefs. I use the Shinto pantheon because I like it. I basically identify universal forces with the names and traits used by the Shinto pantheon. I do recognize one, gender neutral source god from which everything stems.

[SilverStar]

Cool, thirdman. Can you give us more info on that?

[Kobila]

I was reading a bit of what that is, having never heard of it and it sounds really interesting, namely, The story of Izanagi and how his children where born from him,

Are you Japanese? Do you follow more Shrine Shinto, Sectarian Shinto or Folk Shinto?

[SilverStar]

Sounds like I should read up on this.

[Kobila]

I tried this (http://library.thinkquest.org/12865/mray/shi2.htm) Silver, it seems to give a very general understanding of Shinto.

[SilverStar]

Ah thanks flutter!

[thethirdman]

I was reading a bit of what that is, having never heard of it and it sounds really interesting, namely, The story of Izanagi and how his children where born from him,

Are you Japanese? Do you follow more Shrine Shinto, Sectarian Shinto or Folk Shinto?

I'm not Japanese, but I've lived there and I find I identify strongly with them. I'm not with any sort of organized group. 18 years of Catholicism has turned me off of organized religion in most any form. I basically take what I identify with from each and use them to better myself.

[Kobila]

You know I think thats the best way to do it , look inside your self and see what works for you, I am not ashamed to say I sample from many different religious beliefs to come up with my own theory of things.

Do either of you have any ideas about reincarnation or where the after life comes in to your beliefs?

[thethirdman]

I believe in reincarnation and that there are old souls and new souls. The more mature someone is could be because they have an older soul. I'm still exploring what I believe on it. I've got a few answers that I think are right.

[Kobila]

I think religion should be an ever changing thing, you should always update your beliefs with maturitry and insight,
as far as reincarnation is concered I beleive in it to a certain extent, as everything is connected to the earths aura, in the in the end when your life force goes out it becomes one with everyone and never essentially goes away.

[SilverStar]

I'm not Japanese, but I've lived there and I find I identify strongly with them. I'm not with any sort of organized group. 18 years of Catholicism has turned me off of organized religion in most any form. I basically take what I identify with from each and use them to better myself.

:agree: I too, think that's the best way to do it. And I went through 18 years of being a United Methodist. :no: I now feel the same way.

And I guess I'm an old soul, then. :lol:

[crookshanks1177]

I'm not Japanese, but I've lived there and I find I identify strongly with them. I'm not with any sort of organized group. 18 years of Catholicism has turned me off of organized religion in most any form. I basically take what I identify with from each and use them to better myself.

Lol my Catholicism didn't quite last 18 years. Well I don't think it ever really existed. My religion was strongly forced on me by my mother when I was younger. And the stubborn soul that I am didn't appreciate that at all therefore I kind of rebelled in search of other information. I've never been able to accept organized religion myself. I like the ideas of taking ideas from different areas and seeing how it applies to myself. How old were you when you lived in Japan? I lived in Okinawa for a year when I was 10. I loved it! I don't know much about Shinto. I noticed lately a lot of my friends looking towards the Buddhist religion. Isn't that the religion, well it kind of based off of the Hindu religion. I guess the best way I can explain it is from what I remember of this book I read in 10th grade..."Sidhartha" (lack of spelling?). He went through the world in search of Nirvana. And through Karma he eventually reached Nirvana and basiclly became what is now known as Buddah. I'm not absolutly sure if i'm remembering that story correctly. But I do remember when I read that book I took a lot of interest in it. I'll have to find that book again lol.

[grammer]

I always wondered, if there's only one God, why people in different monotheistic religions accused people of beliving in the "wrong" god. If you really believe in only one God, who else are they worshiping(SP?)??

I also came face to face with a fundamentalist Christian that utterly confounded me. She insisted that every word in the bible was "THE WORD OF GOD." Isked her about translation mistakes and was informed that "GOD WHISPERING IN THE EAR OF THE PERSON WHO WRITES IT". I asked her how she knew and she said (get this) "BECAUSE THE BIBLE SAYS SO." Even at 13 I could see the fallacy of that idea.

(sorry for shouting, but she was shouting it at me, so I just repeated it)

As time passed, I began to hear & think and eventually I formed ideas for myself. Those ideas turned out to be paganism. Not Wicca, I don't think they are the same, although they do overlap in spots.

[Kobila]

Grammer I had no idea you were Pagan, please dont take this the wrong way but I thought you were a Christain. I for one dont want to tell anyone there God is wrong, who am I to say such a thing? I do however like to ask questions on why they feel the way they do, and it irks me too when they use the Bible to prove there point. It seems somewhat silly to me.

[busy91]

Grammer I didn't know you were Pagan...learn something new everyday.

I'm Pagan (but I am more Metaphysical), I usually keep it quiet. Most think I'm Catholic as I used to be and my children go to Catholic school. The only go there because in NYC it is not so good in the public arena.

I just can't be bothered with all the dumb questions. If someone has an honest interest I'll talk to them about it, but most want to 'bait', and then quote the Bible.

I believe there are several paths that lead us to the end which is happiness. Sadly people just can't accept that we all are different.

I belive in reincarnation and Karma also.

[grammer]

Why did you think I was christian? 'Cause I'm old? :grins:
I respect tradition, in our culture that means Judea-christian.
I once knew someone who printed T-shirts stating: Follow that old time religion, Wicca. :laughs:

[Taleeya]

Hmmm I as well take a few things from different religions and make them my own. I was raised catholic, but there are things about organized religion that I know in my heart are wrong. And I highly respect paganism for several reasons. I wonder if there should be a new category or something? Multi-Believer?? :)

[Kobila]

Hmmm I as well take a few things from different religions and make them my own. I was raised catholic, but there are things about organized religion that I know in my heart are wrong. And I highly respect paganism for several reasons. I wonder if there should be a new category or something? Multi-Believer?? :)

Thats sorta what Paganism is a individual belief in something, nothing you beleive is wrong because it is yours and yours alone.

[FoxyDoxy]

Hi
I've always felt that paganism was like a pick and mix bag (soz sounds stupid now)
In most bags of sweets there's always the ones that you don't like but you have to have in there. With a pick and mix it's all of the bits that you like. No one's forcing you have what you don't like and there's som many things for you to try.

The only solid thing for me is 'harm it none do what you will'

[Taleeya]

The only solid thing for me is 'harm it none do what you will'

And its kind of funny, because its a simple phrase, yet it encompasses so much. Respect the environment, don't abuse animals, be kind to people, even be good to yourself. I also like that paganism actually DISCOURAGES people from trying to enforce their beliefs on other people (as that would be harming them)

[grammer]

Since I believe that you create the afterlife you expect, what good would preaching do?

[Kobila]

I used to wear this cross my Mother had given me when I was a teenager and very rebellious of her, so it kind of symbolizes my mothers love and patience, but every time I wear it I get bombarded with question on whether or not Im a christian or a pagan, I guess there something wrong with wearing a cross to mean somthing other than Jesus Christ :no:

[crookshanks1177]

I used to wear this cross my Mother had given me when I was a teenager and very rebellious of her, so it kind of symbolizes my mothers love and patience, but every time I wear it I get bombarded with question on whether or not Im a christian or a pagan, I guess there something wrong with wearing a cross to mean somthing other than Jesus Christ :no:

I have a rosary my mother gave me. I've kept it for the same reason. We've had our rough times, but the rosary beads reminds me that she loves me. It is really pretty it is made out of rose pedals, I won't even take it out of the box, I don't want to get oils from my hands on it. That would mess up the beautiful scent it has. I keep it on my dresser, but people go in my room all the time so they see it. So they always assume I'm still practicing the Catholic religion. I do stand by some Catholic beliefs. But, I am more conflicted with my faith now a days. Well I have been for quite a while now. I can't really clarify where I stand when it comes to religion. I do not go to church or confession. I have not done either for over four years. This has caused a lot of problems between me and my mother. And I get a little frustrated when people question my religion when they see the rosary beads, I get tired of trying to explain it to them lol since they want to assume I'm Catholic. But I'd feel like a worse person if I lied about it.

[grammer]

No, not wrong. I assume from your post that your pagan friends are questioning your wearing the cross. Tell your friends what it represents to you, or that you wear it to honor your mother. But I don't believe that you have to change what you wish to do, just to appease your friends.

[Kobila]

I guess your right, I just keep it in a change purse in my hand bag, Its charged with such love and poitive energy and since I always hold it when I need comforting I keep it near at hand.

I have a rosary my mother gave me. I've kept it for the same reason. We've had our rough times, but the rosary beads reminds me that she loves me. It is really pretty it is made out of rose pedals, I won't even take it out of the box, I don't want to get oils from my hands on it. That would mess up the beautiful scent it has. I keep it on my dresser, but people go in my room all the time so they see it. So they always assume I'm still practicing the Catholic religion. I do stand by some Catholic beliefs. But, I am more conflicted with my faith now a days. Well I have been for quite a while now. I can't really clarify where I stand when it comes to religion. I do not go to church or confession. I have not done either for over four years. This has caused a lot of problems between me and my mother. And I get a little frustrated when people question my religion when they see the rosary beads, I get tired of trying to explain it to them lol since they want to assume I'm Catholic. But I'd feel like a worse person if I lied about it.


Have you tried listening to what your heart tells you, and ignoring any outside influence? Dont discount what feels true to you, 9 times outta 10 you know whats best for you when it comes to your spiritual beliefs.

[thethirdman]

The way I see it, the cross and the rosary are just symbols. They have no inherent power. Their power, even if it's nothing more than sentimental feeling, is given to them by the one who wears/uses them.

[Kobila]

Yes, I have a couple things I carry with me that are charged with positive energy. I even casted a protection spell on my house (cant ever be to safe yo know:p

[crookshanks1177]

Have you tried listening to what your heart tells you, and ignoring any outside influence? Dont discount what feels true to you, 9 times outta 10 you know whats best for you when it comes to your spiritual beliefs.

Thank you, yes I try very hard to do that. Just at times that is easier said then done for me. I'm such a skeptic if you know what I mean. I kind of stick to like we were discussing taking ideas from other religions and theories, and seeing which fits me best. If that makes any sense at all.

[Kobila]

Thank you, yes I try very hard to do that. Just at times that is easier said then done for me. I'm such a skeptic if you know what I mean. I kind of stick to like we were discussing taking ideas from other religions and theories, and seeing which fits me best. If that makes any sense at all.


Honestly, everyone does a little of that. I dont think there is one religion yet who has got it all right. I figure when we get the answer to the universe and all lifes little mysteries it will feel like a slap in the face, like how could we have not seen it all along :whistle:

[crookshanks1177]

Honestly, everyone does a little of that. I dont think there is one religion yet who has got it all right. I figure when we get the answer to the universe and all lifes little mysteries it will feel like a slap in the face, like how could we have not seen it all along :whistle:

Hehe yes you are right. All in all though I don't let it bother me too much. I don't really think any of us will ever discover the mystery, well not till we die...not to sound pessimistic. Other then that I don't think we'll discover the truth...atleast not in my life time.

[dementorsekiss]

well, what if i present you with a better (in my opinion) religion, a religion in which u will find soul purification, and i garantee u 100% u will like it, alas, alot in these times have shadowed it with wrong doings putting dirty marks on it that are not essentially there, but if u r willing to accept it i am not the one to point u in the wrong direction :)
Islam, is where i found peace and tranquilty of my mind, some people say it harbors terrorists i say they are thoroughly wrong, proof: let everything aside and look at the meaning of the word..
Islam means peace in Arabic, if people say that islam is terrorism then why is it the fastest growing religion on the face of the earth

and why do over millions of people memorize the Quran (muslim's book like the bible to Christian's) and why has the Quran not changed for 1425 years since it was revealed?
and why is the prophet (messenger) who brought it, Mohammed (peace be upon him) known to all kinds of religious celebrities as being the best person ever to walk on earth?
do not overlook this religion because of what is said about it by it's enemies, go and look at the inner core of it and then judge...
i would hate to see any of u on judgement day taking their work book by their left and dragged face on to hellfire,,,, i would love to walk with each one of u to paradise and enter it behind the beloved prophet Mohammed....
Thank you for hearing me out.....

[Kobila]

Wouldnt that be horrible if when we died we never get any sort of enlightenment? There wasnt a man at gates, or a boat to carry us over the river to our final destination. I think thats why Im so morbidly afraid of death, because I dont believe when you die your soul goes anywhere but back into the earths energy. I dunno its hard to explain, I just dont see there being a Heaven or a place where your soul would go to rest.

[crookshanks1177]

I've studied and researched the Islamic religion before. I have nothing against the Islamic religion. I do not associate the religion with terrorists. I'm happy for you that you found peace in the Islamic religion. It just wasn't for me. But best of luck to you.

Wouldnt that be horrible if when we died we never get any sort of enlightenment? There wasnt a man at gates, or a boat to carry us over the river to our final destination. I think thats why Im so morbidly afraid of death, because I dont believe when you die your soul goes anywhere but back into the earths energy. I dunno its hard to explain, I just dont see there being a Heaven or a place where your soul would go to rest.

Yes that would be horrible. I think I just react to the not knowing of what happens after death differently then you did. It seems you don't like the idea of "not knowing". Noone usually does. But I can't do anything about where I do after death if I have no idea about it, so I guess I really just push that thought aside and hope for the best rather than fearing it. I just hope to be able to join the ones I've lost someday. I'm having a hard time explaining my views on this also lol.

[Kobila]

well, what if i present you with a better (in my opinion) religion, a religion in which u will find soul purification, and i garantee u 100% u will like it, alas, alot in these times have shadowed it with wrong doings putting dirty marks on it that are not essentially there, but if u r willing to accept it i am not the one to point u in the wrong direction :)
Islam, is where i found peace and tranquilty of my mind, some people say it harbors terrorists i say they are thoroughly wrong, proof: let everything aside and look at the meaning of the word..
Islam means peace in Arabic, if people say that islam is terrorism then why is it the fastest growing religion on the face of the earth

and why do over millions of people memorize the Quran (muslim's book like the bible to Christian's) and why has the Quran not changed for 1425 years since it was revealed?
and why is the prophet (messenger) who brought it, Mohammed (peace be upon him) known to all kinds of religious celebrities as being the best person ever to walk on earth?
do not overlook this religion because of what is said about it by it's enemies, go and look at the inner core of it and then judge...
i would hate to see any of u on judgement day taking their work book by their left and dragged face on to hellfire,,,, i would love to walk with each one of u to paradise and enter it behind the beloved prophet Mohammed....
Thank you for hearing me out.....

Now Ill be honest with you, when I first saw your post I got a bit scared, Americans are being fed some pretty horriable things about your religion and its hard to look past the propaganda, However, I usually try to stay opened minded. Could you please give me an idea on what Islam is? Explain it to me like Im a five year old, because I am geniunely curious.

[crookshanks1177]

Now Ill be honest with you, when I first saw your post I got a bit scared, Americans are being fed some pretty horriable things about your religion and its hard to look past the propaganda, However, I usually try to stay opened minded. Could you please give me an idea on what Islam is? Explain it to me like Im a five year old, because I am geniunely curious.

Yes we are fed bad propoganda on the Islamics I admit. I know some Islamics here who get discriminated all the time. A friend of mine that I go to college with is part Arabic and afraid to admit that to people for fear of discrimination. I just can't make myself look at all Islamics as terrorists. I am very sad for the terrorist attack that happened to us. But I do know that not all Islamics follow Bin Laden or are part of Al Queda.

[Kobila]

I've studied and researched the Islamic religion before. I have nothing against the Islamic religion. I do not associate the religion with terrorists. I'm happy for you that you found peace in the Islamic religion. It just wasn't for me. But best of luck to you.



Yes that would be horrible. I think I just react to the not knowing of what happens after death differently then you did. It seems you don't like the idea of "not knowing". Noone usually does. But I can't do anything about where I do after death if I have no idea about it, so I guess I really just push that thought aside and hope for the best rather than fearing it. I just hope to be able to join the ones I've lost someday. I'm having a hard time explaining my views on this also lol.


It isnt that Im scared of not "knowing" Im scared of not being anymore, I think that when my mother dies, when my sister dies when any one in my family dies, thats it there spirit is gone and been reborn into the world as something completly different.

[crookshanks1177]

It isnt that Im scared of not "knowing" Im scared of not being anymore, I think that when my mother dies, when my sister dies when any one in my family dies, thats it there spirit is gone and been reborn into the world as something completly different.

Oh ok I think I understand. I can best associate that with reincarnation...tell me if I am wrong. I can't say I myself am scared of me dying. But I do always fear losing people I am close to, Dad, my family, friends so on so forth. If you go look in the thread about fear of dying you could get a better view of what I mean I think. It was nice talking to you, I know these topics can get offensive if taken the wrong way. I had no intention of offending you if I have. Goodnight. I'll check back later. I have early class. :p

[Kobila]

Oh ok I think I understand. I can best associate that with reincarnation...tell me if I am wrong. I can't say I myself am scared of me dying. But I do always fear losing people I am close to, Dad, my family, friends so on so forth. If you go look in the thread about fear of dying you could get a better view of what I mean I think. It was nice talking to you, I know these topics can get offensive if taken the wrong way. I had no intention of offending you if I have. Goodnight. I'll check back later. I have early class. :p


No of course not you havent offended me!

I'm not sure what to call what I think happens after death, Ive never met anyone who thinks the same way I do :nc: I think that if you were to die tomarrow you wouldnt necessarily be a human again through reincarnation. Its more like your energy dispenses all around and becomes a part or everything. What used to be your soul is now part of the air we breath and the grass we stand upon. If you want when you get back read some of my firsts posts, it kinda explains what I think.

[arwin]

wow, i like this thread a lot!! within the past 2 years i've been teaching myself the Wiccan and Pagan religions because i'm soo interested in it... i think i've always been fascinated with nature and astronomy and how elements connect. everything is connected and it takes skill to recognize how and how to use that. i do practice rituals and do spells which have worked well for me in the past. i also think i have the complete freedom to persue this type of free-spirited religion b/c my parents had different religions and weren't very religious to begin with (mom=christian, dad=muslim).

the only thing i get aggrivated about thoughm, is how many people assume it's a religion based upon satan worship, which could never be true, even if there were bad witches out there. for any skeptic, think about it this way: pagans/wiccans worship nature and coming from christianity and such, God created nature and everything in it. wouldn't it make sense then to say they worship something God has created in a good way, even though they don't believe in the one god. that's just my opinion.

but if you want to start learning more about this stuff, my search began in barnes and noble and other book stores and i have found that they have a wide and great selection of any topic related to magick, wicca, paganism, tarot, dreams, voodoo, celts...and the list goes on! searchin the web will usually find you some good sites as well and they always like to sell books offline too.

i say g'luck to anyone interested in paganism b/c it's can be exciting once you feel connected to it, but it takes some time. i still have a long way to go as well ;)

oh i also wanted to wish a Happy Samhain to everyone!!!

[Kobila]

Well Merry Met sister, always nice to meet new Pagans, I too think its funny that Pagans are look at as evil, I mean the vast majority of us dont ven belive in satan :rolleyes:

But try explaining it to some and they get so furious with you, I just assume keep it to myself ;)


I have a lot of books on the subject have you read Scott Cunningham? Hes kinda cheesy but good in a very superficial way:p

[grammer]

As many books as I've read, I have yet to read one about Paganism. I formed my beliefs and then wenting looking for a name for them.

[crookshanks1177]

wow, i like this thread a lot!! within the past 2 years i've been teaching myself the Wiccan and Pagan religions because i'm soo interested in it... i think i've always been fascinated with nature and astronomy and how elements connect. everything is connected and it takes skill to recognize how and how to use that. i do practice rituals and do spells which have worked well for me in the past. i also think i have the complete freedom to persue this type of free-spirited religion b/c my parents had different religions and weren't very religious to begin with (mom=christian, dad=muslim).

the only thing i get aggrivated about thoughm, is how many people assume it's a religion based upon satan worship, which could never be true, even if there were bad witches out there. for any skeptic, think about it this way: pagans/wiccans worship nature and coming from christianity and such, God created nature and everything in it. wouldn't it make sense then to say they worship something God has created in a good way, even though they don't believe in the one god. that's just my opinion.

but if you want to start learning more about this stuff, my search began in barnes and noble and other book stores and i have found that they have a wide and great selection of any topic related to magick, wicca, paganism, tarot, dreams, voodoo, celts...and the list goes on! searchin the web will usually find you some good sites as well and they always like to sell books offline too.

i say g'luck to anyone interested in paganism b/c it's can be exciting once you feel connected to it, but it takes some time. i still have a long way to go as well ;)

oh i also wanted to wish a Happy Samhain to everyone!!!


Is the Pagan and Wiccan religion that much related? I have known Wiccan people and even participated in the Wiccan religion when I was in Highschool, just really trying to get an understanding of it. I never considered them to do with Satan worshiping or what ever you'd like to call it. I know many Christians do view it that way. But I know man Christians that didn't consider the religions evil and found it intriguing like I did. I actually liked some of the Wiccan morals.

No of course not you havent offended me!

I'm not sure what to call what I think happens after death, Ive never met anyone who thinks the same way I do :nc: I think that if you were to die tomarrow you wouldnt necessarily be a human again through reincarnation. Its more like your energy dispenses all around and becomes a part or everything. What used to be your soul is now part of the air we breath and the grass we stand upon. If you want when you get back read some of my firsts posts, it kinda explains what I think.

Actually reading that, that is a beautiful theory. But then I started thinking about it and it kind of scared me...If we come back and become part of the air and trees and basicly the natural elements, is what I'm getting from what you are saying, what happens when we eventually destroy ourselves off. I'm not trying to sound pessimistic, but if you look back into science, from the looks of it, we're eventually going to drive ourselves into extinction or destroy our own planet as a whole. Probably not in our life time and probably not even in our children or rather future children's life time. But we are gradually breaking down and destroying our own planet. Maybe some kind of evolution will pull through and we'll manage to keep the planet around. Who knows? Like I said I don't think I'll be around to see that day.

[Kobila]

As many books as I've read, I have yet to read one about Paganism. I formed my beliefs and then wenting looking for a name for them.

since Paganism is different for almost every single person there arent too many books on Paganism, but if you look hard enough a Wiican book will have a lot of good things in it. Pagans and Wiccans are similar in the Wicca is a pagan religion, just like druids are pagan. Do you see, its like saying your christian but your really a Presbyterian, or a born again, your still a christian but you call yourself somthing specific.

Actually reading that, that is a beautiful theory. But then I started thinking about it and it kind of scared me...If we come back and become part of the air and trees and basicly the natural elements, is what I'm getting from what you are saying, what happens when we eventually destroy ourselves off. I'm not trying to sound pessimistic, but if you look back into science, from the looks of it, we're eventually going to drive ourselves into extinction or destroy our own planet as a whole. Probably not in our life time and probably not even in our children or rather future children's life time. But we are gradually breaking down and destroying our own planet. Maybe some kind of evolution will pull through and we'll manage to keep the planet around. Who knows? Like I said I don't think I'll be around to see that day.


I would imagine if the earth was to suddenly implode that we would go with it, short of that I dont think the energy would go anywhere if humans were to become extinct, the earth doesnt need humans to be part of the energy to survive, humans need the earths energy to survive, kinda humbling isnt it? Im very concerned with the destroying our planet, and wish we hadnt come up with so much technology (as I sit on my computer :rolleyes:) because it makes so much pollution and damages our mother earth :sad: I dont have a car because I figure If I cant walk there, I dont need to go.

[crookshanks1177]

since Paganism is different for almost every single person there arent too many books on Paganism, but if you look hard enough a Wiican book will have a lot of good things in it. Pagans and Wiccans are similar in the Wicca is a pagan religion, just like druids are pagan. Do you see, its like saying your christian but your really a Presbyterian, or a born again, your still a christian but you call yourself somthing specific.

Ahh ok I understand now. I wasn't sure if they were that closely related or not but I get it now. Thanks! :blush:

[Kobila]

Ahh ok I understand now. I wasn't sure if they were that closely related or not but I get it now. Thanks! :blush:

Dont be embrassed part of the reason I started this thread was to enlighten ppl about the positives in Paganism, (hence its in the spirt division) And maybe to hear what others think, religion fascinates me.

[crookshanks1177]

Dont be embrassed part of the reason I started this thread was to enlighten ppl about the positives in Paganism, (hence its in the spirt division) And maybe to hear what others think, religion fascinates me.

Lol Thanks, I wasn't embarrased, I was just trying to understand the similarities of Wiccan and Pagan and letting you know your explanation helped me understand lol.

[arwin]

hey guys, been reading your recent posts to catch up and i'm glad to see you responded to what i had to say... just to clarify though, i don't mean to say that i think that all or most christines say paganism is a satanic religion, but i've personally heard it said more often than not, but also by people influenced by all different religions/cultures... like i said before my mom is a christine but she isn't the type to wear a cross pendent everyday or go to church regularly. she grew up that way and i believe i have some christian morals instilled in me as well b/c she raised me. in fact she is a christine who practices pagan rituals as well. personally, i admire that b/c it's sort of saying you are the type of person who believes in the possibility of anything.

i was never really conformed to any particular religion growing up either, although i've tried learning about my islamic/muslim heritage, but i guess it didn't quite fit me. so i feel that my path that led me to wicca was meant to be b/c i chose it and it agrees with me, but i am still fascinated with other religions b/c i believe in the possibility of those worlds existing as well (if you can understand what i mean)! i just think that with any religion or anything you are trying to be good at, so to speak, you need practice and dedication to understand and learn something to the fullest. i'm just enjoying the process i'm taking to better understanding wiccan and myself.

[Alhanalasa]

I have a lot of books on the subject have you read Scott Cunningham? Hes kinda cheesy but good in a very superficial way:p

That's where I started, too! Wicca for the Solitary Practitoner is still one of the best references I use, being a solitary Wiccan. Also, Starhawk is a classic. I've heard good things about To Ride a Silver Broomstick, but I've never read it myself. These are all How-To sort of books. I wish I had the titles of some books that are more overviews or references, but there are lots of websites. A google search will get you tons of info.

[Kobila]

That's where I started, too! Wicca for the Solitary Practitoner is still one of the best references I use, being a solitary Wiccan. Also, Starhawk is a classic. I've heard good things about To Ride a Silver Broomstick, but I've never read it myself. These are all How-To sort of books. I wish I had the titles of some books that are more overviews or references, but there are lots of websites. A google search will get you tons of info.


To ride a silver broomstick is the most ridiculas book I have ever read, dont pick it up I have never been so offended by a books obvious fluff and inacurate facts. I would not trust that book to be correct on anything. Hehe Can you tell Im passionate about it.
Solitary Practitoner is great for begginers. It tells you to do your own spells which i like.


arwin;she grew up that way and i believe i have some christian morals instilled in me as well b/c she raised me. in fact she is a christine who practices pagan rituals as well. personally, i admire that b/c it's sort of saying you are the type of person who believes in the possibility of anything.


What dies she do thats a pagan ritual?



Any one have any special plans for the Samhain/Halloween? It is one of the most important wiccan solstice so Im figureing out what Im gonna do right now

[grammer]

I'm not sure what to call what I think happens after death, Ive never met anyone who thinks the same way I do I think that if you were to die tomarrow you wouldnt necessarily be a human again through reincarnation. Its more like your energy dispenses all around and becomes a part or everything. What used to be your soul is now part of the air we breath and the grass we stand upon. If you want when you get back read some of my first posts, it kinda explains what I think.

Flutterby (I love your posting name BTW)

MY belief is that you choose what will happen after you die, if the idea of dissolving into the "force" (for the lack of a better word) bothers you, then determine to maintain your independent thought when that happens. (Kinda like LV does when his body dies in Harry Potter books) -- Not the evil part, just the consciousness part -

[Taleeya]

Any one have any special plans for the Samhain/Halloween? It is one of the most important wiccan solstice so Im figureing out what Im gonna do right now

I pretty much just do the candy/dressup/scary movie/cartoons stuff.

But I also take the night to remember/honour people and pets that I miss. I think I have just watched far too many movies and read too many books, but I believe that Halloween Night really is a time when the barrier between this and the other world is the thinnest (cheesy, I know). Ever since I was a little girl I've always felt a spooky presence on that night, and weird things have happened to me.

[crookshanks1177]

I pretty much just do the candy/dressup/scary movie/cartoons stuff.

But I also take the night to remember/honour people and pets that I miss. I think I have just watched far too many movies and read too many books, but I believe that Halloween Night really is a time when the barrier between this and the other world is the thinnest (cheesy, I know). Ever since I was a little girl I've always felt a spooky presence on that night, and weird things have happened to me.

Lol not cheesy I have a similiar tradition honoring people and pets I miss. But I don't get sad or anything. There is something about Halloween I have always loved, just don't know what it is. It was always one of my favorite holidays. I get more excited over Halloween then I do my birthday or Christmas lol. Other than that I am going to a cook out, then trick or treating with my friends and their kids (I love to watch all the kids running around in costumes) then HORROR Movies! I love horror movies!

[Kobila]

Flutterby (I love your posting name BTW)

MY belief is that you choose what will happen after you die, if the idea of dissolving into the "force" (for the lack of a better word) bothers you, then determine to maintain your independent thought when that happens. (Kinda like LV does when his body dies in Harry Potter books) -- Not the evil part, just the consciousness part -


Thanks, I owled you once on why I like your name:p makes me think of my grandma, although your the same age as my mom :eyebrows:


I suppose that would explain the pressence of "ghosts" kinda like Sir Nickolas?

Seriously though I wouldnt be surpirised if some one was able to retain a shadow of there former selves, I mean the mind is a very powerful thing, and could quite possibly influence what happens to you upon death.



As for holloween, I plan on going outside into a secluded area and just enjoying the air and the earth, if you sit long enough with a clear mind in the middle of a garden you would be surprised at how calm you feel afterwards. It can be the perfect remedy to a very stress full day

[FoxyDoxy]

I've had to change my hallowe'en plans. I was going to do all sorts of weid and wonderfil things but my grandad died yesterday and I don't think I can face it. I'm going to take the chance to say goodbye. The catholics in my family are arranging his funeral and getting their way so I'm going to say goodbye how I want.

[crookshanks1177]

I've had to change my hallowe'en plans. I was going to do all sorts of weid and wonderfil things but my grandad died yesterday and I don't think I can face it. I'm going to take the chance to say goodbye. The catholics in my family are arranging his funeral and getting their way so I'm going to say goodbye how I want.

I am very sorry for your loss. I hope you are able to say your farewell the way you wish.

[Kobila]

I've had to change my hallowe'en plans. I was going to do all sorts of weid and wonderfil things but my grandad died yesterday and I don't think I can face it. I'm going to take the chance to say goodbye. The catholics in my family are arranging his funeral and getting their way so I'm going to say goodbye how I want.


Im sorry to hear about that, and hope your holloween isnt full of to much sorrow, just remember to celebrate his life and the lifes of his children and grandchildren,

Blessed Be dear.

[grammer]

Foxy Doxy - Just remember that his soul is where he wanted it to be.

{long story to be skipped by those uninterested}

I had a friend whose mother had passed over about a month earlier. Mt friend was quite upset and concerned about her mother's afterlife. My teacher took my friend's hand, concentrated for a bit and then said. " Your mother is running through the sprinklers with someone she loves." My friend, stunned, told us, "Mom told me once that the best time of her life was when she and her brother were kids and they'd run through the sprinklers together. My Uncle died 15 years before my Mom."

This brought a great deal of comfort to my friend. Try to think of your Grandfather as reliving the best days of his life.

I'm sorry that this sadness has come into your life.

Blessings

[crookshanks1177]

Foxy Doxy - Just remember that his soul is where he wanted it to be.

{long story to be skipped by those uninterested}

I had a friend whose mother had passed over about a month earlier. Mt friend was quite upset and concerned about her mother's afterlife. My teacher took my friend's hand, concentrated for a bit and then said. " Your mother is running through the sprinklers with someone she loves." My friend, stunned, told us, "Mom told me once that the best time of her life was when she and her brother were kids and they'd run through the sprinklers together. My Uncle died 15 years before my Mom."

This brought a great deal of comfort to my friend. Try to think of your Grandfather as reliving the best days of his life.

I'm sorry that this sadness has come into your life.

Blessings


Wow that is a great way of thinking of it... I had a really hard time getting over my great grandfather's death. I was only 12. But for some reason I always remembered my last moment with him...I'd rather not remember seeing him that way...but it touched me more then ever when he said "I love you Stephany" that day. When he said it I couldn't understand him, he was suffering really bad, and he didn't have his teeth in and my mother had to tell me what he said. But that memory of him will always be with me and be very touching to my heart.

[FoxyDoxy]

Thanks alot everyone.
I'll miss him alot but it was better that he went quickly and painlessly. He'd have hated to have lingered and have everyone worrying around him. Atleast this way my last memories of him will be of him full of life and not hanging around for months slowly deteriorating.

[grammer]

Yahoo has a link to a neo-pagan article

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/cdh/20041030/lo_cdh/realwitchestrytobreakoldmyths

It's actually pretty mellow

[Kobila]

Why did you think I was christian? 'Cause I'm old? :grins:
I respect tradition, in our culture that means Judea-christian.
I once knew someone who printed T-shirts stating: Follow that old time religion, Wicca. :laughs:

Would you be mad If I said yes :evil: :p


Having a sad day today, ive always been afraid of losing a loved one, and when some one dies I always think that Ive lost them forever.

'Blessed Be friend, may you be at peace where ever you went.'

[grammer]

It's OK - young people always think they have new ideas - and then are suprised to find out how old the idea really is.

nipple piercing was popular among the early victorians (1850 or so)

Your loved ones wouldn't want you to be sad.

Blessings

[Kobila]

[COLOR=Black]Iused to have a sig with a john lennon quote

"theres nothing you can know that isnt already known"

I sure love that man, he summed it up quite nicely there.

[nerdypants]

My mom has a few books on witchcraft, and I got into them a few years ago. I find that I identify more with this religion than with the other ones. I'm also a feminist, and I find that the monotheistic religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism), tend to be decidely male-oriented. You know, woman is the source of original sin, and all that. I don't believe people are born sinful, or good. I think there's a gray area that Christianity does not provie for. I believe that everyone has good and bad aspects to their personalities, and instead of trying to "cast out the demons," I should try to create equilibrium between the good and bad.

I'm not part of a coven or anything. I'm a solitary practitioner. If you want to know more about Wicca, I suggest reading Scott Cunningham's books, and also The Spiral Dance. They helped me learn a lot more about witchcraft. (Sadly, it's not much like harry Potter. Oh, well!) Adios, amigos!

[crookshanks1177]

Not to be rude but is Paganism and Wiccan mainly women? That just crossed my mind. I do know a few guys who practice either religion. But I know many more women who are practicing.

[Taleeya]

Well, this may be sexist, but I think women are more intuitive and open minded, therefore, making it easy to try wicca (if they haven't been exposed to it). I know a guy who is a druid, and a couple guys who do magic.

[crookshanks1177]

Well, this may be sexist, but I think women are more intuitive and open minded, therefore, making it easy to try wicca (if they haven't been exposed to it). I know a guy who is a druid, and a couple guys who do magic.

Hehe I assumed the answer would be sexist. It was a sexist question.

[Kobila]

I dont think thats necessarily true (more women than men thing) I know plenty of men who practise. I think its just that wicca is so female based, that we naturally assume men cant worship the divine female. Personally I think men have a better ability to calm down and remove all emotion to better meditate, than women do.

[grammer]

The mere fact that paganism worships both the female and the male is still a big shift from the big three (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Not only that, but movements during the middle ages were made to discredit Women's knowledge (Herbal use, midwifery etc.) Remember that Universities backed by the Church in Europe specifically excluded women as students. The logic went along these lines, a doctor has a degree, women can't get degrees, women can't be doctors, women who act as healers must therefore be witches, gotta burn witches.

[crookshanks1177]

I dont think thats necessarily true (more women than men thing) I know plenty of men who practise. I think its just that wicca is so female based, that we naturally assume men cant worship the divine female. Personally I think men have a better ability to calm down and remove all emotion to better meditate, than women do.

That's true I guess it really depends on what area you live in? I don't really see many who practice here I know a few and they are women. Although when I lived in California (when I looked into the religion more also) I knew guys who practiced, yet I still knew more women who practiced. But like you, you say you know more men who practice. By the way what do you mean by divine female? I'm just curious. Kind of like Mother Nature?

The mere fact that paganism worships both the female and the male is still a big shift from the big three (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Not only that, but movements during the middle ages were made to discredit Women's knowledge (Herbal use, midwifery etc.) Remember that Universities backed by the Church in Europe specifically excluded women as students. The logic went along these lines, a doctor has a degree, women can't get degrees, women can't be doctors, women who act as healers must therefore be witches, gotta burn witches.

Granted like you are describing or rather how I'm understanding it atleast, women are more portrayed as witches. But in learning a little about the religion I learned it was possible for a man to be a witch too.

[grammer]

True, but the majority of witches burned were female, I think ???????? maybe 10 women to 1 man. I only meant that the church institutionalized the prejudice against women. Quite a few men were burned for Heresy though.

Mother Nature?? - in a manner of speaking, I suppose so. The native Americans spoke of mother earth and father sky. Both are required for creation. In many Native America cultures, only women farmed, since mother earth provided and would give more to other women then to men. (and lots of other reasons)

If you know of the Asian concept of yin & yang; I think of the male and female more in those terms. Both are necessary, both are divine, to exclude one is to exclude the other.

Blessings

[crookshanks1177]

True, but the majority of witches burned were female, I think ???????? maybe 10 women to 1 man. I only meant that the church institutionalized the prejudice against women. Quite a few men were burned for Heresy though.

Mother Nature?? - in a manner of speaking, I suppose so. The native Americans spoke of mother earth and father sky. Both are required for creation. In many Native America cultures, only women farmed, since mother earth provided and would give more to other women then to men. (and lots of other reasons)

If you know of the Asian concept of yin & yang; I think of the male and female more in those terms. Both are necessary, both are divine, to exclude one is to exclude the other.

Blessings


I don't really know if the majority of witches burned were women or not? I always kind of wondered if the history written back then was more biased, so now when we think of witches burned at the stake we generally think of women. If that makes any sense at all lol.

[Taleeya]

The mere fact that paganism worships both the female and the male is still a big shift from the big three (Christianity, Islam, Judaism). Not only that, but movements during the middle ages were made to discredit Women's knowledge (Herbal use, midwifery etc.) Remember that Universities backed by the Church in Europe specifically excluded women as students. The logic went along these lines, a doctor has a degree, women can't get degrees, women can't be doctors, women who act as healers must therefore be witches, gotta burn witches.

This may be veering slightly off-topic, but I find it quite interesting that even in these modern times, a similar thing has happened. In Afghanistan, the Taliban banned women from working, even female doctors from working on female patients (but oh, guess what? men couldn't work on women either!). My mother has this theory that similar things may start to happen ( has anyone read the hand maid's tale?) due to the fact that goddess power is growing, some men can sense it, and some will start to do anything they can to oppress women to prevent it from happening.

[Kobila]

[QUOTE=crookshanks1177]That's true I guess it really depends on what area you live in? I don't really see many who practice here I know a few and they are women. Although when I lived in California (when I looked into the religion more also) I knew guys who practiced, yet I still knew more women who practiced. But like you, you say you know more men who practice. By the way what do you mean by divine female? I'm just curious. Kind of like Mother Nature?[QUOTE]

Yes, your right Mother Nature is another way to put it as Grammer pointed out the male and female is equally balanced and the "Mother Earth" "Sacred Female" "Divine female" all are names for the same entity.

[crookshanks1177]

This may be veering slightly off-topic, but I find it quite interesting that even in these modern times, a similar thing has happened. In Afghanistan, the Taliban banned women from working, even female doctors from working on female patients (but oh, guess what? men couldn't work on women either!). My mother has this theory that similar things may start to happen ( has anyone read the hand maid's tale?) due to the fact that goddess power is growing, some men can sense it, and some will start to do anything they can to oppress women to prevent it from happening.

No I haven't read anything like that.

[Taleeya]

No I haven't read anything like that.

Oh, Hand Maids Tale is a book by margaret atwood. Its about a future where the US is taken over by extremists, and they take away alot of things people do (entertainment, cigarettes) and single, fertile women are given to infertile couples, so that they can have children (and single women's children are taken away from them, because they are like, "sinful"). Women basically have no rights. And the way its done is scary, because it almost seems POSSIBLE. ick! It was quite disturbing, I think there was a movie made from the book as well.

[crookshanks1177]

Oh, Hand Maids Tale is a book by margaret atwood. Its about a future where the US is taken over by extremists, and they take away alot of things people do (entertainment, cigarettes) and single, fertile women are given to infertile couples, so that they can have children (and single women's children are taken away from them, because they are like, "sinful"). Women basically have no rights. And the way its done is scary, because it almost seems POSSIBLE. ick! It was quite disturbing, I think there was a movie made from the book as well.

From reading your synopsis of the book it does seem kind of creepy, possible and creepy. I hope that never happens.

[Adritha]

I am currently an atheist, but I am exploring paganism. I was raised in the orthodox religion, which is extremely boring. My grandmother is a little obsessed with going to church, but she hasn't been able to drag me there for a long time. I keep quiet about paganism, but I admit that I am an atheist. I also explore the ancient gods of my country, from Dacia (later Dacia Felix, under the Romans, now known as Romania).

[crookshanks1177]

I am currently an atheist, but I am exploring paganism. I was raised in the orthodox religion, which is extremely boring. My grandmother is a little obsessed with going to church, but she hasn't been able to drag me there for a long time. I keep quiet about paganism, but I admit that I am an atheist. I also explore the ancient gods of my country, from Dacia (later Dacia Felix, under the Romans, now known as Romania).

I can't really claim to be a specific religion. Most the people on this thread are great to ask any questions to though if you have questions. I come in here all the time when I'm curious about something and ask them and they always give me good information and are very nice.

[Taleeya]

Hmmm Adritha, it kinda sounds like you are more "undecided" than athiest. Hopefully you can find what's right for you.

[Kobila]

I am currently an atheist, but I am exploring paganism. I was raised in the orthodox religion, which is extremely boring. My grandmother is a little obsessed with going to church, but she hasn't been able to drag me there for a long time. I keep quiet about paganism, but I admit that I am an atheist. I also explore the ancient gods of my country, from Dacia (later Dacia Felix, under the Romans, now known as Romania).

When you say your an athiest does that mean you dont believe in any higher power, I admit Im ignorant when it comes to athiest and agnostics I havent a clue what the difference is in the two. if any at all. But as crookshanks said if you have any questions feel free to ask, were very open here and have no problem sharing our beliefs, well I dont at any rate.

edit: I just looked up the two in the dictionary and atheist do not believe in a god and agnostics dont beleive either way, sort of indifferent.

[crookshanks1177]

When you say your an athiest does that mean you dont believe in any higher power, I admit Im ignorant when it comes to athiest and agnostics I havent a clue what the difference is in the two. if any at all. But as crookshanks said if you have any questions feel free to ask, were very open here and have no problem sharing our beliefs, well I dont at any rate.

edit: I just looked up the two in the dictionary and atheist do not believe in a god and agnostics dont beleive either way, sort of indifferent.

One of my friends is agnostic. He said agnostic is basicly "open to suggestion" that made perfect sense to me for some odd reason. Kind of like open to what anyone says and takes in what information makes the most sense to them.

[grammer]

An Atheist does NOT believe in a higher power. An Agnostic believes in the power, but not in a church. I think that's the difference.

[FirefightingMuggle]

There's a good thread about Athiets and Agnostics that I found after reading some of the posts in this thread. Check it out here (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=4206)

I think that too often Pagans get lumped into this category with athiests and agnostics as being "evil". Really, that isn't true. Just because you believe in something different, does not ever make it evil. Someone once told me that I was a devil worshipper. I told them that they were wrong, I can't worship the Devil because I don't believe that he exists. :eyebrows: I think that threads like this one are good threads because they help people to understand those who are different then themselves.

[Kobila]

There's a good thread about Athiets and Agnostics that I found after reading some of the posts in this thread. Check it out here (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=4206)

I think that too often Pagans get lumped into this category with athiests and agnostics as being "evil". Really, that isn't true. Just because you believe in something different, does not ever make it evil. Someone once told me that I was a devil worshipper. I told them that they were wrong, I can't worship the Devil because I don't believe that he exists. :eyebrows: I think that threads like this one are good threads because they help people to understand those who are different then themselves.


Thanks, and I agree. Thats pretty much why I started this thread, I saw a lot of christianity ones, whether they believed it or not its been discussed to death, and I only have so much to say on the matter:nc:

Oh by the way I planted a tree yesterday in a park with some friends, were all kinda dorky like that :rolleyes: I said a little prayer from everyone there, its so cute only about 2 feet high:D

[Gabi R]

I am a pagan, as are my sister and mother. We were all raised as Jehovah's Witnesses. I have been on my own path for 14 years now.

Gabi

[FirefightingMuggle]

General question for everyone: What attracted you to Paganism originally?

For me, I was always a nature lover. When I found a religion that was based around natural things and natural powers, I wanted to know more.

[Alhanalasa]

General question for everyone: What attracted you to Paganism originally?

I was raised in a rather Spartan version of Christianity: no frills, no nonsense. When I decided it wasn't right for me anymore, I started searching for something that was. In college, I took a class on Gnosticism (fascinating academically, but not spiritually) and another on Hinduism (same reaction) before I started reading about paganism. It just clicked for me. It was like reading something I'd known a long time ago but forgotten. :D Cheesy, I know, but that's what it was like. Besides the actual teachings of Wicca, I like the mysticism of it: bits that were missing from my upbringing. Sometimes I think if I'd been raised Catholic, I'd never have become Wiccan. However much I disagree with the Church, at least they have the mysticism part down.

[crookshanks1177]

General question for everyone: What attracted you to Paganism originally?

For me, I was always a nature lover. When I found a religion that was based around natural things and natural powers, I wanted to know more.

The Catholic religion was forced on me pretty hard growing up. In turn I became kinda bitter towards the church. So, I guess I just branched out looking into other religions. I can't say I claim a specific religion, but I like to hear different sides input on the subject if you know what I mean.

[Kobila]

Ive always been offended by chrisians (or at least eh ones who push there religion on you) and searched for something that felt right for me. Ive always been calmed by nature and have always felt the pressence of the divine female, just didnt know thats what I was feeling. Now that im Pagan Ifeel like ive come home after a very long confusing trip.

[grammer]

I like the fact that my beliefs don't conflict with anyone else's. My religion is all-inclusive rather than all-exclusive. Many of the Christian, Jewish and Islamic sects appear to completely exclude non-believers.

I can't bring myself to believe in a God (and/or Goddess) that excludes people with no ability to have heard any word of a specific religion. There must have been good people in Asia or North America, or South Africa who never had a chance to hear the Bible. Would a just, caring God exclude them from Paradise? I had to conclude that a God I can believe in would not. So I began my search for another path.

[crookshanks1177]

I have another kind of off the wall question...I mean no offense if my question offends. From the people I know who are either Pagan or Wiccan, it seems to me that they were previously of another religion such as Christian. Granted that is based off of people I have personally encountered, are there still people who could say they are either raised Pagan or Wiccan, like I would say I was raised Roman Catholic for example.

[Midnightsfire]

Kinda cool stuff:

Public Library in the Summerlands (http://www.summerlands.com/crossroads/publibra.html)

Druid's Code (http://www.summerlands.com/crossroads/library/a_druids_code.htm)

http://www.summerlands.com/crossroads/library/greenman.gif

[Kobila]

I have another kind of off the wall question...I mean no offense if my question offends. From the people I know who are either Pagan or Wiccan, it seems to me that they were previously of another religion such as Christian. Granted that is based off of people I have personally encountered, are there still people who could say they are either raised Pagan or Wiccan, like I would say I was raised Roman Catholic for example.


I dont understamd what your question is? Where any of us raised Pagan? Or what religion were we before we were pagan?

Personally I was christian, but I blame that on my best friends mother who would take us tp chruch at an early age. My parents werent any specific religion and didnt ever influence me one way or the other.

[crookshanks1177]

I dont understamd what your question is? Where any of us raised Pagan? Or what religion were we before we were pagan?

Personally I was christian, but I blame that on my best friends mother who would take us tp chruch at an early age. My parents werent any specific religion and didnt ever influence me one way or the other.

Sorry for the confusion lol, I was asking if now a days are there many people that are actually raised among the Pagan religions, rather then converted over later in life if you know what I mean.

[grammer]

I know a number who are being raised pagan, but not many who WERE raised pagan. Pagan wasn't seen much before the rise of the hippies. I know one woman who was raised Jewish/Pagan, but that's about it.

[Kobila]

Lets see, no A couple of my friends who are pagan have children, but I dont think they influence them one way or the other.

Ive always looked at paganism as more of an individual discovery. It isnt something you would force any one to believe.

[grammer]

The whole point behind Paganism is that it is choosen. Most Pagans believe in exposing their children to religions and letting them chose for themselves when they are old enough.

[crookshanks1177]

Ok, I think I understand. Thank you both. I guess I was just asking that because I considered Paganism an older religion. Isn't Celtic considered a Pagan religion? I was thinking back when I was researching Halloween or Samhein (Spelling?) a year or so ago for a class of mine. I was using the holiday for an informative speech, telling everyone some of the originations of the traditions we have today. And a lot of my research led to some Christian traditions, but also Celtic or what I thought were Pagan traditions. It was a year or so ago I was doing this research so my knowledge on it isn't brushed up anymore lol. Too many classes and flushing knowledge for the next class haha.

[Kobila]

I just looked up the defenition of Pagan to see if that would help crookshanks and was kinda offended by the defenition.
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Late Latin paganus, from Latin, civilian, country dweller, from pagus country district; akin to Latin pangere to fix -- more at PACT
1 : HEATHEN 1; especially : a follower of a polytheistic religion (as in ancient Rome)
2 : one who has little or no religion and who delights in sensual pleasures and material goods : an irreligious or hedonistic person

Main Entry: neo-pa·gan
Pronunciation: -'pA-g&n
Function: noun
: a person who practices a contemporary form of paganism (as Wicca)
- neo-pagan adjective

[grammer]

Ah well, what can you expect from the unenlightened?? :lol: I do prefer the definition of neo-pagan however.

What I like about Paganism, is that is accepts all beliefs as true, and excludes none. What I believe is true, what you believe is also true. Any God you worship is the same God(s)/goddess(es) I worship, you simply worship a different form of my God.

Unfortunately, there are many on this earth incapable of seeing the Godliness of others.

[Kobila]

I pretty much see it as all the same thing, most all pretty much say the same thing.

Be good to one another and harm none.

Its when you start making it an organized religion and putting your beliefs down on paper that you lose what its all about in the first place.

[Midnightsfire]

I just looked upi the definition of Pagan to see if that would help crrokshanks and was kinda offended by the definition.
One needs to remember that monotheists (Christians, Jews and Muslims) use the term "pagan."

Pagans usually refer to themselves differently, unless they use the term to thumb their nose at the more established monotheists.

For instance, I've referred as my religion at times as Druid, or Gnostic or even Jedi. I sometimes never mention the word "pagan" because it denotes a polarity and exclusion rather than harmony and inclusion. (the operative word is "sometimes." I'm not perfect.)

[grammer]

One needs to remember that monotheists (Christians, Jews and Muslims) use the term "pagan."

Pagans usually refer to themselves differently, unless they use the term to thumb their nose at the more established monotheists.

For instance, I've referred as my religion at times as Druid, or Gnostic or even Jedi. I sometimes never mention the word "pagan" because it denotes a polarity and exclusion rather than harmony and inclusion. (the operative word is "sometimes." I'm not perfect.)

I noticed Midnightfire, I sometimes never mention :lol:

I think of my religion as Druid more than pagan (the original meaning of pagan is outsider or foreigner) but I use pagan here since the belief-o-matic thread defined me as a neo-pagan. I do incorporate some of the Jedi beliefs into my own, but not all of them.

[Kobila]

When making this thread, I just used the word Pagan becuase, Everyone who isnt Christian seems a bit to Harsh;)

Honestly I dont go around announcing my beliefs to any one in reality, they would look at me as though I were insane or about to curse them in to Hell. Naturally when im asked I tell the truth and have known a couple ladies who stoped talkin to me because of them. I guess you learn when to share and when not to after a while.

[grammer]

I know a number of people who use the term Pagan to describe their religion. But I agree, I think it's just for shock value.

[crookshanks1177]

When I hear of people referring to their religion when it comes to Pagan I hear them break it down into weather they are Wiccan or Druid, kind of like Protestants would say they are Baptist or Methodist. Well that is the way I understood it if you know what I mean. Well I haven't really known any Druids that I know of so I can't say I understand their beliefs. Do your families know of your religion if you don't mind me asking. I know when my family noticing me getting rather bitter towards the church they all had different reactions. Well it was mainly my parents who took notice. My dad let it go and let's me believe what I choose, that is how he intended to raise me. But my mother became very angry and always begs me to come back to the church, go to confession and what not. Our conversations don't last very long when she gets like this. I tend to get frustrated and make up something I have to go do.

[morgiana]

I am a pagan. Most people think I'm a wiccan and I don't correct them. I figure it's something they can understand. I was initiated into wicca and use some of their rituals and traditions in my belief system.

To me a pagan is someone who doesn't fit into the wiccan, druid mold yet believes in the pre-christian, pre-jewish teachings.

Mostly pagans are into saving Gaea (earth) and doing good lest karma kick them in the rear.

[grammer]

Ah yes, the infamous karma points!! :lol: So slow to accumulate, and so swift to go.

[thethirdman]

To me a pagan is someone who doesn't fit into the wiccan, druid mold yet believes in the pre-christian, pre-jewish teachings.

That's how I see pagan too. I'm not Wiccan or Druid. I use the Shinto Pantheon, but recognize the legitimacy of other religions. So when people ask I say Pagan, or non-denominational if it's one of my Dad's friends from the Knights of Columbus :whistle:

[Kobila]

I havent told my Mother that Im a Pagan, she would accept it but it just doesnt seem like any of her bussiness, she is practising eschatology and is pretty open minded about things.

I just find that when You tell people your pagan they often think your kidding or silly for saying it.I know she found some of my Wicca books when I was younger but I think she believes I gave it up awhile ago.

[crookshanks1177]

I havent told my Mother that Im a Pagan, she would accept it but it just doesnt seem like any of her bussiness, she is practising eschatology and is pretty open minded about things.

I just find that when You tell people your pagan they often think your kidding or silly for saying it.I know she found some of my Wicca books when I was younger but I think she believes I gave it up awhile ago.

What is Eschatology if you don't mind me asking? When I lost my faith (for lack of better words) I made it rather obvious to my mother. I quit going to church with her all together. I was still a young teenager so I rebelled quite a bit. She's not stupid. She knows my faith is not what she'd like it to be. But she knows she won't change that. We're both stubborn individuals. Everynow and then she'll bring it up in conversation and question weather I've ever went back to church or anything like that. But she won't take it much further than that. We both know it will open up a big arguement so we stay away from the subject for the most part.

[Kobila]

One entry found for eschatology.


Main Entry: es·cha·tol·o·gy
Pronunciation: "es-k&-'tä-l&-jE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -gies
Etymology: Greek eschatos last, farthest
1 : a branch of theology concerned with the final events in the history of the world or of mankind
2 : a belief concerning death, the end of the world, or the ultimate destiny of mankind; specifically : any of various Christian doctrines concerning the Second Coming, the resurrection of the dead, or the Last Judgment
There the dictionary definition,

Basically they believe in christ but dont believe he got all his healing powers from God, they think he was enlightened enough to find his err "powers" though his own thought.

Its mind of matter type stuff, she thinks we all have the ability to effect our heath, lives and luck by using our minds.

[Daesmirdum]

I am a Pagan who holds to non of the pre-defined Pagan groups (Such as Wicca, Heathen etc), but rather do what many people of my age range do and try to form my own sets of beliefs.

I was raised without religion although my dad is a non-practising Catholic and my mum is a non-practising protestant (Church of England). I became Christian when I attended military school from the age of 11 till I was 16. I lost my faith when I lost a member of my family and I couldn't understand why a divine being would take someone dear to me.

Then a friend introduced me to paganism and I found that I respected this viewpoint a lot more than any other religion in the world as it is more about repecting everyone and everything around you. It does not try to explain the mysteries of life to you, but rather sets you on the right path to make your own decisions about life and the universe.

I must admit that I was drawn to wicca at first, mainly because of the close knit community that many wiccans had in my area at the time. When I moved to Scotland for university I soon drifted from this path of paganism and became my own person. I joined a Pagan Moot (Just a group of people irrespective of disposition) and found many people of a like mind.

I do practice magick sometimes, but mainly for the praying aspect. I believe in the divine, but I do not give the divine a sex as I feel that is beyond me to decide on. I do believe that Mother Nature would be a woman though because of the birth-death circle in the world.

For those of you who are wondering about paganism I would recommend you get in touch with a Pagan Federation in your area. They are very helpful and will point you in the correct direction.

~Daesmirdum

[Ilse]

I'm a pagan too.

I can't say I've been exploring the path for a long time, actually I just really started, but I guess it's time to start giving my religion a name :)
For a long time I called myself atheïst, just because I hadn't really figured it out yet, and it was the best name I could give myself without giving a whole explanation about my vision on life, death, big energy blahblah ;)

I've been reading about paganism on the internet for about a year or two and it felt like coming home. (how cliché :) )
I noticed that I used magic all my life, it's not that I used spells from the moment I was able to talk, but I use drops of lavender oil on my pillow and I listen to meditation music at night to sleep better. Little things like that.
I also love nature, walking in it, feeling so connected with it. I once spend the whole night outside to watch the stars (my mother really laughed at times but never stopped me).

I never really liked the idea of one single god. Not in the way I saw it in other religions. I always felt that there was one big energy that combined all things, dark and light, male and female. I just never realised there were other people who felt the same.
Now that I really found out I'm starting to learn more each day, I ordered the books of Scott Cunningham so it's nice to see that there are people who like them. I hope I'll learn more from it.

@ Kobila: the thing you said about death is almost exactly how I imagine it. I see death as the beginning of so much life. It's just a new possibility, not for me because I already used the biggest gift nature had to give me, my body, but for all other life on this earth. My body will travel with the wind, the bugs, the sand and the grass who will use it to grow.
I don't know if there will be some form of reïncarnation (if that's the right spelling in english, but you'll know what I mean) but I believe that even if I stop being what/where I am now, and the last minutes are passing by when my brain is starting to give in will be happy ones, and I won't be afraid. I don't believe anyone is afraid when there dying, even when they're murdered. I believe that in the last few minutes or seconds when we can let go everything becomes clear and at peace.
I also like to be buried in the ground without any protection around my body so nature can do it's work like it's supposed to be, but I understand that's not possible.

About being raised as a pagan; (please correct me if I'm wrong) there are people who grew up with this religion, but since it's another kind of religion it'll never be like being raised as a Catholic and getting baptised etc. There will be children that celebrate esbats, Samhain, Yule etc. but it's their choice if they are (become) pagans.
I clearly wasn't raised as a pagan, I didn't even know about pagans untill a year or two ago when someone told me a bit about paganism and Wicca. Both my parents were raised as Roman Catholics, but they aren't religious. My father is an Atheïst, and my mother doesn't exactly know how to call it. She believes in the afterlife, but not in the way many religions present it. All my cousins were baptised except me and my sister (I felt a bit left out when I was younger and they all got a party and presents :) ) and though my grandparents (who are pretty religious) didn't really liked that, they always respected their choice to let us make our own decision when we would be old enough to understand. (My grandmother used to bring me rings and stuff with the virgin Mary on it when she went to Lourdes though, I just adored the virgin Mary for some reason and I guess she really hoped it would do something for me :) )

Anyway, I've told my mother and stepmother about my love for paganism now, and they accept it. They are pretty interested themselves actually, so that's nice. I haven't told my father and boyfriend, not because they would reject it, but because it would be confusing for them. They're getting used to the things I do and will accept it but telling I'm a pagan would be kind of a shock because of the word pagan, and their medieval view at paganism. So that's why I don't really tell people about it. I don't hide it, and I answer their questions but I don't want scare people, I know that this way their curiosity will take over :)


Oh my, I've really got excited I guess, I hope I haven't bored you all to death! Anyway, I like to hear more from everyone here about this subject, and it's really nice to see so many people who are pagan or interested in paganism!

[Kobila]

Ilse: Oh my, I've really got excited I guess, I hope I haven't bored you all to death! Anyway, I like to hear more from everyone here about this subject, and it's really nice to see so many people who are pagan or interested in paganism!


Nope you havent bored me that was one of the best posts ive ever read :tu:
I think you and I have a lot in common, only I havent the energy to post like that.

I like what you said about being buried with out a coffin, I figure I dont need my body anymore so why not give it to the earth?

I've found myself using the term "God" to describe the energy we all share when speaking with people who dont understand present day pagans.
Its much easier to explain Im pagan when I refer to it as "my god" rather than "energy" or "goddess" or what ever your cup of tea is;)

Only making it very clear that my god is not the christain God.

[grammer]

Ilse:

I think many "will become pagan people" find themselves attracted to the Virgin Mary. The Virgin Mary is as close as the Christian church comes to a Goddess. I guess it was easier for early European Pagans to accept Christianity, if there was a God/Goddess figure. The cult of the Virgin Mary really didn't rise until the catholic church started to covert Europeans in about 300 AD.

The story of a God being born of a Virgin goes way back into Egyptian mythology (Most of the Virgin Births in Greek mythology are explained away by promiscious Greek Gods) I heard somewhere that even the Buddah came from a Virgin Birth. (I can't prove this. If I'm wrong, please let me know)

[crookshanks1177]

I think you are correct about Buddah but I could be wrong myself. As for the Virgin Mary, when I was practicing the Catholic religion, I did feel closer to her. I was comforted by saying a rosary (which symbolizes the Virgin Mary). I used to hold my rosary and say the prayers with the beads whenever I had a nightmare and I'd eventually fall back asleep feeling comforted.

[Kobila]

Had to come in here and tell how I got in trouble yesterday at work with the christains,

A fellow employee of mine is wearing the pin that says Merry Christmas, and being Pagan it naturally annoyed me. So after she had said it to like the fiftieth customer, I told her not every one wants to hear her preach Christ while they buy there milk and bread. So she went to my manager and told him I was being prejudice to her religion, :rolleyes:

He agreed with me because I think it was getting on his nerves too. ;)

[Taleeya]

Had to come in here and tell how I got in trouble yesterday at work with the christains,

A fellow employee of mine is wearing the pin that says Merry Christmas, and being Pagan it naturally annoyed me. So after she had said it to like the fiftieth customer, I told her not every one wants to hear her preach Christ while they buy there milk and bread. So she went to my manager and told him I was being prejudice to her religion, :rolleyes:

He agreed with me because I think it was getting on his nerves too. ;)
Well, I think everyone is entitled to say merry christmas, I mean I wouldn't be offended if someone said Happy Hannukah, Happy Diwali, Happy Ramadan or whatever to me. Sorry, just my opinion :)

[Kobila]

No she wasnt saying Merry Christmas, she was saying merry CHRISTmas, and going on and on about Jesus, which did offend me because I wasnt at church I was at work.

[kallie]

I can understand getting offended about that co worker. I am pagan and I get frustrated everytime I read an article about boycotting a business because the don't have "Merry Christmas" signs up . It makes me think " boy And I thought the USA had something about religious freedom " :) Just an added note my kids do pagan and christian holidays as not to make anyone else in the family mad. We as a family celebrate Yule and then my Catholic parents come down for Christmas. Kris Kringle visits on Yule . I haven't read through all the other posts yet but I was wondering how many others have to do the dual holiday thing?

[Taleeya]

No she wasnt saying Merry Christmas, she was saying merry CHRISTmas, and going on and on about Jesus, which did offend me because I wasnt at church I was at work.
My apologies, I take it back.... thats just rude and offensive, even to christians :)

[Kobila]

No worries hun, we are all friends here, love your sig by the way Garfield brings back fond memories.

Blessings

[kallie]

Just thought I would pop in and tell you all about an article in the paper that made me smile. This reporter decided to let it all hang out. She said how all of the fundamentalists need to stop their bickering over Christmas losing christ because it really wasn't their holiday. :) She further on listed all of the pagan holidays that the christians based their holiday on. She even admitted that the christians did it to attempt to convert the pagans and how it didn't work! I loved that article because up til tha one the local paper had largely ignored the pagan winter holidays. The article was a big step since I'm sitting in the bible belt.

[Kobila]

Wow really?

What newspaper is it maybe they have a link to the article on line?

[kallie]

The Louisville Courier Journal - don't know if they would put it online though. I'm gonna check witch vox and see if they put it up.

[crookshanks1177]

Just curiosity here, what are the Pagan winter holidays and how do you celebrate them, or is it along the same lines of Christmas some how? I don't celebrate Christmas well the religious aspect of it. It's just a special time for family and friends for me. For some reason even though I despise the cold I have an extremely peaceful feeling about me during this time of year.

[Kobila]

Well these (http://www.geocities.com/lavenderwater37/holidays.htm) are the 8 official ones: but I dont know many Pagans that recoginize all of them, usually just Yule which is around christmas or Mid summer, they all take place when the earth is changing or aligning in certain ways.

Personally I see it as times when there is a lot of energy and mother earth is at her most alert. But our Holidays, for me personally, are not a time to buy things or call up a family member( although you could;) ) its more a time to connect with your self and your surrondings.

Maybe this would be a good time to meditate that extra hour, or drive out to open space and just listen to earth move.


Isnt it funny how many Pagan ides are in the Christain story? Not even those two religions, correct me if Im wrong but dont most religions have holidays around the same time?

[Crystallia]

Yule is on the Winter Soltice usually around the 21st of December. Many people decorate with evergreens and citris fruit. Burning a Yule Log is custom and lighting candles and also staying up and greeting the sunrise. It is a holiday to celebrate the Sun's return because the next day is when the daylight hours get longer.

Also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yule for more detail

[Byrum]

I just stumbled onto this thread and I thought it was really good. I'm not a pagan and I don't pretend to know anything about your religion (do you call it a religion or more of a spirituality) and basically I came in here to learn more. From the looks of things you are all very peaceful people who share many of my beleifs and problems (such as with sometimes overbearing Christians).

I recently read the Da Vinci Code which gave me what was really my first insight into how Christianity has just recycled many pagan rituals and made them into their own. I never actually beleived that Christ was born exactly on Christmas day to a virgin and then did all those miracles, but all the evidence that suggests all the Virgin stories of the past and even the time he was said to be born were all used in religions before was quite an eye opener. Even aspects of the Egyptian religion which I knew had events such as babies born of virgins but it never really connected.

BTW is a pagan 'religion one 'religion' or is a number of different ones, but they all seem to relate to the mother or earth goddess. I like that idea as I strongly support environmentalists and the like who are trying to protect our planets natural beauty and your veneration (?) of the mother earth is definately a good thing :).

Anyway good luck with this thread it is obviously a very special place.

[crookshanks1177]

I just stumbled onto this thread and I thought it was really good. I'm not a pagan and I don't pretend to know anything about your religion (do you call it a religion or more of a spirituality) and basically I came in here to learn more. From the looks of things you are all very peaceful people who share many of my beleifs and problems (such as with sometimes overbearing Christians).

I recently read the Da Vinci Code which gave me what was really my first insight into how Christianity has just recycled many pagan rituals and made them into their own. I never actually beleived that Christ was born exactly on Christmas day to a virgin and then did all those miracles, but all the evidence that suggests all the Virgin stories of the past and even the time he was said to be born were all used in religions before was quite an eye opener. Even aspects of the Egyptian religion which I knew had events such as babies born of virgins but it never really connected.

BTW is a pagan 'religion one 'religion' or is a number of different ones, but they all seem to relate to the mother or earth goddess. I like that idea as I strongly support environmentalists and the like who are trying to protect our planets natural beauty and your veneration (?) of the mother earth is definately a good thing :).

Anyway good luck with this thread it is obviously a very special place.


Isn't Halloween an example of Christians taking on a Pagan holiday? I did a speech on Halloween a few semesters ago and in my paper I found a lot of references to the Celtics which are Pagan aren't they? I believe it was called Samhein. I think I've seen that mentioned on this thread now that I think about it. Sorry to offend if I am incorrect. It's been quite some time since I have done that research. I don't know much about the Christmas holidays except for what Kobilla and Crystallia explained to me. Thank you by the way. But I am not Pagan either but I enjoy coming here and asking questions to the people on this thread. I could go look up pages on the internet I'm sure but I enjoy getting a personal perspective of it. These are great people to ask your questions to Byrum. :blush:

[Crystallia]

Pagananism is an Umbrella term. Usually meaning any religion that is not Judeo-Christian, but that definition fails sometimes. However it is a very broad term and does not neccesarily have to be a nature oriented religion.

Samhain or Halloween is probably the most celebrated holiday when it comes to Paganism. I've never really seen it as a Christian holiday. Not like Christmas and Easter (which is also very pagan in orgin).

[Kobila]

I just stumbled onto this thread and I thought it was really good. I'm not a pagan and I don't pretend to know anything about your religion (do you call it a religion or more of a spirituality) and basically I came in here to learn more. From the looks of things you are all very peaceful people who share many of my beleifs and problems (such as with sometimes overbearing Christians).

Yes, I think the majority of us try to be calm or 'peaceful' because it causes postive energy, positive energy equals happy life. Being mean or grumpy causes negative energy which equals a miserable life. Its really simple when you think about it.
Thats kinda why Ive always had a problem witht he Christian God because he seems to be the keeper or all the good things in life, but only dishes them out when he feels like it, doesnt sound like a nice guy to me :eyebrows:
BTW is a pagan 'religion one 'religion' or is a number of different ones, but they all seem to relate to the mother or earth goddess. I like that idea as I strongly support environmentalists and the like who are trying to protect our planets natural beauty and your veneration (?) of the mother earth is definately a good thing .

Pagan is a really lose term, so loose that even pagans disagree on some things. I always thought 'Pagan' as a person that does not worship any of the main Gods, believes in a higher power of some sort still, and has a respect for Earth and Her people.

Some practice magic, like the Wiccans, some deal with plants and earth like the druids, some have more Egyptian influence, while others focus on more of an Irish, Celtic theme. What I have noticed is a central theme with The Female or Mother Earth. Its is a very feminine religion.

The Pagan way of life is very solitary, you have to find your own path, form your own beliefs, and come up with the answer yourself.

[Alhanalasa]

Samhain or Halloween is probably the most celebrated holiday when it comes to Paganism. I've never really seen it as a Christian holiday. Not like Christmas and Easter (which is also very pagan in orgin).


Some Christians really dislike the celebration of Halloween, since it is so Pagan in origin. There is an attempt to take it over, however. Catholics celebrate All Saints' Day November 1st. This is a day off in some European countries, like Spain and Italy. So, crookshanks1177 does sort of have a point about Christians taking over Samhain. They just weren't that successful at it in the US. Instead, most people celebrate Halloween in a very secular manner, paying more attention to folklore than any spritual meaning.

[FoxyDoxy]

I went to a seminar on the origins of Samhain last October. In this seminar the lecturer talked about how the pagan traditions such as lanterns to scare off evil spirits were adapted under the christians to become a game. They'd carve scary inages into turnips and try to scare those to afraid to venture out. When they moved to America they brought this tradition with them (using pumpkins instead as they were easier to find-and carve) the people in the houses gave them cakes and sweets to go away and trick or treating was born. It became part of American tradition and lost almost all of its spiritual relevance.
This isn't such a horrible thing. I don't mind that the christian or muslim or hindu children in my street dress up and have fun, good for them. It means something different to them that it does to me and theres nothing wrong for that. for them its sweets for me it's sweets and celebrating the lives of those that I've lost. It's become part of western culture now like christmas and easter. most x tians don't celebrate it in a spiritual sense but they still by chocolate eggs and presents.

[Alhanalasa]

It became part of American tradition and lost almost all of its spiritual relevance.
This isn't such a horrible thing. I don't mind that the christian or muslim or hindu children in my street dress up and have fun, good for them. It means something different to them that it does to me and theres nothing wrong for that. for them its sweets for me it's sweets and celebrating the lives of those that I've lost. It's become part of western culture now like christmas and easter. most x tians don't celebrate it in a spiritual sense but they still by chocolate eggs and presents.

I didn't mean to sound as if I thought it was a horrible thing that it's secular! Please don't misunderstand. I think it's actually quite funny that most Americans consider Halloween secular, except for some hard core Christians - the kind who were upset that it fell on Sunday in 2004, and therefore some towns changed the day for Trick or Treating! :rotfl: And there are those (like the church I grew up in) that don't approve of anything to do with Halloween since it is a "demonic" celebration in their eyes.

I was really just trying to point out that Samhain is in fact another thing the Church tried to take over. It worked elsewhere, to an extent, it just didn't work in the US, or other predominately Protestant countries.

Edit: Oh, and as for Christmas and Easter: This is probably to do with how I grew up, but I don't think those two holidays are nearly as secular as Halloween is. That's when people go to church who never go any other time of year. What we see in public is secular, since that's "PC" and "inclusive", but I get the sense that many families' traditions are religious. There are the extra bits that stuck (eggs aren't really Xtian, are they?), but the main sense of the holiday is a christian one.

[FoxyDoxy]

Oh that wasn't aimed at you hun I was just adding my views. I can see exactly what you're saying and I agree totally and find it funny that they feel that after hundreds of years of trying to fight against it the only way they can get rid of it is to take it over.. lets face it their well practiced. Moving all souls day to november first didn't work to well for them so they're trying to take october 31st as well :roll eyes:

[crookshanks1177]

The Pagan way of life is very solitary, you have to find your own path, form your own beliefs, and come up with the answer yourself.


Don't some Pagans practice in groups? Like I think some Wiccans practice in covens I believe it is called. I'm not sure about other Pagan groups. Another thing about Wiccans (they are the group of Pagans I have had the most personal experiences with) I always kind of held a high respect for them, because like discussed earlier they have that calm nature about them and they also are willing to talk about such subjects with you, without making you feel like you are being judged or preached at. But for the last couple monthes or so I have had a couple surprise me. There are like 3 Wiccans in my classes lately that when I talk to them I do feel like I'm being preached at. I feel really uncomfortable around them now. They have been asking me to join their little group or coven, that is something I don't want to do. I enjoyed talking to them before this all happened, because it helped me understand their beliefs. But it upsets me when I feel like it's being pushed on me. I know not to judge the whole Pagan society on how these girls are treating me don't get me wrong. It just really surprises me. Again I mean no offense to anyone I was just venting.

Some Christians really dislike the celebration of Halloween, since it is so Pagan in origin. There is an attempt to take it over, however. Catholics celebrate All Saints' Day November 1st. This is a day off in some European countries, like Spain and Italy. So, crookshanks1177 does sort of have a point about Christians taking over Samhain. They just weren't that successful at it in the US. Instead, most people celebrate Halloween in a very secular manner, paying more attention to folklore than any spritual meaning.

Yes I know some Christians dislike Halloween, weather it's because it's Pagan or they just view it as evil in general. My family (Catholics) on the other hand always celebrated Halloween. I know that All Saint's day is Catholic, but we never truely celebrated that day. Maybe we were just horrible Catholics lol. But I don't personally know any Catholics whoever went out of their way to celebrate All Saint's Day. On the other hand I'm very ignorant on how that is for European Catholics. But in America I find we don't pay that day a whole lot of attention. But I was thinking that Halloween was also taken from the Pagans because don't we also have All Hallow's Eve, which is October 31st? I thought that was considered a Christian day also, I could be wrong. Been a long time since I've studied on the Christian religion lol. Again my family never celebrated it calling it that. We called it Halloween lol.

[Alhanalasa]

Yes I know some Christians dislike Halloween, weather it's because it's Pagan or they just view it as evil in general. My family (Catholics) on the other hand always celebrated Halloween. I know that All Saint's day is Catholic, but we never truely celebrated that day. Maybe we were just horrible Catholics lol. But I don't personally know any Catholics whoever went out of their way to celebrate All Saint's Day. On the other hand I'm very ignorant on how that is for European Catholics. But in America I find we don't pay that day a whole lot of attention.

Again, it's not something that happens here in the US. I only know it happens in Europe since part of what I've been doing lately at my job is updating our reservations systems with holiday hours for locations in several European countries. Not only All Saints Day (which is the one relevant to this discussion) but also things like Corpus Christi and the Ascension, etc. In the US they aren't federal holidays (no days off from school or work) but they apparently are in some countries in Europe. So there must be some tradition that goes along with it, if only to try to keep people from celebrating the night before.

But I was thinking that Halloween was also taken from the Pagans because don't we also have All Hallow's Eve, which is October 31st? I thought that was considered a Christian day also, I could be wrong. Been a long time since I've studied on the Christian religion lol. Again my family never celebrated it calling it that. We called it Halloween lol.

That's pretty much my point: I wouldn't say it's been "taken away" from the pagans because there isn't anything religious (read: Christian) connected to it in our modern minds.

Anyway, this is a link to a good explanation of why it's called "Halloween", which does derive from "All Hallows Eve" (as in "All Hallowed Souls Eve - the vigil preceding "All Saints Day" when you're supposed to contemplate the saints and ask them for help in whatever you need - lots of parallels to the Witches' new year): Halloween (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween) and All Saints Day (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Saints).

[crookshanks1177]

Thanks for the links. "Taken away" was a bad choice of words on my part, couldn't think of anything better at that point in time. But you get my point, thanks for the explanations, I am understanding better.

[Kobila]

Don't some Pagans practice in groups? Like I think some Wiccans practice in covens I believe it is called. I'm not sure about other Pagan groups. Another thing about Wiccans (they are the group of Pagans I have had the most personal experiences with) I always kind of held a high respect for them, because like discussed earlier they have that calm nature about them and they also are willing to talk about such subjects with you, without making you feel like you are being judged or preached at. But for the last couple monthes or so I have had a couple surprise me. There are like 3 Wiccans in my classes lately that when I talk to them I do feel like I'm being preached at. I feel really uncomfortable around them now. They have been asking me to join their little group or coven, that is something I don't want to do. I enjoyed talking to them before this all happened, because it helped me understand their beliefs. But it upsets me when I feel like it's being pushed on me. I know not to judge the whole Pagan society on how these girls are treating me don't get me wrong. It just really surprises me. Again I mean no offense to anyone I was just venting.


Thats totally uncool of them to push you like that, all I can say is that pagans are only human and some of us are real jerks. But it sounds to me like they are more of the wiccan aspect because most Pagans I know might hang out and some might study togather, but you dont have a strict set of beliefs written down that you all follow, basically what I meant is there isnt any one way to describe a pagan.


I never thought of halloween as a christain holiday, and most of the christains I know dont let there children celebrate it either. I worked halloween night and I saw quite a few kids grocery shopping with their parents instead of out having fun :rolleyes:

Personally, I dont even think of todays commercialised hallowen as a Pagan holiday. Now its just about who can has the most creative costom and who gets the most candy :no:

[Crystallia]

Latin America and Spain have strong religious observances with Halloween. And there it is a very Christian/Catholic Holiday. I think I was refering more to the states.

I would disagree with Paganism being feminine...A lot of veiws are that way but not all. Also a lot of pagans do worship by themselves...but a lot also work in groups and with family...but like you said there is a lot of argument on what paganism is exactly even within the pagan community.

[Alhanalasa]

Thats totally uncool of them to push you like that, all I can say is that pagans are only human and some of us are real jerks. But it sounds to me like they are more of the wiccan aspect because most Pagans I know might hang out and some might study togather, but you dont have a strict set of beliefs written down that you all follow, basically what I meant is there isnt any one way to describe a pagan.


My very first experience with a Wiccan (while I was still going to church and everything - this was a very long time ago), she quickly morphed the "An it harm none, do as thou wilt" to add "unless they deserve it". :huh: it turned me off to Wicca for a long time, but then when I start reading what it's really about, I realized it was something for me, and she just needed help.

crookshanks1177, if you're interested, read about it online or in books. Don't be afraid to call them on their preachiness (is that a word?) and tell them to stop. If it's something that's right for you, you'll come to it on your own. They may not realize how pushy they're being. They could just be enthusiastic (or, it could be Heathers all over again... :rotfl: ).

There are other pagans who practice in groups besides Wiccans, though I would certainly call Wicca the most common "organized" form (by comparison, I mean). Druidic practices (not the same thing) tend to be quite formal, from th impression I get. And you can get books about all sorts of Paganism, so they must have a coherent philosophy to some extent. So, I wouldn't automatically assume they are Wiccan just because they are in a coven (though it's a good guess). You sort of have to ask to know for sure what flavor of Paganism they follow.

[kallie]

Flavor :) Never thought of it that way ! It is so amusing to me that pagans as a whole are peaceful folks but there is always disention in the ranks when you discuss differences in belief systems.
I try really hard to be peaceful but with 4 kids I find myself saying "goddess help me out here" a lot. I don't push my beliefs on anyone else because that's just plain wrong. Bad Karma.
For example- about 5 years ago I met the woman who is now my best friend. We knew each other inside and out - but it wasn't until 2 1/2 years ago that religion was discussed. It was just something that we felt was best left alone. But like gravitates to like :) We ae both pagan - but will call ourselves wiccan as well. Both of us are solitary. I couldnt see joining a group. I really don't fit into any of the molds- I float my own way. That is why I love paganism, there isn't someone loking over your shoulder telling you what to do or what to think. Well I'm off to watch "medium" - lovely show by the way. Blessings to all.

[Begoli]

I'm Pagan (more leaning towards a combination of Gaian and Animism). The thing that irks me about Paganism is Wicca. Isn't that just getting the biggest flogging (good and bad) lately? The infighting amongst Pagans for the most part is 'fluffies' against 'traditionalist'. That in itself is silly - most flufflies copy mass media perception and traditionalist in the main are just older but stem from the same Gardnerian/Crowley/Alexandrian beliefs of the last Century as the fluffies.

Anyway not something I ever want to get into - negative energy all round.

I'm solitary although partly through choice part not - I can never find local Pagan's who don't want to start Covens and boss each other around or be elitist! I would love nothing more than meeting up with other Pagans just to chill out and be friends and having a good time and not be looked at weirdly when I say I have two cats, a wand, I hug my tree, love my garden, married and enjoy not doing spells!

Paganism to me is personal choice and the beliefs I came to through my own life path. I have announced it to the world (I'm sure the Australian Govt sees me as a rogue). People love me for it or hate me and that's fine. I believe strongly that you need to live this religion. It has no hard and fast rules but I've never understood Pagans who do spells and wear Pentagrams but can't actually live, breathe, eat, think it. Maybe I am expecting too much?

I look forward to having children - who we will raise as Pagans (of course they are their own person and can change at anytime). I look forward to being able to do whatever I want on Sundays. Look forward to open laws - marriage, public holidays, adoption, death, schooling etc. I look forward to the day when no ones asks me about my religion but when they find out they don't care!

Anyone else in Australia? or by absolute chance Adelaide?

[Ilse]

Anyone else in Australia? or by absolute chance Adelaide?

Nope, but I must say I love your post. I'm a "starting paganist" as I like to call myself, and though there was this huge connection for me when I read more and more about paganism I also disliked many things.

Some people tell you that you can be a solitarian wiccan, other people say you can't etc. etc. There are 12 year olds doing spells without knowing anything about paganism and there older people who claim to know what's right because they've read a hundred books about it.

I don't like it, it is not a contest of who knows more, and it isn't "cool because of the black dresses and spells" (I haven't performed a spell, at least not in the way you see it in charmed etc. That would be pretty amazing wouldn't it? And I don't wear a black dress and I don't have necklace with a pentagram :rotfl: )



Anyway, I wish there were more people who'd like to study with me, or just talk about paganism or anything else...but I don't expect to find someone like that very soon.

[Kobila]

I can understand their out look on paganism, when I was in high school Goth was very big and every one dressed like Marylin Manson. But no in my old 23 years (;) ) I still practise yet I wear what every one else wears, I read what I can get a hold of but I know, that my religion and my beliefs are in my heart and it doesnt matter what you or any one else says. Because I know deep down what I beleive and Im comfortable with that.

I guess im alone in my beliefs there arent many people around who understand let alone believe in what I do, and while thats difficult in times of need, Ive come to accept that Im special and so are my veiws on religion.

If you trully believe you dont need black (I wear pick quite often actually) you dont need symbols worn around your neck, and you dont need some one to tell you that this is what this means, you have every thing you need within yourself.

[Ilse]

If you trully believe you dont need black (I wear pick quite often actually) you dont need symbols worn around your neck, and you dont need some one to tell you that this is what this means, you have every thing you need within yourself.


I think that's true.

I wear black pretty often actually, but the color of my clothes doesn't mean anything than my mood or "nothing else to wear". If someone wants to wear black and a pentagram it is his/her own choice nothing wrong with that, but there is something wrong in my opinion when you are trying to upset or shock people with your appearance or when you start to believe that clothes determine whether a person is right or wrong, because I can't see what that has to to with paganism.

[erynae]

Don't some Pagans practice in groups? Like I think some Wiccans practice in covens I believe it is called. I'm not sure about other Pagan groups. Another thing about Wiccans (they are the group of Pagans I have had the most personal experiences with) I always kind of held a high respect for them, because like discussed earlier they have that calm nature about them and they also are willing to talk about such subjects with you, without making you feel like you are being judged or preached at. But for the last couple monthes or so I have had a couple surprise me. There are like 3 Wiccans in my classes lately that when I talk to them I do feel like I'm being preached at. I feel really uncomfortable around them now. They have been asking me to join their little group or coven, that is something I don't want to do. I enjoyed talking to them before this all happened, because it helped me understand their beliefs. But it upsets me when I feel like it's being pushed on me. I know not to judge the whole Pagan society on how these girls are treating me don't get me wrong. It just really surprises me. Again I mean no offense to anyone I was just venting.

They shouldn't be doing that. Most Wiccans and Pagans are strongly against proselytising. Don't give in to them. Believe what you want, and don't let anybody try and change that. If they are really trying to force their beliefs or opinions on you, I would say that they're hypocritcal. A lot of Pagans complain of people from monothestic people preaching to them and "trying to save their souls", and it is a sad sad day indeed when Pagans are guilty of doing the very same thing.

Anyone else in Australia? or by absolute chance Adelaide?

Perth :eyebrows:




I can't really say when I discovered my religion (Wicca). This is going to sound incredibily corny, but I felt as if it was always there, just waiting to be uncovered. Like when I was younger, I always sensed this "presence", so to speak, and I didn't think that it belonged to anything to do with Christianity, as I have been going to a Catholic school all my life. It was weird. There would be things that I would find beautiful, and when I tried to explain the things I deemed beautiful, they just looked at me weirdly and just couldn't understand, and in return I just couldn't understand why they didn't understand. Why didn't they find stars beautiful, not just pretty? Why didn't they understand the way an autumn leaf falls slowly from the tree branch? Or when the sun shines through a window, and you can see the small dust particles that float around? Or a bird in flight? Or a swaying tree? I just didn't understand it.

In year 8, I began to realise it. We were studying the Arthurian legend, and we watched the movie, Mists of Avalon (nothing compared to the book). I finally realised why I found things beautiful that others didn't. Why I wasn't satisfied with the Christian religion (I wasn't a Christian, I just went to the school). As soon as I got home, I was straight on the computer (as per usual) to research. I had finally found my calling.

Three years later, I still have a lot of things to learn about the religion. I believe that you can't possibly learn it all from books and websites. You have to look within yourself. Search, the true answer is there.

[dani1300]

i'm so glad this thread is on here. i'm a wiccan, and i have been posting on the "does god exist thread," and that is almost all christians versus athiests. i felt very lonely, but i'm glad i found this thread. btw, kobila i checked your profile, and we have the same first name, that's kind of funny.

[Kobila]

Yes we do actually and most every one on here calls me Dani, so merry met sister, I thought my little thread had died;)

Yes there does seem to be a lot of black and white when it comes to religion on here, either you're a christain or you're an athiest there isnt any room for maybe a different sort of higher power than the christain god. There is no in between, or at least those in between arent angry enough about it to discuss it for hours on end. I know I quickly grew bored of arguing whether or not 'He' was real. I know he isnt and thats all that matters.

I tried several times a couple months back to edge in my opiniun but no one cared or picked up on it, so I gave up and found other things to discuss. Thats part of the reason I started this thread, to offer different suggestions to people who are set in such a cookie cutter fashion they cant see whats two feet in front of them.

[dani1300]

i'm trying to present my different non-christian view of god on the existence of god thread. we'll see if i can get people to stop thinking about god in such a "bi-polar" fasion. maybe you could join me, and we could bring a new perspective to the arguments for the existence of a higher power, "god."

[Morgoth]

Right, the thread is now reopen for business.


Thanks

[Kobila]

Thank you ever so much Morgoth, I really really really really really appreciate this, and I will never ever act like that again:)

I promise on my life, Oh you made me sooooo happy!!!

Blessed be to all my pagan friends:)

[Taleeya]

Phew! Glad this isn't closed down.... :)

[Kobila]

Me too, I was pretty angry at first, but I calmed down and tried to focas on positive things, I figure my anger is getting me anywhere lets try positivity instead.

Hey no one said every pagan was positive and happy all the time;)

[crookshanks1177]

Oh, last time I tried to check into this thread it was closed. I am glad to see it is back open. I am too tired for my normal questions or comments though. I'm just happy this thread is back up. :p

[Wickedgirl86]

Hi I'm really enjoying my back reading on this topic. I have been stuiding with Wiccan people for the last 2 years which is very hard for someone who lives with close minded people. I am the first one in my house hold to think (no offence to anyone) the bible is not the world. I mean it's a book after all, how can u place everything you believe on a narrowed veiwed book? So I'm now really very intrested in learning everything about Paganisim because I find the spells and spellcraft of my Wiccan friends is something I am not able to fully do. So where do I start?

[Taleeya]

So I'm now really very intrested in learning everything about Paganisim because I find the spells and spellcraft of my Wiccan friends is something I am not able to fully do. So where do I start?

I'm not sure I understand your question.... You aren't able to fully do what?
Where do you start learning about paganism? or start casting spells? :cool:

[Kobila]

I think I understand what she is saying, I too had a hard time believeing in a lot of the "witch craft" aspect of wicca, I wasnt comfortable casting spells, or gathering ingredients for this or that concoction. And as I read further in to it I slowely realized that wizza just wasnt for me.

You dont have to do much to be a pagan, its such a vast title that you dont really have to worry about gathering or church like functions. Just believe what you want to believe basically. Or, you can try reading up on this thread, there are a lot of very cool pagans that have posted what they believe so far. :)

[crookshanks1177]

I took that differently but maybe I am wrong. I thought she meant she had a hard time studying being from a Christian family. I came to think of when my mother and stepfather started seeing my loss of faith. That was a very hard time for me. They are Catholic. I was about 15, when I started gradually losing my faith and looking into other ideals when I had the chances. To make a long story short. I first started by stopping going to confession, which I hated from the beginning, I never understood or agreed with the sacrament of confession. Then I gradually quit going to church with them all together. This caused many arguements between us. Till one day we were out in the front drive way and my stepfather blows up at me screaming that I was going to hell blah blah blah. And I'm sure the neighbors that heard us thought we were rather crazy. We had small arguements after that, but eventually they gave up on trying to pull me back in. I guess that is why I interpreted what she said that way. Again I could be wrong.

[Kobila]

Im sorry that wasnt very nice of him to do, Although Im glad you held your ground and didnt let him get you down.

As far as what she meant, Im guessing we can only wait for her to post again and reiterate what she meant;.

[crookshanks1177]

Ah thanks for the compliment lol. And no needs to be sorry, I have moved on rather well in my life. No he's not a very nice person lol. And I'm a very stubborn person.

[Wickedgirl86]

Hi again sorry for the confusion. I mean a couple of things: it was hard for me to study the spells and learn them with my bible hugging mother down my back about it. She clamed that the devil was testing her threw me. Blah blah blah anyway I did find ways to go over my friends houses and pratice with them. The thing is I can't be a true Wiccan because I am unable to complet their ways fully. And I don't think its fair of me to keep calling my self one as I can't do a lot of the stuff they ask of me. I learned about this reglion in passing and it sounds like something I could actually do. Being Wiccan wasn't for me so I'm going to try this now. And have tried and will try anything until I find what I am looking for. Which will be hard since I have no idea what I am looking for. :p I'm just so lost and am hoping to find myself in this intresting religion.

[crookshanks1177]

Well good luck in your search, I hope you find what you are looking for. I am not a Pagan, but I love coming to this thread to hear their perspectives on things. They are very patient with me lol. I can't say I'm really searching, I just like to hear other perspectives. And I like to hear the history of the religion also. I'm still that way with the Catholic religion in some aspects, I like to look into the historical aspect of it, but I choose not to practice the religion anymore. I feel I have come to a happy medium with myself. It took me a while to come to that. I had a struggle with religion for quite some time. I felt very bitter towards the church and religion for years. But I have let it go pretty much and moved on with my life. I did briefly study Wiccan early on in highschool, but could never get into Wiccan. As for casting spells, the idea of that rubbed me in the wrong way. No offense to anyone, that is just my personal preference. I had no problems with others casting spells if that is what they wish, I was just weary of casting spells myself. I still love to hear others perspective as long as it's not in a manner I feel it's being pushed on me. That's why I always enjoyed this thread, they seem to respect your beliefs, and also seem appreciative if you have the same courtesy in respecting their beliefs.

[Kobila]

Oh, I think I see where your going, sorry I took it wrong :blush:

I have a couple questions for you, what do you mean you cant fully be a Wiccan? What are they asking you to do that your unable to do?

[Midnightsfire]

The thing is I can't be a true Wiccan because I am unable to complet their ways fully. And I don't think its fair of me to keep calling my self one as I can't do a lot of the stuff they ask of me. I learned about this reglion in passing and it sounds like something I could actually do. Being Wiccan wasn't for me so I'm going to try this now. And have tried and will try anything until I find what I am looking for. Which will be hard since I have no idea what I am looking for. :p I'm just so lost and am hoping to find myself in this intresting religion.

I'm a tad confused.

Wicca isn't some organized intstitution like the Catholic Church. (Although in many parts of the world there is some degree of organization...) A person can be "solitary" or involved with a group. However, what matters most is belief. And strangely enough, Wiccan beliefs can be pretty varied.

Still...

Principles of Wiccan Beliefs; 1974, Council of American Witches (http://www.sacred-texts.com/bos/bos056.htm)


We practice rites to attune ourselves with the natural rhythm of life forces marked by the phases of the Moon and the seasonal Quarters and Cross Quarter.
We recognize that our intelligence gives us a unique responsibility toward our environment. We seek to live in harmony with Nature, in ecological balance offering fulfillment to life and consciousness within an evolutionary concept.
We acknowledge a depth of power far greater than that apparent to the average person. Because it is far greater than ordinary, it is sometimes called supernatural, but we see it as lying within that which is naturally potential to all.
We conceive of the Creative Power in the universe as manifesting through polarity -- as masculine and feminine -- and that this same Creative Power lies in all people, and functions through the interaction of the masculine and feminine. We value neither above the other, knowing each to be supportive to the other. We value sex as pleasure, as the symbol and embodiment of life, and as one of the sources of energies used in magickal practice and religious worship.
We recognize both outer worlds and inner, or psychological, worlds sometimes known as the Spiritual World, the Collective Unconscious, Inner Planes, etc. -- and we see in the interaction of these two dimensions the basis for paranormal phenomena and magickal exercises. We neglect neither dimension for the other, seeing both as necessary for our fulfillment.
We do not recognize any authoritarian hierarchy, but do honor those who teach, respect those who share their greater knowledge and wisdom, and acknowledge those who have courageously given of themselves in leadership.
We see religion, magick and wisdom in living as being united in the way one views the world and lives within it -- a world view and philosophy of life which we identify as Witchcraft -- the Wiccan Way.
Calling oneself "Witch" does not make a Witch -- but neither does heredity itself, nor the collecting of titles, degrees and initiations. A Witch seeks to control the forces within her/himself that make life possible in order to live wisely and well without harm to others and in harmony with Nature.
We believe in the affirmation and fulfillment of life in a continuation of evolution and development of consciousness giving meaning to the Universe we know and our personal role within it.
Our only animosity towards Christianity, or towards any other religion or philosophy of life, is to the extent that its institutions have claimed to be "the only way" and have sought to deny freedom to others and to suppress other ways of religious practice and belief.
As American Witches, we are not threatened by debates on the history of the Craft, the origins of various terms, the legitimacy of various aspects of different traditions. We are concerned with our present and our future.
We do not accept the concept of absolute evil, nor do we worship any entity known as "Satan" or "the Devil", as defined by the Christian traditions. We do not seek power through the suffering of others, nor accept that personal benefit can be derived only by denial to another.
We believe that we should seek within Nature that which is contributory to our health and wellbeing.
Not too shabby... Compare the Druid's Code (http://www.summerlands.com/crossroads/library/a_druids_code.htm)

[Taleeya]

Hi again sorry for the confusion. I mean a couple of things: it was hard for me to study the spells and learn them with my bible hugging mother down my back about it. She clamed that the devil was testing her threw me. Blah blah blah anyway I did find ways to go over my friends houses and pratice with them. The thing is I can't be a true Wiccan because I am unable to complet their ways fully. And I don't think its fair of me to keep calling my self one as I can't do a lot of the stuff they ask of me. I learned about this reglion in passing and it sounds like something I could actually do. Being Wiccan wasn't for me so I'm going to try this now. And have tried and will try anything until I find what I am looking for. Which will be hard since I have no idea what I am looking for. :p I'm just so lost and am hoping to find myself in this intresting religion.
Yes, I had a similar problem with my mother, "I will not have those books in my house!" I'm not really sure what it means to 'complete their ways fully' or doing what they ask of you, that actually sounds kind of scary and creepy to me.... (but maybe I just don't understand what you mean). D you mean join their coven (group)? You can call yourself whatever you want!

You might want to check out a book by Scott Cunningham, I think its called Wicca, a guide for the solitary practitioner. There is also one by Silver RavenWolf (I haven't really read her stuff, some people like her, some despise her, so whatever) To stir a magic couldron or the other one. I believe (but may be wrong, its known to happen) those are about being solitary. I myself am solitary eclectic. I take pretty much what I want to do, and do it, by myself. :p

The spells I do are pretty simple, I don't casts circles or anything. Maybe you can do something like affirmations or creative visualization, or just pray (to whomever you choose), those are all basically spells.
Its all about intention :)

[Aebhel]

Just so y'all know, if you're serious about Wicca, you really ought to read Gerald Gardner's books. Silver Ravenwolf and Scott Cunningham give thoroughly sanitized versions of the religion, so it's sort of like reading the Bible with the Old Testament cut out. They're not bad as a starting point, but they aren't anything to base a fully realized religion on. There just isn't enough information there. Cunningham is a little better than Ravenwolf, though.

A couple really good books (don't remember the authors):

Drawing Down the Moon and Practical Solitary Magic. Also Spiral Dance, which I think is by Starhawk.

You don't have to be a coven member to be a Wiccan, but it's good to be well informed. I'm a solitary because certain traditional coven practices (the Fivefold Kiss, for one) make me uncomfortable, but if you're going to call yourself a Wiccan (as opposed to a Pagan) it's a good idea to know exactly what that implies.

[crookshanks1177]

Sorry my curiosity is perked, what is the Fivefold Kiss? I'm not practicing Wiccan, just being inquisitive.

[Midnightsfire]

Sorry my curiosity is perked, what is the Fivefold Kiss? I'm not practicing Wiccan, just being inquisitive.

Something ridiculous to me. (No basis whatsoever in history) Practiced rather recently probably began with either Gardner or Crowley, neither one a font of sanity to begin with in my opinion. (Ok, Crowley was worse in that regard)

Glossary here (http://www.ancientpathway.com/reference/glossary.html)

[Kobila]

Oh your right midnights, thats the silliest thing Ive read in awhile.

I was never a very ritual orientated Pagan, so I didnt know what it was untill she/he posted it (sorry midnight I have no idea what gender you are) I really like what you have been posting though, you are opening my eyes to a Wizzan religion I hadnt heard of.

I really like these;

GAIAN: a term which recognizes the Earth Goddess Gaia, as a living, breathing organism. Then everything else, is PART of it, rather than APART from it.
Isnt it funny when you feel something that you think is orignal and some one else already had a name for it?
INCUBUS: an oversexed male demon or spirit. Male wraith form projected for purposes of sexual intercourse. In historical writings these Inccubi seem to be associated with Christians who have psycho/sexual problems I didnt know that one :rotfl:

PAGAN: 1) the word Pagan is derived from the Latin Paganus, "peasant," deriving, in turn, from the Latin pagus, "village." 2) They are also many groups of Priests and Priestesses practicing what we call "Paganism" or "Neo (from the Greek word for new) Paganism". 3) Pagan religions are "natural" religions both in origin and in mode of expression as opposed to artificially created ideological religions. 4) General term for magic embracing religions, such as Wicca, Druid, Shaman. Sometimes used interchangably with NeoPagan. This is a much nicer way of putting it, dont you think?

[Wickedgirl86]

Hello people! This #8 Calling oneself "Witch" does not make a Witch -- but neither does heredity itself, nor the collecting of titles, degrees and initiations. A Witch seeks to control the forces within her/himself that make life possible in order to live wisely and well without harm to others and in harmony with Nature. Is what I had a problem with. This is what I was having a problem with. I am not a witch and although I do think that there are witches and such out there. But as I've been raised in structured household with the bible as our guide, I find my heart is split from intriguement and hesitation. And I'm someone that thinks if your whole heart isn't into something then it's not something to devote your life to. Does that make more sense?

[Midnightsfire]

I find my heart is split from intriguement and hesitation. And I'm someone that thinks if your whole heart isn't into something then it's not something to devote your life to. Does that make more sense?

Sounds as if your soul-searching. No problem there.

As I've posted elsewhere I'm pretty multi-faceted in regards to religious beliefs. Taoist, Gnostic, Buddhist, Druid, Witch, Jedi, Shaman/Animist...my beliefs are many, but first and foremost on my journey to other beliefs, I had to first believe in myself. To my mind, you can't believe in anything until you take that first step and that first step is always within you.

*steps gingerly away from the podium* :p :blush:

(When it concerns ideas of magic I'm always looking around (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=14806).)

[Wickedgirl86]

Yes, I'm so glade we are on the same page now.
And thanks for that link, I'm reading it now. :cool:

[Taleeya]

Something ridiculous to me. (No basis whatsoever in history) Practiced rather recently probably began with either Gardner or Crowley, neither one a font of sanity to begin with in my opinion. (Ok, Crowley was worse in that regard)
I agree, it sounds like something a guy would introduce to try to .... hmm I can't really put this into words..... Anyways, it sounds kind of cultish :)

[Aebhel]

I mean, it can be a very powerful ritual thing if you do it with an actual coven with an experienced HP (Head Priest/ess) but in my experience, it's more along the lines of a bunch of teenagers trying something "naughty." Maybe if I got initiated into a serious coven, I wouldn't have a problem with it, but serious covens are few and far-apart. It's simpler to just be a solitary.