Login  
 
 
Go Back   Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Harry Potter Archives > Divination Studies

All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording



 
 
Thread Tools
  #61  
Old December 10th, 2006, 10:16 am
Moriath's Avatar
Moriath  Female.gif Moriath is offline
MODLY CREW
 
Joined: 4817 days
Location: Neverwhere
Posts: 7,036
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
...and the Dark Lord will mark him as his equal...
This part is very interesting because Voldemort does not treat Harry as his equal. Why? Because Voldemort wants to dominate and subdue everyone. He wants to be the best and the most powerful. An old theory of mine is that Harry's resistance and refusal to obey him will play a major part in the final encounter. Harry has to act as Voldemort's equal, has to refuse to obey, in order to vanquish him.


Sponsored Links
  #62  
Old December 10th, 2006, 1:55 pm
SusanBones's Avatar
SusanBones  Female.gif SusanBones is offline
Inconceivable!
 
Joined: 5008 days
Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Posts: 4,090
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madron View Post
This part is very interesting because Voldemort does not treat Harry as his equal. Why? Because Voldemort wants to dominate and subdue everyone. He wants to be the best and the most powerful. An old theory of mine is that Harry's resistance and refusal to obey him will play a major part in the final encounter. Harry has to act as Voldemort's equal, has to refuse to obey, in order to vanquish him.
This "equal" part made me think of something. When a person is considered your equal, you call them by their name. When they are not, you call them by a title. You would never address your Doctor or teacher by their first names, or their name without their title. Most of the Wizards cannot use the name Voldemort. Dumbledore goes so far as to use Voldemort's given name, thereby putting him even lower. Harry has always used Voldemort's name. Maybe that is the "equal" part.


  #63  
Old December 10th, 2006, 3:07 pm
Tinkie's Avatar
Tinkie  Female.gif Tinkie is offline
oooooh spaaaaarkly...
 
Joined: 5855 days
Location: Pixie Palace, Hogsmeade
Age: 38
Posts: 876
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Yes, that is interesting. Harry is the only one who calls Voldemort with his name. But Voldemort does not treat him as equal, though he marked him by attempting to kill him.
As far as the prophecy is concerned, it is clear to me. One of them will die by the other, and I think that it will be Voldemort. Of the way he will die I am not certain; it may be due to the fact that Harry defies Voldemort, and secondly, there is love in his veins. It may be that Voldemort gets so much weakened by the destruction of the Horcruxes that Harry's defiance or love for others vanquishes him - though I am not so sure of that.


__________________


I am the Amazing Pixie Queen! Meet the members of my family and the Royal Court: Brian is my adopted son and Abby my daughter in law.Rell, Hes, Nadia, Heike, Audrey, Mave, Kaz, Donks, Bethany, Maryssa, Lisa and Giulia are my lovely pixie sisters!KitKat and Josh are my pixie brothers.Bill is the King . Matty is my Nephew and Kim8 is my Niece. Celest is my Godmother. Elaina and Evie are the princesses, Chris is the Royal advisor, Poofy is the Court Lawyer, Drew is the Grand Duke, Rusty is the royal fashion advisor & Julie is the Royal Doctor.
Kim (Kimagine) is my Royal Sister the Amazon Queen.
  #64  
Old December 10th, 2006, 4:07 pm
Melaszka's Avatar
Melaszka  Female.gif Melaszka is offline
HighFunctioning Sociopath
 
Joined: 4469 days
Location: England
Age: 50
Posts: 3,294
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

I'm not sure if I really believe it means this, but it occurs to me that the prophecy could be referring to two potential forms of power that Harry has (1)the power that could make him Voldemort's equal, with which V has "marked" him (i.e. amazing magical power), and (2) the "power that the Dark Lord knows not", i.e. love. But Harry has to choose which of these he wants, because it's one of these forms of power which will have to die at the hands of the other and which can't live while the other survives. So Harry will be given a choice a bit like Jesus in the wilderness - power beyond his wildest dreams or love. Possibly he wil even have to sacrifice his magical powers to defeat Voldemort.



Last edited by Melaszka; December 10th, 2006 at 4:32 pm.
  #65  
Old December 10th, 2006, 4:42 pm
waterlilly09  Female.gif waterlilly09 is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 4273 days
Location: neverland with peter pan...
Age: 27
Posts: 11
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

DId anyone ever come to think that if Voldie had an ok childhood he might not be an evil dark lord? that he is this way because of his parents, the lack of love that was never shared with him as a child?...one of the significances the prophecy is the power part...perhaps that hidden power that Harry can use to defeat Voldie is love. Because Harry has one thing that Voldie will never have, love. Harry has the love of his friends and "extend"family. he has grown up in a loving enviroment with a whole group of people that really care about him. Voldie will never have that, like he never did.


  #66  
Old December 10th, 2006, 4:51 pm
ponytail  Male.gif ponytail is offline
Third Year
 
Joined: 5388 days
Location: Leaky Cauldron
Age: 30
Posts: 316
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

well i think that would make some what of a difference but Would a wizards upbringing effect how strong their powers are. I mean are all wizards born equal strength because then it wouldnt make a difference where a wizard grew up. I think that yes his upbringing did taint his views and a loving family might have turned out different but could he fight the dark power that he had inside of him.

I mean at the orphanage, where DD first goes to visit him.. I was kinda scarred how strongly and violently he reacted..


  #67  
Old December 10th, 2006, 5:06 pm
Hermaryne's Avatar
Hermaryne  Female.gif Hermaryne is offline
Fourth Year
 
Joined: 4637 days
Posts: 535
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowdogs View Post
I'm glad you're looking for some way for Tom Riddle to be... I guess cured. I know most think it's a hopeless case, but if it were, then wouldn't evil win, even if he died?

Earlier, I remarked that the Dark Lord, Voldemort, doesn't live at this point anyway, that Voldemort is just an idea that Tom Riddle has of what the perfect being is (got lost in whole either/either debate). Any thoughts?
I've been thinking along these same lines. How can Voldemort "live" with a mutilated soul? And wasn't he already cursed with a "half-life" when he drank the unicorn's blood? So when I apply "neither can live while the other survives, I don't see that Voldemort has a chance (unless Harry tries to redeem him and/or there is some effect from Harry's blood). I know that Rowling has stated that Voldemort is evil beyond redemption, but that doesn't mean that Harry will see it that way. To vanquish Voldemort with LOVE would be to heal, rather than to kill.


  #68  
Old December 10th, 2006, 6:12 pm
shadowdogs  Undisclosed.gif shadowdogs is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 4844 days
Location: Prefects' Bath
Posts: 175
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
I know that Rowling has stated that Voldemort is evil beyond redemption,
I was so hurt when she said this. I mean, a mutilated fraction of a soul that's cursed is still soul after all. Where there's life, there's hope. Maybe if Tom Riddle's hope is to totally divorce himself from everything about himself that's human, then if he succeeded, he would actually be Voldemort and not just be telling people he is. Maybe that would be the Dark Lord that can't live at the same time as Harry Potter.


__________________
"I should have known"
--Albus Dumbledore
  #69  
Old December 10th, 2006, 7:21 pm
meesha1971's Avatar
meesha1971  Female.gif meesha1971 is offline
Master of the Magical Arts
 
Joined: 4877 days
Location: The Unknowable Room
Age: 47
Posts: 12,731
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madron View Post
Thanks for clearing that up, CBW. I didn't know that.

I also like your take on prophecies being glimpses on the future. Although that brings up the question why Trelawney's voice changes. For me It sounds as if someone is speaking through her.
The thing with the voice is rather vague though. Trelawney intentionally alters her voice when speaking in an attempt to sound more mystical. She speaks softly and gives her voice a "misty" sound. This is not her "normal" voice. This is her "I am a seer, respect me" voice. When she becomes irritated, her voice loses that soft, misty quality.

When Harry heard her make the prophecy about Pettigrew, her voice was loud and harsh. He gives the same description when listening to the prophecy about himself - harsh, hoarse tones. It was the tone and inflection that was different - not her actual voice. I attribute this to the trance. She is not consciously aware of what she is saying and not faking what she feels to be a proper "seer's voice".

I sort of agree with CBW on prophecies. I think they are glimpses into a possible future. Nothing in the future is set in stone. Whatever we do today can change what will happen tomorrow or a year from now.

As Jo said, it's the Macbeth idea. Macbeth's destiny was not fated - he made it happen. We also see this with Oedipus. If his father had not heard the prophecy, he would not have sent Oedipus away and Oedipus would not have returned years later and killed him.

It's not the prophecy that is significant. It is the fact that Voldemort believes it. Voldemort made these things happen. If he had never heard the prophecy or if he had chosen to ignore it, nothing would have happened. And he could have done that at any time. If he had left Harry alone, Harry would not be so driven to defeat him. That's the tool that Voldemort has put in Harry's hand - determination. Voldemort made it personal for Harry and that makes him determined to be the one to defeat Voldemort. And that determination is derived from Harry's ability to love. It's personal because he loved his parents - he loved Sirius - he loved Dumbledore as a father figure/mentor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pottersmom View Post
I have to disagree with you here. While yes, one can understand the basic plot of the series by reading only the books, I think you must admit that there are several layers to the story that are enriched by consulting outside sources. For example- the names of characters and places have origins that are not explained explicity in the books, but still add to the story if the reader is aware of those origins. Also the books parallel both folklore and history which are both valuable tools for analyzing the work- which is, in a nutshell, what we are doing on this website.
Sorry, but Hinoema is quite right on this one. No outside source is necessary to understand what is going on in the books. It might be enriching to know that Snape's name came from a map or that Dumbledore's name means Bumblebee in Old English, but neither of those things are necessary to understand what is going on and provide nothing towards literary analysis.

Accurate literary analysis can only come from what is written on the page and revealed by Jo herself. She is not using alchemy or elaborate symbolism that requires the reader to do extensive outside research to understand it. She might be inspired by folklore and history, but she puts her own spin on those things - rendering the outside source completely useless for accurate analysis.

Horcruxes are a good example of this. There is a similar concept within the fantasy genre called a phylactery. A wizard who uses a phylactery is called a lich. While there are similarities between the two concepts, Jo put her own spin on it. A lich can only have one phylactery and it is affixed to the entire soul - not pieces. For analysis purposes, the lich and phylactery are useless because Jo altered them to suit the purposes of her story.

What we needed to understand where Jo was going was contained within COS - the diary. All the information we needed was on page. The diary contained Riddle's soul. The connecting information was provided by Jo - why didn't Voldemort die? Extensive outside research was not necessary for analysis. The information provided on page and by Jo was enough to understand where Jo was going with that.

Any theory that requires outside research to understand it has a very low probability.

Quote:
As far as the prophecy goes I'll say it for the last time and leave you all alone:
'Jo and any character who cares to clarify' ...have all INDICATED or ASSUMED that the prophecy is about Voldemort and Harry, but JK said herself that it was CAREFULLY WRITTEN in order to be ambiguous. Because of this, I do not think it's outside the realm of possibility for the author to hit us with another suprise, that she has been setting up discreetly all along. Perhaps to prevent the Hero from becoming a murderer, perhaps to make a statement about fate and choice... who knows? I havn't read it yet. I'm just speculating.
But I am suprised to see that devoted readers of this story where "things are not always as they seem"- are still being so closed minded about one of the major plot points in the book.
Jo has directly stated that the prophecy is about Harry and Voldemort. She also directly stated that the prophecy could have been about Neville and Voldemort if Voldemort had made a different choice.

There is nothing ambiguous about that. The prophecy is about Harry and Voldemort. How Harry will defeat Voldemort remains to be seen, but it will be Harry who does so. Does it make Harry a murderer if he kills someone who is trying to kill him? I don't think so. That is self defense. Voldemort is not going to leave Harry much choice in that regard because he is not going to leave Harry alone until one of them is dead.

That's what it boils down to. Neither can live while the other survives simply because Voldemort will not allow it. He will keep coming after Harry and trying to kill him until one, or both, of them is dead.


__________________

Reform must come from within, not from without. ~ James Cardinal Gibbons

"So, if people want information on my characters, then they have to accept that I'm going to give them the information on the characters. And if they don't like it, that's the nature of fiction. You have to accept someone else's world because they made that world, so they probably know a little better than you do what goes on there." ~ J.K. Rowling


All posts are my opinions and interpretations based on reading the Harry Potter books and interviews with J.K. Rowling.

  #70  
Old December 11th, 2006, 5:29 am
HJP navy seal  Undisclosed.gif HJP navy seal is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 5108 days
Posts: 102
The Prophecy

In the department of Mysteries the prophecy had a label on it describing who it concerned and who witnessed it. Dumbledore explained to Harry that it was relabelled after the attack on him because previously it was unclear who it concerned (Harry or Neville).
Now what I'm curious about is who else has heard the prophecy? Also how did they record the prophecy? Using what?
Furthermore who has this person told? Does only one person work there? DO they keep written records also? How did they pick up the orb to relabel it if you go near enough insane if anybody other than those whom the prophecy refers to cannot pick it up?
If it was only a case of putting a spell on the glass orb to protect it then I'm sure the more than capable Death Eaters could have used counter spells to take off the jinx and retrieve it themselves.

Too many questions wacko.gif but it is too fishy and unexplained to me....


__________________
DUMBLEDORES MAN THROUGH AND THROUGH



"Remember Cedric. Remember, if the time should come when you have to make a choice between what is right and what is easy, remember what happened to a boy who was good, and kind, and brave, because he strayed across the path of Lord Voldemort. Remember Cedric Diggory."
---Albus Dumbledore
  #71  
Old December 11th, 2006, 5:49 am
meesha1971's Avatar
meesha1971  Female.gif meesha1971 is offline
Master of the Magical Arts
 
Joined: 4877 days
Location: The Unknowable Room
Age: 47
Posts: 12,731
Re: The Prophecy

Quote:
Originally Posted by HJP navy seal View Post
In the department of Mysteries the prophecy had a label on it describing who it concerned and who witnessed it. Dumbledore explained to Harry that it was relabelled after the attack on him because previously it was unclear who it concerned (Harry or Neville).
Now what I'm curious about is who else has heard the prophecy? Also how did they record the prophecy? Using what?
Furthermore who has this person told? Does only one person work there? DO they keep written records also? How did they pick up the orb to relabel it if you go near enough insane if anybody other than those whom the prophecy refers to cannot pick it up?
If it was only a case of putting a spell on the glass orb to protect it then I'm sure the more than capable Death Eaters could have used counter spells to take off the jinx and retrieve it themselves.

Too many questions wacko.gif but it is too fishy and unexplained to me....
Well, to answer one of your questions, the label was not on the prophecy itself. It was affixed to the shelf just beneath the glass ball. That could be written on without touching the prophecy.

Dumbledore did not explain how the prophecy was recorded, but he did tell Harry that nobody else had heard it. That tells us that Dumbledore did the recording himself. Actually, I would say that it's not a recording. It appears to be more like a mini-pensieve. If that is the case, then the memory could have been placed into the glass ball without anyone seeing or hearing it.

And lastly, once the glass ball had been removed from the shelf, anyone could touch it. Lucius demands that Harry hand it over - Bellatrix tries to summon it - Harry actually gave it to Neville to hold at one point. That tells us that the spell preventing anyone from removing the prophecy except those it referred to was apparently on the shelf itself - not preventing anyone from touching the shelf, but preventing anyone from touching the glass ball except whoever it referred to.

Hope that helps.


__________________

Reform must come from within, not from without. ~ James Cardinal Gibbons

"So, if people want information on my characters, then they have to accept that I'm going to give them the information on the characters. And if they don't like it, that's the nature of fiction. You have to accept someone else's world because they made that world, so they probably know a little better than you do what goes on there." ~ J.K. Rowling


All posts are my opinions and interpretations based on reading the Harry Potter books and interviews with J.K. Rowling.

  #72  
Old December 11th, 2006, 12:49 pm
SusanBones's Avatar
SusanBones  Female.gif SusanBones is offline
Inconceivable!
 
Joined: 5008 days
Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Posts: 4,090
Re: The Prophecy

Quote:
Originally Posted by HJP navy seal View Post
Now what I'm curious about is who else has heard the prophecy? Also how did they record the prophecy? Using what?
Furthermore who has this person told? Does only one person work there? DO they keep written records also? How did they pick up the orb to relabel it if you go near enough insane if anybody other than those whom the prophecy refers to cannot pick it up?
If it was only a case of putting a spell on the glass orb to protect it then I'm sure the more than capable Death Eaters could have used counter spells to take off the jinx and retrieve it themselves.

Too many questions wacko.gif but it is too fishy and unexplained to me....
I think that the people who work in the Hall of Prophecy cannot "speak" the words of the prophecies, just as no one can tell a secret except the secret keeper when a Fidelus Charm has been used. I don't think there is anything important to know or find out about how the prophecies are stored and recorded. I think JK Rowling has revealed everything she plans to reveal on the topic.


  #73  
Old December 11th, 2006, 8:54 pm
shadowdogs  Undisclosed.gif shadowdogs is offline
Second Year
 
Joined: 4844 days
Location: Prefects' Bath
Posts: 175
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

quote from Meesha1971
Quote:
No outside source is necessary to understand what is going on in the books. It might be enriching to know that Snape's name came from a map or that Dumbledore's name means Bumblebee in Old English, but neither of those things are necessary to understand what is going on and provide nothing towards literary analysis
I agree with you that JKR has been explicit in stating that the prophesy means that Voldemort and Harry will just never get along At the same time, supposing I had never read a book and never seen a movie or a TV show, would I still be able to follow this story? I think I would have a hard time understanding it.

Also, while I'm sure all the information required to comprehend is already in there, I can't help but notice that the more literate one is, the easier it is to predict what will happen in the future. For example, most of us who've read a lot knew that Dumbledore wouldn't live to the end of the series well before book 6 came out.

While being well-read may not be necessary in interpreting the prophesy, it could certainly be helpful. After all, what were we all doing so much reading for, if not to read better? Not just entertainment, surely!


__________________
"I should have known"
--Albus Dumbledore
  #74  
Old December 11th, 2006, 9:05 pm
Hinoema  Female.gif Hinoema is offline
Zonko's Employee
 
Joined: 4907 days
Location: Er... in front of a computer?
Posts: 3,755
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Common cultural literacy is essential for understanding of any literature, of course. However, what we are saying is that no point significant to understanding the plot will hinge on knowledge of a point not considered within the realm of common wisdom to the reasonably literate- or in this case, 'reasonably literate' by the standard of the young adult reader.

The wise mentor dying to free the hero to journey alone is a common trope. Alchemical color based transformational progressions are not. That sort of thing.

As for the prophecies, it's possible that they simply 'magically' appear on the shelves, and that all the workers can detect about them is who they are about, for labeling. Possibly the only way to hear a prophecy (aside from destruction of the globe) is if it comes true and is released.



Last edited by Hinoema; December 11th, 2006 at 9:07 pm.
  #75  
Old December 11th, 2006, 9:24 pm
ComicBookWorm's Avatar
ComicBookWorm  Female.gif ComicBookWorm is offline
The Next Great Adventurer
 
Joined: 5169 days
Location: Embedded in my sofa
Posts: 16,292
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowdogs View Post
At the same time, supposing I had never read a book and never seen a movie or a TV show, would I still be able to follow this story? I think I would have a hard time understanding it. Also, while I'm sure all the information required to comprehend is already in there, I can't help but notice that the more literate one is, the easier it is to predict what will happen in the future. For example, most of us who've read a lot knew that Dumbledore wouldn't live to the end of the series well before book 6 came out. While being well-read may not be necessary in interpreting the prophesy, it could certainly be helpful. After all, what were we all doing so much reading for, if not to read better? Not just entertainment, surely!
These books do not require a literate background to understand and enjoy them. They have been written so that a young audience can completely understand them.

The sources and themes that we might discern do not change the understanding of the story. Some are very common in our culture, and others are in the eye of the beholder and not necessarily there. We can dig and see where JKR might have drawn upon a source here and there, but there is no secret key to the story that requires any outside source to reveal.

Anything that we need to know is right there on the printed page.


__________________

Sometimes dreams do come true
  #76  
Old December 11th, 2006, 11:50 pm
meesha1971's Avatar
meesha1971  Female.gif meesha1971 is offline
Master of the Magical Arts
 
Joined: 4877 days
Location: The Unknowable Room
Age: 47
Posts: 12,731
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowdogs View Post
quote from Meesha1971


I agree with you that JKR has been explicit in stating that the prophesy means that Voldemort and Harry will just never get along At the same time, supposing I had never read a book and never seen a movie or a TV show, would I still be able to follow this story? I think I would have a hard time understanding it.

Also, while I'm sure all the information required to comprehend is already in there, I can't help but notice that the more literate one is, the easier it is to predict what will happen in the future. For example, most of us who've read a lot knew that Dumbledore wouldn't live to the end of the series well before book 6 came out.

While being well-read may not be necessary in interpreting the prophesy, it could certainly be helpful. After all, what were we all doing so much reading for, if not to read better? Not just entertainment, surely!
Primarily, you have to look at the target audience for any piece of literature. In the case of Harry Potter, Jo is aiming for universal appeal. She has said in an interview that a 9-year-old will be able to read and fully understand all 7 books when she is done. So, what we're looking at in terms of cultural knowledge, etc... is what the average 9-year-old would know and understand.

That eliminates complicated and convoluted ideas. Alchemy, mythological history, Old English translations, etc... Those things would be above the average 9-year-old's head. To require a reader to do outside research in order to understand what is going on, would be detrimental overall because the average reader is not going to do that. The reader should be able to pick of the book, read it, enjoy it, and understand it without having to research anything. That is the goal for any author.

In other words, if Jo were using alchemy as a basis in the story, then there would be references on page within the books to the information that she was using. If the mythological history behind hippogriff's were significant, that would be included on page in the books. And so on and so forth.

As Hinoema pointed out, there are some things that are common knowledge and some things that are not. A werewolf changes when there is a full moon - the average 5-year-old would know that because of cultural references like Scooby Doo and various children's books. There is no need to go into a great deal of detail about that. Alchemy is not common knowledge. The average 9-year-old is not going to know what a Philosopher's/Sorcerer's Stone is. That must be explained on page - what it is, what it does, and why someone would want it. It is reasonable for the author to expect the average reader to have a basic understanding of werewolves because that would be common knowledge. That is not the case for alchemy because that is not common knowledge - it must be explained on page.


__________________

Reform must come from within, not from without. ~ James Cardinal Gibbons

"So, if people want information on my characters, then they have to accept that I'm going to give them the information on the characters. And if they don't like it, that's the nature of fiction. You have to accept someone else's world because they made that world, so they probably know a little better than you do what goes on there." ~ J.K. Rowling


All posts are my opinions and interpretations based on reading the Harry Potter books and interviews with J.K. Rowling.

  #77  
Old December 12th, 2006, 4:29 am
SusanBones's Avatar
SusanBones  Female.gif SusanBones is offline
Inconceivable!
 
Joined: 5008 days
Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Posts: 4,090
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

This recent discussion reminds me of a class I had in high school. The teacher had a list of historical fiction books and we needed to read one and do research on seven historical facts in the book. I had read one that took place during the Revolutionary War. It led me to read things about the war that were only mentioned in the book, or happened off page. The book was interesting without knowing a single thing about the history. But it became even more enjoyable to place the characters in an era that I had learned more about.


  #78  
Old December 12th, 2006, 8:42 am
Moriath's Avatar
Moriath  Female.gif Moriath is offline
MODLY CREW
 
Joined: 4817 days
Location: Neverwhere
Posts: 7,036
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Let's get back to the prophecy, yes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinkie View Post
Yes, that is interesting. Harry is the only one who calls Voldemort with his name.
He is not. Ginny calls him Voldemort, Lupin does in PoA and I think Sirius does as well.


  #79  
Old December 12th, 2006, 10:23 am
lullabelle5  Female.gif lullabelle5 is offline
First Year
 
Joined: 4753 days
Location: Missouri
Age: 33
Posts: 36
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madron View Post
He is not. Ginny calls him Voldemort, Lupin does in PoA and I think Sirius does as well.
Hermione does too. However, I will say the fact that Harry uses voldemort's name says a lot about how he sees voldemort. He may not quite believe in his heart that he is his equal at this point (ha see how I brought it back to the prophecy!) but I've always seen this as a step in the right direction.

Back to the wording of the prophesy though. I found the discussion about the interpretation of the word "either" to be quite interesting. Namely because the first time I read the prophecy, I did interpret it in the less common way. I thought that it meant that Voldemort and Harry were going to die (though it could have been due to sleep deprivation). After subsequent readthroughs I now lean towards the more common idea of "either" meaning voldemort or harry, but I think that "either" meaning "both" is a valid way of reading it. And believe me I didn't, nor do I now, have any special knowledge of old english definitions.


__________________
"The worst thing about prison was the...was the...dementors. They were flying all over the place and they were scary, and then they’d come down and they’d suck the soul out of your body and it HURT!"
--Prison Mike
  #80  
Old December 12th, 2006, 4:41 pm
SusanBones's Avatar
SusanBones  Female.gif SusanBones is offline
Inconceivable!
 
Joined: 5008 days
Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Posts: 4,090
Re: All about the prophecy: meaning, significance and wording

either in this usage means one or the other


 
Go Back  Chamber of Secrets > Forum Archives > Harry Potter Archives > Divination Studies

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 5:41 am.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Original content is Copyright © MMII - MMVIII, CoSForums.com. All Rights Reserved.
Other content (posts, images, etc) is Copyright © its respective owners.