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Cracking the Veil



 
 
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  #81  
Old November 8th, 2006, 5:20 pm
GryffSolider  Female.gif GryffSolider is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nreid View Post

We DONT know wether Dumbledore killed him or whether Grindelwald dies of other causes. All we know is that Dumbledore defeated Grindelwald. If Dumbledore DID kill Grindelwald, I think this could be a candidate for what Dumbledore saw when he was drinking the potion. (One of many theories). So the trick for Harry would be to "vanquish" Voldemort with out "killing" Voldemort. My own personal thoughts are that the Veil will be a big part of this, some way or another.
Or vanqish Voldemort with killing Tom Riddle, and what condition would Tom be in with only 1/7 of his soul, the piece that resides in him. I think regardless the last bit of the book will be truely sad.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Nreid View Post
Also, somebody said that they did not think Voldemort would go back to the MoM. I totally understand that point of view but I have to disagree. I think that the MoM is a exactly where Voldmort wants to be (besides Hogwarts). Only because if I was an evil wizard trying to take over the world, I would think the MoM would be an excellent place to start.

Those are just my thoughts as of right now. They tend to change fairly quickly though. =)

I really think the MoM will have key part in the final book, the locked room for one where resides the powerful of elements aka Love, and it is true, if the rate of death for powerful good side witches and wizards stay at the rate it was in HPB, there won't be much opposition to Voldemort and his cadre of DE's just walking in the Ministry

the whole reason why I don't believe the "Harry will die by bringing Voldemort into the veil together" is the "Love room", and the part it will play in the downfall of the Persona of Voldemort, and possibly Tom Riddle as well, presumably of course.


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  #82  
Old November 8th, 2006, 5:25 pm
Nreid  Female.gif Nreid is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

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Originally Posted by GryffSolider View Post
Or

the whole reason why I don't believe the "Harry will die by bringing Voldemort into the veil together" is the "Love room", and the part it will play in the downfall of the Persona of Voldemort, and possibly Tom Riddle as well, presumably of course.

Oooh. Good point. I always forget about the love room.


  #83  
Old November 8th, 2006, 5:30 pm
sweet16  Female.gif sweet16 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

hmm, well im not really sure that the love room has anything to do with how harry will win(which im sure he will!) i think that maybe he will push voldemort into it and as he can't love, he night get haunted by something from his past that made him not able to love, this will distract him and hopefully give harry enough time to get rid of voldy for once and for all! (does that sound good to you guys?) it made sence in my head! don't know if it does on here!


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  #84  
Old November 8th, 2006, 5:40 pm
GryffSolider  Female.gif GryffSolider is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Nreid- Where's the love hehe





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Originally Posted by sweet16 View Post
hmm, well im not really sure that the love room has anything to do with how harry will win(which im sure he will!) i think that maybe he will push voldemort into it and as he can't love, he night get haunted by something from his past that made him not able to love, this will distract him and hopefully give harry enough time to get rid of voldy for once and for all! (does that sound good to you guys?) it made sence in my head! don't know if it does on here!

I'm sure it will play a huge role, since Dumbledore puts the utmost importance that Harry's most powerful ability is his capacity to love, as I posted to Defy, Harry and Tom Riddle are faced with almost he exact same life, and they made completely polar opposite choices of how to lead their lives.

The reason I stick to the Love Room theory is that is surefire way to incapitate Voldemort and Harry will be completely unharmed and will prevail. Yes I agree this gets rid of Voldemort, but we are still left with Tom Riddle and the 1/7, because logically love doesn't kill, its heals, which leads me back to the "Redemption of Tom Riddle" as which I said before

Because well there are many possible outcomes, and no one wants to argue about can a man such as Tom Riddle be reemed, or does he even want the chance of redemption, you can't redeem yourself if you don't regret your choices and actions. See off topic again, I'm horrible for derailing my own threads


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  #85  
Old April 1st, 2007, 9:25 pm
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Chris  Undisclosed.gif Chris is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Not sure if this is the right thread for this, but a thought just struck me. I did a quick search and this is a "veil" thread that seems to be close to what I'd been thinking.
Anyways, here's the thought: Is there a significance to Sirius having had his body fall through the veil? When DD (and all other wizards we know of) died, their bodies remained earthbound, and only their souls went through the veil. Could this be how some sort of connection may be forged between the world "behind the veil" and the world of the living?
I don't know what to make of this thought, but if anyone else has good ideas, fire away . And, if there's a "consensus" that I didn't find regarding the significance, let me know .


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  #86  
Old April 1st, 2007, 9:52 pm
snuka  Female.gif snuka is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I agree the veil is a passage to the Underworld, the world of the dead - which explains why Harry, Neville and Luna heard voices just like they saw Thestrals (I'm confused why Ginny heard voices, she didn't see anyone die like the other three...?). I agree the whispers and veil movements are the voices of souls of the deceased, and I think this is the other alternative of what happens when you die. If you get scared, you become a ghost. If you're not afraid, you pass the veil.



Last edited by snuka; April 1st, 2007 at 10:03 pm.
  #87  
Old June 5th, 2007, 8:58 pm
20ofdecember  Male.gif 20ofdecember is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I think that we will certainly revisit the veil in Deathly Hallows, if nothing else, because it is never explained by any character, yet it plays such an important (albeit mysterious) role in OtP. I will speculate as to what is beyond the veil, and what purpose it may serve in resolving the series.

Dumbledore called the room with the veil the "Death Chamber"

I think the American cover shows a scene beyond the veil- (old arches, the curtains, the blue light on the wood like the dept of mysteries, etc.). This seems to be a different realm- possibly a world between ours and death. I think it would put an interesting in to the series if Harry does not die, but if he lives forever beyond the veil- where Sirius and maybe even the rest of his family (e.g. Lily and James, maybe DD) are.

It is worth noting that "Beyond the Veil" is a vital part of Old Testament Biblical theology. In Moses's Tabernacle, there was a Holy place where sacrifices and offerings were made. Within the Holy Place was a room that was seperated from the tabernacle by a veil that covered what was known as the Holy of Holies, or the Most Holy Place. The Israelite High Priest would venture beyond the veil once a year (like on Hallows Eve wear the realm between the living and the dead is closest?) to offer Sacrifices to God. The Israelites would tie a rope to the high preist, so that if he died in the Holy of Holies, they could pull him out, because anyone besides the high priest who tried to pass beyond the veil would instantly be killed. Is it possible that there are certain individuals in Harry Potter who can enter the veil without veing killed? Mrs. Rowling has said that she doesn't think the books are that secular, so is it possible that the Veil from the Bible is a basis for the veil in HP?

The Veil certainly seems to be a portal of some sort- becuase Sirius falls through it but does not come out the other side.



Certain Mysterious Traits about the Veil

What could the whispers be?

Why does it ripple as if someone is touching it?


  #88  
Old June 5th, 2007, 9:27 pm
MrsPadfoot07  Female.gif MrsPadfoot07 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Wow, I find your Theory very Interesting, The Veil has been one of the most Mysterious topics around and soon we will find out alot more about it in book 7, thanks for your Insight to this matter!


  #89  
Old June 5th, 2007, 9:55 pm
Frankie62446  Female.gif Frankie62446 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I thought about the Old Testament being a parallel as well, but the veil in the Tabernacle also weighed about 10,000 pounds. I don't see the connection.

Does anyone know if Sirius was hit by Avada Kedavra curse when he went through it? I think I remember it just being a "flash of light". No green light, no "rushing sound" as is described with the curse in other places.


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  #90  
Old June 5th, 2007, 9:58 pm
lupin14388  Male.gif lupin14388 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I believe it was a simple stunning spell that knocked him back through the veil


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  #91  
Old June 5th, 2007, 10:06 pm
volcomdude59  Male.gif volcomdude59 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

yeah, like flipendo or something


  #92  
Old June 5th, 2007, 10:12 pm
charmedp7  Female.gif charmedp7 is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I belive that we will find out more about the veil most definitely... and maybe the MoM will play a large role in DH...
But I've got a question... does anyone think that the US DH Children's Cover is in or behind the veil? I've really considrered this idea... but as we know so little about the veil it self it's really hard to determine.


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  #93  
Old June 5th, 2007, 10:14 pm
oneinhufflepuff  Female.gif oneinhufflepuff is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

I'm thinking the veil is a gateway between the world of the living and the world of the dead, and the voices from behind it are the voices of the dead trying to talk to the living. That explains why only people who have suffered a lot or known people who died are so attracted to the veil while those who have not had a traumatic past are afraid of it or at least not attracted to it, and can't even hear the voices. (Neville, Harry, Ginny and Luna hear the voices and are attracted to the veil, Hermione is afraid of it and Ron is just sort of neutral with it)

I bet we'll get to see the veil in Deathly Hallows. I think there might even be a repeat of the end of book 5 where Harry and Voldemort duel in front of it or even behind it. I also thought maybe on Halloween the barrier between the world of the living and the world of the dead was less strong so maybe Harry could go to the veil then and really hear the voices behind it telling him important information.

Also, if the US cover art for Deathly Hallows really is "behind the veil" I like the idea that all those archways are archways to different worlds or rooms, and that the center of the arches is sort of the first stop between worlds or something.

Oh, one more thing I forgot to mention. I always thought that the reason why the veil moved even though there was no wind, was because the souls of those who had just died were traveling through the veil and made it flap as they went through.


  #94  
Old June 6th, 2007, 4:02 am
NCSUCarrie  Undisclosed.gif NCSUCarrie is offline
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Re: Cracking the Veil

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie62446 View Post

Does anyone know if Sirius was hit by Avada Kedavra curse when he went through it? I think I remember it just being a "flash of light". No green light, no "rushing sound" as is described with the curse in other places.
In the book the first spell Bellatrix sends is a Stunning spell (red light) that Sirius blocks, where he procedes to laugh at her and say surely you can do better than that (or something to that effect) and then it says only that he was hit by another flash of light - it does not say what color or what the spell was for this curse. But Sirius is knocked back with a look of surprise and fear on his face as he fell through the veil.


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