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Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis



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  #141  
Old December 24th, 2008, 5:58 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

Well I don't know that I agree with all of that. The way you have presented Bella, she should not have been able to kill either Tonks or Sirius (certainly both at least as worthy as fighting 3 teenagers in the light you laid them out) and Filch should have been able to beat her. I don't think her talent was meant to be construed at that low a level based on the defeats you listed or else we must assume that Sirius and Tonks rather sucked at being warriors.


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  #142  
Old December 24th, 2008, 6:02 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

1. Bellatrix is often seen as the most fanatical of Voldemort's supporters. Why do you think it is that she has devoted her life and efforts so wholly to Voldemort? What influences in her family and life could have led to her becoming one of the most feared Death Eaters? Could she have any romantic feelings for Voldemort?
I think it was a powerful obsession, and Ive seen it too many times in other women. Not in the series of course, but real life scenarios. I think Bella is a sociopath and shes not on the same footing as regular people. She has unhealthy romantic feelings for voldemort. She idolizes him, turning him into this God-like creature, and she fails to see his faults. She does share the same views, and the same beliefs, but even when it comes to Voldemort trusting Snape, she is so afraid of his wrath, so scared to not be his #1 supporter, that she doesnt say anything to correct him, even when she feels she is correct.

2. What do you suppose leads Bellatrix to distrust Snape so, as seen in the HBP chapter 'Spinner's End'? Does this cast any doubts upon her complete trust in Voldemort? Does it speak of any prior relationship with Snape?
I think part of the reason she distrusts Snape is that he is perhaps Voldemorts right hand man, and she so desperately wants that position. She is extremely jealous and doesnt want anyone to be closer than she is. Another huge reason is Snape and Bellas personality differences. Snape is much smarter, and sees the bigger picture, while Bella is angry, hasty, and narrow-sighted. She for instance, would have killed Dumbledore long ago had she been in the position of Snape, and questions why Snape hadnt for so long. I think even if Snape was truly a Death Eater, he wouldnt have killed Dumbledore right away. He would have waited until the time was right and until he was instructed. I think her unhealthy obsession leads to her inability to partially trust Voldemort. She figured Snape wasnt trustworthy, and she was correct, but she knew she could never let another know that she didnt fully trust Voldemort, or risk not being his go-to woman, the position she hadnt been in, in a long time.

3. What kind of relationship do you think that Bellatrix had with her cousin, Sirius, for her to so easily battle against, and ultimately have a hand in killing him?
She saw him as a disloyal traitor. And traitors deserve death. I agree with her views of loyalty, and how it should be a very high priority, even if the rest of her thinking was....off. I doubt she had any relationship with him. He did not follow the typical Black way of thinking so he wasnt family to her. I can relate to her feelings, even though Im not a deranged killer. Loyalty is a very good policy to live by.

4. Bellatrix is said to have been at school and joined forces with several other Death Eaters prior to Harry's parents being at Hogwarts. What factors do you see as contributing to the turning of Bellatrix and her peers to Voldemort, and how could they have gotten away with this in the middle of Hogwarts?
Tom Riddle was very manipulative, very sly, very charming. it would be easy for Bella, as a young girl, to fall in the wake of Riddle. He is also very handsome, something that made it even easier for her to fall in love, or become obsessed with. It doesnt seem that there were as many precautions taken around the Hogwarts days of Tom Riddle, and I dont think people were as weary of the possibilities of what he could become.

5. Bellatrix seems to have a fondness for the Cruciatus curse. What do you think that this says about her personality and history?
Shes nuts.


7. Do you think Belltrix could have been redeemed?
If by "redeemed" you mean locked in a padded cell with a magic-proof straight jacket. No. "one good deed does not redeem a man from a lifetime of wickedness."


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  #143  
Old December 24th, 2008, 8:21 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Well I don't know that I agree with all of that. The way you have presented Bella, she should not have been able to kill either Tonks or Sirius
I don't appreciate the straw-man argument. I specified that Bellatrix was a skilled fighter but she had weaknesses and was neither infallible nor invincible. Moreover... everything I said is canon. She did let her guard down at crucial moments leading to her failing at missions, being captured, needing to be rescued and eventually being killed by someone with less fighting experience. These have been traits with her since the character was first introduced.

So, I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with here, canon?

As for Tonks and Sirius, Sirius underestimated her clearly as shown by his laid-back attitude during their fight and we don't know how Tonks died. For all we know it could have been after Remus' death and she was so overcome with grief that she couldn't react properly.


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  #144  
Old December 24th, 2008, 9:35 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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I don't appreciate the straw-man argument. I specified that Bellatrix was a skilled fighter but she had weaknesses and was neither infallible nor invincible. Moreover... everything I said is canon. She did let her guard down at crucial moments leading to her failing at missions, being captured, needing to be rescued and eventually being killed by someone with less fighting experience. These have been traits with her since the character was first introduced.

So, I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with here, canon?

As for Tonks and Sirius, Sirius underestimated her clearly as shown by his laid-back attitude during their fight and we don't know how Tonks died. For all we know it could have been after Remus' death and she was so overcome with grief that she couldn't react properly.
Bella took out Kingsley and Tonks before arriving to defeat Sirius. I believe that is what her skill was based upon - her efforts against the two Aurors. She was taunting Sirius as much as he was her (in the book) and she came out the victor - showing she is capable of doing both simultaneously. So I don't think that her skill was overestimated.

I don't feel that she was foiled when she crucioed the Longbottoms into insantiy. Her subsequent capture does not diminish the horror she wrought upon them, imo. The children at the MOM were all scurrying away from her and the other DEs and finally ended up in a place where all of the DEs skills would have been brought to bear upon them, but the Order arrived. Again, I don't see that as lack of fighting skill on Bella's part. I don't see her mission failure as a lack of skill either. There was little that could be done because the prophecy was in a glass bottle and easily breakable (which is why none of the DEs tried to manhandle it away when they had the early advantage.) Finally, when she was alone with Harry (and he attempted to crucio her - and later Dumbledore arrived and she required rescue from him by Voldemort) she was under orders not to kill Harry and she followed them. She didn't stand much of a chance against Dumbledore, imo, and so that she needed rescue from him does not diminish her skill as I saw it; there were not many in canon who could challenge Dumbledore after all.

So while I respect your view, what I am disagreeing with is not the canon, but your interpretation of it. I didn't feel I included things you had not indicated, but I may have misunderstood you. I felt you were saying her skill was overestimated because her weaknesses made her vulnerable to people who were much less skilled than she (children, etc. - although perhaps you would not include Filch ). Nonetheless, I disagree with that interpretation of her ability. I felt that made Molly's beating her unrealistic, despite Molly's motherly rage and Bella's taunting attitude.


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  #145  
Old December 26th, 2008, 8:38 pm
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy View Post
But I think this way of looking at it goes much deeper than just Molly v. Bella, because Bella did the same with Sirius. Sirius was motivated by fatherly love to some degree in his paternalistic and protective feelings for Harry. I continuously pray that JKR was not attempting to show motherly love being of more value and worth - but if the focus is on Molly's prowess and ability to win due to her "motherly love" - and less (if at all) on her ability as a warrior, then it rather shines poorly on Sirius. That is, Sirius was a warrior - he had fought in Voldy War I and he didn't seem to have any problems in that regard until Bella came along.

So the tale unwoven brings us to the idea that Sirius allowed his 'reckless desire to taunt and goad Bella' overtake his sense of fatherly love and need to protect (As to the fact that Harry was not actually his flesh and blood kid; I would remove that notion for the sake of discussion because that was never considered a discounting factor in his devotion to Harry.) Yet Molly is unfettered by any need to goad or taunt. So the only factor remaining is that Sirius and Bella were cousins and had a long history, much of which we do not know, behind their relations.

Still, what was JKR thinking here? Because looking at Bella alone, she too was in goading and taunting mode against Sirius - just like with Molly - yet in the event where she should have been more vulnerable (with Sirius based on their previous relationship) she wins. But in a situation where she behaves the same, she does not have the wherewithall to fight like a warrior despite her goading and taunting.

I don't wish to discuss it in terms of Molly and Sirius - in as far as their differing reactions - but in terms of Bella herself. When she is more personally affected and involved in the duel (Sirius) she continues to show prowess - against an opponent who is more talented than Molly. Yet when she is less affected emotionally/personally, against Molly, and behaving in the same manner as she was with Sirius - she "underestimates" - despite the fact that it was an actual duel (not just Molly using a quick Avada Kedavra) and has at least a couple of moments to gauge Molly's offensive and defensive tactics. And despite the fact that her "heart isn't in it" in the same way it would have been with Sirius.

Now one can argue that Bella would be more prone to defeat Sirius because she would have had more reasons and more desire to do so. But did she really? Was she ready to die at the final battle? I don't think so - so why suddenly underestimate? Why no longer look for and take advantages? Why give up even on minimal tactics?

To me, Bella fell right out of character. There was no reason that she could not goad and taunt - even in a highly emotional and charged situation (Sirius) - and still come out the victor. In a less emotional and charged situation, she should have even had more advantage. Hence, ones focus is thrown back to the force of Motherly love that Molly had (overcoming everything, a lesser dueling ability, and a rather quick defeat of the opponent - in a woman who completely fell apart confronting a Boggart vision of her children dying) - and the lack of fatherly like love in Sirius (his own private concerns overcoming his paternal protective feelings and losing, quickly, to a likely near equal opponent - in a man who remained alive v. countless confrontrations with DEs in VWI and ate rats to be near Harry and protect him). I am hopeful that is not where the focus is supposed to be thrown because I would honestly find that despicable writing on Jo's part with respect to these situations. I prefer to feel she simply pulled Bella out of character without thinking about the dual situations, which is negligent writing, but not despicable, in my judgment. An alternative consideration is that Sirius' paternalistic love was not as strong as she painted it to be previous to that moment. But there again is negligence in writing because we have no canon evidence for that - his running there despite the risk speaks to the opposite view. So again, Bella being out of character makes the most sense to me.
You make some good points there, but there is one other difference between the Molly and Sirius situations- Bellatrix was using her own wand when she fought Sirius, and although we don't know how she got the wand she is using in DH, it's clear that it isn't her own (I believe Hermione has it at that point). As Ollivander says in the very first book, 'you will never get such good results with another wizard's wand' (although we find out later that this is unless you've won it off them), that could also have undermined Bella's ability a little in the later fight. I know it's a minor point, but I felt one worth making.

Another possibility, and one a little more relevant to a character analysis of Bella, is the fact that she does have a past history with Sirius. She may very well have been ordered to kill him, like she was Tonks, and she certainly had a strong personal involvement in that battle. However, she is more likely to feel indifferent and disdainful towards Molly Weasley, perhaps making her less intensely involved in the fight and perhaps therefore less effective. She was totally engrossed in the fight with Sirius: if my memory serves me correctly, neither of them noticed when Dumbledore turned up, as they were so engrossed in the fight. The same is true for Molly in DH, but I don't think so for Bellatrix. (The fact that Voldemort was fighting not that far away from her when she battled Molly might also have had an effect on her concentration levels.)

So for those reasons I don't feel it's that unrealistic that Molly beat Bellatrix, especially considering that we don't know for sure the extent of Molly's previous fighting experience. I'm sure that she would have practiced a few defensive spells in case her home and family were attacked, at the very least.


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  #146  
Old December 26th, 2008, 9:21 pm
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Bellatrix was using her own wand when she fought Sirius, and although we don't know how she got the wand she is using in DH, it's clear that it isn't her own (I believe Hermione has it at that point).
You know what - I think you're the first person I've seen who has remembered that little detail.

Excellent point!


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  #147  
Old January 5th, 2009, 5:50 pm
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

[quote]
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Originally Posted by Kharina View Post
You make some good points there, but there is one other difference between the Molly and Sirius situations- Bellatrix was using her own wand when she fought Sirius, and although we don't know how she got the wand she is using in DH, it's clear that it isn't her own (I believe Hermione has it at that point). As Ollivander says in the very first book, 'you will never get such good results with another wizard's wand' (although we find out later that this is unless you've won it off them), that could also have undermined Bella's ability a little in the later fight. I know it's a minor point, but I felt one worth making.
Given the emphasis on wandlore in DH, I think that is very relevant, Kharina.



Quote:
Another possibility, and one a little more relevant to a character analysis of Bella, is the fact that she does have a past history with Sirius. She may very well have been ordered to kill him, like she was Tonks, and she certainly had a strong personal involvement in that battle. However, she is more likely to feel indifferent and disdainful towards Molly Weasley, perhaps making her less intensely involved in the fight and perhaps therefore less effective. She was totally engrossed in the fight with Sirius: if my memory serves me correctly, neither of them noticed when Dumbledore turned up, as they were so engrossed in the fight. The same is true for Molly in DH, but I don't think so for Bellatrix. (The fact that Voldemort was fighting not that far away from her when she battled Molly might also have had an effect on her concentration levels.)
That's how I see it, too. Bella took Sirius seriously (sorry, couldn't resist). She knew he was a potential threat, skilled at duelling as well as a traitor to her family. Molly was a housewife, someone Bellatrix looked down on and didn't see as a credible threat. So, while she was laughing in both situations, I think she also kept her guard up while duelling Sirius. I don't think Sirius kept his guard up as much as he should have, also, the thrill and rush from being out and fighting for the cause again after so much inaction and Azkaban.

Another factor is, in OotP, Bella had a task to accomplish, something to motivate her - she had to get rid of the Order members, and retrieve the prophecy (not knowing it had just smashed). In DH, as far as she was concerned, the battle was won - her dear Tommykins had just finished off Potter and without their symbol, the rest would soon follow. She probably felt a high of victory at this point, which would have made her less cautious.


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  #148  
Old January 26th, 2009, 1:46 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

I am not sure, but do we ever actually see Bellatrix interact with her husband in any way, at all. I don't think we see so much as a cconversation. What did she marry him for?


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  #149  
Old January 26th, 2009, 2:16 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

Bellatrix probably was in love with him before she met Voldemort. Or, she could've married just to keep the pure blood line going.
But once she 'fell in love' with Voldemort, I'm sure her husband realized he was second now instead of being the love of her life.


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  #150  
Old February 24th, 2009, 7:10 pm
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

If I can just revert back to Bella's duelling for a minute, I notice that she "took out" Kingsley and Tonks at the Ministry but only killed Sirius. My feeling is that she had a real axe to grind there - Sirius had betrayed her family and that was a weakness in Voldy's eyes. Tonks she kills in DH but by then Tonks has also betrayed the family badly by marrying a werewolf and Voldy has pretty much told her to get rid of Tonks. Bella doesn't do as much killing as we tend to think - I always felt her speciality was torturing. That's why I think she didn't kill Hermione, Ginny & Luna when she had the chance - more pleasure from taunting them. Ditto with Molly, and what surprises me more isn't that Bella didn't finish off Molly but that Molly had the skill to finish Bella. I realise how little we've known about Molly.

I also agree that Bella was losing it by the end and certainly wasn't taking Molly as seriously as she should. She was seeing the other DEs being put away by the good guys and it was down to her and Voldy to win for her side. They were up against huge odds which may have made her careless.


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  #151  
Old February 24th, 2009, 10:27 pm
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by horcrux4
If I can just revert back to Bella's duelling for a minute, I notice that she "took out" Kingsley and Tonks at the Ministry but only killed Sirius. My feeling is that she had a real axe to grind there - Sirius had betrayed her family and that was a weakness in Voldy's eyes.
We still don't know for sure if it was Bellatrix's spell that killed Sirius and we probably never will. The thing is that Bellatrix's spell was red and Avada Kedavra is green so unless there are other killing curses it might have been the Veil which caused Sirius's death. Also, I really doubt Voldemort cares about Sirius or the Black family and their business in general so if Bellatrix really did kill Sirius then I think it was because she had a grudge, not Voldemort.
Quote:
Ditto with Molly, and what surprises me more isn't that Bella didn't finish off Molly but that Molly had the skill to finish Bella. I realise how little we've known about Molly.
We've seen how emotions enhance magic, for example when Voldemort suddenly blasts his three opponents away when Bella gets killed even though he had been dueling them for some time before that. Molly's victory was just a fluke really.
Quote:
I also agree that Bella was losing it by the end and certainly wasn't taking Molly as seriously as she should.
I don't think she was losing it at all. It's true that she underestimated Molly but she also fought her pretty well and seemed to be taking the duel seriously at least to some extent. Her arrogance certainly played a part in her demise just as the fact that she didn't have her own wand at the time.


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  #152  
Old February 25th, 2009, 5:08 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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We still don't know for sure if it was Bellatrix's spell that killed Sirius and we probably never will. The thing is that Bellatrix's spell was red and Avada Kedavra is green so unless there are other killing curses it might have been the Veil which caused Sirius's death. Also, I really doubt Voldemort cares about Sirius or the Black family and their business in general so if Bellatrix really did kill Sirius then I think it was because she had a grudge, not Voldemort.
Oh I shouldn't think Voldy cares about the Black family except as a means to needle Bella as he is seen to do later about Tonks & Lupin. And I'd forgotten Bella's spell was red not green - good point.

Quote:
We've seen how emotions enhance magic, for example when Voldemort suddenly blasts his three opponents away when Bella gets killed even though he had been dueling them for some time before that. Molly's victory was just a fluke really.
Depends on whether heightened emotions are a fluke. But i agree in principle.

Quote:
I don't think she was losing it at all. It's true that she underestimated Molly but she also fought her pretty well and seemed to be taking the duel seriously at least to some extent. Her arrogance certainly played a part in her demise just as the fact that she didn't have her own wand at the time.
I was thinking of the description of her in the Hall capering about as madly as her Master. (My DH is elsewhere so I can't quote it tonight).She seemed almost beside herself, I thought.


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  #153  
Old April 19th, 2009, 2:07 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

1. Bellatrix is often seen as the most fanatical of Voldemort's supporters. Why do you think it is that she has devoted her life and efforts so wholly to Voldemort? What influences in her family and life could have led to her becoming one of the most feared Death Eaters? Could she have any romantic feelings for Voldemort? I think it was definitly implied she had romantic feelings fo him. She was completely infatuated with him.

3. What kind of relationship do you think that Bellatrix had with her cousin, Sirius, for her to so easily battle against, and ultimately have a hand in killing him? Their relationship probably consisted of her insulting him, and him pulling brilliant pranks on her. I imagine they were equally disgusted with eachothers life choices.


5. Bellatrix seems to have a fondness for the Cruciatus curse. What do you think that this says about her personality and history? I imagine she had a quite painful childhood. Everyone had very high expectaions of her. The Black family always seemed to demand perfection, living up to that is simply impossible.

6. What do you think of her hatred of Tonks for marrying a werewolf?
For the same reason she hated Andromeda for marrying Ted. It was just wrong in her eyes. Also, she may have been a bit jealous. No matter how much she hated the idea of marrying a werewolf, Tonks was happy. The man she loved was willing to except her. Bellatrix on the other hand was pining over Voldemort and getting nothing in return.

7. Do you think Belltrix could have been redeemed? Honestly, no. She just wouldn't be the same character. If she was sane, and compassionate she would be boring. I like her character the way it is- deranged, sadistic, and very entertaining.


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  #154  
Old April 19th, 2009, 8:04 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

1. Bellatrix is often seen as the most fanatical of Voldemort's supporters. Why do you think it is that she has devoted her life and efforts so wholly to Voldemort? What influences in her family and life could have led to her becoming one of the most feared Death Eaters? Could she have any romantic feelings for Voldemort?
The obvious answer may simply be pureblood brainwash. She bought into it, whereas Narcissa was willing to give up the mania (somewhat) for her son, and obviously Andromeda completely rebelled. Bellatrix is driven to succeed, pushed (presumably) first by her parents, then after joining Voldemort is once again determined to please her master by any means necessary ( the Slytherin ambition thing possibly).I think the romantic thing is incredibly interesting. I can't see anyone, even a psychotic murderer being physically attracted to Voldemort... too creepy... and she certainly doesn't desire his companionship (lol). If anything she seems to be mentally infatuated with his ideals, so I guess you can consider that romance to a certain degree...

2. What do you suppose leads Bellatrix to distrust Snape so, as seen in the HBP chapter 'Spinner's End'? Does this cast any doubts upon her complete trust in Voldemort? Does it speak of any prior relationship with Snape?
I don't think she trusts anyone, let alone Snape, who renounced Voldemort and worked 15 years for Dumbledore. Snape doesn't seem to have a good track record for loyalty to begin with; as a teen he betrayed Lily by calling her mudblood, betrayed her again by telling Voldemort about the prophesy (indirectly, possibly), renounces Voldemort when Lily dies, and in 'Spinners End' he claims to be back on Voldemorts side. I wouldn't be inclined to trust Snape either, Death Eater or not.

3. What kind of relationship do you think that Bellatrix had with her cousin, Sirius, for her to so easily battle against, and ultimately have a hand in killing him?
Sirius seems to be loathed by the entire Black clan. He's a blood traiter. His name was blasted off the family tree. He stands for everything she's against

4. Bellatrix is said to have been at school and joined forces with several other Death Eaters prior to Harry's parents being at Hogwarts. What factors do you see as contributing to the turning of Bellatrix and her peers to Voldemort, and how could they have gotten away with this in the middle of Hogwarts?
Voldemort probably recruited straight from Hogwarts. Teen minds are sponges... they soak up anything. Young Bellatrix and friends might have simply thought it was cool, maybe like a gang thing that turned out to be much much more. They probably got away with it because the teachers didn't think anything of a new 'Slytherin's only' clique.

5. Bellatrix seems to have a fondness for the Cruciatus curse. What do you think that this says about her personality and history?
Mental Imbalance??? Probably something horrifyingly traumatic happened in childhood

6. What do you think of her hatred of Tonks for marrying a werewolf?
I think her hatred for Tonks is probably more of an extension of her hatred of Andromeda. Jealousy of her happiness, anger towards her abandonment (especially if she was the oldest), etc. Werewolves are considered "half breeds" termed similarly to "half blood" etc. All "impure" forms of creatures seem to be at the brunt of Voldemort's wrath.... very Nazi esque

7. Do you think Belltrix could have been redeemed?
Doubtful...


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  #155  
Old May 15th, 2009, 1:21 am
Coley  Female.gif Coley is offline
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

1. Bellatrix is often seen as the most fanatical of Voldemort's supporters. Why do you think it is that she has devoted her life and efforts so wholly to Voldemort? What influences in her family and life could have led to her becoming one of the most only got worse as time went on . I think her family obviously sfeared Death Eaters? Could she have any romantic feelings for Voldemort? I think she devoted her life to him because ,as many others have said , she brought up with a strong predjudice and believed in it 100% which set her of with the " Pure-bloods are the best " attitude and her parents may have even encouraged her to join the death eaters . Since Bella was in Slytherin she might have been exposed to the dark arts from an early age which would have made them seem acceptable . I don't think she had any romantic feelings towards voldemort - an obsession maybe - but not romance , however I have a sneaky suspicion that if voldemort had ever wanted her as a partner ( Yeah right ) she would have complied .

2. What do you suppose leads Bellatrix to distrust Snape so, as seen in the HBP chapter 'Spinner's End'? Does this cast any doubts upon her complete trust in Voldemort? Does it speak of any prior relationship with Snape?
It seems Snape had everyone except Dumbledore (and voldemort , although since he got it wrong it doesn't really count ) scratching their heads in terms of where Snapes loyalties lay . There are many reasons she didn't trust Snape , one of them being that he stayed at hogwarts to "spy" for a master he supposedly thought dead ( thats what she more or less said in HBP) . I think Bella trusted Voldemort but , as she stated , believed he was " mistaken" where Snape was concerned , and who can blame her ? .

3. What kind of relationship do you think that Bellatrix had with her cousin, Sirius, for her to so easily battle against, and ultimately have a hand in killing him? he was a blood traitor , which according to ron is as bad as being a muggleborn , so she hated him .

4. Bellatrix is said to have been at school and joined forces with several other Death Eaters prior to Harry's parents being at Hogwarts. What factors do you see as contributing to the turning of Bellatrix and her peers to Voldemort, and how could they have gotten away with this in the middle of Hogwarts? I think many things drew Bella and her friends to it , first and foremost her predjudices . Secondly her friends were drawn to voldemort so it's comprehensible that she would want to join too . Lastly , she liked the power and superiority that being a death eater had and that ultimatley pushed her into it . I don't think there was anything in Hogwarts that she and her friends needed to get away with . I always had the impression that they became death eaters after Hogwarts and in school they were just nasty predjudice bullys who caused trouble , not great obviously , but there was nothing really big that happend that which they got away with at school .

5. Bellatrix seems to have a fondness for the Cruciatus curse. What do you think that this says about her personality and history? I think it just reinforces the fact she liked power and got a nasty kick out of torturing others , she had no regret for anything horrible she did and when all comes to all , was an evil person .


6. What do you think of her hatred of Tonks for marrying a werewolf?
she felt it was making the blood line even more impure and probably loathed it . She may have even felt embarrassed by it .

7. Do you think Belltrix could have been redeemed? No , she taunted Neville over the insanity of his parents , she would proudly sacrifice her son (if she had one ) because of her hatred she had for different groups of people , she would happily murder her own flesh and blood if they dared make friends with people who deems unworthy and to top it off she gets satisfaction out of all of thoose facts . The only thing I'll give her is that she is pretty talented .



Last edited by Coley; May 15th, 2009 at 10:14 am. Reason: Spelling mistakes .
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  #156  
Old June 19th, 2009, 3:10 pm
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Pearl_Took  Female.gif Pearl_Took is offline
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

I've been thinking about this and I have concluded that I find Bellatrix, rather than Voldemort, the most effective and frightening of Rowling's villains.

Voldemort is cold and unfeeling, sure, but for all that he is supposed to be Harry's dark nemesis, I actually struggle to find him scary.

Bella, on the other hand ... JKR really makes me feel her sadism. When she threatens to torture Ginny, in OotP, (when DA members are cornered by the Death Eaters in the Department of Mysteries) and clearly expresses pleasure at the thought of doing so, it sends a genuine shiver through me.

She is portrayed as intelligent, passionate and fanatical. Her feelings for Voldemort make me go

One of JKR's most convincing villains -- definitely.


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  #157  
Old July 10th, 2009, 8:20 am
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Trixa View Post
We still don't know for sure if it was Bellatrix's spell that killed Sirius and we probably never will. The thing is that Bellatrix's spell was red and Avada Kedavra is green so unless there are other killing curses it might have been the Veil which caused Sirius's death.
With great respect to your opinion, I must disagree. IMO, it was Bellatrix's curse that had caused Sirius's death, I cant be sure if it was supposed to be a 'Killing Curse' or not, but it was the fact that he'd been hit by the curse in the chest, which seems to be twice as dangerous, in OOTP when the Ministry Officials arrived at Hogwarts to arrest Hagrid and then they hit Mcgonagall in the chest with their stunning spells, Madame Pomfrey admitted her surprise that they spells didnt kill Mcgonagall, Also when Umbridge finds Harry in her office, talking to Sirius through the fire, she decides to cruciate him, and was thinking of the best place to hit him with the curse, which makes me think that the place which the curse had hit must affect the results of the curse. So it must be the place the curse had hit, plus Bella's skill that had killed Sirius and not the veil, IMHO.

Quote:
Also, I really doubt Voldemort cares about Sirius or the Black family and their business in general so if Bellatrix really did kill Sirius then I think it was because she had a grudge, not Voldemort.
IMO, Voldemort cares about The Blacks and every other pure-blood family, Tonks was a member of the Black family too, and he ordered Bella to 'Cut away those parts that threaten the health of the rest.' So IMO, Voldemort had also asked Bella to kill Sirius, too not just because of being a bloodtraitor, but because he was an advantage to the Order, he was a skilled wizard, and an Animagus, and anyways Bella had said in DH that Bloodtraitors were next to MudBloods according to her, so like her master she must've wanted Sirius dead, IMO.

Quote:
We've seen how emotions enhance magic, for example when Voldemort suddenly blasts his three opponents away when Bella gets killed even though he had been dueling them for some time before that. Molly's victory was just a fluke really.
True, but I think it was a bit too much, we never have seen Molly duelling anyone, it surprised me that she was able to beat one of the most skilled witchs mentioned throughout the series, no matter how angry she was, emotions may enhance magic as you've pointed out, but IMO, they cant create a skill that wasnt there in the first place. So again I tend to think that being hit in the chest was the main reason of the death and not the curse itself.

Quote:
I don't think she was losing it at all. It's true that she underestimated Molly but she also fought her pretty well and seemed to be taking the duel seriously at least to some extent. Her arrogance certainly played a part in her demise just as the fact that she didn't have her own wand at the time.
I quite agree with that one, I think arrogance and underestimation of other people, brought both Bellatrix and Voldemort down, but I'm not sure if she had been taking the duel seriously enough, it's true that 'Both women were fighting to kill' but to Bellatrix it might've been sort of fun after the pleasant events of the night (i.e Harry's death), and honestly how serious could she be if had the ability to come up with songs, wasnt she saying something like 'what are the children going to do once Mommie had had gone the same way as Freddie?'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pearl_Took View Post
I've been thinking about this and I have concluded that I find Bellatrix, rather than Voldemort, the most effective and frightening of Rowling's villains.

Voldemort is cold and unfeeling, sure, but for all that he is supposed to be Harry's dark nemesis, I actually struggle to find him scary.

Bella, on the other hand ... JKR really makes me feel her sadism. When she threatens to torture Ginny, in OotP, (when DA members are cornered by the Death Eaters in the Department of Mysteries) and clearly expresses pleasure at the thought of doing so, it sends a genuine shiver through me.

She is portrayed as intelligent, passionate and fanatical. Her feelings for Voldemort make me go

One of JKR's most convincing villains -- definitely.
I think they are equally frightening actually, but I think Bella's character was better written than Voldemort's. On one hand, in the books we're told that Voldemort is frightening, that everyone is scared of him that they cant even say his name, but we didnt see any of it before four years and IMO he wasnt so impressive in GOF he kept saying Look what will happen to the boy who lived, they boy they call my downfall ,etc. Then next thing that happens is Harry's escape, on the other hand nothing was said about Bella, we were shown her bravery in GoF as she declared her continued loyality to Voldemort, then her cruelty and sadism in OOTP and her pleasure while torturing Neville, her skill as she beats two Aurors, kills Sirius and manages to escape Dumbledore's spell, IMO she looks more scary but she's just as scary as he is.


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  #158  
Old July 10th, 2009, 1:18 pm
Trixa  Female.gif Trixa is offline
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by bellatrix93
IMO, Voldemort cares about The Blacks and every other pure-blood family, Tonks was a member of the Black family too, and he ordered Bella to 'Cut away those parts that threaten the health of the rest.' So IMO, Voldemort had also asked Bella to kill Sirius, too not just because of being a bloodtraitor, but because he was an advantage to the Order, he was a skilled wizard, and an Animagus, and anyways Bella had said in DH that Bloodtraitors were next to MudBloods according to her, so like her master she must've wanted Sirius dead, IMO.
But Voldemort had no idea that Sirius would even be there. The plan was to lure Harry to the Ministry and get the Prophecy. The fact that some members of the Order showed up wasn't part of the plan.
As for Tonks, I thought there was more of a way to test Bellatrix's loyalty rather than Voldemort having anything against Tonks.

Quote:
True, but I think it was a bit too much, we never have seen Molly duelling anyone, it surprised me that she was able to beat one of the most skilled witchs mentioned throughout the series, no matter how angry she was, emotions may enhance magic as you've pointed out, but IMO, they cant create a skill that wasnt there in the first place. So again I tend to think that being hit in the chest was the main reason of the death and not the curse itself.
I agree that the duel was very far fetched so that's why I was trying to come up with an explanation for it and make it seem less so. The fact that Bellatrix did not duel with her own wand could have been a factor that contributed to her defeat.

Quote:
I quite agree with that one, I think arrogance and underestimation of other people, brought both Bellatrix and Voldemort down, but I'm not sure if she had been taking the duel seriously enough, it's true that 'Both women were fighting to kill' but to Bellatrix it might've been sort of fun after the pleasant events of the night (i.e Harry's death), and honestly how serious could she be if had the ability to come up with songs, wasnt she saying something like 'what are the children going to do once Mommie had had gone the same way as Freddie?'.
Yes she was but she still fought pretty well quite a long time before she said that.

Quote:
I think they are equally frightening actually, but I think Bella's character was better written than Voldemort's. On one hand, in the books we're told that Voldemort is frightening, that everyone is scared of him that they cant even say his name, but we didnt see any of it before four years and IMO he wasnt so impressive in GOF he kept saying Look what will happen to the boy who lived, they boy they call my downfall ,etc. Then next thing that happens is Harry's escape, on the other hand nothing was said about Bella, we were shown her bravery in GoF as she declared her continued loyality to Voldemort, then her cruelty and sadism in OOTP and her pleasure while torturing Neville, her skill as she beats two Aurors, kills Sirius and manages to escape Dumbledore's spell, IMO she looks more scary but she's just as scary as he is.
Well, the reason some people find Bellatrix more scary than Voldemort is because they think that she is thouroughly insane and capable of anything. The things is though, that Voldemort and Bella are equally instable, they just show two different kinds of insanity. Voldemort is cold and Bellatrix is overemotional and more likely to kill you simply because you made her angry. However, Voldemort is presented as a tad more cruel than Bellatrix because Voldemort kills everybody who gets in his way whereas Bellatrix has let Tonks and Kingsley escape her in book five. She seems more content with just defeating someone in a duel without necessarily killing them. Voldemort is also more skilled than Bellatrix so that's why he could be considered more scary. You might have a chance of escaping Bellatrix but definitely not Voldemort.


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  #159  
Old July 10th, 2009, 3:10 pm
hbponjuly15  Female.gif hbponjuly15 is offline
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

i think that in thier actions...bellatrix is more insane and she laughs insanely and she has that demeanor around her.while voldemort just kills because he thinks they are in his way..though in DH we saw him kill or try to that whole room full of people...while if either apperared at my door i would most likely have to be more scared if riddle sowed up..because he will kill you no matter what...while bellatrix she would coy with you...give u time and then you could et a way..in the personalities bellatrix is far scarier and in the skill it would be voldemort...


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Old July 13th, 2009, 12:09 pm
luvlunalovegood  Female.gif luvlunalovegood is offline
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Re: Bellatrix Lestrange: Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by hbponjuly15 View Post
i think that in thier actions...bellatrix is more insane and she laughs insanely and she has that demeanor around her.while voldemort just kills because he thinks they are in his way..though in DH we saw him kill or try to that whole room full of people...while if either apperared at my door i would most likely have to be more scared if riddle sowed up..because he will kill you no matter what...while bellatrix she would coy with you...give u time and then you could et a way..in the personalities bellatrix is far scarier and in the skill it would be voldemort...
Voldemort is always so emotionless. He killed and killed many without showing what he thought or felt about it at all. Bellatrix taunts. She does creepy things and yes, is on the bank of insanity. She is clearly skilled and her passion for the Dark Arts is exteremly obvious. (She even tried to instruct harry how to cast one effectively!). Voldemort's great liking to the Dark Arts is subdued. The only way we know this is through his actual curse usage and his Horcruxes. Bellatrix also tends to make you feel weak. I think that she's the type to in the middle of a duel pointo out your errors and boast of her truimph. Throughout the series, Bellatrix is portayed to be a true villain and honestly mad. Bellatrix even treats her family in a dirty manner! And she seems to intimidate them too! *freaky*


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