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Little Questions Answered v.21



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  #1121  
Old April 15th, 2015, 4:20 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by Kanksha View Post
Do we simply attribute this to a combination of Harry's inexperience with the Imperius Curse and not having his own wand? Perhaps he does not know how to cast it strongly enough? Draco after all is able to keep controlling Rosmerta through most of the school year but he must have been properly taught how to do so. Or can anyone offer a better explanation?
Sounds good to me.


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  #1122  
Old April 15th, 2015, 9:12 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by Kanksha View Post
Do we simply attribute this to a combination of Harry's inexperience with the Imperius Curse and not having his own wand? Perhaps he does not know how to cast it strongly enough? Draco after all is able to keep controlling Rosmerta through most of the school year but he must have been properly taught how to do so. Or can anyone offer a better explanation?
I think this is a case of Harry again not knowing how to use a spell correctly .I think he could have just given them multiple orders without having to recast the spell each time ,but he wasn't aware of how to use the spell correctly.


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  #1123  
Old May 14th, 2015, 7:24 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

Are we ever told what kind of spell Hagrid used to make the boat move?


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  #1124  
Old May 14th, 2015, 7:41 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Are we ever told what kind of spell Hagrid used to make the boat move?
"Forward!"


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  #1125  
Old May 16th, 2015, 5:04 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by Kanksha View Post
Do we simply attribute this to a combination of Harry's inexperience with the Imperius Curse and not having his own wand? Perhaps he does not know how to cast it strongly enough? Draco after all is able to keep controlling Rosmerta through most of the school year but he must have been properly taught how to do so. Or can anyone offer a better explanation?
I think it's a matter of why you imperius someone and what you want them to do. Clearly Harry cast the Imperius correctly because they not only did what he wanted them to do, but were still under his influence after the action was completed. Harry apparently thought he needed to say "imperio" to direct them again, however instinctively at Gringotts, he merely flicks his wand at Travers to make him turn & follow them without muttering imperio. In Ravenclaw tower, Professor McGonagall uses the Imperius on Amicus, makes him hand over his & Alecto's wands, and then has him lie down on the floor next to his sister. Once she envelopes them in magical netting, he just continues to lie there & do nothing. However, it doesn't mean that she didn't cast the spell correctly, only that it was all she wanted him to do for the moment. Rosmerta acted normally when Draco didn't need anything, and the trigger point for controlled action was the activation of the object similar to Hermione's charmed fake galleons. But although Rosmerta acted normally, she was always subject to doing Draco's will whenever he contacted her.


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Old June 21st, 2015, 4:58 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

Why didn't Dumbledore use a time turner to save the Potters from being killed?


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  #1127  
Old June 21st, 2015, 5:16 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by The_Green_Woods View Post
Why didn't Dumbledore use a time turner to save the Potters from being killed?
Because Rowling needed them to be dead to carry on with her plot?

The books are full of situations like that. Remember Harry's summoning charm during the first task of the TriWizard Tourney in GoF? It's incomprehensible he didn't summon the map and the egg when his leg was stuck in the trick staircase later in the same book.


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  #1128  
Old June 21st, 2015, 5:27 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by The_Green_Woods View Post
Why didn't Dumbledore use a time turner to save the Potters from being killed?
What if the loss of the Potters was for the greater good? Voldemort was in that moment defeated, with Harry still having the potential to destroy him. If the Potters had lived, what would that mean for the rest of the wizarding world? Every action has a potential unintended consequence.


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  #1129  
Old June 21st, 2015, 10:43 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by purplehawk View Post
Because Rowling needed them to be dead to carry on with her plot?

The books are full of situations like that. Remember Harry's summoning charm during the first task of the TriWizard Tourney in GoF? It's incomprehensible he didn't summon the map and the egg when his leg was stuck in the trick staircase later in the same book.
Why would he have summoned the egg & map? He was only invisible to the eye, the cloak doesn't turn into ether when you wear it. The egg & map would have been blocked by the cloak if summoned and Harry would have been found out.


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  #1130  
Old June 21st, 2015, 11:11 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by HedwigOwl View Post
Why would he have summoned the egg & map? He was only invisible to the eye, the cloak doesn't turn into ether when you wear it. The egg & map would have been blocked by the cloak if summoned and Harry would have been found out.
He tried several maneuvers before Filch turned up. I've never been able to go along with the fact he didn't remember a summoning charm, and stick a hand outside the cloak to catch the items. Then he could've hidden the egg and the map under the cloak, and Filch would have been scratching his head.


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  #1131  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 1:53 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by purplehawk View Post
He tried several maneuvers before Filch turned up. I've never been able to go along with the fact he didn't remember a summoning charm, and stick a hand outside the cloak to catch the items. Then he could've hidden the egg and the map under the cloak, and Filch would have been scratching his head.
The passage (GOF, chapter 25, pages 467-468 U.S.) seems to show that Harry merely tried to tap the map to clear it, as it showed Harry's location regardless of the cloak, while the egg couldn't be identified as Harry's by looking at it. The egg had opened and fallen down the stairs and was screeching, and the book states that Filch arrived "almost immediately", and Snape very soon after. There wasn't really any time for Harry to do anything except try to wipe the map and not be discovered.


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  #1132  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 2:59 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by HedwigOwl View Post
The passage (GOF, chapter 25, pages 467-468 U.S.) seems to show that Harry merely tried to tap the map to clear it, as it showed Harry's location regardless of the cloak, while the egg couldn't be identified as Harry's by looking at it. The egg had opened and fallen down the stairs and was screeching, and the book states that Filch arrived "almost immediately", and Snape very soon after. There wasn't really any time for Harry to do anything except try to wipe the map and not be discovered.
What if he hadn't tried to "wipe" the map - with his wand, mind you - and he had instead murmured "Accio" when his wand was already pointed directly at the map? Maybe he wouldn't have had time to summon both the map and the egg, I'll grant you that one, but his forgetfulness in that situation is one of the more infuriating omissions in the series. At least to me. I see Harry forgetting that spell - one that he worked so hard on earlier in GoF - as mere plot contrivance. Fake Moody would have been exposed a lot earlier had Harry had the map in his hand or pocket when he left that staircase for the night.

I've been reading the series with my 8yo grandson. We talk about each of the chapters after we're read them aloud. Sometimes we stop and talk during the read when at a critical point and he has a question. He actually asked, while Harry was still stuck in the trick staircase, and before Filch appeared, "Nana, why didn't Harry just summon them?"


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  #1133  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 4:05 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by purplehawk View Post
What if he hadn't tried to "wipe" the map - with his wand, mind you - and he had instead murmured "Accio" when his wand was already pointed directly at the map? Maybe he wouldn't have had time to summon both the map and the egg, I'll grant you that one, but his forgetfulness in that situation is one of the more infuriating omissions in the series. At least to me. I see Harry forgetting that spell - one that he worked so hard on earlier in GoF - as mere plot contrivance. Fake Moody would have been exposed a lot earlier had Harry had the map in his hand or pocket when he left that staircase for the night.

I've been reading the series with my 8yo grandson. We talk about each of the chapters after we're read them aloud. Sometimes we stop and talk during the read when at a critical point and he has a question. He actually asked, while Harry was still stuck in the trick staircase, and before Filch appeared, "Nana, why didn't Harry just summon them?"
While it's easy to look at a book passage and question why it was written as it is, that doesn't mean it should have been rewritten. Harry was still quite a young and immature teenager when this happened. He had time to make one attempt and chose what he thought would serve him best to not get caught. In my opinion, nothing in that scene is out of character for Harry.

As for the theory that fake Moody could have been caught earlier without the map -- I don't think so. Crouch Jr. was good enough to fool Dumbledore up to that point, map or no map, fake Moody would probably have made it to the same point without detection. The departure from the real Moody's behavior after Harry arrives with Cedric's body is what gave him away.


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  #1134  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 4:23 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

Okay. We'll just agree to disagree on that point.


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  #1135  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 4:40 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

OK, I'm good with that.


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  #1136  
Old June 22nd, 2015, 5:17 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

I think that at the moment that he got stuck he panicked and temporarily forgot everything he had learned . I feel that all he was thinking about was how much trouble he was going to get into if he got caught . I also believe it was necessary for the plot for fake Moody to find out about the map.


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  #1137  
Old June 25th, 2015, 7:50 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

And remember that Harry was never shown to be that comfortable with the summoning charm. It took tons of practice to get it to work, and he was never very confident in his ability to use it. Summoning it to the cloak wouldn't have silenced it either. For all Harry knew, dropping the egg down the stairs might have broken the clasp. Had he summoned it and not been able to get it closed again, he could be stuck standing on the stairs under an invisibility cloak, holding a screeching egg after hours.

Plus, Harry was panicked. Trying to get unstuck was probably his first concern. Under the circumstances, I'm not surprised that his first thoughts weren't the accio spell.


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  #1138  
Old June 27th, 2015, 7:04 pm
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Originally Posted by BurrowGhoul View Post
If the Potters had lived, what would that mean for the rest of the wizarding world?
The Wizarding World would not have depended upon a small boy to deal with Voldemort for their sake and so maybe they would have done something to deal with him, since Harry would have had parents. He would have grown up without the abuse. The Potters would not have allowed Harry to be manipulated by Dumbledore (or so I hope).


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  #1139  
Old June 28th, 2015, 2:13 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

Well, without the Potters dying there's no Love Protection for Harry. Which means there's nothing to destroy Voldemort's body and the Wizarding War just continues.

So Harry would grow up in what's basically a Police State, or worse.


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Old June 28th, 2015, 8:36 am
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Re: Little Questions Answered v.21

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Well, without the Potters dying there's no Love Protection for Harry. Which means there's nothing to destroy Voldemort's body and the Wizarding War just continues.

So Harry would grow up in what's basically a Police State, or worse.
Doesn't it depend on the circumstances of the Potters' survival? Perhaps he went to the Longbottoms instead and the above would probably follow since he would have killed them all. Or maybe he was never told that portion of the prophecy. Oh, so many possibilities!!


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