Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
I was under the impression that Aberforth caught him listening at the door, and threw him out before he could hear the whole thing.
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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Since we don't have access to Severus' mind (as we do to Harry's), we don't know the extent to which he allowed that pain and guilt to enter his mind consciously. It's going to be there somewhere, obviously. His reaction after Lily's death demonstrates pretty conclusively, I think, that he's not a sociopath. He does care. So unlike a sociopath, he will have the pain and guilt somewhere in his psyche. If he buries it so that it's not in his conscious mind, it's going to be present in his unconscious mind. But in the unconscious, it is potentially more volatile / more combustible. Buried pain and guilt is extremely unhealthy, and it would tend to lead to intensified anger in the conscious mind. So here's a possible dynamic: anger ---> buried pain and guilt ----> intensified anger ---> more deeply buried pain and guilt ---> increased intensified anger This is a common dynamic in real life, which is why I think it's possible that it would be in play with Severus. It's basically an illustration of a vicious cycle. Quote:
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Severus usually uses snark to put a layer between his anger and the rest of the world. There are only three times in the series, I think, when we see Severus in white-hot fury: the Shrieking Shack, Flight of the Prince, and when he catches Harry in the Pensieve in SWM. My point is that, regardless of who is to blame in the teenage incidents that have got Severus enraged, he is enraged about them, and the rage itself is destructive... and self-destructive. It is, I think, Severus' core demon, and it is something that he desperately needs to lay aside. It keeps him from seeing himself clearly and from seeing Harry clearly. And in PoA, it even keeps him from seeing Remus clearly. Remus clearly wants to put the past in the past. Severus is too angry about the past to do so. I think he may have gotten over that a little bit with regard to Remus, given that he does risk blowing his cover to save Remus' life in 7 Potters. But at the same time, Severus' statement to Dumbledore (i.e., that he saves all the lives it is possible to save) indicates that it is equally likely that Severus saved Remus simply because Remus was a person being targeted by a Death Eater, and it was possible to save his life. It does not necessarily indicate that Severus put the anger behind him. It just shows that he was able in the end to rise above it. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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I've also been wondering lately about Snape's repulsive reaction when he was called a "coward". Was it because Dumbledore's comments to him, about being brave and helpful, were a way of keeping up Snape's self-esteem - a reassurance of "I can get through this" - and a focus point to deal with another day? So whenever he was called a coward his sense of worth and self would shudder around dangerously? Or maybe Lily's last words to him involved calling him a coward? (I don't think I believe that last scene between them in TPT was the last conversation they ever had). And Snape might feel the need to prove her final judgement wrong and show that "I'm a lot more than that!" Being called a coward by her son might've been too much. Just what I thought. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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And as I read his "That's right," it doesn't necessarily mean he still thinks Lupin was in on Sirius' "joke," just that he had believed it. But his cold, sneering manner at that moment seems to be due to Lupin's admission that he inadvertently helped Sirius into the castle as Snape had tried to convince Dumbledore was a possibility (though I believe Snape thought it intentional.) Quote:
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I think Snape's reaction was mostly due to the fact that he had just been forced to kill Dumbledore. Although the effects of this act are not really discussed in the books (since it's Harry's story) it is alluded to. Killing rips the soul apart. Severus has just endangered his own soul by killing Dumbledore, sacrificing himself in order to bring down Voldemort, and he is in excruciating pain, as JKR tells us: |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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Severus has just killed a person that he did not want to kill. He protested when Dumbledore first asked him to do it. He protested again about 9 months later when Dumbledore tried to give him instructions for what to do after he had killed him. Severus was, I think, clearly uncomfortable with the whole thing and wanted out of it. So flash forward to "Flight of the Prince." Severus has killed Dumbledore. Harry has seen him do it. For obvious reasons, Harry thinks Severus is a cold-blooded murderer. And he calls him a coward. Now, here's the real situation, as I understand it (and as I think Severus perceives it):
I'm not blaming Harry for what he said. But I personally don't blame Severus for his response either. It's just an emotionally charged situation. Neither one of them, imo, is in full control of himself. What I do find interesting is that it appears that this rant is something that Severus has psychologically needed to say for a long time. After he finally gets it all out in the open, he seems to settle into a quiet purposefulness during his final year. We don't see a lot of him in that year, but in no scene after this do we see him angry or snarky again. It's almost as if the poison has been removed. Quote:
As for the Wolfsbane potion... I was talking about "anger" and "rage." I was not intending to discuss anything more extreme. At any rate, I never meant to suggest that Severus would be so angry about the past that he could not fulfill his duty. In fact, I suggested that he keeps a lid on his rage by using snark. It is his duty to provide Remus with the Wolfsbane potion, and he performs his duty. Anyway, there's no indication I can find in the text that he would tamper with the potion regardless of how angry he was at Lupin, or for what cause. Quote:
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As I mentioned earlier in this post, Severus seems to settle into a quiet purposefulness during the final year of his life. (I say "seems" because we don't see enough of him to make a conclusive statement). At any rate, I have always found this interesting and see it as showing potential for considerable character growth... if he had survived the war. So in that sense, I do think his character is cut short. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
He is such a complex person.
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Additionally, Harry calls him a coward twice. Here’s the first time and Snape’s response: Quote:
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
I only have time for this part at the moment, but I'll try to get around to the rest of the post later. :)
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"That's why Snape doesn't like you." Snape doesn't like Lupin in present tense. This is a fact that Harry has been able to observe throughout the year. Then Harry ascribes that dislike to an opinion concerning the werewolf prank - and Snape confirms Harry's deduction. So how do we read the shift into past tense? I see three possibilities: Snape does not like Lupin (present tense) because of an opinion he still holds concerning a past event (i.e., the werewolf prank). Harry signals the "past-ness" of the event by accidentally shifting the verb in the second clause to the past tense. Snape does not like Lupin (present tense) because of an (erroneous) opinion that he held in the past concerning a past event (i.e., the werewolf prank). Harry signals the "past-ness" of the opinion by accidentally shifting the verb in the second clause to the past tense. Snape did not like Lupin (past tense) because of an (erroneous) opinion that he held in the past concerning a past event (i.e., the werewolf prank). Harry gets his tense wrong in the first clause and corrects his tense in the second clause. The second possibility make no logical sense to me, the third possibility flies in the face of Harry's observation that the dislike occurs in the present, and we are not given other options in this sentence for Snape's dislike (such as, his perception of the whole Marauder history, his current suspicion of a Sirius Black - Remus Lupin "conspiracy"). I personally think there are additional reasons for the dislike beyond the werewolf prank, but this particular sentence hinges on that one event... and Snape confirms the werewolf prank as a source of his dislike. The first option (accidental tense shift signalling a past event) is something that I see all the time in the writing of students who are 5 or more years older than Harry is here. These sorts of tense shifts are even more common in speech - especially when someone is speaking tentatively or excitedly. So basically, I read the sentence as indicating that Snape's current dislike of Lupin results from a current opinion concerning a past event, and Harry's just having trouble keeping his verb tenses consistent because of the situation. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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This tallies perfectly, IMO, with Snape's fantastic ability to hold grudges and animostity toward people for years and years as he does with James and Sirius as well. This also seems to support Snape's apparent bigotry toward werewolves as he seems to hold a prejudice toward them just like the rest of the wizarding world when he was a teenager and to me this also tallies with his apparent prejudice toward muggleborns which, IMO, he lies to Lily about when they are children when he tells her that having magical blood or not doesn't matter. To me, he says that line like to him it does matter but he is so desperate for someone to talk to, to connect with, to be friends with that he would tell her anything to keep her around. |
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Snape also promised DD he would protect the students and he didn't seem to be one to go back on his promises. As for his anger with Neville, to me that always seemed only tied to Neville's incompetence (even McGonagall's patience was tried with this child). As soon as Neville improved, Snape didn't go after him as much, even protecting him in OotP, albeit with trademark snark. |
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Dumbledore once asked him how many people he had watched die, and Snape responded with something like "recently, only those I could not save." This, to me, is the best example of how much Snape had changed. He went from someone who probably gave no thought to anyone dying (except himself and Lily) when he gave the prophecy to Voldemort, to someone who was actively concerned with other human beings surviving. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
In addition, Dumbledore had to talk Snape into not wanting to be dead after Lily's death. Based on that, and on the dangerous life Snape lives for the next 17 years, I don't think he has much concern for his own personal well-being. Consequently, I strongly doubt he has any fear whatsoever concerning Dumbledore's anger.
IMO, he doesn't tamper with the potion because his essential orientation has changed from practicing dark magic to defending against dark magic. That doesn't mean that he doesn't still have serious issues with anger or that his anger does not often blind him and affect his disposition. But I do think it means that he no longer has an interest in using magic to cause harm. I agree with Merry's interpretation of the conversation in Dumbledore's office. At his core, Snape changed. |
Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis Reboot v.6
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Considering the people we're talking about are Snape and Lupin, I'd give Snape that medal! This shows that in the intervening years between his death eater youth and his OOTP adulthood he grew as a person enough to put some amount of his petty rivalries behind him. Quote:
I don't think Dumbledore giving Snape a second chance himself even enters into the equation; Lupin could make the same argument to Dumbledore about Dumbledore hiring Snape and, in fact, many people did make that argument to Dumbledore knowing Snape's history with the death eaters. I also don't think Dumbledore "choosing to trust somone else" comes into the picture either as Snape would soon find out; Snape got very jealous of Harry's time with Dumbledore and wanted to know what secrets Dumbledore was confiding in a boy who couldn't even close his mind to Voldemort. It seems that Snape would know, likewise, whether Dumbledore was having secret meetings with Lupin as well and I'm reasonably confident in stating an assumption that Dumbledore probably never did have any meetings with Lupin like he had with Snape or Harry. Snape knew how important he was to Dumbledore. He knew he was a valuable asset that Dumbledore couldn't squander. Quote:
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For me, personally, anyone who, at any point in their life, was able to send a one-year-old baby to his death has an essentially distorted moral compass. Sure, he was nowhere near as sociopathic as Voldemort or Bellatrix. But, as evidenced by the snide pleasure he took in poisoning Neville’s toad, some traces of sadism sure remained in him. Quote:
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Secondly, regarding his mistrust of Lupin. Honestly, what did Snape have against Lupin other than an unconfirmed suspicion that he’d tried to kill him as a teenager? Nothing, really. And, about the werewolf prank itself, if Snape had had the maturity to leave aside his blindfold of grudges and self-pity and look at the situation objectively, he would have been able to figure out that Lupin would NEVER willingly take part in a conspiracy to kill someone, let alone throw the topic of his lycanthropy out in the open for people to find out about. You can dislike someone, but normally, if you’re a mature adult, you’ll also be able to acknowledge reason – which, in this case, was that Lupin just wasn’t the kind of person who would intentionally set out to kill someone. And about FurryDice’s claim of Snape’s hypocrisy… I agree. He himself had killed people during his - fortunately for him - short stint as a DE. He certainly hadn’t had any qualms about sending a one-year-old baby and its family to their deaths. He still expects Dumbledore to confide all his plans in him. And yet, Snape himself can’t look past the suspicion that Lupin had tried to kill him as a teenager. Plus, he sure is quick to point out how Sirius was “capable of murder” at sixteen and how that, therefore, should be a reason for DD not to trust him. Definitely hypocrisy, IMO. |
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