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Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4



View Poll Results: What do you think about Snape's treatment of Harry?
Completely justified. 21 8.40%
Partly justified in the light of Snape's tragic story. 74 29.60%
I feel uncomfortable about it but I can understand him. 100 40.00%
I feel uncomfortable about it and disapprove of his actions. 38 15.20%
Completely unjustified. 30 12.00%
It was mutual dislike from the beginning. 67 26.80%
Harry initiated it but Snape should have been more mature. 26 10.40%
Snape initiated it and his actions are not forgivable. 49 19.60%
Other 20 8.00%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 250. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
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  #1  
Old August 17th, 2007, 10:43 pm
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Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Welcome to the fourth instalment of this thread.


For background reading and reference:
version one
version two
version three


Now, for starters (or again for posters who changed their minds):
  1. Snape is revealed to have been acting throughout the series out of love for Lily, how does this effect your view of his actions in the series - his "murder" of Dumbledore, his treatment of Sirius.
  2. Why do you think Snape chose to become a Death Eater?
  3. How do the revelations of DH impact your view of Snape's treatment of Harry and Neville throughout the series?
  4. What do you think of Snape's actions after learning who Volemort had targetted with the prophecy?
  5. What do you think of Snape's actions after Lily's death. How do you think this death has affected his character?
  6. What do you think are Snape's major strengths? What are his major flaws?
  7. Do you believe Snape came to care about Harry?
  8. Do you think Snape should have been sorted in Slytherin? Would he have made the same choices if he had been sorted elsewhere?
  9. There are all kinds of bravery in this series, what characteristics of Snape's make him brave? In what sense is he a hero.
  10. Did Snape fully redeem himself in your eyes? In Harry's?

AS THIS IS STILL A HIGHLY CONTROVERSIAL AND SENSITIVE TOPIC WE WOULD LIKE TO ASK EVERYONE TO PLEASE BE SENSITIVE TO OTHERS OPINIONS. THIS MEANS NO GLOATING AS WELL AS NO BASHING. CONSEQUENCES WILL BE SEVERE.

Additionally please read How to have a pleasant conversation on any topic and Character Bashing/Worship: aka Shades of Gray BEFORE POSTING IN THIS THREAD


Now go on and have fun with the debate!



Last edited by Moriath; August 18th, 2007 at 9:57 am.
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  #2  
Old August 18th, 2007, 10:55 am
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
I disagree here. Snape got the opportunity to keep a piece of Lily alive. He protected Harry because he loved Lily, and Harry represented Lily. He did not protect Harry for any other reason than that he could still see Lily when he looked into Harry's eyes. He did not protect Harry because it was the 'right' thing to do or because Harry was an innocent victim. I am not even sure that, had Harry not had Lily's eyes, and thus offered Snape the opportunity to see her when he looked at Harry, Snape would have protected Harry. In my opinion, that represents greed. He kept Harry alive only for the bittersweet opportunity to look into Lily's eyes again.
I agree with most of your theory here. Although, I believe myself that part of the reason that Snape was so nasty to Harry was a combination of Harry looking like his dad and having Lily's eyes. It was a reminder that James got the girl instead. I think Snape was a bit greedy at first when the reason he went to Dumbledore to save the Potters was really only to save Lily. Since he didn't care if James and Harry were killed, he was willing to let that happen as long as Lily lived. Granted, I know some people believe that Snape didn't really have much of a choice because Voldemort was going to kill Harry anyway and that he might as well save Lily, but it's the part that Snape didn't care if James and Harry were murdered. Lily was the reason he went to Dumbledore, otherwise he wouldn't have cared at all. If Voldemort thought the prophecy meant the Longbottoms, I don't believe Snape would have done anything about it.

Quote:
"That is why--it is for that reason--he thinks it means Lily Evans!"
"The prophecy did not refer to a woman," said Dumbledore. "It spoke of a boy born at the end of July--"
"You know what I mean! He thinks it means her son, he is going to hunt her down--kill them all--"
"If she means so much to you," said Dumbledore, "surely Lord Voldemort will spare her? Could you not ask for mercy for the mother, in exchange for the son?"
"I have--I have asked him--"
"You disgust me," said Dumbledore, and Harry had never heard so much contempt in his voice. Snape seemed to shrink a little. "You do not care, then, about the deaths of her husband and child? They can die, as long as you have what you want?" Snape said nothing, but merely looked up at Dumbledore.
"Hide them all, than," he croaked. "Keep her--them--safe. Please."
bold and italics mine

I know there's going to be tons of disagreements about this statement...but keep in mind this is only my opinion and I'm not trying to offend...but I wouldn't be surprised if a part of Snape kind of hoped that Voldemort would kill James and his son just so Snape can have Lily to himself, and have her without the reminder of James and Lily's love running around. I think that's what Dumbledore meant when Dumbledore told Snape that he disgusted him.


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Last edited by Myst; August 18th, 2007 at 11:14 am. Reason: Fixed Grammer
  #3  
Old August 18th, 2007, 11:43 am
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by anabel
Are you suggesting that Snape felt about Harry the same way Lily felt about James?
No,no of course not,I was providing an example of someone supposedly liking/disliking someone at the same time.


  #4  
Old August 18th, 2007, 11:52 am
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myst View Post
I agree with most of your theory here. Although, I believe myself that part of the reason that Snape was so nasty to Harry was a combination of Harry looking like his dad and having Lily's eyes. It was a reminder that James got the girl instead. I think Snape was a bit greedy at first when the reason he went to Dumbledore to save the Potters was really only to save Lily. Since he didn't care if James and Harry were killed, he was willing to let that happen as long as Lily lived. Granted, I know some people believe that Snape didn't really have much of a choice because Voldemort was going to kill Harry anyway and that he might as well save Lily, but it's the part that Snape didn't care if James and Harry were murdered. Lily was the reason he went to Dumbledore, otherwise he wouldn't have cared at all. If Voldemort thought the prophecy meant the Longbottoms, I don't believe Snape would have done anything about it.
Bolding is mine now. This is a very important point. Snape was upset about Lily being a target. He had a very personal reason for this. Had the Longbottoms been targeted, he might still be a Death Eater.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myst View Post
I know there's going to be tons of disagreements about this statement...but keep in mind this is only my opinion and I'm not trying to offend...but I wouldn't be surprised if a part of Snape kind of hoped that Voldemort would kill James and his son just so Snape can have Lily to himself, and have her without the reminder of James and Lily's love running around. I think that's what Dumbledore meant when Dumbledore told Snape that he disgusted him.
I see everything exactly as you have stated it. That was why Dumbledore was disgusted.

Snape has evidently redeemed himself in Harry's eyes for his years of dangerous spying and eventual personal sacrifice, all in the name of Harry's mother. But Harry has a bigger heart than I have. I remember the years of maltreatment Harry and his friends received, and find that inexcusable. I also find it hard to understand how Snape loathed and mistreated Harry, solely for looking like his father. Snape refused to see how much of Lily was also in Harry. Dumbledore pointed that out to Snape. You'd think that he would treat the son of the woman he loved a little better than that. He wouldn't have to even like the kid, but why loathe him?

Neville also has a good heart, but I doubt he has named any of his children after Snape.


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  #5  
Old August 18th, 2007, 12:27 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

(I'm sure this has been discussed but I pretty much missed most of version 3 so bear with me!)

You know, besides the whole Harry looking like James with Lily's eyes and so on and so forth, I really think that one of the reasons Snape loathed Harry to such an extent is becuase he ultimately partly blames him for Lily's death. Of course, he's partly responsible and I'm sure he's had plenty of time to dwell on that fact, but I really think that he blames Lily's whole sacrifice thing on Harry.

He also probably was so harsh on Neville partly becuase he couldn't stand how horrible he was at potions but also because he may secretly wish that Neville had been a target instead. Horrible, yes, but I can understand that.

How many times have we thought, after something horrible happened to us or our loved ones, "Why couldn't ____ have happened instead? Why couldn't this happen to [insert enemy here]? Anyone but _____" I know I have and I'm not entirely proud of it but we aren't perfect, kind creatures. Of course, Snape is pretty extreme example of such hopes but what can ya do?

Despite Snape's good deeds and intentions and really sad, messed up life, not all of his actions were very angelic. Nevertheless, it's pretty clear that, with as much anger and loathing Snape had for Harry, he was pretty light on him compared to the other horrors involving him. I dunno, but after DH Snape's detentions and snide, embarrassing remarks towards Harry (and the rest), despite still being really horrible, are almost petty in comparison.

[/3 am ramble]


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  #6  
Old August 18th, 2007, 12:54 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

version 4 you guys are killing me

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIP
There is foreshadowing for the fact that Dumbledore left no instructions.

It's in Quidditch Through the Ages, when Dumbledore says that Madame Pince didn't want to give the book to Muggles so they could make a copy. Pince suggests that they should tell the publisher that Dumbledore had died without leaving instructions.

I'm wondering if Dumbledore's portrait ever talked to Minerva? Surely he would have told her "something" about Snape?
erm... I never read Quidditch through the ages - can you explain what you mean for the uninitiated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lorna
That's all fine and good but...here's my problem.
Considering the bad blood between Snape and Harry, without any other soul knowing the truth of DD's death (or DD leaving something behind) why on earth would it be expected by DD that Harry would believe anything Snape said.

Or was the expectation all along that Snape would use his memories to convince Harry.

Of course that would mean Harry would go along with another penseive trip with known death eater and headmaster murderer Snape.
What I find so hard to imagine about this entire complex - here is Severus as the new Headmaster in the Headmaster's office, with all those portraits hanging around. Surely, every now and then, other teachers enter this place for some reason or other to debate with the Headmaster. When McGonagall entered the office and saw Albus' portrait behind Severus' chair - how was he looking then? Was he absent for pretence? Would McGonagall make a scathing remark, or something? I don't know, I find it hard to imagine.

Reading DH, I thought there were some people, like McG, in the secret, it's just that Harry doesn't have any contact to anyone at that time and naturally wouldn't know. So 'The Sacking of Severus Snape' really surprised me because I thought 'Oi, Minerva, what d'you think you're doing there?!'

Seeing what the Carrows would do and compare it with Severus' brand of detentions FOR BREAKING INTO HIS OFFICE!!! - that really didn't give her anything to think about...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bullfrog
Originally Posted by zgirnius
I also don't see why you think Snape was greedy. He surely got nothing out of his sacrifices.

I disagree here. Snape got the opportunity to keep a piece of Lily alive. He protected Harry because he loved Lily, and Harry represented Lily.
And that qualifies as 'greed' to you?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Myst
I know there's going to be tons of disagreements about this statement...but keep in mind this is only my opinion and I'm not trying to offend...but I wouldn't be surprised if a part of Snape kind of hoped that Voldemort would kill James and his son just so Snape can have Lily to himself,
Yeah, you're right... tons of disagreement

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBW
This is a very important point. Snape was upset about Lily being a target. He had a very personal reason for this. Had the Longbottoms been targeted, he might still be a Death Eater.
Maybe I'm alone in feeling so, but why someone initially starts caring and changing doesn't interest me half as much as that they do so in the first place. And Severus does change from the second on when he makes the 'Anything' pledge, and until his end, he keep on transforming into a better and better human being. I don't know, I always have the biblical 'Lost Son' simile in my head.


Quote:
Originally Posted by random musing
I'm sure this has been discussed but I pretty much missed most of version 3 so bear with me!)
ah, you know, we begrudge no one for having an actual life


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  #7  
Old August 18th, 2007, 1:08 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

I know others say if Harry hadn't have been Lily's son he wouldn't have cared about protecting him. It's used a fair amount to point at this negative spot in Snape personality. To be honest, if you're going to use this against it one character you need to apply it to others. I mean would Black (for a while seemed to want Harry to be James) and Lupin have cared about Harry had he not been James's son, probably not. It was just my impression Sirius confused Harry for being James, like when he wanted Harry to sneak out of the castle during Goblet of Fire. I was trying to say Sirius and Snape expected Harry to be another James only they had opposite reactions.

Snape gives up his life to protect had die for someone, he apparently hates, on behalf and in honor of someone he loves. It is one thing to die to protect family and loved ones quite another level/branch of strength to die to protect someone you hate surely. Snape would get no reward, no love returned, because Lily is already dead.

I chose: I feel uncomfortable about it but I can understand him. I don't try to justify Snape's petty or spitefullness but I can certainly see how it grew in his personality. Especially the insecure and bitter part, after seeing how others have treated him.

Also chose: It was mutual dislike from the beginning. As both Harry and Snape seem to judge by appearances. Although snide, Snape does save and spend Harry's first year watching over him. Does Harry saying 'thank you' well, not in the book I don't think. Then the first thing Snape hears is Harry and Ron bad mouthing him behingd his back at the beginning of Chamber of Secrets. When the kids were looking in at the Great Hall after flying the car to school. It just seems to be constant logger-heads and misunderstandings with these two.



Last edited by Annielogic; August 18th, 2007 at 4:40 pm. Reason: Added sentence
  #8  
Old August 18th, 2007, 1:29 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annielogic View Post
I mean would Black (for a while seemed to want Harry to be James) and Lupin have cared about Harry had he not been James's son, probably not.
That is not the point. They would not have made Harry miserable the entire time they cared for him. They would not have hated him for merely looking like his father. They would have brought genuine affection for Harry to the role.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annielogic View Post
Does Harry saying 'thank you' well, not in the book I don't think. Then the first thing Snape hears is Harry and Ron bad mouthing him behingd his back at the beginning of Chamber of Secrets.
Well, since he made Harry and his friends miserable whenever they were in his class, we really can't expect them to think kind thoughts about him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleur du mal View Post
Maybe I'm alone in feeling so, but why someone initially starts caring and changing doesn't interest me half as much as that they do so in the first place. And Severus does change from the second on when he makes the 'Anything' pledge, and until his end, he keep on transforming into a better and better human being. I don't know, I always have the biblical 'Lost Son' simile in my head.
He didn't care for Harry. He did it because of Lily. He hated Harry. He was a poor excuse for a human being with a horrible disposition. But he did one good thing and that was bravely spy against Voldemort and protect Harry. Toward the end, and we really don't know how long a time period it was since he characterized it as "lately," he started trying to save lives he didn't need to.

The complete picture of Snape includes the fact that he was a deeply horrible person, who was also brave and eventually died for the cause. Although, quite a few other people were very brave and died for the cause, too. I have no trouble acknowledging the good things he did, but that doesn't excuse his other rather serious flaws. Both his bravery and his flaws comprise his total persona.


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Last edited by ComicBookWorm; August 18th, 2007 at 1:41 pm.
  #9  
Old August 18th, 2007, 2:08 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

I kept looking for Snape to finally realize that Harry was not James and that it wasn't Harry's fault that James was arrogant. Snape took every chance he could to remind Harry of what a terrible person his father was. Even after Snape has killed Dumbledore and is running away with Draco, he stops and takes the time to remind Harry, once again, ad nauseum, what a rotten father he had. Does anyone really care? Did Harry want to hear about his father's actions when he was consumed with anger at Snape for killing a man who was like a father to him? Over and over, year after year, Snape had to remind Harry of his rotten father. It wasn't necessary. It wasn't Harry's fault. Snape had no right to treat him like that.


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Old August 18th, 2007, 2:52 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIP
Cathy W: Congrats on the prediction in your signature. I think if we had put together everyone's theories on Snape pre-DH, we would have had almost the whole Snape/Lily/Harry story.
It wasn't really a prediction - I always thought Harry wouldn't forgive Snape, and was glad to be wrong! But when I came across that snippet, the wording suprised me. I think the Snape-the-Hero posse pretty much had everything covered though!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBW
Had the Longbottoms been targeted, he might still be a Death Eater.
I don't think there was any "might" about it. Perhaps he would have had an alternative epiphany - I'd like to think so.

Actually thinking about it, given that the Potters ahd already thrice defied Voldemort I think they may well have been targetted or killed at some point, and if that happened I think Snape would have changed his loyalties.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fleur du Mal
Maybe I'm alone in feeling so, but why someone initially starts caring and changing doesn't interest me half as much as that they do so in the first place. And Severus does change from the second on when he makes the 'Anything' pledge, and until his end, he keep on transforming into a better and better human being. I don't know, I always have the biblical 'Lost Son' simile in my head.
I agree. The epiphany is usually something very personal but it does make you look at things differently. Which reminds me of all the talk about the hanged-man Tarot card there was ages ago, and how that symbolised Snape. The hanged man representing some one experiencing for want of a better word an epiphany moment when you see things completely differently.


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  #11  
Old August 18th, 2007, 3:27 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Oh yay, new poll! This is what I picked...
I feel uncomfortable about it but I can understand him.
I have a lot of empathy for Snape's character. I don't like how he acted, but think that a person of his personality and temperament wouldn't really have acted any differently, and so can understand while not condoning.
I feel uncomfortable about it and disapprove of his actions.
As I said, I may understand why he would have acted that way, but I don't like it.
It was mutual dislike from the beginning.
I believe they both had an equal part of blame in how they treated each other. I know many people disagree with me, but that's how I feel.
Harry initiated it but Snape should have been more mature.
Okay, this time I know a lot of people will disagree with me, but I think that Harry was an impressionable young boy who readily accepted the word of others and let it shape his first judgments about Severus. I think that was wrong of Harry but don't particularly blame him for it (I really didn't like the wording of this option or its parter, but felt this one most closely resembled how I felt). I blame Severus more for allowing his own determination to dislike this child (and yes, I do think he was determined not to like Harry and I believe in his Occlumency lessons with Harry he was much gentler than we had ever seen him before and I believe he was very glad of having a reason to stop his close interactions) overshadow the possibility that he might find in him part of his old friend. I really do think that had Snape really given Harry the chance, he would have begun to like him as most others inevitably did, just because Harry was such a likable person.


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  #12  
Old August 18th, 2007, 3:45 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Myst View Post
I know there's going to be tons of disagreements about this statement...but keep in mind this is only my opinion and I'm not trying to offend...but I wouldn't be surprised if a part of Snape kind of hoped that Voldemort would kill James and his son just so Snape can have Lily to himself, and have her without the reminder of James and Lily's love running around. I think that's what Dumbledore meant when Dumbledore told Snape that he disgusted him.
I think so, too. I felt disgust when I read it and was glad to see Dumbledore respond as he did. I really wish Dumbledore had taken a hand in how Snape treated Harry at school. That was also disgusting and totally uncalled for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBW
He didn't care for Harry. He did it because of Lily. He hated Harry. He was a poor excuse for a human being with a horrible disposition. But he did one good thing and that was bravely spy against Voldemort and protect Harry. Toward the end, and we really don't know how long a time period it was since he characterized it as "lately," he started trying to save lives he didn't need to.

The complete picture of Snape includes the fact that he was a deeply horrible person, who was also brave and eventually died for the cause. Although, quite a few other people were very brave and died for the cause, too. I have no trouble acknowledging the good things he did, but that doesn't excuse his other rather serious flaws. Both his bravery and his flaws comprise his total persona.
I really agree with this, Judy. Care for Harry? Didn't happen. Snape hated Harry with his dying breath. As for his "horrible disposition," there can be no argument - or at least not one that would persuade me to see Snape any differently. The man was awful to Harry, Neville, and others.


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  #13  
Old August 18th, 2007, 3:49 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
That is not the point. They would not have made Harry miserable the entire time they cared for him. They would not have hated him for merely looking like his father. They would have brought genuine affection for Harry to the role.
I'm sorry but you cannot force someone to love and/or have affection for another. He watched over, protected and saved Harry's life . Snape ended up sacrificing his life for him in honor of Lily and to keep Lily's sacrifice alive. If Snape was truely the cold hearted creep he would have just totally walked away. Especially, after killing Dumbledore (on Dumbledore's orders) when he was left completely alone with only a portarait for company.



Last edited by Annielogic; August 18th, 2007 at 4:01 pm. Reason: Added words to correct meaning
  #14  
Old August 18th, 2007, 3:51 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

I voted "Other" in the new poll. Snape's actions towards Harry in their personal/ class interactions were wrong, understandable, and pale by comparison to what Snape did do for Harry, would sum up my view on the subject.


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  #15  
Old August 18th, 2007, 4:02 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annielogic View Post
I know others say if Harry hadn't have been Lily's son he wouldn't have cared about protecting him. It's used a fair amount to point at this negative spot in Snape personality. To be honest, if you're going to use this against it one character you need to apply it to others. I mean would Black (for a while seemed to want Harry to be James) and Lupin have cared about Harry had he not been James's son, probably not.
I respectfully disagree that Sirius and Lupin would not have cared about Harry had he not been Lily's son. These two were members of the Order. Kingsley, Moody, Molly, Arthur, Tonks, and other members of the Order were not best buddies with James and Lily and they all strove to protect Harry fearlessly and merely for the 'good cause'. That Sirius and Lupin happened to be James and Lily's friends, they would naturally love and care for Harry in a more personal way, but as we saw, Molly also came to care for Harry that way rather quickly. (and note that Molly was not in the first Order, she likely didn't know James and Lily very well if at all).

Snape disliked James immensely and that is what he saw in Harry and so he transferred that dislike on the lad. It is not hard to imagine he loathed Harry until he died because he also loathed James until he died. As another poster pointed out, Snape took every opportunity to point out to Harry how terrible James was, and his opinion obviously never changed according to JKR. IMO, Snape was more incensed that Harry was also the son of the woman he loved - because he was a constant reminder that Lily had loved James.

Now what always has me completely at a loss is Snape's doe patronus - which was indicative of his emotions for Lily. We assume that the doe, did not reflect any love for James (as Lily's doe patrous did) or reflect Snape's inner animal (as Jame's stag patronus did for him) - but rather was a pure indication of his emotions for Lily. And yet, every time he cast it, it would reflect Lily's love for James just as sure as it reflected Snape's love for Lily. I think Snape ignored this connection just as he did the Harry-is-Lily's-son connection and allowed his mind to focus only on things he could accept.

Snape was a great occulmens, so perhaps blocking unpleasant thoughts from his mind was not all that difficult for him to do.

My vote in the poll: Snape initiated it and his actions are not forgivable.



Last edited by wickedwickedboy; August 18th, 2007 at 4:05 pm.
  #16  
Old August 18th, 2007, 4:24 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

I voted for the first one (completely justified) but I didn't mean too . I meant the second one (partly justified.)
I also put that it was mutual dislike and that Harry initiated it but Snape should have been more mature.
I don't exactly think that Snape was being immature, but I think he could have done better to help the situation.
I agree with zgirnius that what Snape did for Harry was a lot more important than a few nasty comments and unfair grades.
Whenever I read the scene where Harry first sees Snape, I get the impression that Harry started disliking Snape because of the fact that his scar hurt when he looked at Snape. It doesn't say anything about Snape scowling at him or anything. Harry's idea that Snape hates him is later confirmed in the first potions class, but Harry started hating Snape before that, so it was mutual dislike from the beginning.


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  #17  
Old August 18th, 2007, 4:29 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
I respectfully disagree that Sirius and Lupin would not have cared about Harry had he not been Lily's son. These two were members of the Order. Kingsley, Moody, Molly, Arthur, Tonks, and other members of the Order were not best buddies with James and Lily and they all strove to protect Harry fearlessly and merely for the 'good cause'. That Sirius and Lupin happened to be James and Lily's friends, they would naturally love and care for Harry in a more personal way, but as we saw, Molly also came to care for Harry that way rather quickly. (and note that Molly was not in the first Order, she likely didn't know James and Lily very well if at all).
I see what you saying. I said:
"I mean would Black (for a while seemed to want Harry to be James) and Lupin have cared about Harry had he not been James's son, probably not."
Jame's son not Lily's son.

It was just my impression Sirius confused Harry for being James, like when he wanted Harry to sneak out of the castle during Goblet of Fire. I was trying to say Sirius and Snape expected Harry to be another James only they had opposite reactions.


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Old August 18th, 2007, 4:31 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

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Originally Posted by ComicBookWorm View Post

He didn't care for Harry. He did it because of Lily. He hated Harry. He was a poor excuse for a human being with a horrible disposition. But he did one good thing and that was bravely spy against Voldemort and protect Harry. Toward the end, and we really don't know how long a time period it was since he characterized it as "lately," he started trying to save lives he didn't need to.

The complete picture of Snape includes the fact that he was a deeply horrible person, who was also brave and eventually died for the cause. Although, quite a few other people were very brave and died for the cause, too. I have no trouble acknowledging the good things he did, but that doesn't excuse his other rather serious flaws. Both his bravery and his flaws comprise his total persona.
Yeah I think JK said it in one of her interviews (the one with the "Today show")... she said (I don't have the exact quote so don't penalize me ) that Snape wouldn't have saved Harry's life if he had been anyone else's son. He did it for Lily. I completely agree with comicbookworm's take on his character. He was a horrible man who was immensely brave. He was a deatheater for three to four years before he became "good". I wonder how many muggles he had tortured for fun then...
PS I love him as a character just don't think he was a good man though...


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  #19  
Old August 18th, 2007, 4:38 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annielogic View Post
I see what you saying. I said:
"I mean would Black (for a while seemed to want Harry to be James) and Lupin have cared about Harry had he not been James's son, probably not."
Jame's son not Lily's son.

It was just my impression Sirius confused Harry for being James, like when he wanted Harry to sneak out of the castle during Goblet of Fire. I was trying to say Sirius and Snape expected Harry to be another James only they had opposite reactions.
I think I see what you are saying. However, I would still respectfully disagree. Even if Harry had not been James' son, I think Sirius would have cared about 'the boy who was chosen to kill Voldemort' just as much as Kingsley did. Certainly the relationship might have been different, but Sirius was a member of the Order and cared about the good cause, so he would have worked on Harry's behalf to protect him and keep him safe from harm.

Snape would have remained a DE according to JKR if Harry had not been Lily's son and worked against Harry completely.

So that is how I see the scenario under that theory.


  #20  
Old August 18th, 2007, 4:54 pm
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Re: Severus Snape: Character Analysis v.4

Quote:
Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy View Post
I think I see what you are saying. Snape would have remained a DE according to JKR if Harry had not been Lily's son and worked against Harry completely.

So that is how I see the scenario under that theory.
Certainly, yes.

Lily being in danger was the start of Snape's wake up call. There are other characters that don't see their wrong path until a loved one/s are in danger. Percy was blindly following the ministry for example with sadistic/dangerous people like Umbridge in charge - he had to have a wake up call.


 
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