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SageThyme July 13th, 2007 12:55 am

Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Welcome to the post-DH discussion of Rubeus Hagrid. Previous discussion without spoilers can be found here:Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis

1. Keeper of Keys & Grounds at Hogwarts and Care of Magical Creatures Professor. What made Dumbledore convince Dippet to keep Hagrid on & train him as a replacement for groundskeeper? What other qualifications, besides size/obsession with monster animals, qualifies him to teach? Will he be allowed to continue as a teacher, now that Dumbledore is dead?
Why does Dumbledore trust Hagrid, even after all the slip-ups Hagrid's made? Is Hagrid's fierce loyalty to Dumbledore part of the reason? Would you trust Hagrid with the same very important tasks that Dumbledore did? Why or why not?

2. In regards to Hagrid's sheer physical presence/description, JK has said: "In shape he's modelled on the Welsh chapter of Hells Angels who'd swoop down on the town and hog the bar, huge mountains of leather and hair" AND "For Harry, Ron and Hermione, he's benign, but he's supposed to be quite intimidating towards the people who don't maybe appreciate his particular taste in creatures." Hagrid really seems to not know his own strength, and we've seen him sad, hurt, happy, angry, and in a terrible temper. How has Hagrid's character evolved, and what displays of his loyalty and his temper, stick in your mind the most?

3. Having been expelled from Hogwarts because of Tom Riddle, Hagrid's never been too great at magic, though he occassionally surprises himself and others. How does Hagrid feel about Tom Riddle? How does he feel about the present day, Voldemort? How will he aid the Trio in book 7? Will Hagrid be a source of info to Harry, in regards to the young Tom Riddle?

4. Hagrid's parents are both dead, and now he's just got his half-brother Grawp. How did being abandoned by his mother & the loss of his father, affect him? Will his plans for his baby brother ever come to fruition or will the MoM attempt to use Hagrid and Grawp as a leverage to get Harry to do as requested? There was the question of giant involvement in the 'hurricane in the West Country'...

5. Hagrid and his monster obsession, when & why did it start? Will it ever end? How many scrapes has Dumbledore gotten Hagrid out of, in regards to his liking of 'interestin' creatures'? JK has said that for Hagrid and his fascination, it's all about overcoming things that can kill him---which is a central theme in the books, overcoming.

6. Hagrid & Madame Maxime? Will they get together in book 7?
When asked this question: Does Hagrid get a wife?
JK responded: Does Hagrid get a wife? You think anyone would want to live with a man who breeds Blast-Ended Skrewts?

guad July 28th, 2007 10:03 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
I really love Hagrid, but I must say I was a bit disappointed how 'useless' he was in the escape from the Dursleys house. I mean, he didn't do that REPARO properly, which nearly made Harry fall down.

I still wonder how he got out of these spiders. Did they capture him for the DE? Did he chat his way out? :lol:

I'm very happy he didn't die. :)

sllagnire July 28th, 2007 10:45 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
I am actually quite surprised that Hagrid survived the whole book. There were a couple of times when I thought that he was dead. The Seven Harrys, when he fell off, thought he was dead, and when the spiders were all over him during the Battle of Hogwarts. He was one of those characters that I definitely thought would die. I am happy that he lived, but quite surprised.

criostoir August 11th, 2007 7:42 am

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sllagnire (Post 4667349)
I am actually quite surprised that Hagrid survived the whole book. There were a couple of times when I thought that he was dead. The Seven Harrys, when he fell off, thought he was dead, and when the spiders were all over him during the Battle of Hogwarts. He was one of those characters that I definitely thought would die. I am happy that he lived, but quite surprised.

I, too, am happy that he lived. I thought his colorful name had doomed him to a similar fate as his Black (Sirius) and White (Albus) predecessors. However, I also felt his role in the final book was superfluous, especially considering how important he has been in the other books. Really, I would almost have rather seen him die than play such a minimized role.

Peace,
Christopher

Yoana August 11th, 2007 1:39 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
I've always adored Hagrid's character. And I knew he wasn't going to die, I was sure he wasn't all the way! Although I'm a bit disappointed that we saw so little fo him in DH.

Sly_Lady August 11th, 2007 4:48 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by guad (Post 4667196)
I really love Hagrid, but I must say I was a bit disappointed how 'useless' he was in the escape from the Dursleys house. I mean, he didn't do that REPARO properly, which nearly made Harry fall down.

It didn't surprise me that he couldn't manage the Reparo charm at that moment. Hagrid never finished school, so his magical skills are, um, not great. Given the chaos of the whole escape scene, I couldn't help thinking that it could've been worse. :p

criostoir August 11th, 2007 11:42 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoana (Post 4712487)
I've always adored Hagrid's character. And I knew he wasn't going to die, I was sure he wasn't all the way!

I was sure he was for two reasons. First, in the hero cycle, every protector of the hero is stripped away before their final conflict. Harry's parents were killed, his godfather was killed, his mentor was killed, and I was sure that Hagrid, the one who brought him to the Dursley's and to Hogwarts, would be killed as well.

The second, more obscure reason, has to do with alchemy. This is from the wikipedia article on alchemy:
Quote:

The Great Work (Latin: Magnum opus), is a term which originated in medieval European alchemy which refers to the successful completion of the transmutation of base matter into gold or the creation of the philosopher's stone. It has subsequently been used as a metaphor for spiritual transformation in the Hermetic tradition.
  • nigredo, blackening(-putrefaction): individuation, purification, burnout of impureness; see also Suns in alchemy - Sol Niger
  • albedo, whitening: spiritualisation, enlightenment
  • rubedo, reddening: unification of man with god, unification of the limited with the unlimited

It seemed to fit so well! Perhaps Hagrid is the one who got the reprieve?

Anyway, I was disappointed because Hagrid seemed only to be there to carry Harry back to Hogwarts. That said, it was kind of fitting, a completion of the circle. He was always the one to deliver Harry from one place to another, when he was a baby, when he was 11, and when he was about to defeat Voldemort.

Peace,
Christopher

Yoana August 12th, 2007 11:15 am

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by criostoir (Post 4714015)
I was sure he was for two reasons. First, in the hero cycle, every protector of the hero is stripped away before their final conflict. Harry's parents were killed, his godfather was killed, his mentor was killed, and I was sure that Hagrid, the one who brought him to the Dursley's and to Hogwarts, would be killed as well.

But he wasn't really a protector of Harry, he was more like a friend. At least that's how I've always seen him.

DhA August 12th, 2007 1:53 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
I've had Hagrid down as one to die ever since Goblet Of Fire, so it was a ncie suprise to see him survive.

Sly_Lady August 12th, 2007 2:14 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoana (Post 4715597)
But he wasn't really a protector of Harry, he was more like a friend. At least that's how I've always seen him.

He didn't have the opportunity, but Hagrid is a protector. He's a born nurturer, whose first instinct is to protect those he cares for. He loved Harry and would have done anything to keep him safe.

Yoana August 12th, 2007 3:10 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly_Lady (Post 4715760)
He didn't have the opportunity, but Hagrid is a protector. He's a born nurturer, whose first instinct is to protect those he cares for. He loved Harry and would have done anything to keep him safe.

I agree with that. I meant the kind of relationship they actually developed - Hagrid was more a friend to Harry than anything else.

criostoir August 12th, 2007 4:55 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoana (Post 4715597)
But he wasn't really a protector of Harry, he was more like a friend. At least that's how I've always seen him.

Protector might have been a poor choice of word. Patron is better. James was Harry's father, his "pater" and thus definitely a patron (as they have the same root). Sirius was Harry's godfather, again a patron. DD was a patron as well.

Hagrid, I think, was a little too goofy to be a father figure in the same way as the others I mentioned, but I certainly think he was a patron of Harry. However, I think that his role as the person who delivers Harry from one critical moment to another trumped both his role as a patron and the alchemy cycle. Thus, Hagrid delivered Harry to his final conflict.

Peace,
Christopher

Yoana August 12th, 2007 4:59 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by criostoir (Post 4715957)
Protector might have been a poor choice of word. Patron is better. James was Harry's father, his "pater" and thus definitely a patron (as they have the same root). Sirius was Harry's godfather, again a patron. DD was a patron as well.

Hagrid, I think, was a little too goofy to be a father figure in the same way as the others I mentioned, but I certainly think he was a patron of Harry. However, I think that his role as the person who delivers Harry from one critical moment to another trumped both his role as a patron and the alchemy cycle. Thus, Hagrid delivered Harry to his final conflict.

I wouldn't call Hagrid goofy. I actually think he's wise, and very shrewd where human character is concerned, at least most of the time. I can see your logic about him delivering Harry in the beginning as well as in the end, but for the most part, which was in-between those two moments, they were friends, and I think that's how Harry saw Hagrid. I don't think he's ever counted him among the people who watched over him.

Sly_Lady August 12th, 2007 5:48 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Actually, with all the patriarchal testosterone involved in the pater, patron, father discussion :p, I almost hesitate to bring this up. But when Norbert/Norbertha was hatched, Hagrid described himself as 'mommy."

Hagrid's definitely much more in touch with his anima than most guys, and his feelings for Harry are nurturing and rather powerfully female. Considering that Lily gave Harry the most protection in his life, I don't want to underestimate the power of Hagrid's maternalistic (is that a word??) protection.

Yoana, I don't know whether Harry recognized Hagrid as a protector, although when he was lost in Knockturn Alley and Hagrid appeared, he certainly ran to him for protection. But Harry never recognized Professor Snape as a protector, yet the protection was there. Looking back, Harry may realize that there were people watching over him in his childhood, whether he knew they were there or not.

Yoana August 12th, 2007 5:58 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly_Lady (Post 4716042)
Actually, with all the patriarchal testosterone involved in the pater, patron, father discussion :p, I almost hesitate to bring this up. But when Norbert/Norbertha was hatched, Hagrid described himself as 'mommy."

Hagrid's definitely much more in touch with his anima than most guys, and his feelings for Harry are nurturing and rather powerfully female. Considering that Lily gave Harry the most protection in his life, I don't want to underestimate the power of Hagrid's maternalistic (is that a word??) protection.

Yoana, I don't know whether Harry recognized Hagrid as a protector, although when he was lost in Knockturn Alley and Hagrid appeared, he certainly ran to him for protection. But Harry never recognized Professor Snape as a protector, yet the protection was there. Looking back, Harry may realize that there were people watching over him in his childhood, whether he knew they were there or not.


That's a very inetersting Jungian approach to Hagrid, and I think you definitely have a point. I would add the pink umbrella, the flowery apron and household duties. But I have always seen Hagrid as Harry's friend, and that's how I like him, it's just my personal view of him and my preference :)

criostoir August 13th, 2007 12:56 am

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly_Lady (Post 4716042)
Actually, with all the patriarchal testosterone involved in the pater, patron, father discussion :p, I almost hesitate to bring this up. But when Norbert/Norbertha was hatched, Hagrid described himself as 'mommy."

Speaking of that, here's something I cooked up.

Pater = Father
Patron (a derivative of Pater) = the protector of a dependent or client
Patronus = patron

So, when Harry said, "Expecto Patronum," it was doubly appropriate for his patronus to be his pater (or at least his animagus form.)

As for Hagrid, I agree. And what is interesting is that I called him "goofy," when he was only showing what would be considered "feminine" or at least "motherly" characteristics. However, I contend that Rowling included him partially as comic relief and portrayed his motherly qualities in a humorous fashion. Which is interesting because it is apparent that "mother's love" is the backbone of the story and Harry's secret power.

Peace,
Christopher

Sly_Lady August 13th, 2007 1:00 am

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by criostoir (Post 4717210)
Speaking of that, here's something I cooked up.

Pater = Father
Patron (a derivative of Pater) = the protector of a dependent or client
Patronus = patron

So, when Harry said, "Expecto Patronum," it was doubly appropriate for his patronus to be his pater (or at least his animagus form.)

As for Hagrid, I agree. And what is interesting is that I called him "goofy," when he was only showing what would be considered "feminine" or at least "motherly" characteristics. However, I contend that Rowling included him partially as comic relief and portrayed his motherly qualities in a humorous fashion. Which is interesting because it is apparent that "mother's love" is the backbone of the story and Harry's secret power.

Peace,
Christopher

Hagrid definitely has some great comic lines, which help to make the big, scary half-giant truly endearing. But as we see from Lily, not to mention Molly Weasley, mothers should not be taken as a joke! :cool:

criostoir August 13th, 2007 11:48 am

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly_Lady (Post 4717224)
Hagrid definitely has some great comic lines, which help to make the big, scary half-giant truly endearing. But as we see from Lily, not to mention Molly Weasley, mothers should not be taken as a joke! :cool:

Oh, I definitely don't! I do find it interesting that "female characteristics" in the male characters are reason for humor, while "male characteristics" in the female characters are seen as powerful. Just one of the great and unfair dichotomies in literature.

Peace,
Christopher

Yoana August 13th, 2007 6:17 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by criostoir (Post 4718200)
I do find it interesting that "female characteristics" in the male characters are reason for humor, while "male characteristics" in the female characters are seen as powerful. Just one of the great and unfair dichotomies in literature.

And not only literature. It's in everyday life. And it's because men have been the prestigeous sex for the better part of human history, and still sre, actually, so it's always good to have their characteristics. :grumble:

Blast_ended August 13th, 2007 11:29 pm

Re: Rubeus Hagrid: Character Analysis
 
Truth is, when Hagrid was dragged down by the spiders I was sure he's dead, and I actually though it was very fitting; I wasn't happy to see him dead, of course, but having him killed by his own creatures, Aragog's sons... I just though it works, and it's the best way to have him killed. I was nearly dissapointed when he survived...

But then again, Hagrid carrying Harry out of the forest was very fitting and very powerful too!


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