Gender: Roles, Stereotypes, Discrimination

[OldLupin]

Originally Posted by Yoana

Because hitting someone who is physically weaker than you is what's the bad thing here.

And because men have a long and infamous history of beating up women without any consequences - this was consedered alright. It just brings it out, while a woman hitiing a man brings nothing out - women were not legally allowed to beat theur husbands on a Saturday with a stick not thicker than her thumb (a law still existing in an American state, can't remember which one). It just brings back ugly scenes from the totally biased and dscriminating history of gender interaction.

And there's the psychological factor as well. A man hiiting you immediately invokes your awareness of his physical superiority. He could easily pin you down and rape you, while a woman can't do anything, she's the weaker one.

Forgive my cynicism, but you are overlooking the fact that women have always hit men with a certain level of impunity, even when archaic laws have been in place. The difference is that no man will have any sympathy for being hit by a woman. The irony is that it is generally men with no compunction about striking women who are least likely to get struck by women. The men who would not strike a woman have long been the recipients of slap and punches by the fairer sex. To insinuate that women hitting men is acceptable because it hasn't been "allowed" for hundreds of years while beating women has been long sanctioned is misleading and incongruent with the actual history of civilized societies. The men in a woman’s family would deter men of any ilk, many times solely excluding husbands, from raising their hands to a lady in most civilizations. There has hardly ever been any honor associated with striking a woman and the consequences have long been severe for such actions. Acting as if women have long been allowed to be victimized by random men without recourse or reprisals is just not true.

[Eileithyia]

Originally Posted by OldLupin

Forgive my cynicism, but you are overlooking the fact that women have always hit men with a certain level of impunity, even when archaic laws have been in place. The difference is that no man will have any sympathy for being hit by a woman. The irony is that it is generally men with no compunction about striking women who are least likely to get struck by women. The men who would not strike a woman have long been the recipients of slap and punches by the fairer sex. To insinuate that women hitting men is acceptable because it hasn't been "allowed" for hundreds of years while beating women has been long sanctioned is misleading and incongruent with the actual history of civilized societies. The men in a woman’s family would deter men of any ilk, many times solely excluding husbands, from raising their hands to a lady in most civilizations. There has hardly ever been any honor associated with striking a woman and the consequences have long been severe for such actions. Acting as if women have long been allowed to be victimized by random men without recourse or reprisals is just not true.

While it was legal for men to beat their wives and children, I think you are correct in stating that "random" men weren't allowed legally (or otherwise) to go around assaulting women.

And you are also right that there is little sympathy to be found for a man who is abused by a woman. That's pretty shameful, as well. I don't think there is any justification for that type of behavior from either gender. Abuse is abuse, no matter the sex of the perpetrator.

[katsumi]

I think that while some people might not have sympathy for a man who is assaulted or abused by a woman, there are PLENTY who do. In the eyes of the law in Canada, a man who is victimized by a woman will be taken very seriously -- and rightly so.

I think it is very dangerous to make a blanket statement that "since men have had the monopoly on violence, women should be allowed to be violent." It leaves us running around in circles, chasing our own tails. And women being the weaker or fairer sex does not give them the right to use violence against anyone (unless and only if it is in self defense).

I had a file once at our office (I work for the Prosecutor's office) where a man was assaulted by his ex-girlfriend. He had been attending a dancing lesson with a friend and she saw him getting into his car and ran at him, screaming and throwing out insults. She kicked his knee in and hit him in the head with a bottle.
She was charged and the prosecutors really went after her -- and rightly so.

That woman was out of control and she HURT somebody. Being a woman did not excuse her and being weaker than her ex didn't make his knee any less injured.

I think we need to get out of the way of thinking that either "men are violent" or "women are violent." This isn't an US/THEM situation. It's all just US. There are violent people out there -- men and women inclusive -- and they should all be punished according to the law. Gender ought not to have anything to do with it.

[Yoana]

Originally Posted by OldLupin

Forgive my cynicism, but you are overlooking the fact that women have always hit men with a certain level of impunity, even when archaic laws have been in place. The difference is that no man will have any sympathy for being hit by a woman. The irony is that it is generally men with no compunction about striking women who are least likely to get struck by women. The men who would not strike a woman have long been the recipients of slap and punches by the fairer sex. To insinuate that women hitting men is acceptable because it hasn't been "allowed" for hundreds of years while beating women has been long sanctioned is misleading and incongruent with the actual history of civilized societies.

I wasn't "insinuating" any such thing. I was giving a possible explanation of why it might be overlooked or not reprimanded enough. Men did beat their wives up and that was legal and in some epochs even advisable. It does bring some rather unpleasant associations in women's minds.

The men in a woman’s family would deter men of any ilk, many times solely excluding husbands, from raising their hands to a lady in most civilizations. There has hardly ever been any honor associated with striking a woman and the consequences have long been severe for such actions. Acting as if women have long been allowed to be victimized by random men without recourse or reprisals is just not true.

Honour? Who's talking about honour? And you do realise you're talking only about a small fraction of history and places here, don't you? Because for the greater part of human history and geography, men hitting women was something normal and acceptable. "Ladies" existed only in certain classes in certain countries in certain eras. For all the other women who ever walked this world, it was an existence of objects at the mercy of their owner. Up to the 40s in the so-called civilized world, later in the greater part of the world, and still continuing in many places.

Please don't make out that women were rarely hit in history. This is simply not true, and definitely incomparable with the frequency of men having been abused by their wives.

And again, I am NOT saying this is a justification for women to hit men freely. And I am NOT saying that they can do it because they weren't allowed in the past. I am not even saying that I approve of them doing it. I don't. I am saying that this is a possible explanation why a woman hitting a man is not thought to be quite as horrible as a man hitting a woman - generally.

I wonder what your explanation of that phenomenon is? Why do you think it's generally more easily forgiven?

Originally Posted by katsumi

I think it is very dangerous to make a blanket statement that "since men have had the monopoly on violence, women should be allowed to be violent."

If you go back and read my post, you'll see that I did not make such a statement. Never. It's quite upsetting to have such arrogant and insulting words put in your mouth. Please read the post that was commented on before commenting on it in turn, because not doing so obviously leads to very unpleasant misunderstandings.


I am an object od sexual discrimination here almost every day. Here, where I live, it IS a matter of US and THEM. It is. It's very hard to live this way, and I hate it, and I have to endure it every day, and the only thing that upsets me even more is when someone tells me it's not happening. It is, and it's happening to me. I've been assaulted, I've been whistled at, I've been hinted at not being smart enough to understand something because I'm a woman, I live in this kind of attitude all the time. I know it's there, it exists, and can't be waved away. If someone humiliates me because of my sex, and because they feel superior because of their sex, I'll hit them. I've dome it. There's nothing more painful and insulting than being humiliated and discriminated, treated like a lesser being or an object because you belong to the other sex. It's poisoning my life, and I don't know how to fight it, I don't know what I should do.

[katsumi]

I am sorry, Yoana. I did not make myself clear. I didn't mean to imply that you had said those things or had made those blanket statements. I was more criticizing the kind of attitude that Lupe was talking about in his post.

[Yoana]

Oh, I see now. I'm sorry I overreacted. I always do when it comes don to discrimination. I'd better stay away from this thread, it's far more dangerous for me than any Snap thread there is!

[Defyeverything]

1) Do you believe that men and women are inherently "different" on more than a biological level?

I think it all come down to how you're rasied. If you grow up in a house hold where backward thinking like "Women are there to have babies and keep the house clean for her husband" happens, then you're basically brainwashed to think that women are different in more ways then just a biological reason.

2) Do you believe that gendering is a matter of nature or nurture? A combination of both?

Following my train of thought above, I can see how it could be a combination of the two. Men are by nature can do things women have problems doing, ie: opening a jar of something, heavy lifting etc. I mean women can train up to do things like that but the point is they have to work at it twice as hard than a man would have to. At the same time there are cases of people who are born a male but feel like the should be a female and vice versa.

3) Have you ever felt discriminated against or judged based on your gender?

Oh that's a yes! I use to climb trees and go bike ridding with all the boys and for years was a "tom boy". That lable right there "tom boy" speaks for itself I think, like you have to be boyish in order to do things like that. I think if a little boy wants to play house and with dolls it shouldn't be a problem, the same way it shouldn't be a problem if a little girl wants to play cops and robbers or Wrestling (or climb a tree).

4) Do you feel that your gender is misunderstood by the opposite gender? Have you experienced an "Us/Them" scenario with regard to gender in your relationships with other people?

Of course there's a misunderstanding between opposite genders most of the time! When each side have such stereotypes as “girly-girls” who can’t do anything for fear of breaking a nail and “a mans, man” who drinks all the time and sleeps around with anyone who stands still long enough.


6) Have you ever felt limited by gender roles or ostricized by other members of your own gender for failing to live up to stereotypes and expectations surrounding your gender?

I think it's clear that I have. I've yet to meet someone who hasn't felt this way at some point in their life.

[Tenshi]

Men and women are simply different. They are since the stone age, it's natural and part of the evolution. Many of our society's bahaviour and "stereotypes" result from that and this evolution caused difference you can't change or deny. Like the fact that women are worse in parking than men, that women talk more then men etc. All things that are inherited from the stone age. Where women were responsible for collecting berries and other food and didn't need to reckon distances like their hunting mens and were stone age women where able to talk to each other while going for food, while the men had to be quiet not to scare the chase.

Many things also depend on how you were brought up. But boys are brought up like boys and girls like girls. You won't put a boy in a girl's little dress, because it's just wrong in our opinion. You give dolls to girls and cars to boys, the way we do it since centuries. If it was custom to do it the other way round, boys would wear dresses now. But it's not. It's the society which makes us to the men and women we are.

[Pox Voldius]

Well, I don't know about the other gals in here, but when I was a kid, I got more enjoyment out of my blocks, cars, legos, transformers, lincoln logs, rubber snakes, plastic dinosaurs, play dough, video games, scooter, and the fort I made in the back yard, than I did from my dolls. The dolls, ponies, and trolls were more like collections than toys for me -- rather like my mother's stamp collection, or my dad's coin collection. The Barbies really just sat there, posed, on display, and every once in a while I'd dust off their house, rearrange their furniture and change their outfits.

(edit) Hrm...I nearly forgot my squirt guns, and my home-made bow and arrows. Those were fun. And that creepy crawlers thing (with the little oven and the bug molds).

[katsumi]

To be honest, I was an equal-opportunity little girl when I was a child. A toy was a toy, and if it was a toy I liked it and would play with it. I loved Tonka Trucks, G.I. Joes, Dinkie Cars, Transformers, Barbies, My Little Pony, He-Man and She-Rah, kitchen sets, baby dolls... I'd play with anything.
Though (and I think psychologists will tell you that this is stereotypically female behaviour), I preferred adventure play to war games or games that involved violence or mimicking violence.
I always wanted to hunt for treasure, cross over to a magical world, or just plain discover some undiscovered country.

I'm not sure that what we played with when we were children really defines us. And I would bet that a lot of little girls were left out of playing with some of the more boyish toys that they would otherwise have loved to have played with, because they never owned one or never had access to one.

[Kelfa23]

1) Do you believe that men and women are inherently "different" on more than a biological level?
Yes I do, and it has almost everything to do with the fact that women give birth and have been seen as care-giver since the beginning of man-kind. Men were the providers...they were the hunters and the protectors and this tradition continued for a couple thousand years in every society...with few extenuating circumstances.

2) Do you believe that gendering is a matter of nature or nurture? A combination of both?
It can be considered a combination of both but I'm no biology student. From what I see it has more to do with how a child is raised. Whether it is by the parents or the outside world girls and boys learn their gender differences from birth. Boys and girls are encouraged to play with certain toys, watch certain tv shows and movies and read certain books. They learn they are different from the other gender based on the facts that they were different clothes and even go to different bathrooms in public. They grow and change differently from each other and they know this from being observant at school. Basically, unless a child is living like a hermit with their gender-neutral parents at home...they will learn they are different.

3) Have you ever felt discriminated against or judged based on your gender?
I work in a very male-dominated field with aspriations of starting a career in an even more male-dominated field. I'm an EMT who dreams of becoming a Paramedic/Firefighter. Whats interesting is that I don't hear the comments from my fellow co-workers...except when they moan and groan about doing the extra "female-required" calls. Most of the comments I get are from the older and very old-fasioned patients who cannot believe a women is there to rescue, carry, treat and send to the hospital. I don't even look like a male...in fact, with the long hair and feminine features I'm as far away from looking like a male you can get....but I still hear the standard "thank-you gentlemen" almost like a knee-jerk response from both male and female patients who just don't bother to take notice. I hear everything from women are weak comments" "You can't possibly be able to lift me" to the women drivers comments: "wow, your driving this ambulance? put some extra straps on me!" I just smile and laugh and prove them wrong every time.

4) Do you feel that your gender is misunderstood by the opposite gender? Have you experienced an "Us/Them" scenario with regard to gender in your relationships with other people?
I confuse alot of people who don't know me very well. When I'm at work I'm definetly one of the boys. I will literally roll out of bed and make it to work without showering...let alone doing my hair and make-up...but thats mainly because I have to be at work so early. Plus the uniforms are far from flattering with the big boots, tech pants and buttoned down, collared shirt. When I work the motorcross races I usually look like I went swimming in a mud pit. When I'm out of work I definetly like to girl it up because I like feeling and looking feminine. I like doing my hair and wearing make up. I have a shoe addiction that will eat up a small part of my pay check every week. I'm ambidextrous when it comes to my gender role...I've actually changed flat tires with 3 inch heels and a skirt on.

5) Are there any fundamental questions you would like to ask of members of the opposite sex? (For obvious reasons, questions must be PG-13). Any misconceptions you would like to clear up that you feel are generally accepted about your gender?
Not without venturing into the R or even NC-17 rated category

6) Have you ever felt limited by gender roles or ostricized by other members of your own gender for failing to live up to stereotypes and expectations surrounding your gender?
How do I put this....ALL THE TIME! Especially when I'm out at a bar or meeting new people in general. Alot of women just can't hide the shock that some nice looking girl with straightened, highlighted hair, wearing something cute and tight fitting with strappy sandals and a coach purse actually wishes to be a firefighter! My second job was teaching dance and choreography to middleschoolers and directing there plays. After the last show I did I had a couple of mothers come up and thank me for putting on such a nice show and they wanted to know what the next show was going to be and when it was going to start. I told them that I was very sorry but I couldent do another show because I was starting school in the fall. Of course they wanted to know what for and when I told them they went dead silent at first and then graciously wished me luck and how impressed they were. I like knowing that I was teaching middle school aged girls that you can literally be anything you want in want in life and you should never feel restricted from gender roles. The girls not only knew I used to be a ballet dancer and did it for a living for a while but they also saw me visit there school once in uniform driving my ambulance.

[BabyWerewolf]

Originally Posted by TENSHI

Many things also depend on how you were brought up. But boys are brought up like boys and girls like girls. You won't put a boy in a girl's little dress, because it's just wrong in our opinion.

You won't NOW. You would have done a century or two ago, look

Which is a bit odd, because I'd've said we were a lot more relaxed about bringing boys up like boys and girls like girls than people were in the past (this coming from the girl whose favourite toys as a small child were a toy milk tanker and a plastic Triceratops and who then graduated to running around the playground with her friend Ralph playing Robot Wars...and then we grew out of that and got into Fighting Fantasy choose-your-own-adventure books, so I speak with some authority.)

Clothes are a pretty bad indication, though - if you're going with the dress thing, going by what's traditional, should I not be wearing a skirt right now? Or do you mean our opinion just now, at this particular point in history? But if you do, that ruins you point that it's been like that for centuries, right?


And oooh...there's questions...

1) Do you believe that men and women are inherently "different" on more than a biological level?
Um...no. Because surely everything making you "inherently different", if it's inherent, is genetic, right? X and Y chromosomes and whatever. Which is biology.
Any differences that stem from after that point are not inherent, so whether they're biological or not is irrelevant. Ha.

2) Do you believe that gendering is a matter of nature or nurture? A combination of both?
Both. You're born with some tendencies, which are probably roughly in lien with other members of your gender. Not exactly the same, but on average...
And then society tries to adjust the bits that don't fit.


3) Have you ever felt discriminated against or judged based on your gender?
Yes. I hate dance and gymnastics, and we always have to do them in PE while the boys do football and [real not tag] rugby. And admittedly I'm no better at football than dance, but I at least enjoy it. And a lot of our class feel the same, but the teachers are illogical about it...the conversation in year eight went something like this, as I recall.
Me and Dani and Steph and Kirtsy: Sir, can't we do mixed football?
Sir: No.
Me (debating-sensibly-with-teachers-person): Why?
Sir: It's too dangerous, you'd get hurt.
Me: *thinking...yeah...and...?* How do you know?
Sir: Because two of the lads broke their legs last year, so it's obviously dnagerous.
Me: Um...sir...were they playing with girls?
Sir: No!
Me: Then surely all that proves is that it's dangerous for boys to play football with boys? If that's not too dangerous for them, why is it too dangeorus for us?
Sir: Because you're girls.
Me: Oh, I give up... *resists urge to swear*


4) Do you feel that your gender is misunderstood by the opposite gender? Have you experienced an "Us/Them" scenario with regard to gender in your relationships with other people?
Um...I'm not quite sure I get this question....the misunderstanding part...not majorly, but I guess. The us/them thing...since I've started to have a group of friends that's pretty much all girls, yes - because we discuss boys. Boys in general, or specific boys, but it does tend to come down to "boys are weird and we don't know quite what to do with/about/to them", which is definitely a divide, and isn't misunderstanding so much as giving up on ever understanding.

5) Are there any fundamental questions you would like to ask of members of the opposite sex? (For obvious reasons, questions must be PG-13). Any misconceptions you would like to clear up that you feel are generally accepted about your gender?
Um.....no, nothing PG-13.


6) Have you ever felt limited by gender roles or ostricized by other members of your own gender for failing to live up to stereotypes and expectations surrounding your gender?
Yes. I spent a lot of my time at primary school wishing I was a boy, just because I did not give two hoots about anything most of the girls seemed to care about, so I didn't want to hang out with the girls and the girls didn't want to hang out with me...but the boys didn't want to play with a girl either.

[Pox Voldius]

Originally Posted by BabyWerewolf

You won't NOW. You would have done a century or two ago, look

Here is another example (one that comes with a history lesson). There were little boys wearing dresses until around 1920.

[Tenshi]

Originally Posted by BabyWerewolf

Clothes are a pretty bad indication, though - if you're going with the dress thing, going by what's traditional, should I not be wearing a skirt right now? Or do you mean our opinion just now, at this particular point in history? But if you do, that ruins you point that it's been like that for centuries, right?

No, that's just my way to count time. Sorry. Many many decades then ...

I still find that the stereotypes result from our history and how we rise our children in the past years. Take a boy playing with a doll for example, I bet that a lot of people would wrinkle their nose seeing that, because in their humble opinion boys don't do such girly stuff. Same as people looks suspiciously at girl trying to become mechanics etc.

I'm not saying that it's right, it's just the way I see it.

BabyWerewolf, about the pic you linked. I don't get what you are trying to point out.

[Weazleby]

1) Do you believe that men and women are inherently "different" on more than a biological level?
I'm not a biologist, but men and women are physically different (no doubt). Woman was made with structure to bear and rear children. Man was made to be more aggressive. Does that imply that men are inherently "stronger" than women? I wouldn't say so, as anyone who has had a child (or in my case, watched a child) knows taking care of children requires a lot of upper-body strength. Sometimes we like to project our inherited opinions on the difference between the sexes upon science.

2) Do you believe that gendering is a matter of nature or nurture? A combination of both?
Both. Most men I have met have an instinctual desire to protect a girl and pay for her dinner, too. I think most women (remember, I said most) are instictively drawn toward taking care of someone. Or at least I am. I wasn't nutured to do so, I just find alot of peace in caring for children and "taking care" of my family when needed. Is that nature or nuture? I'm not sure. In some cases children are nutured to reject the social norms concerning gender roles and in other cases they are encouraged to follow them. It's a case-by-case thing.

3) Have you ever felt discriminated against or judged based on your gender?
Heavens, yes. Something about me implies I am the typical blonde bimbo and I am treated as such. Which is aggrivating because I believe myself to be smart (4.0 GPA) but also well-spoken and well-informed. I also don't hold myself in any way that would imply I am that "silly, little girl". It's all a matter of men stereotyping me, which I have noticed more now that I am in college. I have had some bad experiences with some of my male professors the last two semesters.

4) Do you feel that your gender is misunderstood by the opposite gender? Have you experienced an "Us/Them" scenario with regard to gender in your relationships with other people?
No. I definitely have certain ideas of the roles of men and women, but I don't project them onto my relationships.

5) Are there any fundamental questions you would like to ask of members of the opposite sex? (For obvious reasons, questions must be PG-13). Any misconceptions you would like to clear up that you feel are generally accepted about your gender?
I can't think of any at the moment, but I might ask some later on.

6) Have you ever felt limited by gender roles or ostricized by other members of your own gender for failing to live up to stereotypes and expectations surrounding your gender?
No. My mom and my dad both raised me to do both what is "male" and "female". I know how to clean a house, watch a kid and cook thanks to my mom and tons of personal experience. But I'm also really good at sports and I know tons about power tools and home improvement, thanks to Dad. And I don't really concern myself with other peoples expectations. Only my own and my parents'.

[Pox Voldius]

Originally Posted by TENSHI

Same as people looks suspiciously at girl trying to become mechanics etc.

My little sister is going to be going to school to become a mechanic later this year. ...Assuming that she didn't fail her GED and neglect to tell me about it. Mom says they've already found an auto shop in their town in Iowa that will hire my sister after she's gotten her qualifications.

[BabyWerewolf]

Originally Posted by TENSHI

BabyWerewolf, about the pic you linked. I don't get what you are trying to point out.

Oh, sorry, I forgot that copy of the picture doesn't have the caption the one in my book does. The baby in the gold dress, on the left - boy.

[IMissPadfoot]

Originally Posted by TENSHI

I still find that the stereotypes result from our history and how we rise our children in the past years. Take a boy playing with a doll for example, I bet that a lot of people would wrinkle their nose seeing that, because in their humble opinion boys don't do such girly stuff. Same as people looks suspiciously at girl trying to become mechanics etc.

It's funny you should say that - I used to work in a toy shop and there were an astounding number of little boys who wanted dolls prams or pushchairs. Mostly, the parents were more than happy to oblige which I thought was good. However - one incident in particular sticks in mind for utter ridiculousness. When the Thunderbirds movie was released, we had the whole range of toys, including the different vehicles. A little boy came into the shop one day with his mum and dad, and he was happily telling us how he had bought the entire collection of Thunderbirds toys with his birthday money. Except for one.

Lady Penelope's car.

The little boy asked very politely if he could have it. His father looked at him and said, "You're not having that. It's pink. Boys don't play with pink things."

I was absolutely stunned. It didn't matter that the car was the only thing missing from his collection. Because it was pink - he couldn't have it.

I truly do not understand that kind of attitude.

Originally Posted by Pox Voldius

My little sister is going to be going to school to become a mechanic later this year. ...Assuming that she didn't fail her GED and neglect to tell me about it. Mom says they've already found an auto shop in their town in Iowa that will hire my sister after she's gotten her qualifications.

That's awesome! I have a female cousin who used to be a mechanic.

[Yoana]

I'm appalled by a commercial on our TV. It's a Barbie commercial, aimed at girls around 7-13, and the main catchphrase is "Be whatever Barbie you like!" And then the ideas as to what "whatever" might include follow - elegant even in class, and I don't remember the rest, but they were all in this register. And the sinister part is, they are using the "feel free to be whatever you like!" slogan (which is connected with feminism) to steer young girls into a horrible stereotype, carefully fenced and defined within the expectations of beauty, elegance, vanity and all the rest "typically female" features. It's disgusting, but it's on and no-one seems to see anything wrong with it.

[CathyWeasley]

1) Do you believe that men and women are inherently "different" on more than a biological level?
Difficult to answer because being biologically different makes us different in so many other ways - even things like our metabolism are different because of this. Certainly men and womens brains work in different ways.

2) Do you believe that gendering is a matter of nature or nurture? A combination of both? Both. There is a certain amount that is genetic, but there is a lot of overlap in the genetic differences. For example an average man is taller and heavier than an average woman but there are a lot of womenb who are taller than a lot of men.
I also think it depends on your culture, and how men and women are expected to behave.

3) Have you ever felt discriminated against or judged based on your gender? Yes people make assumptions all the time - not just on gender.

4) Do you feel that your gender is misunderstood by the opposite gender? Have you experienced an "Us/Them" scenario with regard to gender in your relationships with other people?

Sometimes and by some members of the opposite gender.

5) Are there any fundamental questions you would like to ask of members of the opposite sex? (For obvious reasons, questions must be PG-13). Any misconceptions you would like to clear up that you feel are generally accepted about your gender?

Women CAN read maps. I'm and excellent navigator!

6) Have you ever felt limited by gender roles or ostricized by other members of your own gender for failing to live up to stereotypes and expectations surrounding your gender?
Yes. People think I'm stupid because I chose to give up work and stay at home to raise my children. Strangely it is working women who are the worst for his