Magical Transportation

[Wab]

I don't think there's anything specifically mentioned.

[aimeeaaa]

Originally Posted by Darksmith

Hello folks!

I've been wondering, how does exactly Floo powder work?

Is it comparable to the Stargate,do you get burned to ash by the magical fire and then transported from point A to Point B?
What if you give no destination?
What if you try to send say... a crate of butterbeer?
What if several people try to travel together?
What if a muggle tries to use it?

And finally what if you throw floopowder at fiendfyre or a phoenix on a burning day?

Tell me what you think!

If you gave no destination then either nothing would happen or it would take you the nearest place with floo powder. But I have no idea.

You couldn't send a crate of butterbeer since you had to say the destenation which would mean you would have to be inside the floo thing. But yeah you should be able to take things with you, like hold your glasses in your hands or something.

I think serveal people could travel together, as long as they all fit in. I mean, if you needed to take a baby you would have him/her in your arms.

No clue what would happen if a muggle tried to use it.

[Goddess_Clio]

Originally Posted by merrymarge

Was the Hogwarts Express a magical train?

I always thought the Hogwarts Express was a magical train; like the Knight bus kind of jumps from place to place, I thought the Hogwarts Express could go around slower moving muggle trains.

This seems supported by what little we know of Hogwarts and it's real world location - that it seems to be located somewhere in the Scottish Highland which is around an 8-9 hour daytime train ride from London (a day train from London to Inverness - home of the Loch Ness monster - takes 8-8.5 hours) and if the Hogwarts Express leaves King's Cross at 11am and arrives at Hogsmeade station around 6-6.30pm for a 7pm arrival feast that means the Hogwarts Express is slightly speedier than a muggle train. Unless Hogwarts is closer to, say, Ediburgh than Inverness then there's a huge time discrepency (London to Edinburgh is like a 4-5 hour train ride meaning the Hogwarts Express would be slower than a muggle high-speed, non-stop train from London or the HE is making stops we aren't told about)

[willfitz]

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

I always thought the Hogwarts Express was a magical train; like the Knight bus kind of jumps from place to place, I thought the Hogwarts Express could go around slower moving muggle trains.

Frankly I've always assumed it had its own railroad. I mean, they couldn't have Muggle trains stopping in Hogsmeade, could they?

I do think it is a magical train, though, no sense burning diesel if you have such abundant supplies of magic handy.

[LyraLovegood]

Originally Posted by merrymarge

Was the Hogwarts Express a magical train?

I think it was probably magical at least inasmuch as Muggles couldn't see it. I think it used regular train technology to run, though. I only speculate there; I suppose it could have had some magical means to power it instead of a coal-burning boiler.

[Goddess_Clio]

Originally Posted by willfitz

Frankly I've always assumed it had its own railroad. I mean, they couldn't have Muggle trains stopping in Hogsmeade, could they?

I thought that it would have used muggle railroads - the WW didn't seem that interested in laying down its own infrastructure when it would piggyback on the muggle infrastructure already in place.

As for stopping at Hogsmeade station I think two things:

1) The only WW infrastructure for the HE would have been the one branch of line that diverted off the muggle rail line and went to Hogsmeade.

2) The Hogsmeade station might be on a muggle line but appear as though it were a ruined or abandoned station, like Hogwarts would appear as a ruin to Muggles who view it from a distance (isn't that right?) This theory has issues in how students wouldn't be seen at the station, though, and the town beyond...

Anyway, those are my thougths on the train.

[MerryLore]

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

2) The Hogsmeade station might be on a muggle line but appear as though it were a ruined or abandoned station, like Hogwarts would appear as a ruin to Muggles who view it from a distance (isn't that right?) This theory has issues in how students wouldn't be seen at the station, though, and the town beyond...

I see it's location more along the lines of Diagon Alley and the Ministry of Magic. To reach the train, the witch/wizard had to know how to access it through the secret entrance, just like the other two places, so i think it was completely hidden from view.

I've always seen the train as muggle technology with a boost - similar to the Knight Bus. It is effective in carrying large numbers of people at the same time, headded to the same place, and would be a much more efficient method of transportation for that purpose than anything else, i think. It may also have been able to move at faster speeds over rougher terrain than the average muggle train.

[ajna]

I think by definition it must be a magical train. It can't be seen by muggles. It operates like the Knights Bus that uses roads, but can't be seen. But, why wouldn't it be magical? What would make it non magical?

[Taquiq]

I also believe that it's magical. I agree with above, why wouldn't it be magical? I'm sure there is something it does that is unique from other trains.

[Wab]

Originally Posted by ajna

I think by definition it must be a magical train. It can't be seen by muggles.

Where does it say it can't be seen by Muggles?

[leah49]

I don't think it's ever specifically said that the Hogwarts Express cannot be seen by Muggles, but it probably goes along with other magical transportation. I don't recall if the other transportations are always invisible to Muggles, but in certain instances, like when they are avoiding traffic jams and the like, Muggles do not pay attention.

[Hes]

We still have a ban on divulging Pottermore info until Pottermore is out of beta guys. I am really sorry about it.

[canismajoris]

I thought I would magically transport the conversation from the Triwizard thread here...

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

The train doesn't seem to be super magical - it appears to be able to travel in a manner that doesn't draw a lot of muggle attention, but it doesn't seem to travel at 'warp 2' and there's no reason to believe that it even could. If wizards wanted to move around faster than the train then they took another form of trasportation that was faster.

Hehe, well I was joking about warp 2, which is IIRC about ten times the speed of light--fast enough to be faster than what we consider instantaneous, since we've only ever seen instantaneous things using light which travels at c.

What I'm getting at is that because we know wizards have forms of transportation that are faster than a Muggle train, there's no particular reason the Hogwarts Express couldn't be modified to travel faster than a normal Muggle train. I mean, we need not be concerned about the most efficient means--or at least I'm not, and wizards never seem to be--but with imaginative solutions to a problem that doesn't really exist.

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

I have a whole host of other problems with the hogwarts express, not least of all it only having two stops (London and Hogsmeade) and why, if it is magical, it doesn't travel faster...

As I speculated, and I'm only speculating, it doesn't really need to go anywhere else, and the time it takes to cover the distance could just be a throwback to earlier days. If the school administration was interested in efficiency, they would simply Floo everyone in from their homes. The reason they don't do this might be arbitrary and based on plot demands, but there are no constraints I'm aware of that make the train itself problematic.

I bet we could identify dozens of other magical concepts which seem relatively ineffective or inefficient considering what ought to be possible, and the Triwizard Tournament seems to have brought out the dramatic and the silly qualities of magic, so who knows.

Originally Posted by willfitz

Yes, I'm sure that magically, there is a way to accomplish this, Knight Bus style. It could then just majestically coast into the front of the host school.

Interesting indeed.

Then again, the Knight Bus itself seems far better suited for such a task, and although it is less grand than a steam locomotive, it seems rather essentially British by comparison. The problem of crossing the channel still appears to exist, but why shouldn't a purple triple-decker bus drive on water.

[Goddess_Clio]

Originally Posted by canismajoris

As I speculated, and I'm only speculating, it doesn't really need to go anywhere else, and the time it takes to cover the distance could just be a throwback to earlier days. If the school administration was interested in efficiency, they would simply Floo everyone in from their homes. The reason they don't do this might be arbitrary and based on plot demands, but there are no constraints I'm aware of that make the train itself problematic.

The issue I have with the hogwarts express only making two stops is that it really inconveniences people who live, say, near Leeds, far north of London, or even those who live in, say, Edinburgh who then have the hassle and expense of getting to London in order to send their kid right back north again. This is especially inconvenient for muggleborns like Lily who can't just side-along apparate down to King's Cross or take the floo network or a portkey.

It seems to me that it would be a much better system to have several stops up through England and Scotland to accomodate families not living in southern England. Then the train's pokey time table in reaching Scotland at more or less 'muggle speeds' makes sense - the train would be moving faster than muggle trains, but slowed considerably due to having to make several stops along the way to pick up other students...

Then again, the Knight Bus itself seems far better suited for such a task, and although it is less grand than a steam locomotive, it seems rather essentially British by comparison. The problem of crossing the channel still appears to exist, but why shouldn't a purple triple-decker bus drive on water.

I can believe something like the Knight Bus trundling along an english country lane and then -BAM! - it's in the French riviera and then -BAM!! - it's in the African savanah and then -BAM!!! - it's pulling up in front of Durmstrang... that seems more feasible to me somehow though I can't really explain why, lol

[canismajoris]

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

The issue I have with the hogwarts express only making two stops is that it really inconveniences people who live, say, near Leeds, far north of London, or even those who live in, say, Edinburgh who then have the hassle and expense of getting to London in order to send their kid right back north again. This is especially inconvenient for muggleborns like Lily who can't just side-along apparate down to King's Cross or take the floo network or a portkey.

I think one thing we shouldn't forget is that Diagon Alley is apparently the primary shopping center for the sundry types of items Hogwarts students need. I think we've seen there are owl-orders for items, and places like Hogsmeade have their own shops and services, but it's still presumable that a number of families would wish to do their shopping all in one place, at one time, with a guarantee of finding everything they need. What I'm saying is I think the proximity to a major commercial district makes a common departure point in London at least rational, if not convenient for everyone.

Originally Posted by Goddess_Clio

It seems to me that it would be a much better system to have several stops up through England and Scotland to accomodate families not living in southern England. Then the train's pokey time table in reaching Scotland at more or less 'muggle speeds' makes sense - the train would be moving faster than muggle trains, but slowed considerably due to having to make several stops along the way to pick up other students...

The trouble is that could create additional logistical problems, which I'm not sure are interesting enough even for me to get into. What I would say is that since it has been a tradition for all the students to leave from King's Cross at the same time, I'm sure many of them would be unhappy at the prospect of missing out on time with their friends to catch up, gossip, and speculate about the coming year. Of course, there were also many significant meetings and conflicts on the train that affected plots which might not have developed if everyone had not been on the train all at once.

[DarkWitchZelda]

How do purebloods get to Platform Nine and Three-Quarters? The barrier between Platform Nine and Platform Ten seems more like the muggleborn entrance to me. I can't imagine a family like the Malfoys walking around a muggle train station to use it. I would just say Apparition, portkeys, or the Floo, but then there's the problem of luggage and pets. And I'm embarrased to say I just can't think off the top of my head whether or not any of those methods would let you transport a trunk and owl or cat.

[willfitz]

Originally Posted by DarkWitchZelda

How do purebloods get to Platform Nine and Three-Quarters? The barrier between Platform Nine and Platform Ten seems more like the muggleborn entrance to me. I can't imagine a family like the Malfoys walking around a muggle train station to use it. I would just say Apparition, portkeys, or the Floo, but then there's the problem of luggage and pets. And I'm embarrased to say I just can't think off the top of my head whether or not any of those methods would let you transport a trunk and owl or cat.

The Weasleys are a pureblood family, and use the Platform. It is just like Diagon Alley or St. Mungo's, in that the entrance to the fully-magical location needs to be located in the middle of a Muggle location.

[iluvseverus]

Originally Posted by willfitz

The Weasleys are a pureblood family, and use the Platform. It is just like Diagon Alley or St. Mungo's, in that the entrance to the fully-magical location needs to be located in the middle of a Muggle location.

IMO, it's just JK's way of forging connections between the Wizarding world and the Muggle world. Like, you never know, magic could be lurking behind any non-descript building, bang in the midst of the Muggle world. It's one of the things that makes the series so magical, even for Muggles like us.

[horcrux4]

The Hogwarts Express has to be magical as the Muggles don't seem to notice it. You just don't see steam trains going up or down the lines in Britain and if you did, the steam train enthusiasts would be out chasing them and comparing notes on the internet. Even as the HE slowly pulls out of Kings Cross it has in some fashion to be unnoticeable. If it uses the standard rail network it would have to be invisible and be able to overtake (or be overtaken by) other normal trains so maybe it has some of the properties of the Knight Bus. And where do they keep it when it isn't being used, which is most of the time? Why use an oldfashioned steam train when a high-speed express would get everyone to Hogwarts sooner? Have they been using the same train since the 19th century, do you suppose? And how did students get to Hogwarts before trains were invented?