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Old January 3rd, 2011, 9:30 pm
Hut_On_The_Rock  Male.gif Hut_On_The_Rock is offline
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Re: Grindelwald: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by wolfbrother View Post
The Diary-Riddle told Harry what Riddle's plans had been at the time of the making of the horcrux. Evidently, Riddle changed his mind about leaving it behind.
The diary was originally intended to be left behind, because Riddle was absoluetly sure that he would figure out how to seal a part of his soul in it before graduation. Yet, in the end, he took it with him, which suggests, imo, that he never succeeded in turning it into a Horcrux. Nothing else makes sense to me. (This is, of course, speculation, given the lack of solid canonical evidence on this particular matter)

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Not to mention that the horcrux was probably his only one at the time, so he wouldn't want to risk it being destroyed so soon.
Had he known how to make a Horcrux while still in school, he would have surely wasted no time in turning the ring into one as well. So, we can logically conclude that he most likely had two Horcruxes at the end of his seventh year and had therefore no reason to worry too much about the diary. This of course brings us right back to square one and that's one of the reasons why I don't accept your theory.

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IMO it makes sense for the soul to take the form of the body it was inhabiting at the time of creation.
The piece of soul in a Horcrux can no doubt take whatever form it prefers or whatever form the creator of the Horcrux wants it to take (just look at Horcrux-Harry and Horcrux-Hermione, in DH).

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Yet Riddle seemed to know that Horcruxes were a dangerous subject so much so that he carefully planned a meeting with Slughorn. Harry mentions that it seemed like the Riddle had been working for that moment for weeks. He also knew that it had something to do with immortality.
Harry wanted to know what Horcruxes were as well and he worked long and rather hard for that information, without knowing anything about them, except for the fact that they were the wickedest magical invention ever (according to a book Hermione found during her research). So there's no reason to assume that just because Riddle was thoroughly prepared (according to Harry, that is and just because the main hero of the books says or thinks something, doesn't mean that it should automatically be regarded as truth, btw) that he had any prior knowledge on the subject.

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Also note that Slughorn said he would be "hard pushed" to find a book about Horcruxes at Hogwarts. Hard-pushed not impossible.
Semantics. No matter how one looks at it though, it clearly wasn't a simple matter of going to the library if one wanted to learn how to split the soul. Had it been that easy, then Riddle would have never gone to Slughorn in the first place. The very fact that he asked him about Horcruxes, pretty much proves that he had not been able to find the information elsewhere.

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I also find it a stretch to believe that Riddle went from first hearing about horcruxes to asking Slughorn's opinion on making seven of them in a matter of minutes if not seconds.
I have no trouble believing this.

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The way I see the scene, Riddle knew that Horcruxes had something to do with immortality and splitting your soul prior to meeting with Slughorn. He knew what it was but not the process of how it was made. His purpose of the meeting was to get as much details on the process as possible and Slughorn's opinion on making multiple ones (specifically seven).
1. This conversation took place in September (at the very earliest) of Riddle's sixth year.
2. You say he created his first Horcrux (the diary) as a sixteen-year-old.
3. He turned seventeen on December 31, which would have left him no more than four months, to find out how to make a Horcrux. First of all, where would he have found the information (clearny not at Hogwarts)? The creation of a Horcrux is a "grotesque process" according to Rowling, involvning several curses (no doubt highly advanced Dark Magic), so even if we assume (against all reason) that Riddle had all the necessary information at hand, how likely is it that he would have mastered the magical theory in a matter of months (I know I said the conversation took place in September, but I'm being pretty generous with the timeline here. It could have been October or November for all we know). And if he (through some sort of miracle) succeeded in turning the diary into a Horcrux, then why didn't he leave it behind as planned?

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That said, it doesn't make sense for Grindelwald to spend so much time and effort with Dumbledore.
It makes a lot of sense, imo, becuase it would have been a huge advantage to have someonse as brilliant (and as devoted to the "cause") as Dumbledore.

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Grindelwald would have realized pretty soon that Dumbledore was as talented and as intelligent as himself. He would have started seeing him as a rival soon.
Exactly. Grindlewald doesn't share power.

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Quotes from Bathilda and Dumbledore suggest that they became good friends and Grindelwald didn't see him as a rival.
When Ariana died and Dumbledore was a wreck, Grindelwald left without ever looking back. What a friend.

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People can do horrible things believing that they are doing right.
And there are always those who commit horrible deeds just to satisfy their own sadistic urges.

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Everyone has some motivation or a reason for doing what they do however misguided it is.
Yes, I agree. Everyone does have some sort of motivation for their actions, whether it's genuine principles or just a power-hugry nature and perverted dreams or power.

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He had to have believed in it to a certain extent to have been able to sell the idea to Dumbledore.
No, he didn't. He was just a good liar, imo.

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The prudent action would have been to take out Dumbledore then and continue with his plans.
He needed Dumbledore.


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