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  #21  
Old April 26th, 2007, 11:46 pm
BelleGreenfield  Female.gif BelleGreenfield is offline
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartmywheezy View Post
well, rowling describes metamorphmagi as having an "innate" ability to transform themselves physically. this would mean that they would be born, not made.

you may be thinking of an animagus. although difficult, it is possible to train and become an animagus. i don't have my books and can't tell you exactly the quote, but this may be what you were thinking of.
I know the animagus is hard... but I thought there was a scene where they were talking with Tonks and she says that most are born with it, but that it could be learned it was just extremely difficult and most people don't even try or aren't as good as those born with it... now I'm going to have to go find my book and see if I'm crazy...


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  #22  
Old April 26th, 2007, 11:50 pm
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

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Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
I know the animagus is hard... but I thought there was a scene where they were talking with Tonks and she says that most are born with it, but that it could be learned it was just extremely difficult and most people don't even try or aren't as good as those born with it... now I'm going to have to go find my book and see if I'm crazy...
do you mean metamorphmagus?

if you don't find it, i'll look through my ootp once i get home and let you know what i find...


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  #23  
Old April 27th, 2007, 3:22 am
BelleGreenfield  Female.gif BelleGreenfield is offline
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartmywheezy View Post
do you mean metamorphmagus?

if you don't find it, i'll look through my ootp once i get home and let you know what i find...
I am not very clear am I? What I meant was that I know it is hard to learn to be an animagus, but that in regards to a metamorphmagus it usually is in herited, but that it could be learned though it was very difficult, more difficult than becoming an animagus... I had thought there was a scene when they're at a table with Tonks and she explains all about Metamorphs to them.... but I don't remember.


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  #24  
Old April 27th, 2007, 3:49 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

Quote:
Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
I am not very clear am I?
naw, you're all right. i understand you now, so we're all good.

Quote:
What I meant was that I know it is hard to learn to be an animagus, but that in regards to a metamorphmagus it usually is in herited, but that it could be learned though it was very difficult, more difficult than becoming an animagus... I had thought there was a scene when they're at a table with Tonks and she explains all about Metamorphs to them.... but I don't remember.
maybe this is what you mean?

Can You Learn How to Be a Metamorphmagus?
"Can you learn how to be a metamorphmagus?" Harry asked her, straightening up, completely forgetting about packing.
Tonks chuckled.
"Bet you wouldn't mind hiding that scar sometimes, eh?"
Her eyes found the lightning-shaped scar on Harry's forehead.
"No, I wouldn't mind," Harry mumbled, turning away. He did not like people staring at his scar.
"Well, you'll have to learn the hard way, I'm afraid," said Tonks. "Metamorphmagi are really rare, they're born, not made. Most wizards need to use a wand or potions to change their appearance..." (ootp, us hardback, p.52)


now, this may actually be interpreted two ways, in my opinion. tonks says that metamorphmagi are "born, not made", which leads me to believe that one does not have the ability to 'learn' how to do that.

but, she also says that he'll "have to learn the hard way", possibly implying that he can learn. i took this bit as tonks saying that he'll have to learn a harder, different way of getting rid of his scar, as he cannot learn to become a metamorphmagus because it doesn't work that way.

also, she does trail off, though, which rowling has made obvious by the use of an ellipsis (...). maybe she is not saying everything? i can't see why not. there doesn't seem to be a reason why she would not want harry to know that you could learn to become a metamorphmagus. i don't see the harm in letting him know this, as he could always found out elsewhere if that were the case.

anyway, i think that this shows that tonks told harry that you can't learn to be a metamorphmagus, you have to be born one.


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Last edited by iheartmywheezy; April 27th, 2007 at 6:56 am.
  #25  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:28 am
BelleGreenfield  Female.gif BelleGreenfield is offline
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

THANK YOU!!

That is exactly the scene I was talking about and I wasn't sure what she said. I agree. This proves you can't just learn.

...

However it does show us that there are other ways, and she mentions a wand. Which means there is another way besides polyjuice.

Veeeeery interesting.

So if there's another metamorph then it is going to be somone we don't know that much about. Which I think unfortunately disproves my theory that Regulus could be. Sirius would have obviously known that. It won't be Bellatrix, surely she would have kept herself out of Azkaban for that.

However, if R.A.B. is NOT Regulus they still could be.

Hhhmmm... I still think we'll see another one, or that the ability in Tonks herself will become more important/pivotal. I mean it hasn't played that big of a roll, and I don't think Jo would introduce something like that without using it. Well, know I'll have to think differently how it will be used.

Thanks again for finding that quote! It was driving me mad! I had thought it was while they were eating at Grimmauld Place at the table and I was looking in ALL the wrong places!

EDIT: I just realized something... in that quote Tonks refers to metamorphmagus in the plural form as that-metamorphmagus... not -"magi" or did you type it wrong?


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Last edited by BelleGreenfield; April 27th, 2007 at 5:30 am.
  #26  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:34 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

I agree Jo wouldn't introduce it if it wasn't going to a play a role in DH. I just think Tonks was the one that brought the idea to us; there will be someone else that shows us the significance of being a Metamorphmagus, practicing it in everyday life for a specific reason. Since we haven't been in on the DE side of things (I disregard SE because of the lack of clarity) I think the Order will have a Metamorphmagus in there, and we'll see it firsthand in DH.


  #27  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:40 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

I think it's possible there could be another metamorphmagus; they haven't served a really important purpose really and I think that sort of ability could be really useful, although it may just be Tonks who does it.
I doubt Harry will become one; I seem to remember that they are born and not made, and I wouldn't like it if he suddenly had an ability in the last book like that. I think it could be genetic, if it is something you are born with rather than learn, and it could be seen in someone else we know connected to the Black family (although Harry himself could be a cousin, since there is a Potter in the family).


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  #28  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:47 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Quote:
Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
My apologies, since I started the thread and spelled it wrong... I was excited about the idea and obviously not thinking correctly. I enjoy correct grammar as well and I feel your pain and now that you pointed it out it's bugging the HECK out of me... I wonder if I can change it since I started the thread...


EDIT: That would be a negative... dangit!
Ah well. Thanks for trying. Glad you don't hate me.


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  #29  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:54 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

Naw I don't hate you...

I hate that I can't change it...


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  #30  
Old April 27th, 2007, 6:13 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagus'

Quote:
Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
THANK YOU!!
you are quite welcome.

Quote:
However it does show us that there are other ways, and she mentions a wand. Which means there is another way besides polyjuice.
remember, one of these ways could be transfiguration. we see multiple instances of this throughout the series.

Quote:
So if there's another metamorph then it is going to be somone we don't know that much about. Which I think unfortunately disproves my theory that Regulus could be. Sirius would have obviously known that. It won't be Bellatrix, surely she would have kept herself out of Azkaban for that.
this makes sense to me. indeed, if regulus were a metamorphmagus, sirius would have certainly seen signs of this at one point or another.

the bella argument may also be a valid one, although i had not considered it. at any rate, i don't think she's a metamorphmagus.

Quote:
I just realized something... in that quote Tonks refers to metamorphmagus in the plural form as that-metamorphmagus... not -"magi" or did you type it wrong?
yeah, that was my error. my apologies. brain fart.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
I hate that I can't change it...
actually, there is a way that you can change it. i read this [posted by rell] in the 'ask the staff' thread earlier:

editing thread titles All you have to do is double click on the box withe the thread title on the forum page and you can edit it.


try it and let me know if it works.


EDIT: it does work, because i just tried it myself


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Ahhh, words of wisdom from MGG


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Last edited by iheartmywheezy; April 27th, 2007 at 6:34 am.
  #31  
Old April 27th, 2007, 5:41 pm
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Hooray and huzzah!! I did it!

Thanks again!!


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  #32  
Old April 27th, 2007, 9:55 pm
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

I think there definately has to be some sort of plot line involving metamorphmagi. There is just no other reason for Jo to introduce them if it doesn't come up again. As for contenders, I think it would have to be a bckground character.


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  #33  
Old April 28th, 2007, 2:22 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Well, we know that Andromeda Tonks (nee Black) was a Metamorphmagus (phew!) and that she was against all that the Black family stood for, and we don't know if she's dead (I think she is alive) so I think she will play a part in Book 7.


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  #34  
Old April 28th, 2007, 6:55 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Quote:
Originally Posted by hedwig_3180 View Post
Well, we know that Andromeda Tonks (nee Black) was a Metamorphmagus (phew!) and that she was against all that the Black family stood for, and we don't know if she's dead (I think she is alive) so I think she will play a part in Book 7.
do we know that andromeda was a metamorphmagus? i know that she was apparently against what the black family stood for, as she married a muggle [you know you gotta watch out for those crazy muggle-lovers ]. however, i don't ever remember reading anywhere that she was a metamorphmagus. is it in ootp...???


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  #35  
Old April 28th, 2007, 8:16 pm
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

I don't think it was actually stated... however, Nymphadora had to inherit it from someone right? Or when she says they're born not made is it like a random dormant gene like red hair in an all brunette family?


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  #36  
Old April 28th, 2007, 8:21 pm
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartmywheezy View Post
do we know that andromeda was a metamorphmagus? i know that she was apparently against what the black family stood for, as she married a muggle [you know you gotta watch out for those crazy muggle-lovers ]. however, i don't ever remember reading anywhere that she was a metamorphmagus. is it in ootp...???
I think it was mentioned in OOTP, or at least implied.


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  #37  
Old April 29th, 2007, 12:09 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Quote:
Originally Posted by BelleGreenfield View Post
I don't think it was actually stated... however, Nymphadora had to inherit it from someone right? Or when she says they're born not made is it like a random dormant gene like red hair in an all brunette family?
i don't know how the 'genetics' of it works. there is no evidence that magical traits [whether it be the ability to perform magic at all or to be a metamorphmagus] are even genetic at all, so we can't know this for sure either way. i don't remember ever reading anything about andromeda being a metamorphmagus, or anything about it being an 'inherited' kind of thing. kind of like a parselmouth. harry is a parselmouth because 'part' of voldemort is 'in' him, not because it is 'inherited' from him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hedwig_3180 View Post
I think it was mentioned in OOTP, or at least implied.
as i am re-reading through the series, i will look for it when i get there. of course, i am only on ss, so it might be awhile.


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  #38  
Old April 29th, 2007, 3:00 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartmywheezy View Post
i don't know how the 'genetics' of it works. there is no evidence that magical traits [whether it be the ability to perform magic at all or to be a metamorphmagus] are even genetic at all, so we can't know this for sure either way. i don't remember ever reading anything about andromeda being a metamorphmagus, or anything about it being an 'inherited' kind of thing. kind of like a parselmouth. harry is a parselmouth because 'part' of voldemort is 'in' him, not because it is 'inherited' from him.
Well, I think that the fact that two wizards having all-magic children shows that the magical trait is inherited. If it wasn't inherited, and instead was random, then there would be a lot more diversity magic-wise in all families--this means that Arthur and Molly having seven all-magical children is super-rare, which we know it is not rare to have all children of a witch and a wizard be magical.

I am starting to think that the Metamorphmagus thing is random, not so much genetic, like a gene mutation or something. I don't remember any of the books mentioning that Tonks's mother was a Metamorphmagus. Then again, what human trait isn't genetic to some degree. So my opinion holds, it is genetic. Just super-rare.


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Bean turned to her, put his arms around her, and wept into her shoulder. He had grown, to stand tall enough for that. ---Shadow of the Hegemon, Orson Scott Card
  #39  
Old April 30th, 2007, 5:42 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

I have a theory that Madam Pince might be a metamorphamagus. I won't repost everything here, but here is the link to the thread I started on the topic.

Madame Pince = metamorphamagus = Emmeline Vance = Mrs.Severus Snape?

http://www.cosforums.com/showthread.php?t=101184


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  #40  
Old May 1st, 2007, 1:39 am
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Re: More Metamorphmagi

Tonks did say they were very rare -- and I trust that -- plus, we haven't seen anything to contradict that fact. I don't think at this point JKR would introduce a new character who is a metamorphagus, although an interesting twist might be to find out that it is a famililial trait and that someone else in the family carries it -- and there are so many related to Tonks.


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