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-   -   Gilmore Girls v.2 (http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=102405)

Moriath March 15th, 2007 12:31 am

Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Welcome to the second version of the thread! :)


last few post of version one:    


  
Quote:

Originally Posted by pinguinolatino (Post 4389882)
Exactly. Recognizing the faults in something you like doesn't mean you don't appreciate it anymore.


And It seems that the last half of season 6, not just the finale, was the Palladino's way of goofing the show up for the new writers. The out of characterness really came out of nowhere.

I'm curious about the series finale. Supposedly, ASP had it planned out already, but with her gone, do you think they're still going to follow her original plan? Or do you think they'll come up with a new one?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pegasus (Post 4389890)
Why did the Palladinos ditch the show, anyway?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eira (Post 4391169)
Their contract was over and they decided against renewing it. These are their reasons for why they chose not to renew the contract:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pegasus (Post 4391335)
There has to be something unstated for them to give the kind of send-off they did.
Ah, well. It's Hollywood gossip, anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordmundt6 (Post 4391889)
The CW cheaped out on them. Pure and simple--really ridiculous since they only had TWO quality shows and the other one was the underfed cult favorite Veronica Mars. It was just "too expensive" to pay them what they were worth and keep the cast together. Stupid, stupid, stupid. However, I really think there was trouble brewing in River City during the latter stages of the 5th season as well. They appear to have deliberately written Rory into making the most ridiculously un-Rory decision ever (quitting school and moving back to purgatory, aka the Gilmore house)--was that to force Lorelai into taking the plunge with Luke?:huh: I never got that. Plus, Lorelai was understanding enough that Rory NEVER should have freaked out the way she did.

  



version one

Have fun with the discussion of anything Gilmore! :yuhup:

Pegasus March 15th, 2007 2:33 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

The CW cheaped out on them. Pure and simple--really ridiculous since they only had TWO quality shows and the other one was the underfed cult favorite Veronica Mars. It was just "too expensive" to pay them what they were worth and keep the cast together. Stupid, stupid, stupid. However, I really think there was trouble brewing in River City during the latter stages of the 5th season as well. They appear to have deliberately written Rory into making the most ridiculously un-Rory decision ever (quitting school and moving back to purgatory, aka the Gilmore house)--was that to force Lorelai into taking the plunge with Luke? I never got that. Plus, Lorelai was understanding enough that Rory NEVER should have freaked out the way she did.
Gotcha, and I agree. There's not much I liked about last season. I remember reading an interview with the lady who plays Lorelai and realizing she felt completely out-of-character, so it wasn't just me. I still hated the affair with Dean worse, though.

jordmundt6 March 15th, 2007 3:04 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
The affair with Dean was a two-way street and really, the majority of it was HIS fault. He asked Lindsey to marry him, just to get a rise out of Rory, to prove to her that he'd moved on--and he hadn't. Up to and PAST the night of his BACHELOR PARTY he was wondering--"I loved her so much, and she was so wonderful, but she didn't love me. WHY didn't she love me? Why did it stop?" Luke noticed it and tried to step in. He might have been a little more forceful, but he did just about everything except stand up when pastor said "If anyone knows of any reason why these two should not be joined..." Then, he neglected Lindsey to hang out with Rory in spite of the fact that he knew his wife was threatened by it. Rory did cheat with him and her conduct was appalling, but Dean came out looking much worse in that instance.

We've seen Rory freak out before (the stupid Chilton lit test, aftereffects of the first Dean breakup, realizing that extracurriculars were the key to a college application) but nothing this bad, and given a little space and time, Lorelai's reasoning would win out. As for Lorelai acting out of character--well, she did give Luke a lot of space when he found out about April. But I thought Lorelai might do that (only for the love of her life, mind, but I think she could and would make that sacrifice). As for the Christopher thing though--that was just ridiculous.:grumble::grumble::grumble: The only thing I could think of to explain it was that the Palladinos were scuttling the series because they were being ousted.

Pegasus March 15th, 2007 3:58 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
I agree the Dean thing was mostly his fault, but it doesn't mean I liked it.

jordmundt6 March 15th, 2007 4:27 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
I hated it as well, I mean how could she be that stupid?!:grumble: However, most of the blame fell on Dean, the way they played it and then his comment to Luke about how Lorelai would get bored becasue Luke had no more depth, was worth no more than he was--was just despicable.:argh::argh::argh::argh::argh::argh:

Pegasus March 15th, 2007 4:44 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Luke is so devalued on that show. Lorelai couldn't possibly do better.

jordmundt6 March 15th, 2007 5:09 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Yes, and she's proven it by going after the wrong guys over and over. The truly sad thing about that whole exchange was that it seemed so out of character for Dean, even despondent, bitter, self-pitying Dean. It seemed to contradict at least two years' worth of his development on the show. I really don't think that the writers undervalue Luke--I mean look at the letter Lorelai wrote to that judge, that seemed to display a firm grasp of Luke's true nature and worth. He is what she's looking for, the "complete package" that she lamented losing after Christopher went (kicking and screaming:rolleyes:) back to Sherry. He is her perfect match, her soul mate. As frustrating as that 5th season finale was, the cute part of the whole thing was Luke running through everything out loud that she had previously to demonstrate how alike they thought as Rory's parents. It was so endearing that her tearful gut reaction (the proposal) and his understandably stunned one ("What?!") were completely endearing. The frustrating part about it was that we had to sit on that proposal for summer hiatus, not that it happened, and not that they were both so genuinely in that moment.:D

Moriath March 15th, 2007 9:53 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pegasus (Post 4393250)
Luke is so devalued on that show. Lorelai couldn't possibly do better.

It's not as if he showed her lots and lots of love at the time April came into his life. This was nicely contrasted with Christopher's readiness to share everything. He showed her the letter from GG's mum and he included her into GG's life. Luke was new to the whole parent thing but he should have noticed how unhappy Lorelai was. It's not a week we are talking about but a longer period of time. Postponing the wedding was incredibly insensitive. So no, I do not think that Lorelai could not do better. She loves Luke and they will end up together, there is no doubt about that. But Luke is not perfect. He cannot talk about his feelings, it takes ages until he makes decisions and he closes up on everyone when there is something worrying in his life.

jordmundt6 March 15th, 2007 5:44 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
I would never claim that Luke is perfect, but he is her soul mate and he not only tolerates her quirks, he loves them, adapts to them, indulges them. They've never written a better male character on this show. He is not a man without fault, but no man, save one, ever was. As far as asking for the delay on the wedding--there are a couple of reasons for that.

1. He wants and needs to get his head around being a parent.
2. He knows that he needs to give his marriage his whole self and his whole attention, but in order to do that he has to understand what being a parent means, since he already is one.
3. I think that he was also probably affected by Dean's situation (I mean he had a front row seat for Dean losing his mind) and he was wary of such a thing happening in his own life.

These reasons do not excuse him, but I believe they satisfactorily explain what he did. As for Chris--he was being what he always is--selfish, stupid, and totally unable to handle the situation.:argh:

crookshanks1177 March 16th, 2007 1:06 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
If Chris is so stupid and selfish, would he have let Lorelia go so easily? Would he have admitted he was wrong in rushing her in their relationship and getting married? The guy was hurt, he's allowed to be a bit frustrated. I think he handled well all in all. I wouldn't call him stupid and selfish. Capable of error yes, so is everyone else.

misswildfire March 16th, 2007 4:09 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
So, anything thoughts on how much Logan is being an idiotic jerk lately? He's really beginning to annoy me. I'm super proud of Rory for standing up to him and giving him a piece of her mind! S'about time!

mac_attack March 16th, 2007 7:05 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
logan really is a jerk, i don't get what rory sees in him. he reminds me of an older tristan (from chilton). i think rory has changed a lot from who she used to be, she lets logan push her around more than she let any other boyfriend...i was hoping she'd dump logan and go find jess, but that doesn't seem to be happening. as for lorelai...i agree that luke was being jerk-ish, but to give him an ultimatum like that and then run off and sleep with christopher?? bad idea. and i used to like christopher, but i felt like he was pressuring her too much to get married in paris and thats why she went through with the whole thing.

btw, did anyone catch the gilmore girls mention in the latest veronica mars??
its here if anyone wants to check it out :D

Pegasus March 17th, 2007 3:59 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jordmundt6 (Post 4393275)
I really don't think that the writers undervalue Luke

No; I meant the characters on the show, mostly Lorelai's parents. My comment was in response to Dean's comment about Luke not being good enough for her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jordmundt6 (Post 4393969)
I would never claim that Luke is perfect, but he is her soul mate and he not only tolerates her quirks, he loves them, adapts to them, indulges them.

This is what I meant, too. It took Chris how many years to become responsible? He didn't have any money till he got an inheritance. Lorelai is a self-made woman (in spite of her "upbringing); Luke is a self-made man.

Moriath March 17th, 2007 11:59 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pegasus (Post 4396270)
This is what I meant, too. It took Chris how many years to become responsible? He didn't have any money till he got an inheritance. Lorelai is a self-made woman (in spite of her "upbringing); Luke is a self-made man.

I see your point but they did a poor job presenting Luke as the ideal man in season six and seven. Lorelai does not frequent the social circle her parents live in but contrary to Luke, Christopher knew what to do and how to behave at dinners, etc. He doesn't need encouragement and motivation speeches for weeks just to make it to one of Emily's parties. Their trip to Paris was good for Lorelai and Chris. I had the feeling that the deterioration of their relationship was written in a very forced way. Both Chris and Lorelai were ready for a commitment while Luke was still doubting and faltering. As I said before, Luke and Lorelai are bound to end up together but they should have married in season six. The whole April plot is so very redundant and Christoper/Lorelai was squeezed in.

misswildfire March 17th, 2007 3:15 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Yes, but Chris pushed for them to get married. He knew that Lorelai wasn't ready, but he pushed her anyway. What he ended up with was a wife who wasn't fully ready to be in a relationship like that. Chris realized near the end that she still had feelings for Luke and I'm pretty sure Luke still has feelings for her.

jordmundt6 March 19th, 2007 3:51 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Pegasus--Chris STILL doesn't know how to be responsible which is--I suppose--part of the problem. As for his finally LISTENING to Lorelai and realizing that her heart was breaking to realize that he was the one she "wanted to want" but not the one she actually wanted or needed.:sigh:

As far as knowing that he pushed her--you know that he had to know there was something wrong at least from the time he tried to beat up Luke (as pointless as Tristan trying to fight Dean, but still...:elaugh:).

As far as Christopher "knowing how to behave in Emily & Richard's world"--um, really? He hit the sauce as much as or more than Lorelai did. Furthermore, when he's truly invested in something he's as obnoxious, unfeeling, and self-centered as you could ever imagine (his hissyfit in the diner complaining that Lorelai was "blaming [him] for 15 years of disappointments" was ridiculous; his attempt to bolt from Sherry to Lorelai after smashing Lorelai's heart at Sookie's wedding was both irresponsible and selfish; his behavior at Richard & Emily's vow renewal was UNPARDONABLE:argh:) As far as Luke & Lorelai vs. Lorelai and Chris--Chris STILL hasn't grown up. He STILL isn't ready for a marital relationship. After the experience of trial and error with Chris, Lorelai might FINALLY be ready. Luke had been ready and more, but the insertion of his daughter brought him back to Lorelai's level. It's interesting that BOTH of April's parents were so concerned about being replaced in the little genius' affections by Lorelai that they both overcompensated and treated Lorelai poorly. Luke was defensive and passive-aggressive. Anna was hypocritical and condescending tinged with some downrght hostility that made no sense.

The biggest writing gaffe at the end of Season 6 was Lorelai bolting--she had no reason to do so. The air was clear with Luke over April and she knew that Luke loved her more than life itself. She freaked--and it was as truly inexplicable and uncharacteristic as Rory's behavior at the end of Season 5.:sigh: It looks and feels like the Palladinos were trying to crash the series as they were being forced out.:sad:

pinguinolatino March 19th, 2007 5:59 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jordmundt6 (Post 4399245)
The biggest writing gaffe at the end of Season 6 was Lorelai bolting--she had no reason to do so. The air was clear with Luke over April and she knew that Luke loved her more than life itself. She freaked--and it was as truly inexplicable and uncharacteristic as Rory's behavior at the end of Season 5.:sigh: It looks anf feels like the Palladinos were trying to crash the series as they were being forced out.:sad:

Oh, very well said. You are so spot on.


After all that's happened, I don't even know if I want Luke and Lorelai to get back together. Obviously they will, but with how things are and how they both acted, I'm disappointed in both of them.

Moriath March 19th, 2007 10:27 am

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jordmundt6 (Post 4399245)
The biggest writing gaffe at the end of Season 6 was Lorelai bolting--she had no reason to do so. The air was clear with Luke over April and she knew that Luke loved her more than life itself. She freaked--and it was as truly inexplicable and uncharacteristic as Rory's behavior at the end of Season 5. It looks anf feels like the Palladinos were trying to crash the series as they were being forced out.

How was the air clear? :huh: He still spent time with April alone and did not do anything to change the situation for Lorelai. Basically everyone knew more about April than she did. There was a lot of pent-up frustration and I found the outburst very credible. Lorelai isn't known for her patience and Luke should have given her something she could believe in.

Eira March 19th, 2007 2:03 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pinguinolatino (Post 4399399)
After all that's happened, I don't even know if I want Luke and Lorelai to get back together. Obviously they will, but with how things are and how they both acted, I'm disappointed in both of them.

I do want them to get back together, but I agree on the disappointed bit. I'm disappointed on both of them.

There was a huge miscommunication problem that shouldn't have happened. After all, before they got together, Luke could always read into Lorelai's mood. He always knew if there was something wrong with her. How could he not know she felt hurt and pushed aside with the whole April issue? The way he dealt with all of it was totally out of character. Not the going two months without telling Lorelai, mind you, but the whole not including her in the April stuff.

As for Lorelai, I know she tends to be impulsive in the "do-first-think-about-it-later" mode, but it was completely out of character for her to cheat on her fiancé. Because that's what she did when she went to Christopher, cheat. Perhaps it wasn't so for her, as she may have thought her and Luke were over after he said no to elopement, but she knows Luke isn't the impulsive type. Seriously, what was she expecting? 'Yeah, great idea, let me pack and we're off?' That wasn't going to happen, that's not Luke!

So, it all boils down to: everything is the stupid shrink's fault. ;) :lol: (Just kidding).

jordmundt6 March 30th, 2007 3:11 pm

Re: Gilmore Girls v.2
 
Anyone heard when they're planning to air new episodes? I loved "To Whom it May Concern" but you can only see Chris imploding so many times before it gets boring.


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