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Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3



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  #81  
Old June 13th, 2010, 3:37 am
SentSoaringx3  Female.gif SentSoaringx3 is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

Neville's in Gryffindor, though deep down inside and into the series he gains his bravory...well, harry would have been in slytherin if he had not asked to be in gryffindor. Maybe peter asked to be in gryffindor for some reason.


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  #82  
Old June 13th, 2010, 6:12 am
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

I don't see why Wormtail would ask to be in Gryffindor. It's not certain that he even knew James, Sirius, or Remus before he was sorted so I don't consider that an option as to why he was put in Gryffindor. I have said this in the past and I still stick with it but I think he is like Neville. They both come off as cowardly people who have no idea why they were put in Gryffindor. Later, they both shine through even though Wormtail shows his bravery through actions of evil. We know the Marauders were brave and they did a lot of adventurous things during their time at Hogwarts. Wormtail must have taken part in some of those things. They had to have accepted Peter for a reason other than because he worshiped them. They don't seem like the type of people who are friends with someone just because that person likes them. The Marauders actually seemed pretty selective, imo. There isn't enough about Wormtail to really know why he was a Gryffindor. But I would think it's safe to say that the horrible actions he did took bravery.


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  #83  
Old June 13th, 2010, 9:26 am
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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Originally Posted by SentSoaringx3 View Post
Neville's in Gryffindor, though deep down inside and into the series he gains his bravory...well, harry would have been in slytherin if he had not asked to be in gryffindor. Maybe peter asked to be in gryffindor for some reason.
Sorry, Harry did not specifically request the Sorting Hat to put him in Gryffindor; he repeated 'Not Slytherin', several times and the Hat gave up and shouted 'Gryffindor!'

I suppose it's possible Peter did ask for Gryffindor, though I don't know why he would. We have no idea when he met the other three Gryffindors. Perhaps he joined James and Sirius after Sev and Lily left the train compartment. Or maybe it was Remus that he met first . . .


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  #84  
Old June 13th, 2010, 9:46 am
winky45  Female.gif winky45 is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

May be Peter Pettigrew also had requested "not Slytherin", but he was not witty enought to be in Ravenclaw, not fair and loyal enough to be in Hufflepuff.

Or the other way, he might not have wanted to be in Hufflepuff, but also not enough to be sorted into Slytherin, so he ended up Gryffindor.

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  #85  
Old June 13th, 2010, 5:21 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

Reading the various Sorting Hat Songs, it seems you can be placed into a house based on traits you value more so than traits you necessarily incorporate. For instance, Hermione's biggest strength is her intellect, but she was placed in Gryffindor because she values courage and bravery over books and brains (i.e. her speech at the end of Sorcerer's Stone). Peter probably admired brave people, even if he could be cowardly himself.


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Old June 17th, 2010, 9:18 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

Quote:
Originally Posted by SentSoaringx3 View Post
Neville's in Gryffindor, though deep down inside and into the series he gains his bravory...well, harry would have been in slytherin if he had not asked to be in gryffindor. Maybe peter asked to be in gryffindor for some reason.
I really can't picture Peter Pettigrew asking to be in Gryffindor.

I just don't think that the Hat can be expected to have a 100% success rate.

I also think that deep down the Gryffindor qualities could have been in him, somewhere. I don't think Peter is an inherently evil character, just flawed. He was too weak to resist LV; and became bound to him - but perhaps age 11 this wasn't an inevitability. He obviously was too dim for Ravenclaw; and not loyal enough for Hufflepuff - so the argument would be, why was he not placed in Slytherin?

I believe the reason for this is that in actuality Peter is a tragic character; corrupted by joining the Dark Lord's forces - he seems to carry out his orders out of fear rather than an intent to cause pain, to kill, or to destroy.
A great argument for this would be: why was Snape in Slytherin, when in actuality he was a very brave man, and a very good man? Love transformed him: and although originally he was set on a corrupt and evil path, he veered from it. I think this was probably the case with Peter also. He could have been a great man; like his friends James, Lupin and Sirius - but he veered from this path, and instead allowed weakness to overcome him.


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When Hermione had returned to her bunk, Harry lowered his voice.
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  #87  
Old June 17th, 2010, 9:24 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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Sorry, Harry did not specifically request the Sorting Hat to put him in Gryffindor; he repeated 'Not Slytherin', several times and the Hat gave up and shouted 'Gryffindor!'
Probably because the Sorting Hat would be aware of the rivalry between the two houses, and if a student specifically didn't want to be in Slytherin, they'd be better suited for Slytherin's biggest house enemies.


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  #88  
Old June 17th, 2010, 10:02 pm
Quachett  Undisclosed.gif Quachett is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

It seems to me tht some comments are from guys who never question what was writen, wormtail's supposed bravery in doing evel was not bravery both sirius and LV pointed out the fact tht wormtail's actions were not out of courage but rather out of a desire to always be close to the biggest bully, why did he go to voldemort when he could have stood and fight, why was he weary of the plan to get to Harry in GoF? he wanted to use another because he didnt want to do the difficult thing. All wormtail seemed to do was pretty much try to conive his why into situations and seemed to always try and save his skin, remember what Finius Nigelus said about Slytherens being brave but they would rather save thier own skin first the verything tht wormtail did multiple times. You cant point at one moment of good and say maybe the hat saw tht and put him there, if so then snape should have been a Gryffindor, you are not in a house beacuse of one quality its because of all the qualities you show and to me worm tail was almost a walking defination of slytherin qualities.

I think people forget tht Bravery has multiple incunations the one specific to Gryfindors seems to be more militant willing too lay your life down for your brother. If you say just beeing brave was all then it means all the other houses had wimps, but remember the lunas, the cedrics and the rest of them brave pople whose incunations of bravery were more inline with qualities specific to other houses, luna had the bravery tht stermed for the desire to know and to fight for the truth, the hufflepuffs stood for what was right and fair no matter what even if it ment fighting for it, the slytherines would always stand brave as long as they had something to gain, so even if wormtail was brave he had the incunation consistant with the slytherines.

Personally I think he was put in Gryffindor for convinient's sake. Much like hermione was put in Gryffindor than Ravenclaw because I have tried to see why was Hermione in Gryffindor and not Ravenclaw and I gotta say, I cant see it, I know poeple try to point out the fact of her fighting along side harry but as i said above gryffindors werent the only brave wizards and besides hermione's desire to look for logic and knowledge in everything and a desire to find a peaciful logical way to resolve things was more consistant with ravenclaw but like Wormatail I think it was a matter of conviniance. If they were in other houses then it meant eventually developing thier characters would require writting a lot more about those houses, thts why wormatail ended up in Gryffindor


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  #89  
Old June 17th, 2010, 10:18 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

I think Pettigrew was put in Gryffindor because he wanted to. As Harry says at the end of DH the Sorting is actually about choice. At the age of 11 Pettigrew probably wanted to believe he was brave and courageous as any young boy would. But most of all he probably wanted to join Gryffindor because it was full of people like James and Sirius: cool, funny, brave and most importantly loyal and protective. They would take care of him and let him bask in their glory too.


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Old June 17th, 2010, 10:34 pm
RonShudntDie  Female.gif RonShudntDie is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post
It seems to me tht some comments are from guys who never question what was writen, wormtail's supposed bravery in doing evel was not bravery both sirius and LV pointed out the fact tht wormtail's actions were not out of courage but rather out of a desire to always be close to the biggest bully, why did he go to voldemort when he could have stood and fight, why was he weary of the plan to get to Harry in GoF? he wanted to use another because he didnt want to do the difficult thing. All wormtail seemed to do was pretty much try to conive his why into situations and seemed to always try and save his skin, remember what Finius Nigelus said about Slytherens being brave but they would rather save thier own skin first the verything tht wormtail did multiple times. You cant point at one moment of good and say maybe the hat saw tht and put him there, if so then snape should have been a Gryffindor, you are not in a house beacuse of one quality its because of all the qualities you show and to me worm tail was almost a walking defination of slytherin qualities.
I think you do make some good points: however, I don't like to think JK sorted people into houses out of convenience, although of course there is a bit of that in there. Without Peter, we wouldn't have the whole betrayal of the Potters scenario.

I prefer to think, though, you just can't rely on a Hat to always get it right - even a magical one.

As Dumbledore says, .."sometimes I think we sort too soon.." and I would probably agree with that statement. A person changes alot from their 11 year old self.

I think it also arguable that Peter was a 'walking definition' of Slytherin qualities - as he wasn't ambitious, or cunning, or clever. He wasn't even evil. He was just pretty weak. His moment of weakness when trying to kill Harry in DH was what caused his own death. I know then that it is easy to argue - why was he in Gryffindor if he was weak? But I just think that the Hat can't forsee what a person will become, only what is in front of them in that moment.

I think what you say about it being many qualities is a nice point though, and pretty true. But i also think that is why you can argue for any person being in any house - Harry was loyal, he could have been a Hufflepuff. Hermione was clever, she easily could have been a Ravenclaw. Cedric was brave, he could have been a Gryffindor.

But the overriding point is: all the traits are interchangable anyway. What makes one person braver than another?! It is all subjective - and a matter of opinion. The houses should be considered equal: and like in the final battle, should be able to come together as one.


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When Hermione had returned to her bunk, Harry lowered his voice.
'You only agreed to try and get back in her good books.'
'All's fair in love and war,' said Ron brightly, 'and this is a bit of both.'

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  #91  
Old June 17th, 2010, 10:36 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

Personally I think that Peter was placed in Gryffindor because he does not belong else where. Looking at the situation fully Ravenclaws and Slytherin seem to be more of the intelligent type. Sure you have Crabe and Goyle in Slytherin, but I believe that is because they are inherintly evil. But Peter is not especially clever or smart, and without a leader or boss he could never concieve of any of the plans he partakes in. He is clearly not a Hufflepuff, he would leave his friends in a second if given the chance. Yet griffendor, no offence to any out there, seem to be more of the 'jock' stereotype, they can fit into that niche the best at least. They are there because they are willing to do nearly anything, which Peter would do, he was. I honestly do not believe that the sorting hat would be capable of making a mistake it is to clever for that. I think it seen that Peter was not evil, he does not have the clever ability to be evil, and as such placed him in Gryffindor.


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Old June 17th, 2010, 11:07 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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Originally Posted by AldeberanBlack View Post
Probably because the Sorting Hat would be aware of the rivalry between the two houses, and if a student specifically didn't want to be in Slytherin, they'd be better suited for Slytherin's biggest house enemies.
That's a reasonable conclusion, IMO.

I don't believe Harry was a candidate for Ravenclaw. Of course he's intelligent, but he doesn't have a love of learning for learning's sake as I believe Hermione does.

Back on topic, I can't get the idea out of my head that Pettigrew was in Gryffindor for the sake of the story (like much in the books).


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  #93  
Old June 22nd, 2010, 11:26 pm
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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Originally Posted by LordGrindelwald View Post
Reading the various Sorting Hat Songs, it seems you can be placed into a house based on traits you value more so than traits you necessarily incorporate. For instance, Hermione's biggest strength is her intellect, but she was placed in Gryffindor because she values courage and bravery over books and brains (i.e. her speech at the end of Sorcerer's Stone). Peter probably admired brave people, even if he could be cowardly himself.
I think you have a good point here. And it seems that Pettigrew did indeed admire brave people- just look at how McGonagall described his relationship to James and Sirius: "Hero-worshipped Black and Potter, never quite in their league, talent-wise." He tagged after them, wanting to be like them.

I think that the Sorting Hat takes into account what traits you value because it sorts so young. An eleven year old may not know quite what they are, but they probably have a good idea what they want to be. The hat has to take what it can get!


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Old June 23rd, 2010, 6:04 am
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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I think that the Sorting Hat takes into account what traits you value because it sorts so young. An eleven year old may not know quite what they are, but they probably have a good idea what they want to be.
So if you want to be a Hero-worshiper you get sorted into Gryffindor?


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Old June 23rd, 2010, 7:10 pm
Teghan9559  Female.gif Teghan9559 is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

I think that Pettigrew is a little like Neville. He did end up going against direct orders to mercy harry, even if it was only for a minute, and it made the story flow just that much better.


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  #96  
Old June 23rd, 2010, 7:43 pm
Chouette  Female.gif Chouette is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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So if you want to be a Hero-worshiper you get sorted into Gryffindor?
That's not quite what I meant... He doesn't want to be a hero-worshiper; he aspires to be a hero himself. He got sorted into Gryffindor because he values bravery in others and in himself.

Of course, Pettigrew didn't seem to grow up to have obvious Gryffindor traits... but then, the person one is at eleven is different from the person one is later.


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Old June 23rd, 2010, 8:13 pm
NorthernZel  Undisclosed.gif NorthernZel is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

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Originally Posted by Chouette View Post
Of course, Pettigrew didn't seem to grow up to have obvious Gryffindor traits... but then, the person one is at eleven is different from the person one is later.
I agree. For instance, Regulus Black was sorted into Slytherin... and ended up doing a very Griffindor-ish thing.


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Old July 9th, 2010, 3:23 am
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

People change. Like Dumbledore said to Snape, "I sometimes think we sort too soon".

Even though Pettigrew grew up to be the very opposite of a Gryffindor, slimey little coward he was, that doesn't necessarily mean he didn't value bravery when he was younger. I think perhaps falling into the shadows and always being fourth best with the Marauder's took it's toll on him. He became used to be someone else's lapdog, and this magnified when he went over to serve for Lord Voldemort.

Had they sorted later, I think Pettigrew may have been in Slytherin. He's not loyal at all, he's a dirty coward, he's kinda of slow, so that really only leaves Slytherin. And the only reason he served for Voldy was probably because he thought he'd be getting something good out of it, so that sort of ties in with the ambition theme.


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Old July 9th, 2010, 3:32 am
anjutay  Female.gif anjutay is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

sometimes its their choice..like harry did.. he was about to be sorted as a slytherin but he became a gryffindor..


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Old July 9th, 2010, 3:38 am
CROOKshanks1919  Female.gif CROOKshanks1919 is offline
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Re: Why was Peter Pettigrew in Gryffindor? v3

honestly, i think of pettigrews situation and umbridges. None of the houses seem to fit anyone. Although pettigrew was FARR from a good person, he didn't push people out of the way to be great, and as we have learned not all the evil people are from slytherin, nor was he loyal, brave or live. i think that way back when he might have just been brave.


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