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Downton Abbey - contains spoilers for season 4



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  #101  
Old September 18th, 2012, 6:29 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

I really liked this episode!

Matthew and Mary's conflict was down to difference of character. She's pragmatic and he's idealist. So I really liked that their fight was down to that instead of a contrived exterior conflict being forced on them.

However, this show is struggling with setting plot lines up. Usually conflict appears out of nowhere and then disappears just as quickly after having brought some agony to the characters. Cue Cora's money being invested in the railway shares and Sybil's never-heard-of ex suitor being a moustache twirling old boy with a convenient portable drug store.

I wish they'd do something with Bates and Anna. I cannot stand their storyline anymore.

Mary's wedding dress was lovely, the whole wedding scene was.


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  #102  
Old September 18th, 2012, 3:55 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

I watched all of the first and second series this past weekend and immediately found the new episode online yesterday when I found out the new series just started. LOVE, love, love this show.

Maggie Smith and Shirley MacLaine are perfection together. Mary and Matthew...ugh, I can't even stand how much I love them.


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  #103  
Old September 18th, 2012, 4:21 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

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Originally Posted by decarus View Post
True.

Spoiler: show
But i could see them losing the house for a time for whatever reason. Hopefully Matthew will just come around or something will happen that will fix it otherwise. Another bit of money from Cora's family or something.
That's partly what I suspect might happen, having Cora's mother enter the picture like she has. It's awfully convenient that in the same week Lord Grantham discovers Cora's fortune has been lost to bad investments her rich mother turns up.

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Spoiler: show
In some ways i hope that Matthew sticks to his guns, but another part of me agrees with Mary. I mean to lose their how future and for Mary the loss is huge, for her and her family, even though i am not sure if Matthew really understands it. We will see.
I see a major conflict arising for them based solely off of one line from the premier episodes: when Matthew says to Molesley, "I mean to live more simply." Dude, do you know who you just married? "Simple" is not a word Mary understands.

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Originally Posted by Moriath View Post
Matthew and Mary's conflict was down to difference of character. She's pragmatic and he's idealist. So I really liked that their fight was down to that instead of a contrived exterior conflict being forced on them.
I agree, I liked that too, but I also feel like to a certain extent their other conflicts have arisen out of their characters, too. I mean, Mary's engagement to that awful Richard Carlisle stemmed from her fear that she would never marry because she ruined herself so she ended up choosing a modern man who didn't look down on her for her past indiscretion. (Instead, he used it to blackmail her. )

Quote:
However, this show is struggling with setting plot lines up. Usually conflict appears out of nowhere and then disappears just as quickly after having brought some agony to the characters. Cue Cora's money being invested in the railway shares and Sybil's never-heard-of ex suitor being a moustache twirling old boy with a convenient portable drug store.
As much as it pains me to agree I have to. As I said above, I suspect there will be a storyline to do with Matthew and Mary struggling to agree on a lifestyle since Matthew apparently has reverted back to his season one, episode one views on simple living without servants. Mary ain't gonna be happy about that! She's a very traditional, well-to-do society girl who can't even braid her own hair to go to bed. I see issues.

Also, as mentioned above, the convenience of Cora's fortune being lost and her mother turning up so soon after that realization seemed a little too convenient but whatchagonnado? The Christmas episode kind of tied up too many loose ends to leave many open storyline to continue from season two; Mary and Matthew were sorted out in the Christmas episode, Richard Carlisle was aufed in the Christmas episode, Bates' trial was held in the christmas episode, Sybil and Brason's runaway marriage and now pregnancy was in the Christmas episode... Too much was wrapped up in that episode so this episode was bound to feel a little forced simply because of the contrivance of having to set up this season's problems.

The one and almost the only plot line I have had a problem with was Lord Grantham's adulterous interest in that maid; that seemed out of character for him and seemed to come out of nowhere and flit off into nowhere after it was over. I'll take these semi-forced introductions of problems so long as they're in-character, please don't give us any more of those kinds of storylines.

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I wish they'd do something with Bates and Anna. I cannot stand their storyline anymore.
Oh, thank you! I'm not the only one! I feel so bad because Anna and Bates were right up there with Mary and Matthew for me in season one and two! Their romance was so sweet and dramatic and... victorian! They lived in the same house, saw each other every day, knew they loved each other but couldn't so much as hold hands... Frankly, the strength of this show is the stuff that happens at Downton Abbey so when the show goes somewhere else (to the trenches, to the courtroom, to the prison, and :shiver: if it follows Sybil and Branson back to Ireland) it looses its charm and interest for me. The show is called Downton Abbey. Keep the action at Downton as much as humanly possible!

Quote:
Mary's wedding dress was lovely, the whole wedding scene was.
I was hoping to really love Mary's wedding dress but then I realized I'm not a huge fan of many 1920's fashions; I was kind of crossing my fingers she would have a wedding dress circa 1910-1912 styles, more like the fashions in season one. But that's just my personal taste. She did look lovely, though, and the wedding was beautiful. Oh, to live in a time when the whole village turns out for your wedding like that!! -- wait... that happened for Will and Kate... never mind...

I am looking forward to Mary and Matthew's honeymoon in the next episode, though! I loved Matthew's line when he said how awkward he was going to feel taking Mary up to bed right in front of her father! yeah, awkward is the right word!


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  #104  
Old September 18th, 2012, 11:13 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

Yeah when Lord Grantham first got the phone call i thought the maid he hooked up with was pregnant. I totally agree that that storyline seemed out of character because he seems to actually love his wife.

The crowd following Mary to the church totally made me think of Will and Kate.


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  #105  
Old September 25th, 2012, 2:26 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

Poor Mrs. Hughes


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  #106  
Old September 25th, 2012, 3:46 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

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Poor Mrs. Hughes
I liked her character from the start, I hope she's okay!

I still find it interesting how O'Brien and Thomas are now at odds and working against each other; I don't know who to agree with on the topic of O'Brien's nephew! On the one hand, it's great that O'Brien got him the job and that he seems to be doing well at Downton, on the other hand, is she pushing him into the position in order to fulfill her own ambitions? And Thomas makes a compelling, if mean, argument that you shouldn't, as he says, run before you walk (or walk before you crawl? I can't remember his exact wording). At the same time, though, Thomas's pettiness about giving him the wrong cleaner to fix Matthew's tails cements him as the villain over O'Brien. Never thought I'd say those words!

I also like the idea of the grandmother being the one to push the family into the modern age of the 1920's.


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  #107  
Old September 26th, 2012, 2:28 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

I hate Thomas (well I hate O'Brien too, but not as much as Thomas) so I didn't mind seeing him get what he deserved in this episode. O'Brien's relationship with her nephew makes her a little more likeable, so I do think Thomas is the "main villain" now. I do still wonder who hid Lord Grantham's shirts though.

I really do wish that progress would be made with Bates. I won't be able to tolerate if he's not free soon. Hopefully the path that Anna is going down right now proves fruitful. If the season is only 7 episodes like in the past we need to move forward at a faster pace.

Spoilers:
Spoiler: show
I read that there will be a death mid-season, and I really hope it isn't Mrs. Hughes.


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  #108  
Old September 26th, 2012, 3:29 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

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I do still wonder who hid Lord Grantham's shirts though.
... Wasn't it O'Brien? When American Granny's maid saw her coming out into the hall she was carrying a stack of what looked like white shirts and that's how she knew where the shirts came from.


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  #109  
Old September 26th, 2012, 4:20 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

It's totally possible that I missed it (I watched the latest ep while on NyQuil for a cold ) I suspected O'Brien, but I didn't think the obvious choice would be the correct one.


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  #110  
Old September 26th, 2012, 4:39 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

It was O'brien who hid the shirts. Mrs. Levinson's maid saw her hiding them and told Obrien's nephew.

I too hope that the death mid season isn't a result from Mrs Hughes. It will probably be someone unexpected. According to the Downton twitter feed, Anna might make a breakthrough with helping prove Bates innocence. I wonder though what they will do with his character once he is out. Certainly, Thomas won't be ousted out of his position. It would greatly amuse me if he would become Butler, but that would mean Carson would be out of the picture, and I rather like Carson as a character.

I wonder where the money will come from. According to Season Preview, there is an additional footman, maid, and kitchen maid hired. I can't see Grantham hiring more people given his current situation, so something must happen. I wonder if Cora's brother may send the money.


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  #111  
Old September 26th, 2012, 4:54 am
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Re: Downton Abbey

I certainly hope that if Bates returns to Downton he immediately kicks Thomas out of the valet spot. That's probably what I am looking forward to most. (I told you, I hate Thomas )


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  #112  
Old September 26th, 2012, 12:51 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

Evil speculation by me and my colleagues on Bates and Anna:

Spoiler: show
Is nobody else intrigued by the flash of Dark!Violent!Bates we saw, turning on his cellmate in prison? That was rather ... awesome.

What if he really did murder his ex-wife? There really aren't any other serious contenders, are there? He is an obvious suspect, and if he did actually bump her off, that would make this storyline more plausible.

And interesting.

Told you it was evil!


Am I the only one who wants to offer Lady Sybil a bag of throat pastilles, by the way? Yes, dear, your voice is so husky.

I love Matthew/Mary.

As ever, Maggie Smith rules, and I love Shirley Maclaine's delicious sparring with the Dowager of Snark. I guess the point of her character is to drag the family, kicking and screaming, into the 1920s!

I loved Branson's Irish Republican rant at the dinner table in the first ep. Hilarious that the family forgave him because that Rotten Blighter had spiked his drink with an unspecified drug. That's Downton politics for ya!

Nothing ever came of Thomas and O'Brien's conspiracy of darkly glaring together, did it? Just as well, really. I enjoy O'Brien's glowering and it's fun watching her get one up on Thomas. She's obviously bored of him.


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  #113  
Old September 26th, 2012, 3:51 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pearl_Took View Post
Evil speculation by me and my colleagues on Bates and Anna:

Spoiler: show
Is nobody else intrigued by the flash of Dark!Violent!Bates we saw, turning on his cellmate in prison? That was rather ... awesome.

What if he really did murder his ex-wife? There really aren't any other serious contenders, are there? He is an obvious suspect, and if he did actually bump her off, that would make this storyline more plausible.

And interesting.

Told you it was evil!
I've been wondering that too.

Spoiler: show
I suspect that the death won't be Mrs. Hughs since the entire audience is watching her; I suspect that they'll play it up like she's dying and at the last minute pull a switcheroo and someone else will die.

As for Bates actually killing his wife... I'm torn. On the one hand, he seems to have turned over a new leaf in life and wouldn't want to do anything that jeapordized his being with Anna like that. On the other hand it's bein made pretty clear that he does have a temper and he does have a dangerous side and he did seem to really hate Vera... All I'm hoping for is that he's released soon; I don't like the prison sequences. As I said before, this show suffers when taken away from Downton and the village.


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  #114  
Old September 26th, 2012, 6:49 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

I not going to put this in spoiler tags as its not a spoiler: but I don't think Bates killed Vera. I think the "flash of anger" and "confession" we saw were probably just him trying to scare his cell mate. Prison is a horrid place and he needs to let his cell mate know he means business.


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  #115  
Old September 26th, 2012, 6:52 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

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I not going to put this in spoiler tags as its not a spoiler: but I don't think Bates killed Vera. I think the "flash of anger" and "confession" we saw were probably just him trying to scare his cell mate. Prison is a horrid place and he needs to let his cell mate know he means business.
I always thought Vera framed him and committed suicide because she didn't think she had anything left.


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  #116  
Old September 26th, 2012, 9:44 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

I think that Bates might get killed in prison or kill someone in prison and then be hanged. I have also wondered at times whether or not he actually killed his wife. It just seems to make sense in a lot of ways.


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  #117  
Old September 26th, 2012, 9:54 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

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I think that Bates might get killed in prison or kill someone in prison and then be hanged. I have also wondered at times whether or not he actually killed his wife. It just seems to make sense in a lot of ways.
I thought this as well, particularly that he will get killed in prison. The other part of me, however thinks that this might be a red herring, but I can't be for sure.


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  #118  
Old September 26th, 2012, 10:41 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

Well, okay, if we're lettin' loose our personal interpretation of the Bates/Vera situation, when it first happened I thought Vera committed suicide but wanted to take Bates down with her by framing him. That almost doesn't make sense though since Bates was offering her all the money he had in the world to buy a divorce from her and she still wouldn't give it to him; it seems she hated Bates down to her bones for some reason and wanted to control him even more than she wanted his money. It kind of doesn't make much sense that she would kill herself as a way to control him or ruin his life unless she really truly honestly had no reason to live herself. I can't remember what happened with Bates's inheritance so I can't remember whether she committed suicide under the impression that she now had all that money or not...

Time to rewatch last season?


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  #119  
Old September 26th, 2012, 11:02 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

I've heard a lot of speculation that it was Sir Richard Carlisle who killed Vera, but as we haven't seen him this season, maybe that won't be true. Or does anyone know if Iain Glenn is supposed to come back this season?

And youuu guyyssss hasn't enough bad stuff already happened to Bates! Stop talking about worse things!


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  #120  
Old September 27th, 2012, 5:05 pm
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Re: Downton Abbey

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And youuu guyyssss hasn't enough bad stuff already happened to Bates! Stop talking about worse things!
You can't have drama without bad things happening!


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