The Marauders: Group Character Analysis

[Pearl_Took]

Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy

That is my honest opinion - I've read all the nasty things said about the Marauders. I disagree - I don't think it takes into account what they were up against. I have not and will never forget just how god awful the Slytherins in the series were portrayed and those in the Marauders years were worse from what we saw.

We have some slight evidence that the Slytherins were worse than Draco's generation, but not much. It does seem to be the case that some Slytherins were going round calling other kids 'Mudbloods'. Other than that, the only textual evidence we have is of Mulciber and Avery doing something nasty to Mary Mcdonald (Lily calls it ‘evil’), but we have no clue as to what that actually was, because Rowling doesn’t tell us. I don’t dispute Lily’s opinion because the author is obviously telling us something significant through Lily’s comment -- albeit of a generic, not specific, nature. We also pick up that some Slytherin kids in the 1970s had ambitions to become Death Eaters – which is, of course, disturbing. But the only Slytherin kids we ever see for the entirety of the series with truly murderous impulses are Crabbe and Goyle. (Draco, for one, takes no pleasure in the thought of Harry’s death.)

I do draw a distinction between the Slytherin schoolchildren and the adults here. I think that’s really important, especially as we are shown far more in the books about the activities of the adult Death Eaters. It does seem to be the case that the First War was probably worse than the Second, in the number of disappearances and murders. But that was all caused by adult Death Eaters.

Therefore talk to me about the threat that James and his friends faced after they left Hogwarts, and I will listen with respect … especially as James and his wife were actually murdered by a brutal, racist psychopath.

But I totally dispute that the pranks of the Marauders during their school years are supposed to be taken by me, the reader, as some sort of serious comment on their alleged feuds with Death Eaters. I’m simply not buying it. Because we are not ever shown the teenaged Marauders doing righteous battle with a bunch of evil wannabe DE teenagers.

All we’re told is that James ‘hated the Dark Arts’. OK, fine. Of course I can see that principle in adult James's life with his resistance to Voldemort. What that had to do with schoolboy James blowing up Bertram Aubrey’s head for a laugh is anybody’s guess. It’s the sort of silly thing the Twins might do, but what it has to do with fighting the good fight against injustice beats me.

In Harry's year they weren't creating dark spells and using dark magic spells on others and all that - the Marauders had it very rough because in their years, the kids were more cutthroat, imo.

As I say above … I don’t believe we are ever shown much solid evidence in the text that the majority of Slytherin kids in the Marauder era were really worse than Draco’s generation.

And I don’t see where the Marauders in general had it rough at all. They are shown in the text to be a popular gang, led by two charismatic, glamorous Alpha males. It was Remus who had it rough, because of his condition – I totally agree with you on that one. The other Marauders protected him, hence the strong feeling of brotherhood between them. And I think Sirius had it rough too, in terms of his family’s rejection of him – but that’s a discussion more for his thread. I don’t see him having it rough as far as his school career was concerned. He was popular, handsome and had close friends who meant a great deal to him (the gang seems to have been his surrogate family, and he and James seemed to have loved each other like brothers).

Where the rest of the Marauders had it rough (not just Remus) was after they all left school … when they all got caught up in the war and the tragedy that eventually affected all of them. Not one of them escape its dreadful consequences, including the one responsible (Peter).

[The_Green_Woods]

Originally Posted by eliza101

As for Dumbledore not knowing, that I don't believe for a moment.

He did not know about them being Animagi. Lupin says so in POA.

[eliza101]

Originally Posted by The_Green_Woods

He did not know about them being Animagi. Lupin says so in POA.

Lupin doesn't know everything that DD knows.

[Annielogic]

Originally Posted by eliza101

Lupin doesn't know everything that DD knows.

Dumbledore mentioned to Harry that he did not know.

quotePoA Last night Sirius told me all about how they became Animagi,” said Dumbledore, smiling. “An extraordinary achievement—not least, keeping it quiet from me.

[eliza101]

Originally Posted by Annielogic

Dumbledore mentioned to Harry that he did not know.

He said that they kepr it quiet from hm, not that he didn't know. DD plays his cards very close to his chest.

Anyway I thinks it's time to lighten up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inS5Y...eature=related.

Well I laughed.

[Annielogic]

Originally Posted by eliza101

He said that they kepr it quiet from hm, not that he didn't know. DD plays his cards very close to his chest.

Keeping something quiet from someone is another way of saying they kept it secret/hidden from them. Maybe this is a language thing.

[Daggerstone]

Originally Posted by wickedwickedboy

I am really tired of listening to people put the Marauders down left and right becuase of things they did that might have impacted their enemy or his ilk negatively.

I thought we were discussing the relative merits of letting a fully transformed werewolf run loose on school grounds... Are you saying Werewolf!Lupin somehow focused on Marauders' enemies alone? I didn't get that impression from the books, could you share a quote with us please?

I have not and will never forget just how god awful the Slytherins in the series were portrayed and those in the Marauders years were worse from what we saw.

Now, which shade of gray would 'god awful' be, hmm?

That is why they attacked Snape in SWM - and you know what I have to say about that? My honest opinion? Good for them.

Condoning attacking others because one is bored, wwb? What makes the Marauders' motives so different from Mulciber and Avery's, so that we may say 'good for them'?

Now, I'll probably end up covered with rotten tomatoes, but I don't think the Teen!Marauders were much different from Teen!Enemy&HisIlk - peer support tends to bring out the worst in them. IMO, of course...

I am sorry that doesn't mesh with the "reprehensible, horrid, dirty scoundrals" they've been called in this thread, but now you know - there are those of us with a very different opinion of the Marauders.

I hope you reported that particular post, wick. I might dislike the idea of the fight against the Dark Arts tendencies justifying the means of combat, but such descriptors are out of line.

I love the Marauders and support them 100% - and I hate their enemies and find them 100% in the wrong and deserving of any negative thing that happened to them - at the Marauders hands or otherwise. JMO.

*takes notes on expressing one's opinion without receiving warning owls*

My view of Marauders as a group actually differs from my view of individual characters belonging to that group. What canon offers beyond their teenage years are glimpses into individual characters' actions, and (see 'peer support' comment above) I can't really go into a group analysis of Adult!Marauders - we never get to see them as a group of adults in the books.

[The_Green_Woods]

Originally Posted by Annielogic

Dumbledore mentioned to Harry that he did not know.

Thanks for the quote Annie.

I also think Dumbledore did not know. If he did, I doubt he would have allowed the Marauders to go roaming around the villages, when there was always a danger of Lupin biting or hurting someone. I don't think he'd take it as fun or as a harmless prank.

Plus, Dumbledore would also have been on the lookout of an Animagus trying to enter the School all through third year, if he was aware of the Marauders becoming Animagi.

[eliza101]

Originally Posted by Annielogic

Keeping something quiet from someone is another way of saying they kept it secret/hidden from them. Maybe this is a language thing.

No, IMO it's a Dumbledore thing.

Also, IMO WWB makes extremely good points.

[silver ink pot]

Originally Posted by eliza101

He said that they kepr it quiet from hm, not that he didn't know. DD plays his cards very close to his chest.

Lupin also confirms that Dumbledore knew nothing about the other three Marauders being Animagi:

From PoA:

I sometimes felt guilty about betraying Dumbledore's trust, of course...he had admitted me to Hogwarts when no other headmaster would have done so, and he had no idea I was breaking the rules he had set down for my own and others' safety. He never knew I had led three fellow students into becoming Animagi illegally.

And Dumbledore says that Sirius confessed to him about it, and I don't see why that wouldn't be true

Last night Sirius told me all about how they became Animagi," said Dumbledore, smiling. "An extraordinary achievement -- not least, keeping it quiet from me.

I see no reason why Dumbledore would be lying with that statement. He never once warned Harry about avoiding animals that year, nor does he seem to have asked Lupin about Sirius's form as an animagus.

Harry heard the door of the hall creak open again, and more footsteps.
"Headmaster?" It was Snape. Harry kept quite still, listening hard. "The whole of the third floor has been searched. He's not there. And Filch has done the dungeons; nothing there either."
"What about the Astronomy tower? Professor Trelawney's room? The Owlery?"
"All searched."
"Very well, Severus. I didn't really expect Black to linger."
"Have you any theory as to how he got in, Professor?" asked Snape. Harry raised his head very slightly off his arms to free his other ear.
"Many, Severus, each of them as unlikely as the next."

I take that to mean that Dumbledore was guessing how Sirius entered the school. Being an animagus might have been one guess, but he clearly didn't know since Snape and Filch were searching for a man, not a dog.

Come to think of it, I don't understand why Sirius never admitted to Fudge or someone else that he and Peter were Animagi? What did he have to lose? He was already in prison, after all.

[eliza101]

Originally Posted by silver ink pot

Lupin also confirms that Dumbledore knew nothing about the other three Marauders being Animagi:

From PoA:



And Dumbledore says that Sirius confessed to him about it, and I don't see why that wouldn't be true



I see no reason why Dumbledore would be lying with that statement. He never once warned Harry about avoiding animals that year, nor does he seem to have asked Lupin about Sirius's form as an animagus.



I take that to mean that Dumbledore was guessing how Sirius entered the school. Being an animagus might have been one guess, but he clearly didn't know since Snape and Filch were searching for a man, not a dog.

Come to think of it, I don't understand why Sirius never admitted to Fudge or someone else that he and Peter were Animagi? What did he have to lose? He was already in prison, after all.

DD never comes out and says he didn't know. He makes very ambiguous statements. I think he knew.

[UselessCharmMaster]

Originally Posted by silver ink pot

I see no reason why Dumbledore would be lying with that statement. He never once warned Harry about avoiding animals that year, nor does he seem to have asked Lupin about Sirius's form as an animagus.

Yes, and nobody was looking or asking for a big black dog seen near the school.

Come to think of it, I don't understand why Sirius never admitted to Fudge or someone else that he and Peter were Animagi? What did he have to lose? He was already in prison, after all.

Oh, you know, SIP, my impression is that he was just thrown into the prison -without a trial, do you remeber?- and nobody asked him anything more: being a bloody murderer, he just deserved the Dementors as his only company... (I must admit my opinion about the justice in the WW is very, very low... )

[Moriath]

Locked until you remember your age.