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Nicole February 3rd, 2007 3:03 pm

Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
WARNING: This is a spoiler free area. For all Deathly Hallows discussion, please head to The Deathly Hallows Forum. Any posts in this thread that are considered to be spoilers shall be deleted by staff. Thank you.

Link to Version Four
Link to Version Three

So...the final book of the series, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. Will Harry survive?

Last few posts of V4:    


  
Quote:

Originally Posted by shaun0505 (Post 4328970)
Dumbledore obvioulsy knew loads about the prophecy at that point so hes saying, even if Harry does defeat Voldemort, he will still have his scar. I'd hate Harry to die. What a way to end the series. But I think if he did, Jo wouldn't make the ending depressing, she'd find someway of making it happier and jolly, to the best of her abilities as a writer anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by siebensprung (Post 4328982)
I don´t know if Harry will die (but I hope NOT). This is something I found out while I was searching a proper dictionary for deathly. While I studied a German dictionary about the expression deathly which is tötlich in German I found an interesting synonym for it. deathly=tötlich means sterbend and sterbend means going to die, it´s a process of dying. Therefore a person who looks deathly is probabaly someone who will die, not that the person is already dead. Does it help a little?

Quote:

Originally Posted by xirtalleb (Post 4328986)
An Evening with Harry, Carrie and Garp August 2, 2006Soledad O'Brien: I'm going to pose the final question to you and I'd like all three of you to take a stab at it. You can do it in any order that you would like. If you were to have dinner with any five characters from any of your books -- take a moment to think about it -- who would you invite, and why would they be on your list? Any order.
JK Rowling: Well I'd take Harry, to apologize to him (crowd laughs). Um, I'd have to take Harry, Ron and Hermione.
Stephen King: Sure.
JK Rowling: I would - this is - (crown shouts suggestions).
Stephen King: Hagrid, take Hagrid.
JK Rowling: See, I know who's actually dead.
Stephen King: Pretend you can take them anyways.
JK Rowling: Pretend I can take anyone? Well then I would definitely take Dumbledore. I'd take Dumbledore, Harry, Ron, Hermione...and.. (crowd shouts characters) um, Hagrid. I'd take Hagrid, yeah. And Owen because he wouldn't take up much space (crowd laughs). "
I think that j.k saying she would invite harry to apologize is pretty much telling us that something extremely horrible is going to happen and i think she is apologizing for killing him Harry is going to die. I would like that ending it would be nice sad but nice (nice if he also defeated voldemort)

  

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jammi567 February 3rd, 2007 4:25 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
yay! first post.

no, i don't think it would, because that would be going against the theme that good always wins. and anyway, this is a kids book, so i think it would upset them if he did die.

lindaluna February 3rd, 2007 6:53 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Will Harry Die?

:hmm: I hope want & pray NO. I hope he's the one JKR gave a reprieve to. :relax:

But I'm scared for Ron and Hermione. I can see them saying "you have to go through us first" and Voldie saying "OK" & blasting his way through.

Will Harry as we know him survive?
:no:

On a slightly different theoretical basis though, I can see Harry AS WE KNOW HIM not surviving.

Suppose...Harry, with a time turner, goes back and kills Voldie, or, as they do in hero land, "arranges for Voldemort to die...by the hand of another or by bizarre accident brought on by villian's own eviltude..."

This would change the time line, and Harry as we know him may disappear.

Unfortunately this would pave the way for a multitude of sequels.

If Harry dies, our window into Hogwarts & the magic world will close, and the series will be over.

We will long for the rest of our adult lives to return there.

Now that's a great end to a children's book series.

The End.

Celestrin February 3rd, 2007 7:23 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by walkingideas
I think Harry will die after destroying the Horcruxes and killing Voldemort. It is sad, but Harry's duty , his reason to live, was to defeat Voldemort.
Getting rid of an Horcrux is really difficult and it weakens you a lot ( let's remember Dumbledore's hand ). After destroying 4 of them, I don't think Harry will be fit enough to survive an atack on Voldemort and even if he does, I think Harry would have prefered die. Shocked?
Well, we know by experience that harry likes to take shocking decisions ( He doesn't want to go back to Hogwarts for example ). He is determined to just kill off the guy who killed his parents and thats it. Thats the only thing that matters. He forgot about education, his girlfriend and even wanted to leave his friends out.
I think life after the Second War for Harry would be very sad, because he would always have to remember, what he went through, all the battles, all the people that were killed.
And anyways, don't take Harry's death too bad, don't be egoistic, he wants to join his parents and Sirius.

I think you bring some really important things up in your agument here. For a long time I really felt quite the same way. I thought Harry was a character who could never reach literary compleation untill he was aloud to get his one true desire: family. I though for the first five books that Harry would have to die to really be compleated; that way he could be with his mom dad and Sirius. I agree with you as well that if Harry succeded in killing Voldie he would be too big, too grand a character to continue on.

However I have changed my opinion after HBP. When Rowling gave Harry Ginny, she gave him a life after DH. Ginny is Harry's character compleation. She fufills his greatest desire, family. Through her he can marry into the Weasley's, as well as start his own family.

Also, we see through Dumbledore it is posible to continue living a life after defeating a powerful dark wizard. This along with the Ginny plotline makes me believe Harry will survive DH.

lindaluna February 3rd, 2007 7:28 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestrin (Post 4329502)
I though for the first five books that Harry would have to die to really be completed; that way he could be with his mom dad and Sirius. I agree with you as well that if Harry succeded in killing Voldie he would be too big, too grand a character to continue on.

However I have changed my opinion after HBP. When Rowling gave Harry Ginny, she gave him a life after DH. Ginny is Harry's character completion. She fufills his greatest desire, family. Through her he can marry into the Weasley's, as well as start his own family.

If Harry survived by strange temporal loop, ie he got 18 years grace so he could fulfill his destiny of killing Voldie....

Ginny could just be JKR's way of making us feel that Harry lost a future when he died, making us feel regret, rather than that he is a literary character with a destiny to die to fulfill plot points.

Ie, he's still going to die, but we'll regret it more.

T__Riddle February 3rd, 2007 7:36 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

However I have changed my opinion after HBP. When Rowling gave Harry Ginny, she gave him a life after DH. Ginny is Harry's character completion. She fufills his greatest desire, family. Through her he can marry into the Weasley's, as well as start his own family.
I have always felt that Ginny has given Harry more purpose than just defeating the Voldemort and saving the world, but I have never thought about her giving him a potential life after DH, and now I think about it you are quite right.

Whether this will make a more tragic death by killing him, or a more meaningful life I am divided on: there are so many advantages and disadvantages of both situation.

If Harry does die JK will have to make sure it isn't an anticlimax after 7 books, in other words his death will have to have meaning and he doesn't just die for the sake of it. I am inclined to think that if he does die he will die for love, either for Ginny, his friends or the whole human race, as love is a recurring theme throught the books and it would almost complete the circle.

Harry_Potter31 February 3rd, 2007 7:58 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
What I hope will happen is that when he kills Voldemort it will be out of self sacrifice type thing to only have his scar disappear and he will looklike a normal 17 year old boy , and marry Ginny , but I'll have to read book 7 to find out if that even could happen I mean Voldemort and Harry 's fate are intertwined like Sherlock Holmes and Moriarty and both of them will have to die to free the world of evil but I still hope that Harry will survives and marries Ginny and have a family together .

mactabard_25 February 3rd, 2007 8:04 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Personally I think Harry will die. Voldy and Harry's fates are intermingled. :evil:

Spritey February 3rd, 2007 10:47 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Okay, broken record girl is here! I figured I could restate my case in the new thread, so that you don't all just think I'm a horrible fan who wants Harry dead :D

Anyway, basically I think it's likely that Harry will die and be reunited with his family, or die and come back from beyond the Veil, having at least met them again one more time. I mainly believe this because Voldemort, Harry's rival, is so terrified of death himself - so terrified that he would even split his own soul to avoid it. Harry is a parallel of Voldemort in lots of ways, but he's also very different; he makes good choices, he's brave, and he loves others. I think that, because of this, he'll give up his life for someone else - which will put a stress on the differences between them, since Harry will have done what Voldemort is so blindly scared of, and he'll have done it in the name of saving someone else.

However, I think that he may be given a choice of coming back, and that he'll take the chance if he's given it, because he's really got a lot to live for.

Quote:

and anyway, this is a kids book, so i think it would upset them if he did die.
Doesn't work, I don't think.

Quote:

Have you ever thought "Maybe I should tone it down"?

JKR: No. I know that sounds kind of brutal but no, I haven't. The bottom line is, I have to write the story I want to write. I never wrote them with a focus group of 8-year-olds in mind. I have to continue telling the story the way I want to tell it. I don't at all relish the idea of children in tears, and I absolutely don't deny it's frightening. But it's supposed to be frightening! And if you don't show how scary that is, you cannot show how incredibly brave Harry is. He's really brave, and he does, I think, one of his bravest things in this book: He can't save Cedric, but he wants to save Cedric's parents additional pain. He wants to bring back the body and treat it with respect.
Quote:

DR: ... and if you've just joined us, we have a real treat this morning, having J.K. Rowling with us. She is Joanne Rowling, the author of the Harry Potter series. Three books that have ignited young *and* adult readers all around the world. If you'd like to join us 1-800-433-8850. What age group are you actually aiming for, Jo?

JKR: When I'm writing, I don't aim for any - any age group. I write these books entirely for myself. And in fact, before - before my British publisher Bloomsbury told me that they were going to market the books as for 9 year olds and above, I really had no idea. A vague idea, obviously. I mean, I was aware they weren't for 3 year olds, and I knew that probably 19 year olds would be wanting to read other stuff, although I've met quite a few 19 year olds since, so that's - that's a really nice thing. The optimum age, I'd definitely say is 9+ for these books.
Here and here.

xirtalleb February 3rd, 2007 11:06 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jammi567 (Post 4329244)
yay! first post.

no, i don't think it would, because that would be going against the theme that good always wins. and anyway, this is a kids book, so i think it would upset them if he did die.

J.K.Rowling has said and i will find the quote that she doesn't write the book thinking about how the little kiddies reading it will react she writes it the way she wants to which is fair enough its her book and i don't think she wouldn't kill harry off just because all the little kids will get upset :rockon:

La_La February 4th, 2007 12:00 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I think Harry is definitely going to vanquish Voldemort. Whether he'll die or not...I'm still undecided. I couldn't bear it if he lost his powers and became completely muggle. I'd rather he died.

hphphp62442 February 4th, 2007 12:52 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I really, really hope not. JK set it up perfectly for him to live. He has the Weasleys to be his family now, he will never have to see the Dursleys again....If he destroys Voldemort, he will have the chance to turn his life around completely, he'll be able to start over.

JK has also said that Harry is now realizing that Ginny is the girl for him. Why would she make him realize that if it's only going to last for those few short weeks in the 6th book? That would be completely pointless, I don't believe she would have spoken about their relationship in that way if she was going to do no more to continue it.

tuer_lisse February 4th, 2007 12:55 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I think Harry will die. JKR wants to leave absolutely no room for other authors to write subsequent or prequel novels. The best way to accomplish this would be to kill Harry and Voldemort.

FaceofBoe February 4th, 2007 1:10 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tuer_lisse (Post 4330027)
I think Harry will die. JKR wants to leave absolutely no room for other authors to write subsequent or prequel novels. The best way to accomplish this would be to kill Harry and Voldemort.

JKR has said that, although she can understand writings killing their protagonist to prevent other people writing about them, she herself has never been tempted to do that. If Harry dies, it will be because that's the story, and it's been the story since the beginning.

mactabard_25 February 4th, 2007 1:16 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hphphp62442 (Post 4330019)
I really, really hope not. JK set it up perfectly for him to live. He has the Weasleys to be his family now, he will never have to see the Dursleys again....If he destroys Voldemort, he will have the chance to turn his life around completely, he'll be able to start over.

JK has also said that Harry is now realizing that Ginny is the girl for him. Why would she make him realize that if it's only going to last for those few short weeks in the 6th book? That would be completely pointless, I don't believe she would have spoken about their relationship in that way if she was going to do no more to continue it.

Yeah but JK has also said that her books are sometimes cruel. So that few weeks could be the knife to twist in the readers as Harry looses Ginny or is lost himself.

Daelin February 4th, 2007 2:00 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I don't know if I'm right, but for the first time I feel like I know what the title means before I read the book, and that is important to this question.

There are a lot of hints in the books, which say things along the lines of Harry looking back later, as if to indicate he thinks back on them many years later. But more to the point, let's consider what happens in this book that we can reasonably expect.

OK, Rowling has definitely not promised that Harry lives. However, we know from the prophecy that Harry, Voldemort, or both will have to die. Now frankly, while Harry could die, if Voldemort kills him and lives himself, I really don't see how that is a satisfying end. So option 1 seems closed to me. Either just Voldemort dies, or both Harry and Voldemort buy it.

OK, part 2. A LOT of people have sacrificed to keep Harry safe and alive. Do the deaths of his parents, Cedric [yes, I know Cedric wanted to live, but remember what he and Frank said in Goblet of Fire when Harry had the showdown with Voldemort], numerous members of the Order, indirectly Sirius and Albus Dumbledore make sense in the end if all they did was let Harry die later? I don't see changing 'The Boy Who Lived' into 'The Young Man Who Died Anyway' as a satisfying plot.

And finally, the title. "Deathly Hallows". Ahhhhhhhhhh, there's a carefully chosen phrase.

"Deathly". NOT "Deadly", not "Dead", but "Deathly", as in contact with Death, but not dying himself. It implies help from the dead, as we saw foreshadowed in 'Goblet of Fire', and it reminds me of what Voldemort fears most. Since Voldy fears death, there is no way he can access help from the other side, and I doubt he's got a lot of friends there anyway.

And "Hallows". As in to make holy, but more important, Hallows, not Hallows' <i>Eve</i>, which is Halloween, but Hallows, as in the next day. The title clearly implies that Harry will be finished with the events and enemy of Halloween, Voldemort who killed his parents, and will be able to move on, to the 'next day' and on with his life.

Strider62442 February 4th, 2007 7:28 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
JKR has carefully kept open the possibility that Harry could die. She acknowledged the scenario where the writer kills the character to keep them theirs for eternity. But it struck me as odd because its really a non-issue. Could anyone ever concievably take up Harry Potter without JKR's permission? Harry is already locked in as hers and only hers, so the death based on closing off Harry to other authors seems pointless since hes closed off to them alive. Yet JKR made a point of acknowledging it. I think she wants to keep us guessing and in suspense.

The series, its message and themes point more toward Harry living. Throughout the books Harry lives against increasingly astounding odds. But he has suffered terribly along the way. To kill him upon achieving final victory would be too cruel. Seeing his parents and Sirius and Dumbledore again wouldn't be enough. He has more on the ground going for him in Ginny and Ron and Hermione.

Its not as simple as saying "you cant kill him because it will upset the kids." Let us not forget that this series has likely upset most people already. Cedric's murder was disturbing, Sirius's was upsetting, Dumbledore's was downright crushing. The series has already established through those deaths, especially Dumbledore's that heroes often meet their end unnaturally. The series has not been all miraculous victories for the Light Side in Harry's triumphs and escapes. This series has also been filled with predictable and inevitable numerous victories that evil wins.

Then there is the wizarding world to think about. These people as a society have given Harry very little but pain. The society is sufficently sunken prejudice and corruption to deserve what its getting. They don't desserve to be saved by Harry's sacrifice. It would do much more than frustrate many of us. The peace after the war will be botched by whoever is left to lead the wizarding community and minimal change will insue because all the wise leadership was killed in the war. It's happened before in our world. It would be too real for it to be presented in HP.

It would also seem too cruel to Ginny. Sure, its not as though they were married or anything like that, and yes she could move on and have a happy life. But she would always remember and wonder. Can someone ever really move on from something like that? This is a situation that has occured too often also. And we all already knew it. Why insert despair into a series that has been about hope? I look at Ginny more as other people have mentioned, as evidence that Harry has a purpose after Voldemort. She has been explicit in saying that Harry is not a Christ figure. She has also been careful to say again and again that that the prophecy is only significant because both Harry and Voldemort have chosen to take it seriously. So you can't say Harry came into the world for the sole purpose of killing Voldemort, it isn't true to the message about destiny and the gradual ascension of Ginny as Harry's ideal girl reinforces this.

Harry is clearly willing to die to get rid of Voldemort and would not hesitate to sacrifice himself for those he loves. This doesnt mean that it must be so. It is critical that Harry is willing to do as his mother did. In the end I think it will be like when he looked into the Mirror of Erised; one willing to lay down their life for others will be able to vanquish Voldemort and live.

Death is present throughout the whole of the series. But while keeping it real, with innocents and good guys dying, she has also cultivated a refined and hopeful presentation of the subject. In Order of the Phoenix Harry heard voices behind the veil. This was a subtle but obvious confirmation to Harry that there is definately something on the other side. Before the moment when he talked about it with Luna Harry viewed death simply as the end. JKR presents that view of death without Dr. House's "let's make sure you know that your existance and your pain and suffering is all for nothing". JKR has routinely injected a tone of mystery and hope into the subject.

Perhaps this could be viewed as preparing the reader and Harry for his ultimate demise. At least he'll see his dead loved ones again. But while this could be a comfort to Harry, the one who has almost literal proof that death isnt just "the end", it is little comfort to us, the readers who have no such comfort as voices from beyond the veil, and we who have Dr. House weekly to give us our dose of depression.:lol: I think its a bad way to end the series. It pretty much says "Do the right thing kids, and even if you die, and die you probably will, and violently by the way, (since most people who do right in the face of evil do) and you will be with your dead loved ones in the beyond... if there really is one." Its not really an uplifting message and not at all consistent with the rest of the series. Even in the books that end in darkness, GoF, OotP, HBP, there is still the lingering hope. This is present in the last line of each of those books. Harry's death would just bring about the line "so what was the point of all this?"

Then there is the "Frodo" argument about Harry as we know him dying and maybe not being enough left to go on. I just can't see this happening. Harry is stronger than people give him credit for. I get surprised when people think he won't defeat Voldemort without Ginny holding his hand or something as if it wasnt his inner strength that got him through every serious crisis in his life. Sure Harry "cracked up a little" in OotP. But that was more a natural outgrowth of the strain he had been put through for five years and coming to the realization that it isn't going to end. By HBP though he has revived perceptably. His resolve has never been stronger. He isnt damaged goods to the point that he can't function, interact and love and he never will be. One of the keys to Harry's greatness according to Dumbledore was Harry's ability not to let evil corrupt or change his fundamental core. Predicting that Harry living would just leave severly damaged goods is inconsistant with what Dumbledore called "the incomparable power of the soul that is unbroken and whole."

For these reasons I think he will live. The series will end on its strongest message of hope. The good person can conquer evil totally. I think we will see Harry come out older in spirit and very weary. And who wouldnt be? The series has also been about Harry's education in a realm of magic outside of spells and potions-- corny but true. Harry will emerge from this thing with more wisdom than most people achieve in their lifetimes.

dobby999 February 4th, 2007 10:52 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
i can see two sides to this. if harry dies then something will happen to voldie which will make all his powers go, making him a squib, he will then end up working in hogwarts (as he has always had a conection with the place) and realise there are much worse things then death, especially when no one believes that he used to be the best wizard there ever was, though i can't work out how he wont go to azkaban if he loses all his powers, maybe just because he wouldn't be able to use magic to kill anyone anymore.
but if voldie dies, then harry survives which is then a proper childrens book because the good always win. and what was the point in J.K.R. creating such a charcter to kill him of, though i suppose that at least no one could carry the story on for her.
so as you can see i dont have a answer for this question, we are just going to have to wait for the book to come out.

witch1561 February 4th, 2007 11:44 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I also think that Harry will survive because I don't think he will be given a choice to sacrifice himself, if you know what I mean, because Voldemort would never let him live. Voldemort might kill him, but to me, that would be murder, not Harry sacrificing himself. It would be VOLDEMORT's decision ot kill Harry, and Harry's bad luck not to avoid it, and anyway how would Voldemort be killed? I know some people will disagree with me, but I don't think they can be connected so that by killing Harry Voldemort kills himself, or the prophecy would have said "neither can live when the other dies", and following the prophecy wouldn't have been a choice for either of them.

The idea of someone sacrificing his- or herself for a cause has to involve a choice. Lily sacrificed herself for, and saved, her son because she was given the chance to live and she turned the opportunity down to protect her baby son. That's what sacrifice is about: deciding to die to help someone/something else. Can you really see Voldemort giving Harry the chance to live?? Someone else (Snape? Wormtail?) sacrificing himself for Harry, maybe, but LV letting Harry live? Don't be daft.

jammi567 February 4th, 2007 12:07 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by xirtalleb (Post 4329855)
J.K.Rowling has said and i will find the quote that she doesn't write the book thinking about how the little kiddies reading it will react she writes it the way she wants to which is fair enough its her book and i don't think she wouldn't kill harry off just because all the little kids will get upset :rockon:

ahh, okay, i wasn't aware of those quotes. thanks for pointing that out to me.

Pat4891 February 4th, 2007 12:34 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
When reading the early books, 1-4 i did think it unlikely that Harry would ever live past book 7, how he would cope with his life after all this trauma? I couldn't see where the character could go. However book 5 changed that with the help of Harry teaching DADA. I can imagine when JK plots her books she decided to have a different teacher each year for DADA, while in fact Hary was better at the subject than most of his teachers. He was certainly better than Umbridge and perhaps even Snape. I can see the books ending with Harry being given the job of DADA professor. now i know someone has asked JK this question in one of her interviews and she said Harry was no academic, but DADA is more of a practical subject than an academic one. It would also have a bit of poetic justice if Harry became DADA. Another example is that Harry wanted to be part of the ministry, but recent events have made him think differently, so he ould want a job elsewhere, so where better than Hogwarts, the place he loves as his home. And Harry has stayed at the Privet Drive and Grimmauld place, but his only true home is Hogwarts though he does love the burrow.

My second reason why I think Harry will survive is Ginny. JK has built up their love story since the first book, why would she go through all this trouble just to rip them apart in book 7? If they were still together at the end of book 6 then i could see Harry dying, this would have given a bigger shock ending, but because they split up I can see them staying together after book 7. There's hope between them.

I know 2 characters are reported to die in book 7, but how major they are remains to be seem, and anyway they could be major bad characters.

inuyasha February 4th, 2007 9:45 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I really don't think that Harry will live at the end of deathly hallows, much to my dismay. It just seems like something JkR would do.

Sevstrueluve February 5th, 2007 7:05 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
" Soledad O'Brien: I'm going to pose the final question to you and I'd like all three of you to take a stab at it. You can do it in any order that you would like. If you were to have dinner with any five characters from any of your books -- take a moment to think about it -- who would you invite, and why would they be on your list? Any order.

JK Rowling: Well I'd take Harry, to apologize to him (crowd laughs). Um, I'd have to take Harry, Ron and Hermione.

Stephen King: Sure.

JK Rowling: I would - this is - (crown shouts suggestions).

Stephen King: Hagrid, take Hagrid.

JK Rowling: See, I know who's actually dead.

Stephen King: Pretend you can take them anyways.

JK Rowling: Pretend I can take anyone? Well then I would definitely take Dumbledore. I'd take Dumbledore, Harry, Ron, Hermione...and.. (crowd shouts characters) um, Hagrid. I'd take Hagrid, yeah. And Owen because he wouldn't take up much space (crowd laughs). " An Evening with Harry, Carrie and Garp:
Readings and questions #2, August 2, 2006
The trio will live. Harry is not going to die. Mayhap he might come close. But, Harry is not going to die.

Spritey February 5th, 2007 7:29 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
^ I don't think this proves that Harry won't die. I think it proves that he's the main character who springs to mind everytime she's asked that question :) Why do I keep italicizing "proves" in my head, making it sound super obnoxious and not-at-all-how-I-intended-it? We may never know. Did I mention it's 6am?

But seriously, I confess that when I saw that, I was irritated the MN hadn't put spoiler warnings near it - because I felt kind of spoiled, you know? But now I have had time to regroup and convince myself of my own delusions all over again :D Though I stick by the idea that she chose them straight off because hey - they're her main characters, and it would look odd if she didn't. And when I say stick, I mean, "won't be annoyed if Harry lives, either."

cocobean February 5th, 2007 8:34 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Asking will Harry die in DH?

Thats like asking will you get hit by a bus tomorrow?

We dont know! and any amount of guess work and analysing isnt going to make this topic an clearer or sway the answer towards a yes or no.

Obviously, there are excellent arguements for both, the favourite arguemnt i have found for Harry dying is: "JK will kill Harry to prevent any spin off's..."

Okay...i know what i just said (about that there is NO possible way to analyse this situation) but there is somthing that i have to say about this particular arguement. Which is as follows:

I dont see JK deciding to change the outcome of her whole series just to make sure a few nerds dont try and get the rights to publish some spin off's. If JK has it planned for Harry to die, then Harry's gonna die!
Besides, even if Harry does die, do you really think its going to prevent spinoffs? its easy to see from mugglenet fanfiction that adequet stroy lines can be written without Harry, or at least without Harry as a central character.

6_PhoenixSong_6 February 5th, 2007 11:16 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I really don't want Harry to die, but I think he will. I don't think Harry Potter is a completely happy ending sort of series. And when people say that if Harry dies it will contradict the theme that good always wins, good can still win, but consequences may also come with the victory. Harry's death could be one of those consequences. Trust me I would love it if Harry and Hermione (no I don't like the idea of Harry and Ginny, she seems to childish. And she irritates me.) could live happily ever after, but I highly doubt that will be the case. I just don't think that's JKR writing style.

Krystalus February 5th, 2007 1:19 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I personally hope he does die.
I think it would be harder for me to part with the 'Harry potter' series if I knew there was a Happy ending because.. well he'd still be alive and there would be more stories that could go on but wouldn't..

- But if he was killed off, I think it would make parting easier.
Thats just how I feel anyway.

Daelin February 5th, 2007 4:27 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Krystalus, are you saying that a live Harry would ruin the story for you?!?!?!

Personally, I think it's one of Rowling's famous Herrings a la Rouge, this notion that someone would 'steal' Potter and continue stories with him, like the 'Star Wars' stuff. After all, Star Wars started off as the movie and the books were a lower-order spinoff. The Potter books have always been the prime source, and anyone trying to shove out a 'Harry Potter' book whose name is not J.K. Rowling would have a very hard task indeed. Also, a dead Harry Potter would not prevent someone from writing stories about him. I myself could see a 'prequel' Potter, say the Life of Harry Potter circa 6 years old, or an interregnum Potter wedged in between the books.

A living hero is not going to be copied, necessarily. No one seriously tried to write a Sherlock Holmes story, for example, for decades after Doyle finished the series. So far as I know, the 'Tarzan' series left the King of the Apes alive and well, and no one tried to riff on Burroughs. Shoot, we could go all the way back to Beowulf if memory serves, and no one else has done a story using him. If the hero is sufficiently great, he is not cloned, at least while the original author lives.

And the living hero is not too schmaltzy. Look at Sam Gamgee at the end of Lord of the Rings, or anyone in Roger Zelazny's 'Amber' families, or Dashiell Hammet's ace detective Sam Spade, or just about any of Tolstoy's heroes and heroines. Just because the hero gets to keep breathing, does not demote him to a Teletubby.

FredWeasleyJr February 5th, 2007 6:02 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
its definately possible that Harry dies but I dont want to even think about it because it makes me insane... I want Book 8 to be released on 08/08/08

Timekill February 5th, 2007 6:45 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I've been on the fence about Harry dying but I've made up my mind tonight. I think he'll die.

Voldemort will somehow force Harry in to sacrificing himself for what he loves the most, Hogwarts, his friends and Ginny, and thus protecting them from Voldemort through his love, much in the same way as his parents protected him from Voldemort through their love.

Love is the thread that runs through the books, love is the strongest and most ancient magic, and the only thing that, in the end, can defeat Voldemort.

Harry will die protecting what he loves the most so that it can stay the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin (Post 4332723)
Krystalus, are you saying that a live Harry would ruin the story for you?!?!?!

Personally, I think it's one of Rowling's famous Herrings a la Rouge, this notion that someone would 'steal' Potter and continue stories with him, like the 'Star Wars' stuff. After all, Star Wars started off as the movie and the books were a lower-order spinoff. The Potter books have always been the prime source, and anyone trying to shove out a 'Harry Potter' book whose name is not J.K. Rowling would have a very hard task indeed. Also, a dead Harry Potter would not prevent someone from writing stories about him. I myself could see a 'prequel' Potter, say the Life of Harry Potter circa 6 years old, or an interregnum Potter wedged in between the books.

A living hero is not going to be copied, necessarily. No one seriously tried to write a Sherlock Holmes story, for example, for decades after Doyle finished the series. So far as I know, the 'Tarzan' series left the King of the Apes alive and well, and no one tried to riff on Burroughs. Shoot, we could go all the way back to Beowulf if memory serves, and no one else has done a story using him. If the hero is sufficiently great, he is not cloned, at least while the original author lives.

And the living hero is not too schmaltzy. Look at Sam Gamgee at the end of Lord of the Rings, or anyone in Roger Zelazny's 'Amber' families, or Dashiell Hammet's ace detective Sam Spade, or just about any of Tolstoy's heroes and heroines. Just because the hero gets to keep breathing, does not demote him to a Teletubby.

I think what Krystalus means that if Harry lives he will continue to have stories and adventures in his life that we won't know about because JKR won't write them. :)

Hermeneutic February 5th, 2007 8:25 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin (Post 4330132)
OK, part 2. A LOT of people have sacrificed to keep Harry safe and alive. Do the deaths of his parents, Cedric [yes, I know Cedric wanted to live, but remember what he and Frank said in Goblet of Fire when Harry had the showdown with Voldemort], numerous members of the Order, indirectly Sirius and Albus Dumbledore make sense in the end if all they did was let Harry die later? I don't see changing 'The Boy Who Lived' into 'The Young Man Who Died Anyway' as a satisfying plot.

Okay, now that's the funniest thing I've read all week.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin
And finally, the title. "Deathly Hallows". Ahhhhhhhhhh, there's a carefully chosen phrase.

"Deathly". NOT "Deadly", not "Dead", but "Deathly", as in contact with Death, but not dying himself. It implies help from the dead, as we saw foreshadowed in 'Goblet of Fire', and it reminds me of what Voldemort fears most. Since Voldy fears death, there is no way he can access help from the other side, and I doubt he's got a lot of friends there anyway.

And "Hallows". As in to make holy, but more important, Hallows, not Hallows' <i>Eve</i>, which is Halloween, but Hallows, as in the next day. The title clearly implies that Harry will be finished with the events and enemy of Halloween, Voldemort who killed his parents, and will be able to move on, to the 'next day' and on with his life.

I like this. The titles are pretty literal in what the main overarching plots of the books are or at least heavily entail. So Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows kinda reads like Harry Potter and the Day After. However this may just refer to the epilogue in general and things being wrapped up.

witch1561 February 5th, 2007 8:46 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin (Post 4332723)
After all, Star Wars started off as the movie and the books were a lower-order spinoff.

And the living hero is not too schmaltzy. Look at Sam Gamgee at the end of Lord of the Rings, or anyone in Roger Zelazny's 'Amber' families, or Dashiell Hammet's ace detective Sam Spade, or just about any of Tolstoy's heroes and heroines. Just because the hero gets to keep breathing, does not demote him to a Teletubby.

First, I was always told that the 'Star Wars' books came first, they just weren't very good, and there are the prequels because the were the first three books but when someone thought they would make a good film, they decided book 4 was much better than book 1...

I agree that living heroes can be fine, letting them survive the end can almost give a point to everything, if you know what I mean. Of course, it is usually happy for everyone else, but it feels a bit like "this character did all that for everyone, and then they don't live to see the results, when they should benefit the most!" if the hero/heroine dies.

I agree about the title suggesting moving on - to me it seems to suggest "going back to the beginning so we can leave this all behind".

Daelin February 5th, 2007 9:01 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Witch1561, as I recall - the advantage of being 17 when the first Star Wars movie came out - the movie came out in 1977, based on a screenplay Lucas proposed after the success of 'American Graffiti'. He had written the synopsis for each of 9 stories, but had to sell the producers on a space action film, which focused on Luke Skywalker. The other stories were basically 'backstory', not very different from what Rowling did to give depth to her characters. The retail books started coming out about 1980, after the success of 'Empire', when it was obvious that the series was a smash hit and TCF was talking about making 9 Star Wars movies. So the books were a later spin-off of the movies, and since Lucas never released the screenplays (the last 3 are still in his possession), the books were fan-fic, sold at conventions and over the Internet.

In Rowling's case, the books were the primary source, and so are less likely to see a copycat.

kash February 6th, 2007 7:12 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
well the way she has a flare for drammatics.. i think she will kill harry.. she has killed all the nice strong characters already.. plus no matter how secret she keeps the story.. some people know SOME DETAILS... the fact that they are making a helpline and mentioned in the next line that it is required to help cope the deaths of 2 people NOT to help people cope with the end of the series.i have a very strong feeling that harry will be killed. she has given us alotttt of hints.she does have tendencies to throw us off the mark.. but usually strong hints are usually right.. like the couples.. it was always ginny and harry.lupin and harry will die.. PLUS i almost forgot.. she has introduced the idea of death not being a bad thing in the wizard world.. and harry has already said that i wll take as many as i can with me.. i found that to be a HUGGGEEE sign.. harry isnt afraid of death.

Night_Seeker February 6th, 2007 7:48 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
'Witch1561, as I recall - the advantage of being 17 when the first Star Wars movie came out - the movie came out in 1977, based on a screenplay Lucas proposed after the success of 'American Graffiti'. He had written the synopsis for each of 9 stories, but had to sell the producers on a space action film, which focused on Luke Skywalker. The other stories were basically 'backstory', not very different from what Rowling did to give depth to her characters. The retail books started coming out about 1980, after the success of 'Empire', when it was obvious that the series was a smash hit and TCF was talking about making 9 Star Wars movies.'


No, see your right to a point but the very first Star Wars book came out in December 1976. It was a novelization of the film, ghost written by Alan Dean Foster, but credited to George Lucas based off of his screenplay for the film.

Then there was a spin-off novel for Star Wars that came out in 1978, called 'Splinter of the Minds Eye' by Alan Dean Foster as well. The rumor is, if SW wasen't successful, Lucas would turn that novel into the sequal, thats why most of it takes place on a foggy planet, to secure a lower budget.

Then there were toher spin-off likes the Han Solo adventures and Lando Calrissan adventures which came out in 1979-1980.

So there were SW spinoffs way before 1980.


Anyway, it'd be pretty fitting if history repeats itself and after destryoing all the Hrorcruxes, Harry stands weakened and defeated before Voldemort, who kindly asks him to stand aside so he could kill Ginny and Harry refuses. Voldemort kills Harry, tries to kill Ginny but once again the curse backfires but this time truly destroys him since the horcruxes are gone, thus love saves the day in the end as in the begining, and Harry having his mother in him pays off..


Just an idea. I dunno.

English_Rose February 6th, 2007 2:34 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
It's just one of those things i dont think were ever going to guess. if he dies i might have a breakdown so i hope he lives, he deserves to. Is Rowling really evil enough to kill him?

Elysia February 6th, 2007 5:57 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I can see reasoning for both sides.

Reasons JKR might let Harry live:
1. He's HARRY, for the love of pumpkin juice!
2. It is supposedly a children's book series - why upset the kiddies?
3. Everyone, no matter how rich they are, likes to make more money. Though she says she'll never write any more HP books, if she lets Harry live, then she leaves the option open just in case...
4. A dead hero? Boooo!

Reasons JKR might kill off Harry:
1. No more Harry, supposedly no one can bug her to write more HP books (but of course, they will anyway)
2. To show that Harry is willing to make the ultimate sacrifice.
3. It's her show, and if she started a "children's book series" with a baby's parents getting murdered, what wouldn't she do, really? People and creatures have been brutally murdered throughout the series, so why would Harry be exempt?


Personally, I hope Harry lives. It took me so long to get over Dumbledore's "death" (?) that if Harry dies, I don't think I can be held responsible. I will call in sick to work for at least a week. No kidding. I may have to change my name and move to another country. I just don't know if I can take it.

guad February 6th, 2007 6:48 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Well, I think most of you have seen already JKR update on her webpage, Diary section. :)

Jkrowling.com update feb6th extractWhile each of the previous Potter books has strong claims on my affections, 'Deathly Hallows' is my favourite, and that is the most wonderful way to finish the series.

She likes Harry, and if she says that it's a wonderful way to finish the serie, I have the feeling that he will survive. :)

kash February 6th, 2007 7:19 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by guad (Post 4334538)
Well, I think most of you have seen already JKR update on her webpage, Diary section. :)

Jkrowling.com update feb6th extractWhile each of the previous Potter books has strong claims on my affections, 'Deathly Hallows' is my favourite, and that is the most wonderful way to finish the series.

She likes Harry, and if she says that it's a wonderful way to finish the serie, I have the feeling that he will survive. :)


???!!!! u think that when she says its" the end of harrys story" it means harry wil survive..??? she couldve said end of harrypotter series.. she said end of harrys story..HE IS DEAD.. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH. SHE KILLED HIM.. she actualy killed him. im sure of it.. she is mourning cause she kiled him.she has a flare for drammatics.im having a break down.

Elysia February 6th, 2007 7:23 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
How many seconds must tick by until July 21st? They are surely the slowest seconds in the history of mankind....


TICK....





TICK.....





TICK.....






AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Daelin February 6th, 2007 7:56 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Here's the full text from JKR:

"FEBRUARY 6th

Charles Dickens put it better than I ever could:

'It would concern the reader little, perhaps, to know how sorrowfully the pen is laid down at the close of a two-years' imaginative task; or how an Author feels as if he were dismissing some portion of himself into the shadowy world, when a crowd of the creatures of his brain are going from him for ever.'

To which I can only sigh, try seventeen years, Charles...

I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book, but saying goodbye has been just as hard as I always knew it would be. Even while I'm mourning, though, I feel an incredible sense of achievement. I can hardly believe that I've finally written the ending I've been planning for so many years. I've never felt such a mixture of extreme emotions in my life, never dreamed I could feel simultaneously heartbroken and euphoric.

Some of you have expressed a (much more muted!) mixture of happiness and sadness at the prospect of the last book being published, and that has meant more than I can tell you. If it comes as any consolation, I think that there will be plenty to continue arguing and speculating about, even after 'Deathly Hallows' comes out. So if you're not yet ready to quit the message boards, do not despair...

I'm almost scared to admit this, but one thing has stopped me collapsing in a puddle of misery on the floor. While each of the previous Potter books has strong claims on my affections, 'Deathly Hallows' is my favourite, and that is the most wonderful way to finish the series."


You can read that a lot of different ways ...

Hermeneutic February 6th, 2007 8:14 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Oh, I think you have to try super extra special chocolately hard to dig clues out of that diary entry. If she really is holding herself to seven books, Deathly Hallows will be the end of Harry's story whether he lives or dies. And closing out this series, 17 years of her life, is easily enough to make someone emotional regardless of the fates of any of the individual characters.

Daelin February 6th, 2007 9:11 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Using the word "euphoric" seems telling ...

AliceFO February 6th, 2007 11:51 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
No I don't think he will. But if he was to die, it will be to sacrifice himself for the Wizarding World and thefore he will be reunited with everyone he loves, who has died. I hope this doesn't happen though - and I am almost certain this will not happen though. When Jo came up with the idea of Harry Potter on the train, did she think, "I'm going to write a book about a young boy who has a horrible childhood, no mum and dad, goes to Hogwarts, goes through each year trying to dodge Voldemort, fights a dragon amongst other things, learns he has to kill Voldemort - only for him to die in the end" I really don't think thats how it will work. I think there will be a huge twist at the end, I think there will be a loophole, that being Voldemort taking Harry's blood in GoF for him to rebulid his body, he no longer has Slytherin blood now, does he? I think this will weaken him, and he will be defeated.

momeve February 7th, 2007 6:15 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
On the first page of this thread, Strider {and some numbers- sorry, don't remember!} posted a list of very compelling reasons why Harry won't die and I tend to agree with those. However, having said this, my first impression reading what Jo said today about ending the book, was that she was describing killing off her hero. She used some telling words, like "mourning", and "a puddle of misery". I know that the end of the series itself could explain such intense feelings but my gut reaction was " oh ****- Harry's a goner!"

squibpott February 7th, 2007 6:15 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I think I've always known deep down that Harry would die at the end even though I didn't want it to happen, but that bit 'I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book' bit in her diary entry just makes me think that it will definitely happen. Seventeen years of writing are over, as are seventeen years of misery for Harry. Wonder how she's going to finish him off!:scared:

kash February 7th, 2007 6:24 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
end of harrys story. means the end of harrys story... it means tehre is no story.. cause thee is no harry.end of series means the end of series.not the end of anyone really.
it could include harrys death or not.
but end of harrys story and the words she has written to describe what she feels because it has ended pretty much describes what she would feel if she killed harry in a heroic way.. a death fit for a hero..
im feeling even worse now.she has killed him people.all signs do point to it.she doesnt really mislead us that much. its only our denial that makes us go around in circles.. like harry and ginny couple or the harry and hermy one.. it was pretty clear it was harry and ginny.
he is going to die.. he left ginny cause he didnt want her in trouble,, cause he was ready to die.to finish the work and take as many deatheaters as he could with him.. he said that to dumbledore in the broom closet.

Spritey February 7th, 2007 6:59 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Okay, as much as I'm of the belief that Harry may die, I don't think Jo's diary update proves that in any way. The books have always been Harry's story, no matter how many other characters there are involved. So the end of the books are the end of his story, because Jo will no longer be writing him, whether he lives or not.

The use of the word "mourning" was also, IMO, purely about the end of a huge and life-changing chapter of her life, and not really an indication that Harry will die. You can mourn an ending, with or without someone's actual death.

_Dark_Lord_ February 7th, 2007 9:16 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I've somehow got the feeling that Harry has to sacrifice himself in order to kill Voldemort. Voldemort just seems way too powerful and evil that Harry can kill him and make a full recovery just like that, regardless how Harry will kill him. It's a similar situation to something that happened in the Japanese anime "Naruto". In order to defeat Kyuubi (the most powerful being in the Naruto universe) and ensure the safety of his village, its head (the Fourth Hokage) sacrificed himself. I don't think the price Harry and the wizarding world will have to pay for Voldemort's death will only be the lives of some of Harry's friends amongst many other wizards and witches, but perhaps also his own life.

If his scar indeed is a Horcrux and I believe it is, I doubt he will survive the final fight will Voldemort. If Harry indeed sacrificed himself and got rid of the final Horcrux this way, there would be not a chance in the world Voldemort would survive this. It's just not possible that Harry dies and Voldemort lives on. The prophecy said that neither can live while the other survives, but it didn't say that one of them would definitely survive. Sacrificing himself to defeat the evil forces and safe the wizarding world would be an extremely heroic and noble thing to do. I also don't think that Harry could live on happily after having gotten his revenge, but this also depends on whether his closest friends survive. Death also doesn't seem like the completely wrong destiny for Harry, he would be reunited with his parents and Sirius again (as he thought in the MoM when Voldemort possessed him). I really hope he doesn't die, but I think his death might be necessary to defeat Voldemort. That's not exactly what we want a happy ending to look like though, is it?

g_black February 7th, 2007 9:48 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Its too hard to tell. I really really really Really dont want him to die. But sometimes I think he will. Everyone has really good reasoning. My history teacher made the suggestion that when Harry kills Voldemort (inevitable, it cant be denied) he could create a Horcrux so that if he gets killed in the process he cant really die... If that makes any sense. I was surprised by this (didnt expect my teacher to be that into it). I thought it was pretty good until I got to thinking that creating a Horcrux is really hard and quite evil. Evil because killing people is wrong.. So I dont know. I thought it was a really interesting theory.

Its good to hope that Harry will live but it can be hard to believe that he could survive the hardhsips his been through.. But I guess thats what makes Harry special :)

Tiberius February 7th, 2007 10:29 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I'm gonna say that Harry will survive, based only on the fact that the last word is said to be "scar". If harry dies, I think it's unlikely that this will be the last word, not unless the last sentence is something like, "...their late friend who had the scar" and I don't see that as Jo's style.

Fenster February 7th, 2007 10:34 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I can't see it to be honest. I mean a whole series of books whose main character is in each title and then dies at the end; what a real gutter!

I would have to quote Jonny Rotten from the Sex pistols then, 'Ever feel you've been cheated?'

guad February 7th, 2007 10:45 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kash (Post 4334582)
???!!!! u think that when she says its" the end of harrys story" it means harry wil survive..??? she couldve said end of harrypotter series.. she said end of harrys story..

I meant that she said about the ending that is a wonderful way to end the story, and as Harry is one of her favourite characters, I sort of feel that he will survive. :) If he died, maybe it wouldn't be that wonderful. It's only my feeling anyway, but I don't think that Harrys death would qualify as a 'wonderful ending'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JKR
I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book, but saying goodbye has been just as hard as I always knew it would be. Even while I'm mourning, though, I feel an incredible sense of achievement. I can hardly believe that I've finally written the ending I've been planning for so many years.

Regarding this, she is mourning the story, not necessarily Harry. It means that her saga is over, that no sequels will come and a work that lasted for nearly 2 decades is achieved. I think a story can become very important to an author, and of course she feels strange when it's finished. IMO it doesn't mean that Harry dies.
Besides, if he would die, she wouldn't have written this of fear of revealing too much.

snuka February 7th, 2007 11:27 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I think he will.

I think the prophecy part "one must die at the hand of the other" can be seen as Harry defeats LV or vice versa, but it's the "neither can survive while the other lives" part that has me thinking they will both die. Throughout the books we have seen how they're like yin and yang, opposites in that one was filled with love and the other is completely void of it. So wouldn't it make sense for the peace in wizarding world that they cancel each other out in the end ?

Second, I still think Harry's scar may include a piece of LV's soul, so even if he defeats him a part of him is still in Harry. "But in essence divided?" like DD said in OOTP.

I think Harry laying down his life to defeat LV would be a fitting end to the story. Also consider no one can write a sequel later and JK wouldn't be bothered by the readers to write any more HP books (she did say she didn't ever plan anything beyond book 7 and that there will be no adult Harry books).

Last but not least, Harry has to track down the horcruxes, and neutralise them, before even facing LV. Now DD took care of one of them and it claimed his life (I do believe the potion was killing him before the AK). Even with Hermione and Ron at his side, can we see a 17 yr old wizard taking on the strongest evil wizard and getting out of it alive?

beth83 February 7th, 2007 12:46 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
i think she is mourning the end of a very large part of her life, not for harry himself. she could also be mourning the lives of the others that have died in the book.

i personally think that killing harry would be similar to jrr tolkien throwing frodo into mount doom

Prof.Blink February 7th, 2007 12:53 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I'm not sure at all. The Mirror of Erised still plays on my mind when I think of this debate. Being with his family is his hearts desire and maybe in the end, that is what will be fulfilled. I am pretty certain Voldermort will be defeated but I just get an awful feeling Harry will be killed too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberius (Post 4335768)
I'm gonna say that Harry will survive, based only on the fact that the last word is said to be "scar". If harry dies, I think it's unlikely that this will be the last word, not unless the last sentence is something like, "...their late friend who had the scar" and I don't see that as Jo's style.

That's a good point. Hmm.

kash February 7th, 2007 1:31 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
her exact words"I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book, but saying goodbye has been just as hard as I always knew it would be."
harrys story...? its doesnt make sense.. see the sentence construction. she didnt say i always knew the series would end with the 7th book.. she is great at mincing words. she has killed him.

Daelin February 7th, 2007 3:55 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Sorry no, don't see it from the 2/6/7 diary note.

JKR also says she's "euphoric" and that the ending was a "wonderful way to finish the series".

Those are not the words I would expect from Jo if she just whacked Harry.

GryffSolider February 7th, 2007 4:19 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I know for the people who say Harry will die, and that he reward will be to join his parents and Sirius and dumbledore. But I don't know if its been mentioned but Harry best and long lasting quality is his courage and it will take real courage to live and move on from on the death and ugliness that has happened to him, and I think JKR knows that, so I think Harry will live.

Daelin February 7th, 2007 4:20 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Living is not always the easy choice, though.

John the Boggart February 7th, 2007 5:12 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Am I the only one who doesn't think it's going to be as simple Harry living or dying?

Jo's recent and past messages, to me, make it fairly clear that she's had something quite clever planned out for some time. Perhaps, even, as far back as when she started this whole wonderful endeavour.

Let's do a little digging, shall we?

1)
Quote:

I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book, but saying goodbye has been just as hard as I always knew it would be.
That's a strange way of phrasing something, especially for someone who chooses her words so carefully. Sure, it's ambiguous, but I'm trying to establish a context here.

2)
Quote:

If it comes as any consolation, I think that there will be plenty to continue arguing and speculating about, even after 'Deathly Hallows' comes out.
This to me indicates that she feels that she has created and ending that's either something ambiguous (which is highly unlikley, given her stated desire to cement her place in literary history) or something very clever that, while it likely wraps up that which requires wrapping may do so in such a way that will leave much open to interpretation.

Now, when viewing all of this in light of the over-arching story of "choices", the very-carefully-worded "Prophecy" and Harry's one ace-in-the-hole over Lord Voldything (his ability to love), this leads me to the conclusion that Jo will likely have Harry make a selfless act of sacrifice in order to end the Reign of HWMNBN... which may not have its denouement as something as simple as Harry and Voldymold living or dying.

Thematically, it makes sense, too, for it's not whether or not Harry actually survives that's important; no, it will be Harry making the conscious choice based on his capacity to love that will make or break the whole darn thing, IMHO.

DevilsSnare February 7th, 2007 5:54 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I tend to agree with most of the replies here where I think Harry will die and be reunited with Lily & James Potter (his parents), Sirius Black (his Godfather), and Albus Dumbledore (his mentor).

It'll be a bittersweet ending.

Dunedin February 7th, 2007 7:00 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I've always been of the opinion that Harry will die in a magical sense. He'll physically be alive but will be rendered a Muggle.

outsidessence February 7th, 2007 7:41 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
It's just so difficult to predict what will happen. John the Boggart is probably correct in his assertion that theending will not be as simple as living or dying. It would be, in my opinion, fairly un-rowlingish for harry to vanquish voldie (or vica versa) andlive happily ever after. Although he certaintly deserves it, I can't see Harry having a life after Voldemort. He will have to go but I don't know if he will neccesarily die. Voldemort need not die either. On many occasions Dumbledore has asserted that there are things much worse ten death. Perhaps voldie will be forced to suffer for the pain he has caused? (of course one of them must die- my guess is Harry)

mactabard_25 February 7th, 2007 9:50 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by John the Boggart (Post 4336138)
Am I the only one who doesn't think it's going to be as simple Harry living or dying?

Jo's recent and past messages, to me, make it fairly clear that she's had something quite clever planned out for some time. Perhaps, even, as far back as when she started this whole wonderful endeavour.

Let's do a little digging, shall we?

1)
That's a strange way of phrasing something, especially for someone who chooses her words so carefully. Sure, it's ambiguous, but I'm trying to establish a context here.

2)
This to me indicates that she feels that she has created and ending that's either something ambiguous (which is highly unlikley, given her stated desire to cement her place in literary history) or something very clever that, while it likely wraps up that which requires wrapping may do so in such a way that will leave much open to interpretation.

Now, when viewing all of this in light of the over-arching story of "choices", the very-carefully-worded "Prophecy" and Harry's one ace-in-the-hole over Lord Voldything (his ability to love), this leads me to the conclusion that Jo will likely have Harry make a selfless act of sacrifice in order to end the Reign of HWMNBN... which may not have its denouement as something as simple as Harry and Voldymold living or dying.

Thematically, it makes sense, too, for it's not whether or not Harry actually survives that's important; no, it will be Harry making the conscious choice based on his capacity to love that will make or break the whole darn thing, IMHO.

I will agree with you on this. I believe Harry will die. He almost has to. Not nessasarily due to the prophecy but just because the series (to me) has lead him to this critical point. He will have to choose (as DD so lovingly put it) between what is right and what is easy.

Hermeneutic February 7th, 2007 10:30 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dunedin (Post 4336302)
I've always been of the opinion that Harry will die in a magical sense. He'll physically be alive but will be rendered a Muggle.

That would be interesting. Imagine if Harry's scar is not only the source of his Parseltongue ability, but also his magic, period?

Spritey February 8th, 2007 12:23 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kash (Post 4335907)
her exact words"I always knew that Harry's story would end with the seventh book, but saying goodbye has been just as hard as I always knew it would be."
harrys story...? its doesnt make sense.. see the sentence construction. she didnt say i always knew the series would end with the 7th book.. she is great at mincing words. she has killed him.

It does make sense. Harry's story is technically over - she will never write him again, so he's done as a character. His character arc thingy is finished.

mactabard_25 February 8th, 2007 2:36 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritey (Post 4336904)
It does make sense. Harry's story is technically over - she will never write him again, so he's done as a character. His character arc thingy is finished.


Yeah but one way (given that there are many) his story could come to an end would be through his death. That would definately put an end to his arc. There wouldn't be anything else to write. But I see a lot of peeps point. This could simply be the end of his story arc. Harry completed what he was ment to do. He can simply live out his life with/without Ginny and friends. No more adventures or battles. Just old man Potter, hopefully teaching, living out his old days like a normal wizard. Gosh... that sounds so dreadful. I think I really would rather see him die. It just seems he would be miserable living that kind of life. And JK would have to start another story arc if he was not to live this kind of life. Because if he was to have another adventure we would all of course want to know all about it. :drool:

lindaluna February 8th, 2007 2:43 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
ABSOLUTELY TERRIFIED THAT JKR IS "MOURNING" SO MUCH!

Where's the joy of victory, the relief of a battle won?

I think Harry bites the dust.

phoenix43 February 8th, 2007 2:54 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I don't think Harry will die. Just because "Harry's story is ending" doesn't equate with death. The story of Harry does end, with hopefully good and good choices triumphant over evil. The story then does end. It means this aspect of his life. When Voldemort is vanquished or dead depending on what happens, the story as we know it has ended. This could mean that Harry continues to live a life of a normal wizard, thus ending his story.

Daelin February 8th, 2007 2:55 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lindaluna (Post 4337178)
ABSOLUTELY TERRIFIED THAT JKR IS "MOURNING" SO MUCH!

Where's the joy of victory, the relief of a battle won?

I think Harry bites the dust.

If so, why did her message also say she was "euphoric", and that the ending was "wonderful"?

Those words aren't funeral-talk, ya know?

MAGICicalMUggle February 8th, 2007 2:56 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
:no: I think Harry will die!...But in a very noble way like sacrificing himself for the love he has for his friends!...I also think that the best way to end the series is with a hero's death!...But after all harry has been through he deserves to live a happy life with his friends.... I'm still hopeing that Harry was the one who got the reprieve!:tu:

magicalmysteryg February 8th, 2007 3:25 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
The "harry's story" quote--i dont think this means his death. the books are about harry, they're called harry potter and the... It doesn't have to refer to his death. The books are harrys story.

mactabard_25 February 8th, 2007 3:43 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGICicalMUggle (Post 4337205)
:no: I think Harry will die!...But in a very noble way like sacrificing himself for the love he has for his friends!...I also think that the best way to end the series is with a hero's death!...But after all harry has been through he deserves to live a happy life with his friends.... I'm still hopeing that Harry was the one who got the reprieve!:tu:

Very agreeable. Even the part about the reprievel. I dont want to see Harry die. I just dont think the series could end properly with out it happening. Unless JK really pulls out all the stops.

tofo579 February 8th, 2007 3:47 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
jkr adores the classics...and in the classics, the hero never dies.

magicalmysteryg February 8th, 2007 3:58 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I dont know what classics you're talking about, but what about the many many tragedies? Shakespeare...greek tragedies...there are many stories that end with the hero's death. classic tragedies.

mactabard_25 February 8th, 2007 4:21 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
There is great wisdom in Magicalmysteryg's words.

sickoftv February 8th, 2007 4:39 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Deep down, I want Harry to die. Not that I have anything against the guy, it just seems apropriate. However, there are two solid reasons he will not:

1) It would break Point of View atrociously. Any writer who has been through an entry level workshop or had fiction edited by a professional will know that breaking POV is discoraged unless done well and for a good reason. To KILL the point of view character of a seven book series is tantamount to heresy. Rowling writes in a heavily traditional way with out any traces of avant garde or experimentalism. She simply won't kill the POV character.

2) Quiddich. Yup... that sport. There IS a point to it. I have spent seven books trying to figure out why the flitwick Rowling felt a game as preposterous as Quiddich should serve as an important piece of the story. The entire game goes on as points are scored for as long as it takes to find the snitch. Then a seeker gets the snitch. Then that seeker's team wins. It seems pointless to have so many players simply as a distraction. Then I realized it's more than a bit of a metaphor. Its not just a ritualized form of struggle in the wizarding world, it is the entire plot. In the end, the teams do not matter. It is Harry and Voldemort - the two seekers - that matter. Only one of them can get the snitch. It seems that snitch is the ability to survive, whatever form Rowling chooses to give it.

mactabard_25 February 8th, 2007 4:55 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sickoftv (Post 4337363)
Deep down, I want Harry to die. Not that I have anything against the guy, it just seems apropriate. However, there are two solid reasons he will not:

1) It would break Point of View atrociously. Any writer who has been through an entry level workshop or had fiction edited by a professional will know that breaking POV is discoraged unless done well and for a good reason. To KILL the point of view character of a seven book series is tantamount to heresy. Rowling writes in a heavily traditional way with out any traces of avant garde or experimentalism. She simply won't kill the POV character.

2) Quiddich. Yup... that sport. There IS a point to it. I have spent seven books trying to figure out why the flitwick Rowling felt a game as preposterous as Quiddich should serve as an important piece of the story. The entire game goes on as points are scored for as long as it takes to find the snitch. Then a seeker gets the snitch. Then that seeker's team wins. It seems pointless to have so many players simply as a distraction. Then I realized it's more than a bit of a metaphor. Its not just a ritualized form of struggle in the wizarding world, it is the entire plot. In the end, the teams do not matter. It is Harry and Voldemort - the two seekers - that matter. Only one of them can get the snitch. It seems that snitch is the ability to survive, whatever form Rowling chooses to give it.

:err:

Sorry mate... It is an intriguing agrument (and I do agree with you on the POV style of writing she uses), but I think at this point JK feels she can do just about anything she wants with the story. In other words she isn't going to conform to a style of writing she is just going to tell the story as it was ment to unfold. Based on her. I also like the analogy of Quiddich and Harry/Voldy's conflict. :cool:

sickoftv February 8th, 2007 5:06 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by magicalmysteryg (Post 4337315)
I dont know what classics you're talking about, but what about the many many tragedies? Shakespeare...greek tragedies...there are many stories that end with the hero's death. classic tragedies.

Sorry to double post, but I felt that this idea of the tragic story line needed to be addressed as well.

Harry isn't a tragedy. The point of a tragedy is to demonstrate a clear cause-effect relationship between a person's actions and their undoing. The narrative proceeds with very little deception from tragic flaw to tragic fall. Not only is the plot line far from straight forward in HP, Harry also isn't given a clear tragic flaw. He does not feel overwhelming jealousy like Othello, nor does he outlaw the worship of a god as in the Baccae. He hasn't Frankenstien's ambition and he is certainly more decisive than Hamlet. Now, notice what all these people have in common that Harry does not share: they are adults. They are set in their ways, and we can assume they will not make the change necessary to survive their own flaws because of something formed in their character. Harry is a bit of a jerk in OotP, but he's not fully in control with all the hormones and feelings of abandonment and dark lords coursing through his adolescent skull. Hardly an irreversible tragic flaw.

harshil February 8th, 2007 2:14 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
i think JKR has said that she has killed hay(just in pasing) so we have to just accpt the sad fact dats all

Daelin February 8th, 2007 4:31 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
If there's anything about JKR about which I am sure, it is that she most definitely has not specifically confirmed Harry's death or survival!

Hermeneutic February 8th, 2007 8:23 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin (Post 4338675)
If there's anything about JKR about which I am sure, it is that she most definitely has not specifically confirmed Harry's death or survival!

And besides, even if she had, she's switched around the life/death result of three characters already. Any old quotes would be rendered useless by this.

wobbleshanks February 8th, 2007 8:40 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sickoftv (Post 4337363)
Deep down, I want Harry to die. Not that I have anything against the guy, it just seems apropriate. However, there are two solid reasons he will not:

1) It would break Point of View atrociously. Any writer who has been through an entry level workshop or had fiction edited by a professional will know that breaking POV is discoraged unless done well and for a good reason. To KILL the point of view character of a seven book series is tantamount to heresy. Rowling writes in a heavily traditional way with out any traces of avant garde or experimentalism. She simply won't kill the POV character.

2) Quiddich. Yup... that sport. There IS a point to it. I have spent seven books trying to figure out why the flitwick Rowling felt a game as preposterous as Quiddich should serve as an important piece of the story. The entire game goes on as points are scored for as long as it takes to find the snitch. Then a seeker gets the snitch. Then that seeker's team wins. It seems pointless to have so many players simply as a distraction. Then I realized it's more than a bit of a metaphor. Its not just a ritualized form of struggle in the wizarding world, it is the entire plot. In the end, the teams do not matter. It is Harry and Voldemort - the two seekers - that matter. Only one of them can get the snitch. It seems that snitch is the ability to survive, whatever form Rowling chooses to give it.


Wow! Nice one about the Quiddich. Lovely analogy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hermeneutic (Post 4338937)
And besides, even if she had, she's switched around the life/death result of three characters already. Any old quotes would be rendered useless by this.

Excellent point!

Chris February 8th, 2007 8:44 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
That is a nice quidditch analogy.

Never having been to writers workshops, I can't speak about the POV myself. But it would be a letdown to many readers for HP to die. Unless it's some heroic death.

That being said...I'm steeling myself for harry to go :(. My official prediction is he lives, but that's the heart talking :).

Official prediction: Harry lives, becomes Britain's seeker, and faces Krum for the Quidditch World Cup, where the two of them have a spirited battle before Krum catches the snitch when Britain is up 150 points, resulting in an unprecedented draw and magical harmony everywhere.

mactabard_25 February 9th, 2007 12:16 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chparadise (Post 4338975)
That is a nice quidditch analogy.

Never having been to writers workshops, I can't speak about the POV myself. But it would be a letdown to many readers for HP to die. Unless it's some heroic death.

That being said...I'm steeling myself for harry to go :(. My official prediction is he lives, but that's the heart talking :).

Official prediction: Harry lives, becomes Britain's seeker, and faces Krum for the Quidditch World Cup, where the two of them have a spirited battle before Krum catches the snitch when Britain is up 150 points, resulting in an unprecedented draw and magical harmony everywhere.

I'm a firm believer that Harry will die (speculation of course) but if he did live I could see something like that in the epiloque. Maybe not with Vic Krum, but definately Harry playing Quidditch for a pro team as a seeker. That would make him happiest I think, other than Ginny of course. Good survival scenario.

fang25 February 9th, 2007 12:45 am

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Despite claims of satanic plots, Harry Potter has a lot of religious undertones so i could see Harry dying in a christ-like sacrifice for wizard kind. THat being said, i don't think it will happen

The prophesy seems to indicate that ONE will die and i highly doubt JKR would let evil win...

Smarties February 9th, 2007 12:53 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
There's no way Harry will die... I hope!

What a waste of a life it would be if he did die. Spending 10 years with the Dursley's... never having a proper family... spending his Hogwarts years in danger of being killed...

I just don't think JKR would do it. You must remember that she wrote the final chapter years ago, before she knew how big Harry Potter would be, and although in recent years she may have thought it would be best just to kill him off to get people off her back, she'd decided Harry's fate at the beginning.

Smarties http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...s/MYSMILIE.gif

Mad_Ravenclaw February 9th, 2007 1:16 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Smarties (Post 4340164)
There's no way Harry will die... I hope!

What a waste of a life it would be if he did die. Spending 10 years with the Dursley's... never having a proper family... spending his Hogwarts years in danger of being killed...

I just don't think JKR would do it. You must remember that she wrote the final chapter years ago, before she knew how big Harry Potter would be, and although in recent years she may have thought it would be best just to kill him off to get people off her back, she'd decided Harry's fate at the beginning.

Smarties http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...s/MYSMILIE.gif

I agree with you! I mean, the boy's never been happy for more than five minutes in a row in his entire life, and now he's facing the responsability of getting the world rid of Voldemort... and will probably succeed (can you objectively imagine the series ending with Voldemort's triumph????). So I know life is everything but fair, but he deserves to live. He deserves to live and to be happy.
Pleeeeeeaaaaase!!!!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sickoftv (Post 4337363)
2) Quiddich. Yup... that sport. There IS a point to it. I have spent seven books trying to figure out why the flitwick Rowling felt a game as preposterous as Quiddich should serve as an important piece of the story. The entire game goes on as points are scored for as long as it takes to find the snitch. Then a seeker gets the snitch. Then that seeker's team wins. It seems pointless to have so many players simply as a distraction. Then I realized it's more than a bit of a metaphor. Its not just a ritualized form of struggle in the wizarding world, it is the entire plot. In the end, the teams do not matter. It is Harry and Voldemort - the two seekers - that matter. Only one of them can get the snitch. It seems that snitch is the ability to survive, whatever form Rowling chooses to give it.

Oh and nice one, but it's not necessarly the team that gets the snitch that wins... If the other team is ahead, pointwise, they still win. Cf the World Cup... Krum catches the snitch, but Ireland still wins.

Eliya February 9th, 2007 1:51 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I don't think Harry will die. It's too simple or maybe too unconvenient end... Indeed, like someone said before, it's a children book so in this light, it would be too cruel for J.K.Rowling to 'kill' Harry.

prongs92 February 9th, 2007 2:28 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Eliya I think that harry will have to die. Even though that would easily finish the series which would suck!! But yeh I have my reasons why he would have to die. In the 5th book there is a part where trelawney make a prophecy about harry and voldemort at ther school. Its says something to the effect of neither one can live while the other does. So that means that harry will have destroy all the horcruxes and will have to kill himself and somebody else kill voldemort. the night that voldemort tried to kill harry he failed and put some of himself into harry giving him different qualities. which is apart of his soul. that is my view on the subject.
Prongs

Daelin February 9th, 2007 3:44 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
I have said it before, and I will say it again:

It hardly makes sense for "The Boy Who Lived", to end up 'The Young Man Who Died Anyway'.

sparkly February 9th, 2007 6:27 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
It does not appear from the way the sixth book ended that Harry will die. In HBP Harry was given a reason to live with his relationship with Ginny. Before he fell for Ginny, Harry was torn between the people he loved in his current life (Hermione and Ron and the rest of the Weasleys) and the people he lost (his parents and Sirius). With Ginny, Harry has someone he can build a life with after Voldermort and JKR has given him something to look forward to. Harry now has a reason to choose to live and stop looking over his shoulder to the people he has lost.

JKR has developed the Harry/Ginny relationship since the first book and by bringing them together briefly in HBP she clearly foreshadowed that Harry will survive Voldermort. To change that abruptly in the final book doesn't make sense from a literary perspective and isn't good writing technique. If JKR intended to kill Harry she would not have said that Ginny was his best source of comfort, nor would she have separated them at the end of HBP. Instead, she would have kept them together but demonstrated that their relationship couldn't survive Harry's hunt for the Horcruxes. Then the transition to Harry's death would flow more easily. The current situation where Harry has separated from Ginny to keep her safe indicates he wants to return to her, which means JKR intends for Harry to be looking beyond Voldermort.

Daelin February 9th, 2007 6:51 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Good post Sparkly, especially about Ginny's position viz a viz the end of HBP. We know from JKR's comments that she considers HPB and DH two halves of a whole story, and so Ginny's position is critical to the plot.

PhoenixFire_DA February 9th, 2007 7:16 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fang25 (Post 4339400)
Despite claims of satanic plots, Harry Potter has a lot of religious undertones so i could see Harry dying in a christ-like sacrifice for wizard kind. THat being said, i don't think it will happen

The prophesy seems to indicate that ONE will die and i highly doubt JKR would let evil win...

Well on the note of religious undertones I will say this:

I remember reading some comments from JKR once when she was responding to criticism from Christian groups. (I'm paraphrasing, of course) She basically said that no one had ever asked her if she was religious and that yes, she does believe in the Christian faith. In fact, she continued on to say that if anyone knew the true nature of her faith, that they'd probably know what was going to happen in the stories. Now maybe I'm reading too much into this but I kind of get the impression that Harry may have to sacrifice himself (or be willing to sacrifice himself) in kind of the same way that Jesus sacrificed himself to save mankind.

Don't get me wrong... I very much want Harry to live, to be together with Ginny and to be happy. I just can't help feeling that the last book will have a lot to do with sacrifice. Keep in mind, however, the story tells us Jesus was resurrected after 3 days. So maybe Harry could die and come back? Or perhaps Voldemort just has to think he's dead and it will give Harry the element of surprise? Hmm... I just thought of something. What if the "Deathly Hallows" is a place or a kind of magic where the line between live and death is blurred, allowing Harry to be killed but then come back stronger than ever?

Daelin February 9th, 2007 7:24 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Well, you can only carry that so far.

I myself am a fundamentalist Christian, and I would be very surprised if Harry followed the same road Jesus took.

I could not see, for example, Harry coming back to life three days later, and sending out his friends to tell the world about the Gospel of Harry the Risen Potter.

:lol:

MHPFAN February 9th, 2007 7:38 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daelin (Post 4340556)
I myself am a fundamentalist Christian, and I would be very surprised if Harry followed the same road Jesus took.

I could not see, for example, Harry coming back to life three days later, and sending out his friends to tell the world about the Gospel of Harry the Risen Potter.

I just don't see this happening either. If he dies, I see him dying in battle against Voldemort while defeating him. I don't see the whole sacrifice thing as being a good enough ending in my opinion. Harry has already sacrificed so much (i.e. normal childhood) that to have him sacrifice his life is just not right in my honest opinion. Obiviously, it is possible, but I just can't come to grips, or even see the logic in that happening.

sparkly February 9th, 2007 7:42 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by PhoenixFire_DA (Post 4340546)
Well on the note of religious undertones I will say this:

I remember reading some comments from JKR once when she was responding to criticism from Christian groups. (I'm paraphrasing, of course) She basically said that no one had ever asked her if she was religious and that yes, she does believe in the Christian faith. In fact, she continued on to say that if anyone knew the true nature of her faith, that they'd probably know what was going to happen in the stories. Now maybe I'm reading too much into this but I kind of get the impression that Harry may have to sacrifice himself (or be willing to sacrifice himself) in kind of the same way that Jesus sacrificed himself to save mankind.

Don't get me wrong... I very much want Harry to live, to be together with Ginny and to be happy. I just can't help feeling that the last book will have a lot to do with sacrifice. Keep in mind, however, the story tells us Jesus was resurrected after 3 days. So maybe Harry could die and come back? Or perhaps Voldemort just has to think he's dead and it will give Harry the element of surprise? Hmm... I just thought of something. What if the "Deathly Hallows" is a place or a kind of magic where the line between live and death is blurred, allowing Harry to be killed but then come back stronger than ever?


There's a lot of options in the story if you take the position that JKR believes in the same way as most Christian faiths. It doesn't necessarily follow that Harry has to sacrifice himself. She could mean that evil won't triumph over good, or that Harry won't become a murderer but Voldermort is still defeated.

JKR has never likened Harry to a Christ figure, so her comments about Christianity don't indicate that Harry will follow the same path. In fact, many Christian beliefs would take that as a heretical position since no one but Jesus is able to die and be resurrected.

PhoenixFire_DA February 9th, 2007 7:47 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Sorry don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to show Harry and Christ as equals. It's more the message behind it. That sometimes good must make the dearest sacrifice in order to defeat evil.

Daelin February 9th, 2007 7:54 pm

Re: Will Harry die in Deathly Hallows? v5
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MHPFAN (Post 4340575)
I just don't see this happening either. If he dies, I see him dying in battle against Voldemort while defeating him. I don't see the whole sacrifice thing as being a good enough ending in my opinion. Harry has already sacrificed so much (i.e. normal childhood) that to have him sacrifice his life is just not right in my honest opinion. Obiviously, it is possible, but I just can't come to grips, or even see the logic in that happening.

I agree that JKR is under the weight of what I call 'Author's Morality'. She can throw in twists and curves, but in the end the story must end with Good winning over Evil, and commensurate rewards/penalties for the actors in the story. Harry getting to be with his family after dying, well, that just falls short.

Where I do see a 'Christian' theme in the 'Harry Potter' series, is the idea that almost everyone can be redeemed, that no matter what someone thinks, the power of Love can reach them. Love is a bit like water. Water seems like weak stuff. You can freeze it or boil it and it moves around so smoothly, yet given time it eats away at rock, destroying mountains and changing continents. Its force can move the planet; scientists now realize that the tides affect the Earth's rotation, for instance. So subtle forces can still be very, very powerful, and Love works like that.


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