Login  
 
 
Go Back   Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Harry Potter Archives

Can Snape really be trusted?



 
 
Thread Tools
  #61  
Old August 26th, 2003, 12:33 am
jasper's Avatar
jasper  Undisclosed.gif jasper is offline
Seventh Year
 
Joined: 5412 days
Location: alternate reality
Posts: 1,758
Mr. Malfoy speaks highly of Snape to Dolores Umbridge/ the ministry. What does that mean? Does that really mean that Malfoy trusts Snape and thinks highly of him? Malfoy is in the business of lying to the ministry.

Malfoy speaking highly of Snape could just be Malfoy schmoozing up, trying to secure favors for his kid, and trying to sound like a supporter of the ministry effort at school reform.

What is Malfoy going to tell Umbridge if he in fact doesn't trust Snape? He can't say, "That Snape is a dirty double crosser. It makes me so mad that he's working against my pal Voldy."

So, anyway, no matter what Snape is up to, we are unlikely to hear Malfoy badmouthing him for it.


Sponsored Links
  #62  
Old August 26th, 2003, 3:17 am
avada_kedavra  Female.gif avada_kedavra is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5407 days
Location: an existential quandary...
Age: 28
Posts: 41
But what if Umbridge was on Voldemort's side? If Umbridge and Lucius both are on Voldy's side, then why can't Lucius speak of Snape as he wants to? I think that Umbridge just wanted to make Snape THINK about possibly Umbridge and Lucius being on to him, and maybe getting caught.


__________________
"This is Ken Kaniff calling from Connecticut, can you accept?"
  #63  
Old August 26th, 2003, 4:28 am
vickygirl4  Female.gif vickygirl4 is offline
Fourth Year
 
Joined: 5446 days
Location: Guess
Age: 31
Posts: 551
I don't think Umbridge was on Voldemort's side. She was evil, but like Sirius said, the world is not divided into good people and death eaters. SHe is too proud and selfish to serve Voldemort.


  #64  
Old September 3rd, 2003, 3:38 am
MadMagic's Avatar
MadMagic  Female.gif MadMagic is offline
Twilight Princess
 
Joined: 5646 days
Location: in the sky with diamonds
Age: 34
Posts: 3,075
I would like to trust him, actually I completely trust him. But I don't know if we can in the future. JK said (at least I am pretty sure she did) that we shouldn't be feeling so sorry for him (because of his Worst Memory), which leads me to think that he will do something that will make us not want to trust him anymore. Hopefully whatever is going to make us not feel sorry for him anymore took place in the past, but we don't really know.

For now though, I think we can trust him.


__________________
Into these twisted months I plunge without a light to follow
but I swear that I would follow anything,
just get me out of here.


  #65  
Old September 3rd, 2003, 4:37 am
Severely Snapped's Avatar
Severely Snapped  Female.gif Severely Snapped is offline
Fourth Year
 
Joined: 5639 days
Location: The S.S. Always
Age: 50
Posts: 552
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper
Mr. Malfoy speaks highly of Snape to Dolores Umbridge/ the ministry. What does that mean? Does that really mean that Malfoy trusts Snape and thinks highly of him? Malfoy is in the business of lying to the ministry.

Malfoy speaking highly of Snape could just be Malfoy schmoozing up, trying to secure favors for his kid, and trying to sound like a supporter of the ministry effort at school reform.

What is Malfoy going to tell Umbridge if he in fact doesn't trust Snape? He can't say, "That Snape is a dirty double crosser. It makes me so mad that he's working against my pal Voldy."

So, anyway, no matter what Snape is up to, we are unlikely to hear Malfoy badmouthing him for it.
All excellent points. But I have a question: is Malfoy speaking "highly" of Snape to Umbridge personally, or is this just what she's getting trickle-down from Fudge? Because if Malfoy is singing Snape's praises to Fudge, I'm VERY confused. Fudge KNOWS Snape is supporting Dumbledore; Snape showed him his Dark Mark at the end of GoF ("I don't know what you and your staff are playing at, Dumbledore...") and told him DD was right, that the Dark Lord had returned.

Now, Fudge doesn't trust DD, so why on earth would he trust Snape, no matter what Malfoy said?


__________________

"Hey, Mom! Snape DIDN'T die - he's pitching in the World Series!"
[
  #66  
Old October 12th, 2003, 4:49 pm
Severus15  Female.gif Severus15 is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5340 days
Location: Up in the Great White North
Age: 30
Posts: 71
I theink Snape's still on the good side. Moreover, I think he was that spy that alerted Lily and James Potter about Voldemort comming after them so that they could perform the Fidelius Charm to protect themselves. In The Prisoner of Azkaban, McGonnagall tells Madam Rosmerta that it was a spy that found out about Voldemort comming after them. Snapes really the only spy we know so the idea seems plausable.

Severus15

"You should have realized that if Voldemort didn't kill you, we would. Goodbye, Peter."

"The crumple-horned snorkack can't fly!"


  #67  
Old October 12th, 2003, 5:16 pm
TiffW04 TiffW04 is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5355 days
Posts: 28
""Then there's characters like Snape, who are bad but there is a certain ambiguity about him. You can't quite decide because there's something quite sad about him. Something very lonely. We're slowly (after five books) getting the idea that maybe he is not so bad after all.

JK Rowling:
Yes, but you shouldn't think he's too nice. Let me just say that. It is worth keeping an eye on old Severus Snape, definitely.

^That's from the webcast with J.K. Rowling a couple of days ago.""

Do you have a link to that interview?


  #68  
Old October 12th, 2003, 5:56 pm
paradoxpanda paradoxpanda is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5434 days
Posts: 26
"Only the death eaters call V the Dark Lord (ytes, Ludo Bagman included). "

I might be wrong, but in PoA I think Sibyll Trelawney calls him the Dark Lord when she's making her prediction.

We all know Snape was once a Death Eater. So what if he didn't stop calling Voldemort the Dark Lord?


I like Snape in general, but it was in PoA that he was genuinely slimy. Assuming he WAS a spy for Voldemort before his downfall, he knew that Sirius was innocent, and he still tried to get him put in Azkaban. That's all that we really have against him.


  #69  
Old October 12th, 2003, 6:44 pm
xx-adele-xxx xx-adele-xxx is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5337 days
Posts: 1
i agree with u, why does dumbledore trust snape so much? well, i think he trusts snape because snape isnt all he thinks he is. i think snape puts on an act. i think that deep dwon, he isnt as bad as he makes out he is. i know that sounds stupid but it is what i think. and that is why dumbledore trusts him, coz dumbledore knows the real snape. dumbledore is bery wise and i think he knows best. if he suspected at all that snape was still workin for voldemort, he would certainly sack snape hterefore i dont think snape is still working for voldemort and i think he is trustworthy. plz reply.


  #70  
Old October 13th, 2003, 2:54 am
Cosmos  Male.gif Cosmos is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5339 days
Location: Australia
Age: 34
Posts: 20
So many possibilities here.
First of all, correct me if I'm wrong. Didn't Dumbledore say that he gives everyone a second chance? It's been a while since I read the earlier books, so I'm kinda rusty.
But I do have a feeling snape will turn bad again, only because he still calls Voldemort the Dark Lord.
But I could (and probably am) totally wrong. It might be the totally opposite, he could end up really helping harry in the end, and even die saving him (maybe I'm getting too far here)


  #71  
Old October 13th, 2003, 4:39 am
Severely Snapped's Avatar
Severely Snapped  Female.gif Severely Snapped is offline
Fourth Year
 
Joined: 5639 days
Location: The S.S. Always
Age: 50
Posts: 552
"What made you believe he'd really stopped supporting Voldemort?"
"That, Harry, is a matter between Professor Snape and myself."


Obviously, we don't know what "that" is (or was), but with a setup like that, it has to be big. I can't wait to find out more about this.

Oh, and Rowling would NEVER tell us to "keep an eye" on a character if she's planning some major shocking plot twist around him or her. It's not her style. Can you imagine how it would have spoiled GoF, for example, if she'd said, "It's worth keeping an eye on old Mad-Eye Moody?"


__________________

"Hey, Mom! Snape DIDN'T die - he's pitching in the World Series!"
[
  #72  
Old October 16th, 2003, 12:14 pm
paradoxpanda paradoxpanda is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 5434 days
Posts: 26
Back to the Dark Lord thing, Trelawney does call him the Dark Lord in her prediction, Kreacher calls him the Dark Lord (I forget where, but I remember that distinctly). For anyone who knows the books particularly well, does Karkaroff refer to him as the Dark Lord? Because he's ALSO an ex-Death Eater.


  #73  
Old October 16th, 2003, 7:20 pm
Prosperine  Female.gif Prosperine is offline
Third Year
 
Joined: 5444 days
Location: Wishing I was elsewhere
Age: 36
Posts: 474
I think Snape did something to save someone else, which he probably risked his own life to do, which is why Dumbledore trusts him. I think the thing JKR refers to us having to keep an eye on is the fact that it is quite obvious that Snape has a VERY dark past and there may be several things that he has done that are downright evil.

The Death Eaters in the dept of mystery (OotP) reacted very strongly when Harry said Voldemort's name. They're just as afraid as everyone else of using it. And if Snape knew or even suspected he would have to return to associating with them someday, why would he get out of the habit of refering to Voldie as the Dark Lord?? If he slipped, then he might be killed, and I would be sad with no Snape around!


__________________
[center] <br>Fancy a dip in the pool, mate?
<br>
marquee not functioning
  #74  
Old October 16th, 2003, 10:58 pm
hesdead-dealwithit  Male.gif hesdead-dealwithit is offline
Banned
 
Joined: 5408 days
Posts: 2,478
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prosperine
I think Snape did something to save someone else, which he probably risked his own life to do, which is why Dumbledore trusts him. I think the thing JKR refers to us having to keep an eye on is the fact that it is quite obvious that Snape has a VERY dark past and there may be several things that he has done that are downright evil.
Several? He was a Death Eater, for crying out loud. He's probably killed or tortured dozens! At heart, probably, he is a good person, which is why DD trusts him, but on the surface, he probably succumbed to some sort of peer pressure and joined the DEs. And you can't be a Death Eater without doing some evil stuff.


  #75  
Old October 17th, 2003, 12:54 am
[Pretty]_[Unicorn]  Male.gif [Pretty]_[Unicorn] is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 5434 days
Location: Unicorn Land
Posts: 244
I think Snape proved himself in OotP because somewhere in the book DD said Snape is doing some very dangerous work (wonder what it can be). But he has always struck me as being evil. He past seems to make him what he is in the future and HP being James's son, and James who played a lot of tricks on Snape and even saved his life but Snape won't admit it, Snape wants to get back whatever way he can. I have my doubts on Snape and really actually hate him.


  #76  
Old October 25th, 2003, 11:53 pm
Angora's Avatar
Angora  Female.gif Angora is offline
Sixth Year
 
Joined: 5427 days
Location: Canada
Posts: 961
I don't think there was some dramatic gesture that made Dumbledore trust Snape. I think it's just a matter of Dumbledore being very good at understanding people.

I think if at some point DE Snape approched him and indicated (intentionally or unintentionally) that the whole DE thing was kind of upsetting him, Dumbledore would have trusted that.

I think Snape is trustworthy as far as the larger issues go. But there'll probably be something smaller that he'll cop out on because of his personal issues.


  #77  
Old October 26th, 2003, 12:22 am
purplehawk's Avatar
purplehawk  Female.gif purplehawk is offline
Renegade
 
Joined: 5416 days
Location: Buckeye Country
Age: 69
Posts: 28,509
I don't like Snape at all. I felt a bit sorry for him when James and Sirius were tormenting him. I felt admiration for the way he discussed matters with Harry at the beginning of their occlumency lessons. These things are outweighed in my mind, however, by the way he set out to make Harry pay for James from Harry's first day at Hogwarts. Snape is a good teacher in terms of knowledge... but that doesn't change the fact he is a hopelessly flawed person.


__________________



"A great democracy does not make it harder to vote than to buy an assault weapon."

~ President Bill Clinton ~
August 28, 2013
50th Anniversary of "I Have a Dream"


All opinions expressed are my own and do not reflect those of any political or government body.
  #78  
Old October 26th, 2003, 12:36 am
Jill  Female.gif Jill is offline
Banned
 
Joined: 5332 days
Location: confusion land....
Posts: 1,064
Quote:
Originally Posted by purplehawk
I don't like Snape at all. I felt a bit sorry for him when James and Sirius were tormenting him. I felt admiration for the way he discussed matters with Harry at the beginning of their occlumency lessons. These things are outweighed in my mind, however, by the way he set out to make Harry pay for James from Harry's first day at Hogwarts. Snape is a good teacher in terms of knowledge... but that doesn't change the fact he is a hopelessly flawed person.

Yes but sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. I think this is what Snape has been doing all along with Harry. I think its more than just a grudge caused by past wrongs with James. Everyone else moddlecoddles Harry and really thats not preparing him to face Voldermort, thats shielding Harry from what he needs and has to face. Snape on the other hand gives Harry a bit on insight into what Voldermorts personality is like. If Harry can not cope with Snapes tauntings then what chance does he have with Voldermort. I am not saying that Snape has help Harry out intensionally but he has taught him how to hold his tongue and be patient even at the worst of times.


  #79  
Old October 26th, 2003, 12:43 am
purplehawk's Avatar
purplehawk  Female.gif purplehawk is offline
Renegade
 
Joined: 5416 days
Location: Buckeye Country
Age: 69
Posts: 28,509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill
Yes but sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. I think this is what Snape has been doing all along with Harry. I think its more than just a grudge caused by past wrongs with James. Everyone else moddlecoddles Harry and really thats not preparing him to face Voldermort, thats shielding Harry from what he needs and has to face. Snape on the other hand gives Harry a bit on insight into what Voldermorts personality is like. If Harry can not cope with Snapes tauntings then what chance does he have with Voldermort. I am not saying that Snape has help Harry out intensionally but he has taught him how to hold his tongue and be patient even at the worst of times.
Snape has also taught Harry hate, cruelty, utter disregard for fairness, and sheer loathing - traits more associated with the dark side than the good. No way will I ever believe Snape's behavior is intended to help Harry grow strong. Snape would love nothing better than the pound Harry into the ground.


__________________



"A great democracy does not make it harder to vote than to buy an assault weapon."

~ President Bill Clinton ~
August 28, 2013
50th Anniversary of "I Have a Dream"


All opinions expressed are my own and do not reflect those of any political or government body.
  #80  
Old October 26th, 2003, 12:53 am
Jill  Female.gif Jill is offline
Banned
 
Joined: 5332 days
Location: confusion land....
Posts: 1,064
Quote:
Originally Posted by purplehawk
Snape has also taught Harry hate, cruelty, utter disregard for fairness, and sheer loathing - traits more associated with the dark side than the good. No way will I ever believe Snape's behavior is intended to help Harry grow strong. Snape would love nothing better than the pound Harry into the ground.
Yes but then so has Voldermort before hand, so Snape really hasn't taught him those qualities, Tom and Voldermort have. Even so Harry now has a better understanding of where Voldermort gains his powers from. So Snape is teaching Harry to expect the worst from Voldermort and also where to hit him the hardest because Harry now knows where Voldermorts power comes from.

Harry has learnt to restrain himself from Snapes teachings proving that he is capable and has the potential to defeat Voldermort himself. Thats why Snape tells Harry that he is no match for the Dark Lord if he doesn't even try to hold back on his emotions. Not in those such words but thats what Snape was trying to teach him in OotP and possibly all along throught out the books.

I just hope she doesn't kill Snape off in the next book, if she does I won't cope and I will not be able to continue with the series. It would be too devestating for me.

Besides Snape has also taught Harry that no matter how much you dislike someone, you can never stand by and see them die. Snapes saved Harrys life so many times, I have lost count. This is actually something good in Snapes character, he would never allow a student to be harmed in anyway and would put himself infrount of any danger instead. Thats why Dumbledore trust Snape so much.


 
Go Back  Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Harry Potter Archives

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 5:28 am.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Original content is Copyright MMII - MMVIII, CoSForums.com. All Rights Reserved.
Other content (posts, images, etc) is Copyright its respective owners.