How did Voldemort get his wand back?

[Spitf1re]

When Harry rebounded Voldemort's Avada Kedavra curse, the books say that Voldemort fled, with his body destroyed and all. I want to know how he got his wand back at the end of Goblet of Fire. It says that the Potter's house was blown up, and that Hagrid pulled him out of the rubble. Wouldn't have Voldemort's wand been destroyed too?

[EvilMeghan]

Good thread, Spitf1re! I think wands are sort of powerful and don't get destroyed that easily (but they can break - like Ron's). Maybe Wormtail got it back for him?

[1MelissaPotter]

Yea EvilMeghan, I think maybe he had someone get it, but not Peter, because where would he have kept the wand if he was with the Weasleys for all that time?

[EvilMeghan]

Good point...and I don't think Wormtail would do anything for Voldie if he knew he was not powerful. Maybe someone like the Lestranges picked it up...but then where did they keep the wand for 13 years?

[Rowena Ravenclaw]

Hmm...if I thought Voldemort had more trust in him, I'd be tempted to suggest Lucius kept it in his basement.

Maybe Wormtail did manage to retrieve it from the rubble of the Potters' house and found a safe place for it before his confrontation with Sirius.

[EvilMeghan]

Did Pettigrew take Voldie's wand for himself? I believe they sent his mother his finger and his wand, so maybe it was kept in his mother's Gringotts vault?

Just rambling...

[Camo]

Maybe Peter used the 'Accio' spell/charm and the wand was not locked up very tightly and it flew to him from wherever it was. Underground in the rubble perhaps?

[Aramis Diggle]

I believe that when Voldemort's body was destroyed, so was his wand. When he brought his body back, everything that was in his robes, i.e. his wand, came back. Just a thought.

[bubblesofdeath88]

Maybe barty crouch did because he was convicted of trying to find his master ya know? he could have been trying to find him to return his wand to him. Or maybe when peter returned to him he might have sent him to godrics hollow to find it for him.

[ilovelifex1000]

I believe Crouch Jr. is the more likely person to have found his wand. Peter had no place to keep it and Voldie was, well he didn't have a body. I can't remember if it says that Peter handed him his wand back or not.
Nope it says " Voldemort sipped one of those unnaturally long-fingered hands into a deep pocket and drew out a wand" ch 33 first page. Then he caresses it or whatever. The robe had previously been laying on the floor and Peter picked it up. So someone, somehow found not only his wand, but his robes before the MoM came to check out the Potter's place. Before Hagrid retrieved Harry.

[kit]

Interesting thread, and a very good question.

We know that until Wormtail returns to Voldemort in GoF that none of the death eaters are in contact with Voldemort. They are no doubt aware of his continuing existence but not of his location or his state. It's possible that one of these other deatheaters managed to save Voldys wand from the ruin of the Potters house, but then how would Voldemort have had acquired it when he was "reborn"? The only death eater present was Wormtail when Voldy first pulled out his wand, and at that point while the deatheaters knew of his return, none had seen him or had a chance to return his wand to him.

Yet, it can't have been wormtail who kept it safe for the 13 years. He had no reason to and he will only do something if he will gain from it.

My guess is that one of the death eaters, or perhaps someone at the MoM picked up the wand and stored it. Most likely a death eater, because surely the MoM would have destroyed the wand. And when Wormtail returned to serve Voldemort he simply stole his wand back for him.

Edit: Ugh, just read ilovelifex1000's post.

I completely forgot about Crouch. That makes perfect sense. He had the opportunity, the means and the reason. Yes, he spent time in Azkaban, but there is no reason to believe that before his imprisionment he didn't conceal Voldemorts wand in anticipation for his return. Once he was free from his fathers spell and returned to Voldys service, he would definitely return the wand.

Perfect sense. I can't believe I missed it. I'll have to go and re-read GoF.

[daredevildiver13]

I have been wondering the same thing. How did Voldemort do Avada Kedavra on Frank Bryce without a proper body?

[Spitf1re]

In regards to killing Frank Bryce; wasn't Voldie like in the body of like that little baby-sized-creature thing. He might've been able to use a wand. Most likely Wormtail USED Voldemort's wand to kill him. That's why he showed in the 'Priori Incantatem' chapter.

[miri]

I was wondering about this thing for a while!

I'd happily accept that they got replacement robes but it was definitely his original wand. I dont think we know enough about the timing of everything to say it was definitely Barty Crouch Jr who kept the wand safe - were all the Pensieve trails after Voldemort's demise? Coz i thought that they started before..?

[dorcasderr]

I think the trials started after Voldemort's disappearance because he was too powerful for that kind of opposition before his disappearance. Barty Crouch, jr. seems like a perfect choice for wand-saver to me too. Since after his escape from his father, he knew that Voldemort was trying to return (we know this because Voldemort himself says his faithful servant is working for him at Hogwarts). So, that proves that there was communication between them and for all we know they were able to meet, so Barty, jr. could return his wand to him.

[GodricSlytherin]

I think that Peter might have gone with Voldy to the Potter's house. He was there when BOOM! The house explodes. He looks for his wand as a rat and he grabs it and crawls away and puts it in a secret place for when Voldy comes or he can pick it up.

[Sorting Hat's Songwriter]

barty crouch cant be wand saver. Bertha Jorkins anyone? Voldy had his wand back to kill bertha before he knew crouch jr was even alive!!! So, this leaves pettigrew, i think the theory of his mother getting his finger and wand back, and the wand being voldy's is the best. then pettigrew could have retrieved it before goin to find voldy. the only problem bein, how did he avoid being seen??? im sure we'll find out, coz it places someone else (pettigrew) in godric's hollow on that fateful halloween night..... also, voldy was returned to a primitive body by wormtail, so he killed bertha and frank coz he could hold a wand.

[Alastor D]

I agree that Barty jr couldn't have been the wand saver. Bertha was killed before Voldy and Peter left the Albanian forest. No chance to meet Barty before that.
So the only wand saver left is Peter. But how?

[Ashkins]

Maybe Peter was there at Godrics Hollow and saw everything happen. How else would Voldie know where the Potters were?? Peter presumably had to lead him.

Peter could have picked up Voldemorts things and fled. Hide the stuff then faced Sirius. It is assumed Peter and Sirius fought that very same night. Or the next.

[Padfoot127]

It's possible that Voldemort could have bought a new one, or stole someone else's, like Quirrel's after he got blown to pieces!

[hpangel102]

I don't think its possible for Voldemort to get a new one. 1. There wasn't any other wand like its kind besides Harry's, and 2. who would have gotten it for him? Honestly, he would have had to be there to get it, or else the wand would have been fit for someone else. and 3. At the end of Gof, it would have had to be the same wand, because of the thing that happened with Harry's wand and his.

[bubblesofdeath88]

Yes voldemort did kill bertha, but he could have been using peters wand until he found barty, and he returned his true wand to him.

[smartypants]

I got the feeling Whats-his-name was naked after he got his body back. Isn't there hints of that? Somebody probably kept it for him. It could very well be wormtail, because when you transfigure into an animal, your clothes seem to transfigure with you, and then why not some extra stuff like wands.

And I surely have no problem with Lucius Malfoy storing it. He did have his diary, and if oldmort trusted him or not is a moot point, Voldemort didn't give him the wand, he just kept it, if that's the case.

[Sorting Hat's Songwriter]

sorry bubbles but voldy didnt use wormtails wand to kill bertha. Bertha came out of voldys wand remember? I think wormtail WAS at godrics hollow at some point after voldy was stumped by little harry potter. but how he stored/retrieved it is causing me to lose sleep! its 3 am in england!!! ive got to get a definitive theory for this one coz its been buggin me for months!!!!

[Alastor D]

All those ppl whose shadows came out of the wand was killed by that very same wand. That's clear enough. And yes, Voldy was naked and Peter had just before used that same wand to kill Cedric. Obviously Peter put that wand in in the pocket of the robes he had ready for Voldy.

And if Peter was at Godric's Hollow with Voldy, he must have left and came back later. Because Sirius was alone there when Hagrid met him.

[Sorting Hat's Songwriter]

not necessarily with voldy. he could have heard (like sirius) gone to see what happened, retrieved the wand and run away. Sirius then arrives, meets Hagrid, Hagrid takes Harry, and Sirius, realising who betrayed them ('You take it Hagrid, I wont need it any more' ie he was goin to murder peter) gets on peters tail (sorry, no pun intended) and when he catches him, we all know what happened then. Only problem is still where peter stored the wand. I think possibly he used voldys wand to blow the street up, and his mother got it back with his finger, and the order of merlin.

[Sorting Hat's Songwriter]

But no!!! coz then we would have seen an echo of the explosion peter caused when priori incantetem happened!! Grrrr this is hurting my head!!!

[EvilMeghan]

OOO - stroke of genious!! OK, listen to my new theory:

After the Potters were killed, the place was probably swarming with MoM people, who confiscated Voldy's wand, robes, etc. - whatever was left. Crouch Jr., through his father's connections, or maybe even through his father (using the Imperious Curse), retreived all these articles and kept them in his possesion. He may have left them at his house, hidden under a floorboard, like Harry and his cake. So when he was taken out of Azkaban, the stuff was still there waiting for him. He probably carried it with him to the World Cup and had it with him when he went to Moody's place. He was obviously in contact with Voldy in order to set up the portkey, so he probably gave Wormtail the stuff to hold then. YAY! A theory that could work!

[Daily Propheter]

After the Potters were killed, the place was probably swarming with MoM people, who confiscated Voldy's wand, robes, etc. - whatever was left. Crouch Jr., through his father's connections, or maybe even through his father (using the Imperious Curse), retreived all these articles and kept them in his possesion. He may have left them at his house, hidden under a floorboard, like Harry and his cake. So when he was taken out of Azkaban, the stuff was still there waiting for him. He probably carried it with him to the World Cup and had it with him when he went to Moody's place. He was obviously in contact with Voldy in order to set up the portkey, so he probably gave Wormtail the stuff to hold then.

That's what I always thought as well.

[smartypants]

Originally posted by EvilMeghan
After the Potters were killed, the place was probably swarming with MoM people, who confiscated Voldy's wand, robes, etc. - whatever was left. Crouch Jr., through his father's connections, or maybe even through his father (using the Imperious Curse), retreived all these articles and kept them in his possesion. He may have left them at his house, hidden under a floorboard, like Harry and his cake. So when he was taken out of Azkaban, the stuff was still there waiting for him. He probably carried it with him to the World Cup and had it with him when he went to Moody's place. He was obviously in contact with Voldy in order to set up the portkey, so he probably gave Wormtail the stuff to hold then. YAY! A theory that could work!


Except that Barty jr comes to the attention of Voldemort through Bertha Jorkins, so then he has to go to Barty first and THEN kill Bertha, which seems strange.

Yup, I think JK Rowing will have trouble expaining this too. :)

[HPviolinist85]

After the Potters were killed, there was probably a gap between the time that Sirius found them dead and when they were actually killed. Someone could have gone into their house and taken Voldemort's things.

[HPviolinist85]

wait, i have a small rebuttle to my last post, if they took Voldemort's things, wouldn't they have taken Harry away too if they were a Voldemort supporter. Wow, this is really complicated.

[EvilMeghan]

Where does it say that Crouch found Voldy after he killed Berthy? I thought the time he contacted Voldy was a bit vague. We only know for certain it was before Frank Bryce.

[miri]

I would suggest something obscure like *maybe they transfigured the wand into Harry's scar and then when they retrieved the blood got the essence needed to reform the wand* but it doesnt make any sense, and Voldy had the wand before then!

I do find it odd that Voldy's wand was kept safe and Harry was left alive. I think it points to Wormtail tho - after seeing a baby apparently kill the greatest magician, would you try to kill that baby?

I dont think Peter had the self-confidence to face the boy who lived. An elaborate disapearing act involving severing 2 of his own fingers off seems out of character enough for him - sounds painful and he's a coward - but I dont think it was an accident... grabbing the wand, turning into a rat and heading for the nearest sewer entrance is far more his style

[Sorting Hat's Songwriter]

Voldy only found out about crouch being alive from Bertha, so he definitely killed bertha before contacting crouch. It does raise a lot of questions about what went on at godrics hollow that night, and what happened in the 'missing' 24 hours. JK will prob reveal all, we just gotta wait......

[hermiones mum]

When it is explained who was at Godrics Hollow on that night, I am sure it will make sense. However, lots od hidden vaults/storage areas have appeared why not a Voldys one. Peter would have been able to get to it as a rat (possibly the hope that it would make him a greater wizard!).

[smartypants]

Originally posted by EvilMeghan (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=207375#post207375))
Where does it say that Crouch found Voldy after he killed Berthy?


Because otherwise he would have travelled with Bertha to England to meet with Barty and then killed Bertha. It seems very far fetched.

[Alastor D]

Where does it say that Crouch found Voldie after he killed Bertha?
In GoF ch. 35.
Quote: "Now it was just Father and I, alone in the house. And then........My master came for me". Unquote.

And that is after Winky had been dismissed. Which means it was later than the world cup AND later than the murder of Frank Bryce.

[Jessica]

THEORY ONE
The wand chooses the wizard, right?

Maybe there is some kind of bond between wizard and wand and even is his half dead state Voldemort was able to keep it near him somehow.

THEORY TWO
How did Voldemort leave. Maybe somebody came to help him and took the wand with?

[Alastor D]

Jessica, I might bet a knut on THEORY ONE, But not on the other. Didn't Voldie himself say that nobody ever came to help him before Wormtail came 12 years later?

[Jessica]

You're right. I re-read that part of four last night so I'm retracting Theory Two

[smartypants]

Although Voldemort is rather weak in his strange "foetus" stage he still is able to kill both Bertha and that old man I forgot the name of at the moment... and Avada Kedavra requires strong magic. So maybe, after he got into this semi-body he could call upon the wand with a powerful summoning charm to get it back?

[Alastor D]

But then again you need a wand for the summoning.

[Spitf1re]

Hmmm. Im still wondering how Voldemort killed Bertha Jorkins with his wand. Barty Crouch couldn't have had it because Bertha was killed with it before they come to him.
I'll bet 10 galleons that Pettigrew killed Bryce. With the Priori Incantatem, it shows what spells the wand performed, not the just the spells of a particular wizard.
Also, Pettigrew and Voldemort could have stolen Bertha's wand. It says in the books that "The wand chooses the wizard." But it also says that "you wont get the same results with anothers wand." Doesn't this mean that a wizard CAN use any wand?
Im still confused...

[Virtuousdream]

Maybe, this is where book 2 comes in. Tom Riddle is alive in the diary, with the wand, so perhaps that surviving, it allows the wand to survive somehow? But then again, it doesn't explain what happened after the Diary was destroyed.

Oh and HPviolinist, they wouldn't have taken Harry away because it would have been too suspicious. Woah...woah...woah REWIND!

Remember the beginning of book1 , how people knew harry finished off voldie, how did they know? Voldie COULD have just tried to curse Harry another way and fled, but for them to know what happened, there must hve been a trace of voldie left. In that case, if they took Harry, then it would have meant 2 corpses, something of voldie left but no Harry, it would also be very hard to hide Harry because of the search, and also the owl of Hogwarts I suspect would have defenately found him. They also wouldn't have taken him, they would have probably killed him!

[Alastor D]

Originally posted by helhorns (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=216606#post216606))
Maybe, this is where book 2 comes in. Tom Riddle is alive in the diary, with the wand, so perhaps that surviving, it allows the wand to survive somehow?


How's that?
In the chamber he picked Harry's wand from the floor. And it was clearly stated that he used Harry's wand when he wrote I am Lord Voldemort in the air.

[Virtuousdream]

1 moment...*waddles off to get book 2*

Oh yes, well forget that idea then lol, I forgot it was Harry's wand!

[miri]

A wizard can definitely use anothers' wand - unless it's been mangled to the extent that NO ONE can use it without risking severe back-fireage!

Maybe the DEs were too shocked that Voldie was gone to kill Harry? Or too freaked out to try to kill the baby that had destroyed their dark master? Probably too scared to touch him or point a wand at him!

[Jaded_Wanderer]

hmmmm...I'm VERY confused...I do however, have 2 thoughts on the matter:
1. Isn't Lucius Malfoy a member of the MoM? I can't quite remember whether he is or not, but i should imagine he is a fairly important person in whatever he does - he obviously has contacts where he can get dark items from (Borkins or whatever that shop in Knockturn Alley was called perhaps?).
2. (fairly far fetched, and I can't see it happening, but it's an idea all the same...) Is Sirius Black really innocent?? Because if by some strange twist he isn't, maybe he was the one who picked the wand up - we know he was already there when Hagrid arrived, so he would have had the opportunity...but what of the motive? Maybe he picked it up so that it wouldn't find its way back into bad hands? No I have no idea where I'm going with this, hope it at least makes sense!! Byes!

[Alastor D]

1 There is no mention abt Lucius' profession. He seems to be living on inherited money. He has influence, but that's because he is rich and of an old family.
2 It was made clear enough in GoF that Peter was the one who betrayed the Potters and blew up the street killing those muggles. The wand found it's way back in bad hands, yes, but there is no reason to think Sirius helped there.

[smartypants]

Originally posted by Alastor D (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=214453#post214453))
But then again you need a wand for the summoning.


Yes, but you can use somebody else wand. It just doesn't work as well.
Either Voldemort used Worktails wand, or wormtail did the summoning, or they did it together somehow, if neither of them was strong enough.

[miri]

I think if the MoM had found it, Voldemort's wand would have been destroyed.

I dont know how it got back to Voldemort. Was hoping maybe his name would give some clue - mortis means corpse, death, annhilation... couldnt fine a vold-some word!

[EvilMeghan]

Could it be that a character we have not yet met had the wand in his/her possession? Because most of the people we can think of don't work...

[Hermoine]

When I first read Malfoy saying they had things stored under the floor in his castle, the first thing that jump to my mind was "Voldy's wand" but that wouldn't explain how Voldy would have gotten his wand back.

Maybe the wand seeks the wizard out?

Any thoughts?

[miri]

Originally posted by jessicacarstens (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=211334#post211334))
THEORY ONE
The wand chooses the wizard, right?

Maybe there is some kind of bond between wizard and wand and even is his half dead state Voldemort was able to keep it near him somehow.


really great theory!

I dont think it's quite like the *one ring to rule them all* in it's quest to get back to its master but...

I think maybe he wouldnt have needed that strong a summoning charm to summon something that wanted to be with him.

[smartypants]

I don't know if wants seek their wizards out, but I would imagine that the connection between a wizard and the wand would make it easier to find it somehow. For example, summoning charms on your wand may be much easier than on other objects, maybe?

[Alohamora]

harry must have some relation with voldermort to have had the same wand as him. but the thing that i dont get is fawkes being the soul bearer of the feather in both the wands. could this have any relationship with these two...AND OF COURSE THE WAND CHOOSES THE WIZARD :banghead: :wacky:

[Barbara Kennedy]

We have all been assuming that Voldemort went to the Potters home ALONE, but suppose he had more than one [read 'several'] Death Eaters there, surrounding the house, while he went inside?
Wouldn't at least one of them think to gather any evidence left behind as they fled, including Voldemort's wand?

[Starseyer]

Don't you think one of the death eaters could have tried to finish Harry off if they were still there. Or maybe they were so shocked they just didn't think of it. Or afraid that the same would happen to them if they tried to kill him.

( :clappy: This post makes me a second year!!!:clappy: )

[Barbara Kennedy]

Somehow I went to third year today, didn't notice when....
Then again I was too busy posting to notice, lol.

[smartypants]

Originally posted by Alohamora (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=220198#post220198))
harry must have some relation with voldermort to have had the same wand as him.

Uhm.... no he doesn't have to have some relation at all. There is no indication wands chooze their wizard because of relations.

And besides, he doesn't have the same wand, he has it's brother. :)

[Barbara Kennedy]

Originally posted by smartypants (original post (http://www.cosforums.com/a/showthread.php?postid=255838#post255838))
Uhm.... no he doesn't have to have some relation at all. There is no indication wands chooze their wizard because of relations.

And besides, he doesn't have the same wand, he has it's brother. :)

Of course, you're right smartypants, there are two diferent wands. How else did the wands interact in the end of GoF?

[Morgoth]

*bump*

[H0gwartz]

i doubt JKR even thought about it when writing it were jsut using our imaginations.

[dobbyhassecrets]

actually it was stated, i can't remember exactly where (my sister has the book right now) but somewhere when either hagrid was telling him about voldie or when harry over heard the teacher's conversation at that restraunt or something like that. It went something like this: And when we searched the house we found james and lily dead and you just lying there. Voldemort however was not to be found, blah blah and then it said that his wand was nowhere to be found. Which leads to the question how.

Also, i would like to add that that was probably the worst quotation of the harry potter book series, and therefore, highly inaccurate.

Once i get the book back, i quote the whole thing word for word. Sorry!

[Barbara Kennedy]

Still the most likely explanation seems to be that one of his supporters was there at Godric's Hollow the night Voldemort killed the Potters. Before anyone else arrived after the place was destroyed they gathered any evidence they could find and escaped, either never knowing Harry was still alive or fearing to attempt to do anything to him themselves.
Voldemort's wand had to have been kept by someone in the meantime, and returned in time for the rebirth ceremony.

[smartypants]

I still like the idea that Voldemort + Wormtail somehow together performed a powerful accio spell to get the wand back.

But that of course does not explain where it was...

[Imperio! (Crucio!)]

Matbe lucious malfoy was holding it. he already riddles diary and he also says inCOS that he has allot more items which he may not wish for the MoM to see. how he got the wand in the first place? maybe he bought it off a dark arts market or something (with the seller just thinking it was an ordinary wand). really though anyone could have had his wand. wormtail might have retreaved it from the rubble (there was no mention in the books to say that wormtail wasnt with voldie the night of the potters deaths) he could have been in his rat form and burried underneath the rubble to retreive it. he could then have gave it to one of the deatheaters too look fter. wormtail could have also stole it back from the MoM (if they where holding it) i mean i can change into a rat!!! it wouldnt be too hard for him to sneek into the MoM and steal it back. dark magic could even been involved to use a very strond summoning charm or something. there are lots of ways voldermort could have got his wand back. maybe there will be an answer in book 5?

[wendelin_the_weird]

If Hagrid could get into the house after Voldie's li'le mistake, any of the deatheaters could, and I'm pretty sure the Ministry went to the house and buried Lily and James, and there were tons of DE working for MoM any one of them could have taken it. Cheers:ghost:!

[Barbara Kennedy]

Perhaps he simply used a wand [taken from Bertha Jorkins possibly?] and used the accio charm to call his wand to him from wherever it was.

[smartypants]

Ah, yes, of course!

I had this theory earlier, but I didn't know where he would get the original wand from. If he used Pettigrews wand, why did not Pettigrew use his own wand to kill Cedric? (Yes, I know he used Voldemorts wand to Cedrics 'echo' could ask Harry to bring back his body, but that's stepping outside the story.) So we can assume Pettigrews wand is gone too, right? Perhaps he left it behind at the 'scene of the crime' or something.

And of course, Bertha Jorkins wand comes as a rescuer to this theory! Thanks, now it's complete. :)

[Imperio! (Crucio!)]

but voldemort didnt know that that was the night that he would loose everything. so wouldnt he have just used his own want to do the £dirty work". and according to priori incantatem. both of harrys parents came out of voldemorts wand. so that wand was used to kill them. so that wand would have been left at the rubble of the potters home. not pettigrews.

[smartypants]

Uhm, yes. I don't think I understand what your point is. ????

[stellaluna]

I highly doubt that Voldemort got his wand back by the means of a summoning charm. it would mean taht the wand lay around in Godric's Hollow for 10 (?) years. I don't think that could be. I'm quite sure the house has been searched by Ministry representatives many times to solve the mystery of what had happened to Voldemort. they would have found the wand, I'm sure.

I'm sorry, I didn't read this thread through; I discussed this topic in another thread that was closed now :).

[Gilderoy Lockhart]

Maybe the better question is will JK ever explain it?

[nightingale]

I don't think that he used a summoning charm, either. If the MoM had his wand, wouldn't they have noticed it missing? (And, as stellaluna says, I don't think it's been lying around Godric's Hollow for 10 years. Someone from the MoM would have found it, I'm sure the place where the greatest dark wizard of all time had been defeated would have been searched for his wand and any remains quite well.) Plus, someone here said that in one of the books Hagrid says that Voldemort's wand was never found; therefore I'm inclined to believe that one of his Death Eaters took it (I mean it wasn't too hard to get in and they had enough time, Sirius got in and so did Hagrid), and kept it for him until his re-birth. But who was it? They all seemed surprised in the end of GoF to see Voldemort back, and I think he had his wand before the Death Eaters apparated around them, so if they had given the wand back to him, shouldn't he/she have known that he was back? Did Voldemort steal the wand from him/her? If so (and I doubt it), why? Was it just that the overall reaction of the Death Eaters was surprise, and this Death Eater feigned it? (Why?) Or that his/her reaction wasn't mentioned? Was it Peter? If so, where exactly did he keep the wand, while he was busy being a rat? Was it a faithful DE that already knew Voldemort's plans and didn't/wasn't supposed to apparate to the graveyard? ...

[hesdead-dealwithit]

Let's see what we know. First, LV lost his wand and Godric's Hollow. But that wand killed Frank Bryce, Bertha Jorkins, and Cedric Diggory, so he had to have regained the wand sometime before or at the time of when Wormtail arrived. However, the wand had to be taken out of Godric's Hollow before the Ministry arrived, and probably before Sirius and Hagrid arrived. Probably, a DE went in and got it (perhaps there were other DEs surrounding the building?) and then gave it to LV. It would have been destroyed if the Ministry found it. But once a DE has it, its not too hard to give it back to LV. If it was wormtail, he could have given it when he arrived. This I doubt - he's not the type to go back to where he betrayed Lilly and James that night. However, there are other ways of giving the wand to LV. Instead of LV summoning it, how about - wait for it - the DE banishing it to LV? He could also send it via owl. (This brings up a whole new topic. You would think that since Harry could send owls to Sirius, the MoM could do the same and follow the owls. The same could have been done with LV. However, I think, and the consensus is, that owls will not betray the recipients. Someone on the same side as a hiding person will be able to send owls, but someone on the opposite side will not.) Anyway, using an owl is high risk as it could be intercepted. Why not banish the wand to Voldemort? It would take a powerful spell, but it would probably not be intercepted easily. What do you guys think?

[stellaluna]

Good you found a contra-argument against the point that it was probably Wormtail who found it. But... do you think his moralty is great enopugh when he's up to please his master?

[hesdead-dealwithit]

Good you found a contra-argument against the point that it was probably Wormtail who found it. But... do you think his moralty is great enopugh when he's up to please his master?

I don't know about his morality - it's just that I think that Wormtail would be too scared to go back to Godric's Hollow. Scared of Sirius, mostly. Plus, if he retrieved the wand it had to be almost right away, and before he met Sirius (afterwards would be too late, the MoM would have surrounded the building). If he had it before he met Sirius then he couldn't have taken the wand with him when he transfigured to a rat. (A rat carrying a wand would go very slow and be very conspicuous). I personally can't find any way Wormtail would have gotten the wand in the first place AND kept it after he killed the 13 muggles AND gotten away with it to eventually give it to LV.

[kismetgirl]

I don't think that any death eater had it. B/c would they have not joined up and helped Voldemort with getting a body when he retrieved it.

Could it have been Mr. Ollivander? I don't think it is the wand in the window b/c I don't think he would have kept it that prominently displayed. But twice in the wand buying scene Harry is creeped out about Mr. Ollivander and his shop. And as it is said if Rowling repeats it; it is important. Maybe he is kind of like Swizterland banking. Neutral and confidential.

[gig103]

We have to believe that animagus retain the articles in their robes. It would have made sense for Pettigrew to have the wand when he transfigured into Scabbers. Ollivander says that different wands have different qualities based on the wood and core... Peter probably wouldn't have been strong enough to curse that street, but with Voldemort's wand the power might have existed...

[JimmyPotter]

I think it is clear that the wand Voldemort has now is the same wand he had before he lost his powers when he tried to kill baby Harry. There is the Priori Incantatum that caused the emergence of Cedric, Frank Bryce, Bertha Jorkins, Lily Potter, and James Potter, in that order (in the revised editions).

The only deatheater who could have returned Voldemort's wand to him is Wormtail. He's the only one who got with Voldemort before they came across Bertha.

Perhaps Wormtail went by Lily and James' house after Voldemort tried to kill Harry and finds the wand. Wormtail then picks up the wand and gets out of there before Sirius and Hagrid arrive. At this point Wormtail has his own wand and Voldemort's wand.

When Sirius catches up with Wormtail, Wormtail uses his own wand to create the explosion and sever his finger while he keeps Voldemort's wand in his pocket. Wormtail's wand and finger are left on the ground while he turns into a rat with Voldemort's wand in his possession.

[Zachary1993]

When Harry rebounded Voldemort's Avada Kedavra curse, the books say that Voldemort fled, with his body destroyed and all. I want to know how he got his wand back at the end of Goblet of Fire. It says that the Potter's house was blown up, and that Hagrid pulled him out of the rubble. Wouldn't have Voldemort's wand been destroyed too?
One of his servents probably gave it back to him or something.

[Xylia]

Ahhh. . . but what if Voldemort never did get his wand back :eyebrows: . What if the wand he has now is not really his. It would explain why he looked so scared when the ghosts came out during the priori incantatem.

[Adrelamas]

The simpliest answer is usually the most correct. Pettigrew was at the Potter house when things went 'BOOM', for Voldemort.

Now, I'm fairly certain of this. Why? Well, does Voldemort strike anyone as a trusting sort of fellow? Is he going to go up to Pettigrew, and say, 'Give me an address' and whatever address Peter spits out, Voldemort runs off to? What if Peter doesn't have the courage to betray his friends? No, Voldemort would make Peter SHOW him where the Potters were hiding. So Peter was there, and when things went bad, he grabbed Voldemort's wand, and ran. It also fits in why whoever took the wand didn't try to kill Harry. Pettigrew wouldn't have taken such a risk.

It makes further sense, since wands obviously transform with their animagus, (how else does Sirius keep his wand with him when he's running around as Snuffles?) so, why would Peter give up his own wand, when he faked his death, unless he had another to protect himself with. They don't search Peter when he returns to human form in PoA, so he could have Voldemort's wand on him. Why doesn't he use it? Outnumbered 5 to 1? He'd never risk it. So he kept it hidden with him, and when he fled back to Voldemort, he returned the wand to it's rightful owner.

[Baron_G]

Pettigrew would have had to be observing from a safe distance to have avoided the explosion that totalled the house.

I'm more partial to the opinion that a DE was sent there (were the rumours already flying around?) and arrived after Hagrid and Sirius and the only sign of the dark lord found among the wreckage there was the wand which Hagrid hadn't seen. (If he had arrived before Hagrid, Harry would be dead) Then he probably took it to DE HQ and showed it to the others and left it there after they had all decided to flee.

Had Quirrell later retrieved the wand for Voldemort and used it, it may have been lost at Hogwarts. I think after the Quirrel failure, Wormtail may have been sent back to England to fetch the wand while Voldemort kept 'possession' of Bertha Jorkins. Or likelier still, he stopped by the old DE HQ for some clue to Voldemort's whereabouts and found the wand. Still a shaky theory though I tried sticking to canon. There are few ways in which the wand could have followed Voldemort to Albania.

[Elocin4684]

Well, we have to think... let's see, we know Hagird showed up to rescue Harry when the house went boom that faithful night. If Dumbledore knew enough to send Hagrid before anybody else showed up (which is really fast), then we know Dumbledore knew before most people. But then, Hagrid ran into Black on his way there, so, either the wizarding community knew when Dumbledore did what had happened or somehow Black found out about it ahead of everybody else like Dumbledore did. Now, if Dumbledore and Black could find out so fast, we know that Voldie's people could have known even before they did because atleast some of them would have known that Voldie was going there. We atleast know that Pettigrew knew of him going there. For all we know, Pettigrew was with him waiting outside and snatched the wand and ran out of there before Hagrid showed up.

Now, this doesn't explain where he had kept the wand. So let's look at where we have seen Voldie:

We saw in first in PS, but, as he was attached to somebody else, he would not have had his own wand.

We then saw him in CoS, but he was not the present Voldie but a manifistation from a diary, and, therefore, used Harry's wand at the end. If Harry's wand was so close to his, he should have had an easy time using it (theoretically).

Let's see... I don't think we ever really see him in PoA.

Then there's GoF, which we know he had his wand then. Pettigrew didn't leave the Weasleys' until PoA, so that only leaves about a year for him to find the wand.

I want to subscribe to 2 theories:

1.) Somebody like Malfoy got the wand from the house and has been hiding it all these years.

2.) Voldie had this covered, much like his ability to "never die", and had a contengency plan to take care of his wand in case he ever lost it.

[Alastor D]

Ahhh. . . but what if Voldemort never did get his wand back :eyebrows: . What if the wand he has now is not really his. It would explain why he looked so scared when the ghosts came out during the priori incantatem.

The Priori Incantatem needs 'brother' wands. Fawkes never gave more than two feathers, so the only brother to Harry's wand that ever existed is the one Ollivander sold to Tom Riddle long ago. He must have looked scared for some other reason. Maybe he didn't know that Harry had the brother wand?

And Elocin, I think your theory 2.) is better than 1.) because he had the wand already in the Riddle House scene. I have the impression that he had not at that stage told anybody about his return.

[mirandam]

A few of you have said what I would say, Pettigrew was forced by Voldemort to go to Godrics Hollow with him. I think that Pettigrew was in the house when they were killed, probrably cowering in a corner someplace. I believe the house was on fire, and that Pettigrew took the wand. He would of been able to transform and get away without anyone seeing him. I do believe that when they transform to the animagus state that their wands are still with them. The dark mark was over the house after the attack. Hagrid came there and was able to get Harry out, then I believe Sirius then showed up. I am not sure what the time frame was before Hagrid took Harry to the Dursleys, I think this has been discussed before. I think that Pettigrew gave Voldemort the wand back when he found him again. This to me seems to be the only logical answer. Dumbledore did not seem to question that Voldemort had his wand when Harry explained about the echo's. I am sure that JKR will say something about this in her story, or she may not feel that it is important.

[smartypants]

The simpliest answer is usually the most correct. Pettigrew was at the Potter house when things went 'BOOM', for Voldemort.

Now, I'm fairly certain of this. Why? Well, does Voldemort strike anyone as a trusting sort of fellow? Is he going to go up to Pettigrew, and say, 'Give me an address' and whatever address Peter spits out, Voldemort runs off to? What if Peter doesn't have the courage to betray his friends? No, Voldemort would make Peter SHOW him where the Potters were hiding. So Peter was there, and when things went bad, he grabbed Voldemort's wand, and ran. It also fits in why whoever took the wand didn't try to kill Harry. Pettigrew wouldn't have taken such a risk.

It makes further sense, since wands obviously transform with their animagus, (how else does Sirius keep his wand with him when he's running around as Snuffles?) so, why would Peter give up his own wand, when he faked his death, unless he had another to protect himself with. They don't search Peter when he returns to human form in PoA, so he could have Voldemort's wand on him. Why doesn't he use it? Outnumbered 5 to 1? He'd never risk it. So he kept it hidden with him, and when he fled back to Voldemort, he returned the wand to it's rightful owner.

A good idea. But my quetion is: Where is Pettigrews wand?

[Drusilla]

Sirius didn't have a wand of his own in PoA.He confiscated Ron's wand in the Shrieking Shack,and used that to disarm Harry and Hermione when they appeared.
As for Voldemort's wand,even though it's most probable that Voldemort went alone to Godric's Hollow that night,it's also probable that in the wake of Voldemort's disappearance,Pettigrew went to the ruined house to check on the situation before Sirius caught up with him,and that he retrieved and hid Voldemort's wand "before the Muggles started swarming around"-most likely a while after Hagrid and Sirius had left,because Voldemort had his wand before he met all the other Death Eaters-the only one he was with till the time in the cemetary was Pettigrew,who probably hid the wand somewhere while he was in rat form.

[Adrelamas]

A good idea. But my quetion is: Where is Pettigrews wand?

Quite simple, Pettigrew didn't have one, when he returned to human form in PoA. (At least, one that he showed.) If you're asking about where his wand was, well, he faked his own death with it, which is how Sirius was framed, and it was sent to his mother, along with a finger. What SHE did with the the wand from there is anyone's guess.


He had to steal one from Ron, (possibly Lupin) in order to make his escape.

[Achilles]

A question possibly answered in book six. if anyone hasnt had the chance yet, go to JK Rowling's new website. www.jkrowling.com. Its very interesting. :) Finally good to join a forum, hopefully this will be a chance to have interesting convo's with Harry fans all over the world.

:cool:


"Do you know what's waiting beyond that beach? Immortality! Take it! It's yours!" Achilles

[feshnie]

Good thread, Spitf1re! I think wands are sort of powerful and don't get destroyed that easily (but they can break - like Ron's). Maybe Wormtail got it back for him?

You might be right but wasn't he on the run. I dont think he has enough time to scramble through the ruined house to get Voldemorts wand. Wouldn't Lily and James wands be there too?

[Elocin4684]

well, Voldie has his wand somehow, and we can be assured that he made sure that he got his wand back if he "almost died".

If he had a plan to ressurect his own body, then he knew something might happen to his wand if he lost his body, so I'm sure he thought of it. I doubt he left it up to one of his cronies just chancing to go to the place where he lost his body and find his wand from what ever powerful spell could kill him.

[smartypants]

You are right of course. Very clever. You must be in Ravenclaw too. ;)

Yeah, Voldemort had planned for this. He traveked the world to gain immortality, and obviously one of the things he tried worked, since he didn't die (I think he even sais this in book 4, or?) so of course he has a plan for the wand too.

Pettigrew didn't. Still find it bit strange though.

[Mugsy]

Why can't Pettigrew have been the one to get it? He's just a snivling little servant. I think there a few good reasons why Pettigrew would have it. 1. He was the Secret Keeper..so only those he told would know where to find the Potters. It's never been said that anyone else knew. 2. He's a follower, not a leader. He's the only DE I can think of that going into the house to get the wand and cloak, wouldn't be able to kill Harry. The other DE's have shown they are very much capable of trying at least. 3. While he's none to bright, he does have his moments like with Bertha Jorkins, and not having seen LV's body..thought he might still be alive. He obviously went on the run soon after that from both Sirius and fellow DE's. He could've stored it anywhere. And having heard rumors and absolutely no where else to go, he finally returned to his master. Having the wand and now the ability to restore his master would be enough for LV not to kill him. Although he still had penance to pay.

If another DE had it, wouldn't they have tried to return it to LV? The only people out looking for him all ended up in Azkaban, and he had his wand back before he knew Jr. was out. That's just my thoughts though.

[Ivan34]

Just read this thread, and some of you make good points, BUT if you remember that DD said that when the 2 wands met in battle and attached to each other like that that the last people of the other end of his last spells came out. The first one was Cedric, and he was killed before Voldy was brought back. Which means that Peter had his wand, Voldy ordered him to "kill the spare" so some how peter got his wand.

[Sturgis Podmore]

yeah i think Wormtail must have got the wand back and stuffed it into his robes before he changed into a rat? A very good thread though!!

[deadsirius]

I was going to start a thread like this and somehow someone else thought of it too.(yes I used the search button! :angel: ) this is a great thread and it doesn't look like anyone came to a conclusion!

[Angelina X]

Yes this is a good thread and I like some of the theories floating around. I, too, have wondered how he got his wand back. I'm still wondering.

Alastor D states that "The Priori Incantatem needs 'brother' wands. " I do not think this is true. In Chapter 9 of the GoF Cedric's dad, Amos, performs a Priori Incantatem on the wand that Barty Jr used to cast the Dark Mark. The book does not indicate that these wands were brothers.

I'll keep thinking on this issue. I'm sure JKR will have a clever answer for this one.

One other question someone caused me to think of was how did Hagrid know where the Potters were hiding out. If Sirius and Peter were the only 2 secret keepers - keeping secret the Potters' whereabouts - then how could anyone else know?

[Alastor D]

Alastor D states that "The Priori Incantatem needs 'brother' wands. " I do not think this is true. In Chapter 9 of the GoF Cedric's dad, Amos, performs a Priori Incantatem on the wand that Barty Jr used to cast the Dark Mark. The book does not indicate that these wands were brothers.

It's true that Amos forced Harry's wand to show it's latest spell by uttering 'Prior Incantato!', but in the graveyard scene nobody used that spell. The two wands spontaneously refused to 'work properly against each other'. As Dumbledore explained in chapter 36 that happens with 'brother' wands.

[Angelina X]

It's true that Amos forced Harry's wand to show it's latest spell by uttering 'Prior Incantato!', but in the graveyard scene nobody used that spell. The two wands spontaneously refused to 'work properly against each other'. As Dumbledore explained in chapter 36 that happens with 'brother' wands.

I follow you. I was just saying that u didn't need brother wands to perform the Priori Incantatem. I know you're saying that brother wands forced to work against each other will automatically bring about the priori incantatem against one of the two wands. :blush:

[PolarbearInFl]

All good points but Voldemort had his wand prior to his rebirth. He used it to kill the Groundskeeper at his father's house. Still a mystery how he got it back.

[Tonks04]

Well we are talking about voldemort, i mean he abvioulsy can find a way to do anything, he found a way to not die and sure he could find a awy to get his wand back. But remember he said he would possess animals, maybe while he was an animal he went back and got his wand.

[Crookshanks800]

Here's what I think happened. Wormtail told Voldemort where to find Lily and James. When the Potters house blew up, Wormtail was nearby, knowing that LV was going there to kill them. Wormtail went in, found his master's wand but no master so he took the wand and hid it somewhere before the confrontation with Sirius. After escaping from Sirius and Lupin at end of POA, Wormtail retrieves the wand and heads to Albania to search for his master.

[lorna]

Well Crookshanks that makes the most sense.
If MOM had found it, surely to god they would have snapped or somehow destroyed the wand.
The timeline does not allow-- without major amounts of speculation-- Malfoy or Crouch to come into possession of the wand.
So we'll hang this one on Wormtail.

[weasley]

Here's what I think happened. Wormtail told Voldemort where to find Lily and James. When the Potters house blew up, Wormtail was nearby, knowing that LV was going there to kill them. Wormtail went in, found his master's wand but no master so he took the wand and hid it somewhere before the confrontation with Sirius. After escaping from Sirius and Lupin at end of POA, Wormtail retrieves the wand and heads to Albania to search for his master.

I think this theory is most likely, it could explain why it taken about 6 weeks to get to Voldemort. But where could Wormtail have hidden it?

[Teatime]

The only person who could have given Voldemort his wand back is Pettigrew, because remember, Bertha was murdered with Voldemort's wand before they discovered where Crouch was being kept. And Voldemort didn't have any contact with the other death-eaters, we know this from the graveyard scene in which he apparently meets them all for the first time in 14 (13?) years. However, I just don't see why Peter would bother retrieving Voldie's wand from the potters' home:
1. We know Peter wouldn't risk his neck for something unless there was something in it for him. He's not like the other death-eaters, he may be a coward, but he obviously doesn't relish his work like Bellatrix, for example... he's loyal to Voldie only because he wants to play with the big boys, as Sirius says, and now only because he has no other choice (except for death)
2. Why would Peter retrieve Voldie's wand when he doesn't even bother to look for him again for another 13 or 14 years??

[LedZeppelin]

Voldemort chould have easly just either got a new one or is using someone elses...maybe someone that Wormtail Killed for him...no one ever said that powerfull wizards like him can't use any wand they please.

EDIT** I forgot that voldemorts wand had the phoenix tail feather in it....so yea i guess that does complicate things! lol...

[Xantilair]

I think that Peter did actually have Voldemort`s wand. When he confronted Sirius he blew the street apart with a blast from a weand concealed behind him. When he transformed and ran away he would have left the extra wand and his own wand behind. The Ministry wizards would have taken both wands when they captured Sirius Black.

All Voldemort would have to do is get someone to retrive his wand from the Ministry when he came to power. Maybe there are still unknown Death Eaters working in the Ministry?

[destiney]

This is a good point and it seems lots of diffrent views! It is puzzeling about how he got his wand back. I dont think Peter would of had two wands with him when he was "blown up" or jkr would of mentioned it when they had the convo about it in book 3? But i think we should find out about it in the 6th and 7th books becauase we also need to find out what happened to the house? Maybe the ministry went to the house and cleaned up the mess and keeped lily's, James and voldemorts wands and like xantilair said voldemort had de working at the ministry who got his wand for him?

[Alastor D]

I think that Peter did actually have Voldemort`s wand. When he confronted Sirius he blew the street apart with a blast from a weand concealed behind him. When he transformed and ran away he would have left the extra wand and his own wand behind. The Ministry wizards would have taken both wands when they captured Sirius Black.

All Voldemort would have to do is get someone to retrive his wand from the Ministry when he came to power. Maybe there are still unknown Death Eaters working in the Ministry?
But Frank Bryce was killed with Voldemort's wand before he made contact with any Death Eater except Peter.

[Xantilair]

Yes I know that but how do you know that Peter had not been controlling another MOM witch or wizard who got the wand back. The MOM might not have known it was missing as a replacement might have been left behind at the MOM evidence locker to hide the fact that the original wand had been stolen?

[tarachristwen]

It's possible that Voldemort could have bought a new one, or stole someone else's, like Quirrel's after he got blown to pieces!

i don't think he's able to do so..

maybe barty jr kept it for him...who else?

[Diary]

I think the reason Peter wasen't in OOTP was because he was trying to get Voldemort's wand back. Then be in hiding. If I remember he used his own one in GOF toressurect Voldy and gave it to him to duel.

Because, in SS Olivander told harry the wand chosses the wizard and that if a wizard used someone's wand then it would cause problems.

[mattimusprime]

Voldemort used his own wand in the duel at the of GOF. The reason it wen't haywire is because you can't use a wand's twin against the other. Harry and Voldemort share twin wands. My theory to Voldemort getting his own wand back is that Pettigrew or possibly another DE(Lucius Malfoy mentions that he has a lot of dark arts things hidden at his house) was simply keeping it for him.

[Tane]

I am with those that say Pettigrew got the wand back to Voldemort; he was in rat form and could have very easily sliped past anyone at Godric Hollows. Peter could have very easily hid the wand at the Riddle House before being found by the Weasleys.

[victoriakrum]

the wand chooses the wizard (or witch) so maybe it finds them too...?

[Fawkesified]

Voldemort used his own wand in the duel at the of GOF. The reason it wen't haywire is because you can't use a wand's twin against the other. Harry and Voldemort share twin wands. My theory to Voldemort getting his own wand back is that Pettigrew or possibly another DE(Lucius Malfoy mentions that he has a lot of dark arts things hidden at his house) was simply keeping it for him.

As far as I know, the wand itself is not 'Dark Magic'.

[skittles2]

Maybe it flew out of the house after the explosion and couldn't be found by anyone because it was dug in or something. And then, after years of Voldy going around becoming snakes and animals and Peter finding him again, he became a little stronger. And as Mr. Ollivander said, not the wizard chooses the wand, but the wand chooses it's owner. So I think maybe the wand found its way back to Voldy after him searching it in his mind or something. I think there is a very close connection from wand to owner and that a wizard can always find his wand because of this connection. Could be, right?

[cornish_pixies]

I'm think that it was Peter who picked up Voldemort's wand from the rubble and gave it back to him, after he had returned to power. Perhaps he did that whole - faking suicide thing - with Voldemort's wand as well?

[skittles2]

Maybe the wand flew away to somewhere because of the explosion when Voldy tried to kill Harry. He was very weak then and fled, knowing that he had to save the little life that was still left in him. But over the years he got stronger and used animals (mainly snakes) as a body until Peter found him again, who then helped Voldy get even stronger. So after a while he wanted his wand back and maybe he searched for it in his mind, maybe he had a feeling where it could be. I think there is a close connection from wizard to wand and that he can always find it because there is something binding them to each other. And a wand chooses its owner, so maybe it's able to find him again when he's lost it. That's what I think.