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Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4



 
 
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  #81  
Old December 23rd, 2007, 7:47 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

Sirius seems a bit jealous, I think, of the family festivities at Grimmauld Place when Arthur comes back. I know he is putting on a face because he doesn't want to ruin anyone's fun, because he is secretly sad that Harry and the gang are leaving, but I honestly think there was a hint in there of something missed -- perhaps from his own childhood, perhaps of the family he never had as an adult -- and he seems almost awkward in the face of this. I was, frankly, surprised that they developed this a bit in the OotP film. Don't you see a little bit of distance there? I don't think it is completely due to his respect of their own celebrations, either.


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  #82  
Old December 23rd, 2007, 10:45 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Sirius seems a bit jealous, I think, of the family festivities at Grimmauld Place when Arthur comes back. I know he is putting on a face because he doesn't want to ruin anyone's fun, because he is secretly sad that Harry and the gang are leaving, but I honestly think there was a hint in there of something missed -- perhaps from his own childhood, perhaps of the family he never had as an adult -- and he seems almost awkward in the face of this. I was, frankly, surprised that they developed this a bit in the OotP film. Don't you see a little bit of distance there? I don't think it is completely due to his respect of their own celebrations, either.
Yeah I re read this sceen and I kind of get that feel to. Sirius at the most maybe had three or four christmases with James includeing the years he ran away and it must have been hard for him to but on a brave face when Arthur came back. Poor Sirius I bet when they left he was isolated and forced to remember all he had lost.


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  #83  
Old December 24th, 2007, 5:49 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by Kimagine View Post
Sirius seems a bit jealous, I think, of the family festivities at Grimmauld Place when Arthur comes back. I know he is putting on a face because he doesn't want to ruin anyone's fun, because he is secretly sad that Harry and the gang are leaving, but I honestly think there was a hint in there of something missed -- perhaps from his own childhood, perhaps of the family he never had as an adult -- and he seems almost awkward in the face of this. I was, frankly, surprised that they developed this a bit in the OotP film. Don't you see a little bit of distance there? I don't think it is completely due to his respect of their own celebrations, either.
That's a great point! While I do think that most of Sirius' bitterness came from Harry's departures to Hogwarts, I like the idea about Sirius' lack of holiday festivities.

He seemed really enthusiastic in OotP when the house was full. How many good Christmases did he actually have? He disliked his family for a while, so I don't think he went there for Christmas - he probably chose to stay with James or at Hogwarts. Sirius had a few good holidays between the time he ran away from home and Lily and James' deaths, though. But how about after that? He was in Azkaban for twelve years. I don't think dementors handed out candy canes, so it must have been a very grim place to be during the holidays. Even after Sirius broke out of Azkaban, he was isolated from the world in Harry's third year (no one knew that Sirius was innocent except Crookshanks, Pettigrew, and Voldemort, I assume). Even after Harry found out he was innocent, he was in a cave living off rats.

The one in OotP made him really happy, and I'm glad since that was his last one.


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  #84  
Old December 24th, 2007, 3:57 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by Kimagine View Post
Sirius seems a bit jealous, I think, of the family festivities at Grimmauld Place when Arthur comes back. I know he is putting on a face because he doesn't want to ruin anyone's fun, because he is secretly sad that Harry and the gang are leaving, but I honestly think there was a hint in there of something missed -- perhaps from his own childhood, perhaps of the family he never had as an adult -- and he seems almost awkward in the face of this.
That makes sense, considering that Sirius never had a family who truly accepted him and loved him unconditionally - almost like Harry at the Dursleys. I get the feeling that Sirius' family's Christmas celebrations probably weren't like the Weasley's celebrations. It does stand to reason he might have been a bit jealous that they were able to share in a family celebration like that, which is something he never had.

Sirius and Harry are alike in a lot of ways, which makes it so natural for Sirius to be Harry's godfather. Both had crummy childhoods living with crummy families (obviously not counting the time Harry had with his parents before they were killed), both Harry and Sirius have similar personalities (to a degree) - they're both somewhat impulsive. And both have a very strong belief system and are willing to fight (and die) for what they believe in.


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  #85  
Old December 24th, 2007, 4:18 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimagine View Post
Sirius seems a bit jealous, I think, of the family festivities at Grimmauld Place when Arthur comes back. I know he is putting on a face because he doesn't want to ruin anyone's fun, because he is secretly sad that Harry and the gang are leaving, but I honestly think there was a hint in there of something missed -- perhaps from his own childhood, perhaps of the family he never had as an adult -- and he seems almost awkward in the face of this. I was, frankly, surprised that they developed this a bit in the OotP film. Don't you see a little bit of distance there? I don't think it is completely due to his respect of their own celebrations, either.
I agree with your analysis...
I think that your analysis can be broken into two parts;
1] Sirius before Azkaban
2] Sirius after Azkaban

And then connecting the dots. There is also the theory that maybe Sirius considers Harry to be James, even though he vehemently denies it in OOTP...I think Hermione's take on Sirius before starting DA club is very insightful and without prejudice...But again Hermione does not know Sirius Pre Azkaban...I think Remus would be the best judge as to Sirius' feeling albeit biased...


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  #86  
Old December 24th, 2007, 8:10 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan View Post
That makes sense, considering that Sirius never had a family who truly accepted him and loved him unconditionally - almost like Harry at the Dursleys. I get the feeling that Sirius' family's Christmas celebrations probably weren't like the Weasley's celebrations. It does stand to reason he might have been a bit jealous that they were able to share in a family celebration like that, which is something he never had.

Sirius and Harry are alike in a lot of ways, which makes it so natural for Sirius to be Harry's godfather. Both had crummy childhoods living with crummy families (obviously not counting the time Harry had with his parents before they were killed), both Harry and Sirius have similar personalities (to a degree) - they're both somewhat impulsive. And both have a very strong belief system and are willing to fight (and die) for what they believe in.
That is a very perceptive take on the Sirius - Harry relationship. It makes perfectly good sense because Sirius and James were such good friends, they likely had a lot in common and Harry is much like his dad. But the aspects you brought out are very Sirius, such as the impetuousness, the willingness to be reckless when they feel it is necessary and the unwavering loyalty - the last they share with James as well. It was a natural choice, I agree.


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  #87  
Old December 28th, 2007, 5:09 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by Kimagine View Post
He also never really felt a need to impress people -- he seemed very self-assured and comfortable in his (good-looking) skin. He seems to really have a sense of the value of a person based on their character -- one would think that he would be shallow, being good-looking, a pure-blood and wealthy besides. Yet he accepts Remus as one of his best friends, and rejects the philosophy of racial hatred his family espoused.
I agree with you one hundred percent!!!! He could have chosen to rebel against a hundred different things if his only motive was to get his mum mad at him but he chose a cause and stuck to it because he believed it and lived it and that makes him more of a hero than a rebel


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  #88  
Old December 28th, 2007, 7:15 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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He also never really felt a need to impress people -- he seemed very self-assured and comfortable in his (good-looking) skin. He seems to really have a sense of the value of a person based on their character -- one would think that he would be shallow, being good-looking, a pure-blood and wealthy besides. Yet he accepts Remus as one of his best friends, and rejects the philosophy of racial hatred his family espoused.
Very intresting thought. Sirius was born into plivalage in every way so it took extra strenght to rebel against everything he'd ever know in life. You can kind of see in the Princes Tale when he and James are talking on the train that Sirius doesn't like his family and I find it remarkabel that even at a small age he knew the ideas of his parents were wrong. Most people have trouble coming to terms with that even in adult hood.


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  #89  
Old December 29th, 2007, 2:45 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

Well it is official...Harry's first born son is none other than James Sirius Potter. I believe that adds support for our past discussions on what Harry thought of Sirius as a godfather. Reckless, sure, but also compassionate and full of love and loyalty for his godson. JKR revealed that little James middle name was Sirius in a Times article, Dec 29, 2007.

Weasley family tree for the next generation - Revealed!


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  #90  
Old December 29th, 2007, 4:39 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy View Post
Well it is official...Harry's first born son is none other than James Sirius Potter. I believe that adds support for our past discussions on what Harry thought of Sirius as a godfather. Reckless, sure, but also compassionate and full of love and loyalty for his godson. JKR revealed that little James middle name was Sirius in a Times article, Dec 29, 2007.

Weasley family tree for the next generation - Revealed!
I just screamed "YES!" This made my day. It doesn't surprise me, though. He loved Sirius so dearly that it would have been ridiculous for him to not honour him as he did so many others. And it works nicely considering Sirius was a father figure to Harry, and the closest possible person to James - so his first child's full name honours not only his real father, but his godfather.

I've said it before, but man that kid will be great fun. James and Sirius in one - that's just asking for trouble.


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  #91  
Old December 29th, 2007, 8:50 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

So Harry honoured Sirius' memory! I'm glad that he not only appreciates his enemies but also his godfather and what he represented. Sirius was the link to his parents and although he was rash and always under the influence of Azkaban, he did his best to be there for Harry.


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Old December 29th, 2007, 11:01 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by LilyDreamsOn View Post
I just screamed "YES!" This made my day. It doesn't surprise me, though. He loved Sirius so dearly that it would have been ridiculous for him to not honour him as he did so many others. And it works nicely considering Sirius was a father figure to Harry, and the closest possible person to James - so his first child's full name honours not only his real father, but his godfather.

I've said it before, but man that kid will be great fun. James and Sirius in one - that's just asking for trouble.
Haha so did I! I am so excited, it just seems so appropriate. I was really hoping that one of his children would be named after Sirius. Sirius may not have been the perfect godfather, but he loved Harry unconditionally and he died in an effort to protect him and his beliefs. In my opinion, he was a wonderful man.

But you are right... that kid is going to cause a LOT of trouble at Hogwarts!


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  #93  
Old December 29th, 2007, 7:38 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

I am happy about this as well. I must say I was shocked it wasn't mentioned in the Epilogue but I'm glad Harry (or Jo?) did Sirius's memory justice.

Harry being a godfather himself, I think he would appreciate what Sirius did for him even more now.


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Old December 30th, 2007, 9:40 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

Well, I am absolutely thrilled! Sirius may have died, but his lovely name will live on, united forever with the name of the person he loved beyond all others in James Sirius Potter!

I thought for sure that Harry had to name a child after Sirius, the man who loved him so much, who ate rats and lived in caves for him, who escaped prison for him, who died trying to protect him. Sirius' time in Harry's life was so fleeting, but he was always there for Harry, a loving and devoted godfather, and I was so happy to see Harry honor him by naming a his firstborn son after him.

James II (A bright, mischievious prankster if I ever saw one) certainly seems to be living up to his name...


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Old December 30th, 2007, 11:58 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

This is the best news I have had in a long time!!!!!!! James SIRIUS Potter is the best name ever!!!!!!! I am glad Harry did not forget about his godfather and I am glad he honored him as well.... This is the best news for every Sirius Black fan. I am glad that JK confirmed what most of us already knew but could never prove without canon....


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  #96  
Old December 31st, 2007, 9:13 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by missbrunettgirl View Post
Very intresting thought. Sirius was born into plivalage in every way so it took extra strenght to rebel against everything he'd ever know in life. You can kind of see in the Princes Tale when he and James are talking on the train that Sirius doesn't like his family and I find it remarkabel that even at a small age he knew the ideas of his parents were wrong. Most people have trouble coming to terms with that even in adult hood.
I agree, but I don't think Sirius was rebeling against the wealth part. . However, it is also very likely that his parents were not as open handed with Sirius as they were with his brother due to his contrary attitude. I figure things got especially difficult when Bella came around to visit or other members of the family who thought as his parents did. I could imagine Sirius was 'round tabled' at times, defending his thoughts before an entire group. It is understandable that he would finally just run away; there was likely never any give and take over the issues.


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Old December 31st, 2007, 9:27 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy View Post
I agree, but I don't think Sirius was rebeling against the wealth part. . However, it is also very likely that his parents were not as open handed with Sirius as they were with his brother due to his contrary attitude. I figure things got especially difficult when Bella came around to visit or other members of the family who thought as his parents did. I could imagine Sirius was 'round tabled' at times, defending his thoughts before an entire group. It is understandable that he would finally just run away; there was likely never any give and take over the issues.
Yes, knowing Sirius and knowing he was a Gryffindor makes it hard to believe he didn't leave sooner...*smirk*

I was really creeped out the other day when my friend told me that the whole 'hate' thing with Sirius/Snape/James was unresolved sexual tension... *shudders*

~WendyPotter


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Old January 1st, 2008, 7:33 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

I shudder with you as well Wendy... Even I don't see Sirius rebelling against the money, in fact I think he liked the fact he was rich and could get anything he wanted. It was the pure blood mania stuff that drove him over the edge. I also think he was probably physically abused or punished as a child and that is why he finally had had enough and ran away from his house just like Harry did in the second and third book...


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Old January 1st, 2008, 9:08 am
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by padfootrules View Post
I shudder with you as well Wendy... Even I don't see Sirius rebelling against the money, in fact I think he liked the fact he was rich and could get anything he wanted. It was the pure blood mania stuff that drove him over the edge. I also think he was probably physically abused or punished as a child and that is why he finally had had enough and ran away from his house just like Harry did in the second and third book...
I agree I don't think Sirius had a problem being rich... he had a problem with his parents' ideals. That is an interesting hypothesis you brought up there... We have enough evidence to by to prove that Sirius was very likely mistreated even abused emotionally by his family. Something must have happened when he was sixteen that made him finally leave. He left his inheritance behind, he left his family behind and if he had waited one more year then he would have not lost much and he could have walked away from his family with no repercussions. Which leads me to believe that something happened that year that was the final straw as far as Sirius was concerned.


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  #100  
Old January 1st, 2008, 9:15 pm
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Re: Sirius Black: Character Analysis v.4

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I agree, but I don't think Sirius was rebeling against the wealth part.
Yeah I definatly don't think that was a problem for him I just think that it took even more courage to rebel against all that and give it all up.


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