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  #1  
Old July 13th, 2007, 1:23 am
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Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Welcome to the post-DH discussion of the Ravenclaws. Previous discussion without spoilers can be found here: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis


Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?


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Last edited by Jessica; July 23rd, 2007 at 9:47 pm.
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  #2  
Old July 24th, 2007, 9:16 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Ravenclaw are the thinkers, the scientists of Hogwarts. They are not content with learning spells, they experiment and try to understand how magic "really" works. They are very theoretical, and can seem a bit cold and distant to other people.

In a MBTI analysis, Ravenclaws are probably predominantly iNtuitive-Thinkers.

//Smartypants. Total Ravenclaw.


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Old July 25th, 2007, 7:14 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I absolutely LOVED that the password to the Ravenclaw common room was answering a question. It really shows that Ravenclaws need to be abstract and philosophical thinkers.


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Old July 25th, 2007, 5:12 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Rell View Post
I absolutely LOVED that the password to the Ravenclaw common room was answering a question. It really shows that Ravenclaws need to be abstract and philosophical thinkers.
I think this was key to why Hermione was not in Ravenclaw. She was always dismissive of the abstract and wanted the FACTS. The fact that it would except a well reasoned answer was really wonderful. I loved how Luna asked Harry for his opionion. I could see this as typical and lead to debates that followed as typical Ravenclaws debated it as they entered the room.

I think it was also notable, how death eaters, power hungry RW types, had problems with this.

All the Best,

Lunatic


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Old July 25th, 2007, 5:20 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I think of Percy being the archetypcal Ravenclaw until he repented and bravely put his life on the line for his family.


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Old July 25th, 2007, 5:36 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Lunatic View Post
I think this was key to why Hermione was not in Ravenclaw. She was always dismissive of the abstract and wanted the FACTS. The fact that it would except a well reasoned answer was really wonderful. I loved how Luna asked Harry for his opionion. I could see this as typical and lead to debates that followed as typical Ravenclaws debated it as they entered the room.
The questions didn't seem to have one right answer. The room just said that it liked the answer, not that it was the right one. That's something that Hermione would have trouble with. I like the idea that they would go into the common room debating. I liked that McGonagal had no problem getting in - it fits her personality well.


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Old July 26th, 2007, 2:23 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

The fact that McGonagal could get in is another way of showing that you are not stuck in one frame of mind just because of your house. I liked the password idea because it showed that Ravenclaws do not just learn off the book, they think about it. Hermione said that the Hat did think about putting her in Ravenclaw. I wonder did it decide her bravery was a stronger trait or that she did not fulfill Ravenclaw characteristics. I like to think she just stood out as a Gryffindor because of her use of logic (book 1) and her insistance that learning the theory behind spells would help (book 4) understand.


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Old August 2nd, 2007, 5:51 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Sinistra255 View Post
I think of Percy being the archetypcal Ravenclaw until he repented and bravely put his life on the line for his family.
I see Percy as the opposite of a Ravenclaw. Narrow minded, accepting the handed down wisdom, judgmental etc. He couldn't think outside the box if it were made of air. No wonder there was no indication that Miss Clearwater stayed with him. She was probably irritated with his stick in the mud ways, for reasons totally different then the Weasleys.
Speaking of which, Ravenclaw Girls probably would be totally into George (and Fred, when not dead) though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartypants View Post
In a MBTI analysis, Ravenclaws are probably predominantly iNtuitive-Thinkers.

//Smartypants. Total Ravenclaw.
Me too.
RW Honorary "RavenClaws": Benjamin Franklin, Tomas Eddison, Bill Gates, Jane Goodall, Albert Einstein, Isaac Asimov, Fox Mulder (yea fiction, but who cares), Nostradamus, Marcus Aurelius, Julian the Apostate, Socrates, Al Gore, unless he's Gryffindor, Actors, writers and artists too numerous to name.

All the Best,

Lunatic



Last edited by Lunatic; August 2nd, 2007 at 5:57 am.
  #9  
Old August 2nd, 2007, 7:05 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Lunatic View Post
I see Percy as the opposite of a Ravenclaw. Narrow minded, accepting the handed down wisdom, judgmental etc. He couldn't think outside the box if it were made of air.
I agree. Ravenclaws don't seem to just be smart - they seem to be philosophical. Percy is not philosophical.


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Old August 3rd, 2007, 8:04 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Here's a rough way to sort yourself. Which is your favorite of these four social sciences: history, economics, political science, or psychology?

If you say "history," you're most likely a Ravenclaw. As others have said, Ravenclaws tend to be not only intelligent but intellectual---they enjoy learning for its own sake and not necessarily for practical reasons, and need to analyze and understand the theory and reasons behind something, just as a student of history does. By contrast, if you said "political science" you're more likely a Gryffindor, since this concerns a more practical application of intelligence. Economics would be Slytherin, since understanding economics makes one resourceful and able to do much with little. Psychology would be Hufflepuff, since it concerns fairness: knowing how a person thinks is essential for being fair towards them.

The differences between Gryffindor and Ravenclaw can be seen in the roles of their two Heads of House throughout the books. Both McGonagall and Flitwick demonstrate exceptional intelligence and skill with magic and are very good teachers. McGonagall tends to use her knowledge with wider goals in mind: observe how she says, "Potter, I will assist you to become an Auror if it's the last thing I do!" Her role is that of a guiding mentor who helps Harry to be brave. Flitwick, by contrast, is more focused on the magic itself: observe how he leaves a bit of Fred and George's swamp because it was "a really good piece of magic." His role is mainly to introduce a number of magical theories and new spells. The difference is not, of course, absolute: Flitwick fights at the Battle of Hogwarts, and McGonagall teaches Gamp's Law of Elemental Transfiguration. In general, however, this is how I see Ravenclaw and its contrasts to Gryffindor.

Observe also that one of Ravenclaw's attributes is "wit", which I interpret in the sense of "having your wits about you." Remember "wit beyond measure is man's greatest treasure." Luna demonstrates this well---for example, when Harry is burning his head off trying to figure out how to get to London, she calmly comes up with the idea of Thestrals.

I have long considered myself a Ravenclaw. As a member of Academic Decathlon, I spend a great deal of time learning just because I enjoy it---I love to exercise my mind, compare it with others', and learn from them. I also tend to have my wits about me; for example, I almost never forget the route from point A to point B. My weakness tends to be in application of my knowledge; for example, last year in AP Chemistry I understood nearly every concept but was often unsuccessful in the laboratory. I would think this would be many Ravenclaws' main weakness.

I can also give myself as an example of someone who would be almost placed in another house, but end up in Ravenclaw. I tend to be very moralistic and opinionated, which would often indicate Gryffindor. (I do also love political science.) However, my strongly held morals and opinions are usually based on what I believe is best for human wisdom. This, combined with my academic inclinations, would make Ravenclaw override Gryffindor.

Any other self-appointed Ravenclaws wish to give their thoughts?



Last edited by AK_WDB; August 3rd, 2007 at 8:09 am.
  #11  
Old August 3rd, 2007, 9:04 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Well, it has already come out in the books that the Sorting Hat really wanted to put Hermione in Ravenclaw, so it didn't really rule it out.

What has been revealed in interviews, and which fits rather well with what has been revealed so far, is that the Hat goes not only by what suits you, but by your potential.

Hermione, who was already clever, smart and bookish, really didn't need ravenclaw membership to become the smartest witch her age. But her latent bravery, her potential for courage would never flourish if she landed with the blue school uniform, and so she got placed in Gryffindor.

It seems therefore that ravenclaw isn't just "gryffindor and slytherin rejects, or that people in this house "lack" something which kept them from other houses, but rather that students are appointed to the houses which will develop their inclinations best.

So when the Ravenclaw students are baffled that Hermione, who is so very much an intellectual, isn't in their house, it's not because she doesn't think outside the box enough. It's because she needed a different type of stimulus to become a more rounded person.

And, of course, choice does impose an important factor here...


  #12  
Old August 3rd, 2007, 4:54 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I was always under the impression that a person who is in Ravenclaw has the first priority of learning. Whatever happens, learning and figuring things out always comes first.

This is why Hermione, Snape, Tom Riddle and other very intelligent people weren't in Ravenclaw, but in other houses. Hermione, although she was smart, would lay down her textbooks and, say, help her best friend hunt horcruxes. Tom Riddle, on the other hand, was also very intelligent, but prized power and notoriety above learning. Snape was more intent upon other things.


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  #13  
Old August 5th, 2007, 11:29 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I don't think it's exactly fair to say that intelligent people are only sorted into Ravenclaw if they lack Gryffindor or Slytherin traits. Ravenclaws have their own unique way of looking at things; they seem very open-minded and curious, and, as their door-knocker showed, seek something new to learn at every opportunity. These aren't things that are necessarily associated with any other house.


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Old August 6th, 2007, 4:11 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by hermy_weasley2 View Post
Welcome to the post-DH discussion of the Ravenclaws. Previous discussion without spoilers can be found here: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis


Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?
I think Ravenclaws are more open-minded and then anything else. I thinK Luna Lovegood is the perfect example of a Ravenclaw. She gives the impression of not being that smart but she is open-minded to the point of insanity. The way to get into Ravenclaw common room is also important. They ask a question which has no wrong answer which shows that Ravenclaws are thinkers and people who learn for the sake of learning not people like Riddle or Hermione who always learn because they have a goal to accomplish. Hermione just to pass a test and Riddle to conquer the world. For some reason I can't picture Luna studying for Exams like Hermione.

I think the Raven is a bird that symbolizes flying and freedom. That's just me though.


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Old September 5th, 2007, 2:52 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by Mike_NYY View Post
For some reason I can't picture Luna studying for Exams like Hermione.

I think the Raven is a bird that symbolizes flying and freedom. That's just me though.
Oddly enough, I could see Luna doing almost as well and definately better then Harry and Ron.

All the Best,

Lunatic


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Old September 5th, 2007, 6:55 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?

Yes. To get into Ravenclaw you must be clever and I would think that's their main quality. "Wit Beyond Measure Is Man's Greatest Treasure"

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?

Luna, most definitely. She shows bravery and loyalty to friends that would be beyond the "qualifications" to get into Ravenclaw. I think Luna was placed into Ravenclaw because of her thirst for knowledge. I see her as the perfect researcher.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?

I think a Ravenclaw would analyse the whole situation before coming out with a result. Gryffindors tend to be rash in decision making and go in head first. Slytherins would choose the easy way out for themselves. Hufflepuffs I think would try to think of the wider spectrum and the impact on other people, before making a decision.

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?

I feel pretty bad for them having to answer a question every time they want to get into their common room and admire them even more.


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Old September 5th, 2007, 8:57 pm
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

I think it's very interesting that the only Ravenclaw we really get to know is Luna Lovegood. Obviously, there are many Ravenclaws who aren't that wacky.

Wit seems to be an important characteristic of Ravenclaws. This comprises not only the ability to think but also the ability to think quickly. Luna always has her wits about her in a tense situation, and as far as we can tell, so does Flitwick; he was a dueling champion, after all.


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Old September 12th, 2007, 2:07 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

Is there a predominant quality that a Ravenclaw must have in order to be a Ravenclaw?
Intelligence seems to be the most prominent quality for a Ravenclaw. Not to suggest people in the other Houses are not intelligent, the people in Ravenclaw would seem to have to possess intelligence that’s a step above the rest. A Ravenclaw’s power is a power of the mind.

It appears that Ravenclaw is a resting place for highly intelligent students that lack qualities that Slytherin or Gryffindor would select as in the case of Severus Snape and Hermione. What might be an example of someone almost chosen for one of the other houses but was placed in Ravenclaw?
The most prominent example that I can think of is Luna Lovegood, who appears to have plenty of Gryffindor bravery and courage as shown by her involvement in the DA and in the student resistance in DH, but who values knowledge and wit more.

What are some of the decisions that students from other houses have made that Ravenclaws would decide differently?
In general, I’d say Ravenclaws would decide to tackle problems using knowledge and logic rather than instinct and feeling, though Luna sort of seems to go against that. I think a Ravenclaw would have excelled at Snape's challenge in SS/PS.

What are the significance of Air and the Raven to Ravenclaw?
Perhaps the significance of Air to Ravenclaw is that they are on a higher plain of learning than everyone else (and for Luna, well, she always has her head in the clouds). As for the Raven, it is the symbol of knowledge. The raven is also a trickster, teacher and hoarder. It can represent healing, initiation, protection, shaman's power, transformation, change in consciousness, and mark of a shape shifter as well. Additionally it represents mystery and exploration of the unknown, which I really think fit with Ravenclaw.

What is the significance of JKR splitting the students into classes and why did she make Ravenclaw House from a literary perspective?
Ravenclaw’s significance as a House is that it embodies strength of the mind. Slytherin also seems to embody a sort of strength of the mind, but Ravenclaw’s strength of the mind comes from knowledge and learning rather than the application of knowledge, which seems to be more of a Slytherin area. I sort of consider Ravenclaws to be theorists while Slytherins are the ones who employ those theories.

What new thoughts do you have on Ravenclaw post DH?
I really like that we got a glimpse into the Ravenclaw common room, and that we got to hear the Grey Lady's story regarding the Bloody Baron and the Diadem.


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Last edited by RemusLupinFan; September 12th, 2007 at 2:10 am.
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Old September 12th, 2007, 2:28 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

About the Ravenclaw Ghost, the Grey Lady: Everyone knew who she was before DH, but her name was never mentioned. Is there an interview where JKR mentions her?


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Old September 12th, 2007, 7:01 am
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Re: Ravenclaw House: Group Character Analysis

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Originally Posted by smartypants View Post
Ravenclaw are the thinkers, the scientists of Hogwarts. They are not content with learning spells, they experiment and try to understand how magic "really" works. They are very theoretical, and can seem a bit cold and distant to other people.

In a MBTI analysis, Ravenclaws are probably predominantly iNtuitive-Thinkers.

//Smartypants. Total Ravenclaw.

Haha! I knew there was a small part of me that should be in Ravenclaw. I took that analysis- and I was an INFJ- which means introverted, intuitive, feeling, and judgement. I was very torn between thinking and feeling. I think a good majority of Ravenclaws would be introverts, because they would always be thiinking through facts and theories to themselves. As for me, I would love to believe I would be in Ravenclaw, because I do love to learn, and I do think in abstract ways like Luna. But I am also loyal and kind, so many quizzes give me Gryffindor and Hufflepuff as results, although I am the opposite of patient and I'm scared of like 20 different things. i'd say 50% give me Hufflepuff, then 30% Gryf and 20% Rav. Hmmmm


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