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Cracking the Veil



 
 
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  #41  
Old November 2nd, 2006, 9:17 pm
GryffSolider  Female.gif GryffSolider is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Peg View Post
Another thing the four affected by the veil have in common: they've all had near death experiences.
Harry: too many to list.
Ginny: Voldy uses her "life force" or whatever to nearly come out of the diary all the way in CoS. If he'd succeeded, he'd have used up all her energy and she would've died.
Neville: he "nearly died" when his uncle pushed him off a pier, and has been dropped head first out of windows.
Luna: Her mother died when one of her experemental spells went wrong, and Luna was in the room. Yes, this is rather shaky, but really, what are the chanced that the spell only affected Mrs. Lovegood?
Ok, less likely than the stinksap, I know, but I just thought I'd point it out.


Way to go Peg, I completely forgot about the near death experiences!


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  #42  
Old November 2nd, 2006, 9:27 pm
ancy  Female.gif ancy is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg View Post
Another thing the four affected by the veil have in common: they've all had near death experiences.
Harry: too many to list.
Ginny: Voldy uses her "life force" or whatever to nearly come out of the diary all the way in CoS. If he'd succeeded, he'd have used up all her energy and she would've died.
Neville: he "nearly died" when his uncle pushed him off a pier, and has been dropped head first out of windows.
Luna: Her mother died when one of her experemental spells went wrong, and Luna was in the room. Yes, this is rather shaky, but really, what are the chanced that the spell only affected Mrs. Lovegood?
Ok, less likely than the stinksap, I know, but I just thought I'd point it out.
Well yes they did all have near death experiences, but then so did Ron and Hermione, just remember the chess game in PS. It might be the case that the effect of the vail on the person depends on the "degree" of death experience. (Hehe. That sentence's just weird) What I mean is that Harry and Luna were obviously most affected by the vail, they are the two that actually hear the voices (it is not clearly stated that Neville and Ginny hear them), I believe this is because they have both lost someone extremely close to them. Harry lost both of his parents and Luna lost her mother. So, I think the the whispers they hear are actually the souls of their beloved ones. Then there are Ginny and Neville. They are both entranced by the vail, but seem to be somewhat less affected by it than Harry and Luna. They might be entranced by it because they have as Peg pointed out both had very traumatic near death experiences. They were both very close to dying, but have not lost anybody so close to them that they would hear their soul whispering. Perhaps? I don't know, but I think that Jo somewhat set Harry and Luna apart from Neville and Ginny and we know that they are the only ones that actually lost their parents. As for Ron and Hermione they did also have very traumatic experiences, but I don't think they are nearly as traumatic as that of Ginny or Neville thus they weren't really affected by the vail.


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  #43  
Old November 2nd, 2006, 11:39 pm
GryffSolider  Female.gif GryffSolider is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by ancy View Post
Well yes they did all have near death experiences, but then so did Ron and Hermione, just remember the chess game in PS. It might be the case that the effect of the vail on the person depends on the "degree" of death experience. (Hehe. That sentence's just weird) What I mean is that Harry and Luna were obviously most affected by the vail, they are the two that actually hear the voices (it is not clearly stated that Neville and Ginny hear them), I believe this is because they have both lost someone extremely close to them. Harry lost both of his parents and Luna lost her mother. So, I think the the whispers they hear are actually the souls of their beloved ones. Then there are Ginny and Neville. They are both entranced by the vail, but seem to be somewhat less affected by it than Harry and Luna. They might be entranced by it because they have as Peg pointed out both had very traumatic near death experiences. They were both very close to dying, but have not lost anybody so close to them that they would hear their soul whispering. Perhaps? I don't know, but I think that Jo somewhat set Harry and Luna apart from Neville and Ginny and we know that they are the only ones that actually lost their parents. As for Ron and Hermione they did also have very traumatic experiences, but I don't think they are nearly as traumatic as that of Ginny or Neville thus they weren't really affected by the vail.

Actually I have a long story on how i don't think that the chess game was a near death experience, but I wo't go into that here

Secondly it is always possible that the reason Ginny and Neville don't say anything is because they are even more affected by the veil then Harry, Luna.
That they are deeply shocked t the point of no words whatsoever.


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  #44  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 12:02 am
ancy  Female.gif ancy is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by GryffSolider View Post
Actually I have a long story on how i don't think that the chess game was a near death experience, but I wo't go into that here
Okay?...

Quote:
Secondly it is always possible that the reason Ginny and Neville don't say anything is because they are even more affected by the veil then Harry, Luna.
That they are deeply shocked t the point of no words whatsoever.
Oh I highly doubt that. Firstly it is pretty obvious that Harry and Luna have had the most traumatic experience of death than any of the rest - I doubt that anything would beat losing your parents. Secondly if we look at the way it is written it is obvious that Harry and Luna are most affected. The only thing mentioned about the affect of the vail on Neville and Ginny is that they were "staring, apparently entranced, at the vail too", while Jo spends an entire 2 pages before that describing how Harry almost walked through the vail as he heard the whispering. I think it's pretty obvious that Harry and Luna were most affected by it.


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  #45  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 12:46 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Peg View Post
Another thing the four affected by the veil have in common: they've all had near death experiences.
Harry: too many to list.
Ginny: Voldy uses her "life force" or whatever to nearly come out of the diary all the way in CoS. If he'd succeeded, he'd have used up all her energy and she would've died.
Neville: he "nearly died" when his uncle pushed him off a pier, and has been dropped head first out of windows.
Luna: Her mother died when one of her experemental spells went wrong, and Luna was in the room. Yes, this is rather shaky, but really, what are the chanced that the spell only affected Mrs. Lovegood?
Ok, less likely than the stinksap, I know, but I just thought I'd point it out.
The only problem with this theory, as others have mentioned, is that Ron and Hermione have had many near death episodes as well. The basilisk for Hermione, the spiders and the whomping willow for Ron, and that's just from the second book.


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  #46  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 12:52 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by ancy View Post
Well yes they did all have near death experiences, but then so did Ron and Hermione, just remember the chess game in PS. It might be the case that the effect of the vail on the person depends on the "degree" of death experience. (Hehe. That sentence's just weird) What I mean is that Harry and Luna were obviously most affected by the vail, they are the two that actually hear the voices (it is not clearly stated that Neville and Ginny hear them), I believe this is because they have both lost someone extremely close to them. Harry lost both of his parents and Luna lost her mother. So, I think the the whispers they hear are actually the souls of their beloved ones. Then there are Ginny and Neville. They are both entranced by the vail, but seem to be somewhat less affected by it than Harry and Luna. They might be entranced by it because they have as Peg pointed out both had very traumatic near death experiences. They were both very close to dying, but have not lost anybody so close to them that they would hear their soul whispering. Perhaps? I don't know, but I think that Jo somewhat set Harry and Luna apart from Neville and Ginny and we know that they are the only ones that actually lost their parents. As for Ron and Hermione they did also have very traumatic experiences, but I don't think they are nearly as traumatic as that of Ginny or Neville thus they weren't really affected by the vail.
This is why I said we're on shaky ground here. But I like this theory anyway because we know that the veil is in some way connected to death. Anyway, back to why it's hard to define: Ron has had a couple of bad injuries, too. But I think that the Chess match doesn't count because, if I remember corectly, Harry can tell at a glance that Ron's just out cold, whereas with Ginny, Harry's shaking her and muttering "please don't be dead." So Ron's not too badly hurt. And Luna: that's speculation, really, though she was in the room when her mother died.

Quote:
Originally posted by GryffSoldier:
Actually I have a long story on how i don't think that the chess game was a near death experience, but I wo't go into that here
Come on; we want to know.

Quote:
Way to go Peg, I completely forgot about the near death experiences!
-Takes a Lockhart-style bow- Thanks!

Quote:
Originally posted by Infinity9999x:
The only problem with this theory, as others have mentioned, is that Ron and Hermione have had many near death episodes as well. The basilisk for Hermione, the spiders and the whomping willow for Ron, and that's just from the second book.
OK, by "Near Death Experience," I mean they nearly died. Petrification, to our knowledge, is not really all that dangerous (no lasting after effects, and, as far as we know, it doesn't hurt, anyway). And there are no near-fatal injuries with the Whomping Willow (just a few bruises) or the spiders. In fact, as far as I can remember, neither Ron nor Hermione has had a near fatal injury when they enter the Death Chamber.

One last thought: Ron and Hermione have both had a near death experience by the end of HBP, so it might be interesting to see how they react to the veil now.


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Last edited by Peg; November 3rd, 2006 at 1:01 am.
  #47  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 1:06 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Peg View Post
This is why I said we're on shaky ground here. But I like this theory anyway because we know that the veil is in some way connected to death. Anyway, back to why it's hard to define: Ron has had a couple of bad injuries, too. But I think that the Chess match doesn't count because, if I remember corectly, Harry can tell at a glance that Ron's just out cold, whereas with Ginny, Harry's shaking her and muttering "please don't be dead." So Ron's not too badly hurt. And Luna: that's speculation, really, though she was in the room when her mother died.
Like I mentioned above though, Ron and Hermione have each had many near death experiences, but maybe it's connected to how much the near death experience effected the person?

If you look at it, Harry's biggest near death expierence (his parent's murder) changed his life forever, you can tell Ginny's expierence in the COS affected her pretty drastically as well from her reaction in OOTP, and I would bet that a big part of Luna's odd personality comes from seeing her mother die. I'm not sure about Neville, was he present when his parents were tortured?

But anyway, they've all been effected drastically by their near death expierences, while Ron and Hermione haven't been as much. Hermione probably doesn't really remember being petrified, and all the other instances they've been in have been high adrenaline enviroments, so the real danger of the thing never really set in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peg View Post


OK, by "Near Death Experience," I mean they nearly died. Petrification, to our knowledge, is not really all that dangerous (no lasting after effects, and, as far as we know, it doesn't hurt, anyway). And there are no near-fatal injuries with the Whomping Willow (just a few bruises) or the spiders. In fact, as far as I can remember, neither Ron nor Hermione has had a near fatal injury when they enter the Death Chamber.

One last thought: Ron and Hermione have both had a near death experience by the end of HBP, so it might be interesting to see how they react to the veil now.
Well, Hermione's expierence was near death, because if she hadn't looked in a mirror, she would have been dead. That's still pretty close to death, but I see your point, neither of them had suffered a near fatal injury.


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  #48  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 1:15 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Infinity9999x View Post
Like I mentioned above though, Ron and Hermione have each had many near death experiences, but maybe it's connected to how much the near death experience effected the person?

If you look at it, Harry's biggest near death expierence (his parent's murder) changed his life forever, you can tell Ginny's expierence in the COS affected her pretty drastically as well from her reaction in OOTP, and I would bet that a big part of Luna's odd personality comes from seeing her mother die. I'm not sure about Neville, was he present when his parents were tortured?

But anyway, they've all been effected drastically by their near death expierences, while Ron and Hermione haven't been as much. Hermione probably doesn't really remember being petrified, and all the other instances they've been in have been high adrenaline enviroments, so the real danger of the thing never really set in.



Well, Hermione's expierence was near death, because if she hadn't looked in a mirror, she would have been dead. That's still pretty close to death, but I see your point, neither of them had suffered a near fatal injury.
Obviosuly, I'm not very eloquent today. My definition of near death experience IS the near fatal injury. Does that make any sense now?

Yes, exactly. The effect of the experience (of the near fatal injury) on the person is what we're talking about here.


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  #49  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 2:11 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Wow, good investigating! Not sure where you got the information about Luna though. Unless it slipped my mind and I didn't catch it in the books.


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  #50  
Old November 3rd, 2006, 11:37 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Peg View Post
OK, by "Near Death Experience," I mean they nearly died. Petrification, to our knowledge, is not really all that dangerous (no lasting after effects, and, as far as we know, it doesn't hurt, anyway). And there are no near-fatal injuries with the Whomping Willow (just a few bruises) or the spiders. In fact, as far as I can remember, neither Ron nor Hermione has had a near fatal injury when they enter the Death Chamber.
As you said I think this theory is a bit shaky, just because either way you look at it something doesn't completely fit in. Just the way Luna talks about her mother's death it doesn't seem as though she had a near fatal injury when it happened. I don't know, I just didn't get the impression that she was affected by the curse. What I mean is that I think we're on the right track by assuming it has something to do with death, a person's experience with death, traumatic experience, a person't view of death perhaps? I think we're close to finding an answer, but not quite there yet.


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  #51  
Old November 4th, 2006, 6:54 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I just had a thought while reading through these posts again. Well, not really a thought, more of a hmmm. Someone mentioned the possible significance of Voldemort choosing to kill James and Lily on Halloween and how the "veil" between the physical and spiritual worlds is thinnest on that night of the year - spirits roam the earth, and all that. I'm sorry, I don't have the original post. But there was a question also about how that might relate to the veil in the MoM. Now here's my "hmmm", and I know I am reaching way, waaayyy out there, but... Remember when JKR gave us the "never asked question" about why Dumbledore had James' invisibility cloak before James died? And how an invisibility cloak sort of VEILS you from sight? Could there be some sort of crazy link between those three topics? Obviously, there is nothing in canon to support this, and I can't seem to take it any further than just questioning it myself, but do any of you see anything worth pursuing here?


  #52  
Old November 4th, 2006, 8:15 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by LemonFaerie View Post
I just had a thought while reading through these posts again. Well, not really a thought, more of a hmmm. Someone mentioned the possible significance of Voldemort choosing to kill James and Lily on Halloween and how the "veil" between the physical and spiritual worlds is thinnest on that night of the year - spirits roam the earth, and all that. I'm sorry, I don't have the original post. But there was a question also about how that might relate to the veil in the MoM. Now here's my "hmmm", and I know I am reaching way, waaayyy out there, but... Remember when JKR gave us the "never asked question" about why Dumbledore had James' invisibility cloak before James died? And how an invisibility cloak sort of VEILS you from sight? Could there be some sort of crazy link between those three topics? Obviously, there is nothing in canon to support this, and I can't seem to take it any further than just questioning it myself, but do any of you see anything worth pursuing here?


That is very good conjecture, it does me pause and think hmmmmmm

There just seem to be so many pieces of puzzle missing, leaving me abit flabbergasted


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  #53  
Old November 5th, 2006, 7:06 am
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by GryffSolider View Post
You may be asking yourself even now why is this so important. Well if we go back to the MuggleCast question, "How do wizards/witches study death?"
It is my conjecture that, the veil is constantly moving because there is a constant stream of souls passing through the veil.

...I believe that DoM wizards/witches choose to learn a path of magic or is born with the ability to see souls, and study the Veil which is a passageway between Life and Death, physical and spiritual realms.

We know from the example of Sirius' death that the physical can't enter veil without suffering instantaneous death.

Unfortunatly all this leads to a dizzying amount of questions to my mind.
If not wizards/witches studying death could it be ghosts, ghosts are even a more logical choice to study death. They are already dead, they could be presumably enter and exit the veil. Are they the "inside man"

Another question are souls immortal? Apparently not the broken or fragmented soul akin to Voldemort's, we know a Horcrux can be destroyed along with the fragment of soul it shelters. But that could be left for another day to discuss.
Ok first off this is a great Topic and Mugglenet should posted up there.
Secondly it's logical that "the veil is constantly moving because there is a constant stream of souls passing through it." We know there are people called Mediums in the world who make it their job to be the bridge between the living and the dead. I'm sure the Unspeakables who study the Veil have this gift. I agree that along side of these people would be ghost who were wondering what they missed out on. I believe that pure and whole souls are immortal but with so much evil around even in the Harry Potter world this is a rare thing.


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  #54  
Old November 5th, 2006, 3:26 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by Defyeverything View Post
Ok first off this is a great Topic and Mugglenet should posted up there.
Thank you very much

Quote:
Secondly it's logical that "the veil is constantly moving because there is a constant stream of souls passing through it." We know there are people called Mediums in the world who make it their job to be the bridge between the living and the dead. I'm sure the Unspeakables who study the Veil have this gift.
Which makes me wonder, are these witches/wizards born with such a gift, like Tonks and her Metamorphmugus ability, or do they learn to do it somehow?


Quote:
I agree that along side of these people would be ghost who were wondering what they missed out on. I believe that pure and whole souls are immortal but with so much evil around even in the Harry Potter world this is a rare thing.
Here I must slightly disagree, we are all born with souls that are whole and intact, and the only way we (the readers) have been told how to destroy the soul is through commiting a murder, which rips the soul in half. Not everyone commits a murder and not everyone makes a Horcrux, Horcruxes are apparently a very very very rare thing in the magical world. One has to commit the evil to be evil, can there be tainted souls, sure! But those souls are still whole, until JKR says otherwise


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Last edited by GryffSolider; November 5th, 2006 at 3:29 pm.
  #55  
Old November 5th, 2006, 3:56 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

It's nice to know there is a thread about this because I've always seen the veil this way and haven't gotten a lot of support.

I think it is an excellent editorial. I'll just throw out my theory, in case anyone is interested:

The veil in OotP has always interested me --so much that I firmly believe we will see it again in Book 7 -- and I always wondered what's the deal with it?

I think the veil is a portal to afterlife. And it would be great if a Horcrux can be destroyed by just chucking it through the veil, and for that matter, Voldemort, himself. This theory gets complicated along the way, but I, firmly believe, we will see the veil in Book 7 in some way. I read an interesting editorial in which the writer poses the question: What will happen if you throw the Two-way Mirror on the other side of the veil? I think that's a great idea if you want to create a communication link between the dead and alive. Maybe Harry will be able to contact with Sirius, again?

I also think one of the Hogwarts ghosts could go through the veil and return unaffected. I'm leaning towards Nearly Headless Nick because it would give him a chance to show his Gryffindor bravery and also because he has been mentioned a lot in the books.

I've read theories saying that dementors are made from the people who fall through the veil, and therefore, Sirius will become a dementor. I actually think it is a good theory because the veil's movement, physical appearance matches a dementor's movement and "cloak"

Another thing to throw out:

I was on Wikipedia reading about Dumbledore and I can't believe I never knew this but Percival (One of DD's "middle" names, Percy's full name) means 'pierce the veil' in Old french!

Hmm..is it a hint/clue or suggesting one needs to pierce the veil in order to find out something or am I losing my mind? Jo is very sneaky, after all. I can back that up:

Slughorn means something related to Potions. A co-incidence? I think not.

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Lastly, thanks to Karatekid, luvmeanddespair, Anyanka and everyone who participated in my thread "The Mystery of the Veil" (at HPIA) and supported me.


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  #56  
Old November 5th, 2006, 4:21 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by mugglesrock View Post
It's nice to know there is a thread about this because I've always seen the veil this way and haven't gotten a lot of support.

I think it is an excellent editorial. I'll just throw out my theory, in case anyone is interested:
Thank you very much

Quote:
The veil in OotP has always interested me --so much that I firmly believe we will see it again in Book 7 -- and I always wondered what's the deal with it?

I think the veil is a portal to afterlife. And it would be great if a Horcrux can be destroyed by just chucking it through the veil, and for that matter, Voldemort, himself. This theory gets complicated along the way, but I, firmly believe, we will see the veil in Book 7 in some way. I read an interesting editorial in which the writer poses the question: What will happen if you throw the Two-way Mirror on the other side of the veil? I think that's a great idea if you want to create a communication link between the dead and alive. Maybe Harry will be able to contact with Sirius, again?
Well that would all depend on A:Is the veil merely a portal to the afterlife, leading to a limbo sorta of realm, or B: is it a full blown last destination type of place. And I also agree the DoM will play a role in Book 7!

Quote:
also think one of the Hogwarts ghosts could go through the veil and return unaffected. I'm leaning towards Nearly Headless Nick because it would give him a chance to show his Gryffindor bravery and also because he has been mentioned a lot in the books.
Ummmm possible about Nick.

Quote:
I've read theories saying that dementors are made from the people who fall through the veil, and therefore, Sirius will become a dementor. I actually think it is a good theory because the veil's movement, physical appearance matches a dementor's movement and "cloak"
We know the basics on how Dementors are made, they reproduce, they breed.
To quote Wikipedia and JKR

According to the author, J.K. Rowling, they grow like fungi in the darkest, dankest places, creating a dense, chilly fog.

We also know from the chapter "The other Minister" in HBP, Fudge tells the muggle Prime Minister why they had all the chilly fog in July was from the Dementors breeding.

So I don't think Sirius can become a Dementor, thankfully.



Quote:
Another thing to throw out:

I was on Wikipedia reading about Dumbledore and I can't believe I never knew this but Percival (One of DD's "middle" names, Percy's full name) means 'pierce the veil' in Old french!

Hmm..is it a hint/clue or suggesting one needs to pierce the veil in order to find out something or am I losing my mind? Jo is very sneaky, after all. I can back that up:
Yes that is very instersting...~twirls evil guy moustache~ ...but it could also mean that it was our warning all along that Dumbledore would die in the series, remember Sirius in OoTP the book was peppered with scenes that gave us the warning Sirius would die.

Quote:
Slughorn means something related to Potions. A co-incidence? I think not.
From Wikipedia: His name, which has a generally unpleasant sound in English in keeping with many of the names of Slytherin students and staff, may be derived from "slug" (to drink alcohol) and "horn" (an ancient drinking cup). In the series, a "Horned Slug" is a Potions Ingredient used in Boil-Cure Potion. 'Slughorn' (also spelt 'Slughorne' or 'Sloggorne') is an old Scottish word meaning "battle cry" or "rallying cry", from which "slogan" is derived [1]. Scotland is JK Rowling's country of adoption, and many of her characters (McLaggen, Moody, Scrimgeour, McGonagall) have Scottish names. The name Horace is probably a reference to the Roman philosopher Horace, who like Slughorn, enjoyed wealth and the influence of his associates.


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Last edited by GryffSolider; November 5th, 2006 at 4:24 pm.
  #57  
Old November 5th, 2006, 4:30 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by GryffSolider View Post
Well that would all depend on A:Is the veil merely a portal to the afterlife, leading to a limbo sorta of realm, or B: is it a full blown last destination type of place. And I also agree the DoM will play a role in Book 7!
I believe it is merely a portal. Mortals who pass through it cannot come back, but I believe if someone already dead goes through it and tries to return, it may happen. Then again, this is all speculation.
Quote:
Ummmm possible about Nick.
Why I so strongly believe in this is because Moaning Myrtle, Peeves, and Nick are mentioned so much. Myrtle did her job in CoS, and a bit in GoF. Peeves isn't in the movies which means he isn't that important plot-wise (if he were, then Jo would have asked WB to include Peeves). The only one remaining is Nick and since we already know we are going to learn more about why some people choose to be ghosts, I assumed it will be Nick's job.

Quote:
We know the basics on how Dementors are made, they reproduce, they breed.
To quote Wikipedia and JKR

According to the author, J.K. Rowling, they grow like fungi in the darkest, dankest places, creating a dense, chilly fog.

We also know from the chapter "The other Minister" in HBP, Fudge tells the muggle Prime Minister why they had all the chilly fog in July was from the Dementors breeding.

So I don't think Sirius can become a Dementor, thankfully.
I know dementors breed and I am glad Sirius won't become a dementor, but it was a nice thought -whoever proposed it.
Quote:
Yes that is very instersting...~twirls evil guy moustache~ ...but it could also mean that it was our warning all along that Dumbledore would die in the series, remember Sirius in OoTP the book was peppered with scenes that gave us the warning Sirius would die.
There have been hints of DD's death all along. But consider Percival is Percy's full name and he works for the Ministry. He needs to redeem himself too --once he realizes his family is right-- so it might play a big role. Jo loves to drop hints.


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Old November 5th, 2006, 5:32 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I hope JK doesn't kill Percy, I'm hoping for a Wealsy death-free zone for book 7, cause' really the family has already had it share of losing or almost losing family members ~crosses fingers~


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Old November 5th, 2006, 5:55 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by MariahCarey View Post
I enjoy this, but assuming people can go through it and will die instantly, is that why everyone thinks Harry will push Voldemort through it in the end?
I don't think this would automatically kill Voldemort until all the horcruxes are destroyed. And I think Voldemort would be smart enough to stay out of the Ministry of Magic again now that people know he is back, and that there's a special place where he could be shoved through a sheet and killed. I think peopl eare clinging to this idea because they can't see Harry being able to kill Voldemort through wand magic on his own.


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  #60  
Old November 5th, 2006, 11:00 pm
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by ID824 View Post
I think peopl eare clinging to this idea because they can't see Harry being able to kill Voldemort through wand magic on his own.


People are clinging to this theory, because we have been told time after time that murder is wrong, we know what happens when someone commits murder, their is split in two, I don't think it will matter how "right" or "self-righteous" the killing is. So no one wants Harry to be a murderer, or rather no one wants his soul split in two. Even pushing Voldemort through the veil is murder. Defeat can mean so many different things. The death of the persona of Voldemort, and the death or redemption of Tom Riddle. But I won't speculate on this.


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