Login  
 
 
Go Back   Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Post DH References

Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis



 
 
Thread Tools
  #61  
Old December 20th, 2009, 6:23 am
MistressofRaven's Avatar
MistressofRaven  Female.gif MistressofRaven is offline
Fifth Year
 
Joined: 3721 days
Location: New Orleans
Age: 30
Posts: 931
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

I think the most important quality for a Ravenclaw to have is an open mind. Many people say that Ravenclaws have to be intelligent. To me, Ravenclaws are intelligent not because they just learn a lot from books (like Hermione), but because they are open minded enough to accept knowledge from anywhere. They won't discount the validity of something just because it is unusual.


It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione.

That seems a rather biased statement. Ravenclaw is a place for those who are intelligent, witty, open minded and creative. Take the example of the common room riddles. One may be very book smart, but book smarts won't help you solve a riddle if you can't think outside the box. Also, I would say that only Ravenclaw and Slytherin are known for intelligence.

What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

Like others have said, Luna is a good example. She is obviously very brave since she joined the DA, fought in the DoM, fought at Hogwarts. That could have put her in Gryffindor. She is fair minded and seems unafraid to be friends with any kind of person which could have put her in Hufflepuff. Cho Chang was also brave for most of the same reasons as Luna yet she was also in Ravenclaw.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

Ravenclaws think before acting and are intrinsically motivated to learn. One example is when Harry decided to go the Ministry of Magic after seeing Sirius being Crucioed. That was a very Gryffindor thing to do. I think a Ravenclaw would not have rushed off to save Sirius the way Harry did. A Ravenclaw would have thought what Hermione thought and considered that someone could have been trying to trick him. Another thing that comes to mind is Snape's Half Blood Prince book. Though all his corrections and inventions show that he is very intelligent, everything in that book had a practical purpose. His corrections to the instructions got him better grades in the class and his spells were to be used against the marauders. That to me is indicative of a Slytherin. I think a Ravenclaw would like to invent new spells, but not necessarily because of what is to be gained from them. A Ravenclaw would get joy just from having new knowledge and having been able to do something very creative.

What is the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?

To me air is a reference to having your head in the clouds which makes me think of people like Luna Lovegood, intelligent but whimsical. Also, of the four elements, air allows the most freedom. You can't see it and sometimes you can't even feel it. I think that is supposed to be in reference to the creativity and open-mindedness of Ravenclaws. More freedom is more room to be creative and creativity comes from having an open mind. Ravenclaws just need the least restrictive environment and to me that is air. By Raven I assume you mean Eagle. The eagle has the same purpose as air in my view. An eagle symbolizes freedom, the freedom to soar in the sky as long as it wants with nothing to stop it.

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?

I think the purpose of splitting students into houses is to show more clearly how people with different personalities react to the same situations. It also shows us how people judge each other before even getting a chance to know them. Example = the way James judged Severus, Severus judged Gryffindors, Hagrid and Ron judged Draco, etc. I would say that specifically creating Ravenclaw shows the importance of wit, thinking outside the box, and similar qualities. Take the example of the story of the Deathly Hallows. Someone from another house might discount that as just a silly children's story. But Xenophilius believed it and was able to give the trio crucial information.

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?

I don't know if I have any new thoughts. I always identified with Ravenclaw but I like that they have to answer riddles to get into the common room. It shows that Ravenclaws really love to learn. DH also showed that they are very brave and loyal. For example, The Quibbler supported Harry Potter when he was being trashed by the Daily Prophet and Ministry of Magic.


__________________
who cares about the children

avatar by cpatten-d32vy3p

Last edited by MistressofRaven; December 21st, 2009 at 2:40 am. Reason: Forgot to answer part of a question and new ideas have come to mind. Since no one's responded yet I figure it's safe to edit
Sponsored Links
  #62  
Old December 21st, 2009, 2:13 am
ignisia's Avatar
ignisia  Female.gif ignisia is offline
Leader of the GLITTELUTION
 
Joined: 4890 days
Location: Sitting in a Tin Can
Age: 30
Posts: 4,418
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

I would say curiosity. Not everyone is born with a talent for learning or retention, but simply wanting to be knowledgeable is the biggest step a person could take in trying to be intelligent.

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

We don't have many people to choose from. Luna belongs in Ravenclaw 100%, and we don't know Cho well enough to make any big judgements-- the poor girl was grieving by the time Harry got close enough to her. There is Helena, but I'm not quite sure about her.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

I think that Ravenclaw students would likely run to an adult whenever there was danger. It's the most logical first choice, since adults are more equipped to handle situations than children who are just learning to harness their magic.

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?

I suppose it represents aspiring to greater levels of knowledge or a free and open mind that can soar to new heights.

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?

I think intelligence is one of the important qualities JKR thinks makes Hogwarts what it is. All of the qualities of the Houses can make for a good, enlightened, and successful human being.

There is also the role it played in DH: Luna and Xeno talk about how it is right to believe the unbelievable. That idea is echoed by Dumbledore's speech about the truth in small things like children's stories.

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?

Still love the House. I like the role it played in DH, and the parts with Luna and her father were very thought-provoking-- which, I suppose, is a pretty good thing from a Ravenclaw perspective.


__________________
I am incapable of hating someone who, instead of using a spell to guard the Sorcerer's Stone, uses a logic puzzle.
I'm sorry.



VIVA LA GLITTELUTION
Looking for a home away from home?
Hogsmeade ~ Apparate.me
Avatar by SIP
  #63  
Old December 21st, 2009, 4:23 am
halfbreedlover's Avatar
halfbreedlover  Female.gif halfbreedlover is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 5633 days
Location: somewhere
Age: 30
Posts: 1,985
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis


Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?


I think curiosity would be the most important quality. It can't be raw intelligence. Too many brilliant Muggle psychologists have spent their careers trying to define intelligence. I can't imagine how the Sorting Hat (or by extension Rowena Ravenclaw) could figure it out so simply.

Curiosity seems a bit more cut-and-dry IMO.

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?


Like I said above, I don't think it is intelligence, because intelligence is much too vague and hard to define. I think a valuing of intelligence and a strong drive to learn would be the most important qualities. I think we can definitely see this in Luna, since she goes on to become a naturalist who discovers new species of animals. As for Cho, I think she said that she joined the DA so that she could learn how to avenge Cedric or how to defend herself. So, that's a desire to learn too.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?


I think Ravenclaws would be a bit less rash than Gryffindors or Slytherins. I think they'd be more likely to look before they leaped, so to speak, and think a decision through. I also think they would be a bit better at finding more convenient and safe solutions, like the way Luna thought of using the thestrals to get to the ministry.

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?


Well, Ravenclaw does seem to have an affinity with birds. Their symbol is the eagle, and there is Raven in their name. I think it is strange. Eagles are a very noble bird, but I've never heard of them associated with intelligence. I usually think of the owl...but I guess since owls are already used to deliver mail in Harry Potter, they really wouldn't make a good emblem of a house. Perhaps JKR figured she'd already used owls enough.

I guess they would symbolize an open mind like ignisia said.

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?


Hmmm. Well, splitting students into residential houses isn't unheard of among English boarding schools and universities. I think Oxford and Cambridge have systems like this (Yale does too, having copied it from Cambridge), though of course the students there are sorted randomly and not by personality traits.

Perhaps this was a way to infuse some more magic into the sorting process? I think it is also a convenient way to develop character.

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?

Well, I like that we finally met the Ravenclaw ghost. I also think it is interesting that Ravenclaws have to solve a riddle to enter the house rather than memorize a password. That was clever.

I'd like to add another question....

What Muggle professions would Ravenclaw residents excel in, if it were set in the Muggle world?


I hope people aren't offended by this question...but it is one way I like to consider the houses. I guess it is because I spend so much time in the Sorting Hat here.

I tend to think Ravenclaw would be good at producing college and university professors, scientists, researchers, museum curators and archivists. What do you think?


__________________

Can you find the frog? Click here for an enlarged image.

“Whether you come back by page or by the big screen, Hogwarts will always be there to welcome you home.”
― J.K. Rowling

"She boiled her brain."- Karl Pilkington
  #64  
Old November 29th, 2010, 4:55 pm
Chrysalis's Avatar
Chrysalis  Undisclosed.gif Chrysalis is offline
Hogwarts Graduate
 
Joined: 5894 days
Location: in my leisure suite
Posts: 2,899
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Ravenclaws are not only intelligent, but open-minded and curious. They are very philosophical. They think very carefully before taking action. Their negative traits are predominantly aloofness, a certain haughtiness and they can be a bit elitist. We see the same traits in Luna actually, in the way she responds to Hermione. (I don't blame her, since Hermione can be very maddening at times.) Ravenclaws seek to learn for the pleasure of learning. Though Snape could've been in Ravenclaw, above all he wanted to be somebody, which was understandable considering the sort of life he came from. That is why he was sorted in Slytherin. Ravenclaw and Slytherin are known for their intelligence, but Slytherins tend to view intelligence more as a means to an end, rather than an end in itself. The Air of Ravenclaw represents their need to reach higher and higher and their open-mindedness. Water shows that Slytherins are Intuitive Thinkers, who instead of jumping from point A to B to C jump straight from A to F.

Hermione, as was previously stated, is unable to think outside the box, and bravery is her secondary quality, which is why she's a Gryff. She also doesn't seem to be very keen on arguing about magical theory and she's not philosophical. She's much more like Percy, in fact, quite rigid. She doesn't seem to be able to pick up knowledge very well if it doesn't come straight from a book. In HBP she doesn't even once consider that Liberace Borge's instructions are in fact wrong or at the very least outdated, and the Half-Blood Prince's annotations are correct.


  #65  
Old January 24th, 2011, 10:54 pm
AldeberanBlack  Male.gif AldeberanBlack is offline
Secret Chocolate Keeper
 
Joined: 3699 days
Location: London
Posts: 6,168
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?
Intelligence, wit and imagination

Quote:
It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?
I don't know. We don't really know enough about any specific Ravenclaw to make that kind of judgement IMO

Quote:
What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?
Thinking before acting. Weighing up a situation carefully before blindly jumping in.

Quote:
What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?
Air represents clear thinking. An open sky = An open mind.

The raven is one of the most intelligent birds in the world. A versatile problem solver.

Quote:
What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?
I have always admired them. Still do.


__________________
The Noble and Most Ancient House of Black
  #66  
Old June 9th, 2011, 7:50 pm
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

Ravenclaws seem, as a group, to be intelligent and open minded - they love to learn new things, think outside the box and look at life with a fresh pair of eyes, rather than parroting everyone else.

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

This question sounds a bit biased to me. For one thing, we really aren't told about anyone the sorting hat considers for one house but places in Ravenclaw instead. Many of the posts here mention Luna, who is also very brave, but I think people keep forgetting that Flitwick, who was the head of the house, was a Dueling Champion. The movies place Guilderoy Lockhart in Ravenclaw, probably because he wrote books, but I could see Slytherin as a possibility - he was a fraud, I think, but he also wanted power and notoriety.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I can see Ravenclaws spending more time thinking about problems and exhausting their resources before jumping into something.

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?

Air symbolizes intelligence and open mindedness, and also can mean "air head" (perhaps) and spending time with "your head in the clouds." I think the Eagle and not the Raven is the mascot for the house, and I believe it symbolizes freedom, pride, and independence.


As a Ravenclaw, I've completed this to better understand myself and my house. I have also done many searches, but could find no other place to ask this question, so...I'll ask it here.

In the movies, at least, Moaning Myrtle is said to be a Ravenclaw. Which qualities does she possess which would lead you to believe she belongs in this house?


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
  #67  
Old June 9th, 2011, 9:24 pm
iluvsnape17  Female.gif iluvsnape17 is offline
Third Year
 
Joined: 4379 days
Location: in the blue room
Age: 24
Posts: 359
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?
I think the main thing would be an intelligent open-mindedness. The ability to spot things that others probably wouldn't, and be capable of alternative interpretations and logic.

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

Flitwick and Luna are clear examples of brave people showing Gryffindor qualities (and perhaps Luna's loyalty being a Hufflepuff quality) who probably ended up in Ravenclaw for their thought processes and the way they see the world. Perhaps the Grey Lady could have been a Slytherin, with her cunning in plotting to steal the Diadem.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?
I think that in Ootp, a Ravenclaw would perhaps not have run off to the room of requirement to retrieve Sirius quite so quickly, but more take Hermione's view and take time to consider the likelihood of it being a trap, and contact other people to get better information before making an informed decision.

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?
I think the air is probably symbolising the open-mindedness of the house. And also the more daydreamer qualities of Ravenclaws like Luna. The idea of having 'your head in the clouds' symbolising the imagination and creativity of Ravenclaw.


__________________
'You're too old to be so shy'

[center]SEEING OTHER PEOPLE
~Rose and Scorpius' story about love~
  #68  
Old June 9th, 2011, 9:30 pm
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by iluvsnape17 View Post

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?
I think that in Ootp, a Ravenclaw would perhaps not have run off to the room of requirement to retrieve Sirius quite so quickly, but more take Hermione's view and take time to consider the likelihood of it being a trap, and contact other people to get better information before making an informed decision.
I completely agree. It also reminds me of when the group found out how to access the Chamber of Secrets. I suspect the first thing a Ravenclaw would have said was, "Somebody, go get a professor, quick!"

In the movies, at least, Moaning Myrtle is said to be a Ravenclaw. Which qualities does she possess which would lead you to believe she belongs in this house? - Ideas?


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
  #69  
Old June 10th, 2011, 2:11 am
RemusLupinFan's Avatar
RemusLupinFan  Female.gif RemusLupinFan is offline
I want to believe
 
Joined: 5624 days
Location: The office in the basement
Posts: 5,897
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
In the movies, at least, Moaning Myrtle is said to be a Ravenclaw. Which qualities does she possess which would lead you to believe she belongs in this house? - Ideas?
FYI the Hp-lexicon confirms that Myrtle was a Ravenclaw, so it's not just in the movies. As for what got her sorted into Ravenclaw, I honestly don't believe we know enough about her character beyond saying that she possessed the qualities of a Ravenclaw, like being studious and valuing intelligence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
Maybe I'm wrong, but I can see Ravenclaws spending more time thinking about problems and exhausting their resources before jumping into something.
I think that's a fair assessment. I could see a Ravenclaw wanting to puzzle something out on their own before getting others involved (as someone who identifies with Ravenclaw myself, I can see this being the case).


__________________

X-Files is the property of Ten Thirteen Productions, 20th Century Fox
WolfCloak30 Pottermore
  #70  
Old June 10th, 2011, 2:34 am
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan View Post
FYI the Hp-lexicon confirms that Myrtle was a Ravenclaw, so it's not just in the movies. As for what got her sorted into Ravenclaw, I honestly don't believe we know enough about her character beyond saying that she possessed the qualities of a Ravenclaw, like being studious and valuing intelligence.I think that's a fair assessment.
Thanks - that makes sense!

Someone also reminded me that Myrtle is a ghost, and that ghosts are echos of who they once were.


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
  #71  
Old June 10th, 2011, 9:22 am
Quachett  Undisclosed.gif Quachett is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 3423 days
Posts: 143
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I still don’t get why a lot of fans think if you are brave then you go to Gryffindor, if you are sly then you go to syltherin and all that. I think there is more to it than that the qualities are a summation of your life style and how each quality manifest when needed. I’m gonna list some of the predominant qualities and at least try to see how they present themselves in each house using examples were possible:

1. Bravery: Largely associated with Gryffindor but i have to point out that bravery manifests itself in many different ways. Gryffindors are soldiers by their nature, they will take up arms at any sign of trouble and tend to be rushed in battle. Best example i can give is Harry's impulse to fight and defend his friends without really thinking of the risks involved, this was also shown in the twins in the final battle. For Slytherin they have bravery when it best suits them. Having realised the only way to get Draco, Narcisa bravely told LV a lie because all she wanted was to get her son, same thing happened with Snape turned spy as a way to remember lilly and keep her legacy going. Ravenclaws' bravery seems more rooted in logic. They will fight for what makes logical sense, they fought LV as they knew with him in power pursuit of knowledge will be hard if you want to study matters not relating to blood purity or dark arts, they knew that logic gained from muggles or muggle borns will be lost as well. Hufflepuffs were to me the pacifist of the wizarding world but in face of great evil they would be brave as they would fight for what is right no matter what.

2. Intelligence: largely associated with ravenclaws but, you have to see that for ravenclaws its more the pursuit of knowledge above all else that separates them from the rest. Intelligent students can be found in all houses but how that intelligent defines their lives is how they get placed in houses, Tom was very intelligent but and was thirst for knowledge but he dint do it for the sake of learning rather he did it for gaining power and domination which made him a slytherin, Albus was more curious and wanted to learn as much as possible to protect hence he was a gryfindor, this is previllent in other characters like Sirius, James, Lupin, Bellatrix, Snape they were all intelligent but they pursued knowledge not for knowledge's sake hence were not Ravenclaws. Hufflepuffs seemed to be intelligent as well and largely pursued knowledge for conflict resolution and just the ability to add to their skill set for no pointed goal. Cedric seemed to be very intelligent and skilled at magic showing that it was how he used his intelligence that made him a hufflepuff and not raven claw

3. Kindness, fairness and Loyalty: The qualities most associated with Hufflepuffs, these were also in all houses but for hufflepuffs they all combined to make generally peace loving people. those that simply want a simple life and are not keen to fight. the reason why hufflepuff seemed devoid of glory was because they never had any students who really sort glory. They were the humble and meek sort who most likely wanted to just co-exist in peace with everybody. Raven claws were shown to be loyal as members of the DA responded to the call to arms, thier kindness is evident in Luna, slytherins were the same kind to those they like look how the malfoy treated Krecher even draco's wierd relationship with Mettle in HBP. They were loyal as well look at Bellatrix and those death eaters that braved Azkaban but fair they were not, Slaghourn was the perfect example, very kind and loyal those of great potential and influence but unfair as he showed massive favouritism. Gryffindors seemed to have all these qualities but like slytherins they were directed to some people. What separates them from slytherins was that they were willing to exercise these qualities to anyone and chose to stop if they established tht the person was bad or at least did something they didn’t like.

4. Those cunning folk that will use any means to achieve their goal, Slytherins: while this is prevalent amongst slytherins, I should also point out that it is more in the means than anything that separates slytherins and the rest. Slytherins are readily willing to go over the line to archive their goal unlike the rest. Gryfindors showed this quality many times like Harry, Ron and the twins constant disregard of rules to get what they wanted, the only difference is they seemed to know when to stop and not cross a line though they occasionally did cross it. It is also true with Ravenclaws as seen in Harry and Ron's bid to get good OWLs when they were getting contra banned substances from some ravenclaws to bust their intelligence, the ravenclaw just wanted some cash so he exploted the market, also Cho's purposeful blocking of Harry in their Quiditch match showed the similar trait and like gryfindors they knew were to stop. Unlike malfoy who grabed Harry's broom to stop him from getting the snitch, Cho just tailed him and blocked him and stopped at tht. Persie showed His willingness to archieve what he wnted by even turning his back on family so as to further his ministry career and he was a Grifindor.

To me Students like Hermione, Worm tail and Lily, were placed in thier houses for conviniance, Like I said bravery has many forms and Hermione's seemed to be so much inline with Ravenclaw. To me Hermione seemed to be a walking defination of Ravenclaw, I have not seen anything that she did that shows why she was a gryfindor and not ravenclaw. Even when she was brave she was always the voice of reason and logic. She pursued knowledge for knowledge's sake. To me the best example came when Fred died, Ron and Harry acted like Gryfindors they just wanted to get into the battle and kill some death eaters but Hermione saw that this was not the correct course of action but rathe to find LV and Kill Nagini showing her bravery which was governed by logic like a Ravenclaw should. Wormtail lacked the wit to be a full on walking defination of slytherin but was close to. Lilly was exactly like hermione from how she is described, sacrificing herself for harry was a motherly action than an act of bravery. Narcisa did the same for Draco, when she lied to LV about Harry being dead she was willing to die (as LV would have killed her if he found out that she lied before they got to the castle) for a chance to see her son. Putting these student in those houses they seemed to fit better would have required a lot of expanding of the plot to accomodate those houses especially with Hermione.


  #72  
Old June 10th, 2011, 9:30 am
Lisl_Loveheart  Female.gif Lisl_Loveheart is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 3111 days
Location: Germany
Age: 41
Posts: 222
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Having been sorted into Ravenclaw I was a bit uncertain at first... even though I have changed in the last couple of years, at heart (and mind) I'm still the passionate thinker I was as a student.
Reading these posts helped me realize that and oh, how proud I am to be a Ravenclaw!

I'd like to think about this post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by AK_WDB View Post
Here's a rough way to sort yourself. Which is your favorite of these four social sciences: history, economics, political science, or psychology?

If you say "history," you're most likely a Ravenclaw. As others have said, Ravenclaws tend to be not only intelligent but intellectual---they enjoy learning for its own sake and not necessarily for practical reasons, and need to analyze and understand the theory and reasons behind something, just as a student of history does. By contrast, if you said "political science" you're more likely a Gryffindor, since this concerns a more practical application of intelligence. Economics would be Slytherin, since understanding economics makes one resourceful and able to do much with little. Psychology would be Hufflepuff, since it concerns fairness: knowing how a person thinks is essential for being fair towards them.
(And I'm sorry if my English is not good enough to express my ideas here...)
I'm a psychologist and would have loved to be a Hufflepuff, but one thing to consider is how much philosophy one has to study to understand human beings. For me, human behavior, feelings, thoughts, and the internal logic of each individual self are fascinating!

What makes a Ravenclaw is the love of learning, no matter the subject (and what more complex subject than mankind?). We see examples of Ravenclaws passionate about magical creatures and plants (Luna), passionate about magic itself (Flitwick) and passionate about (self-)marketing (Lockheart). What do they have in common? It must be the way they think.

This post warmed my heart! I completely agree!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath View Post
I was always hesitant to consider myself a Ravenclaw because I doubted if I was smart enough but I have since realized that Ravenclaw is not only about academic intelligence but also the desire to learn, that hunger for knowledge, the wit of unconventional thinking and the pursuit of the philosophies of life. The free thinkers and the open minded. The dreamers, the romantics and the odd person is what defines a true Ravenclaw to me and if that is the case then I am a proud Ravenclaw all the way.


__________________
Lisl Loveheart

Image by the lovely SadiraSnape

"Neville is the man!"

Wand: Pear, Phoenix, 14.5 in, quite flexible
HUFFLEPUFF
MagicProphecy
  #73  
Old June 10th, 2011, 4:31 pm
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post

To me Students like Hermione, Worm tail and Lily, were placed in thier houses for conviniance, Like I said bravery has many forms and Hermione's seemed to be so much inline with Ravenclaw.
I agree with you in that Hermione very much thought like a Ravenclaw and would be a good fit in that house, but even after she took the time to think things through and added her viewpoint to Harry's, in the end she usually dove headfirst into what Harry had planned, choosing Gryffindor bravery first.

Lily also placed courage and bravery above all, in my opinion. She publicly stood up to her housemates when she thought they were wrong. She stood up to her best friend and ended their friendship when she decided he'd crossed over the line. I think a Ravenclaw would have spent more time trying to understand both sides.


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
  #74  
Old June 10th, 2011, 9:43 pm
Quachett  Undisclosed.gif Quachett is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 3423 days
Posts: 143
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
I agree with you in that Hermione very much thought like a Ravenclaw and would be a good fit in that house, but even after she took the time to think things through and added her viewpoint to Harry's, in the end she usually dove headfirst into what Harry had planned, choosing Gryffindor bravery first.
I always thouhgt tht was her loyalty to Harry tht eventually made her go and the fact tht she was brave as well. I still see little Gyfindor in her compared to Ravenclaw

Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
Lily also placed courage and bravery above all, in my opinion. She publicly stood up to her housemates when she thought they were wrong. She stood up to her best friend and ended their friendship when she decided he'd crossed over the line. I think a Ravenclaw would have spent more time trying to understand both sides.
As for lilly, Cho, Ernie (i know he is hufflepuff) and Luna all public supported Harry when the whole school thought him a liar in OoTP and Cho even did so in the early stages of GoF when the whole school including Ron thought he was a cheat, I think all this shows a good and strong moral compass more than brevary (which is still a big deal), but eventually all ravenclaws would have to decide on what to do afteer giving the person a chance and try to understand both sides, like lilly did. That said there is just too little in the book to really say she was a better fit for Ravenclaw than Grifindor but i got say what I read sure looks tht way


  #75  
Old June 11th, 2011, 4:04 pm
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Well, another thing I believe the Sorting Hat takes into account is not just who the person is when the Hat is placed on their head, but who they have the potential to become and a side of themselves which they already have but which could be strengthened.

Hermione was very much a Ravenclaw, but by being sorted into Gryffindor and being with other Gryffindors she could develop her courage and round out her character.

I think the Hat wanted to place Harry in Slytherin, but Harry did not want to develop those particular qualities, so he was placed in Gryffindor.


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
  #76  
Old June 12th, 2011, 3:22 pm
Quachett  Undisclosed.gif Quachett is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 3423 days
Posts: 143
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
Well, another thing I believe the Sorting Hat takes into account is not just who the person is when the Hat is placed on their head, but who they have the potential to become and a side of themselves which they already have but which could be strengthened.

Hermione was very much a Ravenclaw, but by being sorted into Gryffindor and being with other Gryffindors she could develop her courage and round out her character.

I think the Hat wanted to place Harry in Slytherin, but Harry did not want to develop those particular qualities, so he was placed in Gryffindor.
I get your point but it comes back to my initial point that Gryfindors arent the only brave students, What Hermione did is to me no different to what Luna did, like hermione luna went with Harry to the ministry even though she wasnt asked to, She co-led the DA when the trio were out hunting for Hocruxes, she responded to the call to arms at the end of HBP at the north tower, in short when she knew about what was going on she never questioned anything she just stood by Harry and the others and fought valiently much like hermione did, I still cant see the Gryfindor connection.

Harry's almost sorting into Slytherin seemed to be based on the ability to speak to snakes and the fact that Both gryfindor and Slytherin share identical qualities, the only difference seems to be arrogance which was one of Harry's weakness. I think the main trouble was the parslemouth and the thirst to prove himself Vs. the head strong bravery that seemed to be in all gryfindors, Harry could have been in either house.


  #77  
Old June 12th, 2011, 3:53 pm
FurryDice's Avatar
FurryDice  Female.gif FurryDice is offline
Hogwarts Graduate
 
Joined: 4313 days
Location: Ireland
Age: 35
Posts: 2,591
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post
Ravenclaws' bravery seems more rooted in logic. They will fight for what makes logical sense, they fought LV as they knew with him in power pursuit of knowledge will be hard if you want to study matters not relating to blood purity or dark arts, they knew that logic gained from muggles or muggle borns will be lost as well.
I don't think Ravenclaws fought just so that knowledge and learning could be preserved. Cho fought because of Cedric, and there were probably plenty of Ravenclaws who were Muggleborn, or had Muggleborn family or friends.

Quote:
To me Students like Hermione, Worm tail and Lily, were placed in thier houses for conviniance, Like I said bravery has many forms and Hermione's seemed to be so much inline with Ravenclaw. To me Hermione seemed to be a walking defination of Ravenclaw, I have not seen anything that she did that shows why she was a gryfindor and not ravenclaw. Even when she was brave she was always the voice of reason and logic. She pursued knowledge for knowledge's sake.
I don't think Hermione purused knowledge for its own sake - she was very competitive and had a fear of failure - she pursued knowledge because she wanted to be the best, because she didn't want to fail, because it might be useful to their work against Voldemort. Also, Hermione's priority wasn't her studies - "Books and cleverness! There are more important things, like friendship and bravery..." whereas as Luna quotes Rowena Ravenclaw "Wit beyond measure is man's greatest treasure" and it seems to be something she genuinely believes. Also, Hermione isn't open-minded enough to be a Ravenclaw, IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
Lily also placed courage and bravery above all, in my opinion. She publicly stood up to her housemates when she thought they were wrong. She stood up to her best friend and ended their friendship when she decided he'd crossed over the line. I think a Ravenclaw would have spent more time trying to understand both sides.
I think, in this case, overthinking it, and over-use of logic would be a Ravenclaw weakness. It suggests that a Ravenclaw could be persuaded to join Voldemort if the argument was persuasive enough, if someone was clever enough to present their case for the DEs being right well enough. A balance between logic and values is necessary. Seeing that there is a line is important. I don't think someone should try to logically understand and be supportive of the DE/bigot rationale.

Personally, I think all the House traits need to be tempered with an opposing trait. Being rational needs to be balanced with values. Courage needs to be balanced with common sense. Loyalty needs to be tempered with critical thinking - about exactly who or what one is loyal to and why. Ambition needs to be balanced with repsect for the rights of others.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post
Harry's almost sorting into Slytherin seemed to be based on the ability to speak to snakes and the fact that Both gryfindor and Slytherin share identical qualities, the only difference seems to be arrogance which was one of Harry's weakness. I think the main trouble was the parslemouth and the thirst to prove himself Vs. the head strong bravery that seemed to be in all gryfindors, Harry could have been in either house.
I don't think arrogance is limited to any particular House.


__________________

Pic by julvett at deviantart http://julvett.deviantart.com/gallery/2984632
"Relationships are like glass; sometimes it's better to leave them broken than to hurt yourself trying to put them back together." Anonymous
"Like this one time I sort of ran over this girl on her bike. It was the most traumatising event of my life and she’s trying to make it about her leg. Like my pain meant nothing." - Cordelia; Buffy the Vampire Slayer S1Ep11.
  #78  
Old June 12th, 2011, 4:12 pm
Quachett  Undisclosed.gif Quachett is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 3423 days
Posts: 143
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryDice View Post
I don't think Ravenclaws fought just so that knowledge and learning could be preserved. Cho fought because of Cedric, and there were probably plenty of Ravenclaws who were Muggleborn, or had Muggleborn family or friends.
My theory is based on general ravenclaws, Cho is a unique case, remember there were other ravenclaws tht fought tht did not have any personal grudges, Luna is the perfect example. besides They dont just have to fight for the preservation of knowledge, they also fought because they knew a great evil needed to be defeated, the idea of courage is simply based in non war time eras how it would manifest itself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryDice View Post
I don't think Hermione purused knowledge for its own sake - she was very competitive and had a fear of failure - she pursued knowledge because she wanted to be the best, because she didn't want to fail, because it might be useful to their work against Voldemort. Also, Hermione's priority wasn't her studies - "Books and cleverness! There are more important things, like friendship and bravery..." whereas as Luna quotes Rowena Ravenclaw "Wit beyond measure is man's greatest treasure" and it seems to be something she genuinely believes. Also, Hermione isn't open-minded enough to be a Ravenclaw, IMO.
Hermione's constant studying was not born out of fear of failure, it was born out of love of knowledge (the reason why she did all those extra subjects), her obsersive studying is what was born out of fear of failure. There multiple times hermione just read something for the sake of it, remember what she could smell in HBP in the pressence of that powerful love potion, partchment, sugesting the inherent need to study and pursue knowledge. I have seen people quoting the PS line "Books and cleverness! There are more important things, like friendship and bravery..." and there is no where in the book it actually says this is what hermione prioritiesed above all. She made an observation about harry's qualities she admired, she never said I want to be like tht, she just complimented him of those qualities period. Also the books never say you have to be open minded to be a ravenclaw, Luna was the only revanclaw shown to be open minded the rest never expressed anything either way and wit beyond measure seems to suggest prising logic and quick thinking not open mindedness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FurryDice View Post
I don't think arrogance is limited to any particular House.
I never said its limited to one house, I simply observed tht slytherins are the most arrogant of the houses, the trio all showed massive levels of arrogants at one point or another, Slytherins seem to do it almost all the time



Last edited by Quachett; June 12th, 2011 at 4:16 pm.
  #79  
Old June 23rd, 2011, 6:59 pm
Alicia6166  Female.gif Alicia6166 is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 3051 days
Location: England
Age: 24
Posts: 23
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post
I have seen people quoting the PS line "Books and cleverness! There are more important things, like friendship and bravery..." and there is no where in the book it actually says this is what hermione prioritiesed above all.
Yes, it does say that's what Hermione values above all. She is saying that friendship and bravery are more important the book smarts. That's why she says "There are MORE IMPORTANT things ..."


Quote:
Originally Posted by Quachett View Post
Both gryfindor and Slytherin share identical qualities, the only difference seems to be arrogance.
I don't quite agree with the latter part of that. I think both houses are rather prone to arrogance because they're very proud houses. I think Gryffindor is proud because of its nobility and chivalry. There's a lot of arrogance on James and Sirius's part in the Marauder's era.



On an unrelated note from this particular debate, why was Lockhart in Ravenclaw? That may just be in the films but it doesn't make sense to me at all. Surely he should be in Slytherin. He was very cunning and used "any means necessary to achieve [his] ends." He didn't seem to be a very gifted wizard and he seemed to value achievement more than wit, so I don't think it's a matter of priorities or Ravenclaw qualities overriding his Slytherin tendencies. Does anyone understand this?


__________________
Proud to have wit beyond measure!

"You haven't got a letter on yours," George observed. "I suppose she thinks you don't forget your name. But we're not stupid - we know we're called Gred and Forge."
  #80  
Old June 23rd, 2011, 7:55 pm
MerryLore's Avatar
MerryLore  Female.gif MerryLore is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 3058 days
Location: catagorizing Sev's books
Posts: 1,627
Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alicia6166 View Post
On an unrelated note from this particular debate, why was Lockhart in Ravenclaw? That may just be in the films but it doesn't make sense to me at all. Surely he should be in Slytherin. He was very cunning and used "any means necessary to achieve [his] ends." He didn't seem to be a very gifted wizard and he seemed to value achievement more than wit, so I don't think it's a matter of priorities or Ravenclaw qualities overriding his Slytherin tendencies. Does anyone understand this?
He wrote books And this is the only explanation I have.....


__________________
avatar by me and WB, banner by Dark_Disciple

When I'm 80 years old and sitting in my rocking chair, I'll be reading Harry Potter.
My family will say to me, “After all this time?”
And I will say, “Always.”
- source unknown
 
Go Back  Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Post DH References

Bookmarks

Tags
character analysis, ravenclaw house


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 1:59 am.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Original content is Copyright © MMII - MMVIII, CoSForums.com. All Rights Reserved.
Other content (posts, images, etc) is Copyright © its respective owners.