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Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2



View Poll Results: What did you think of the movie?
A – Fantastic Adaptation. I loved everything about this movie. 36 15.52%
B – Very Good Adaptation. I enjoyed the movie. A few minor issues but no big deal. 89 38.36%
C – A Good Adaptation. I was entertained. Some room for improvement but overall it was fine. 48 20.69%
D – Viewable Adaptation. There are lots I would have done differently though. 24 10.34%
E – Below Average Adaptation. It needed improvements throughout, unfortunately. 23 9.91%
F - Awful Adaptation. I found the film almost intolerable. There is a great deal wrong with HBP 12 5.17%
Voters: 232. You may not vote on this poll

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  #241  
Old December 20th, 2009, 5:18 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
To those who say that not showing the Vow is impossible, well...it's possible indeed, just the idea of how it might work:
Snape:...but it might be possible for me to help Draco.
Narcissa: Severus!
Bella: Swear to it...make the unbreakable vow!
Narcissa: Bella, I trust him there's no...
Bella: There is need indeed. Oh, it's just empty words, he'll do his best effort sure, but when it's time to take action he'll just slither behind Dumbledore, oh, on the Dark Lord's orders of course...bloody coward.
Narcissa stares back at Severus.
Narcissa: Severus, what say you?
She holds out her hand to him.
Bella: Yes Snape, what say you? WHAT SAY YOU?
Snape is cornered, he opens his mouth to speak and we cut to weasley's joke shop.
This is very close to what I had in mind, and quite possibly an improvement! I do think that closing the scene on Snape's expressionless face (which Rickman does so well), and then cutting right when we were about to get the answer (argh!) would have been great mystery setup.

I then would have added a line from Draco where he rebuts Snape by saying something along the lines of "They told me you'd say that." Then, Hermione would have the out of "Yes, but Malfoy didn't believe Snape, did he?"

Ah, of all sad words of tongue or pen....

Still, as a teen romcom goes, it was first rate!


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  #242  
Old December 20th, 2009, 6:11 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
To those who say that not showing the Vow is impossible, well...it's possible indeed, just the idea of how it might work:
Snape:...but it might be possible for me to help Draco.
Narcissa: Severus!
Bella: Swear to it...make the unbreakable vow!
Narcissa: Bella, I trust him there's no...
Bella: There is need indeed. Oh, it's just empty words, he'll do his best effort sure, but when it's time to take action he'll just slither behind Dumbledore, oh, on the Dark Lord's orders of course...bloody coward.
Narcissa stares back at Severus.
Narcissa: Severus, what say you?
She holds out her hand to him.
Bella: Yes Snape, what say you? WHAT SAY YOU?
Snape is cornered, he opens his mouth to speak and we cut to weasley's joke shop.
I would dislike this so much. It sounds like something you'd see on a serial television show. All it would need is some music during the transition to the next scene and it would fit in with with Lost, Prison Break, etc.


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  #243  
Old December 20th, 2009, 9:37 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

I choose option 'C.' Overall the film is good. However, more memories related to Riddle are needed, especially those involving his mother and at least one of the other horcruxes. That way, the horcruxes are better explained and viewers have a further understanding of their nature. Also, Riddle's lying about being a "pureblood" is significant. Murdering his Muggle father and grandparents doesn't change his lineage, or the fact that his status as leader of the Deatheaters and their allegiance to him is based on a lie.


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  #244  
Old December 20th, 2009, 9:53 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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All it would need is some music during the transition to the next scene and it would fit in with with Lost, Prison Break, etc.
Thank you! Lost and Prison Break both share great worldwide success!


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  #245  
Old December 20th, 2009, 10:06 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
Thank you! Lost and Prison Break both share great worldwide success!
As TV shows, not as blockbuster movies.


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  #246  
Old December 20th, 2009, 11:13 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

I see no difference.
Anyway, this is the topic for the HBP reviews, I was already sorry to be off topic at the beginning.
If both of you feel the unavoidable need to discuss it further so to sleep peacefully, pm me.


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  #247  
Old December 21st, 2009, 12:12 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

Quote:
Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
Thank you! Lost and Prison Break both share great worldwide success!
Quote:
Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire
I see no difference.
There's a difference between cinematic and episodic. What you said is very episodic and cliff hanger-ish, and would quite frankly be terrible. People who watch those shows like being yanked by their chains like that, with film, people hate that. That's why they're two different mediums. There shouldn't be any ambiguity with Snape's decision, in fact, we're supposed to know he made it, we just don't know what he made the Vow to. Nor does the film need such overdramatic lines.

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Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
Also, showing Snape making the Vow during the Prince's Tale in DH would be more effective, because that would really complete the puzzle
The puzzle isn't whether or not Snape made the vow. The audience isn't stupid, there's just enough to make a case of whether or not Snape is good or evil. If he was good, why would he even offer to help Draco (to essentially kill dumbledore), much less actually agree to do it if Draco should fail (where the chances of this were 99% likely)? The puzzle should be whether or not Snape and Dumbledore had something planned, not whether or not he made the vow.


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  #248  
Old December 21st, 2009, 10:27 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

Well DML91, since my requests to keep in topic have gone astray....

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Originally Posted by DML1991 View Post
There's a difference between cinematic and episodic. What you said is very episodic and cliff hanger-ish, and would quite frankly be terrible. People who watch those shows like being yanked by their chains like that, with film, people hate that. That's why they're two different mediums. There shouldn't be any ambiguity with Snape's decision, in fact, we're supposed to know he made it, we just don't know what he made the Vow to. Nor does the film need such overdramatic lines.
Huh?
I see no difference between a blockbuster saga of 8 episodes and a blockbuster tv shows, apart from the ads of course.
If you told me 'Is there any difference between Lost and Lars Von Trier's Dogville? or between Prison Break and The Seventh Seal?' Well, then I'd say plenty!
But, you may like it or not, Harry Potter is a blockbuster episodic saga, just like Lost, or Dr Who, or Charmed.

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The puzzle should be whether or not Snape and Dumbledore had something planned, not whether or not he made the vow.
Snape and Dumbledore had something planned, hence he made the Vow...tą-dąąąąą!!!


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  #249  
Old December 21st, 2009, 10:55 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by KlausBaudelaire View Post
Well DML91, since my requests to keep in topic have gone astray....
Actually you are right.

HBP reviews are on topic here, not the comparison between HP movies and other big blockbuster movies.

Stay on topic.


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  #250  
Old December 21st, 2009, 3:24 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by DML1991 View Post
The puzzle isn't whether or not Snape made the vow. The audience isn't stupid...
And Hermione is? Again, in the book, Hermione (like Arthur and Lupin) think that Snape is lying to Draco, because that is what they assume a double-agent would be doing. If the scene ends before Snape replies, then the audience just does not know.
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Originally Posted by DML1991 View Post
The puzzle should be whether or not Snape and Dumbledore had something planned, not whether or not he made the vow.
In the book, this never is discussed. Yes, some people worked out (or at least hypothesized) that Dumbledore was dying and that Snape had agreed to give Dumbledore the coup. However, never in the book is it suggested that Snape and Dumbledore "had something planned." The closest thing is the issue of watching out for Draco: but that is because all of the heads-of-houses are on the lookout.

That being written, this might be a good adaptation if you are telling the story about personal politics rather than the romcom. A couple of scenes in which Harry can misconstrue Snape's words would have gone a long way towards a "Snape is working for Voldemort and made the Vow" vs. "Snape is working for Dumbledore and lied about the Vow" political debate. Add a couple of "The Prince is Great" vs. "The Prince is a Sociopath" interactions at the same time, and the movie really could have clicked.

For example, what if Harry overhears Snape telling Dumbledore that he, Snape, had done everything Dumbledore had asked: that Snape had even done what Dumbledore wanted when Bellatrix asked Snape to make the Unbreakable Vow! Ah, so Dumbledore anticipated that, eh? Clever boy! And that means that Snape did... um, what did he do?


Regarding the "Previously on Lost" motif, the movie really blew it here. I thought that they were going to do this at the outset: camera's flashing in Harry's face, with closeups on his eyes and then newspaper headlines ("Sirius Black Innocent, Murdered"; "Voldemort Returns"; "Malfoy Charged with Opening Chamber of Secrets") with flashbacks after the Harry's eyes closeups to the key points. The reason why successful TV serials (Lost, Battlestar Galactica, etc.) do this is because the producers correctly recognize that the audiences need to be reminded of key plot points from earlier episodes.

The shame of it is that Rowling did a great job of this herself. Yes, the first two chapters are cannon shots for the story: what better way to introduce a story about personal politics than a scene centered on politicians? Simple! Follow that up with a scene focusing on the internal politics of the "bad guys," in which we immediately learn that people question Snape's loyalties: oh, but it's some of the bad guys who think that he's working for the other side!

Instead, we got Lav-Lav.....


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Last edited by Wimsey; December 21st, 2009 at 3:28 pm.
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  #251  
Old December 21st, 2009, 4:01 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by Wimsey View Post
And Hermione is? Again, in the book, Hermione (like Arthur and Lupin) think that Snape is lying to Draco, because that is what they assume a double-agent would be doing. If the scene ends before Snape replies, then the audience just does not know.
This has nothing to do with anything I stated.
Quote:
In the book, this never is discussed.
Which is a response to suggesting it should be shown in Deathly Hallows.
Quote:
Regarding the "Previously on Lost" motif, the movie really blew it here. I thought that they were going to do this at the outset: camera's flashing in Harry's face, with closeups on his eyes and then newspaper headlines ("Sirius Black Innocent, Murdered"; "Voldemort Returns"; "Malfoy Charged with Opening Chamber of Secrets") with flashbacks after the Harry's eyes closeups to the key points. The reason why successful TV serials (Lost, Battlestar Galactica, etc.) do this is because the producers correctly recognize that the audiences need to be reminded of key plot points from earlier episodes.
The flashback doesn't exist as a reminder of the last film. But rather, with Dumbledore wrapping Harry around with his left arm ties into the farewell sequence in which Harry puts his hand gently on Dumbledore's chest, different, but similiar situations bringing the portrayal in their relationship full circle in the film.
Quote:
Instead, we got Lav-Lav.....
Who was in it around 15 minutes only, barely less or barely more. She doesn't have that much screentime. She sure must have made a heavy impact.


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  #252  
Old December 21st, 2009, 4:13 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

Didn't Dan say in a recent interview that if it wasn't for the romance, the movie would have been 2 1/2 hours of boring stuff? I still like HBP better than OotP. The pace of the movie in HBP was a bit slower, and even though I didn't like the scene with Harry and the waitress. That didn't make sense to me.


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  #253  
Old December 21st, 2009, 4:31 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Didn't Dan say in a recent interview that if it wasn't for the romance, the movie would have been 2 1/2 hours of boring stuff? I still like HBP better than OotP. The pace of the movie in HBP was a bit slower, and even though I didn't like the scene with Harry and the waitress. That didn't make sense to me.
It does make sense; he is a teenager who is noticing members of the opposite sex. Of course it is out of character, but if you want a perfect portrayal of Harry, you can read the books.


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  #254  
Old December 21st, 2009, 4:33 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Originally Posted by NumberEight View Post
It does make sense; he is a teenager who is noticing members of the opposite sex. Of course it is out of character, but if you want a perfect portrayal of Harry, you can read the books.
I kinda liked that scene. I always felt JK left out the usual teenage issues boys are faced with.


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  #255  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 1:31 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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This has nothing to do with anything I stated.
It has everything to do with what you stated. Never is it "obvious" to the objective observer within Potterverse that Snape made the Vow. If we had not read Spinner's End, then Hermione's (and Arthur's and Lupin's) suggestion that Snape was lying would seem perfectly sensible. Indeed, this was the big flaw (that an editor should have altered) in the narrative: because we read Snape making the Vow, we "know" that Harry is correct and Hermione et al. do come off looking a bit dumb.

(These are two of the only cases after Stone where Rowling deviates from her usual narrative style, i.e., 3rd person subjective single protagonist, where we only see what Harry sees, down to pejorative adjectives and adverbs giving us Harry's slant on things; even in the case of Frank the Caretaker in Goblet, Harry was "there" via his link with Voldemort.)

Within the book, however, the only issue is: what, if anything, are Snape and Draco planning together, not what are Snape and Dumbledore planning. Although Harry ignores the evidence that he himself witnesses, we are presented with a big inconsistency with Harry's insistence that Snape and Draco are working together: namely, Snape does not seem to know exactly what Draco is doing and Draco wants none of Snape's aid. (Again, this is the politics of fear/ hatred: if you are convinced that there are WMDs, then you'll ignore evidence to the contrary.)
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Originally Posted by DML1991 View Post
The flashback doesn't exist as a reminder of the last film.
Agreed: but it was a lost opportunity to bring the audience back up to speed and remind them of plot points from earlier stories that would be (or could have been) important in this one. Of course, as I have noted, these points were not important to romcom story about sexual politics, except possibly Harry having saved Ginny's life in the Chamber of Secrets.

The scene did accomplish the rest of what you note, and it did so quite well. However, recall how Rowling's "Previously on Harry Potter..." chapters served to both introduce the story AND bring the audience back up to speed: a well produced scene here could have done the same.
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Originally Posted by DML1991 View Post
She doesn't have that much screentime. She sure must have made a heavy impact.
Remember, LavLav is not just screentime with Jennifer Cave: it was the Quidditch and time spent dealing with the issue in other scenes. It was not the character, but the plotline.

However, if you are telling a story about sexual politics, then it really is appropriate to cut the fear/hatred politics stuff and amp up the romcom stuff.

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Didn't Dan say in a recent interview that if it wasn't for the romance, the movie would have been 2 1/2 hours of boring stuff?
I think that you are rephrasing Radcliffe! I seem to recall that he said that if it were not for the romance, then the film would have been 2.5 hours of heavy/depressing/intense stuff. Now, some people would find that boring: but Radcliffe has elsewhere expressed interest in such things for film fodder. Given the success of films such as Lord of the Rings, etc., it is pretty clear that heavy/intense/depressing can bring back audiences, too!


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Last edited by Wimsey; December 22nd, 2009 at 1:38 am.
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  #256  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 2:04 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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Agreed: but it was a lost opportunity to bring the audience back up to speed and remind them of plot points from earlier stories that would be (or could have been) important in this one.
Why do you love flashbacks so much? It would have been repetitive if there was a flashback in the same league as OotP's. I may catch flak for this but I believe that if someone cares deeply for the Potter films, they would have re-watched, skimmed over, or even read summaries on each film before venturing out to see the new one. Do you have little faith in the film's audience?


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  #257  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 4:36 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

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I may catch flak for this but I believe that if someone cares deeply for the Potter films, they would have re-watched, skimmed over, or even read summaries on each film before venturing out to see the new one. Do you have little faith in the film's audience?
The proportion of the audience that "cares deeply" is tiny. There is no pulse in rentals of Harry Potter films prior to the release of new films, and for the vast majority of attendees, this is "just" another very popular film franchise. Yes, they like the films: otherwise they would not be coming back. However, they expect to have each film entertain them on their own.

And as for "faith," I have none, but I do have a lot of relevant knowledge. For example, tell a class that material from the midterm will be on the final and then listen to the groans. (Although I still do not know how warning them prior to the midterm that they'd be expected to remember it 4 weeks later would change anything that they would do: but I digress!)

The point? People are in the here-and-now at all times. It is exacerbated here: people are paying to see the film-makers present a story, and thus the film-makers are being paid to do all of the work. When you get down to it, university is the only thing where you should have prereqs for a paid product, and even then any decent prof. will briefly review older material before expanding upon it. (He/She will catch hell in teaching reviews if he/she does not!) In story-telling, if you want to communicate a story that relies on some "there-and-then," then you must refresh their memories. This is why Rowling had the opening two chapters of the HBP book. This also is why serial TVs programs like Lost, Battlestar Galactica, etc., do "Previously on <BLANK>" shots at the outset. Had Prince done this with the Diary, then they could have advanced two plots: but as it is, I seriously doubt that most viewers connected the Diary to the 2nd movie.


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  #258  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 8:24 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

Maybe it's time to remember that everyone's opinions are equally valid and relevant here, no matter what one's occupation is.


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  #259  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 8:44 am
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

True.
But allow me to say that Wimsey has actually a point.
I watched The Dark Knight three years after Batman Begins with a completely blank mind, and I didn't remember that Michael Caine was playing Alfred, or that the actress playing Rachel had been replaced.
Nor did I remember the relationship between Mr Wayne and Rachel, and if I was supposed to remember the Dent guy from the previous movie.
This is not because I'm dumb, or stupid, or with the worst long-term memory in the whole world, I just don't care for the Batman franchising.
The majority of the people go to watch Harry Potter with the same mind I watched the Dark Knight.
So, if in the sixth episode of a saga there is no sequence like 'previously on Harry Potter...' then people is going to forget what happened earlier, and this is not a priority of tv shows even G. Lucas in a thing named Star Wars did something similar.


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  #260  
Old December 22nd, 2009, 4:20 pm
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Re: Half-Blood Prince Movie Reviews v.2

Personally I'm with Dylan and Jeff on this one.

I'm still of the belief that it is NOT the filmmakers obligation to make sure the audience is up to speed, but rather an individual obligation.

Heck, with the age of technology we live in it's not even necessary to watch the prior film and/or read the book anymore, but I digress...


I actually loved the opening for Half-Blood Prince, though I didn't really see much purpose for it. But it was creative and artistic


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