The All Inclusive HBP Thread v11

[Montse]

Originally Posted by lcbaseball22

I watched the interview, he said there was a scene cut from OotP where he was "driving a car hanging out with a girl

What?
Dont I tell you these people are adding new stuff. It might help the plot.After all they did cut Snape´s worst memory into nothing and of course now they need to make up for it. After Hallows they have realized it was a dumb thing to butcher Snape´s worst memmory.But in a car?
doing muggle stuff?
I will wait to see what they come up with and how creative it turns out to be and how it was needed .

I agree the scary face is probably the Infieri.

[Fleur du mal]

I got the impression that the mention of the car and the girl were intended ironically - probably because he isn't permitted to take about his actual scenes in detail.

[boushh]

I think he was joking about shooting stuff in a car with a girl...

I'm just happy he's going to be in some moving photograph(s) in HBP. It's possible Lily may show up in a similar way as well. That's my guess anyway.

[Hysteria]

I got the impression that the mention of the car and the girl were intended ironically - probably because he isn't permitted to take about his actual scenes in detai

That's what I thought. I don't see how a 'girl and a car' scene is at all relevant to the Harry Potter story or Snape in general.

[MasterOfDeath]

INTERESTING interview! What really got me most was when he revealed he called Yates up to ask why his role in Snape's Worst Memory was cut down so much and Yates said it was the studio's decision. This is very important to me and anyone who complained about the choppy editing of OOTP because it might be along the path of proving Phrozenone's point that perhaps we shouldn't blame Yates too much for the choppy editing of OOTP. It might have been the blasted studio. Hopefully after the success of OOTP, they will have given Yates more freedom this time around!

When he described his scene that was cut with Snape in a car or something, he sounded very serious...I mean if it was a joke, wouldn't the interviewer or the actors have laughed or something? I agree its an odd concept...I really hope we get some information on this or someone confirms he was joking.

They made plenty other great jokes. Alec Hopkins said he would be in HBP throughout the film in a painting and then the interviewer said something like: "Oh! Thats a step-up! Your in the film for a few more seconds. What are they going to do for HP7? Put you in a stamp?!"

So it is confirmed that young Snape's photo will be featured throughout HBP. This is a good thing imo.

[Fleur du mal]

wouldn't the interviewer or the actors have laughed or something?

the way the interviewer was looking, he was on the verge of bursting out with laughter ALL THE TIME, imo

[MasterOfDeath]

Originally Posted by Fleur du mal

the way the interviewer was looking, he was on the verge of bursting out with laughter ALL THE TIME, imo

Yeah, I know but still...Alec Hopkins sounded pretty serious when he talked about the cut scene of Snape in a car. Note: I don't recall him talking about 'girls' in the car. Just Snape in a car. Maybe it was one memory where Snape was in the backseat of a car while his parents fought in the front seat?

[oierem]

If the studio forced Yates to cut down the movie, it was because the movie was too long. That's Kloves/Yates' fault. They shot a movie of 3 hours and then they had to cut down everything. If the adaptation was handled better, there would be no need to cut everything down.

[MasterOfDeath]

Originally Posted by oierem

If the studio forced Yates to cut down the movie, it was because the movie was too long. That's Kloves/Yates' fault. They shot a movie of 3 hours and then they had to cut down everything. If the adaptation was handled better, there would be no need to cut everything down.

In your opinion. I would have absolutely no problem with a three-hour film.

[Fleur du mal]

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

In your opinion. I would have absolutely no problem with a three-hour film.

I second that

[yoshi2542]

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

INTERESTING interview! What really got me most was when he revealed he called Yates up to ask why his role in Snape's Worst Memory was cut down so much and Yates said it was the studio's decision. This is very important to me and anyone who complained about the choppy editing of OOTP because it might be along the path of proving Phrozenone's point that perhaps we shouldn't blame Yates too much for the choppy editing of OOTP. It might have been the blasted studio. Hopefully after the success of OOTP, they will have given Yates more freedom this time around!

I wouldn't infer that much. Maybe they told Yates to cut down the irrelevant (to the story of OOTP) scene involving Snape and Lily, but the movie had other editing problems that were far more glaring. Yates should have recognised that OOTP was not the right time for that particular scene in the first place. He only has himself to blame when a higher-up rightly tells him to cut/condense something that has no resolution by the end of the movie. He included an irrelevant scene, was told to cut it down, and instead of chopping it completely he chose to leave a half-baked snippet in the movie. The studio might have pressured Yates in terms of what was included, but the actual cuts and transitions were still under the control of Yates/Mark Day, and the fact that Yates chose to include the gimped SWM, rather than saving it for later, shows that, for OOTP at least, he was more interested in faithfulness to the text than elegant film making. A natural reaction for someone thrust into their first book-to-film adaptation, but not a good one.

[lcbaseball22]

Originally Posted by yoshi2542

I wouldn't infer that much. Maybe they told Yates to cut down the irrelevant (to the story of OOTP) scene involving Snape and Lily, but the movie had other editing problems that were far more glaring. Yates should have recognised that OOTP was not the right time for that particular scene in the first place. He only has himself to blame when a higher-up rightly tells him to cut/condense something that has no resolution by the end of the movie. He included an irrelevant scene, was told to cut it down, and instead of chopping it completely he chose to leave a half-baked snippet in the movie. The studio might have pressured Yates in terms of what was included, but the actual cuts and transitions were still under the control of Yates/Mark Day, and the fact that Yates chose to include the gimped SWM, rather than saving it for later, shows that, for OOTP at least, he was more interested in faithfulness to the text than elegant film making. A natural reaction for someone thrust into their first book-to-film adaptation, but not a good one.

Yes, but he didn't know that because DH wasn't out yet Jo should have told them to save it for later

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

Yeah, I know but still...Alec Hopkins sounded pretty serious when he talked about the cut scene of Snape in a car. Note: I don't recall him talking about 'girls' in the car. Just Snape in a car. Maybe it was one memory where Snape was in the backseat of a car while his parents fought in the front seat?

You have to listen carefully to catch the "with a girl" part...he kinda tails off at the end of that sentence

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

In your opinion. I would have absolutely no problem with a three-hour film.

Me Three! I love LONG films! Hence, one of the reasons the first 2 HP movies are my favorite thusfar

[TLFL22]

I really dont mind the house elves part being cut out...I mean there is a lot of information that has to be revealed and wasting screen time on events that are implied is kind of a waste if you ask me...but I would of like to see the funeral if only for the fact that Ron and Hermione have a moment...

[JamesPotter17]

Well the first one we got I believe it was early August or late July! I can't remember, but I know it was either 4-5 months before it came out(well this one, the next one could be closer to it's opening in July!

but I just want a posters that looks good; and maybe shows the trio and maybe Lavender and Ginny in the back ground. Or like that poster they had in New York.With Harry and Dumbledore on the left and Draco and Snape on the right!

[MasterOfDeath]

Originally Posted by yoshi2542

I wouldn't infer that much. Maybe they told Yates to cut down the irrelevant (to the story of OOTP) scene involving Snape and Lily, but the movie had other editing problems that were far more glaring. Yates should have recognised that OOTP was not the right time for that particular scene in the first place. He only has himself to blame when a higher-up rightly tells him to cut/condense something that has no resolution by the end of the movie. He included an irrelevant scene, was told to cut it down, and instead of chopping it completely he chose to leave a half-baked snippet in the movie. The studio might have pressured Yates in terms of what was included, but the actual cuts and transitions were still under the control of Yates/Mark Day, and the fact that Yates chose to include the gimped SWM, rather than saving it for later, shows that, for OOTP at least, he was more interested in faithfulness to the text than elegant film making. A natural reaction for someone thrust into their first book-to-film adaptation, but not a good one.

Oh come on. That just shows how much Yates cares about the fans then. The studio told him to cut it so he comprised and left enough of it in there. It's a great scene that fleshes out Snape's character and its relevant to the film because it is the incentive that causes Snape to throw Harry from his office and cancel his occulmency lessons, leading to Voldemort being able to manipulate Harry's thoughts and show him the vision of Sirius being tortured leading Harry to the Ministry and capping off the entire ending of the movie.
SWM was hardly useless in OOTP. Unless you dumb it down and invent a boring non-canon reason for Snape stopping the lessons or change the entire story, but WHY do you need to do that when the original story is so compelling as it is? I agree though that OOTP had bad editing all around but where we disagree is that I don't believe its because of 'useless' scenes. Am I being a purist because I think the story as in the book is good enough for a film and doesn't need to be changed so drastically?

Besides, many people understand (or should imo) that this is a series of movies and an on-going story. It's good to have plot points or hints in one movie that pay-off in the next movie. Having Snape/Lily in OOTP might have been too much for OOTP as a movie (we agree on that) which is why I hope they make extended editions of all the movies for the fans.

It's good to see you agree, Fleur and LC. A three hour film would be amazing and I think WB kinda owes it to us now, especially after the delay.

If they made HBP nearly 3 hours, I would be more keen to forgive them for the delay.

[yoshi2542]

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

SWM was hardly useless in OOTP.

It served it's purpose as a way to get out of the Occlumency lessons. I'm simply saying that instead of saving that whole moment for a more appropriate time, Yates had to hastily remove half of it and then, once it was on screen, completely forget about the other half. The full version could have had much more impact, where Harry actually has time to reflect on it. Using such an important moment as a throwaway may be functionally sound, but it's used up a critical moment in Harry's development as a get-out for the Occlumency lessons. Don't get me wrong, they can go back to it and it will still work, but it did feel a little cheap for us to be teased with this harsh truth about James, and to then never see Harry react properly.

It's good to see you agree, Fleur and LC. A three hour film would be amazing and I think WB kinda owes it to us now, especially after the delay.

If they made HBP nearly 3 hours, I would be more keen to forgive them for the delay.

Personally I think there is not enough material for a 3 hour HBP. You'd be veering into self-indulgence IMO. Look at Peter Jackson's King Kong. What would fill up the extra 45 minutes of a 3 hour HBP?

[MasterOfDeath]

Originally Posted by yoshi2542

It served it's purpose as a way to get out of the Occlumency lessons. I'm simply saying that instead of saving that whole moment for a more appropriate time, Yates had to hastily remove half of it and then, once it was on screen, completely forget about the other half. The full version could have had much more impact, where Harry actually has time to reflect on it. Using such an important moment as a throwaway may be functionally sound, but it's used up a critical moment in Harry's development as a get-out for the Occlumency lessons. Don't get me wrong, they can go back to it and it will still work, but it did feel a little cheap for us to be teased with this harsh truth about James, and to then never see Harry react properly.



Personally I think there is not enough material for a 3 hour HBP. You'd be veering into self-indulgence IMO. Look at Peter Jackson's King Kong. What would fill up the extra 45 minutes of a 3 hour HBP?

Are you kidding? Not enough material to fill up three hours? Theres enough material to fill up 8 hours if they wanted to!

A 3 hour movie would have space to have Scirmgeour, the Gaunts, many of the other memories and the Lavender/Ron/Harry/Ginny/Quidditch romance stuff, plus the new Burrow attack, Dumbledore's funeral, extend every scene so they are scenes and not barely clips like OOTP, More classroom scenes with Snape, etc.

Now an 8 hour HP film would not make a good movie (maybe for the fans) but you can hardly say there is not enough material...

Sorry, its just funny that you said there is not ENOUGH material because that is the problem the filmmakers always face. Having to cut down so much and now you're saying theres not even material for a 3 hour film. That is absurd, imo.

[yoshi2542]

Originally Posted by MasterOfDeath

Are you kidding? Not enough material to fill up three hours? Theres enough material to fill up 8 hours if they wanted to!

A 3 hour movie would have space to have Scirmgeour, the Gaunts, many of the other memories and the Lavender/Ron/Harry/Ginny/Quidditch romance stuff, plus the new Burrow attack, Dumbledore's funeral, extend every scene so they are scenes and not barely clips like OOTP, More classroom scenes with Snape, etc.

Now an 8 hour HP film would not make a good movie (maybe for the fans) but you can hardly say there is not enough material...

Sorry, its just funny that you said there is not ENOUGH material because that is the problem the filmmakers always face. Having to cut down so much and now you're saying theres not even material for a 3 hour film. That is absurd, imo.

Perhaps I should have said good material. I do think some of what you've mentioned is worth including, the Gaunts and Scrimgeour, I'd add the Dursleys, but the rest save for Ginny, is fluff, Dumbledore's funeral would work much better as the opener to a one part DH IMO and extending scenes arbitrarily always means you risk boring people. Being forced to suffer through 3 hours of teen romance and wizard sports would be...unpleasant. I suppose the difference between our views is that whereas you enjoy the fullness of the world and all the characters, and enjoy seeing that on screen, I am always thinking about what I would do from a storytelling perspective. By including things like Quidditch, Ron's romantic foibles, extraneous classroom scenes, I can only see the movie's tone being muddled and the message being obfuscated. Seems like you want to take the novel and fashion a movie out of that, and I want to take the story itself (in this case Harry making the right/easy choice of companions), and build a movie around that.

[MasterOfDeath]

Originally Posted by yoshi2542

Perhaps I should have said good material. I do think some of what you've mentioned is worth including, the Gaunts and Scrimgeour, I'd add the Dursleys, but the rest save for Ginny, is fluff, Dumbledore's funeral would work much better as the opener to a one part DH IMO and extending scenes arbitrarily always means you risk boring people. Being forced to suffer through 3 hours of teen romance and wizard sports would be...unpleasant. I suppose the difference between our views is that whereas you enjoy the fullness of the world and all the characters, and enjoy seeing that on screen, I am always thinking about what I would do from a storytelling perspective. By including things like Quidditch, Ron's romantic foibles, extraneous classroom scenes, I can only see the movie's tone being muddled and the message being obfuscated. Seems like you want to take the novel and fashion a movie out of that, and I want to take the story itself (in this case Harry making the right/easy choice of companions), and build a movie around that.

Well, no, I don't think an extremely long film will technically be a good movie (it could be it would need alot of work). I'm just saying ascetically for me and many other fans, they would be.

I'm not saying the films need to be so many hours, I'm just making the point that they could be. I wasn't so keen on the lavender/Ron subplot but after seeing pictures of those scenes and seeing them together and seeing the pic of Ron drugged up on love potions, I think this could be a really funny and entertaining part of the movie.

As a hardcore fan of the books, I would love for everything to be in the movies but that doesn't mean I think they would be popular with general audience, no not at all. My own opinions on films and my opinions on what makes a good film that pleases many other people are two different things. In-fact, what makes a popular film does not all the time match with what makes a critically good film.

When it comes to art, I really don't like to complain about anything. It is the author's story. They could do whatever they want as long as it makes sense within the world they created. I'll flow with it. The same for films.

The thing is, these movies aren't original. They are based on an already well-established and well-loved international story, and in my mind, the filmmakers should have some obligation to respect and stay true to the original stories. Legally, I know they could do whatever they want, but morally, in my opinion, they should stay true to the books.

I don't only love HP for the overall stories. If so, I would be a big fan of any other story. I enjoy the unique characters and the experience of the story instead of only the bare bones story itself.

Wimsey likes to make the point (and it is a good point to an extent) that fans see the trees but do not see the whole forest. For me, I believe that there would be no forest without the trees.

I think a 3-hour film could work as long as the pacing and the editing and narrative are sufficient.

My problem with the OOTP film lies not in the conception but in the execution and I think this is true for this entire debate.

In my opinion, its not all about the conception of ideas. It's about the execution. It doesn't matter if you plan to make a three hour film or a two hour or if you plan to make a film about the bare bones overall story or stay truer to the book.They both could fail and they both could succeed. It all depends on the execution. The manner in which the idea is translated to reality.

[yoshi2542]

I get what you're saying Master. I am just unable to take off my 'story first' goggles.

When it comes to art, I really don't like to complain about anything.

I guess I do. When justified of course. I prefer to think of it as sensible criticism rather than complaining, though.