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New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2



 
 
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  #41  
Old July 10th, 2006, 10:23 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

I'm with Peg - I can see Lupin becoming the leader of the Order for all of the reasons she mentioned. He definitely does have a lot of experience, and he has the trust and respect of the other members. If Remus does become the official leader, I agree that he probably would encourage help and imput from the other members in his role of leadership.

If Lupin isn't the leader, then my other bet would be on McGonagall. Even though she already has a leadership position (Headmistress of Hogwarts), that didn't stop Dumbledore from leading the Order as well. I think she has the respect of the Order members as well, and some experience in fighting the Dark Arts. So my second choice would be her if Lupin doesn't lead the Order.


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  #42  
Old July 11th, 2006, 12:14 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Yay, I'm not completely crazy!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lepamaniac
What about Regulus?
Well, JKR said that he's definitely dead in an interview, though I do wish we could meet him.

Quote:
Originally posted by shellbell32:
I do think Lupin is smart and brave enough to lead the Order and also has experience. The only problem with him is he needs to keep his werewolf problem under control. Who is going to make his potion for him? Hopefully Mrs. Weasley will
We've never heard that Mrs. Weasley is particualrly good at potions, but as there are 3 aurors (including Moody) in the Order, I don't think it would be all that difficult to get Wolfsbane, as Tonks, Kingsley, and Moody all had to have done quite well in NEWT potions. And even if none of them are up to making Wolfsbane, McGonnagall could probably get Sluggy to make it, since a) she's now his boss and b) He seems to be very happy to do things for a little extra money.


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  #43  
Old July 11th, 2006, 6:41 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
Well, JKR said that he's definitely dead in an interview, though I do wish we could meet him.
Ah yes, I suppose that I should have considered the whole R.A.B being dead thing before opening my mouth. =/

I don't see Dumbledore's shoes being filled by just anybody though. Certainly Lupin and McGonagall are both worthy candidates, but they're also very obvious and that's just not JKR's style.

My bet is that she's going to use it as a way to introduce a new character. Especially if Hogwarts will be closing down.

We don't really know that much about Aberforth yet to create too much stipulation...is he even alive? =/

Also let's consider what we know...he's off his rocker and he might have not be able to read.

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practicing inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers, but did Aberforth hide? No, he did not! He held his head up high and went about his business as usual! Of course, I'm not entirely sure he can read, so that may not have been bravery..."

Not someone I would want leading the charge against Voldemort.


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Last edited by lepamaniac; July 11th, 2006 at 6:46 am.
  #44  
Old July 11th, 2006, 8:17 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

I think it should be Moody...


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  #45  
Old July 11th, 2006, 8:34 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by 62442al_Man
I think I should just post up the possibilities of who was in the Order and who stands a chance at becoming Head;

Voldwar II possibilites:
  • Alastor Moody
  • Molly Weasley
  • Arthur Weasley
  • Bill Weasley
  • Charlie Weasley
  • Nymphadora Tonks
  • Dedalus Diggle
  • Remus Lupin
  • Mundungus Fletcher
  • Kingsley Shackbolt
  • Minerva McGonagall
  • Severus Snape

Other possibilities:
  • Aberforth Dumbledore
  • Fred and/or George Weasley
  • Harry, Ron, or Hermione
  • No one...
What amazes me is no one has thought about "HORACE SLUGHORN". Don't you think he was a character induded for some important role, what I mean is that he may be well a bit ignorant but he is very learned and knows TMR(LV) very well(having had him as one of his favourite students), moreover there are more reasons for it:-

1) It was because of him Lord Voldemort Came to know more about the Horcruxes and their multiplicity. So er... he would like to REPENT for his MISTAKE (which is huger than this).

2) As a mark of Friendship for DD. He would want to finish the Task that DD took in Hand.

3) He has no option. He knows LV is looking for him and he knows he will have to die so why not die serving HUMANITY.

Erm.. Your views..


  #46  
Old July 11th, 2006, 8:51 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Slughorn? I think not. He's too likely to spill something important just to impress someone.


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  #47  
Old July 11th, 2006, 9:14 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwendolyn_Weasl
Slughorn? I think not. He's too likely to spill something important just to impress someone.
Good point.


  #48  
Old July 11th, 2006, 2:56 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Adding to the Slughorn idea...

In the chapter "Horace Slughorn" in the HBP, one of the reasons Slughorn was reluctant to becoming Potions Master again was partly because he thought of it somehow as the public allegiance to the Order of the Phoenix. He was not interested in it at all. Henceforth, I think there would be a small probability of joining the Order in the first place, let alone becoming leader.


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  #49  
Old July 11th, 2006, 5:31 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by voldyvolvol
Adding to the Slughorn idea...

In the chapter "Horace Slughorn" in the HBP, one of the reasons Slughorn was reluctant to becoming Potions Master again was partly because he thought of it somehow as the public allegiance to the Order of the Phoenix. He was not interested in it at all. Henceforth, I think there would be a small probability of joining the Order in the first place, let alone becoming leader.
I thought I had mentioned that under the present circumstances, anyway my point is now that the situation demanded he might put his hand up and accept the challenge(for the want of right word) that was presented by the situation, moreover he is more learned than any one else so even if he dosen't want to I think he would realize his need by the order and harry in Particular so he might just do it in.


  #50  
Old July 11th, 2006, 11:47 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by lepamaniac
Ah yes, I suppose that I should have considered the whole R.A.B being dead thing before opening my mouth. =/

I don't see Dumbledore's shoes being filled by just anybody though. Certainly Lupin and McGonagall are both worthy candidates, but they're also very obvious and that's just not JKR's style.

My bet is that she's going to use it as a way to introduce a new character. Especially if Hogwarts will be closing down.

We don't really know that much about Aberforth yet to create too much stipulation...is he even alive? =/

Also let's consider what we know...he's off his rocker and he might have not be able to read.

"My own brother, Aberforth, was prosecuted for practicing inappropriate charms on a goat. It was all over the papers, but did Aberforth hide? No, he did not! He held his head up high and went about his business as usual! Of course, I'm not entirely sure he can read, so that may not have been bravery..."

Not someone I would want leading the charge against Voldemort.
No major new characters. I forget which interview that is, but JKR said it. I think that it will be a relatively obvious candidate, since it really has to be someone we all trust (or that Harry trusts, since he'll be working with whomever it is).

Yes, Aberforth is alive. He is the barman at the Hog's Head.

I agree with you, though. He doesn't fit the "leader" role very well, based on what little we do know about him.

Quote:
Origianlly posted by MAGICialMUggle:
I think it should be Moody...
The only problem with Moody is his paranoia.

Quote:
Originally posted by Mysterious:
I thought I had mentioned that under the present circumstances, anyway my point is now that the situation demanded he might put his hand up and accept the challenge(for the want of right word) that was presented by the situation, moreover he is more learned than any one else so even if he dosen't want to I think he would realize his need by the order and harry in Particular so he might just do it in.
A Gryffindor would do that, but Sluggy's a Slytherin. He's not that noble, and his only goal is to preserve his standard of living. He'd never join Voldemort, but he won't put himself in that kind of danger.


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  #51  
Old July 12th, 2006, 12:11 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Actually, I think Harry is a good choice. He knows certain information that no one else does and will be of age. I am sure he will be advised wisely by Mr. Weasley, Lupin, Shacklebolt and others. Guess he won't have much time for Quidditch.

Quote:
The only problem with Moody is his paranoia.
People certainly don't take him seriously, for example, Tonks in OOP.



---And Aberforth can't read......

Quote:
Originally Posted by gryffinsgirl
McGonagall.
will have her hands full with Hogwarts



Last edited by codswallop; July 12th, 2006 at 12:18 am.
  #52  
Old July 12th, 2006, 12:20 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Harry will have his hands full looking for and destroying the horcruxes. And anyway, he's not actually in the Order AND may or may not actually leave Hogwarts, meaning that he might not be elligable to join, much less lead, the Order.


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  #53  
Old July 12th, 2006, 2:28 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
Harry will have his hands full looking for and destroying the horcruxes. And anyway, he's not actually in the Order AND may or may not actually leave Hogwarts, meaning that he might not be elligable to join, much less lead, the Order.
All very, very valid points. Putting aside my opinion that Order members could be very beneficial in the Horcrux hunt, I also think it's quite unlikely that Harry would become the next leader. (I'm just wishing).

However, more to the point of realistic possibilities, in my opinion, is the Lupin camp. I think that Lupin might be one of the few who would be more likely to see Harry's need for information and less likely to keep him out of the information loop, whether or not Harry is even invited to join the Order.

Dumbledore always played his cards close to the chest, but I think it's possible he played them too, too close to the chest and in effect withheld vital information from Harry which might have prevented some of Harry's rash acts.

We have two axioms which have importance here:
Knowledge is power. - only with adequate and correct information can intelligent decisions be made.
A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. - rash actions evolve from this, Voldemort acting on only a partial prophesy is a prime example, Harry dashing to the DoM is another.

I think we can assume the head of the Order would be on the receiving end of every bit of information gathered by the rank and file members, and if that isn't Harry, then the next leader absolutely must be someone in whom Harry has as much trust as he had for Dumbledore, and it must be someone who acknowledges that maybe, just maybe Harry is mature enough to handle the knowledge if he is only given the chance.


  #54  
Old July 12th, 2006, 6:07 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

I think it's either going to be Lupin or McGonagall.


  #55  
Old July 12th, 2006, 7:02 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by RemusLupinFan
I'm with Peg - I can see Lupin becoming the leader of the Order for all of the reasons she mentioned. He definitely does have a lot of experience, and he has the trust and respect of the other members. If Remus does become the official leader, I agree that he probably would encourage help and imput from the other members in his role of leadership.

If Lupin isn't the leader, then my other bet would be on McGonagall. Even though she already has a leadership position (Headmistress of Hogwarts), that didn't stop Dumbledore from leading the Order as well. I think she has the respect of the Order members as well, and some experience in fighting the Dark Arts. So my second choice would be her if Lupin doesn't lead the Order.
Does having the respect of the entire order matter very much, what I mean is if moody does become the head of the Order not all will respect him-will they? I don't think so but if he gives them an order they would definatly follow it(to certain extent) as they did in "The Advance of Guard" chapter in Ootp.
P.S.- And well if not Slughorn then I would prefer Lupin.


  #56  
Old July 12th, 2006, 7:29 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by mysterious
Does having the respect of the entire order matter very much, what I mean is if moody does become the head of the Order not all will respect him-will they? I don't think so but if he gives them an order they would definatly follow it(to certain extent) as they did in "The Advance of Guard" chapter in Ootp.
P.S.- And well if not Slughorn then I would prefer Lupin.
I'd say Moody is regarded as a "loose cannon", and so his ascension to OotP Leader is doubtful. Similarly, Slughorn is too unpredictable to be made leader of the Order. Lupin seems like a plausible candidate, although I think he is too modest/engrossed in other duties to become the leader.

Given that Harry is about to become "of age" according to Wizarding standards, it'd make sense if he were nominated Leader. Additionally, he knows more than anyone else about how to defeat Voldemort. So why not? (Who cares if he is too rash? )

Bear in mind, this is not the Ministry we're referring to...so whoever becomes the leader of the Order must actually have explicit knowledge of Voldemort and Co.'s doings. that leaves the Trio and Snape (who, as far as we know, is evil). Or perhaps Arthur Weasley could become leader, and Harry could just tell him all that has been going on.


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  #57  
Old July 12th, 2006, 11:37 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFal
All very, very valid points. Putting aside my opinion that Order members could be very beneficial in the Horcrux hunt, I also think it's quite unlikely that Harry would become the next leader. (I'm just wishing).

However, more to the point of realistic possibilities, in my opinion, is the Lupin camp. I think that Lupin might be one of the few who would be more likely to see Harry's need for information and less likely to keep him out of the information loop, whether or not Harry is even invited to join the Order.

Dumbledore always played his cards close to the chest, but I think it's possible he played them too, too close to the chest and in effect withheld vital information from Harry which might have prevented some of Harry's rash acts.

We have two axioms which have importance here:
Knowledge is power. - only with adequate and correct information can intelligent decisions be made.
A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. - rash actions evolve from this, Voldemort acting on only a partial prophesy is a prime example, Harry dashing to the DoM is another.

I think we can assume the head of the Order would be on the receiving end of every bit of information gathered by the rank and file members, and if that isn't Harry, then the next leader absolutely must be someone in whom Harry has as much trust as he had for Dumbledore, and it must be someone who acknowledges that maybe, just maybe Harry is mature enough to handle the knowledge if he is only given the chance.
Which Lupin does. Excellent point. That never occured to me.

Quote:
Originally posted by MathewMazer:
Given that Harry is about to become "of age" according to Wizarding standards, it'd make sense if he were nominated Leader. Additionally, he knows more than anyone else about how to defeat Voldemort. So why not? (Who cares if he is too rash? )

Bear in mind, this is not the Ministry we're referring to...so whoever becomes the leader of the Order must actually have explicit knowledge of Voldemort and Co.'s doings. that leaves the Trio and Snape (who, as far as we know, is evil). Or perhaps Arthur Weasley could become leader, and Harry could just tell him all that has been going on.
Harry cannot lead the order simply because he won't have enough time. He has to locate and destroy 4 Horcruxes. I therefore agree with LadyFal that the new leader will have to be someone Harry might trust with the information Dumbledore gave him in HBP, but also someone who has enough time to lead the Order. McGonnagall fits neither creiterion. Harry refusus point-blank to tell her anything in HBP and she'll probably be Headmistress of Hogwarts. Moody has time, but I'm not sure Harry trusts him that much, especially because of the imposter in GoF, not that that's Moody's fault, and because of his paranoia. Harry certainly doesn't trust Aberforth either, as he's never properly met him. That leaves 3 candidates: Kingsley Shacklebolt, Arthur Weasley, and Remus Lupin. We don't really know Kingsley well enough to know if Harry trusts him, and he's too busy anyway. Harry most defintiely trusts Arthur, but again, he's head of a newly created Ministry office; he's got too much on his plate. That just leaves Remus. We know from PoA and then HBP that Harry trusts him. The mere fact that he is the only adult Harry tells about the Prince's potions book, and that he even waits until Arthur is out of the room speaks volumes. And Remus is unemployed. He does have a girlfriend now, but she's an auror, leaving him plenty of time while she's off at work. Yes, he i a werewolf, and therefore out of commission one night a month, but who's to say someone else can't take over at the full moon? Who knows? Mabey having a werewolf at the forefront of the war will help get rid of the prejudice against part humans in the wizarding world.


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  #58  
Old July 12th, 2006, 11:57 pm
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
Which Lupin does. Excellent point. That never occured to me.

That just leaves Remus. We know from PoA and then HBP that Harry trusts him. The mere fact that he is the only adult Harry tells about the Prince's potions book, and that he even waits until Arthur is out of the room speaks volumes. And Remus is unemployed. He does have a girlfriend now, but she's an auror, leaving him plenty of time while she's off at work. Yes, he i a werewolf, and therefore out of commission one night a month, but who's to say someone else can't take over at the full moon? Who knows? Mabey having a werewolf at the forefront of the war will help get rid of the prejudice against part humans in the wizarding world.
Thank you. Your points are well stated as well, and you gave me food for thought too. I missed the one about Harry waiting until Arthur left the room and then Harry confided to Lupin. Can you tell me what chapter that is in so I can stretch out my arm to retrieve my copy of HBP and re-read it?


  #59  
Old July 13th, 2006, 1:41 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFal
Thank you. Your points are well stated as well, and you gave me food for thought too. I missed the one about Harry waiting until Arthur left the room and then Harry confided to Lupin. Can you tell me what chapter that is in so I can stretch out my arm to retrieve my copy of HBP and re-read it?
I was wrong. He doesn't ask Lupin about his work for the Order until Arthur leaves the room, but Arthur is walking around handing people glasses of Eggnog when Harry asks Remus about the Prince, and is out of earshot. This scene is in Chapter 16, by the way, and starts on page 334 of the US edition.


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  #60  
Old July 13th, 2006, 1:45 am
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Re: New Leader of the Order of Phoenix? v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg
Harry most defintiely trusts Arthur, but again, he's head of a newly created Ministry office; he's got too much on his plate. That just leaves Remus. We know from PoA and then HBP that Harry trusts him. The mere fact that he is the only adult Harry tells about the Prince's potions book, and that he even waits until Arthur is out of the room speaks volumes.
Well stated. I think I agree with you. If Lupin does, in fact, assume the leader position, I suppose that means there is no more hope on the Werewolf-community front?


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