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All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2



 
 
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  #41  
Old July 18th, 2006, 1:03 pm
kash kash is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by j_rod
RAB got past the potion and since he put the note inside the fake locket he expected voldemort to get past it too.
If the potion slowly kills you then the kreacher was with regulus theories are false,since kreacher would be dead.

welll it doesnt have to be kreacher who drank the potion.. it could be any of the house elves stuck on the wall in the black house.. regulas could have been killed by voldi later.. but the house elf could have his head mounted up on the walll..


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  #42  
Old July 24th, 2006, 9:57 pm
gabrielle10  Female.gif gabrielle10 is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Oh yes, the draught of living death, that would be quite exciting really...that would be sweet, but you think that Regulus made a house elf drink it? well...i suppose a house elf would be more than willing, eh? I can tell you one thing tho, if hermione found out, boy would she be hacked off...tee hee


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  #43  
Old July 29th, 2006, 4:46 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by kash
welll it doesnt have to be kreacher who drank the potion.. it could be any of the house elves stuck on the wall in the black house.. regulas could have been killed by voldi later.. but the house elf could have his head mounted up on the walll..
But most of us bank it to be kreacher because she was very firmly attached to Regulus's mother and therefore to Regulus who was her favourite son. Moreover Regulus must have said that he needed kreacher for his lords work and his mother would have happily ordered Kreacher to go with him.


  #44  
Old July 30th, 2006, 10:19 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

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Originally Posted by First post previous version
I mean, if he was able to lift the potion out of the basin with the cup, why didn't he just throw it aside instead of drinking it?
I was thinking that too. Why couldn't Dumbledore have conjured a big jug or something to put the potion in after his took it out with the cup? That way he wouldn't have had to drink it.


  #45  
Old July 30th, 2006, 11:09 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Probably because of the magic of the basin. Only the goblet could break the surface. The potion would probably just go back to the basin or bounce off of the jug, falling into the lake and awakening the Inferi. Couldn't Dumbledore just have scooped up the locket into the goblet?


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  #46  
Old July 30th, 2006, 11:15 pm
indnmagic21 indnmagic21 is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

what if he put it in his mouth and spit it out


  #47  
Old July 31st, 2006, 3:46 am
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
I mean, if he was able to lift the potion out of the basin with the cup, why didn't he just throw it aside instead of drinking it?
It is probably not the actual act of filling a cup with the potion that lets the goblet break the surface, but the intent of drinking it.

Dumbledore most likely could have used his hands or just stuck his head in there and the potion wouldn't care; however, Dumbledore does seem the type that would rather conjure himself a nice goblet.


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  #48  
Old July 31st, 2006, 5:19 am
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

I believe that Dumbledore knew exactly what the potion was once he saw it. He is too smart not to know just by looking at it and possibly smelling it ( can't remember if he did this ). Look at Slughorn's first potions class. Hermione was able to name every single potion, even the ones not close to her. She noted the color, smell, the vapors.

I think Dumbledore knew what he had to do to get the locket out. There must have been properties to the potion that it had to be taken out a certain way and drank before removing the locket.


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  #49  
Old August 12th, 2006, 10:41 pm
Scarlet Tears  Female.gif Scarlet Tears is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spinners_End
It is probably not the actual act of filling a cup with the potion that lets the goblet break the surface, but the intent of drinking it.
Good thinking. If the act of removing the liquid from the basin with a goblet was what allowed Dumbledore to break the surface, then there would have been no need for him to drink it. However, Dumbledore appears to have tried to do something of the sort when he was making "complicated movements over the surface of the potion, murmuring soundlessly." He concluded shortly thereafter, "This potion cannot be penetrated by hand, Vanished, parted, scooped up, or siphoned away, nor can it be Transfigured, Charmed, or otherwise made to change its nature" (HBP pg 568). It was only when he decided to drink the potion that he was able to remove it from the basin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelbell32
I believe that Dumbledore knew exactly what the potion was once he saw it. He is too smart not to know just by looking at it and possibly smelling it ( can't remember if he did this ). Look at Slughorn's first potions class. Hermione was able to name every single potion, even the ones not close to her. She noted the color, smell, the vapors.
I would agree with you, seeing as how intelligent Dumbledore is, yet what he says to Harry while examining the potion paints a different picture. He didn't know, for instance, that the potion could not be removed in any way besides drinking it before testing out various possibilities. Also, he was unsure of what effects the potion might have on anyone who drank it, though he does make several suggestions, including paralysis, intense pain, amnesia, etc. (HBP pg 569)

Yet my conclusion that Dumbledore did not know what the potion was leads me to believe that it was invented in secret by someone working for Voldemort. I've always believed that when he was a Death Eater during the First War, Snape specialized in making and inventing potions to help Voldemort in his quest for immortality. We know from his notes in his old Advanced Potions book, his ability to brew complex potions like the Wolfsbane Potion for Remus, not to mention the fact that Dumbledore insisted on his teaching Potions, that Snape is an especially gifted potions maker. Undoubtedly, Voldemort would have needed someone who specialized in the subject to help him, and Snape appears to be the best candidate.


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  #50  
Old August 12th, 2006, 11:15 pm
FabricateDemons  Female.gif FabricateDemons is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Nice post, Scarlet Tears. I've often wondered if Snape had (unknowingly) brewed the potion in the basin. But I have a few more questions that take it a step further.

No one can be quite sure what the basin was filled with before R.A.B. drank it and replaced the locket. It could very well have been the same thing, but there's also the possibility that it was something completely different. Also, R.A.B. left the locket with a note to the Dark Lord. He probably assumed that the Dark Lord would be the one to read it, right? If that's the case, then the Dark Lord would be the one drinking the potion. Maybe R.A.B. replaced the original potion with the slow-working poison, intending to kill another piece of soul and get rid of two pieces in one shot? He might have even asked Snape to brew a poison for him. If that were the case, Snape would never make the connection between the horcrux (or simply Voldemort) and the potion he brewed. You think that if he had, he might've mentioned it to Dumbledore--I'm sure they discussed Severus's involvement with Death Eater activity at length.



Last edited by FabricateDemons; August 13th, 2006 at 3:07 am.
  #51  
Old August 13th, 2006, 7:57 am
Scarlet Tears  Female.gif Scarlet Tears is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by FabricateDemons
Nice post, Scarlet Tears. I've often wondered if Snape had (unknowingly) brewed the potion in the basin. But I have a few more questions that take it a step further.
Thanks! And by the way, to CoSforums!

Quote:
No one can be quite sure what the basin was filled with before R.A.B. drank it and replaced the locket. It could very well have been the same thing, but there's also the possibility that it was something completely different.
I never considered that before, but it is definitely possible that R.A.B. refilled the basin with a different potion than the one Voldemort originally filled it with, if indeed he did fill it with one. We know that Dumbledore drank the entire contents of the basin without it automatically refilling itself, but if R.A.B. had done the same thing, the basin would have been empty by the time Harry and Dumbledore came (unless it refills itself after a certain period of time). Since it obviously wasn't, R.A.B. had to have filled the basin somehow, and there's no way of telling whether or not he filled it with what was there in the first place.


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  #52  
Old August 13th, 2006, 6:45 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlet Tears
We know that Dumbledore drank the entire contents of the basin without it automatically refilling itself, but if R.A.B. had done the same thing, the basin would have been empty by the time Harry and Dumbledore came (unless it refills itself after a certain period of time).
I'm not sure about this. For one thing, we don't actually know that R.A.B. (or anyone else) actually drank the potion the first time around.

For example, it's possible that the basin is enchanted so that lowering one locket in allows you to remove the other. The way that I look at it, there is no way that Voldemort would stoop to drink a dozen (thirteen?) cups of potion just to check on his Horcrux. He has to have a back door that Dumbledore didn't discover in the time allowed.

Remember, Dumbledore had just told us that his mistakes are big ones.

Secondly, we only saw the basin for a few moments, so who is to say that it didn't begin refilling the moment that Harry and Dumbledore stepped off the island?

I like the point about R.A.B. filling the basin with a different potion, but remember that to fool Voldemort, it would have to have been identical in appearance to the original potion.

It seems to me that there is simply too much that we don't know to postulate specific theories. At this stage, all that I am really willing to say is that "it's possible".


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  #53  
Old August 13th, 2006, 8:15 pm
arameme  Undisclosed.gif arameme is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

How could Riddle leave the potion in the basin when RAB had been the last (we know of) to be there?
Is it possible RAB put a different potion in the basin to kill Riddle?
Riddle probably would have come to the cave with antidote in hand for the potion he had put in the basin, but if RAB substituted the potion for an unknown, Riddle might have been killed? (If all Horcruxes had been destroyed, of course)
Dumbledore concluded that Riddle "...would not have wanted to kill the person who reached this island." That suggests that Riddle would expect that he would be that person.
RAB seemed to know all about the cave and the Horcrux and may have known about Riddles potion and an antidote, too. It's possible that he drank the potion, took an antidote, and filled the basin with the same potion, but why miss the chance to stop Riddle?


  #54  
Old August 13th, 2006, 10:25 pm
callistto  Female.gif callistto is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

What if the original locket was never in the basin? Could be he was sent by Voldemorte to place it there in
the first place. It could explain why the potion is there, and also how RAB knew where the amulet was in the first place.


  #55  
Old August 28th, 2006, 6:13 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

I have a few questions concerning the potion that Dumbledore drank..
1st- Dumbledore knew that in order to reach the Horcrux, he would have to drink the potion. Why didn't he just sccop it out and cast it aside?
2nd- After drinking the potion, Dumbledore needed water. Harry tried using the Aguamenti spell, but everytime the cup went to Dumbledore's lips, the water was disappear. Why didn't Harry just put his wand to Dumbledore's mouth and use the spell? Why didn't he just use 'Accio water' or 'Accio waterbottle'?


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  #56  
Old October 31st, 2006, 11:37 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

What about the potions effects? It seems to me, after having re-read HBP just a couple of days ago, that the potion not only causes pain and suffering but also perhaps causes the drinker to relive particularly painful memories...?

"'Nothing's happening to you, you're safe, it isn't real, I swear it isn't real -- take this, now, take this...'
And obediently, Dumbledore drank, as though it was an antidote Harry offered him, but upon draining the goblet, he sank to his knees, shaking uncontrollably.
'It's all my fault, all my fault,' he sobbed, 'please make it stop and I'll never, never again ... '"(HBP, 535)


  #57  
Old October 31st, 2006, 11:47 pm
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gryffind0r23 View Post
I have a few questions concerning the potion that Dumbledore drank..
1st- Dumbledore knew that in order to reach the Horcrux, he would have to drink the potion. Why didn't he just sccop it out and cast it aside?
2nd- After drinking the potion, Dumbledore needed water. Harry tried using the Aguamenti spell, but everytime the cup went to Dumbledore's lips, the water was disappear. Why didn't Harry just put his wand to Dumbledore's mouth and use the spell? Why didn't he just use 'Accio water' or 'Accio waterbottle'?
We know that there was some magic on the basin that made the liquid refill each time it was removed, unless by being consumed. That's the impression I had anyway.
As for shouting 'accio...', for that to work you'd need some drinkable water somewhere else within range. I doubt Harry would remember where he last saw some and if he could, how would it come into the cave?


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  #58  
Old October 31st, 2006, 11:51 pm
Phobos  Female.gif Phobos is offline
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rag View Post
We know that there was some magic on the basin that made the liquid refill each time it was removed, unless by being consumed. That's the impression I had anyway.
As for shouting 'accio...', for that to work you'd need some drinkable water somewhere else within range. I doubt Harry would remember where he last saw some and if he could, how would it come into the cave?
Also, Harry tried to Accio the horcrux, and it triggered one of the inferi. I would imagine this would also be true if he tried to Accio anything else that may help the person.


  #59  
Old November 1st, 2006, 2:00 am
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

One question I have about the potion is why wouldn't DUmbledore have carried a bezoar with him? He must have known that horcrux hunting was a dangerous business and after his hand incident especially. I would think the chances of encountering some type of poisinous protection would be high. We were also introduced to the teaching about identifying the different poisons in a complex potion and how to combat them. i don't have HBP with me and don't remember the name of the "law" that Hermione was able to recite in class. There must be, imo, a reason to tell us about that, either a way we've seen it used or will see it.
I like the Draught of Living Death idea. It is the only potion mentioned, I think, that we were not shown used in some way in the book, so it would fit nicely if it was, in fact, what was in the lake.


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  #60  
Old November 1st, 2006, 2:29 am
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Re: All about the potion in the basin that Dumbledore drank v2

In the spirit of Halloween today, I'm just going to say that maybe what he really wanted to do was bob for apples in the basin.... =) (ok, that was really stupid... but Happy Halloween!!)


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