Greatest Tragedies in History

[haha]

Hey guys,

I know that there is a thread on the Columbia tragedy and one on Hiroshima, but i thought i'd post this thread discussing what people think is the worst tragedies in history, either military realted or a natural disaster, etc. And why? This is a more general thread than the previous two.

IMO, i think that the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki is the worst tragedy not just because of how many people suffered at the time, but also the fact that people are still suffering because of the lingering nuclear effects. The sad thing is that mothers who are affected by the radiation also affect their children when they are pregnant with them.

Any thought?

[Wab]

Bible literalists would have to say the Deluge. Everyone but eight people (surely the rest couldn't have all been wicked)

[haha]

So are you a Bible Liberalist Wab :huh:

Anyone wondering about the Deluge...
The Book of Genesis gives the following brief account of the Deluge: God sees the wickedness of men, and determines to destroy them excepting Noe and his family (vi, 1-8). He reveals his decree to Noe and instructs him how he may save himself and the seed of all animal life by means of an ark to be built according to certain dimensions (vi, 9-22). Seven days before the Flood, God commands the patriarch to enter the ark (vii, 1-5). Noe completes his entrance into the ark on the very day on which the Flood begins; the rain falls for forty days and nights; all living things outside the ark are destroyed; the waters prevail upon the earth a hundred and fifty days (vii, 6-24). The waters decrease, the earth dries up; Noe ascertains its condition by means of a raven and a dove sent out from the ark (viii, 1-14). Noe obeys the Divine command to leave the ark, builds an altar, offers sacrifice, makes a covenant with God, and begins to be a husbandman (ix, 1-27).

[HesHPfan]

Apart from the Atomic bombs, I would say that big epidemics like the yellow fever with millions of deaths and Aids are great tragedies. Fevers can come anytime, anyplace and of on massive scale not easy to cure. There is in the netherlands right now quite a lot of talk about an fever outbreak, because healthcare has discovered that they are not enough prepared if it happens.
Other tragedies are of course big wars, the plague in Europe in the Dark Ages.

[haha]

You're referring to the Bubonic Plague, right? The ironic thing about that was that it spread with rodents and fleas carrying it to people, and the first outbreak was in the early 1330s in China, which just happened to be one of the busiest of the world's trading nations. Hence, it was only a matter of time before the outbreak of plague in China spread to western Asia and Europe.

[Wab]

I'd say the deaths in the New World from smallpox and measles would be at least comparable.

[Seren]

Oddly enough, I think one of the greatest tragedies in History was the murder of Archduke Ferdinand of Austria. Although he wasn't that important in context, his death helped start WW1, which led to WW2 and all it's atrocities.

Let's see, other tragic moments... the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the rape/Holocaust of Nanking... well, any moment of Genocide really belongs there.

[Delving]

I thought at first about agreeing or disagreeing with some of the ideas people have posted for the greatest tragedy, but the more I thought about it, the more I wondered whether it was a good idea. There have been many, many tragedies in the world which were so immense that I'm not sure there is anything to be gained by trying to say that this one was a little bit more immense than that one. I wonder, human nature being what it is, whether it might just lead to resentments that will divide people who should be united in trying to see that tragedies aren't repeated, or to people feeling that they can ignore tragedy A because it wasn't as "big" as tragedy B. I thought about John Donne's famous poem.

No man is an island, entire of itself
every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main.
If a clod be washed away by the sea,
Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were,
as well as if a manor of thy friends or of thine own were.
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind;
and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls.
It tolls for thee.


-- John Donne, Meditation XVII

I'm not sure... just some thoughts. What do other people think?

[HesHPfan]

Yeah I do mean the Bubonic plague, but also the Spanish flue from the 1919s onwards, I usually translate the Dutch words into English so sometimes I get mixed up.

[haha]

Oddly enough, I think one of the greatest tragedies in History was the murder of Archduke Ferdinand of Austria. Although he wasn't that important in context, his death helped start WW1, which led to WW2 and all it's atrocities.
The assasination was merely a triggering point for the war but the bad feeling had been building up for a long time. If that hadn't occurred i'm sure something else would have to trigger the war.
There have been many, many tragedies in the world which were so immense that I'm not sure there is anything to be gained by trying to say that this one was a little bit more immense than that one.
I get what you're saying and i'm not trying to say that one tragedy is more important in any way than another. I think you can also look at it from the point that the thread discusses the reasons behind the fact of why certain people think it's a tragedy, which also looks at their culture, background and where they're coming from. Do you get what i mean :huh:

[Delving]

I get what you're saying and i'm not trying to say that one tragedy is more important in any way than another. I think you can also look at it from the point that the thread discusses the reasons behind the fact of why certain people think it's a tragedy, which also looks at their culture, background and where they're coming from. Do you get what i mean :huh:

Yes, I think so. What people find to be significant or tragic can certainly say a lot about their way of thinking.

There have been a lot of forgotten tragedies, including some of the "forgotten wars" which have been discussed on another thread here, and some of them have been forgotten by most people, but are still very important to some cultures. There's a lot to be gained by letting them bring these stories to a wider audience.

What I was afraid of (and maybe I'm just too cynical about human nature) is that for some people, this wouldn't be about sharing, but about competing -- about saying "My tragedy is bigger than yours." Oh well. Let's hope my cynicism is unjustified.

[erynae]

The Boxing Day tsunami. Hiroshima and Nagaski. Titanic. The Beslan Scholl hostage crisis last year. The burning times

[crazy_megan]

I think there's been too many tragedies to really know what was the biggest one of history because it's all based on personal opinion. How do you measure how great tragedy is, do you go by the amount of people who died in it or by how they died? Or is there another way to measure it?

I definately think World War II was, with all it entailed, one of the greatest man made tragedies to ever happen. You had so much happen during it that it is still incredibly hard to comprehend why and how it happened. The Boxing Day Tsunami disaster is undoubtably one of the greates natural disasters to happen, and the effects it has had on the world will continue for a long time. AIDS and other diseases/plagues have also been huge tragedies.

In short, I'm not sure how I can answer this question, although it is a very good one. From what I know of WWII I would definately consider it in the top 3 greatest tragedies though.

[haha]

I think there's been too many tragedies to really know what was the biggest one of history because it's all based on personal opinion.
Exactly! And if you say WHY you think a certain tragedy is significant, then other people can see where you're coming from and it does help to discuss other people's viewpoints because they are all so different.

[thrawn]

imperialism was the biggest tragedy.

[Ilse]

I believe that every war is a tragedy, and it's hard to pick one, but WWI and WWII would be high on my list, because so many people were killed, in so many countries and we still feel the scars of this war. Germany was still torn in two 16 years ago, and that shows how much things can get out of hand. everytime when I read the Diary of Anne Frank I get goosebumps, and I wonder how my life would be if I was born 80 years ago; my sister who is mentally disabled, my friends who are gay, black or Jewish, they could have been killed just because they weren't "normal" in the eyes of people who thought they had the right to tell what's right and wrong.

Ofcourse there's the tsunami, and many plagues, but even though that's really horrible, I think that a tragedy that is created by humans is even more scary and wrong.

[haha]

I think that a tragedy that is created by humans is even more scary and wrong.
Can't argue with you there. I find it so sad what some humans can do to others, just because their different. Alot of tragedies has helped show the extent of human creulty and it's not always a very mice result that we find about ourselves. I remember a quote from the terminator which said something like, "It's in our nature to destroy each other" :sad:

[Blizzard]

The Boxing Day tsunami. Hiroshima and Nagaski. Titanic. The Beslan Scholl hostage crisis last year. The burning times

I would agree that both of the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombings would be two of the biggest Tragedies of all time. I'm not sure about Titanic though. Sure, it was a big affair, but not as many people got killed as in the bombings. Also, It was a natural disaster, so that makes things a bit different.

[haha]

Yeah. People tend to classify disasters inflicted by humans as more of a tragedy than those that are a result of natural disaster, i guess because we could have controlled the former and not the latter. Although, you could argue that Titanic was in a small way due to human error rather than creulty. The captain wanted the fame of getting the 'unsinkable' ship to the port before the deadline rather than listen to warning of icebergs ahead.

[Potters Goblet]

I am not sure if this will qualify or not...And it is strictly an opinion. But I often wonder what would have happened if God had created Mankind without the benefit of Free Will. We "Must" follow God's plan. All choice to be eliminated. I wonder would that be a bigger tragedy?

Or was the advent of Free Will the bigger tragedy? The way I see it, yes. Free will was the bigger tragedy. But I can see an argument for both sides. Just thought I'd bring it up because it's an obscure "outside the box" concept that I figured some might appreciate.

[erynae]

Very wise, Potters_Goblet!

[DoctorMildew]

my answer is the fall of the soviet union and the resulting movement conservatism in the US. and i will be so bold as to venture that this ascendant american "fourth reich" will make its european predecessor seem liberal by comparison. a tragedy by any means.

[GryffondorGrl]

I think any time when one single person tried to go for total dictatorship and tried to take out a race of people. Like Hitler and the Jews...and other groups too. And Saddam and the Kurds, (that makes me really sad because I'm Kurdish and it was recently). Also, anything with bombs is awful. Like Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I think that was so awful. Also, World War 2 in general.

[HP26]

I agree that Hiroshima was the worst tragedy, mainly because we caused that destruction willfully.

[haha]

But I often wonder what would have happened if God had created Mankind without the benefit of Free Will. We "Must" follow God's plan. All choice to be eliminated. I wonder would that be a bigger tragedy?
i guess a way to look at that is God gave humans the will to choose between right and wrong, whereas for other animals he took away that will, so that they lived with and were balanced in nature. 'Free Will' is a gift we can use for good or bad, and in this thread i guess it shows that sometimes we have abused this gift anf chosen bad rather than good.