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Nagini: Character Analysis



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  #141  
Old August 3rd, 2011, 4:18 am
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

1. Did the bit of Voldemort's soul in Nagini make her more human? We've seen that she was able to impersonate a human being - could an ordinary snake have done that even to a parselmouth?

I think it did. If we think about Tom Riddle's diary having part of Voldemort's soul and it was an inanimate object that talked to people it definitely had to have a similar possibly more powerful effect on Nagini.

2. Nagini was Voldemort's pet prior to becoming a horcrux. Do you think she was fond of him? Did she do his bidding willingly?

She is an animal and they have loyalty to people that treat them well and take care of them. I think she was really fond of him, why else would she stick around if she did have some kind of connection with him? Just as a dog will protect it's owner I think Nagini did the same for Voldemort, except of course Nagini is more like a magical dog

3. We've seen Nagini have a conscious thought process when she tells herself to hold Harry in Godric's Hollow. Is this the result of being a horcrux?

I think all animals have a conscious thought process in the HP world. The snake in PS/SS knew it wanted out of the exhibit. I think Nagini may have a more complex thought process but she is not the only creature to have one.

4. Is Nagini ultimately evil? Ultimately innocent? What standards can we hold her to?

I don't think she was evil. Nor innocent. Her goal was to protect and obey her owner just like most "pets" who are treated well.


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  #142  
Old August 14th, 2011, 5:35 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

It was asked on the Snape death thread if, since Nagini killed Snape, would that not make her the master of the Elder Wand?

Well, since Snape wasn't the master, Draco was, and then Harry disarmed Draco, so Harry actually was, no.

But - it's still a great question, I think. Could Nagini be the master of the Elder Wand? Was she an ordinary snake? She was obviously sentient.

Myself, I'm thinking that she was intelligent, as far as snakes go, but she also held a piece of Voldemort's soul, and was an extension of him. And I see nowhere in canon where an animal owns a wand. Magical creatures have their own special forms of magic.


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  #143  
Old August 14th, 2011, 6:06 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by MerryLore View Post
It was asked on the Snape death thread if, since Nagini killed Snape, would that not make her the master of the Elder Wand?

Well, since Snape wasn't the master, Draco was, and then Harry disarmed Draco, so Harry actually was, no.

But - it's still a great question, I think. Could Nagini be the master of the Elder Wand? Was she an ordinary snake? She was obviously sentient.

Myself, I'm thinking that she was intelligent, as far as snakes go, but she also held a piece of Voldemort's soul, and was an extension of him. And I see nowhere in canon where an animal owns a wand. Magical creatures have their own special forms of magic.
But we also see Griphook argue with Ron about how wizards are unwilling to share what they know about wand lore, with at least Goblins, for fear that they may be able to use it to extend their own powers. So wand-holder or not, other creatures want to know more or posses wands, but wizards won't let them. If snakes can speak their own spells, wands could be used if they have magical ability to come to bear. In the case of a normal snake, no. But in the specific case of Nagini, a snake with a piece of wizard soul in it, I believe It could be possible.


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  #144  
Old August 14th, 2011, 6:18 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

Hmm... Nagini is an interesting well, I couldn't say charactar because I don't think that describes her. She may be intelligent, but it may just be the Voldie in her. Major what if moment: What if Nagini is the snake that Harry set loose in SS/PS?


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  #145  
Old August 14th, 2011, 6:32 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

Nagini was a surprisingly intelligent snake, but I think that part of the reason her thought process seemed so complex was because she had a piece of Voldemort's soul within her. But nevertheless, she was capable to making decisions that would benefit her master.


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  #146  
Old August 14th, 2011, 11:16 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

1. Did the bit of Voldemort's soul in Nagini make her more human? We've seen that she was able to impersonate a human being - could an ordinary snake have done that even to a parselmouth?
Voldemort's piece of soul certainly had influence on how Nagini could act. She seems almost able to comprehend human thought. I do not think that a snake could do that with anyone without the magic Voldy put in her.

2. Nagini was Voldemort's pet prior to becoming a horcrux. Do you think she was fond of him? Did she do his bidding willingly?
Pet? Not exactly. Familiar? Yes. Its hard to say if she would have been fond of Voldy since shes an animal. It seems she was actually, since he could speak her language (literally) and they could understand each other on a basic level. By doing his bidding, she was rewarded with the most basic desire animals have: food. Most animals are attached to those who provide such things.


3. We've seen Nagini have a conscious thought process when she tells herself to hold Harry in Godric's Hollow. Is this the result of being a horcrux?
I think so because it was more or less Voldy instructing her to hold Harry instead of kill. She doesnt "tell herself" to do that. The connection via horcrux between her and Voldy allow this. Animals do have conscious thought. Well most of them do. In that scenario, she was obeying her master. She was intelligent enough to be able to do this.

4. Is Nagini ultimately evil? Ultimately innocent? What standards can we hold her to?
Animals by nature are not inherently evil. Animals cannot comprehend between good and evil. She is a snake and she is more or less not aware of these sorts of disambiguations. Try asking your dog if he believes in god and note the response you will get. (A cocked head with a look of "huh?" Ive actually done that before.) Animals do tend to know whats "wrong" when their master trains them. "Dont do that! BAD DOG!" Or in Nagini's case, snake. So since she belongs to Voldy and has a piece of him in her, she would only know one side of things and its doubtful she could be conscious of the other side of things.


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  #147  
Old August 14th, 2011, 11:38 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by SimplyMe View Post
Hmm... Nagini is an interesting well, I couldn't say charactar because I don't think that describes her. She may be intelligent, but it may just be the Voldie in her. Major what if moment: What if Nagini is the snake that Harry set loose in SS/PS?
I read some "interview" with JK Rowling that said this was true, but apparently that interview was a fake, since the HP wikia says the following:
Quote:
There was a rumour that Nagini was the snake Harry released from the zoo in Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone. This was proven false, as Nagini is some type of viper while the snake in the zoo was a boa constrictor. Furthermore, the snake was given a male voice in the film, while Nagini is female.
Would've been a cool irony though!


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  #148  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:14 am
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

Going on this whole Harry letting Nagini loose in the first book. There are many similarities. Well, really just one. The are both boa constrictors (in my opinion). So that is a pretty big coincidence for the HP series, and as I've definitely learned there is no such thing as a coincidence with JKR. It really would be cool/freaky/ironic/awesome if this was the case, whether intended or not.

I don't think it is ever mentioned in the books, although I'll have to give them a thorough review soon, what type of snake nagini is. I assume boa because it makes reference to her being massive and giant. And going by the movies probably isn't the best way to tell (CGI, etc.).



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  #149  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:58 am
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

I personally think it would be kind of tragic if the snake Harry let loose ended up becoming Nagini. I don't know why, but I really hate to think of that snake being freed only to become Voldemort's pet/familiar/slave/horcrux and compelled to do his bidding.

I do hope we ultimately find out more about Nagini's background when Pottermore gets to GoF.


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  #150  
Old November 17th, 2011, 1:10 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

I have to disagree here. From what we know about nagini-- she was made a horcrux by Voldemort who likely used the murder of Bertha Jorkins to create her ...and just look at the manner in which he controls her and trusts her... This gives me the feeling that Voldemort had Nagini for quite a while before he made her into his 6th (or 7th depending on how you view it) horcrux.

As for the snake in the Zoo in book one... My impression was that this was an older, male snake that was kept in captivity his whole life before Harry communicated with/released him. I don't see how this snake could be Nagini? They are -- in my eyes having read all the books several times-- completely seperate characters and though both significant in their own unique way (obviously, Nagini more so) they are not the same snake or even the same sex or species...

Someone mentioned that Nagini is a Boa Constrictor like the snake in the zoo- this is incorrect- I don't think this could be possible because although Nagini is large, we know she has enormous fangs and that her bite is extremely poisonous. Boa Constrictors, while large, are not poisonous and do not have extremely large fangs or a deadly bite. The snakes way of getting food is by wrapping themselves tightly around their prey, hence constrictor, then eating them after they die... Personally I always pictured her (Nagini) being an exotic and obviously deadly serpent that Voldemort probably found, was fascinated by, and in time decided to keep as his pet/protector while he was somewhere in Albania.


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  #151  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:05 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

I would have to agree actually. I have looked into it much further. Nagini's head shape (at least in the movies) is more consistent with that of a venomous snake and not a constrictor. However, maybe we can say that she had been changed by Voldemort or was affected by him over her time spent wtih him, making her a unique snake unlike any others.

Oh well, would have been cool though!


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  #152  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:16 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

She had a Diamond-shape pattern on her body, so I whought she was a Diamondback which lived in hot dry climates. Except England was neither.


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  #153  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:36 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

I was researching after reading this thread and found some interesting info and I wonder what you all might think...

I was thinking about when Voldemort could have possibly come across a snake like Nagini... and I kept thinking Albania, since he spent so much time there in exile particular in the forests. Well I read about a large and lethal albanian snake called an Adder. The description is exactly like Nagini is described in the book--extremely large in overall size and forest dwelling, it's markings, longer fangs than most venomous snakes (we know her long fangs in particular were mentioned in the attacks she made throughout the books) and the most deadly of all Adders due to its quick striking ability is called... a DEATH ADDER. Death Adder... Death Eater? And we know both Nagini and the "Death Eaters" were both introduced for the very first time in the whole series in The Goblet of Fire. We knew Voldemort had followers but they were only called Death Eaters for the first time in GoF. I think its more likely that the snake and the name of Voldemorts followers are interrelated than it is that the Boa Constrictor from the Zoo became Nagini. I love these theories though!!


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  #154  
Old November 17th, 2011, 4:47 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

that's for the background info. Do Death Adders eat their prey?

In HBP, we learn that Voldemort's followers were called DE's. That's what Dumbledore told him when Voldemort came to ask for a teaching postion. While we might not have heard of the DE's until GOF, Voldemort had already named his followers. And of course, In Snape's Worse Memory, Lily told Snape that he wanted to join Voldemort's followers, DE's.
Snape didn't deny it.


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  #155  
Old November 17th, 2011, 5:11 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by merrymarge View Post
that's for the background info. Do Death Adders eat their prey?

In HBP, we learn that Voldemort's followers were called DE's. That's what Dumbledore told him when Voldemort came to ask for a teaching postion. While we might not have heard of the DE's until GOF, Voldemort had already named his followers. And of course, In Snape's Worse Memory, Lily told Snape that he wanted to join Voldemort's followers, DE's.
Snape didn't deny it.

I understand your reasoning but HBP was obviously written after GoF so we don't really have any basis to say that JKR knew what she wanted to call the Death Eaters before GoF. Because they talk about past memories in HBP which obviously happend before the story in GoF and they use the term Death Eaters in those memories, I see how you might think that but there is no telling either way besides when the term is actually used first, which was not before GoF.

I just thought Death Adder sounded so much like Death Eater (very creepy), and since JKR obviously had to research snakes with large fangs that are native to only particular areas before she wrote about Nagini in Goblet of Fire and by now she would need a name to call Voldemorts followers in this storyline in this book... maybe she got the idea for it from Death Adder and from that research. It was just a thought, though.


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  #156  
Old November 17th, 2011, 10:07 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by crmdy1023 View Post
Someone mentioned that Nagini is a Boa Constrictor like the snake in the zoo- this is incorrect- I don't think this could be possible because although Nagini is large, we know she has enormous fangs and that her bite is extremely poisonous. Boa Constrictors, while large, are not poisonous and do not have extremely large fangs or a deadly bite. The snakes way of getting food is by wrapping themselves tightly around their prey, hence constrictor, then eating them after they die...
I see this as proof that Nagini is not the snake that Harry set loose. I always imagined that snake was recaptured, too. The zoo authorities would have made every effort to recapture him- public safety and the zoo's liability would have been concerns.


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Originally Posted by merrymarge View Post
She had a Diamond-shape pattern on her body, so I whought she was a Diamondback which lived in hot dry climates. Except England was neither.
But Voldemort travelled a lot after he left Borgin and Burkes - he associated with "the very worst of our kind" all over the world, according to Dumbledore. He could have found Nagini in any one of these places. But then, there's the question of where she would have been during his Vapourmort years. He could have encountered her in the forest where he hid in Albania, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crmdy1023 View Post
I think its more likely that the snake and the name of Voldemorts followers are interrelated than it is that the Boa Constrictor from the Zoo became Nagini. I love these theories though!!
Interesting suggestion and background info. Would Voldemort have named his DEs in connection with his snake? IMO, their name had more to do with their actions, when it came to Voldemort's reasoning.
It's possible that JKR, on the other hand, saw the double meaning when she was choosing the name.
He was in Albania to find the Ravenclaw diadem in his early years, so if Nagini is this species, he could have found her then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crmdy1023 View Post
I understand your reasoning but HBP was obviously written after GoF so we don't really have any basis to say that JKR knew what she wanted to call the Death Eaters before GoF.
I agree - up until GoF, they were just referred to as "Voldemort's inner circle", much as the Dementors were referred to as "Azkaban guards" until one was shown on-page. JKR may not have decided exactly what she wanted to call both of these, or she may have wanted the reveal to be at a relevant time in the books.


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  #157  
Old November 17th, 2011, 11:53 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

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But Voldemort travelled a lot after he left Borgin and Burkes - he associated with "the very worst of our kind" all over the world, according to Dumbledore. He could have found Nagini in any one of these places. But then, there's the question of where she would have been during his Vapourmort years. He could have encountered her in the forest where he hid in Albania, too.
Yep! I looked up Albanian snakes or "vipers" as JKR referred to Nagini as being a "green viper" snake with "long fangs and a poisonous bite" and the most lethal one that came up was the Death Adder... and Adders are native to Albania, as I said.

I read some interesting theories about nagini on a few blogs earlier today, and one had suggested that Nagini was indeed a Death Adder (by her description in the books and by JKR) and that Voldemort himself had put an engorgement charm on her to increase her size (she was unnaturally large for a venomous snake of her description)so that she could better protect herself and do his bidding and I like this theory very much, it makes the most sense to me.


Quote:
Interesting suggestion and background info. Would Voldemort have named his DEs in connection with his snake? IMO, their name had more to do with their actions, when it came to Voldemort's reasoning.
It's possible that JKR, on the other hand, saw the double meaning when she was choosing the name.
He was in Albania to find the Ravenclaw diadem in his early years, so if Nagini is this species, he could have found her then.
This is my theory as well, and it just seems to make sense to me that Voldemort had her for quite a while before he made her a horcrux. I could see him, in his weakend state in Albania, befriending a snake that only he could talk to and keeping her as pet and protector. Dumbledore himself said that Voldemort was unnaturally protective of her and seemed to have affection and concern for her more so than he had ever had for any human being, no matter how close his followers thought they were to him.

I didn't mean to suggest that Voldemort named his Death Eaters after Naginis species though... just thought Death Adders sounded so much like Death Eaters, and surely JKR had to come across the term while researching snakes as it is almost her exact discription of Nagini. And Death Adders, to me, just sounds like a creepy term.

Oh-and to answer Merry's question about if Death Adders eat their prey, yes, they deliver a swift, deadly bite or two and wait for their prey to pass away from the venom then they eat them whole. I also read that eating their prey while the venom is still fresh aids in the snakes digestion and makes the snake stronger because of the proteins it contains. I only bring this up because I found it interesting that Naginis venom was used to strengthen Voldemort. Creepy, I know.


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  #158  
Old November 18th, 2011, 4:19 am
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

O.K., I always wondered about that.


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  #159  
Old December 13th, 2011, 8:10 pm
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

I agree with crmdy1023 that Voldemort would have most likely possessed Nagini for a while before turning her into a horcrux. I think it speaks volumes about the amount of trust he placed in his pet that he would make her the host for a piece of his soul. No other living thing would house any part of his soul (except for Harry, which was completely accidental) and I believe that this is likely because Voldemort would only place his trust in inanimate objects, simply because they are incapable of betrayal. Of course one might argue that he trusted his death eaters, but I do not believe that to be the case. He placed a bit of confidence in them certainly, but likely just enough to make them want to continue follow him. He never fully trusted them, because if he had, he would have told him about his horcruxes and various other parts of his life that (as far as we know) he told none of them about. (It is true that Regulus knew about the locket, but I see this as more of a "he-figured-it-out-on-his-own" type of instance.)

The only one of his faithful posse that he placed enough trust in to assign as the guardian of his soul was Nagini. I see Voldemort's relationship with his pet as the closest he could ever come to actually loving something. At the same time though, one must consider that he most likely simply viewed her as a tool for his plans, just as he viewed all others who followed him, although she was likely his best tool, thus his enhanced feelings for her over all others.

Something else to consider though, is that she might have just been convenient at the time. I believe I remember reading Dumbledore saying something about Voldemort never using just "any old thing" as a horcrux. He strikes me as too dramatic for that. Really the only thing we see as a "normal" item being used as a horcrux is the diary, but other than that, he chooses items of significance. Especially if the theory about him placing an engorgement charm on Nagini is true, he might consider her a significant item simply because of her deadly nature and the fact that she, at least in some sense, is the result of magic he himself cast, and was likely the most convenient "significant item" present at the time he was going make the horcrux. This would reflect the attitude of superiority he seems to hold about himself.



Last edited by always_33_687; December 15th, 2011 at 11:33 pm.
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Old July 7th, 2012, 8:59 pm
Halcipher  Female.gif Halcipher is offline
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Re: Nagini: Character Analysis

Excuse me if this has been discussed before... But I want to know why Voldemort would make someone who is mortal, a horcrux. If say, Nagini dies of age... Is that another horcrux down, or does the soul fragment stay in her 'corpse'?


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